College age teacher - young teenage student WWYD?

[justkeepswimming]

Thanks for the input! We have enough to make our decision. Letting the thread die now before it elevates into anything outside of what I originally intended. Thank you all for being nice in your replies and allowing me to ask this here! 😊 Such a wealth of opinions and information here - I really appreciate you all! 😄

[Catwoman]

If you and your family trust this young man, I would tell your friends and acquaintances to mind their own business.

 

He sounds like an excellent teacher, and quite frankly, I find it quite offensive that the people you know are judging him solely because he is male and based on that single fact, they assume he must be some sort of sex fiend. :glare:

 

Also, I think it's awful that they may also be surmising (even if they aren't saying it out loud to you) that your dd won't be able to control her own "urges" when she is alone with her teacher. :angry:

[foxbridgeacademy]

If you and your family trust this young man, I would tell your friends and acquaintances to mind their own business.

 

He sounds like an excellent teacher, and quite frankly, I find it quite offensive that the people you know are judging him solely on the fact that he is male and based on that single fact, they assume he must be some sort of sex fiend. :glare:

:iagree:

You know him, you know your daughter, no need to second guess your gut feeling on this.  

[Seasider]

Considering this in light of youth protection training I've been through...

 

You would be doing the young man a favor by going inside with your daughter. It protects him against false accusations. Not that your daughter would do that - I mean he needs a general policy to protect himself. You don't have to hover, but be in an easily accessible range.

 

Unfortunately, our society is such that he needs to consider such things, and perhaps lacks the experience to realize that.

 

ETA this honestly has nothing to do with how much you trust him. It's all about him protecting himself and his reputation as he deals with minors in private lesson situations.

[Jean in Newcastle]

trust your own gut and that of your dd.  

[justkeepswimming]

Considering this in light of youth protection training I've been through...

 

You would be doing the young man a favor by going inside with your daughter. It protects him against false accusations. Not that your daughter would do that - I mean he needs a general policy to protect himself. You don't have to hover, but be in an easily accessible range.

 

Unfortunately, our society is such that he needs to consider such things, and perhaps lacks the experience to realize that.

 

ETA this honestly has nothing to do with how much you trust him. It's all about him protecting himself and his reputation as he deals with minors in private lesson situations.

 

ok - I do see your point. :) Keeping up appearances and all of that...  I am certain that making a general policy is the very last thing on his mind - I'm pretty sure dd is his only student at the moment. lol We live in a college town and there are college-student music teachers a dime-a-dozen - but he is a perfect personality match for dd teacher-wise.

 

Would just my randomly going in sometimes achieve the same thing?

 

By NOT going in, I am able to actually squeeze quite a bit of school work with the boys. When I have to go in, I leave the boys at home with biggest sister and they're... well... young. lol Only so much actually gets done. We are gone for 1 hour, 45 minutes for her lesson, once a week (including drive time). When the boys are with me, we get a LOT done on the drive & while T is inside. When I leave them at home, it's dicey (what they get done) and I feel like I am wasting those 2 hours. :/ Time is so precious - and I need to multi-task as often as I can.

 

[kiwik]

I voted yes assuming you were outside in the car. I think given the friends I might take some paperwork and sit in their kitchen more or less out of earshot. Could he possibly come to your house (maybe you could give him petrol money).

[justkeepswimming]

I voted yes assuming you were outside in the car. I think given the friends I might take some paperwork and sit in their kitchen more or less out of earshot. Could he possibly come to your house (maybe you could give him petrol money).

 

The boys & I are outside in the car. :) His coming to our house for lessons is not very practical for a number of reasons.

 

The front room is a big living area/kitchen open space. The front door is left open and I can see their shadows inside the room from the street if I bother to look to my right.

 

[maize]

The door is open and you are sitting in the car right in front?

 

I would not be concerned at all.

[Mrs Mungo]

When my kids have done lessons at a music store with rooms that had glass doors, then I have dropped them off. There were tons of people around, and you (or anyone) could see in the rooms. When they have had lessons at someone's house? I stay in that case-man/woman, boy/girl, old/young. IMO, not having someone else around is risky for student and teacher. No tsking or shaming, that is just how we have handled it.

 

Eta: I agree with Seasider that this is something he should be thinking about and is too naive to realize it.

