Volunteering for an organization that benefits your kids

[SKL]

Our scouting group has some people that put way more time in than others.  I am not one of those people but I can see very clearly that it's true.  And it's not fair unless the people doing all the work want it that way.

So this year they decided to require all parents to volunteer a set number of "points" - the board set the point values for various jobs.

I already have a job that gets me about 2/3 there.  I also offered to do a couple other things, but these things are not on the list - either they changed their mind about what badges to do, or they just didn't get that micro.  They do say you can suggest other point-earning activities as the list is not exhaustive.

Thing is, I kinda feel like the amount they are setting as a minimum is kinda high.  For example, leading one entire badge (multiple meetings) is one point.  I don't want to get too detailed but it seems to me that some families would have a hard time getting up to 3 points.

You aren't allowed to register your kids if you don't promise to do the 3 points.

So ... how much do you think is reasonable to require of every family participating in scouts?

I wonder how the other parents will think of this.  We have a bunch of new folks and I wonder if they will change their minds after seeing this.  Or maybe it's just normal?

[Arcadia]

I was in Girl Scouts decades ago when my mom was still working as a full time, rotating shift NICU nurse. My mom wrote checks for my non-profit extracurriculars in lieu of volunteering.

So far all the non-profit activities my kids are in have the cash donation in lieu of volunteer time option which makes it easier for parents. Some younger kids are drop off and pick up by grandparents or babysitters. No point affecting children whose parents can’t find the time to volunteer without clearing annual leave. I remembered a non-Scout activity when I was a kid that needed an adult to be present per child, my adult cousin went with me. 

I could volunteer for one of my kids non-profit extracurriculars by helping to maintain the webpage. An accountant mom volunteer by doing the accounts. I would want to have do from home volunteer options to choose from if volunteering is required for my kids to be allowed to participate.

[mumto2]

I have been a GS leader in the past and it’s hard work.  I actually did this as a college student and was not exactly sad that neither of my kids wanted to be scouts.  The other leader and I did it all.  I think the point system is a good way of spreading the work between the families who has a child participating which is as fair as it gets. The troop I was involved with it never would have worked, we had several unique circumstances.  I do worry about the kids who have no adult willing.  Totally nosey but I am curious.......are the points per each child participating or per family?  

 

In answer to to your question, yes we supported our kids activities.  Financially and with our time/presence. ?  I have climbed so many bell tower steps for my kids......... and I hate heights!

[Ellie]

51 minutes ago, SKL said:

Our scouting group has some people that put way more time in than others.  I am not one of those people but I can see very clearly that it's true.  And it's not fair unless the people doing all the work want it that way.

So this year they decided to require all parents to volunteer a set number of "points" - the board set the point values for various jobs.

I already have a job that gets me about 2/3 there.  I also offered to do a couple other things, but these things are not on the list - either they changed their mind about what badges to do, or they just didn't get that micro.  They do say you can suggest other point-earning activities as the list is not exhaustive.

Thing is, I kinda feel like the amount they are setting as a minimum is kinda high.  For example, leading one entire badge (multiple meetings) is one point.  I don't want to get too detailed but it seems to me that some families would have a hard time getting up to 3 points.

You aren't allowed to register your kids if you don't promise to do the 3 points.

So ... how much do you think is reasonable to require of every family participating in scouts?

I wonder how the other parents will think of this.  We have a bunch of new folks and I wonder if they will change their minds after seeing this.  Or maybe it's just normal?

The group that broke off from Boy Scouts (Trail Life) require major participation, including each boy's father being in attendance at every meeting (or something close to that). American Heritage Girls requires heavy parent participation, as well. As involved as I was in my children's activities, I would not want to make that a requirement for children to participate, as it just isn't reasonable.

Parents need to have their children to meetings and whatnot on time, and pay any dues or fees on time, and sometimes they need to go on field trips, but they don't need to do that three points thing.

[Clemsondana]

I don't have an answer for this, but I will say that one of my pet peeves is that, as a society, we've gotten to the point that everything is run by the families that use it.  I understand the logic of 'if you want it, do the work' but I think that communities run better when people do the work that they're good at, whether they benefit or not.  My grandfather had 2 girls...and led groups of boys (I think it was scouts, but may have been some other group) on camping trips.  My mom has great memories of camping in the mountains with a lot of boys when she was young.  My dad remembers being coached for years by the uncle of one of the boys on the ball team, and a retiree coached football.  My aunt coached a girls softball team for years when she was single and had no kids.  I think that the move towards ' if you want it, you do it' leads to people saying 'I'm done' when their kids finish because it was never really 'their thing' in the first place.  At church, I specifically tell children's directors that the K-5 group is not 'my people' - I'm happy to be a set of hands if they're in a pinch, but despite having kids that age, I don't want to teach that age.  I'll help in the nursery, I'll help with youth, I'll help in the kitchen, I'll lead my adult class - those are 'my things'.  My mom has taught 3-4yo Sunday School for the past 15 years - those are 'her people'.  

With anything that my kids do, I'll show up with a good attitude, do unskilled grunt work as needed, and help pay for things if there's a need, but not every activity uses the things that I'm good at.  I put a good bit of time into volunteer work that doesn't benefit anybody that I know (well, I know the people now, but didn't before I started) because there's a need that I can fill, and when I do the right job, I'm not counting hours because I don't mind doing the job.  I am eternally grateful that a scout dad whose son already has his eagle took the time to help my son earn the riflery badge, and I could dedicate my time to figuring out how to teach math to my struggling tutee at the after-school program for underpriviledged kids.   Sorry I don't have a better answer for you.  I'm big on the idea that kids need experience being led by adults that aren't related to them, and I think that communities could be strengthened if more people were involved in each other's lives through volunteering based on their abilities instead of every family managing their own kids' activities.   

[Frances]

36 minutes ago, ClemsonDana said:

I don't have an answer for this, but I will say that one of my pet peeves is that, as a society, we've gotten to the point that everything is run by the families that use it.  I understand the logic of 'if you want it, do the work' but I think that communities run better when people do the work that they're good at, whether they benefit or not.  My grandfather had 2 girls...and led groups of boys (I think it was scouts, but may have been some other group) on camping trips.  My mom has great memories of camping in the mountains with a lot of boys when she was young.  My dad remembers being coached for years by the uncle of one of the boys on the ball team, and a retiree coached football.  My aunt coached a girls softball team for years when she was single and had no kids.  I think that the move towards ' if you want it, you do it' leads to people saying 'I'm done' when their kids finish because it was never really 'their thing' in the first place.  At church, I specifically tell children's directors that the K-5 group is not 'my people' - I'm happy to be a set of hands if they're in a pinch, but despite having kids that age, I don't want to teach that age.  I'll help in the nursery, I'll help with youth, I'll help in the kitchen, I'll lead my adult class - those are 'my things'.  My mom has taught 3-4yo Sunday School for the past 15 years - those are 'her people'.  

