Does anyone else think the trash appearing everywhere in national parks during the shutdown in the US is just weird?

[moonflower]

I mean, who, upon seeing an overflowing trash can in a National Park, just puts their own trash on top instead of packing it out with them?  And how do we have evidently thousands of these people in the US, visiting these places and not picking up after themselves?  It's a complete mystery to me.  does it strike anyone else as very weird?

[sassenach]

I really don’t understand why the gates are still open if they can’t run the parks. 

[Jean in Newcastle]

Not really. I see people doing that sort of thing all the time. 

[Arcadia]

I see people doing that at local city parks so not surprised. People who tie up their trash and leave the trash bags next to the trash bins at local city parks are already “nicer” than people who left thrash on the tables and chairs for wind to blow their trash everywhere.

[Frances]

30 minutes ago, Jean in Newcastle said:

Not really. I see people doing that sort of thing all the time. 

Exactly. Before they banned smoking in our city parks, the beautiful small park near us would have areas almost completely covered in cigarette butts from the hospital workers next door smoking on breaks because smoking was not allowed on the hospital grounds. One of our neighbors picked them all up several times per week.

[Carol in Cal.]

I’m not surprised at all.  Unfortunately it’s always like this now in the Sierras, shutdown or not.  Yosemite is known for feces next to the toilets—why, I have no idea.  It has always been the case that people pee out in the wild, but now they poop and don’t bury it—I’ve just started to see this in the last few years, and it’s really gross.

Part of it is the lack of public and semi-public restrooms in general.  Out here there is a guy who goes around suing for ADA violations and winning massive amounts of money if a restroom’s sink is half an inch shorter or taller than the regulations, for instance.  So people who used to let customers use their restrooms have stopped doing so.  Plus there has been a rash of supposedly out of order bathrooms at gas stations—not always truthfully.  People have gotten used to having to improvise, and they don’t really know how.

Plus in general the folks that use the national parks for one glorious week in 5 years are not as well versed in realistic expectations of the wilderness as, say, those who do thru or section hikes, or who have grown up camping.  It’s a broader and less oriented group in general.  I grew up going to the mountains every year, and being taught by my parents to take care of the land and be considerate of others who visit.  I had picture books about Smokey the Bear helping children who were lost in the woods overnight and how they managed.  I read Girl Scout handbooks.  I don’t think very many kids get that kind of casual interaction with wild nature and basic sanitation and survival anymore.

[Amira]

I had a totally different reaction to hearing that.  Yes, I completely agree that people should take their trash with them (and be aware of generating less trash and recycling more and a whole host of environmentally-friendly things), but I don’t think that’s the problem here.  Keeping places trash-free is bigger than individuals. Instead, it’s weird to me that a wealthy country’s government would just stop picking up trash when it is capable of doing so. The country I currently live in has a trash problem and the government has been unable to deal with it because of infrastructure and other significant contributing factors that the US doesn’t face. Individuals can’t just take care of their own trash here because there’s nowhere to put it where it will be taken away. It’s ludicrous to me that the US government would choose to do this.

[DesertBlossom]

It surprises me, but it also doesn't. There are a couple popular places near here in the desert where people ride motorcycles and do target shooting. There is so much garbage. People haul out old appliances or mattresses (and all sorts of targets) to shoot up and then leave them in the desert. Makes me furious.

[mathnerd]

I think that the national parks should be closed to visitors if they have skeletal staff. I don't see any point in national parks being littered and i am disgusted by news that Yosemite has poop on the roadside etc.

But, I am not surprised. Our local parks are full of people having BBQs and parties all year round and then, their trash flies everywhere until it gets cleaned up. I was walking the other day in our park and a prison van pulled up and a bunch of prisoners got off and were told to clean up all the trash in our park. That was a new one to me. None of them were very happy to be picking up trash and an old man mistook those prisoners for park staff and went to ask for directions and the guy snarled at the old man asked him to back off. I live in a very high COL area and I thought that what I witnessed could be because they could not hire anyone locally for such jobs?

