My rant for today: teens and school trip medicine policies

[SKL]

My teens' band has a Disney trip coming up over spring break.  I've received several messages regarding medicines.  Note this is for kids in 9th-12th grade.

The rules:

• Teens are not allowed to have their own pills on them; they must all be given (by the parents, weeks in advance) to a doctor who's traveling with the band.
• This includes OTC as well as prescriptions.  Tylenol, etc.  Only exception is emergency stuff like epi-pens.
• You need a doctor's note stating your kid is allowed to take these meds. 
  • This includes Tylenol etc!! Seriously I need to go get a doctor's letter to allow my kids to take Tylenol??
• If your kid wants to take meds of any kind at any time, she needs to contact the doctor and ask for the meds.
  • This is in Orlando where everyone is going to be all over the place.  You get a headache on the Rotor ride and you gotta track down the doctor who is probably 5 miles away?

I don't know what the penalty will be if my kids commit the atrocity of bringing and taking their own damn pills.

Aside from possibly wanting an OTC pain reliever, one of my kids takes prescribed meds for OCD and birth control.  Neither of which is anyone else's damn business!  Is this for real?  She has to go get her "clearly labeled" meds for birth control and mental problems from some dude?  In front of everyone else?

I assume this is just a normal policy, but I never really thought about it before, since my kids never used to be on meds.  (Though I seem to recall that it even included vitamins when I asked before the 2021 trip.)

Am I crazy or is this stupid?

Am I the only one who is probably going to tell my kids to bring their own meds regardless?

[KSera]

I haven’t had kids in public school, but is this not the regular policies even at school? I thought it had long been that kids weren’t allowed to have even Tylenol or ibuprofen on them. I agree that’s difficult, though I also see the kind of issues they’re trying to avoid. But that’s kind of difficult for medications that a kid that age could buy over-the-counter themselves. Seems more reasonable if they allowed one or two doses worth of over-the-counter meds to be with a student’s belongings. Prescription meds are a whole different complication. Adhd meds are the ones that seem particularly problematic, but maybe they don’t want to single those out.

Edited March 16, 2023 by KSera
Typo

[teachermom2834]

I haven’t been in this exact position but I would probably feel and do as you are doing.

Years ago my now adult ds had a summer engineering camp he was to attend and had been looking forward to for months. The local utility board gave him a scholarship to attend. Not a big deal in the grand scheme of things, of course, but a big deal at the time.

He got sick right before and the details are fuzzy but he was positive for strep. The doc understood the scenario and gave him a shot of antibiotics and told him to keep the rest of his course of pills on him and not to disclose to the leaders and that he would be fine and not get anyone sick. But if he gave them his medications like he was supposed to they would freak out and not let him on the bus.

So that is what we did. With a much younger child. I think it was the summer before 7th grade for him. 
 

Now I hope your thread isn’t taken over by discussion of my bad parenting. 

[HomeAgain]

For Tylenol, First Aid in the parks will give it out.

The rest is pretty standard.  Scouts has a multi-part health form filled out by parents and Part C is signed by the doc.  All meds need to be clearly labeled, in their original containers, and scoutmaster needs to know the dosage.  It's something that happens at breakfast.  I cannot remember if epi-pens were an exception, but oldest ds gave his to scoutmaster/head of activity anyway so he didn't have it weighing down his pocket.

Schools have to treat it the same as school days.  They don't have a separate policy for overnights, usually.

[Soror]

11 minutes ago, SKL said:

My teens' band has a Disney trip coming up over spring break.  I've received several messages regarding medicines.  Note this is for kids in 9th-12th grade.

The rules:

• Teens are not allowed to have their own pills on them; they must all be given (by the parents, weeks in advance) to a doctor who's traveling with the band.
• This includes OTC as well as prescriptions.  Tylenol, etc.  Only exception is emergency stuff like epi-pens.
• You need a doctor's note stating your kid is allowed to take these meds. 
  • This includes Tylenol etc!! Seriously I need to go get a doctor's letter to allow my kids to take Tylenol??
• If your kid wants to take meds of any kind at any time, she needs to contact the doctor and ask for the meds.
  • This is in Orlando where everyone is going to be all over the place.  You get a headache on the Rotor ride and you gotta track down the doctor who is probably 5 miles away?

I don't know what the penalty will be if my kids commit the atrocity of bringing and taking their own damn pillls.

Am I crazy or is this stupid?