[Pawz4me]

He sounds like an excellent teacher, and quite frankly, I find it quite offensive that the people you know are judging him solely because he is male and based on that single fact, they assume he must be some sort of sex fiend. :glare:

 

I totally agree.

 

[kroe1]

I said "no way". Now they are building a history together over time. While they may not be "in love" the first year, subsequent years may change as they get to know each other more.

 

The other reason I put down that answer comes from a wise boss I once had. He said he never puts himself in a situation where there is room for assumption that he would have to explain to his wife. Therefore, he would never attend a business lunch with one woman, but would if there were more than one. I have taken that concept and applied it to many facets of my family life.

 

Finally, had you not known this young man, would you let your 14 y.o. daughter go alone into a college male dorm room? Since you do not know the roommates, or when they will be home, I think your decision should be based on that, rather than your assurance of the integrity of the teacher alone.

 

As an empty nest mom, I can assure you there will come a time when you remember those screeching moments of your children learning to play instruments. These moments will bring huge smiles to your face. They may be painful to listen to now, but will bring joyful memories.

 

Just my $.02 of what I would do. I tend to be helicopterish.

[MEmama]

It wouldn't even occur to me to question it. What 22-23 yo man would be interested in a 14 yo girl? She may seem grown up to you but she wouldn't to him, Kwim?

 

She knows what to be aware of. I wouldn't worry about it.

[ashfern]

Considering this in light of youth protection training I've been through...

 

You would be doing the young man a favor by going inside with your daughter. It protects him against false accusations. Not that your daughter would do that - I mean he needs a general policy to protect himself. You don't have to hover, but be in an easily accessible range.

 

Unfortunately, our society is such that he needs to consider such things, and perhaps lacks the experience to realize that.

 

ETA this honestly has nothing to do with how much you trust him. It's all about him protecting himself and his reputation as he deals with minors in private lesson situations.

 

:iagree: Take headphones and listen to something else if you don't want to listen to the lesson. 

[bettyandbob]

It's inconvenient, but it's not fair to your dd or the young teacher to leave them alone.

 

The teacher probably does not understand the implications. If he plans a career of teaching or a career that includes teaching as a supplement, he needs to set his teaching routine so he cannot be accused of improprieties. Your dd is at an age where she probably "knows everything", "you wouldn't understand" , and doesn't understand the issues of being above improprieties either.

 

At home you could plan specific stuff to be done independently (worksheet and science video, spelling work) with something special if it's actually done when you get home. Or the time you are gone could be built in as your younger dc screen time for two days. There are ways to work around this.

 

If the doors to the studio are glass , you could evaluate if the situation is like Mrs. Mungo described. If there aren't a lot of people, but you can see in, I think looking in at random intervals would probably work. If the studio does not have an open or glass door, it may be difficult or odd for you to wonder in and out at random intervals. You may just have to sit in there.

 

How much would you actually get done. Considering much of the time you are gone, you will be driving, I don't think you should expect the older sibling to supervise an intense 1 hour 45 minute session. What do you get done in the car. When mine were little and we had to wait in the car, we did mostly spelling workbook work. That would be comparable to what I think a teen sibling could help a younger dc with. You might be using the drive to listen to audio books, but that isn't that much to lose and at home the spelling could be followed with an educational video or the older sibling could hold onto preferred toys (ds game system etc) until spelling is done.

[Cindy in FL.]

This happens way more often than I care to think about!

 

It wouldn't even occur to me to question it. What 22-23 yo man would be interested in a 14 yo girl? She may seem grown up to you but she wouldn't to him, Kwim?

 

She knows what to be aware of. I wouldn't worry about it.

[I talk to the trees]

I would trust your/your dd's instinct on this one. I wouldn't have a problem with it, given his behavior so far. But I do agree with the pp who mentioned that he needs a better policy on this. I try to always be in the house when dh gives a lesson. It's safer for him that way.

[marbel]

It wouldn't even occur to me to question it. What 22-23 yo man would be interested in a 14 yo girl? She may seem grown up to you but she wouldn't to him, Kwim?

 

She knows what to be aware of. I wouldn't worry about it.

 

I'm sorry, but that's pretty naive. 

 

But, even if he is not interested in her, and always acts in an exemplary manner, people, particularly young people, can misinterpret words, gestures, tones of voice.  