[Tanaqui]

Are the national parks actually physically *gated*? Smaller ones like Liberty Island can be, I suppose but... how're you gonna put a fence and a gate around Yellowstone?

[mathnerd]

34 minutes ago, Tanaqui said:

Are the national parks actually physically *gated*? Smaller ones like Liberty Island can be, I suppose but... how're you gonna put a fence and a gate around Yellowstone?

I remember there being an Entrance Fee that I had to pay to purchase a pass to get into yosemite.

[Tanaqui]

Okay, but... I mean... does it actually physically go all the way around, or do they rely on manpower to stop people from crossing the invisible border?

[happi duck]

I don't think much can be secured.  I've read that some people are taking advantage to get in free, hunt, and use motorized vehicles where it isn't allowed.  It makes me angry for so many reasons.

[Carrie12345]

Humans are disgusting.

Also, I am not the superhero I like to think I am.  I was pumping gas last week and saw a guy, sitting in his parked car, IN THE FIRE LANE, with plenty of people in the immediate vicinity, open his car window and toss out a crumpled piece of paper onto the ground. I was completely dumbstruck.

I have seen people toss entire fast food bags out their window. While that enrages me, they don't run any risk of confrontation (unless a cop happens to see it.) But then, there I was in a parking lot, and I was so shocked I couldn't confront that jerk! Nor did anyone else.

[MEmama]

5 hours ago, sassenach said:

I really don’t understand why the gates are still open if they can’t run the parks. 

In most large parks there are a thousand ways to walk in. Of course the gates are closed, but that doesn't mean people won't just park and walk around them.

My mother did that in Acadia during the last shutdown. I was so angry; I told her they were begging people to stay out for all the obvious reasons; she didn't care. I warned her there were no services if she got hurt or had a heart issue; didn't make any difference.  She wanted to go so she went. I was livid (but it's typical...sigh).

The older I get the deeper I understand why good behaviour requires good government. Left to their own devices, too many people will allow their selfishness to take over and destroy something that could be good for all (parks, healthcare, infrastructure, you name it). It's sickening to me.

[Pawz4me]

5 hours ago, Tanaqui said:

Are the national parks actually physically *gated*? Smaller ones like Liberty Island can be, I suppose but... how're you gonna put a fence and a gate around Yellowstone?

 

4 hours ago, mathnerd said:

I remember there being an Entrance Fee that I had to pay to purchase a pass to get into yosemite.

 

4 hours ago, Tanaqui said:

Okay, but... I mean... does it actually physically go all the way around, or do they rely on manpower to stop people from crossing the invisible border?

Some large parks are gated and some aren't. The Great Smoky Mountains National Park is an example of a large one that isn't gated. There is no entrance fee, and one of the primary roads through it is a US highway.

[PrincessMommy]

6 hours ago, Danae said:

I think there are more people in the world who would pile their trash on top of an overflowing trash can than wouldn't. Even when the can is in their own house and there's a bin right outside the back door they could dump it in. So I'm not at all surprised that people would leave trash in a pile rather than hauling it out with them.

truth.  It happens just about every day at my house...why not in other places too.

[Roadrunner]

Not surprised at all. Human feces is lining up coastal highway thanks to tourists. It’s infuriorating. 

[fairfarmhand]

I’m not surprised. We live in a rural area but still a very nice neighborhood. All summer my kids have to go out by the road and pick up trash that jerks have tossed out there. Before we cut grass that’s what has to be done. It’s not biodegradable stuff like a banana peel or apple core. It’s whole bags of fast food trash, beer bottles, and soda cans.

[Ravin]

6 hours ago, Tanaqui said:

Are the national parks actually physically *gated*? Smaller ones like Liberty Island can be, I suppose but... how're you gonna put a fence and a gate around Yellowstone?

 

Closing gates across roads would probably take care of 90% of the sort of people who trash parks. If they are too lazy to practice leave no trace, they're probably too lazy to hike in, and if they do, they won't get very far.

