Musings on perception of affluence and acceptable spending

[Soror]

Musings on peoples comments and reactions... rant and maybe a JAWM... people spend their money how they want and live with the choices!

Dh and I have a 2 week vaca to Scotland planned for May. It is our 25th anniversary year and he's graduating college. Woot!

The things some people say is ... something. Oh, you must be rich. I could never afford that. Then there are the comments that imply that we are being frivolous.

Ironically the guy who would give dh the most grief about how lucky he was had 2 new cars and upgraded his house twice within a few years time and was also bragging about his spendy meals out. 

Now, if we wanted all of those things we couldn't afford trips. It's just different priorities and preferences. I don't care for a big, fancy house. That's just more to clean. I have never bought a new car and don't want one. I replaced my 17 year old van 2 years ago with a 4 year old car- the cost difference between the car I bought and a new car was enough to send my family of 6 to Europe for 3 weeks. I know that becasue with used prices up I considered a new one but I couldn't bring myself to spend that much and kept shopping until I found one for a price I wanted to pay. To plenty of people that would be silly as a car is something you drive every day. I thought after the fact I should have went for one even older and done another trip 🙂

I just find it a bit funny that if we bought new cars or a bigger house or upgraded my furniture (all of mine was bought used except my Ikea living room set and department store recliner) it would seen as perfectly normal thing to do but instead spending money on trips and its frivolous. 

Then when dh tells them how we cheaply vacation(no checked bags, cooking most of our meals, laundering our clothes etc) they say oh we couldn't do that either. To us seeing places is worth doing it on the cheap as we have limited funds. I use credit card rewards to make those stretch even further.

[scbusf]

Same here. We have been on 2 Disney cruises in the past 2 years. We don’t have a huge, fancy house. We don’t have fancy cars. DH is a saver and he has spreadsheets galore and we worked hard to save up for those trips. We got so many comments about those cruises - Just like the ones you are getting. 
 

Congrats on the anniversary and graduation!!!! 

[SKL]

Never apologize for either your blessings or the good consequences of your choices.

I come from a very working-class background.  I heard a lot of "it must be nice."  I did my share of minimizing how nice it actually is to be able to travel.  I wish I didn't.

One day I'd had enough.  My older brother heard I was going on a trip somewhere, and he said, "it must be nice."

My response was approximately:

"Yeah, it is nice.  It's called delayed gratification.  I've finished 21 years of school and worked 2 jobs most of my adult life.  I've never spent a penny on alcohol, tobacco, or illegal drugs.  I am still wearing the clothes I got for Christmas in undergrad.  I don't buy "big toys."  I don't have hobbies.  So yeah, it's nice to be able to take a trip.  It is!  Is there something wrong with that?  Also, do you realize how many thousands of dollars you could have saved up if you weren't a smoker for all these years?  You could go on a trip too if you had chosen differently."

I never heard "it must be nice" again.  😛

Edited February 18 by SKL

[KungFuPanda]

People are weird. It takes me almost as long to get to California as it does to London but there are people that would consider one a much bigger deal than the other. 

[Kassia]

I can't believe people actually comment to you on how you spend your money!  I guess it would be different if you were asking for handouts or owed them money and then going on what they thought was a frivolous vacation, but otherwise it's none of their business!  

ETA and congratulations on the anniversary and graduation!  Definitely a lot to celebrate!

 

Edited February 18 by Kassia

[SanDiegoMom]

My nephew’s girlfriend’s family invited my nephew on a trip to Ireland - 2 weeks or so.  My mom said something along the lines of must be nice to be so rich. My parents have plenty of money to go on a trip like that every year if they wanted, but travel makes them incredibly anxious,  so they do very little of it!  I am genuinely happy when people are able to enjoy their money and especially like it when they travel, so I can hear all about new places!    

[Carol in Cal.]

We drive very old cars.  We buy only used cars (since 1989) and drive them further into the ground that most people can even imagine.  And because of that, and because we also don’t spend on new decor, we have a cabin.  I truly never dreamed of such a thing, but a bunch of stuff broke right for us (DH’s most high paying job ever, right when interest rates AND vacation real estate prices were very low all at the same time) and our frugality paid off for us.  But also, we sacrificed, big time, for me to be able to stay home with DD for quite a long time while she was young, and took some heat for that, too.  People are funny.

Edited February 18 by Carol in Cal.

[Arcadia]

10 minutes ago, Soror said:

I just find it a bit funny that if we bought new cars or a bigger house or upgraded my furniture (all of mine was bought used except my Ikea living room set and department store recliner) it would seen as perfectly normal thing to do but instead spending money on trips and its frivolous. 

In my parents generation, it would be seen as a hierarchy of needs. So a newer or bigger car might be due to a need, like my friend earns money driving her kid’s classmates to school since she is driving her own kid. Expense on the house is also mainly viewed as a need. Vacation trips were viewed as coming from disposable income or fun money.

My in-laws has never taken their kids for a vacation so my husband’s first “vacation” was his semester in a study abroad program. To them vacation is a want and that money can be used for their retirement savings. They did ask their kids to pay for their vacations when their kids start working (part of many reasons I am wary of them). 
 

Enjoy your vacation. Congratulations on your husband’s graduation and your wedding anniversary. Ignore those people because they will say whatever they will say. 
 

6 minutes ago, Kassia said:

I can't believe people actually comment to you on how you spend your money! 

My husband’s parents and brother do that. It is a dog in the manger attitude plus trying to size up your wealth mentality.  

[Katy]

I’m sorry people are giving you grief. I would gently and with a smile shrug and say, “Everyone spends money differently. We don’t have new cars, houses, or furniture. I’m sure those things cost more than a few week trip.”

I buy most things second hand too. Antiques, furniture, and art are mostly from estate sales. 

[MEmama]

My in laws are the type to make travelling a big deal with the snarky "must be nice" comments. Truth is they can afford it just fine, they just have no interest. I think commenting on others gives them an out for not wanting to leave their little suburb. They would be more impressed by us if we bought a McMansion in the suburbs and drove fancy cars. They also  make a big deal for spending any of their own money with chipper comments like "well there goes your inheritance!". We're like go live your lives and spend the money you earned and saved! It's so needlessly uncomfortable.

My parents, on the other hand, have always prioritized travel. They love that their only grandson lives overseas and that we travel as often as we can get away. They travel in Europe for months on end, as many times a year as they are allowed (given the 3 month Schengen rule). They think we are clever to have a smaller house and live comfortably within our means, which in turn allows us to vacation. We both take after my parents, thankfully.
 

Idk why anyone could possibly care what other people do or don't do with their money, that's very strange to me. 