 

There is a reason most organizations that work with youth have child protection policies.   Those policies don't just protect the kids/teens though. They protect everyone involved.

 

He really should have a policy of not being alone with students.

 

[Kerileanne99]

I agree, I would trust your own judgement and that of your daughter. I see no problems now, although the instructor really does need to consider some sort of long-term policy on this to protect himself. I understand he is currently in a fairly transient situation as a college student, so that of course factors in.

 

The only caveat I would add is that I would continue to make sort of random, unannounced visits to gauge the tone of the lesson. You would do this anyway, regardless of the ages/sex of the participants, as you are paying for quality instruction and safety, right? This is for several reasons: quality of instruction, monitoring your child's progress and goodness of fit with instructor...and because whilst I would sincerely doubt that he is looking at her now as anything over than a 14 year old child? If he continues to teach her long-term she will eventually be 16-17 etc., and they will have a long, shared history. Still not necessarily a problem because I DO believe that most people have control of their urges, lol...but occasionally popping in to watch is a reasonable measure.

[G5052]

I said "no way". Now they are building a history together over time. While they may not be "in love" the first year, subsequent years may change as they get to know each other more.

 

The other reason I put down that answer comes from a wise boss I once had. He said he never puts himself in a situation where there is room for assumption that he would have to explain to his wife. Therefore, he would never attend a business lunch with one woman, but would if there were more than one. I have taken that concept and applied it to many facets of my family life.

 

Finally, had you not known this young man, would you let your 14 y.o. daughter go alone into a college male dorm room? Since you do not know the roommates, or when they will be home, I think your decision should be based on that, rather than your assurance of the integrity of the teacher alone.

 

Same here.  Even when tutoring a college student alone in a classroom, I prop the door open and ask them to sit near the door.  I never tell them why, but IMHO it is just the right thing to do.  In fact the 19-year-old son of someone I've known for probably 10 years asked for help after class Monday night, and I propped the door.  Probably not needed, but I always do that.

 

DH and I have had to be a little more lenient with the work lunch issue, but we always travel separately and meet at a restaurant with open tables.  No cozy booths or small rooms.  And we tell each other the when and where.

 

Our martial arts sensei always has me sit in the room if there's no other adult present, even if he is teaching all teenages and even though the room has big glass doors.

 

In all of my child protection training, the message is over and over "no opportunity."  

[bettyandbob]

Adding, this is really a situation where

 

1. you can look back at lessons in a few years and recall nothing in at all in particular

2. be full of regret

 

Number 2 is highly unlikely, but the implications of number 2 are so bad that the risk is not worth the time you save. 

[SparklyUnicorn]

This would not bother me at all. 

[Shellydon]

No way.  I can't believe the young man would ever even consider it.  As a parent, I would never, ever consider it.  I don't care to listen to lessons either, but you better believe I would be in that house.

[Jenrae]

In all kindness, and no judgement, but said with many years of parenting experience.....

 

No, I would not permit this. Even when I took my son for his lessons, I sat outside the room, just to be cautionary.

 

With that said, no, never for a young girl.

 

In all honesty, I wouldn't even hire a male that is so young to tutor my daughter. I just would prefer to be cautious and not place her in a prolonged situation (years of lessons) with a young man whom she may develope an attraction to, which happens frequently at that age. Not to mention that possibility of an attraction deveoping on the part of the young man. IT HAPPENS ALL THE TIME, not EVERY time, but frequent enough.

 

It may take more of your time now, but believe me, * IF * you end up dealing with a "teenage girl crush", it will take much time and effort on your part to deal with it.

[Chris in VA]

It wouldn't bother me in the least, esp if you are in the car and can see their shadows.

But as a kindness to him, I would bring it up without dd within earshot, how he might consider protecting himself from accusations. It's sad, but it's a good idea. I would make it very clear that you have no problem with him and consider him completely trustworthy.

 

I have a young friend who gives lessons this way (I think he's 25 or 26--unmarried, has many students), and I don't know his policies; his behavior with students is completely professional, he's highly regarded as an excellent teacher, and I would put dd with him in a heartbeat. I would not be surprised to find he only gives lessons when others are around or has some sort of protective policy, though.

 

 

[MEmama]

I'm sorry, but that's pretty naive.