[Miss Tick]

Saddened, but not surprised in the least. Those conditions seem relatively common even when government is operating as usual. Even if we staffed the parks at a level they deserve, it would be difficult to police this kind of human nature.

[Ravin]

3 hours ago, Carrie12345 said:

Humans are disgusting.

Also, I am not the superhero I like to think I am.  I was pumping gas last week and saw a guy, sitting in his parked car, IN THE FIRE LANE, with plenty of people in the immediate vicinity, open his car window and toss out a crumpled piece of paper onto the ground. I was completely dumbstruck.

I have seen people toss entire fast food bags out their window. While that enrages me, they don't run any risk of confrontation (unless a cop happens to see it.) But then, there I was in a parking lot, and I was so shocked I couldn't confront that jerk! Nor did anyone else.

 

This is the sort of thing which has been known to prompt me to let my mouth run ahead of my sense of self-preservation. If his window was down, I'd have been tempted to pick up the bag and hand it back to him: "excuse me, you dropped this." Maybe with my camera out. Get a good shot of his license plate, publicly shame him on FB. That's if I was thinking.

Otherwise, I might just yell, "Hey, @ssh0le, didn't your mama teach you not to litter?" That kind of thing was less dangerous when I was perceived as female. I'm more likely to get physical retaliation now.

[teachermom2834]

I live in an area of the country where people are very into camping, hunting, and fishing yet regularly see people roll down their windows and throw out fast food bags and cups. So it doesn’t surprise me one bit that people do this. Confused but not surprised.

[Faith-manor]

I lot of what dh, our kids, and I know about treating the environment with respect came from being raised camping, traipsing around the landscape with responsible adults when we were young, participating in 4H or Scouts and other such civic education groups. I think that likely this generation has had far less exposure and upbringing, and it could be regional as well. Here in Michigan, camping and the great outdoors is still a very, very popular thing, and the "how" is still being passed down from generation to generation. It is rare for us to go into a state park, at least on our side of the state, and see the kinds of problems being described. Our national Lakeshores - Pictured Rocks, Sleeping Bear Dune, National Park - Isle Royale, and National Forest - Hiawatha, are not experiencing this. However, I also have to admit that right now, these areas are also not so heavily frequented due to cold weather. They are also heavily monitored by grad school students as all of our better state schools have major DNR conservation study programs, environmental science programs, etc. and these national areas probably have a ton of students and volunteers pitching in.

Maybe if the shut down occurred during the summer when we have more tourists from our of state, we would see it. Hard to say.

It would not be seen on Isle Royale. That National Park is only available by expensive ferry ride from the Keeweenaw Peninsula, and you can only take what you can back pack in. No vehicles, rough camping - ie you will find some potable water on the island for drinking, but no electricity, and only composting toilets. It is rugged, gorgeous terrain whose only regulars are park rangers, and a lot of research groups, especially grad students, and the most ardent, die hard hikers. It isn't the kind of place that the lazy would go. The population of regulars is low enough that the rangers can actually figure out who messed up and littered. They will find out, and since all visitors are registered, they will fine you. The fines are expensive, very expensive.

So potentially maybe we don't see this kind of thing due to weather at the moment, but also due to the culture of the Great Lakes Region being one of handing down proper camping and hiking/backpacking from generation to generation.

I also wonder about school culture. When I was a kid, during good weather the teachers often had us all take our lunches outside and eat in the landscaped area of the school, sitting on blankets that they brought from home. They would point out the different flowers and trees that had been planted, and when we were done eating, we got the lecture about bussing out EVERYTHING and not leaving a hint of litter there, of caring for our beautiful yard, etc. It was just part and parcel of the civics education that we were given as elementary and middle school students. I never see that now. I drive pass my old elementary school all the time, and no one is eating outdoors no matter how nice the weather. I've heard that the teachers no longer eat with their students either. The lunchroom has something like 150 students at a time monitored by just three or four lunch room workers. 