[Carol in Cal.]

Thinking further—I have never bought a new stove in my whole life, and the only new couch I have ever bought was a cheap IKEA one for my then. new office.  Ditto dining table sets.  Our washing machine is so old that we can’t buy most parts for it anymore, and our dryer was used when we bought it so it’s even older.  We repair these as best as we can.  And guess what?  We are not deprived!  We do live well!  We just try to avoid spending money on new stuff when older, less expensive stuff is usable.  Often these days it’s actually better quality than what is new.  

[SKL]

But honestly - why is our go-to response "but look what I don't spend money on"?

If it's your money, it's your money.  Spend it in whatever way feels right.

I guess we were brought up in a culture that highly values frugality - and for good reason.  I'm not advocating waste.  If you know me, you know that I don't consider travel to be waste.  There are choices that may be considered luxuries, but there are reasons why we choose them over the alternatives.  Maybe a time constraint, a health constraint, work requirements, or just "this is a bucket list item."  I don't know anyone who just throws away money because they can.

People don't know this, but every year, since I made more than enough money to keep me out of bankruptcy, I've always given away more than I spent on myself every year.  Sometimes many times what I spent on myself.  And don't get me started on the taxes I pay.  I guess that's one of the reasons it bugs me when people act like I'm frivolous or selfish.

Funny contrast though - my other brother used to call me "Mother Teresa" because I kept wearing the same clothes for so long.  Like that's any of his business either.  😛  If I were buying new clothes, how would I have the money to help him pay his bills that he made buying new clothes?  😛  But that's long in the past.  I should actually try to forget all of that.

[Pawz4me]

I think it's a whole ball of lack of self awareness, tendency to judge, insecurity about one's own choices, wanting to validate (or have validated) our own choices, and lots of other things. In short -- human nature.

[Carol in Cal.]

But SKL, most of us have to decide what to spend our money on.   Some of us have decided to spend it on charitable giving and a cabin.  (Me.). Some of us have decided to spend more conventionally on new cars, clothes, appliances, and decor.  It’s a bit of a zero sum game, in a sense.  I don’t have enough income to spend it on all the things, but my choices are seen as weird by some, but suit me really well.  

And actually, it’s helpful to people, at times, to hear what someone else does differently, so that they can truly consider their choices rather than being on autopilot.  I distinctly remember being in a car full of people when I was still working in engineering, and mentioning that I only paid a total of $7500 for my last used car (this was a long time ago), that I budgeted $1000 to refurbish it during the first year of ownership, and that I would probably drive it for about 10 years.  Before that everyone had been saying that they only bought new so that they didn’t inherit someone else’s car trouble, but once they heard my actual numbers they reconsidered because I spent only about a third of what they did.  

[City Mouse]

Yeah, it is all about choices, but it sure is annoying when other people make comments about your own family choices whether it is about spending or other things.
 

When my DD (soon to be 29) was a baby my MIL used to make comments about how good it was that my SIL stayed home with her child and golden grandchild did not have to go today care and instead went to some posh mothers-day-out program 2 or 3 days a week. One day I got fed up and agreed with her that it was nice for SIL and golden grandchild that BIL made such good money that they could afford a house, 2 cars, a stay at home mom, and mothers-day-out. Unfortunately her own son as a rookie policeman did not make that much money, and if I did not use the college education that I paid for and work as a teacher, we would have to move into the income based apartments down the street, have one car that we shared, and would not be able to put DD in a pre-school of any kind. My MIL never said anything about our financial choices again. 

[DawnM]

Eh, who cares what they think.   We are taking a huge trip with all 6 of us this summer and it is going to cost what a used car would cost.   We are ok with that.

I have a friend who is always "broke."   But she makes $70k and drives a Lexus she bought new and gets expensive hair treatments, facials, nice meals out, etc...she doesn't have to be broke, but she makes those choices.

We have 4 cars (and 4 drivers).   Three of our cars are 2014 and one is 2004!   They all run and are doing fine.   We even took our 2004 vehicle on a long trip recently.

[Kassia]

15 minutes ago, SKL said:

 

Funny contrast though - my other brother used to call me "Mother Teresa" because I kept wearing the same clothes for so long.  Like that's any of his business either.  😛  If I were buying new clothes, how would I have the money to help him pay his bills that he made buying new clothes?  

that would bug me

 

 

11 minutes ago, Pawz4me said:

I think it's a whole ball of lack of self awareness, tendency to judge, insecurity about one's own choices, wanting to validate (or have validated) our own choices, and lots of other things. In short -- human nature.

 

 

3 minutes ago, City Mouse said:

Yeah, it is all about choices, but it sure is annoying when other people make comments about your own family choices whether it is about spending or other things.

QFT on both of these!  🙂

[Soror]

1 hour ago, SKL said:

Never apologize for either your blessings or the good consequences of your choices.

I come from a very working-class background.  I heard a lot of "it must be nice."  I did my share of minimizing how nice it actually is to be able to travel.  I wish I didn't.

One day I'd had enough.  My older brother heard I was going on a trip somewhere, and he said, "it must be nice."

My response was approximately:

"Yeah, it is nice.  It's called delayed gratification.  I've finished 21 years of school and worked 2 jobs most of my adult life.  I've never spent a penny on alcohol, tobacco, or illegal drugs.  I am still wearing the clothes I got for Christmas in undergrad.  I don't buy "big toys."  I don't have hobbies.  So yeah, it's nice to be able to take a trip.  It is!  Is there something wrong with that?  Also, do you realize how many thousands of dollars you could have saved up if you weren't a smoker for all these years?  You could go on a trip too if you had chosen differently."

I never heard "it must be nice" again.  😛

Well played !  

1 hour ago, KungFuPanda said:

People are weird. It takes me almost as long to get to California as it does to London but there are people that would consider one a much bigger deal than the other. 

True, true!

1 hour ago, scbusf said:

Same here. We have been on 2 Disney cruises in the past 2 years. We don’t have a huge, fancy house. We don’t have fancy cars. DH is a saver and he has spreadsheets galore and we worked hard to save up for those trips. We got so many comments about those cruises - Just like the ones you are getting. 
 

Congrats on the anniversary and graduation!!!! 

Enjoy your trip! I love spreadsheets but alas dh is not a fan 🙂 I still use them for goals but we use YNAB for budgeting. 

1 hour ago, SanDiegoMom said:

My nephew’s girlfriend’s family invited my nephew on a trip to Ireland - 2 weeks or so.  My mom said something along the lines of must be nice to be so rich. My parents have plenty of money to go on a trip like that every year if they wanted, but travel makes them incredibly anxious,  so they do very little of it!  I am genuinely happy when people are able to enjoy their money and especially like it when they travel, so I can hear all about new places!    