With anything that my kids do, I'll show up with a good attitude, do unskilled grunt work as needed, and help pay for things if there's a need, but not every activity uses the things that I'm good at.  I put a good bit of time into volunteer work that doesn't benefit anybody that I know (well, I know the people now, but didn't before I started) because there's a need that I can fill, and when I do the right job, I'm not counting hours because I don't mind doing the job.  I am eternally grateful that a scout dad whose son already has his eagle took the time to help my son earn the riflery badge, and I could dedicate my time to figuring out how to teach math to my struggling tutee at the after-school program for underpriviledged kids.   Sorry I don't have a better answer for you.  I'm big on the idea that kids need experience being led by adults that aren't related to them, and I think that communities could be strengthened if more people were involved in each other's lives through volunteering based on their abilities instead of every family managing their own kids' activities.   

I completely agree with you. But I think many parents have ruined this possibility by complaining about everything or wanting things catered to their child, but not being willing to help out when needed. Growing up in a small community, virtually all of my activities were led by non-parent volunteers. But you better believe the parents stepped up and helped when asked and no one was demanding special treatment for their child, let alone criticizing everything the volunteer leaders did.

[Bluegoat]

I think it's really tricky, and maybe there is no real answer.  It may be that since it's new, they haven't really worked out how much to ask of people or what items to include.

Or, it may be they have looked at what needs to be done and divided it up notionally.  To some extent, group activities have a certain amount of work involved, and if the group is going to carry on it just needs to get done, whether it is "too much" or not.

[Bluegoat]

1 hour ago, ClemsonDana said:

I don't have an answer for this, but I will say that one of my pet peeves is that, as a society, we've gotten to the point that everything is run by the families that use it.  I understand the logic of 'if you want it, do the work' but I think that communities run better when people do the work that they're good at, whether they benefit or not.  My grandfather had 2 girls...and led groups of boys (I think it was scouts, but may have been some other group) on camping trips.  My mom has great memories of camping in the mountains with a lot of boys when she was young.  My dad remembers being coached for years by the uncle of one of the boys on the ball team, and a retiree coached football.  My aunt coached a girls softball team for years when she was single and had no kids.  I think that the move towards ' if you want it, you do it' leads to people saying 'I'm done' when their kids finish because it was never really 'their thing' in the first place.  At church, I specifically tell children's directors that the K-5 group is not 'my people' - I'm happy to be a set of hands if they're in a pinch, but despite having kids that age, I don't want to teach that age.  I'll help in the nursery, I'll help with youth, I'll help in the kitchen, I'll lead my adult class - those are 'my things'.  My mom has taught 3-4yo Sunday School for the past 15 years - those are 'her people'.  

With anything that my kids do, I'll show up with a good attitude, do unskilled grunt work as needed, and help pay for things if there's a need, but not every activity uses the things that I'm good at.  I put a good bit of time into volunteer work that doesn't benefit anybody that I know (well, I know the people now, but didn't before I started) because there's a need that I can fill, and when I do the right job, I'm not counting hours because I don't mind doing the job.  I am eternally grateful that a scout dad whose son already has his eagle took the time to help my son earn the riflery badge, and I could dedicate my time to figuring out how to teach math to my struggling tutee at the after-school program for underpriviledged kids.   Sorry I don't have a better answer for you.  I'm big on the idea that kids need experience being led by adults that aren't related to them, and I think that communities could be strengthened if more people were involved in each other's lives through volunteering based on their abilities instead of every family managing their own kids' activities.   

 

I feel this as a sunday school coordinator - there seems something a bit off about the assumption that it's the parents who do it all.  I ran our end of the year bbq and an older lady said to me that the other mothers should be helping.  ignoring that she'd let the fathers off the hook, I thought, why is it people seemed to think the parents should be running this for the rest of the parish?  

Anyway, I think the other side is that people overall are volunteering less.  They have less time in a lot of cases.  And I find more parents seem to expect drop off  activities.  And asking parents to contribute cash instead can only go so far.  

[frogger]

It is hard when our society only wants to serve when it benefits them or expects others to serve them while not contributing. Rules can't replace caring attitudes but I can see where they must be used as a last resort.

 

 I feel like I'm a slacker parent currently. Last year I taught every week, did a indoor camp sleep over, craft day, prepared lessons at home and I need to withdrawl from outside activities for a year because I have a lot of family issues and medical for me and therapy for a kid, etc. I will still be on the church nursury rotation (if my back allows me) even though I don't have young children because I believe parents with young children need a break. In fact my youngest son and teen daughter are my aids when I'm in there so our family contributes triple in that area and it's a good opportunity for them to serve. But right now we can't handle more and honestly, I'd appreciate some grace. I have in turn given grace. I took kids to things when parents couldn't. Didn't expect kids whose parents were deployed or had medical issues to contribute much and was very happy to help. I also volunteered for certain things before I even had kids. But that only works if the majority give when they can. I hope in a couple years things calm down and I can step back up. I would say if your lifelong expectation isn't one of contributing though then you are part of the problem. That is a general statement not intended at OP. It's just a statement regarding the general attitude and that givers get burnt out when the work isn't shared.

 

It also doesn't make sense to me that I contribute a little in all my kids activities. It would make more sense for me to contribute in areas where I'm strong and do most of the heavy lifting and not expect all parents to contribute the same so that they can focus on a different thing. If a couple of us are doing 80% of this activity over here do I really still have to do a certain number of points for this other activity? Certainly, a contribution here and there like setting up for a banquet where they need lots of hands but not points for points sake. To spread myself equally among symphony, sports, scouting, or whatever else a family might do rather than just being really focused on 1 or 2 is madness to me, inefficient and disheartening.

 

 

[Hilltopmom]

I feel like I put in my years running stuff when my teens were younger and tbh for my next set of kids coming up I am not planning on running activities for them & their peers. Helping, yes. But minimally. I’m burnt out.

Right now I’d rather sign them up for paid activities like dance where parents are not expected to plan, teach, or supervise anything (well except for backstage during shows).

[teachermom2834]

23 hours ago, Hilltopmom said:

I feel like I put in my years running stuff when my teens were younger and tbh for my next set of kids coming up I am not planning on running activities for them & their peers. Helping, yes. But minimally. I’m burnt out.

Right now I’d rather sign them up for paid activities like dance where parents are not expected to plan, teach, or supervise anything (well except for backstage during shows).