Times have definitely changed in this regard. It makes me very glad that although I did not enjoy camping with little people because it is so much work, we did it anyway.

[Wheres Toto]

The trash doesn't surprise me but the pooping thing does.  I've never seen anything like that and we've camped all over NJ is state and county parks.   I don't understand why someone would go in a parking lot instead of walking to a facility, with running water and TP.  

[Pam in CT]

7 hours ago, Tanaqui said:

Are the national parks actually physically *gated*? Smaller ones like Liberty Island can be, I suppose but... how're you gonna put a fence and a gate around Yellowstone?

Many national park sites are either not gated at all -- only the buildings and very selected areas require entrance (Mammoth Cave/KY), or have public roads cutting through them (Smoky Mountain/NC-TN, Shenandoah/VA), or have gated sections interspersed with private/residential/ungated areas (Acadia/ME) that make access in practice open, on the honor system.  I can understand a family who's planned a vacation for months and paid for non-refundable airfare and accommodations being quite frustrated with a shutdown that hinders their longstanding plans.  (Not CONDONING skittering into technically closed park sections, and certainly not condoning leaving trash behind -- understanding.)

 

9 hours ago, Danae said:

I think there are more people in the world who would pile their trash on top of an overflowing trash can than wouldn't. Even when the can is in their own house and there's a bin right outside the back door they could dump it in. So I'm not at all surprised that people would leave trash in a pile rather than hauling it out with them.

  Hey, that's MY house!!

 

8 hours ago, Amira said:

I had a totally different reaction to hearing that.  Yes, I completely agree that people should take their trash with them (and be aware of generating less trash and recycling more and a whole host of environmentally-friendly things), but I don’t think that’s the problem here.  Keeping places trash-free is bigger than individuals. Instead, it’s weird to me that a wealthy country’s government would just stop picking up trash when it is capable of doing so. The country I currently live in has a trash problem and the government has been unable to deal with it because of infrastructure and other significant contributing factors that the US doesn’t face. Individuals can’t just take care of their own trash here because there’s nowhere to put it where it will be taken away. It’s ludicrous to me that the US government would choose to do this.

This.

The issue is not having infrastructure and services to haul garbage away.   It's not like there are roomy dumpsters available outside the technically-closed park ready to receive dirty diapers, leftover picnic remnants

 

5 minutes ago, Where's Toto? said:

The trash doesn't surprise me but the pooping thing does.  I've never seen anything like that and we've camped all over NJ is state and county parks.   I don't understand why someone would go in a parking lot instead of walking to a facility, with running water and TP.  

My understanding is that those facilities (including the porte-potties) are closed and locked.

[Garga]

4 hours ago, Carrie12345 said:

Humans are disgusting.

Also, I am not the superhero I like to think I am.  I was pumping gas last week and saw a guy, sitting in his parked car, IN THE FIRE LANE, with plenty of people in the immediate vicinity, open his car window and toss out a crumpled piece of paper onto the ground. I was completely dumbstruck.

I have seen people toss entire fast food bags out their window. While that enrages me, they don't run any risk of confrontation (unless a cop happens to see it.) But then, there I was in a parking lot, and I was so shocked I couldn't confront that jerk! Nor did anyone else.

 

I have a little friend. She’s quiet and about 5’2 and skinny.  When she lived in DC, she lived next door to a drug house.  She was getting sick of their antics.  One day, one of the drug people was hanging on on the street in a group and tossed some trash on the sidewalk in front of her house.  She said, “Pick it up.”  He spoke in another language indicating he didn’t know English.  In one of those perfect moments, it happened that the language he spoke was one she had studied, so she switched to his language and told him to pick it up.  

I’m not sure how she didn’t end up dead, but the drug dealer left his group of people and came over and picked up the trash like the skinny 5’2 woman told him to.  I was constantly terrified I’d be getting the call that she’d been murdered with the way she stood up to those guys.  I think what saved her is that she was very, very quiet.  So when she told them to get off her lawn or pick up their trash, she did it so quietly they figured she must have been completely crazy and they were scared of her. Like a tiny Clint Eastwood.

