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when your teen asks you if something looks good


kristin0713
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8 minutes ago, kristin0713 said:

and she says BE HONEST, and you say honestly it's not flattering, xyz is better, and then she is mad and it's all your fault 🙄🤦‍♀️ 

 

For one, I would preface with: do you want my opinion or not?   Don't shoot the messenger if you don't like the message.  I also learned to be careful what I suggested.  I once showed her an ugly lime green fleece - as I was getting really frustrated with the shopping trip.  She loved it, and wore it constantly.  (Her now-diagnosed ASD showed when I had to tell her to "put it in the wash".)

You might want to include what it is about that item isn't flattering so she can learn for herself.

I had one son who was really into attitude T-shirts at that age.  We really had to pick through them to find OK ones . . .  Funny ones were good.

He picked one, that on the surface looked funny.  Bless his heart - he had no idea what it *really* meant . . . I told him.  He turned beet red and quickly put it back.

 

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Context matters! In my experience, anyway.
If it’s about style, “Not my bag, but you’re rocking it.”
If it’s about fit, “Do you feel great in it? Then it’s great.”
If it’s about appropriateness for the occasion, AND takes into account the wearer’s age/vibe, honesty.
If it’s ridiculous fabric for a super cold day, I tell them they’re being stupid. 😛 

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I'm reading Caitlin Moran's More Than a Woman (lots of explicit stuff in there--warning) and I love her feminist take on how she handles such questions with her teen daughters. "Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, and YOU are the beholder." Lots of discussion on what do YOU find beautiful? If it's Amy Winehouse eyeliner, go for it. You're not dressing to please someone else.

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“It’s not flattering” is horrible feedback.  
 

If there’s something specific, say that.  Like, “The back side seam is in an odd place and makes it look like you have a weird bump on your butt.”

If you just don’t like it say something like “It’s not my style, but if you like it, go for it.”

If what you really mean is “You are not shaped like societies’ current body ideal and this outfit doesn’t hide that” then think hard before speaking.

Edited by Danae
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5 minutes ago, Ali in OR said:

I'm reading Caitlin Moran's More Than a Woman (lots of explicit stuff in there--warning) and I love her feminist take on how she handles such questions with her teen daughters. "Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, and YOU are the beholder." Lots of discussion on what do YOU find beautiful? If it's Amy Winehouse eyeliner, go for it. You're not dressing to please someone else.

I don't know...

I get crap from my oldest dd who I allowed pretty much to wear and look how she wanted. She was a prickly kid and there were so many things I HAD to dig in about that I didn't care if she wore ratty stuff. She looks at photos and says, "Geez mom, why didn't you stop me or tell me or something." She is genuinely frustrated that she looked so terrible in old pictures. I tell her that it was her choice, but still doesn't seem to mollify her.

Who knows?

It seems that there's no winning in these kinds of conversations. 

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The *absolutely most best and most healthy and effective communication* tradition within the WTM boards is, JAWM.  Thank you  @Mrs Mungo , wish you still were here.  More often than not, JAWM is precisely what we truly want.

Affirmation: the greatest of all the Emotional Intelligence gifts.

Clear and succinct communication of what we actually want (which in turn entails *knowing* and *acknowledging* and *courage to verbalize* what we really want: the greatest of Self Advocacy skills.

 

It's too much to ask, of teens, that THEY be able to verbalize JAWM.  We're the d@mn grownups (though it's worth at least trying, off the passion of a particular encounter, to teach them the language of JAWM).  But 90% of the time JAWM *is* where they're coming from.

Be grateful that they're looking to us for affirmation. However goofy their clothing choice may be, the fact that they're coming to us for affirmation, is huge.

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I do encourage my girls to not play games with those around them. IF you REALLY want the feedback, then it's unfair to ask for it and be mad at honesty. I hate it when women (grown women) play those kinds of games. I realize that takes emotional maturity, but I do work through those moments with them later when they aren't feeling put on the spot.