This is where I am. My oldest kids are 20 and 18. I was run ragged doing for them and their peers for a long time. My other kids are 15 and 10. I don't have it in me to be the leader on their activities or very involved at all. That said, I don't ever put them in an activity that I feel like i am a "taker". They just don't do activities that require heavy parental involvement and I'm sure not starting something that doesn't exist. I'd never be comfortable being that parent that doesn't contribute so we just don't do those kind of activities. I do look for opportunities to volunteer that I'm comfortable with and try to jump in and offer my help on small tasks. I also volunteer to donate food, make small donations, etc.

I also have a kid in dance and our studio doesn't even ask for help for backstage supervision. I pay and provide her the personal support of getting her there and properly supplied with shoes, tights, etc. I just got burned out and I don't have the kind of energy anymore that heavy volunteering requires.

I am really okay with any level of parental requirements as long as it is spelled out at the time of sign up. I'd rather everyone be upfront rather than carry resentment. I love the situations where parents can "buy out" and other parents can pick up the slack for a reduction in fees. I have been on both sides of that equation and thought it was a sweet deal both times.

Another wrinkle- when my oldest kids were younger, my fellow volunteers were my peers and often my friends. With my dd, I am a good ten years older and further down the parenting line that the other moms. They are good ladies but I just don't necessarily have alot in common or gel with them the way I did the parents of my older children. I'm closer to a Grandma than a new mom at this point and I find that changes the dynamic as a volunteer.

[Faith-manor]

I always thought we would be the people that would volunteer for years and years and years after our kids graduated out of the program. Then the program changed and the volunteer work became a ridiculous amount of work for the volunteer leaders. Like seriously, NUTS. So we made a rule that the parents had to help because we simply couldn't give that many hours. Parents could have older teens or grandparents, whatever help or they could ask another parent who was already going to be there to do their part, and then they would come the following month and do double duty in exchange. We made it easy. Super easy. We tried to be flexible. And the parents would not help us.

So at the end of nine years with the organization, and eight years with the rocket team, we are resigning. The rocket team had already started on this season's designs, so we found a local civic group to take on sponsorship of the team which makes it pretty simple because the civic group doesn't require a bunch of extra work from us besides the 200 hours we put in with the team. Yes, you read that number right. The STEM club however with the amazing, monthly science and mathematics projects is over as of July 30.

Parents are very upset, almost angry. But none of them are willing to do even five or six hours out of the entire year to help alleviate our load. If you burn out your leaders and make them want to bang their heads against the wall, then probably you will lose the program. If you can't help, that's fine, but you also can't complain if the leaders burn out and choose not to continue.

And the reality of a lot of programs that have been run by moms is that many of us, me included, are facing an economic reality of needing to get back into the workplace. That means the hours that we can reasonably give to a volunteer program have been seriously curtailed. I think Scouts and 4H are going to at some point have to face this new reality, and if the programs are going to survive, people are really going to have to chip in to help the leaders. There simply isn't going to be any other way to do it.

My mom would like to volunteer for 4H, she believes in it show much, however her health won't allow it. That is another reason many retirees cannot take on extensive leadership responsibilities, and some of the sixty-two year olds who might have been in good enough shape to do it, and in times past might have done so, are now working. Economics. It isn't pretty for a lot of people.

Case in point is the newly formed "Director of Community Arts" position funded through an education endowment. Originally, the organizers thought that this could be a volunteer outfit. Volunteer leaders, volunteer manager. Sounds nice. In times past that might have been possible if there was a retired musician/artist in the area with the necessary expertise to do it, and the desire. However, none of the people in the county who would be qualified for the job and could conceivably pull off starting and running a community arts program are retired or able to work for free. Once they offered it for salary, then it was something I could consider because I am returning to the workforce to help pay for our three sons' college educations. If there was no salary attached, I wouldn't be able to do it because I'd be traveling outside this area to find paid, music work. I have accepted the position because the pay was the minimum I needed to make for this coming year. And of course the down side is that another program that is not offering pay for the unbelievable hours that I've given them is losing me. But the budget no longer allows me to be a SAHM and volunteer. That's a reality that can't be avoided. I think many programs are going to see more of that.

[ScoutTN]

AHG troops vary widely in how they handle this and it can change as the board changes over time.

We do not have a formal rule. We ask every family to help in some way, knowing that for some, just getting their girls to meetings and bringing refreshments occasionally is all they can do. We have enough parents who do serve and lead in significant capacities that we can float the families who really cannot do it. We consider the troop a ministry and not requiring too much of single parents, families in divorce or loss scenarios, families caring for aging parents or special needs kids, etc. is one aspect of that.

I think troop leadership needs to be sensitive, as well as honest about the work to be done. If they are already in the classic 20/80 thing, they may be on the edge of burnout and not know what else to do. It takes wisdom and time getting to know people to discern parents who just have a consumer mentality from those who really can't do one.more.thing. 

[Lang Syne Boardie]

I've posted about volunteer burnout recently. I think one solution is to Scale The Heck Down. A music festival that I am hosting this summer, is going have an awful lot of "elegant simplicity." The plan has been continually adjusted to fit what people are able to provide, instead of shooting for the moon and then trying to harry people into creating an unrealistic dream. That's how I managed Sunday school in a mega church, too - quality over quantity, talent over expense.

I mean, face it, we cannot possibly go further toward materialism and chaos in our society. Let's start moving in the other direction. We need to share the load and expense, but that will not happen if the bucket is never filled - if there is no end to time, money, and stress every time we volunteer, why would anyone volunteer more than once? But if we can say, "You know what, that wasn't really too much time, and we didn't lay out our own money, and the goals were reached...I could do that again..." now we'll have a success loop. 

1. They don't always need a snack.

2. They don't always need a trip.

3. They don't always need a t-shirt, a goodie bag, or a hired entertainer at the end-of-season celebration.

4. We don't always need 5,000 emails for every aspect of every event - the people who care the most (or who have the most to lose) should oversee the essential elements. Delegate the rest, and let the chips fall where they may. And don't treat volunteers or leaders as if they are on call, with insane texting and emailing over nothing.

This is not going to solve the problem of overworked, unavailable parents and grandparents. It won't solve the problem of half the nation having zero extra money to pay for the "privilege" of volunteering. But if we can get our expectations nearer to what the community can provide, we might begin to grow community again. I'm seeing it in the inner city church where my son is a worship minister. They still do literal sewing circles, chili suppers, family movie night, community garden plots - they leverage their facility and their reusable stuff, and keep the scale small. The neighborhood shows up and the church grows. That attitude needs to extend to the school, the homeschool co-op, the scout troop.

Old question: "What's our big vision and how do we get more people to make it happen?"
New (throwback) question: "What can we do *well* with the people and resources that we have?"

 

 

 

[SKL]

Yeah, I've been all over the place in the past.  I used to do a lot of of volunteer work before I had kids.  It was sort of a passion for me.  Some of it was working with other people's kids, some was more administrative stuff.

When my kids were little, I found it very difficult to volunteer as a single working mom.  But, I didn't have my kids in any activities that involved volunteering.