[SamanthaCarter]

Are people bringing trash in to make a point? This is the off season. 

[elegantlion]

As quickly as my trash cans in a 3 person household get filled, I'm not surprised. Some people may honestly think that someone is picking it up, just on a delayed schedule. Others may just be jerks. I read an article yesterday, can't remember which park, which stated they had less than a dozen people still on staff for a park with hundreds of visitors. 

[moonflower]

I wonder about school culture too.  I dunno, I've just never in my life left trash outside a trash receptacle in a public place.  To be fair, I don't understand littering either, but maybe I expected better from people who are exploring the National Parks?  I know dealing with your own trash when you're away from home is not fun; I've camped/cabined before in pack-it-out places and finding a place to eventually dispose of diapers and food waste and etc. is not always easy.  On one trip, I found a local dump (by local I mean an hour down the mountain, but that was fine) where you could pay I think $15 or so to dump a car load - I paid $15 for a few bags.  Another time - the first time I realized I was stuck with the trash we packed out and a 10 hour drive from home! - I just asked the guy at the front desk of the hotel we were staying at on the way home how I should deal with it.  I figure they're used to that question in an area where a lot of people drive up into the mountains for a few days and would know what the SOP is.  They let me use their dumpster, which was great.

But in any case you can't just leave it on the roadside, or next to a full trash bin.

[moonflower]

2 minutes ago, elegantlion said:

As quickly as my trash cans in a 3 person household get filled, I'm not surprised. Some people may honestly think that someone is picking it up, just on a delayed schedule. Others may just be jerks. I read an article yesterday, can't remember which park, which stated they had less than a dozen people still on staff for a park with hundreds of visitors. 

 

That makes sense, I hadn't considered that.

[Faith-manor]

9 minutes ago, elegantlion said:

As quickly as my trash cans in a 3 person household get filled, I'm not surprised. Some people may honestly think that someone is picking it up, just on a delayed schedule. Others may just be jerks. I read an article yesterday, can't remember which park, which stated they had less than a dozen people still on staff for a park with hundreds of visitors. 

True. I think a lot people are quite confused about what happens during a government shut down. They may also not understand what "essential personnel" means so think that trash is essential. I honestly wish that when things like this happen, instead of a lot of the nonsense that pollutes the news cycle, it would be nice if journalists would do some good, public education stories like "what to expect during the shut down and in detail" which could then be shared and posted all over social media. Too many people do not understand what is going on, and that's a real problem.

[livetoread]

Not to be too dramatic, but we are always just a few steps away from the breakdown of civilization as we know it. I’m not saying we are close because of feces, but just that the sense of common good and societal bonds are easily frayed, especially in our country, and when it goes too far, people generally look out for themselves.

[Faith-manor]

5 minutes ago, livetoread said:

Not to be too dramatic, but we are always just a few steps away from the breakdown of civilization as we know it. I’m not saying we are close because of feces, but just that the sense of common good and societal bonds are easily frayed, especially in our country, and when it goes too far, people generally look out for themselves.

Agreed. And sometimes I do feel like it is more of a danger in the US than other developed nations simply because of the extreme, rugged individualism, individuals' rights kind of mentality that is often so prevalent here. We forget that we are a community, a society, that there is interdependence necessary in order to keep it going.

[Faith-manor]

This gives me a great idea though. I have an ecology team through 4H, four young ladies who are very environmentally conscience. I think that it would be great when the shut down is resolved, to take them on a field trip to one of our National Lakeshores or forests and see if there is any volunteer clean up work to be done. While we aren't having a major trash issue here, I would still imagine there would be routine maintenance and cleaning that has been neglected and maybe the rangers would like some free hands to help. It's worth checking into as it seems like a perfect service opportunity for 4H'ers, and they always learn a lot when in the company of the rangers.