Say what you mean. 

If you want people to be honest, then you have to accept the results of that honesty. 

And if you're mad at the fact that it's hard to have x body in a world that only likes and clothes y bodies, then be mad at that and not your mom or your sister or whoever was honest with you.

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Yep.

A few years ago, my then-young-adult daughter cited that kind of exchange as an example of how I fostered her unhealthy body image.

Honestly, I don't even remember the incident, but I can pretty much guarantee that I perceived and intended the comment as applying to the skirt she was trying on, not her body. ("Mom, what do you think of this skirt?" "Hmm, I don't think it's the most flattering thing you've tried on today."")

But that isn't how she heard it.

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10 minutes ago, Carrie12345 said:

Context matters! In my experience, anyway.
If it’s about style, “Not my bag, but you’re rocking it.”
If it’s about fit, “Do you feel great in it? Then it’s great.”
If it’s about appropriateness for the occasion, AND takes into account the wearer’s age/vibe, honesty.
If it’s ridiculous fabric for a super cold day, I tell them they’re being stupid. 😛 

Yep. It took a long time for my daughter to really get it that I don't have to like her clothing. Ripped jeans?  Sorry, don't like them. But, hey, they look like they fit well and if you like them, wear them. BTW she is 23 now and still asks my opinion, but she understands that I can not like a style but still think it's fine for her. 

I focus on fit. Whether something is flattering or not is subjective. I will say if I think something is too tight or loose and ask if she's really going to be comfortable in it. Sometimes something is cute but just doesn't fit, and having a second person question the fit can be helpful. Like, that top looks looser than your usual style. Did you bend over in front of the mirror to see how it looks? Are you OK with people seeing your bra etc? If so, OK, just understand how it fits and if it's appropriate for the place you're planning to wear it. That has nothing to do with modesty btw but how she wants to present herself at work or where ever. 

 

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7 minutes ago, fairfarmhand said:

She looks at photos and says, "Geez mom, why didn't you stop me or tell me or something." She is genuinely frustrated that she looked so terrible in old pictures. I tell her that it was her choice, but still doesn't seem to mollify her.

Yep to this, too.

That same daughter who was upset by my "the skirt isn't flattering" comment has also expressed irritation that I "let" her get a haircut she now perceives as being unattractive . . . when she was 12.

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3 minutes ago, marbel said:

I focus on fit. Whether something is flattering or not is subjective. I will say if I think something is too tight or loose and ask if she's really going to be comfortable in it. Sometimes something is cute but just doesn't fit, and having a second person question the fit can be helpful. Like, that top looks looser than your usual style. Did you bend over in front of the mirror to see how it looks? Are you OK with people seeing your bra etc? If so, OK, just understand how it fits and if it's appropriate for the place you're planning to wear it. That has nothing to do with modesty btw but how she wants to present herself at work or where ever. 

 

This is how I learned to manage things. 

Also, I found my girls to be much more receptive to my opinions when I made a conscious effort to affirm their appearance in other ways at other times when they weren't asking for my thoughts. 

Even if they do weird things like dye their hair orange, you can always find something 

"Your eyes look so blue today. So pretty."

"I love your smile."

"I wish I'd had the confidence to wear what I really liked when I was your age."

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15 minutes ago, Danae said:

“It’s not flattering” is horrible feedback.  
 

If there’s something specific, say that.  Like, “The back side seam is in an odd place and makes it look like you have a weird bump on your butt.”

If you just don’t like it say something like “It’s not my style, but if you like it, go for it.”

If what you really mean is “You are not shaped like societies’ current body ideal and this outfit doesn’t hide that” then think hard before speaking.

If she was overweight, I would agree with you. This has nothing to do with her body. She's a healthy weight and she knows it. I'm not sure these particular jeans would be flattering on anybody. 

I did say, "It only matters if you like it. You asked my opinion. Your other jeans look great on you. I don't think these are flattering. But if you like them, that is what is important." 