 

But, even if he is not interested in her, and always acts in an exemplary manner, people, particularly young people, can misinterpret words, gestures, tones of voice.

 

There is a reason most organizations that work with youth have child protection policies. Those policies don't just protect the kids/teens though. They protect everyone involved.

 

He really should have a policy of not being alone with students.

Nope, not naive. The daughter knows what to be aware of, the roommates are home and mom is in the car. It's our job as parents to understand risk, and the OP is comfortable.

 

What I think is sad is that so many people are willing to make assumptions about the teacher solely because he's male. THAT, to me, would be sending the wrong message. I don't disagree that he should have an open door policy, but it sounds like he does, in that mom is welcome to join.

[ErinE]

For his protection, he should have a policy of never being alone with a child. It only takes one accusation, even if false, for his reputation to be ruined.

[J-rap]

Seeking input (not a JAWM, but please be kind!! :)

 

So - my younger dd (14) takes music lessons from a college senior.

 

She (dd) is an excellent judge of character

 

(unfortunately, she has had experience with some "older" guys being inappropriate...

 

 

At first I was going to say that I'd have no problem with it, but after giving it some thought, I changed my mind.  First, even if your daughter so far seems to have good judge of character, I don't think there is any way a 14-year-old can be a complete judge of character of a young adult man.  Secondly, if she has run into trouble before (and you say "guys," not just one "guy" even), then it makes me wonder why.  Does she appear more mature than her age, or give off certain vibes? 

 

Under those conditions, unless I knew him almost as well as my own son, then I think I'd plan to go there with her even though it's an inconvenience.  I'd probably bring head phones and do my own thing.

 

I will say we have a family friend whose son gave piano lessons in their home while they were at work.  He was a senior in high school, a music nerd.  Really a sweet guy and I really would have trusted him completely with my young teen daughter.   So, part of it depends on how well you really know him.

 

ETA:  I'm not assuming that he will be a problem just because he is a young adult male.  :)   He is probably completely trustworthy.  But I think I'd still stay.

[J-rap]

He's well aware that he is building a professional reputation as he transitions away from being a student.  Since he is behaving professionally, no worries. 

 

One of my elderly relatives shared her story with us....as a young girl, she took piano, and thought there was something funny about the way the teacher smelled, a smell she hadn't encountered before.  Her mother though, knew that smell, and lessons were cancelled after she did her spot check and detected it. The fellow was a functional alcoholic.

 

This reminds me of an old violin teacher of mine when I was a girl!  I remember feeling uncomfortable around her, and therefore not enjoying the lessons at all.  She was always chewing something.  Eventually, my mother discovered she was chewing tobacco throughout my lessons.  It was so strange and we quit pretty quickly after that!  :)

 

[marbel]

Nope, not naive. The daughter knows what to be aware of, the roommates are home and mom is in the car. It's our job as parents to understand risk, and the OP is comfortable.

 

What I think is sad is that so many people are willing to make assumptions about the teacher solely because he's male. THAT, to me, would be sending the wrong message. I don't disagree that he should have an open door policy, but it sounds like he does, in that mom is welcome to join.

 

Naive because of the comment that a 22/23 year old man could not be interested in a 14-year-old girl.  

 

I don't know about anyone else but I don't make any assumptions about him because he's male.  Women also need to be careful who they are alone with.  

 

But of course the OP is free to decide what to do.  She asked for opinions on what others would do - she's not obligated to agree with everyone!

[SKL]

I agree with everyone.  It's probably perfectly safe, but it would be a little uncomfortable for me under the circumstances you describe.

 

What I would do is randomly sit in on only some lessons, so nobody thinks of this as "his time alone with your daughter."

 

Stuff does happen between sincere people at that age.  IIRC Celine Dion was 14 when she started working with her (much older) husband.  It worked out for her, of course; it isn't necessarily all bad if something does come of it; but 14 is 14.

[momto10blessings]

It wouldn't even occur to me to question it. What 22-23 yo man would be interested in a 14 yo girl? She may seem grown up to you but she wouldn't to him, Kwim?

 

She knows what to be aware of. I wouldn't worry about it.

I know a seemingly normal 30 year old man who was sleeping with a 14 yr old girl. I'm not sure how he's not in jail.

[City Mouse]

Just curious if people would answer the same way if the music teacher was female and the student male?