Am I the only one who is probably going to tell my kids to bring their own meds regardless?

I just give mine their own. I adamantly disagree with the policy. It would one thing if it was a med that kids sell or something. They've not got caught yet.

On the otc meds they even wanted you to hand over epipens and inhalers. It's stupidity. And they won't give you ibuprofen but don't let you bring it either. So stupid. 

[NorthernBeth]

Most schools won't let students take pills on their own.  Overdoses of Tylenol are often used in teen suicide where I live.  ADHD medicine could be taken twice by a forgetfull student or stolen by a roommate who wants to get high.  My son offered his friend an Advil once for a headache, not realizing the friend had a clotting issue.  Luckily, the student was aware those weren't safe for him and turned it down.  I confess that I don't think the birth control pills should be an issue, but they probably worry about people getting upset about exceptions.  How much trouble would your daughter get into if she just keeps the birth control pills and takes them on her normal schedule?  Is it the kind of thing they would send a student home for? 

[skimomma]

Seems pretty normal to me.  We also hated it and I do confess to being the parent who gave my kid the OK to just have her own meds and take them as prescribed....just don't get caught.  But I realized this could have gotten us in trouble.  We ran into this at summer camps and multi-day sports trips.  We tried following the rules the first few times but it was terribly embarrassing (and inconvienient) to have to stand in line where everyone could see you during each med time.  I 100% understand the rules and why they have them, but to me the deal is broken when they have these rules yet have nothing in place to protect the privacy of the medication takers.  And one was an inhaler....which is used as-needed.  It was ridiculous for them to expect someone who is having breathing trouble to go find whoever holds the meds, wait in line, or wait for the nurse station to be "open."  Nope.

[Jean in Newcastle]

I hate it too but it's because teens really do abuse stuff like that.  There were teens who were stealing inhalers from people with asthma and huffing them.  There are people who take other pills to just on the off chance it will give them a buzz.  It doesn't matter if it's something like Tylenol.  Unfortunately everyone pays and has to abide by strict rules because of this sort of thing. 

[Danae]

Our local high school allows kids to carry and self administer OTC meds if they have a note from their parents.  They don’t need to have the note on file, just have it on them if they are asked.  
 

Although one kid told me they are cracking down on lots of things, so who knows if that policy will last.

[catz]

Well, my kids went to a camp without that policy where someone's ADHD meds were stolen so let me tell you that isn't such a fun situation either.  It stinks, but I totally get why places have policies like this now.  Teens don't always make the best choices when out of their regular element.  

That camp changed their policy the following year.  

[SKL]

As far as I know, my kid's meds are neither dangerous nor likely to be a hot commodity among drug abusers.  That said, I will probably just send enough for the days she's going to be there (which is only about 4 days, since I'm picking her up early to go on a family trip).  If some idiot steals 4 days of her meds, nobody will die from that.

Honestly I think there should be a blanket exception for BCP.  But nobody asked me!  And Tylenol etc.  I mean if my kid is gonna try to overdose on OTC pain meds, she can just as easily walk down the street and buy some from the local Walgreens.

 

[WildflowerMom]

I would just send her with her regular meds.   Keep them on her at all times, in a bag.  Maybe one of those waist belt things that hold your cell phone against your waist while you’re running?   Something like that would probably be hidden pretty well.    Then again, it might be better to send them with her in the original bottle.   I agree that it’s no one’s business what meds she is taking as long as she has her parent’s permission.  

[kbutton]

Giving the meds to the organizer weeks in advance is not even possible with many Rx meds, especially controlled substances like ADHD meds. It's really hard to get a meds refill around a vacation--they seem to think that you can just swing by the pharmacy on the way to the airport every time, and they make even that difficult. 

I am agreeing on the ADHD meds and meds that would be stolen. You don't want a kid responsible for those!

31 minutes ago, NorthernBeth said:

Most schools won't let students take pills on their own.  Overdoses of Tylenol are often used in teen suicide where I live.  ADHD medicine could be taken twice by a forgetfull student or stolen by a roommate who wants to get high.  My son offered his friend an Advil once for a headache, not realizing the friend had a clotting issue.  Luckily, the student was aware those weren't safe for him and turned it down.  I confess that I don't think the birth control pills should be an issue, but they probably worry about people getting upset about exceptions.  How much trouble would your daughter get into if she just keeps the birth control pills and takes them on her normal schedule?  Is it the kind of thing they would send a student home for? 