In our scouting group, parent volunteering is basically everything, and that is why I do volunteer; the amount I did last year would qualify as just "enough points."  But it isn't easy for me, and it is probably harder for some others.

I think that in particular, the newer members would have a hard time doing it because they don't really know how the organization works, and their lives are less likely to be organized in a way that allows this kind of volunteering.

 

[SKL]

On the other hand ... when they put it like that (you have to do x amount of work [and here is what we mean by work]), I find myself more motivated to consider things I had previously been afraid to commit to.

[SKL]

Yeah, the fact that there is no credit for the volunteering we did when our kids weren't beneficiaries is kinda sad.  Not that I was doing it to get something, but to be thought of as a "taker" when I have more to balance feels unfair.  (I do think I was thought of that way in the first couple years.  Maybe I still am.)

[LucyStoner]

Our scout troop puts out a list of activities in September.  Any that need a parent volunteer that don’t get a parent volunteer are cancelled.  It works well.  People step up for the things that they want and if no one wants it, we let it go.  Love it.  

[frogger]

I have to say I agree with the posters who spoke of scaling back. Everything doesn't have to be a big fancy ordeal. I think there are more rules regarding number of adults and other safety aspects which may help mitigate bad things happening (which is good) but it also adds a little more to the burden. 

 

I also agree with those who mentioned the economic issues of people simply needing more income.

 

In my area there are just so many things to do! And many kids are constantly busy and have a lot less free time and by free time I mean a time to just interact without adults telling them what to do. So perhaps just having less activities is good although I'm not seeing a lot of that. I do see more paid activities. 

[Hilltopmom]

Going back to work does have a lot to do with it too. I’m barely keeping my head above water between work, trying to get dinner on the table and kids where they need to be. So at this stage I’m in the not volunteering stage.

[ScoutTN]

1 hour ago, Tibbie Dunbar said:

I've posted about volunteer burnout recently. I think one solution is to Scale The Heck Down. A music festival that I am hosting this summer, is going have an awful lot of "elegant simplicity." The plan has been continually adjusted to fit what people are able to provide, instead of shooting for the moon and then trying to harry people into creating an unrealistic dream. That's how I managed Sunday school in a mega church, too - quality over quantity, talent over expense.

I mean, face it, we cannot possibly go further toward materialism and chaos in our society. Let's start moving in the other direction. We need to share the load and expense, but that will not happen if the bucket is never filled - if there is no end to time, money, and stress every time we volunteer, why would anyone volunteer more than once? But if we can say, "You know what, that wasn't really too much time, and we didn't lay out our own money, and the goals were reached...I could do that again..." now we'll have a success loop. 

1. They don't always need a snack.

2. They don't always need a trip.

3. They don't always need a t-shirt, a goodie bag, or a hired entertainer at the end-of-season celebration.

4. We don't always need 5,000 emails for every aspect of every event - the people who care the most (or who have the most to lose) should oversee the essential elements. Delegate the rest, and let the chips fall where they may. And don't treat volunteers or leaders as if they are on call, with insane texting and emailing over nothing.

This is not going to solve the problem of overworked, unavailable parents and grandparents. It won't solve the problem of half the nation having zero extra money to pay for the "privilege" of volunteering. But if we can get our expectations nearer to what the community can provide, we might begin to grow community again. I'm seeing it in the inner city church where my son is a worship minister. They still do literal sewing circles, chili suppers, family movie night, community garden plots - they leverage their facility and their reusable stuff, and keep the scale small. The neighborhood shows up and the church grows. That attitude needs to extend to the school, the homeschool co-op, the scout troop.

Old question: "What's our big vision and how do we get more people to make it happen?"
New (throwback) question: "What can we do *well* with the people and resources that we have?"

 

 

 

Amen! 

Our girls are generally happy with simple events and activities. The friendships grow, and girls can learn to lead just fine with inexpensive, local, not too complicated things. 

[ScoutTN]

1 hour ago, SKL said:

I think that in particular, the newer members would have a hard time doing it because they don't really know how the organization works, and their lives are less likely to be organized in a way that allows this kind of volunteering.

 

Yes! AHG has a lot of jargon/code words and it takes a year of having a daughter in it to figure out which way is up and in which roles you could serve well. We don't pressure new parents to jump into leadership roles, but do encourage them to assist or do smaller things that will help them get the feel for how things work. We also list a zillion small ways people can help. All of them do NOT need to be done, but any of them would be of benefit to the troop. 

 

[hippiemamato3]

As  a GS leader, I don't request much of parents at all. Occasionally we need a parent to be an additional driver for a field trip, but otherwise I expect/request that they pay dues and make sure I know if their child won't be at a meeting (because otherwise I worry about them!)

[Liz CA]

What Lucy suggested upthread seems reasonable and certain activities will fall by the wayside while others may have more volunteers.

Honestly, the whole thing sounds like a burnout waiting to happen and the poor kid(s) are told they cannot participate because their parents are overscheduled, tired, working or not physically able to keep up.

I was thinking the point system you described is a little stingy. 1 point for 3 meetings? I would not be surprised if some people politely declined.

[LoveMyBeautifulGift]

Sounds like maybe the leaders need more help. Could be they need to scale back the amount of time they spend on volunteering. Could be the group has grown and the amount of help they were previously getting just isn't cutting it any more. Could be they're losing important volunteers or those volunteers had to scale back this year. I've had all of the above happen in our troop. I would look at this as them trying to clearly communicate that they need help this year and what kind of help they need. It doesn't mean they don't appreciate the help given previously. 

[DawnM]

I did 10 years of scouts. I did TONS.  Loads and loads of time, and it got frustrating when those who did absolutely nothing, would complain.  

We also volunteered for almost 20 years at church.  About 10% of the people do 90% of the work.

I am now completely burnt out.  And tired of the complainers.  I mean like seriously tired.  I may snap if I volunteer any more.  

[TechWife]

I think volunteer expectations are much more unrealistic when they were in the past. Others have mentioned scaling back & making things less elaborate, and I think that's a great way to go.

I was the parent who didn't sign up to volunteer in the nursery or preschool Sunday School rooms because that is not my age group. During the time my son was that age I was teaching a women's Bible study and then was in charge of our church's women's conference. Teens and adults are my people!

I volunteer at a hospital on a regular basis and I love it. Now, it is the hospital that literally saved my son's life, so the organization did benefit us, but my volunteering benefits only those I help during my shift (staff and families). Hospital volunteering is my niche.