I don't have a problem with the concept of something being flattering or not. I can see why some people do. I think, generally, most people want to wear things that they look good in. 

22 minutes ago, marbel said:

I focus on fit. Whether something is flattering or not is subjective.

I think that fit and color both contribute to whether or not something is flattering. Yeah, some of it is subjective, but sometimes it is pretty obvious. 

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My mom is so happy that all the schools my brother and I attended from preK to 12th had school uniforms.  The bulk of my clothes were tailor made and I helped my mom picked clothes. My teens will “critique” each other’s clothing so I never had to comment unless it is things like “your jeans look outgrown” or “your shirt isn’t tuck properly”.

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56 minutes ago, fairfarmhand said:

I don't know...

I get crap from my oldest dd who I allowed pretty much to wear and look how she wanted. She was a prickly kid and there were so many things I HAD to dig in about that I didn't care if she wore ratty stuff. She looks at photos and says, "Geez mom, why didn't you stop me or tell me or something." She is genuinely frustrated that she looked so terrible in old pictures. I tell her that it was her choice, but still doesn't seem to mollify her.

Who knows?

It seems that there's no winning in these kinds of conversations. 

Aww, I feel bad for her.
I truly love seeing how stupid I looked as a kid, lol. 

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1 hour ago, Ali in OR said:

I'm reading Caitlin Moran's More Than a Woman (lots of explicit stuff in there--warning) and I love her feminist take on how she handles such questions with her teen daughters. "Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, and YOU are the beholder." Lots of discussion on what do YOU find beautiful? If it's Amy Winehouse eyeliner, go for it. You're not dressing to please someone else.

I can understand this perspective as an adult. But the reality for teens is that they DO care a great deal about what other people think. I definitely see the value in helping them to choose what they love and feel confident in their choices. I think that's a lifelong process. I still struggle with it. 

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19 minutes ago, Carrie12345 said:

Aww, I feel bad for her.
I truly love seeing how stupid I looked as a kid, lol. 

One thing I notice about my daughter's generation is that the middle schoolers are less likely to look as awkward as we did a hundred years ago. I see many middle schoolers and they are so nicely put together. IT seems that there is a higher percentage of girls who are more aware of how to dress and do makeup and hair. 

Maybe that's just my perception,

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7 minutes ago, fairfarmhand said:

One thing I notice about my daughter's generation is that the middle schoolers are less likely to look as awkward as we did a hundred years ago. I see many middle schoolers and they are so nicely put together. IT seems that there is a higher percentage of girls who are more aware of how to dress and do makeup and hair. 

Maybe that's just my perception,

To an extent, I think it probably IS just our perception. We remember ourselves and our classmates as being self-conscious and vaguely feeling ugly, and we look at the fashions of the times that we thought were super cool and think they look super stupid, and these two things make us go "Wow, middle schoolers look nicer than I remember!" when really, it's our memory that's flawed.

Though I will say I do not see any of the severe cases of acne that I saw a lot of when I was a kid. Mild acne, sure, and I bet a lot of those kids think that they have the WORST pimples ever. But kids with zits literally covering their entire face, which I knew more than a few of as an adolescent, and in some cases have the non-blurry photographic evidence to prove? No. I haven't seen any of that, nor anything nearly that bad.

But... that might be some sort of weird freakish demographic thing, like how when I went from middle to high school suddenly the number of kids I knew with highly visible keloid scars on their face, arms, or hands went from "surprisingly high" to "zilch". I might have spent adolescence in a very acne-infested circle and now I'm in a weirdly acne-free circle.

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40 minutes ago, Tanaqui said:

To an extent, I think it probably IS just our perception. We remember ourselves and our classmates as being self-conscious and vaguely feeling ugly, and we look at the fashions of the times that we thought were super cool and think they look super stupid, and these two things make us go "Wow, middle schoolers look nicer than I remember!" when really, it's our memory that's flawed.