I have a kid who is good about knowing things he needs to know, but yeah, he can't take most NSAIDS.

I would have her keep the birth control pills on her person if she can avoid telling friends about them.

12 minutes ago, SKL said:

 I mean if my kid is gonna try to overdose on OTC pain meds, she can just as easily walk down the street and buy some from the local Walgreens.

Having extra steps is enough to save lives sometimes.

I think she can get it at a first aid station as someone else noted, and she likely can pick up sample sizes in one of the park stores--a lot of touristy places have sample sizes of OTC meds for sale. 

Another likely reason for all the care and original packaging is that some illicit drugs are made to look like legit pills, and people get overdose poisoned that way. I know someone whose son died this way; good kid, didn't take drugs. Very tragic. 

[itsheresomewhere]

Ours is like that but the exception now it epi pens and inhalers.  It used to be all had to go to the nurse and then the kid had to go to her to gets medication/epi pen/inhalers.  Then one mom had a massive issue with it and took to very far and threatening to sue over the lack of being able to keep the epi pen/inhalers in the same class as the student.  It was ridiculous they thought it was acceptable to have a kid in need of an inhaler or epi pen had to wait until the the elderly nurse got to that classroom after the teacher summoned her.  Now any class with a child who needs an epi pen or inhaler keeps in the classroom or it moves with the classroom aide to wherever the student is.  

[sassenach]

My kid went on multiple ps trips and this seems extreme. I would have a very hard time abiding.

[Spryte]

Not saying anyone else should do what I’d do: I’d send kid with a tiny running waist bag to wear, or whatever she wants, and I’d tuck the BCP in someplace zippered inside. That is no one’s business but her own. I’d tell her about the first aid stations and suggest she pick up a sample pack of Tylenol to keep in her bag next to the BCP. I’d consider putting the antidepressant with the BCP, but might give that one to the doc. 
 

Here’s one type of bag we’ve used: https://spibelt.com/collections/running-belts?gclid=CjwKCAjw_MqgBhAGEiwAnYOAel2wzB_EqPSlnzwjYWfm1ADEITxD3ym-LG_uimNcSKC6owtfwFzk4BoCzM0QAvD_BwE

18 minutes ago, itsheresomewhere said:

Ours is like that but the exception now it epi pens and inhalers.  It used to be all had to go to the nurse and then the kid had to go to her to gets medication/epi pen/inhalers.  Then one mom had a massive issue with it and took to very far and threatening to sue over the lack of being able to keep the epi pen/inhalers in the same class as the student.  It was ridiculous they thought it was acceptable to have a kid in need of an inhaler or epi pen had to wait until the the elderly nurse got to that classroom after the teacher summoned her.  Now any class with a child who needs an epi pen or inhaler keeps in the classroom or it moves with the classroom aide to wherever the student is.  

Yep, that’s why we homeschooled. Epipens were kept in a locked cabinet, in the locked traveling nurse’s office, and she was only in that school twice a week. Teachers would make kids run to the office, if they had a reaction. So stupid. We decided we’d rather put our resources into homeschooling than fighting the school policy. It was bad.

Edited March 16, 2023 by Spryte

[Murphy101]

Here’s what I don’t get. How does this not violate medical privacy?

Especially when it’s so strict that it’s even for stuff even a 10 yr old can buy on their own, like Tylenol.

And we don’t hand over meds. If it’s a med my kid needs to take, then they are responsible for keeping it.

I know a lot of type 1 diabetic kids really struggle with this too. 

 

[Starr]

I was a school nurse and this has been going on for a long time. It was even the case when my kids were camp counselors. As I recall they may have given some to the med person but always stashed something for headaches.

[City Mouse]

That is normal for all the schools I have worked at. It is also similar to the policy at most BSA summer camps my DS attended in the past. 
Schools have to be very careful. When your well meaning and super responsible and mature student gives some of her advil, or cough drops, or whatever to another student while trying to be helpful, and that other student experiences an allergic reaction or other negative side effects, who do you think the other student’s parents will hold responsible? 
 

Schools can’t win no matter what they do.

[DawnM]

I went on the DC trip a few years ago and we had the same policy.   Kids steal, share meds, etc.....All it has taken is for one parent to sue and now a new/more strict policy is implemented.