Next year I will take on teaching women's Bible study again. I am currently a member of the class and am transitioning back into a leadership role. I know already that I will be doing some things differently. For example, we have coffee and then someone brings a snack every week. Our current leader heads this up - she arrives early to make the coffee, set up the coffee snack table, sends around a sign up sheet and reminds people when their turn to bring the snack comes around. I'm going to ask for a snack coordinator to take care of this for me and if no one signs up to fill that role, we will not be having coffee and snacks. There are a few other similar things of similar nature that I will be changing as well.  I will be using my time to prepare the lesson, field phone calls about the lessons from students and lead the lesson - that's my love, my calling and my role.

 

 

[Chris in VA]

2 hours ago, hippiemamato3 said:

As  a GS leader, I don't request much of parents at all. Occasionally we need a parent to be an additional driver for a field trip, but otherwise I expect/request that they pay dues and make sure I know if their child won't be at a meeting (because otherwise I worry about them!)

I was a Scout leader for my boys for a year. So I have volunteered. 

TBH, I didn't do a darn thing for my dd's troop (2 years). I mean, I went on a field trip because parents needed to drive there and stay, but other than that, I thought of it as a drop-off activity. 

Well, maybe I stayed a time or two--but my attitude was like my public school attitude in that I thought volunteering was extra-ordinary and not required. 

"Do you think these things just run themselves?" Cue guilting look and tapping foot. 

Well, YEAH. 

I'm not a very involved parent when it comes to extracurriculars. I don't think of myself as a taker. I just think of people who volunteer as wanting to be involved. I didn't. No biggie. 

But I see I'm definitely in the minority! 

[Tsuga]

I guess my question would be who is going to do all that if we don't all do it? I'm very pro-requirements because otherwise it's the same amount of work and fewer people.

I always volunteer as much as they ask and try to do more. Otherwise it just falls on other women. Other working people. When I volunteer I will ask others to help, especially calling out dads pointing out that "everyone in my family over 16 is working 40+ hours a week, we know what it's like to be busy but if we don't do this, our kids won't have the same opportunities as kids elsewhere! Dads, we need more men to step up please!" It's a little crazy-making with the dads. I think that a lot of them really think every other man has a woman at home cooking all day or something.

Nope. Nope. All the coaches, all the room parents, all the scout parents, we ALL have jobs. Not a single one of us even worked part-time. 90% of us were women.

If I ever don't volunteer it is because I have explicitly said "we have enough women, a man can step in and provide a male perspective."

I do think that reducing the load by reducing fluff is important though, and I've said so and I won't volunteer if they add in a bunch of stupid entertainment stuff that doesn't function except as a photo op.

[Tsuga]

2 hours ago, DawnM said:

I did 10 years of scouts. I did TONS.  Loads and loads of time, and it got frustrating when those who did absolutely nothing, would complain.  

We also volunteered for almost 20 years at church.  About 10% of the people do 90% of the work.

I am not completely burnt out.  And tired of the complainers.  I mean like seriously tired.  I may snap if I volunteer any more.  

 

Exactly. This is why I am pro-requirement. Otherwise it's just more for me. Really. Because I have no fewer than four things I volunteer for right now on top of work. That doesn't include charity events. And I only do essentials.

Complainers can come talk to me. ? We're currently looking for a communications manager and we are SO GLAD you want to help!

As for wanting to volunteer... nope, I want all this stuff done with no contribution just like everyone else wants. I would also like the dishes to get done without me doing it, and the oil changed, and the yard raked. Any volunteers?

[Starfish]

4 hours ago, LucyStoner said:

Our scout troop puts out a list of activities in September.  Any that need a parent volunteer that don’t get a parent volunteer are cancelled.  It works well.  People step up for the things that they want and if no one wants it, we let it go.  Love it.  

 

Our homeschool group started this a few years ago, and most of us really like this new approach.   We didn't realize how busy and stressed we were until we stopped making sure that every event happened every year.  It's been good for us.  

[Serenade]

I'm an advocate at our scout troop for NOT pressuring parents to participate if they are not able or willing.  Frankly, in our troop, we need the boys more than we need the parents.  If a boy can't join scouts because his parents are unable to volunteer, not only does the boy lose out, but it only makes our troop smaller and weaker.   We have quite a few adults in our troop who still volunteer, even though their kids have aged out.   I figure that makes up for the parents who don't choose to volunteer for whatever reason.

[chiguirre]

12 hours ago, SKL said:

Our scouting group has some people that put way more time in than others.  I am not one of those people but I can see very clearly that it's true.  And it's not fair unless the people doing all the work want it that way.

So this year they decided to require all parents to volunteer a set number of "points" - the board set the point values for various jobs.

I already have a job that gets me about 2/3 there.  I also offered to do a couple other things, but these things are not on the list - either they changed their mind about what badges to do, or they just didn't get that micro.  They do say you can suggest other point-earning activities as the list is not exhaustive.

Thing is, I kinda feel like the amount they are setting as a minimum is kinda high.  For example, leading one entire badge (multiple meetings) is one point.  I don't want to get too detailed but it seems to me that some families would have a hard time getting up to 3 points.

You aren't allowed to register your kids if you don't promise to do the 3 points.

So ... how much do you think is reasonable to require of every family participating in scouts?

I wonder how the other parents will think of this.  We have a bunch of new folks and I wonder if they will change their minds after seeing this.  Or maybe it's just normal?

The only activity my kids have done that had this explicit a system of volunteering was swim team. There you signed up for shifts when you registered (or paid a couple hundred dollars extra). It was a highly organized system because they'd done it for years. I'm sure your system will be more refined with time and experience. I think you should bring up the activities you offered to do and see what they say.

[SKL]

A lot of good thoughts above.

I will say I don't think the stuff our troop does is "fluff," and I always thought most if not all parents were already volunteering some.

A buy-out would be convenient for me, but most of what we do is not a matter of financial cost, it's hands-on time.  (That said, I wonder if I should ask about covering materials or financing a fee reduction ... but would that make me look lazy and show-offy about being able to afford a buy-out ....)

In our troop, I think most of the moms don't work full-time outside the home.  Many are homeschoolers (not to say they don't do a lot, but they can work extracurriculars including scouts into their 8-6 schedule to some extent).  Also I think I am the only member who is a single parent.  Some of the families have both parents volunteering on a regular basis.

[Pen]

Have not read all replies, however, I have not been able to have my ds do some activities over the years due to rules like this. 

I have been especially irked that often it seems to be a set amount  of time per family—which seems to favor families with 2 parents able to “volunteer” on behalf of many children as compared to single parents of online children. 

I put “volunteer” in quotes, because required work hours is not the same as voluntary volunteering. IMHO

[Tsuga]

Well, there is the po

On 7/15/2018 at 10:55 AM, Pen said:

Have not read all replies, however, I have not been able to have my ds do some activities over the years due to rules like this. 

I have been especially irked that often it seems to be a set amount  of time per family—which seems to favor families with 2 parents able to “volunteer” on behalf of many children as compared to single parents of online children. 