My parents get anxious about travel but are supportive. 

1 hour ago, Arcadia said:

In my parents generation, it would be seen as a hierarchy of needs. So a newer or bigger car might be due to a need, like my friend earns money driving her kid’s classmates to school since she is driving her own kid. Expense on the house is also mainly viewed as a need. Vacation trips were viewed as coming from disposable income or fun money.

My in-laws has never taken their kids for a vacation so my husband’s first “vacation” was his semester in a study abroad program. To them vacation is a want and that money can be used for their retirement savings. They did ask their kids to pay for their vacations when their kids start working (part of many reasons I am wary of them). 
 

Enjoy your vacation. Congratulations on your husband’s graduation and your wedding anniversary. Ignore those people because they will say whatever they will say. 
 

My husband’s parents and brother do that. It is a dog in the manger attitude plus trying to size up your wealth mentality.  

I'd say transportation is a need but a new car is not a need. For some, they find it a worthwhile use of their money and get great enjoyment out of it. Dh and I are not those people!

52 minutes ago, MEmama said:

My in laws are the type to make travelling a big deal with the snarky "must be nice" comments. Truth is they can afford it just fine, they just have no interest. I think commenting on others gives them an out for not wanting to leave their little suburb. They would be more impressed by us if we bought a McMansion in the suburbs and drove fancy cars. They also  make a big deal for spending any of their own money with chipper comments like "well there goes your inheritance!". We're like go live your lives and spend the money you earned and saved! It's so needlessly uncomfortable.

My parents, on the other hand, have always prioritized travel. They love that their only grandson lives overseas and that we travel as often as we can get away. They travel in Europe for months on end, as many times a year as they are allowed (given the 3 month Schengen rule). They think we are clever to have a smaller house and live comfortably within our means, which in turn allows us to vacation. We both take after my parents, thankfully.
 

Idk why anyone could possibly care what other people do or don't do with their money, that's very strange to me. 

This is my mil. When her brother and wife went on a 3-month trip she was very sour about it and made so many comments. The fact is she has much more money than they do but chooses not to spend it on travel. I can't ever figure her out.

Edited February 18 by Soror

[Mrs Tiggywinkle Again]

One of my sisters has a very nice lifestyle due to making a good marriage choice, frankly.  I’m talking million dollar house in a beach community, very expensive travel sports, etc. I suspect though they are in a good amount of debt. 
Another sister has not made good marriage choices more than once.  So she is a single mom with one baby dad tens of thousands in child support arrears that he can never pay and one baby dad who has 50/50 and doesn’t pay child support but who spends his fairly decent income paying his lawyer to tie my sister up in court which will likely go on another ten years.  She has nothing after basic living expenses and attorney fees, and frankly with the choices my fifteen year old niece is making and encouraged to make, I expect there’s going to be a baby in the next year or two to support.

it’s all choices.  We could afford my first sister’s lifestyle but have chosen a small ranch house with a low mortgage payment, drive older cars that are paid off or almost paid off, and we put our money into private school/homeschooling and I travel with the kids. Plus when my other sister makes those comments like OP mentioned, I have to bite my tongue because frankly I work two jobs and my husband works 72 hours most weeks.  We are probably at the pinnacle of our careers making very good salaried and that’s happened through years of building a reputation of excellence and hard, hard work.

Everyone gets to choose who they’ll marry, have babies with, what jobs they’ll pursue, and how to spend the money they have.  We all choose based on our personal priorities.

Edited February 18 by Mrs Tiggywinkle Again

[Soror]

12 minutes ago, City Mouse said:

Yeah, it is all about choices, but it sure is annoying when other people make comments about your own family choices whether it is about spending or other things.
 

When my DD (soon to be 29) was a baby my MIL used to make comments about how good it was that my SIL stayed home with her child and golden grandchild did not have to go today care and instead went to some posh mothers-day-out program 2 or 3 days a week. One day I got fed up and agreed with her that it was nice for SIL and golden grandchild that BIL made such good money that they could afford a house, 2 cars, a stay at home mom, and mothers-day-out. Unfortunately her own son as a rookie policeman did not make that much money, and if I did not use the college education that I paid for and work as a teacher, we would have to move into the income based apartments down the street, have one car that we shared, and would not be able to put DD in a pre-school of any kind. My MIL never said anything about our financial choices again. 

How insensitive! Good for you for standing up for yourself. 

17 minutes ago, Carol in Cal. said:

But SKL, most of us have to decide what to spend our money on.   Some of us have decided to spend it on charitable giving and a cabin.  (Me.). Some of us have decided to spend more conventionally on new cars, clothes, appliances, and decor.  It’s a bit of a zero sum game, in a sense.  I don’t have enough income to spend it on all the things, but my choices are seen as weird by some, but suit me really well.  

And actually, it’s helpful to people, at times, to hear what someone else does differently, so that they can truly consider their choices rather than being on autopilot.  I distinctly remember being in a car full of people when I was still working in engineering, and mentioning that I only paid a total of $7500 for my last used car (this was a long time ago), that I budgeted $1000 to refurbish it during the first year of ownership, and that I would probably drive it for about 10 years.  Before that everyone had been saying that they only bought new so that they didn’t inherit someone else’s car trouble, but once they heard my actual numbers they reconsidered because I spent only about a third of what they did.  

Yes, I say that all the time with budgeting I don't have enough to spend on all the things so I pick and choose and prioritize. 

---------------------------------

Dh had an aha moment when his Dad passed IRT travel. His Dad had always wanted to see the Grand Canyon but for whatever reason it never happened. Dh would have liked to take him but of course, when things get to that point travel is difficult and MIL would have thrown a fit.

6 months or so after his Dad passed I told dh we needed to finally do a trip overseas. We really wanted to when we were around our 5th anniversary but I got pregnant and we played it safe and put aside cash. Another time we could have but again played it safe and conservative and didn't. I said it's time. For months he didn't believe me that we could pull it off. I researched and planned and schemed and finally got him to believe me and he joined in on the planning. Then a couple of years after that I told him that I wanted to take all the kids. Again he didn't believe me but we pulled it off. 

I only have regrets about the trips we didn't take, not of the ones we did. 

[Clarita]

You just can't care about their perception. For us it's opposite, we spend money to make our home better because we don't travel. Then people make comments about my "fancy" cabinets or whatever. I smile and move on with those people. I tried justifying it once to someone like that and there really is no reasoning with them. If you prove to them they are the bigger spender or a similar spender, then they'll just be mad at you for judging them, when they started the whole stupid conversation. 