[Ausmumof3]

1 hour ago, SKL said:

My teens' band has a Disney trip coming up over spring break.  I've received several messages regarding medicines.  Note this is for kids in 9th-12th grade.

The rules:

• Teens are not allowed to have their own pills on them; they must all be given (by the parents, weeks in advance) to a doctor who's traveling with the band.
• This includes OTC as well as prescriptions.  Tylenol, etc.  Only exception is emergency stuff like epi-pens.
• You need a doctor's note stating your kid is allowed to take these meds. 
  • This includes Tylenol etc!! Seriously I need to go get a doctor's letter to allow my kids to take Tylenol??
• If your kid wants to take meds of any kind at any time, she needs to contact the doctor and ask for the meds.
  • This is in Orlando where everyone is going to be all over the place.  You get a headache on the Rotor ride and you gotta track down the doctor who is probably 5 miles away?

I don't know what the penalty will be if my kids commit the atrocity of bringing and taking their own damn pills.

Aside from possibly wanting an OTC pain reliever, one of my kids takes prescribed meds for OCD and birth control.  Neither of which is anyone else's damn business!  Is this for real?  She has to go get her "clearly labeled" meds for birth control and mental problems from some dude?  In front of everyone else?

I assume this is just a normal policy, but I never really thought about it before, since my kids never used to be on meds.  (Though I seem to recall that it even included vitamins when I asked before the 2021 trip.)

Am I crazy or is this stupid?

Am I the only one who is probably going to tell my kids to bring their own meds regardless?

Tylenol is being regulated into smaller OTC packs here because apparently too many teens are trying to overdose on it. So, that probably explains that as crazy as it sounds.

[melbotoast]

That's the policy at my kids' camps. It is also so the nurse knows what meds each person is taking in case there is an emergency. My daughter with several medications turns hers in. My son taking Claritin keeps his on him.

[SKL]

Yeah I know that's the policy at school, but my kid takes her daily pills at bedtime, so they aren't normally anyone's business.

And my kids do hide some OTC pain killers in their backpacks for things like cramps.

This is part of what made me hate high school - the way they treat near-adults like either babies or criminals.  Ugh.  For all this carefulness, you'd think schools were actually keeping our kids safe from things that could actually hurt them.  Ha!

[Soror]

Just now, SKL said:

Yeah I know that's the policy at school, but my kid takes her daily pills at bedtime, so they aren't normally anyone's business.

And my kids do hide some OTC pain killers in their backpacks for things like cramps.

This is part of what made me hate high school - the way they treat near-adults like either babies or criminals.  Ugh.  For all this carefulness, you'd think schools were actually keeping our kids safe from things that could actually hurt them.  Ha!

Yes, we infantalize teens and forbid them from responsibility and then complain they can't do anything on their own. 

[rebcoola]

Yeah that's the norm not a doctor but am adult handles all meds and we have to give permission in advance for OTC meds. Prescription meds have to have the doctors instructions and be turned into the school nurse in advance so she can instruct chaperone.  It would be nice if their was some way at least the meds weren't named.  Though my kids are very open about their mental health diagnosis it's still not anyone's business

[SKL]

I mean if they stop her from taking the meds, she won't die from that either, but it just feels like a total no-win situation.  I think I'd be boiling if my kid needed life-saving meds on demand.

[Soror]

Here even if you give permission for meds like Tylenol or ibuprofen they still won't give them. The only thing the nurse hands out is Tums. When dd had horrible period pains she was SOL. We emptied out a chapstick container to put a few ibuprofen and I instructed her to take them in the bathroom when she needed them. For her Beta trip this month she packed her BCP in the bottom of her makeup bag.

[ScoutTN]

Standard stuff, but I have always let my Dd have OTC meds to keep with her and take as needed. 

My Ds15 cannot manage his meds and I am glad to have adults doing that.

It’s all about liability.

[Farrar]

I agree but also, I totally get why they do this.

When I was working at a school, this policy had to be implemented due to some new rules for the state and it led to a lot of changes and some annoyances for us. Previously, we had a store of OTC stuff in the office and if kids had permission for it, we'd just dole it out. We let other meds be on a case by case basis (small school) so sometimes kids were responsible for their own. But other times they were kept in the office and anyone could oversee. After these rules came down, we had to keep everything locked. Kids could not take from a general store of OTC Tylenol, etc. Instead, they had to have parents send their own with a medical note. Certain people had to be designated on legal forms as the people who could oversee kids taking meds. And they had to have backup people, all listed on forms.