Though I will say I do not see any of the severe cases of acne that I saw a lot of when I was a kid. Mild acne, sure, and I bet a lot of those kids think that they have the WORST pimples ever. But kids with zits literally covering their entire face, which I knew more than a few of as an adolescent, and in some cases have the non-blurry photographic evidence to prove? No. I haven't seen any of that, nor anything nearly that bad.

But... that might be some sort of weird freakish demographic thing, like how when I went from middle to high school suddenly the number of kids I knew with highly visible keloid scars on their face, arms, or hands went from "surprisingly high" to "zilch". I might have spent adolescence in a very acne-infested circle and now I'm in a weirdly acne-free circle.

Back when I was a teen, the only choice I ever heard about for acne prevention was Clearasil.  There is so much more out there now including medications for severe acne. 

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My kids learned early that if you asked me a question, you got an honest answer. If you didn't want to hear what I really thought, you should not ask. 
But, if they came out with something that was awful, if I were paying, I would say, we are not getting that. If they were buying, I wouldn't say anything unless it was so over the top bad it had to be said.  I just don't have the time or mental energy or patience or desire to play any sort of games with communication. 

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My mom in hindsight and during I thought was a fantastic mom during my teenage years. She gave me excellent clothing advice. She would separate out whether it was a piece of clothing that she felt no one would look good in or whether I just didn't look good in it. So, for clothes that just didn't appeal to her tastes she would say I don't like baggy pants, I don't think they look good on anyone.

For things that she just didn't think look good on me, she would point out exactly where the issues were, and we would try to fix it together. She wasn't the best at giving me high self-esteem about my physical appearance, however she made sure to teach me that clothes should work for me not the other way around. If something didn't look flattering on me; it wasn't my fault I didn't look good in it, it was the weird design/cut/sizing of the article of clothing in question (it might be for someone but not for me). 

FWIW she wasn't the best mom when I was a child. 

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17 minutes ago, Brittany1116 said:

I think there is a struggle, too, between wanting to wear what's in style and wanting to look good. But does anyone actually look good in acid washed high waisted mom jeans with a rolled cuff?

That depends on how many pairs of scrunched socks you're wearing with them. 

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1 hour ago, Brittany1116 said:

I think there is a struggle, too, between wanting to wear what's in style and wanting to look good. But does anyone actually look good in acid washed high waisted mom jeans with a rolled cuff?

A.b.s.o.l.u.t.e.l.y. n.o. o.n.e.

Clothing designers and fashion trend setters are just playing with us for their own amusement. Like a domesticated cat with a house mouse.

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9 hours ago, Jean in Newcastle said:

Back when I was a teen, the only choice I ever heard about for acne prevention was Clearasil.  There is so much more out there now including medications for severe acne. 

Kids have so many options. A visit to the family doctor is easy and results in basic acne meds. When I see kids with bad acne - and I do see them - I am so sad for those kids because there are so many options for acne now. 

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My kids have enough history with me to know that if they tell me to be honest, they're getting matter of fact, unvarnished honesty. Sometimes they ask and sometimes they don't.

I don't interpret any of their reactions personally-I completely understand being frustrated that something you like doesn't fit well.  I get irritated about that too. (Petite size with a longer torso and short legs for a petite person here.)  I'm very sympathetic when they're grumpy about it.

If someone doesn't make a "You......" statement, or explicitly lay blame in uncertain terms, I don't take it personally. Waaaay too many people take things personally when the speaker didn't intend it.  I have no idea if that's the case with the OP or not, there are no direct quotes.

There are Youtube videos that help people understand how to maximize and minimize aspects of their silhouette with clothing choices. I think most teens would benefit watching them as long as ones are chosen that don't promote one body type over another.  Watch some that say things like, "If you want your shoulders to seem wider wear these things....If you want your shoulders to seem narrower wear these things....If you want your legs to seem longer wear these things.....If you want your legs to seem shorter wear these things...." With everything stated neutrally it's empowering. Teens can experiment to see which proportions they prefer for themselves.