Edited February 18 by Clarita
typo

[HomeAgain]

I call it the Facebook effect.  You see a glimpse of each person's decisions, but taken all together it rolls the experiences into a singular entity.  So if a person is going to Scotland, you also assume they are doing well enough to have the bigger house and the newer cars and....you don't necessarily see a singular decision.

And it makes a difference in perception if you are not out of the 'norm' that the person experiences.  If most of their friends are getting by/have normal purchases, then an interesting vacation looks more out of place.  Probably the same person wouldn't bat an eye if you went to WDW, but wouldn't even realize it's the same cost to go to Scotland (seriously, we priced out a trip to Paris for the same length as WDW and it was a bit less).

[mommyoffive]

We have traveled a lot with the kids and have run into people who say things like that.  Honestly I don't bring things up with those kinds of people anymore.  It is just easier.  You know who they are and what they are going to say, why even go there?  I am also careful to not say things to people I know don't have the means to travel to the places we have.  So basically I only talk about travels with "safe" people.  That isn't the term that I am really meaning, but you know what I mean.  People who are happy for you and you feel the same for them when they go somewhere.  I am just not someone to bring up and brag about anything either so it just works.  I don't feel the need to do that.  Basically I don't really talk about our travels ever really to outside people.   Now to each other we talk about trips all the time.  And we have taught the kids to not brag about things either.  So many of their friends brag and brag and brag about going somewhere and they find that really annoying so I make that a talking point, yeah you don't want to be that person.   I feel like people take you bringing up the vacation as a brag and then instantly go into an attacking mode to make themselves feel better about it.   I don't even want to start into that.

[SKL]

1 hour ago, Carol in Cal. said:

But SKL, most of us have to decide what to spend our money on.   Some of us have decided to spend it on charitable giving and a cabin.  (Me.). Some of us have decided to spend more conventionally on new cars, clothes, appliances, and decor.  It’s a bit of a zero sum game, in a sense.  I don’t have enough income to spend it on all the things, but my choices are seen as weird by some, but suit me really well.  

And actually, it’s helpful to people, at times, to hear what someone else does differently, so that they can truly consider their choices rather than being on autopilot.  I distinctly remember being in a car full of people when I was still working in engineering, and mentioning that I only paid a total of $7500 for my last used car (this was a long time ago), that I budgeted $1000 to refurbish it during the first year of ownership, and that I would probably drive it for about 10 years.  Before that everyone had been saying that they only bought new so that they didn’t inherit someone else’s car trouble, but once they heard my actual numbers they reconsidered because I spent only about a third of what they did.  

I must have worded my comment poorly.  Of course most of us have to make choices, myself included.  Not only does nobody spend on "all the things," but nobody I know would want to do that.  As we move through life, some of us get an expanded range of choices, but nobody I know has a money tree in the backyard.

My point was that we shouldn't feel like we have to explain this to anyone else (except maybe our kids, when they say "why don't we do the things Family X does?")  For one thing, it should be a given, shouldn't it?  Why is it our fault if someone else thinks "they paid for ___, they must be filthy rich!"  For another thing, I don't think that having a few extra bucks (or a lot of extra bucks) is a character flaw.

I think it's fine to explain to friends how one saved money as a positive discussion.  I used to be in the "frugalista" threads, because having been on the edge for so long, I kinda turned saving into a hobby.  I learned some things that could help others.  And I hope to pass some of these things along to my kids, so maybe they won't have to live on the edge as long as I did.  (Though a truly tight budget may be the best way to learn some of these things.)

Edited February 18 by SKL

[teachermom2834]

We send our dd to Catholic high school, which while not like the pricey prep schools around town, is not cheap. It isn’t really in line with the frugal ways in which we have always lived but it is this one thing we have chosen to do with this one child left at home.

Some people that have known us forever all of a sudden think we are made of money. Not that things might be tight because we are doing this thing we decided was best. 
 

People are so weird about money.

[PronghornD]

I have somewhat negative feelings about the course of this discussion. "Everyone has choices" -- well, sort of. We seem to be talking about middle-class-and-above people pretty much in our responses.

Once I was talking to a guy who lived on SSI, with drug dealers literally on his doorstep. He was talking about how you could get free furniture after floods because rich people would throw it out just because it got wet. My first thought was that rich people would not be living in a flood plain. My second thought was that some of those living in a flood plain were truly rich to this person living on SSI.

When I was in college once I caught a ride to my mom's place with several other students. We met at one guy's parents' home, a modest ranch house. I don't know what caused this guy to say it to me, but he said, "I hope you don't think we are rich." My response was, "Well, you have a boat." And perhaps that was his only luxury. Now, I probably shouldn't have said that, but he probably understood better when they stopped in at my mother's apartment. My mother was sitting in the living room in her lawn chair. She did have a TV, I think, sitting on some boxes. I think there might have been a kitchen chair or two. I can't remember if there was any sort of table -- maybe a card table. One of the students asked my mother if he could stay overnight, and my mother said, "You are welcome to stay, but we don't have any beds." And she didn't mean any extra beds. She slept on the floor, as did my brothers.

Now, my mother still did make choices, of course. She made the choice to get her master's degree at the age of fifty or so. (She was poor before starting her master's degree but did have furniture.)

When people say, "It must be nice," I would just say, "I'm really grateful that I have enough income to allow me to save money for a trip. It's a wonderful blessing." It really is!

Edited February 18 by PronghornD

[Soror]

6 minutes ago, PronghornD said:

I have somewhat negative feelings about the course of this discussion. "Everyone has choices" -- well, sort of. We seem to be talking about middle class and above people pretty much in our responses.

Once I was talking to a guy who lived on SSI, with drug dealers literally on his doorstep. He was talking about how you could get free furniture after floods because rich people would throw it out just because it got wet. My first thought was that rich people would not be living in a flood plain. My second thought was that some of those living in a flood plain were truly rich to this person living on SSI.

When I was in college once I caught a ride to my mom's place with several other students. We met at one guy's parents' home, a modest ranch house. I don't know what caused this guy to say it to me, but he said, "I hope you don't think we are rich." My response was, "Well, you have a boat." And perhaps that was his only luxury. Now, I probably shouldn't have said that, but he probably understood better when they stopped in at my mother's apartment. My mother was sitting in the living room in her lawn chair. She did have a TV, I think, sitting on some boxes. I think there might have been a kitchen chair or two. I can't remember if there was any sort of table -- maybe a card table. One of the students asked my mother if he could stay overnight, and my mother said, "You are welcome to stay, but we don't have any beds." And she didn't mean any extra beds. She slept on the floor, as did my brothers.