When the legal folks talked to us about it, they made some good points about our liability. And discussed good Samaritan exceptions as well. And I will say there was a non-fatal overdose of OTC meds at my high school as a kid. Kid purposefully downed a ton of ibuprofen and passed out in a very scary way. So it's not like there's no way to abuse this stuff. 

But this raises other questions to me. Teens on BCP can usually take them at home, but for overnights, what happens if the school decides that it's "immoral" and they don't want to dispense them? 

[SKL]

Another thing a parent asked about ... do students over 18 have to have their parents sign waivers for the trip?  Answer:  yes!  Ridiculous!

I always thought the rule was that you can't share your meds (including OTC) with others.  So if your friend is having cramps and you have some Midol, you can get suspended for helping your friend out.  That's ridiculous enough, but now they can't even ... ugh ....

These are the times I question whether I ought not be a teetotaler ....

[MEmama]

41 minutes ago, SKL said:

I mean if they stop her from taking the meds, she won't die from that either, but it just feels like a total no-win situation.  I think I'd be boiling if my kid needed life-saving meds on demand.

And it doesn't even have to be life saving in the sense of of an epi pen or something. There's zero chance my high anxiety, ADHD, autistic kid could find and ask a total stranger for his own medications--imagine, in the middle of a panic attack or meltdown. Nope, nope nope. I'm a rule follower to stupid levels but I wouldn't abide by rules like this. No way. 

[Storygirl]

I'll be honest -- I was glad when one of my kids decided not to go on the band trip to Disney earlier this year, mainly for medication management issues. On the 8th grade DC trip, we followed policies and sent the ADHD medications with the chaperone, but DS did not ask for his medications, and it was not the responsibility of the chaperone to chase people down or keep track of whether people took their meds. So he was unmedicated during the trip. Now he takes medications that must be taken daily and can't be skipped, and we didn't trust that the school's system would work for him. We would have tried to figure something out, if he had wanted to go, but it would not necessarily have gone well for him.

 

[Murphy101]

2 hours ago, Starr said:

I was a school nurse and this has been going on for a long time. It was even the case when my kids were camp counselors. As I recall they may have given some to the med person but always stashed something for headaches.

We never did crap for OTC meds when I was in high school. Every girl had her mini-bottle of Motrin in her purse and no one gave a flip.

If the teen is going to do something stupid like OD on Tylenol - the problem is not the Tylenol.  (Not saying teen mental health shouldn’t be addressed. It should. But saying no teen can have Tylenol in their purse is not address anything.) 

1 hour ago, SKL said:

Another thing a parent asked about ... do students over 18 have to have their parents sign waivers for the trip?  Answer:  yes!  Ridiculous!

I always thought the rule was that you can't share your meds (including OTC) with others.  So if your friend is having cramps and you have some Midol, you can get suspended for helping your friend out.  That's ridiculous enough, but now they can't even ... ugh ....

These are the times I question whether I ought not be a teetotaler ....

Yes. When I was in high school, we didn’t share anything. But honestly there was no reason to share. Any teen can easily get a bottle of generic ibuprofen for less than $2.

Generally speaking I’m a tee totaler just because … well.. have you met humanity? I have trust issues.  Always have. 

Edited March 16, 2023 by Murphy101

[Starr]

If you don't think they should turn their meds in be sure they don't tell anyone, at all. No one keeps a secret. Everyone thinks they have one other friend they can trust.

[Pippen]

4 hours ago, itsheresomewhere said:

Ours is like that but the exception now it epi pens and inhalers.  It used to be all had to go to the nurse and then the kid had to go to her to gets medication/epi pen/inhalers.  Then one mom had a massive issue with it and took to very far and threatening to sue over the lack of being able to keep the epi pen/inhalers in the same class as the student.  It was ridiculous they thought it was acceptable to have a kid in need of an inhaler or epi pen had to wait until the the elderly nurse got to that classroom after the teacher summoned her.  Now any class with a child who needs an epi pen or inhaler keeps in the classroom or it moves with the classroom aide to wherever the student is.  

Our state allows students to carry their own inhalers and epi pens with doctor's note.. 

[catz]

I personally think a don't ask don't tell approach is fine.  I would probably buy my kid a cross body purse for travel with an inside zipped pocked and supply just enough for the trip to be kept in there.  I'd package so they don't shake.  And tell my kid not to talk about the meds and take them in private.  And that bag is what goes out during the day.  I'd probably have a frank discussion with my kid why these types of policies are in place.  Or if you had luggage with an inside zip pocket, I'd get my kid a luggage lock for the outside.