I put “volunteer” in quotes, because required work hours is not the same as voluntary volunteering. IMHO

It's not ever required. You always have the option if your child not getting the services.

What strikes me in these conversations is that you rarely hear about all the amazing services scouts, rec leagues, FFA and 4H provide. Our entire society is built on this free labor pool. We get out what we put in. If you just want to get, you'll get nothing but promises. You have yo be willing to give.

Or to be a burden on others.

[Bootsie]

On 7/14/2018 at 11:31 AM, ClemsonDana said:

I don't have an answer for this, but I will say that one of my pet peeves is that, as a society, we've gotten to the point that everything is run by the families that use it.  I understand the logic of 'if you want it, do the work' but I think that communities run better when people do the work that they're good at, whether they benefit or not.  My grandfather had 2 girls...and led groups of boys (I think it was scouts, but may have been some other group) on camping trips.  My mom has great memories of camping in the mountains with a lot of boys when she was young.  My dad remembers being coached for years by the uncle of one of the boys on the ball team, and a retiree coached football.  My aunt coached a girls softball team for years when she was single and had no kids.  I think that the move towards ' if you want it, you do it' leads to people saying 'I'm done' when their kids finish because it was never really 'their thing' in the first place.  At church, I specifically tell children's directors that the K-5 group is not 'my people' - I'm happy to be a set of hands if they're in a pinch, but despite having kids that age, I don't want to teach that age.  I'll help in the nursery, I'll help with youth, I'll help in the kitchen, I'll lead my adult class - those are 'my things'.  My mom has taught 3-4yo Sunday School for the past 15 years - those are 'her people'.  

With anything that my kids do, I'll show up with a good attitude, do unskilled grunt work as needed, and help pay for things if there's a need, but not every activity uses the things that I'm good at.  I put a good bit of time into volunteer work that doesn't benefit anybody that I know (well, I know the people now, but didn't before I started) because there's a need that I can fill, and when I do the right job, I'm not counting hours because I don't mind doing the job.  I am eternally grateful that a scout dad whose son already has his eagle took the time to help my son earn the riflery badge, and I could dedicate my time to figuring out how to teach math to my struggling tutee at the after-school program for underpriviledged kids.   Sorry I don't have a better answer for you.  I'm big on the idea that kids need experience being led by adults that aren't related to them, and I think that communities could be strengthened if more people were involved in each other's lives through volunteering based on their abilities instead of every family managing their own kids' activities.   

I agree that it would be great if we could have people volunteering in the activities that they are best suited for volunteering in.  Looking back at how things ran when I was a child in the 60's and early 70s, versus how they are run now, I think a lot has changed in regards to the quantity of volunteer time needed to run many activities.  When I was young, a friend's older brother coached our recreation basketball team.  We showed up for practice at the outdoor basketball court, he gave us drills, we went home...  Now, he would not be old enough to qualify as a leader.  We would have to have adult leaders who went through safety and sexual abuse awareness training.  We would have to have multiple adults available at the practice for liability reasons.  In addition, we would need someone to maintain the webpage, the communication list, the snack list for each practice, the uniform distribution.  I think many volunteers have also experienced criticism from non-volunteering parents (you didn't let my child play enough, you didn't provide enough supervision, you didn't do enough badges, you had practice at a time I didn't like, you should make it cheaper for my child to participate...) that they get exhausted and say, "Hey!  You have to help, too!"

I think you also make a good point that children benefit from having their own activities which are run by adults other than their parents.  Many children would greatly benefit from participating in an activity in which a parent is not constantly hovering.  

On a micro-level, however, I can see how a particular team, club, or organization says "we can't do all the things we need to do to have this running well if we don't have X number of volunteer hour" which have to come from somewhere.  

[vonfirmath]

On 7/14/2018 at 6:00 PM, LoveMyBeautifulGift said:

Sounds like maybe the leaders need more help. Could be they need to scale back the amount of time they spend on volunteering. Could be the group has grown and the amount of help they were previously getting just isn't cutting it any more. Could be they're losing important volunteers or those volunteers had to scale back this year. I've had all of the above happen in our troop. I would look at this as them trying to clearly communicate that they need help this year and what kind of help they need. It doesn't mean they don't appreciate the help given previously. 

 

Agreed. A system like this does not say to me "The troop has enough help and the adults are happy to do it"  It says to me "The adults who made this work (Barely--remember one of your kids realized at the last minute she needed to do a activity to get her end of the year award) are burned out and realizing, if they are going to keep this working, they need more help. What they did last year to get more help didn't work so now they are trying something else.

 

[katilac]

On 7/14/2018 at 8:33 PM, Tsuga said:

 

This is why I am pro-requirement. <snip>

Complainers can come talk to me. ? We're currently looking for a communications manager and we are SO GLAD you want to help!

 <snip>

1

 

I think you lose the right to call yourself a service organization if you have those types of requirements, you become a regular club or extra-curricular. Which is fine, but bill yourself as such. Organizations that make a big deal about serving the community cannot, imo, kick out kids whose parents are unwilling or unable to do a set number of volunteer hours. Some of those kids are of course the ones most in need of attention and support. 

Absolutely agree with telling complainers to step up to the plate, but that is different from requiring volunteer hours in order for the kid to participate. Volunteer leaders need to remember that they do not have to please the complainers, they don't have to give in to the complainers, and, after an initial brief discussion, they don't even have to listen to the complainers. Tell them to put their detailed complaints in writing ?

Many posters have hit on the numerous complicating details. What if the parents are heavily volunteering in another activity? What if they are just at a season in their life when they can't volunteer? And so on. 

Certainly it's fine to remind people how many volunteer hours are required to run the organization. Certainly it's fine to say a certain activity can't be done because there aren't enough volunteers. Those are just facts. 

I spent a few years of my working life recruiting and training volunteers. Here are some helpful tips for success: 

• DETAILED job descriptions are critical. 
• Have easy entry-level jobs. People are afraid of not doing well. Starter jobs, along with job descriptions and training, remove this obstacle.
• Have a chain of command.  
• Give volunteers the freedom to do their jobs; no micromanaging. Once the decorating committee is selected, they do what they want within budgets and rules, they don't bring ideas back to the group for approval. If decorations are important to you, join the decorating committee. 
• Have a regular reporting system. 
• Recognize volunteers. 
• Train volunteers.
• Create an identity and sense of teamwork for volunteers. 
• Have high standards (which doesn't work with requiring volunteering). 
• It never hurts to point out the benefits of volunteering. It's a networking opportunity, a chance to learn new skills, something to put on the resume. 