Now, my mother still did make choices, of course. She made the choice to get her master's degree at the age of fifty or so. (She was still poor, though, before starting her master's degree.)

When people say, "It must be nice," I would just say I'm really grateful that I have enough income to allow me to save money for a trip. It's a wonderful blessing." It really is!

I was about to say something similar. Of course, it isn't all choices. It is some luck and some good fortune as well health, FOO, capabilities, timing etc. However, with the people making comments it is not ones that truly can't afford it it's ones that choose not to but don't own that. That's why I mentioned the fact the most vocal critic was one that was spending all sorts of money, on different things. With dh's coworkers that he is with the most he's on the bottom salary wise because his lack of degree. 

 

Edited February 18 by Soror

[Ottakee]

15 minutes ago, PronghornD said:

I have somewhat negative feelings about the course of this discussion. "Everyone has choices" -- well, sort of. We seem to be talking about middle-class-and-above people pretty much in our responses.

Once I was talking to a guy who lived on SSI, with drug dealers literally on his doorstep. He was talking about how you could get free furniture after floods because rich people would throw it out just because it got wet. My first thought was that rich people would not be living in a flood plain. My second thought was that some of those living in a flood plain were truly rich to this person living on SSI.

When I was in college once I caught a ride to my mom's place with several other students. We met at one guy's parents' home, a modest ranch house. I don't know what caused this guy to say it to me, but he said, "I hope you don't think we are rich." My response was, "Well, you have a boat." And perhaps that was his only luxury. Now, I probably shouldn't have said that, but he probably understood better when they stopped in at my mother's apartment. My mother was sitting in the living room in her lawn chair. She did have a TV, I think, sitting on some boxes. I think there might have been a kitchen chair or two. I can't remember if there was any sort of table -- maybe a card table. One of the students asked my mother if he could stay overnight, and my mother said, "You are welcome to stay, but we don't have any beds." And she didn't mean any extra beds. She slept on the floor, as did my brothers.

Now, my mother still did make choices, of course. She made the choice to get her master's degree at the age of fifty or so. (She was poor before starting her master's degree but did have furniture.)

When people say, "It must be nice," I would just say, "I'm really grateful that I have enough income to allow me to save money for a trip. It's a wonderful blessing." It really is!

I sorta/mostly agree.   I grew up in poverty and was working regularly before age 11 to help with the basics like clothing, etc.  it was just a way of life in our rural community.

Now as an adult, I am not making a huge amount of money but my frugal beginnings have taught me a lot about not needing much.   We are very comfortable and I save money for retirement but in paper I would be considered poverty or near poverty level.

I love to travel and that is a priority.   Much of my travel is backpacking so once I bought the basic gear (about $500) it is just gas to get to a place and very basic food.

I am doing a bigger trip this year to Italy but will be staying with a friend, using public transportation, and mostly eating grocery store type food.

On the flip side, I have a limited wardrobe and most is from the $2/item thrift store or Walmart clearance.  I don’t buy coffee out or gas station snacks, never had a manicure, and rarely go out to eat.  Those are choices that help my travel budget.

but there is also the element of being blessed such that I was able to sell a house when I got divorced and pay cash for one that is a lot smaller but fits my needs

[SanDiegoMom]

18 minutes ago, PronghornD said:

I have somewhat negative feelings about the course of this discussion. "Everyone has choices" -- well, sort of. We seem to be talking about middle class and above people pretty much in our responses.

 

I am only commenting on the people who actually have money, good money, and act like other people spending money "frivolously" on trips or what not as being a waste of money or implying that they would never be able to afford it. 

[SKL]

55 minutes ago, Soror said:

I was about to say something similar. Of course, it isn't all choices. It is some luck and some good fortune as well health, FOO, capabilities, timing etc. However, with the people making comments it is not ones that truly can't afford it it's ones that choose not to but don't own that. That's why I mentioned the fact the most vocal critic was one that was spending all sorts of money, on different things. With dh's coworkers that he is with the most he's on the bottom salary wise because his lack of degree.

Yes, I was talking about my older brother, who had been to Disney World multiple times (I had not been there).

I could have retorted to him, "it must be nice to be a male and automatically assumed to be worth a much higher salary than a female."  But I didn't.

My brother isn't rich, but he was born with the same choices I had!  He was the eldest and a boy.  He had more years of parochial education than I had.  He chose to drop out of college because it was eating into his hobby time.  He had every advantage as far as health and intelligence and stable parents that I had.

I didn't just make choices as in pushing button A instead of button B.  I worked my arse off 7 days a week.  I had so much anxiety over paying my student loans.  (If you only knew how many times and ways I contemplated suicide!)  I have always had housemates rather than pay rent/mortgage for independent living (and that isn't always easy!)

So when someone says, "it must be nice," really it wasn't all nice!  It was mostly freaking hard and scary and often felt impossible.  But sure, the end result is nice.  Is that a character flaw?

(The implication of "it must be nice" is that I must have been handed something I didn't deserve.  Spoken by someone who was handed the same or more, it's grating.)

Obviously I don't go around flaunting my trips in low-income neighborhoods.  But I shouldn't be afraid to mention, in my parents' house, something I'm looking forward to.  (I'm pretty sure I had told my mom, who then mentioned it in front of my brother.  I reserve the right to tell my mom if I'm going to travel.)

Edited February 18 by SKL

[denarii]

I just smile and say "yup it is nice". I don't need to justify to anybody how we chose to spend our money. 

[Bootsie]

DH and I have been very fortunate to be able to do a great deal of traveling over the years with our children.  While we have spent many summers in Europe, most of the time DH or I (often both) were working during that "vacation"; travel is important to us and we have found ways to do so economically.  Over the years we have had a number of people tell us "well, we just would never be able to afford a trip to Europe;  all we can afford is a trip to Disney World. and a week skiing in Colorado...."  Yet, DH and I are spending a lot less money on our trips than they are on their vacations.  We have been able to rent an apartment for a month in other countries for what they are paying for a hotel room for three nights.    DH and I often respond "Well, we can't afford to vacation in the US"

[SKL]

When I first joined the WTM community, I got my butt reamed for talking about choices.  So I know it's taboo, but really.

I know we don't all have the same choices.  But that doesn't mean most people can't benefit from making good choices instead of poor ones.  The choice to not drink, smoke, or use illegal drugs is one that anyone can make.  I am not saying it's easy.  But it's possible.  The choice to show enough respect at work so that you don't get repeatedly fired for stupid reasons is a choice almost everyone can make.  And then there are lots of choices that not everyone has, but a lot of the people who do have the choice don't choose it.  Like getting a marketable career certification or degree.  They've decided that other things are more important to them.  Fine.