That said I really don't get all the outrage if you're asking another set of adults to be liable for a group of kids for an extended length of time.   It's easy enough not to participate in trips like this.  It's also possible to volunteer to chaperone which I have done (not for this reason but for others).  My kids have had friends over the years that I am not sure could handle meds responsibliy in a group of possibly curious teens.  My son was pretty absent minded until his late teens, I'm glad this wasn't anything we had to think about regularly because neither of my kids take meds regularly.

I've also been on the board of a group that has these type of liability discussions.  It's a hard problem.   Teens in groups don't always act in predictable ways.  Your kid can act perfectly but some other may not.

Not allowing a severely allergic child to carry an epi pen or an emergency inhaler is absolutely crazy town

[Nart]

Since teens can get a prescription for birth control without a parents consent knowledge then I don’t see how they can require a teen to turn in her birth control pills. I absolutely would not turn them in to the school doctor. Logistically you can’t easily turn in birth control pills early. 

I would however turn in the ocd pills. 

[rebcoola]

1 hour ago, Murphy101 said:

We never did crap for OTC meds when I was in high school. Every girl had her mini-bottle of Motrin in her purse and no one gave a flip.

If the teen is going to do something stupid like OD on Tylenol - the problem is not the Tylenol.  (Not saying teen mental health shouldn’t be addressed. It should. But saying no teen can have Tylenol in their purse is not address anything.) 

 

We did to but it was against the rules. A group of 6th graders all got suspended over tums.  Zero tolerance policy.

[Shoeless]

I get why schools do this. 

I also get why it's maddening. 

It's part of the price of admission for school.  If you want to attend, you have to obey their byzantine rules. 

[ScoutTN]

My main experience with this is in scouting or summer camps. Camps generally have a nurse who deals with all meds. Scouting, ime, has a designated adult to manage meds on trips. Families complete a health/medical form at the beginning of each year. If I am responsible for your kid away from home, I need to know what the health issues are and how they are treated.
 

In both cases, the adult is responsible to make sure the kid gets and takes meds on the correct schedule. As a mom of a kid with ADHD, I cannot imagine leaving that up to kids! 
 

Also, I would never have a man responsible for this on a girls or coed trip, bc that could be awkward for the girls. 

In both scenarios, I am fine with having my responsible high school Dd manage her own ibuprofen etc. and would be fine with the bc too. Meds for psych things should be with adults. 

[SKL]

I think my kid would just skip her pills rather than have to go to some doctor to get them.

[MercyA]

Invasive, annoying, and (IMHO) unnecessary for teens. I would still have my kid follow the rules. Surely she will not be the only one who has to go see the doctor. 

Sorry you have to deal with this.

[wathe]

I totally understand the reasons for such a policy.  Teens may be near-adults, but the point is that they are not adults.  They are legally children. Who are in the care of the school staff while on an overnight trip away from home -- staff, who, (here at least), are loco parentis. 

Teens get up to all kinds of shenanigans.  Stealing meds, abusing meds, overdosing on meds, sharing-meds-with-good-intentions-scenarios-that-go-sideways.  The school is legally liable for all of it.  And also genuinely cares for children and wants to reduce the risk dead or injured kids.

It's annoying but necessary.

The weird part of the policy to me is that a doctor is dispensing meds.  Medication administration would usually be a nursing task. But,  I've never heard of bringing a doctor along on a school trip (and even less likely, an out of state field trip, where a doc from home would likely not even be licensed to practice -- licensing is by state, right?), never mind for the purpose of dispensing meds.  But, I'm not American, so take that for what it's worth, I guess.  Maybe USA school trip culture is different than here.

ETA - I realize that OP did not specify whether or not the trip is out of state.  I am assuming based on balance of probabilities.

ETA again - sounds like nightmare gig for the doc.  I would not want that job!

Edited March 17, 2023 by wathe

[Xahm]

In high school we were quietly told the unofficial policy was that we needed to be quiet about it if we needed to carry pain meds, and we shouldn't share, but the school had enough real things to deal with that they weren't checking purses for otcs, and they weren't going to notice them if they could help it. I let my (homeschooled) son carry ibuprofen starting at 8 because he very occasionally gets migraines that make him vomit, and worrying about a headache becoming a migraine makes him miserable and anxious. He can take it on his own, but then he has to tell me he has done so as soon as he gets a chance to. We would be able to work with school rules if we had to, but it would make him nervous that the person with the meds might be busy or mean or no where to be found. I'd be inclined to decide what the spirit of the rule is and follow that rather than the letter.