  

[unsinkable]

On 7/14/2018 at 4:56 PM, Faith-manor said:

I always thought we would be the people that would volunteer for years and years and years after our kids graduated out of the program. Then the program changed and the volunteer work became a ridiculous amount of work for the volunteer leaders. Like seriously, NUTS. So we made a rule that the parents had to help because we simply couldn't give that many hours. Parents could have older teens or grandparents, whatever help or they could ask another parent who was already going to be there to do their part, and then they would come the following month and do double duty in exchange. We made it easy. Super easy. We tried to be flexible. And the parents would not help us.

So at the end of nine years with the organization, and eight years with the rocket team, we are resigning. The rocket team had already started on this season's designs, so we found a local civic group to take on sponsorship of the team which makes it pretty simple because the civic group doesn't require a bunch of extra work from us besides the 200 hours we put in with the team. Yes, you read that number right. The STEM club however with the amazing, monthly science and mathematics projects is over as of July 30.

Parents are very upset, almost angry. But none of them are willing to do even five or six hours out of the entire year to help alleviate our load. If you burn out your leaders and make them want to bang their heads against the wall, then probably you will lose the program. If you can't help, that's fine, but you also can't complain if the leaders burn out and choose not to continue.

And the reality of a lot of programs that have been run by moms is that many of us, me included, are facing an economic reality of needing to get back into the workplace. That means the hours that we can reasonably give to a volunteer program have been seriously curtailed. I think Scouts and 4H are going to at some point have to face this new reality, and if the programs are going to survive, people are really going to have to chip in to help the leaders. There simply isn't going to be any other way to do it.

My mom would like to volunteer for 4H, she believes in it show much, however her health won't allow it. That is another reason many retirees cannot take on extensive leadership responsibilities, and some of the sixty-two year olds who might have been in good enough shape to do it, and in times past might have done so, are now working. Economics. It isn't pretty for a lot of people.

Case in point is the newly formed "Director of Community Arts" position funded through an education endowment. Originally, the organizers thought that this could be a volunteer outfit. Volunteer leaders, volunteer manager. Sounds nice. In times past that might have been possible if there was a retired musician/artist in the area with the necessary expertise to do it, and the desire. However, none of the people in the county who would be qualified for the job and could conceivably pull off starting and running a community arts program are retired or able to work for free. Once they offered it for salary, then it was something I could consider because I am returning to the workforce to help pay for our three sons' college educations. If there was no salary attached, I wouldn't be able to do it because I'd be traveling outside this area to find paid, music work. I have accepted the position because the pay was the minimum I needed to make for this coming year. And of course the down side is that another program that is not offering pay for the unbelievable hours that I've given them is losing me. But the budget no longer allows me to be a SAHM and volunteer. That's a reality that can't be avoided. I think many programs are going to see more of that.

What happened to the $24/ hour paid STEM Educational consultant job? 

You said that this school year it was one day per week but next year it changed to full time and how perfect it was bc you 'd be done homeschooling.

 

[Laurel-in-CA]

We're in an AHG troop and we've talked about the volunteer points thing....but then we'd need somebody ELSE to manage the points. No way.

We expect new parents to be present in their daughter's unit or in the nursery with younger siblings if applicable. We ask those who aren't unit leaders to plan or help plan a special event or service activity...but this depends on the family's circumstances as we get to know them better. We have a single-dad family (we see him once/year at our father-daughter event; the neighbor brings his daughter). We have families where dad is on a ship (NOAAH) or where divorce is happening or has happened or there's a special needs kid or parent medical issues. Volunteer requirements HAVE to be able to flex for family needs...otherwise it's not volunteering and it's not family friendly, and it ends up undercutting the very families we want to serve. On the other hand, if there's no service and no reason for not helping....we have a little conversation about which badge you can lead for which unit or whether you'd like to reorganize storage with me over the summer or which activity didn't happen because there wasn't a lead parent. 

[Pen]

6 hours ago, Tsuga said:

Well, there is the po

It's not ever required. You always have the option if your child not getting the services.

What strikes me in these conversations is that you rarely hear about all the amazing services scouts, rec leagues, FFA and 4H provide. Our entire society is built on this free labor pool. We get out what we put in. If you just want to get, you'll get nothing but promises. You have yo be willing to give.

Or to be a burden on others.

 

As having been the child of a very hard working mom who, by no fault or choice of her own had to raise me on her own and knowing others in similar situations , I don’t agree with you about having “to be willing to give” — had circumstances been different, my mom would have loved to have been able to give her time as den mother or what have you, as would I have in other circumstances. Willingness requires a great deal of good fortune behind it to become possible. 

[Ausmumof3]

Most of our activities are paid and run by paid helpers.  There's one that is all volunteer but there's still only three volunteers involved really.  The other is mostly paid but has one volunteer.  I guess now I think about it one other is volunteer run but dh helps out.

i want to say this is a two income family thing but then I am a stay at home mum and don't volunteer much.  Most of what I have done was when we were both working but kid free.  Somehow I seem to have got lazy or this homeschool thing is just hard.  

[unsinkable]

The leader/coach type that I find difficult is the type who is the leader/coach bc she wants her own kids involved/on the team and/or she is a control freak. but then this same person moans about how much work it is and no one appreciates it, etc...

And I want to say...cut the garbage. Your kid wouldnt even have made the team of you weren't the coach. He definitely wouldn't be a starter or start at XYZ position.

Or...you're the leader bc you're on a power trip and you want things your way but you want to tell other parents how to do it.

[skimomma]

8 hours ago, katilac said:

 

 

I spent a few years of my working life recruiting and training volunteers. Here are some helpful tips for success: 

• DETAILED job descriptions are critical. 
• Have easy entry-level jobs. People are afraid of not doing well. Starter jobs, along with job descriptions and training, remove this obstacle.
• Have a chain of command.  
• Give volunteers the freedom to do their jobs; no micromanaging. Once the decorating committee is selected, they do what they want within budgets and rules, they don't bring ideas back to the group for approval. If decorations are important to you, join the decorating committee. 
• Have a regular reporting system. 
• Recognize volunteers. 
• Train volunteers.
• Create an identity and sense of teamwork for volunteers. 
• Have high standards (which doesn't work with requiring volunteering). 
• It never hurts to point out the benefits of volunteering. It's a networking opportunity, a chance to learn new skills, something to put on the resume. 

  

 

I am on the board of a local youth activity that does "require" parent volunteer points.  There are always the parents that don't volunteer at all and we do not kick those kids out.  Then there are the parents that do WAY more than their fair share and we sit on pins and needles worried they will get burned out and quit.  Whatever the case, the list above is great.  But.  It takes MORE volunteers to do the things on the list!  We are currently trying to do some of those things and finding the people to do THOSE things is just another drain on an already overtaxed system.  Almost every family involved is 2+ income, multiple child or single parent juggling jobs and multiple kids.  I honestly have no idea how we get the volunteer hours we have as it is.  It gets worse every year.  I am honestly counting the days until my kid ages out because I seriously fear that the volunteer scaffolding holding this whole organization up is about to crumble.  Fluff, SNACKS, rules about how many adults, etc.... all contribute to the problem in addition to people having to work more and jobs being more demanding.  Some we can control but most we cannot.