Maybe when they see others, who started out in similar conditions, being able to do cool things, their minds are rebuking them for doing just the minimum to get by.  Maybe they don't like the rebuke, so they turn it around and somehow blame the person whose cool experience reminds them of their own choices.

 

[prairiewindmomma]

I “speak” more openly here than I do anywhere else. Close relatives have no idea we recently went to Europe, that we flew to Hawaii, etc. The kids told none of their friends, etc. We shouldn’t have to manage our conversations to this degree, but why make people uncomfortable with the nice things we are choosing to do? If they cant respond appropriately, why bring up the issue? So, we dont. 
 

In an ideal world, we’d all be comfortable with everyone’s different circumstances and choices, but people have their own insecurities and challenges and so talking about anything money related IRL is…complicated. 
 

It’s easier for them to see us driving 20+ year old cars with no ac and not know the rest. 

[goldberry]

6 minutes ago, prairiewindmomma said:

I “speak” more openly here than I do anywhere else. Close relatives have no idea we recently went to Europe, that we flew to Hawaii, etc. The kids told none of their friends, etc. We shouldn’t have to manage our conversations to this degree, but why make people uncomfortable with the nice things we are choosing to do? If they cant respond appropriately, why bring up the issue? So, we dont. 
 

In an ideal world, we’d all be comfortable with everyone’s different circumstances and choices, but people have their own insecurities and challenges and so talking about anything money related IRL is…complicated. 
 

It’s easier for them to see us driving 20+ year old cars with no ac and not know the rest. 

Wow, how do you manage that?  I am super private about money, but no way my family could be kept in the dark about 2 weeks of travel.  I talk to my elderly dad almost daily.  We are trying to be frugal to prepare for retirement. DH and I both self-employed, so no pension.  But, I have started planning for a trip to Italy.  I'm similar to others in this thread, and would rather do without MANY other things in order to travel.  We are serious about saving for retirement, but I have also seen too many people wait until they are in too poor health to do anything.  We want to balance it out.  We've even talked about maybe retiring in a mobile home so we could still afford to travel in an RV.  

[prairiewindmomma]

Find a white wall to do the video call against in your house and keep the photo frame tight (most places have white walls) , or call from outside without obvious visual background cues. I have long made video calls from weird places while waiting during kid activities, so new backgrounds arent different for me. I text daily, and then video call 2-3 times a week. We dont live in the same town, so it’s not like they are going to drop in. 
 

We travel for the same reasons—with my health issues we need to go now as there is no guarantee I will be able to travel later. 

[Ausmumof3]

I’m on the other side of this having had some pretty serious travel envy at times. Hopefully I was polite enough to say “how nice, I hope you have a fantastic trip!” And nothing else.

Our expensive choice was having a farm and I know there are people that really envy that, so I try to remind myself about that. We don’t have a fancy house either, most things are falling apart (but thankfully it’s big enough to be comfy for us all).

Stuff other than money can influence travel choices too.  Like I’m married to a guy who really is not into cultural stuff so if we have a trip, it’s going to be a fishing trip to the beach somewhere. We weren’t able to go for a few years between Covid and a career change that meant an income drop but we’ve finally got away and it made me feel so much happier. 

[crazyforlatin]

@soror That sounds like an exciting trip! I like the fact you just have a carry on. It’s the only way to travel for me to lessen stress. Are you staying at a house so that you can cook and do laundry? I have a friend who went back to Scotland after grad school, and I’ve always wanted to include it in a European travel just the way he used to talk about the country.

[pinball]

3 hours ago, SKL said:

When I first joined the WTM community, I got my butt reamed

Figuratively, I hope

[PronghornD]

5 hours ago, SKL said:

When I first joined the WTM community, I got my butt reamed for talking about choices.  So I know it's taboo, but really.

 

I don't think choices are taboo. They are quite popular and important. People's quality of life is definitely impacted by choices, and responsible people should own their choices.

However, my heart is still with the person who made the best choices they could reasonably make and yet gets blamed by society for their poor quality of life. Perhaps those people are a minority, but they are certainly not rare. And even some of those who actually make poor choices are influenced in those choices by forces beyond their control. I haven't read up on it recently, but studies a while back were showing trauma to be a big predictor of addiction.

I have a brother who is pretty rich (upper middle class, at least) and one who is scraping along on SSI. They have made some different choices, but those choices were not the biggest determining factors in how well their lives turned out.

 

[SKL]

1 hour ago, PronghornD said:

I don't think choices are taboo. They are quite popular and important. People's quality of life is definitely impacted by choices, and responsible people should own their choices.

However, my heart is still with the person who made the best choices they could reasonably make and yet gets blamed by society for their poor quality of life. Perhaps those people are a minority, but they are certainly not rare. And even some of those who actually make poor choices are influenced in those choices by forces beyond their control. I haven't read up on it recently, but studies a while back were showing trauma to be a big predictor of addiction.

I have a brother who is pretty rich (upper middle class, at least) and one who is scraping along on SSI. They have made some different choices, but those choices were not the biggest determining factors in how well their lives turned out.

 

Well sure, I have people in my life like that too.  And I make mental allowances for them, when they do things I wouldn't do.

I don't think the people being discussed in this thread are in that group that really couldn't have had different outcomes by making different choices.

And it's more that those people who feel like they "can't" travel (for example) are the ones judging those of us who can and do.  I don't know what those people want from us.  Do they want us to stay home?  Buy them a ticket to come along?  Apologize?  Die?  What?  I've already given these people a lot.  I have a right to enjoy the fruits of my labor too ... without guilt trips.

[kirstenhill]

We are most likely going to take an international trip with our family this summer - something we've never done before as a whole family.  I worry too about "what will people think" - most people in our circle (friends, not family) probably could not afford this kind of trip. I really can't imagine any of our friends being outwardly judgy about it, but I also think I might also worry about the appearance of it if we had chosen to spend on different "extras" like a fancier house or nicer cars.   Sometimes "life choices" go all the way back to what career people chose - many of our friends are in careers that top out much lower than DH's career tops out.   I am thankful for people making the sacrifice to be in education, social work, ministry, etc...but I do sometimes feel like I need to be careful what I discuss.  We are still really frugal in some areas, but on the other hand I know I probably shouldn't go on about the great new restaurant I tried because they can barely afford to eat out. 

Edited February 19 by kirstenhill

[J-rap]

Yay for you for your trip!  I wouldn't think twice of those comments.  Our family chose to live in an inexpensive home and live simply so that we could afford trips, and sometimes had/have the opportunity to inexpensively live overseas while keeping our home.  We never talk much about our trips because of how people could (mis)interpret them.  But if people don't understand that, whatever.