[Faith-manor]

I understand the policy. We are a very lawsuit/liability centered society. But, I also think we have gone so far overboard that teens turn 18 and can't function properly as adults because they have been stripped of responsibility for themselves, and treated like babies. It seems there should be a middle ground. I also do not like the total lack of privacy that soon to be adults endure. It is hard to balance safety and growing and training emerging adults.

When my sis was a teen, she was on PCP to treat endometriosis, though I think back then her diagnosis was "painful periods with heavy bleeding and anemia". My parents had stuck her in an awful, IFB private school, a real control freak of a place. The official theology of that particular church was all birth control for any reason is sin and prohibited. So when the senior class was taken to Washington, D.C., she had to sneak her BCP with her. She was able to keep it discreet enough that no one knew despite the fact that the students spied on each other because they gained special privileges for turning people in for infractions. Think" High Inquisitors Squad/Dolores Umbridge" of Harry Potter books. Sis had a thin body bag that she slept with under her pajamas, and would dress in the bathroom in the morning with that on her person. she packed clothing that was loose and would easily hide the bag. She would get up early in the morning before the other girls she shared a hotel room with had awakened, and take her meds.

In the OP's shoes, I think the student's privacy and well being and access to her meds trumps the school policy. Though there is a doctor to do the dispensing, I highly doubt anyone has thought this out in such a way that the dispensing will preserve the dignity of the student as it is no one else's business what drugs anyone is taking. So I recommend finding a discreet way to hide them and for her student to make sure they are ingested on schedule. I am normally a rule follower. But this is something I would do.

When we had our rocket team and we traveled for competition, our policy was that students needed to keep and care for their own meds. We had a long talk with the kids about this, and we also told parents we would hold and dispense meds ONLY if that was what the parent wanted and with a signed and dated note from them. We also said we would have tums, tylenol, advil, vitamin C cough drops for dry throats or developing coughs, and an otc cold med on hand. They could sign that it was okay for us to dispense according to our own judgement or ask that we call first. We didn't have issues. But, we also only had 8-10 students which made it easy to manage. To be honest we now mentor university teams, and frankly, it is a very nice break from dealing with minors and all the liability issues. I do hope to some day work with 7th-12th graders again. However the break is definitely needed on our end. It has become insanely complicated to manage all the expectations parents and organizations have when working with kids. 

[MEmama]

4 minutes ago, Faith-manor said:

our policy was that students needed to keep and care for their own meds. We had a long talk with the kids about this, and we also told parents we would hold and dispense meds ONLY if that was what the parent wanted and with a signed and dated note from them. We also said we would have tums, tylenol, advil, vitamin C cough drops for dry throats or developing coughs, and an otc cold med on hand. They could sign that it was okay for us to dispense according to our own judgement or ask that we call first.

This. This is sensible and should be the default for teens. They have basic autonomy unless parent knows it's not best. NOT the other way around.

Well done @FaithManor

[skimomma]

Coming back to this again, as one of the "rule-breakers."  I do understand the rules.  No one would give a 6yo a bottle of tylenol to keep in their book bag at school.  And I think most would agree that an 18yo should be able to.  The line is somewhere in between, that line varies by kid/environment, and schools/groups have to draw that line where they cannot be considered liable.  But, they should also then be required to have privacy policies in place as well as quick-access plans for meds that must be administrated on an as-needed basis.  Inhalers and epipens are obviously in this category but there are a lot of less obvious situations like migraines, cramps, and anxiety that also need quick action.  Those things are all very hard to implement well.  I feel for the people in charge, really I do.  But until/unless those things are addressed, I would allow my own offspring to break the rules understanding that they/I could be disciplined for it.