ETA: MY teen doesn't like the hat in pic.  I didn't ask her what she thought because I don't care, but I do tease her that now that's she's said something I have to wear it until I die.

Edited by HS Mom in NC
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12 hours ago, Danae said:

“It’s not flattering” is horrible feedback.  
 

If there’s something specific, say that.  Like, “The back side seam is in an odd place and makes it look like you have a weird bump on your butt.”

If you just don’t like it say something like “It’s not my style, but if you like it, go for it.”

If what you really mean is “You are not shaped like societies’ current body ideal and this outfit doesn’t hide that” then think hard before speaking.

I love the first part of this, but I am equally honest for the last line as well.  I will say it more like "IMO that doesn't work with your body type but if you want to buy it because it's in style now then go for it" -- but then she and I have had lots of discussions about body types and how hard it has been for me to find things that worked for my body type (we both have more extreme body types although somewhat opposites).   She also had a clothes allowance since starting in high school so she didn't need to have my approval to buy anything from that point on. 

Of course personally I love shopping with my one friend that will be completely totally honest with me, so probably that matters too 😄

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11 hours ago, fairfarmhand said:

One thing I notice about my daughter's generation is that the middle schoolers are less likely to look as awkward as we did a hundred years ago. I see many middle schoolers and they are so nicely put together. IT seems that there is a higher percentage of girls who are more aware of how to dress and do makeup and hair. 

Maybe that's just my perception,

I completely agree with this and I think it is because of the smart phone. Kids these days (geez…I sound like a dinosaur! 😂) have grown up with the ability to instantly view themselves in photos. I mean, back in my day we had to use up a whole roll of film, drop it off (or send it off), and then wait for the photos to be developed to know how we really looked. My 14 year old dd takes a beautiful photo. She knows exactly how to smile and how to position herself correctly. This is due to the ability to take a million selfies/pics with her friends. So I do think that my kids’ generation look way less awkward that my generation…back in the day….

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I used to tell my daughter that from my xx year old person's eyes, and what styles I think look best on her....that this item, is not my favorite. 

She was also good about listening, but also having her own opinions. The only things I would veto, was short shorts or short tops. Otherwise, I just let her pick her own items.

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14 minutes ago, Just Kate said:

mean, back in my day we had to use up a whole roll of film, drop it off (or send it off), and then wait for the photos to be developed to know how we really looked.

and there were always doubles. We have doubles of endless bad pictures. lol

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1 hour ago, Just Kate said:

to know how we really looked. My 14 year old dd takes a beautiful photo. She knows exactly how to smile and how to position herself correctly. This is due to the ability to take a million selfies/pics with her friends. 

Just make sure they know... selfies aren't how you really look either!  The close angle and wide lens distort the face! 

https://www.vgplasticsurgery.com/blogs/phone-cameras-selfies-distort-face-making-face-nose-look-wider-longer/#:~:text=Phone cameras and selfies have,making them wider and longer.&text=Taking face photos with short,longer than in real life.

 

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6 hours ago, Just Kate said:

I completely agree with this and I think it is because of the smart phone. Kids these days (geez…I sound like a dinosaur! 😂) have grown up with the ability to instantly view themselves in photos. I mean, back in my day we had to use up a whole roll of film, drop it off (or send it off), and then wait for the photos to be developed to know how we really looked. My 14 year old dd takes a beautiful photo. She knows exactly how to smile and how to position herself correctly. This is due to the ability to take a million selfies/pics with her friends. So I do think that my kids’ generation look way less awkward that my generation…back in the day….

I see jr high girls running the gamut. I know for my teens, I am investing a lot more $ in clothing, accessories, skin and hair care, etc than my parents ever would have invested for me. My kids have a lot more choice in those areas than I ever would have too! My teens also have liberal use of social media, so they have far more exposure to examples of how to not look awkward at younger ages.