[SKL]

I would also note that 14yo girls often develop crushes on adult men in positions of caring authority.  I remember a pretty serious crush I had on a teacher or two when I was 14.  Thankfully my teachers were responsible adults and I was too shy / scared to make a fool of myself.

[marbel]

Just curious if people would answer the same way if the music teacher was female and the student male?

 

I would.   There's no difference. 

 

My daughter's female piano teacher preferred that I stay during lessons, which were held in her apartment.  I had no worries about her.  But she is a schoolteacher and she knows not to be alone with students.  

 

A friend of mine tutors. She has a good space at home which would work great for her, but she works at the public library.  Our library is full of tutors and students every night and Saturday.   Nice open, public, visible space.    

 

ETA:  my daughter has been babysitting since she was 13.  Never once has a dad picked her up or brought her home.  Either the mom does it, or I do the driving.  This wasn't something I requested or demanded. They just naturally do it that way.

[SKL]

I know a seemingly normal 30 year old man who was sleeping with a 14 yr old girl. I'm not sure how he's not in jail.

 

I know of multiple women who had their first baby around that age with an adult male, sometimes much older.  :(

  I too have wondered why that is not prosecuted more often.

[BigMamaBird]

With his pattern of behavior I would say that he has proven himself trustworthy and would not have a problem sitting outside in the car.  However, if the lessons had started out in his home, rather than in the studio, I would have been less comfortable and probably would have sat in on the lessons for a few months to get to know him rather than letting her go in alone.

[Sarah CB]

I would have no problem with my daughter going in alone at that age, however if my son was the teacher I'd strongly discourage him from teaching in room where the door was closed and he was alone with a female student - not because I'm worried about my sons, but because even the perception of something going on can ruin a young man's life pretty quickly.  

[Jenrae]

Just curious if people would answer the same way if the music teacher was female and the student male?

 

Yes, my response would be the same I gave for a male teacher with a female student.

[Annie G]

I'd be fine with it. 

 

Our girls are grown now, but when they were teens they were occasionally alone with men.  In our area driver's ed involves 5 hours of behind the wheel instruction and each one was alone with a male instructor.  They all babysat for families in which the dad would sometimes get home before the mom.  Two took music lessons from a male teacher and the music store provided private rooms for lessons.  A couple of times a male youth group leader drove a kid home because there was an illness or a minor injury.  

 

The flip side is that I tutor and currently all of my students are teenage boys.  If the moms wanted to sit in, I would be fine with that, but the whole point of hiring me is so they can be doing other things.  Nobody has ever asked to sit in while I tutor. 

 

Yes, I'm sure we're fortunate that nothing bad happened to our girls.   It's such a fine line to walk- balancing being cautious with being confident in your choices.  

[Dmmetler]

I think he's perfectly trustworthy and is trying to be very professional, but to avoid those wagging tongues, I'd stop in intermittently. It really doesn't take much to trash someone's reputation, and it could be so damaging to both your young teacher and your DD. That's one reason why DD's pre-baccalaureate program requires a parent be present, and some of the pre-bacs are 17/18 yr old seniors in high school. I'm convinced that kindles were invented by a mom who was stuck waiting at kids activities.

[Roadrunner]

For his protection, he should have a policy of never being alone with a child. It only takes one accusation, even if false, for his reputation to be ruined.

What a world we live in. As a mother of two boys, this makes me really sad.

 

 

OP, do what feels right.

[AK_Mom4]

I voted other.  DD13 takes lessons from a college senior at a studio.  The front and back walls of the studio are glass so I can watch from the lobby or from my car in the parking lot. She goes in by herself and there is always lots of activity in the main area. Never had any issues and I don't expect any.

 

However, if the lessons were at his house, I would be sitting on the couch playing on my iPad in the same room.  As other posters said, it's a matter of protecting reputations.- his and hers.

 

Not being alone with a student is a good practice.  I coach skiing and we aren't even alone with kids on the trails.  I vote for sitting there with headphones on while the lesson is going on.

[Jenny in Florida]

Honestly, in your position, the only cause I see for hesitation is that I would want to make sure there was no chance others might look askance at the young man. He sounds like a wonderful teacher and a great mentor for your daughter, and I would want to do everything I could to protect their relationship and keep it on track for the long haul. I would not want any misconceptions or misunderstandings to get in the way of him continuing as her teacher. So, although I am not generally a hovering type -- and both of my kids have taken music lessons with teachers who taught from their homes -- I think I would find a way to provide gentle, non-invasive chaperonage. 