I was the team manager for a travel sport that included kids with ages that spanned 13-19.  We were ragtag enough that no one really worried about this.  We had one or two kids over the years that needed help managing their meds, and we would arrange that individually with that family, but otherwise had no policy or rules.  That was risky.  We did a lot of other legally risky things like carpool during long travel and group lodging without reams of permission slips and waivers.  I'm glad nothing happened as I am sure I would have been found liable if it had.  And I am really glad I am not responsible for it now that the litigation situation seems to inflated.  In fact, while I know this group still operates the way it did when I was in charge, it is likely that the only way to do it legally "correctly" would be to eliminate group travel and require each family to travel on its own.  Which would be sad as we had many kids that never would have been able to compete had there not been a way for them to go independent of their parents.  When these things get "too hard," people stop offering them.

[vonfirmath]

10 hours ago, wathe said:

I totally understand the reasons for such a policy.  Teens may be near-adults, but the point is that they are not adults.  They are legally children. Who are in the care of the school staff while on an overnight trip away from home -- staff, who, (here at least), are loco parentis. 

Teens get up to all kinds of shenanigans.  Stealing meds, abusing meds, overdosing on meds, sharing-meds-with-good-intentions-scenarios-that-go-sideways.  The school is legally liable for all of it.  And also genuinely cares for children and wants to reduce the risk dead or injured kids.

It's annoying but necessary.

The weird part of the policy to me is that a doctor is dispensing meds.  Medication administration would usually be a nursing task. But,  I've never heard of bringing a doctor along on a school trip (and even less likely, an out of state field trip, where a doc from home would likely not even be licensed to practice -- licensing is by state, right?), never mind for the purpose of dispensing meds.  But, I'm not American, so take that for what it's worth, I guess.  Maybe USA school trip culture is different than here.

ETA - I realize that OP did not specify whether or not the trip is out of state.  I am assuming based on balance of probabilities.

ETA again - sounds like nightmare gig for the doc.  I would not want that job!

With AHG, the Health and Safety lead has to have First aid and CPR training.

 

When we give medication at an event, there is a form to track it on that is also kept in case there is an adverse reaction to let the emergency personnel know what is in the system

At the summer camp I go to, there are so many kids taking medications that no one really cares WHAT the medication is. And if you have on your med sheet that you take a med EVERYDAY and you don't show up to get it, they do go track down the girl and make sure it gets taken.  When I fill out for my daughter a lot of meds are "As needed" (Basically to make sure they have specific things on hand in case of a reaction)

 

 

Edited March 17, 2023 by vonfirmath

[vonfirmath]

1 hour ago, skimomma said:

I was the team manager for a travel sport that included kids with ages that spanned 13-19.  We were ragtag enough that no one really worried about this.  We had one or two kids over the years that needed help managing their meds, and we would arrange that individually with that family, but otherwise had no policy or rules.  That was risky.  We did a lot of other legally risky things like carpool during long travel and group lodging without reams of permission slips and waivers.  I'm glad nothing happened as I am sure I would have been found liable if it had.  And I am really glad I am not responsible for it now that the litigation situation seems to inflated.  In fact, while I know this group still operates the way it did when I was in charge, it is likely that the only way to do it legally "correctly" would be to eliminate group travel and require each family to travel on its own.  Which would be sad as we had many kids that never would have been able to compete had there not been a way for them to go independent of their parents.  When these things get "too hard," people stop offering them.

This is basically how our troop works. Each family is responsible for getting their girl to the location. If they want to independently work with someone in the troop to carpool, that is up to them. (And every year for camp so far I've had another family's girl in my car) But we do not arrange it as a troop because it is too difficult.

 

[catz]

1 hour ago, skimomma said:

... The line is somewhere in between, that line varies by kid/environment, and schools/groups have to draw that line where they cannot be considered liable.  ....

Well as someone who has been on a board for an most volunteer run kid based org, sometimes it's about the need to carry liability insurance and requirements and recommendations from that end.  Unfortunately, groups can't just decide they're not liable for something.  They may be held liable regardless of intent or policy.  I was part of the group as it went from a rag tag group to a small non-profit with a board and liability insurance.  It grew to the point where we had to have official policies on this kind of thing.

So I suspect many places with official policies like this have real humans that understand some (hopefully mature) kids are going to have their advil or tums on the down low and that is likely fine.  As long as it's hidden, private and not seen.  Where it becomes a problem is if it is flashed or found or treated carelessly.  Because our co-op is volunteer run, no volunteer there on and off wants to be responsible for doling out meds and parents can stay on site if they need to.  Food allergies are a real issue too.  

I would assume a doctor on the trip was a parent volunteer chaperone.  Possibly who has some particular reason for wanting to be a chaperone and is willing to take on this role.