 I'm happy you can travel.  Have fun! 

[Resilient]

I am what most people would consider rich, and even so I wonder how people afford some things.  

I think some of this is due to a bit of penuriousness on my part, a bit of being able to be content with what I have and my interests, a bit of chicken-heartedness in pursuing my interests, some equal amount of personal responsibility for my "golden years" mixed with fear about same, and a general lack of understanding about how to make things happen.

So: it's a mish-mash. If I can rationalize this:, it looks like this:  My ignorance or incapability is not your problem.  It's mine.  So is any envy on my part. However, I think I have a right to say harumph when your spending (which I may envy) is essentially based in an expectation that I will take care of you (AND me) in retirement. Especially when I have been responsible enough to give up some spending so as not to burden you (and others).

Make sense?  Some parts of this belong to me, and some to you.  

[SKL]

22 minutes ago, Resilient said:

I am what most people would consider rich, and even so I wonder how people afford some things.  

I think some of this is due to a bit of penuriousness on my part, a bit of being able to be content with what I have and my interests, a bit of chicken-heartedness in pursuing my interests, some equal amount of personal responsibility for my "golden years" mixed with fear about same, and a general lack of understanding about how to make things happen.

So: it's a mish-mash. If I can rationalize this:, it looks like this:  My ignorance or incapability is not your problem.  It's mine.  So is any envy on my part. However, I think I have a right to say harumph when your spending (which I may envy) is essentially based in an expectation that I will take care of you (AND me) in retirement. Especially when I have been responsible enough to give up some spending so as not to burden you (and others).

Make sense?  Some parts of this belong to me, and some to you.  

And I've felt that way sometimes about people who spend beyond their means, then ask me for money to bridge gaps, then spend beyond their means again, year after year after year.  But the people telling me "oh it must be nice" are definitely not in any danger of taking care of me in my old age.  😛  They have come to me for help, but never the other way around.  And I definitely pay way more taxes than they do.  😛

I also have a friend whose close relative whines "it must be nice" when she travels.  He also frequently asks her for money.  I'm pretty sure she's given him hundreds of thousands of dollars at this point.  His lifestyle is way more extravagant than hers.  One could be tempted to say "it must be nice to have a relative you can hit up for money like that."  But my friend would never say that.

In the more general sense, if you're referring to the way policymakers are constantly pushing for higher taxes on people who already pay high taxes, to take care of those who are always borrowing against tomorrow, I feel you there too.  It's true that well-off people don't need to travel.  But they also don't need to work more than 35 hours per week all their lives.  If we all just worked enough for what we need, then I guess taxes would be more evenly spread out, meaning the average person would pay a bigger share and/or enjoy fewer benefits.  And certain industries that aren't "needed" would go bankrupt.  Perhaps that would be better than envy.  But, I think people would figure out a way to envy others even if money were not a thing.

(Some cultures have a concept where you are supposed to place a flaw on something good in order to ward off the evil eye of envy.  Like, if your child is beautiful, you put a fake blemish on their face; if you have a new vehicle, you hang a dirty old shoe from it; to theoretically prevent the jinx of the evil eye.  So it isn't really about wealth privilege per se.)

[Carrie12345]

7 hours ago, SKL said:

Well sure, I have people in my life like that too.  And I make mental allowances for them, when they do things I wouldn't do.

I don't think the people being discussed in this thread are in that group that really couldn't have had different outcomes by making different choices.

And it's more that those people who feel like they "can't" travel (for example) are the ones judging those of us who can and do.  I don't know what those people want from us.  Do they want us to stay home?  Buy them a ticket to come along?  Apologize?  Die?  What?  I've already given these people a lot.  I have a right to enjoy the fruits of my labor too ... without guilt trips.

I agree. I have siblings who certainly do make small choices I think are nuts in their circumstances, but not to the point of “You could do this expensive thing if you didn’t occasionally do those tiny things that make you very happy.” Their circumstances are different.

Travel is not my thing, but I’m happy for people who get to do their thing. My things are weird to most people, so they don’t come up often, lol.

The most obvious “thing” is that I haven’t worked since 2001, and have 5 kids. There were definitely a lot of choices made to make that work. I’m grateful to have had those options. But, like someone mentioned, my knee-jerk response to any raised eyebrows is to want to point out what I gave up.

[Ginevra]

For me, I got negative feedback from several people when I started working FT and stopped hsing (after 16 years of hsing). Questions about why do I want to work, won’t that make it hard to do your hobbies (yes!!), are you just trying to elevate your lifestyle? It was hard for me to understand how people who were very supportive of my staying at home and teaching my kids (which I was grateful for) were “turning” on me because I changed what I was doing. 
 

I’m with SKL - these are MY choices. Why does anyone else need to comment on it? They don’t know what’s in my bank account or what our plans are for the future. I’m happy that the burden of being the sole provider is off my husband after almost thirty years. We are both in a far better place emotionally due to my working. And I have health insurance now, including vision and dental, which feels like a miracle! Even if my job made no difference to our income that alone would be a really, really good reason for my work. 
 

(For clarity: we have always had health insurance - no dental or vision though - but we had to pay most recently $1300/month for an individual plan.) 

[Soror]

10 hours ago, kirstenhill said:

We are most likely going to take an international trip with our family this summer - something we've never done before as a whole family.  I worry too about "what will people think" - most people in our circle (friends, not family) probably could not afford this kind of trip. I really can't imagine any of our friends being outwardly judgy about it, but I also think I might also worry about the appearance of it if we had chosen to spend on different "extras" like a fancier house or nicer cars.   Sometimes "life choices" go all the way back to what career people chose - many of our friends are in careers that top out much lower than DH's career tops out.   I am thankful for people making the sacrifice to be in education, social work, ministry, etc...but I do sometimes feel like I need to be careful what I discuss.  We are still really frugal in some areas, but on the other hand I know I probably shouldn't go on about the great new restaurant I tried because they can barely afford to eat out. 

Yes, different extras and a different perception of needs in some cases. Amen on careers- said as a social worker- that even going back to work isn't making much!

6 hours ago, Resilient said:

I am what most people would consider rich, and even so I wonder how people afford some things.  

I think some of this is due to a bit of penuriousness on my part, a bit of being able to be content with what I have and my interests, a bit of chicken-heartedness in pursuing my interests, some equal amount of personal responsibility for my "golden years" mixed with fear about same, and a general lack of understanding about how to make things happen.