 

The specifics would vary depending on the situation. One of my son's voice teachers, for example, used a spare bedroom in his apartment as a studio, and parents usually sat in the living room to wait for their kids. So, I would sit quietly and read while my son was in his lesson. The bonus to this was that they were free to come grab me if they needed to talk about scheduling or wanted to show me something my son was working on. I didn't always stay, but I did so more frequently in the beginning and would drop in occasionally after that.

 

If your mom-instinct says everything is fine, I'm sure it is. But I would still want to keep an eye on the situation and not give anything problematic -- even if it's just the perceptions of others -- a chance to get started.

[Jenny in Florida]

Just curious if people would answer the same way if the music teacher was female and the student male?

 

For what it's worth:

 

1. I have a teenage son who wants to teach and possibly run his own dance studio in the future. He has lost out on a couple of opportunities to substitute teach classes because it would have involved him being alone with younger kids in a studio without windows . . . the exact same studio in which my daughter regularly taught acting classes to kids the same age. So, I absolutely recognize that this kind of thing is frustrating and upsetting for young men and their parents. 
2. My answer is yes. I would have exactly the same concerns with a teacher of either gender. As others have said, I think it's just good policy and practice not to allow any situation to develop that would put either the student or the teacher at risk. My daughter's (female) voice teacher used the front room of her home as a studio, routinely left the front door not only unlocked but open (with a screen door) and always welcomed parents to go in and out freely and to use the dining room area as a waiting room if they preferred. 

[SKL]

There's a difference if the teacher is female:  onlookers are far less likely to assume the two are a couple (or trying to be).  Unless a lot has changed in recent years.

[elegantlion]

Without assuming anything about behavior of either teacher or student, I would stay. Not because I'd presume anything happened or would happen, but to protect his reputation.

 

Exdh was a carpenter. Many times he would be working on a house without the homeowner present. There were several jobs where he'd leave early because a teenager came home from school and he was in the house alone with them. Not that teenage girls were an issue, but his reputation was. One false accusation would have ruined his business, which ran primarily on word of mouth referrals. 

 

It really is a Cover yourself policy that he should have in place for himself. 

[Tsuga]

Considering this in light of youth protection training I've been through...

 

You would be doing the young man a favor by going inside with your daughter. It protects him against false accusations. Not that your daughter would do that - I mean he needs a general policy to protect himself. You don't have to hover, but be in an easily accessible range.

 

Unfortunately, our society is such that he needs to consider such things, and perhaps lacks the experience to realize that.

 

ETA this honestly has nothing to do with how much you trust him. It's all about him protecting himself and his reputation as he deals with minors in private lesson situations.

 

I wish I could 100% agree with Catwoman--in fact I do, on a theoretical level. I have no problem with my kids being alone with a teacher particularly if I'm nearby. I trust my gut.

 

But I would agree that the main danger here is to him--the vast majority of men are wonderful people and can be great teachers, but our society has, uh, ISSUES.

 

However I'm not at all sure how to broach the topic since the last thing I would like to talk about with someone in a professional context is that some people are prejudiced and think he might be a child molester. :(

[Reefgazer]

I answered yes, I would let DD take lessons with the person.  I'm not a fan of accusing men of ungentlemanly actions unless I have a reason.  I do see the point about another person in the room for the young man's professional/legal protection, but I also feel that is for him to address if he feels the need to do so.

[SKL]

I wish I could 100% agree with Catwoman--in fact I do, on a theoretical level. I have no problem with my kids being alone with a teacher particularly if I'm nearby. I trust my gut.

 

But I would agree that the main danger here is to him--the vast majority of men are wonderful people and can be great teachers, but our society has, uh, ISSUES.

 

However I'm not at all sure how to broach the topic since the last thing I would like to talk about with someone in a professional context is that some people are prejudiced and think he might be a child molester. :(

 

FTR it is not considered child molesting if the "child" is 14.  I think most states put the threshold at 12 or maybe even 10.

 

Also, he's on notice because his friends / associates have already been making comments / signals indicating that they think he's "with" her.  I'm going to assume that's because she looks older than 14, which he must also have noticed.