[sassenach]

5 hours ago, MEmama said:

In most large parks there are a thousand ways to walk in. Of course the gates are closed, but that doesn't mean people won't just park and walk around them.

My mother did that in Acadia during the last shutdown. I was so angry; I told her they were begging people to stay out for all the obvious reasons; she didn't care. I warned her there were no services if she got hurt or had a heart issue; didn't make any difference.  She wanted to go so she went. I was livid (but it's typical...sigh).

The older I get the deeper I understand why good behaviour requires good government. Left to their own devices, too many people will allow their selfishness to take over and destroy something that could be good for all (parks, healthcare, infrastructure, you name it). It's sickening to me.

I don’t think that’s accurate for this shut down. It sounds like maintenance is shut down but rangers and other staff are not. 

Also, at least for Yosemite, which was the main topic of the article, closing the gates would solve 99.9% of the issue. The gates are WAY far from the valley. 

Edited January 3, 2019 by sassenach

[unsinkable]

29 minutes ago, elegantlion said:

As quickly as my trash cans in a 3 person household get filled, I'm not surprised. Some people may honestly think that someone is picking it up, just on a delayed schedule. Others may just be jerks. I read an article yesterday, can't remember which park, which stated they had less than a dozen people still on staff for a park with hundreds of visitors. 

Right...this might be a lot of it. 

People piling garbage around a garbage can that is full is a different mindset than throwing trash willy-nilly where ever they happen to be.

They might figure it will be picked up eventually or even think they did "enough" by putting it near a can.

[unsinkable]

39 minutes ago, SamanthaCarter said:

Are people bringing trash in to make a point? This is the off season. 

LOL

This wouldn't surprise me at all.

[unsinkable]

2 hours ago, HeighHo said:

No surprise. I spend youth baseball season picking up after families who thow their trash out the window as they drive by.  Apparently the concept of a trash bag in the vehicle is too much.  Luckily there aren't many diapers. And the lack of respect for gates and closed parks is never ending -- around here community parks are closed and gated from Nov 1 to April 1 --  just makes it easier to pick up the drug dealers as they adopt it as their commerce spot.

And its not just parks; I crossed a ski resort of my list when our family went back to the vehicle and had lunch, only to look out the window and see a female drop trou two cars ahead of us  and imitate a cow rather than walk across the parking lot and use the very nice facility which at that moment had no line.  The lack of personal responsibility is huge.

Leave No Trace, Pack it in/pack it out....these people aren't there for the view.  

The US has certainly changed.

 

Maybe the woman was having an issue and didn't want to pee or poop in her pants.

It's hard to believe you'd stop going to a ski resort bc one random woman peed or pooped in the parking lot one time.

That seems like an overreaction.

[unsinkable]

IME, there has been MORE education about ecology, environment, personal responsibility to the Earth than there used to be. I grew up in the 70s and 80s and remember the lessons on not littering, etc. I remember the change in neighborhoods, as they got cleaned up and kids, IME, were in the forefront. 

This was the age of pull off pop and beer tabs and in the 70s, it wasn't unusual to cut your feet on them, even on your own lawn, bc people tossed them everywhere. But that eventually decreased, even when they were still making the pull-offs (and then the tops changed).

(Blew out my flip-flop...stepped on a pop top...cut my heel, had to cruise on back home...I told DH our kids would probably never cut their footsies on a pop top).

Edited January 3, 2019 by unsinkable

[Carol in Cal.]

8 hours ago, mathnerd said:

I remember there being an Entrance Fee that I had to pay to purchase a pass to get into yosemite.

I’ve heard that they put a sign.up saying that the fee is waived during the shutdown.

Thank God it’s not fire season.  

[happi duck]

Some parks do have volunteers cleaning up.  Joshua Tree is one I specifically heard about.