So: it's a mish-mash. If I can rationalize this:, it looks like this:  My ignorance or incapability is not your problem.  It's mine.  So is any envy on my part. However, I think I have a right to say harumph when your spending (which I may envy) is essentially based in an expectation that I will take care of you (AND me) in retirement. Especially when I have been responsible enough to give up some spending so as not to burden you (and others).

Make sense?  Some parts of this belong to me, and some to you.  

Well, we aren't just living it up here all YOLO style. Dh has saved for retirement since he was 18. Because he started early compound interest is on our side and we're on track for a slightly early retirement of 57(me)/60(dh). We could save even more but that is always the case. As it is, our post-retirement spending plans are ample enough for us and dh doesn't care to cut back even more just to retire early.  We are at a good balance of saving enough to retire earlyish but enjoying some things now (that balance of course will be different for everyone). The first thing we discussed with DH's upcoming raise was how to change savings goals and how that affects things- then it was what areas would we like to increase spending (travel, helping kids, house projects).

2 hours ago, Ginevra said:

For me, I got negative feedback from several people when I started working FT and stopped hsing (after 16 years of hsing). Questions about why do I want to work, won’t that make it hard to do your hobbies (yes!!), are you just trying to elevate your lifestyle? It was hard for me to understand how people who were very supportive of my staying at home and teaching my kids (which I was grateful for) were “turning” on me because I changed what I was doing. 
 

I’m with SKL - these are MY choices. Why does anyone else need to comment on it? They don’t know what’s in my bank account or what our plans are for the future. I’m happy that the burden of being the sole provider is off my husband after almost thirty years. We are both in a far better place emotionally due to my working. And I have health insurance now, including vision and dental, which feels like a miracle! Even if my job made no difference to our income that alone would be a really, really good reason for my work. 
 

(For clarity: we have always had health insurance - no dental or vision though - but we had to pay most recently $1300/month for an individual plan.) 

I felt a lot of negativity when I let my oldest go to school from the hs community at large. By the time I started work last year, I already felt a disconnect. Of the ones that I do talk to a fair amount of them work too so it hasn't been a huge deal.

I'd say so what if you want to elevate your lifestyle? Even last year with me working we qualify for a Pell Grant. When dh gets his promotion after graduation I think we'll finally make too much. Besides our vacations, which we've done as cheaply as possible, we've not been living it up. I'd like to build up savings, more easily do house projects, and not have to watch the pennies quite as closely! Last year we just ended up even with my salary after we paid off the HELOC from the summer before (building project that I thought we had enough saved but didn't), dd2 meeting max OOP, the well pump going out, dd coming home and costing more for DE, and helping ds with his college. Without me working we wouldn't have been able to do half of those things so thank goodness for that but I'm going to be 'greedy' a bit and work for the time being.

17 hours ago, Ausmumof3 said:

I’m on the other side of this having had some pretty serious travel envy at times. Hopefully I was polite enough to say “how nice, I hope you have a fantastic trip!” And nothing else.

Our expensive choice was having a farm and I know there are people that really envy that, so I try to remind myself about that. We don’t have a fancy house either, most things are falling apart (but thankfully it’s big enough to be comfy for us all).

Stuff other than money can influence travel choices too.  Like I’m married to a guy who really is not into cultural stuff so if we have a trip, it’s going to be a fishing trip to the beach somewhere. We weren’t able to go for a few years between Covid and a career change that meant an income drop but we’ve finally got away and it made me feel so much happier. 

It's hard when there is a mix-match between spouses! I'm jealous of your land and farm. That is one dream that dh and I have had and we've gone back on whether it is worthwhile. We'd love more land but I don't know that we could stomach the cost as land is so expensive. When we take walks we daydream about different properties we see and how we could save money if we built another house. 

18 hours ago, prairiewindmomma said:

I “speak” more openly here than I do anywhere else. Close relatives have no idea we recently went to Europe, that we flew to Hawaii, etc. The kids told none of their friends, etc. We shouldn’t have to manage our conversations to this degree, but why make people uncomfortable with the nice things we are choosing to do? If they cant respond appropriately, why bring up the issue? So, we dont. 
 

In an ideal world, we’d all be comfortable with everyone’s different circumstances and choices, but people have their own insecurities and challenges and so talking about anything money related IRL is…complicated. 
 

It’s easier for them to see us driving 20+ year old cars with no ac and not know the rest. 

It certainly can be complicated. I don't hide things but don't volunteer them to everyone. Dh is just so giddy about it anytime we travel he shouts it from the mountains and he really don't care what people say. He then campaigns for others to do the same and tells them how we keep costs down.

19 hours ago, Bootsie said:

DH and I have been very fortunate to be able to do a great deal of traveling over the years with our children.  While we have spent many summers in Europe, most of the time DH or I (often both) were working during that "vacation"; travel is important to us and we have found ways to do so economically.  Over the years we have had a number of people tell us "well, we just would never be able to afford a trip to Europe;  all we can afford is a trip to Disney World. and a week skiing in Colorado...."  Yet, DH and I are spending a lot less money on our trips than they are on their vacations.  We have been able to rent an apartment for a month in other countries for what they are paying for a hotel room for three nights.    DH and I often respond "Well, we can't afford to vacation in the US"

I believe it. I know we usually try to stay awhile once we're overseas but our vaca time is limited. I was just talking to dh about this in retirement it is something we'd live to do. 

[Arcadia]

20 hours ago, prairiewindmomma said:

We travel for the same reasons—with my health issues we need to go now as there is no guarantee I will be able to travel later. 

My mom’s best travel years were 62 to 65 years old. She didn’t get to go to Europe which was a not high ranked want. I agree to travel while health issues are “manageable”.

20 hours ago, goldberry said:

I am super private about money, but no way my family could be kept in the dark about 2 weeks of travel.

Our nearest relatives are in a different state so it is easy to just do any video calls at generic places like Starbucks or Target or a supermarket. 

[TechWife]

On 2/18/2024 at 12:30 PM, HomeAgain said:

I call it the Facebook effect.  You see a glimpse of each person's decisions, but taken all together it rolls the experiences into a singular entity.  So if a person is going to Scotland, you also assume they are doing well enough to have the bigger house and the newer cars and....you don't necessarily see a singular decision.

And it makes a difference in perception if you are not out of the 'norm' that the person experiences.  If most of their friends are getting by/have normal purchases, then an interesting vacation looks more out of place.  Probably the same person wouldn't bat an eye if you went to WDW, but wouldn't even realize it's the same cost to go to Scotland (seriously, we priced out a trip to Paris for the same length as WDW and it was a bit less).

This attitude towards others' spending has been around far longer than Facebook has. I can't remember a time when it wasn't, TBH.