For those wanting to be able to pay our of volunteering or just not volunteer....how do you think programs should be run (extenuating circumstances aside)?  Who should do it?  I'm with you.  I am terrible at working with kids that are not my own.  I do not enjoy it and I am not good at it.  I make a beeline for any admin task available.  But the fact is, if I want my kid to be able to do these things, someone has to do the work.  Why should I expect other people to do more than me?

[Wheres Toto]

2 hours ago, unsinkable said:

The leader/coach type that I find difficult is the type who is the leader/coach bc she wants her own kids involved/on the team and/or she is a control freak. but then this same person moans about how much work it is and no one appreciates it, etc...

And I want to say...cut the garbage. Your kid wouldnt even have made the team of you weren't the coach. He definitely wouldn't be a starter or start at XYZ position.

Or...you're the leader bc you're on a power trip and you want things your way but you want to tell other parents how to do it.

The bolded is why I'm a 4-H leader.  ? But I don't moan about it, and I don't really make any effort to recruit parents to help out.  Dh is my required second responsible adult and even he tends to just sit and watch unless I need an extra set of hands. 

But, I also stopped doing field trips, never even started doing snack, and only communicate on Facebook unless it's very important in which case, I'll send an email.   I run things in the way that works for me.  I guess I'm lucky in that our county office isn't overbearing.  They don't really require anything except annual training that can be done online and registration.

[Sugarfoot]

I don't know what the answer is, but I'm struggling with this right now, too. I spent 6.5 hours today helping to run a kids' activity. I spent about 8 hours preparing for it, as well. I've been parenting a long time. I did a lot when my older kids were little, and I'm still doing it, but I'm so, so tired. I really enjoy being with the kids/teaching them, but I can feel burnout on the horizon. My DD enjoys it, and it seems important to her that I'm there volunteering.  When I asked her if she had fun today, she said her favorite thing was lunch... I'm really questioning whether stuff like this is worth it... I have church and community responsibilities, too, and I don't want to give those up.

 

[SKL]

I do think some of it is that the adult involvement requirements have been artificially or externally increased.

A certain number of requirements are because we need to "make the numbers."  I had agreed last year to become a "leader" on paper and sit in on some of the PiPa meetings for this reason.  This is not something that necessarily helps anyone, but it needs to be done because "numbers."  To do this, I have to take a training course - presumably they will train me in all the things a lone adult is not allowed to do with kids, LOL.  I mean I already know you aren't supposed to club or drown them or leave them alone on top of Mount Everest, so ....

The above won't even count toward my "points" because it isn't a substantive contribution.  But it will take time (mostly likely in the wee hours some morning), and make it that much harder to do the work that does count. 

If the troop could forego a lot of these administrative requirements, they probably would not need everyone to volunteer.  But you can't just decide not to do that stuff.

[Carrie12345]

I can't speak for people who don't want to volunteer, but I can speak for some people who may LOOK like they don't want to volunteer, because I'm sure I've appeared that way.

The rotten FB memes that go around, talking about how anyone could make time for things that are important enough to them?  I hate that <expletive>. Little League has been very important to my family. For much of the time my kids have played, I've had babies and/or toddlers with me, and a spouse with an unpredictable travel schedule. With multiple kids on different teams, sometimes double and triple booked on fields 30 minutes apart.  And teaching multiple classes in two co-ops, plus helping to run one of them (which, it turns out, never stops being a full time job.) Plus being active with our volunteer fire department.  Plus trying to attend community meetings one Saturday a month and, for a time, additional committee meetings on other Saturdays.  Plus trying to stay active in a local politics without being pressured into a board position.
Add in homeschooling, grocery shopping, cooking, cleaning, handling finances, trying to have some actual family togetherness time, attempting to carve out some time to be a real human being with personal needs, making sure the kids have time to go run around in the woods or see a movie with friends or whatever, maybe spending some actual time with extended family and friends, and there's just no more time or energy to give without sacrificing OTHER important things.

So my kids' LL season was pretty crummy this year, with very few volunteers to go around. It stinks, for sure.  I'll be very upset if they can't make ends meet next year, but I will 100% understand if it goes away due to lack of volunteers.  If something is unsustainable, it's unsustainable.  Sad, but reality.

The other message that goes around is "Stop the glorification of Busy."  So, yeah, I'm not supposed to say that I'm busy.  But I am supposed to get more busy, or else I'll be considered lazy.  I'm so over it.  I'll just be over here, trying also not to be too fat, too skinny, or too buff, trying to create a not too perfect, not too "lived in" home, educating my kids to be excellent college applicants, but also with thorough alternate skills if they choose another route, and generally just trying really hard to look like I'm not trying at all in every other aspect of my life so everyone can judge me for being too lazy or too busy depending on which side of the fence they're on that day.

So, that turned into a venty rant that I wasn't exactly expecting...

[DawnM]

6 hours ago, Margaret in CO said:

I'm struggling with this too. I'm musing because I have to fill out a inner-looking questionnaire BEFORE I spend an entire week at Wood Badge, which *I* had to pay for! It's also involves 10+ hours of driving. Did I mention that I haven't had a kid in the troop for 4 years???? I'm in the process of running Rendezvous for 100 Scouts. I've been asked to do a merit badge rally this fall. Did I mention that I've already put in 4 hours on Scouts today--about the usual amount. And then I had a parent tell me that the extra Board of Review that I put together this weekend wasn't convenient! I'm trying to squeeze one in before dh takes the troop to a different camp. I had a dad demand that he get the ASM title because he wanted to be the big man at Philmont. Um, no. We don't need another ASM. We need mb counselors and he's "too busy". When I had to answer the question this evening, "Where do you see yourself in 5 years in Scouting?" I'm thinking it's not going to be at the troop or crew level (I'm starting a new crew this winter) but confining myself to the district level. I spent 4 hours on the phone with two boys this week, trying to make their Eagle projects work. That was days ago--no paperwork from them yet. I'm doing over half the Crew Advisor's and SM's jobs right now as dh is gone so much for cancer treatments. The saving grace is that we have a fabulous advancement chair and a great treasurer. But we also have the usual collection of parents who are "too busy". 

 

We had a handful of families who stuck around after their boys got Eagle or aged out, but most of us bailed.  I worked scouts for 10 years.  I spend a lot of time.  But once my boys were out, I was out.  For one thing, once my boys were out I had to go back to work full time to pay for college!  But beyond that, I just couldn't.    And that stuff you are mentioning is so frustrating.  But I work with teens for my job and it is frustrating!  but at least I get paid now.