My teens are fortunate that they do look good in pretty much anything, but still, I wouldn’t say something generic like “that’s not flattering”. I make very specific comments about the item in question focusing on fit, cut, construction for their specific body. I also talk about how the piece in question will fit in their wardrobe - what will you wear this with and what occasions?

We spend a shocking amount on clothing, but I want my kids to explore and learn what they like and what works for them. 

Sometimes I’m surprised at what they want to wear, and I do say I don’t like certain styles. I don’t understand why anyone wants to wear a shorter top in winter in MN! That being said, all my kids have athletic bodies dressing very mainstream, so this area of teen life has been very easy for us. 

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I was just talking about this with my teen daughter and her friend. If she just wants validation she will say- tell me I look great or similar. If she wants actual opinion then I'll give it but I try to stay honest but gentle.I try to remember what it was like to be a teenager. It's rough. And teenagers always have fashions that adults don't like. Teens are going to wear things that look truly awful because that is what is in and wearing something flattering that isn't in can be harder on them. I try hard not to push her towards things I like but focus on things she likes that are acceptable to me. 

If she really likes something and is looking for validation- I'll usually find something positive to comment about-like the color/accent.

If it is something I really don't like due to the fashion- I will say such and such fashion is not my favorite/I don't care for/ something like that but I try not to harp on it. 

Something that I don't find appropriate (and I allow quite a bit)- I will just bluntly say- it's too short/low cut

I just took her dress shopping- my comments were along the lines of- I don't like that color on you/that color really brings out your eyes, too short, that is cut funny, that looks great on you. Usually my opinion lines up close enough to hers-- not that I like everything she does- but I don't hate things, even if it isn't my preference.  I try to talk about size in a positive way and we joke back and forth. That dress can't handle your luscious hips. Dd is built curvy like me so it has always been a thing- when she was younger we could call them wonder thighs- when she needed muscles for something-- Wonder Thighs Activate!!!

My middle daughter doesn't really ask me if I like something or very rarely. My youngest- 9 does. She has her own fashion. Currently she's into knee high socks and plaid skirts. Not my preference but she likes it. 

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My mom gave my sister and I very little input on fashion when we were young, except for in terms of modest. My sister, I thought, always had a pretty good sense of style. I always had a pretty. . .unique sense of style. I sometimes asked people what they thought, but if they didn’t agree with me, I ignored the advice, whether it was parents or peers. I didn’t get bent out of shape about it, that I remember. I look back and can’t believe what I wore, and how dorky I looked, but I figure it was 100% my own fault. I don’t remember my sister ever having those sort of fashion disasters.

 My sister has mentioned how she can’t believe that our mom didn’t give us more feedback to help us dress well. She wishes she had been given more advice. Do whatever you do, how well it is later thought of will probably depend entirely on the personal quirks of the child, and not on any objective standard that can be predicted, unless you’re just mean.

 How DD 16 insists on dressing does bug me sometimes. She’s very short-waisted, and always tucks  in her shirts and sometimes wears a belt, and not only an I from the generation that wore things things untucked, it just looks extremely unflattering on her body type. But I generally don’t comment, except last week when it looked not only unflattering but actually uncomfortable. And that’s what I told her, “You look uncomfortable”.  I think the shirt was lined, so tucking it in made the jeans tighter around the waist than normal, and the belt cinching it in further looked painful, or something.  

I try not to comment if all I have to say has to do with body type. We are very different body types, even though we wear roughly the same size. But if it’s a matter of colors/style clashing or looking out of place I might mention it, or like “usually people wear no-show socks with that style of pants,” or something. But I don’t make a big deal out of it unless it’s inappropriate. The things I decided i loved and wore out in public when I was her age…

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Oh, and you have my full sympathy for dealing with a teen who asks for feedback and then gets upset upon receiving it. It’s my son I usually get that from, though. I really try to emphasize to my kids that if they ask a question, they should be prepared to get an answer that doesn’t match what they wanted to hear. Don’t ask unless you genuinely want to hear what I think.

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