[goldberry]

This thread makes me so sad for humanity.  There is something about littering that has always struck me very deeply, it's symbolic to me of incredible selfishness and total lack of respect both for other humans and for the earth. I once said to DH that it's a good thing I'm not God, because littering makes me so disproportionately angry I would zap litterers with lightning.  It definitely is one of my pet peeves/pushes my buttons/however you would describe it.

[Carol in Cal.]

8 hours ago, unsinkable said:

IME, there has been MORE education about ecology, environment, personal responsibility to the Earth than there used to be. I grew up in the 70s and 80s and remember the lessons on not littering, etc. I remember the change in neighborhoods, as they got cleaned up and kids, IME, were in the forefront. 

This was the age of pull off pop and beer tabs and in the 70s, it wasn't unusual to cut your feet on them, even on your own lawn, bc people tossed them everywhere. But that eventually decreased, even when they were still making the pull-offs (and then the tops changed).

(Blew out my flip-flop...stepped on a pop top...cut my heel, had to cruise on back home...I told DH our kids would probably never cut their footsies on a pop top).

This is true—I remember cutting my feet on broken glass on beaches if I wasn’t extremely watchful, too.  But I think that public restrooms were a lot more readilly available, in a casual way, and that people were more embarrassed by even the idea of defecation in public, and also tended to foresee the need for a trowel on a long hike, or at least saw the necessity of burial, if only with a stick, should the need arise out in wild nature.  Plus they were more likely to have experienced that need and the process as kids, which makes it easier to suss out as an adult.

Edited January 4, 2019 by Carol in Cal.

[EmseB]

13 hours ago, sassenach said:

I really don’t understand why the gates are still open if they can’t run the parks. 

They just closed the gates out here on Sequoia and Kings Canyon. 

[Laura in CA]

1 hour ago, happi duck said:

Some parks do have volunteers cleaning up.  Joshua Tree is one I specifically heard about.

 

... yes, and getting his life threatened! People are so disgusting.

LA Times article:

That situation — and the multiplying trash — has spurred volunteerism, but it also has many locals nervous. “I’ve gone through 500 rolls of toilet paper,” said Rand Abbott, a Joshua Tree rock-climber and volunteer who started restocking park toilets on Saturday, the first full day of the shutdown. “And I’ve been emptying all the trash cans that are there and putting bags in. And then I’ve been giving out trash bags to people. I’ve probably put 60 hours in.”

Abbott, a 54-year-old Marine Corps veteran and paraplegic who is well known in the climbing community, said he has also been trying to talk visitors out of illegal fires, illegal parking, littering and other forbidden activities. Some comply right away, but “70% of the people I’m running into are extremely rude,” Abbott said. “Yesterday, I had my life threatened two times. It’s crazy in there right now.”

 

 

 

[TABmom]

I'm not surprised. We went to Sea World last year and we were among the last people leaving the park, so we were walking back to our car through a parking lot that was mostly empty. There was trash everywhere. Everywhere. I was shocked and we were talking about it a lot. It was as if every single car, set all of their trash in the parking lot next to the car before they left. There were just piles of trash everywhere. I ranted about it a lot and my kids were left with no question about how awful i thought the whole thing was. But the kicker was, every show we went to all day long had a "take care of our world" message. It couldn't have been more obvious if they got us over the head with it. And after listening to this all day, 1000s of people got in their cars and dumped their trash in the parking lot. 

[Annie G]

At one point Illinois government had no budget and they did the same kind of thing but in the parks we visited they removed the trash cans. They figured out people will do a little better taking their own stuff out if there is not a trash can nearby. Weird, but I guess it worked. 

[Scarlett]

2 hours ago, happi duck said:

Some parks do have volunteers cleaning up.  Joshua Tree is one I specifically heard about.

I heard that yesterday on NPR

 

[katilac]

4 hours ago, SamanthaCarter said:

Are people bringing trash in to make a point? This is the off season. 

 

Even the very slowest times mean over 100,000 visitors per month at Yosemite. "Off season" definitely does not mean only a few visitors!