Two anti-homeschooling articles.

[LaxMom]

I got as far as this line in the first article:

 

"How can a home-schooled child have compassion for his community when he isn't part of it?"

 

And stopped reading. What a limited idea she must have of what a community actually is. I feel sorry for her.

 

Yes, that IS unfortunate. I would try to teach my children compassion for their community, but I don't want to interrupt them while they're stuffing dolls we've made for an orphanage in Nicaragua. (My four year olds are particularly proud of their fabric choices)

 

It is times like these when I wonder if I've missed the memo on some benefit in the crack the rest of the world appears to be smoking.

[eternalknot]

Voddie Baucham's blog (Truth in Love) addresses this article today. Here is a link to his comments:

 

http://www.voddiebaucham.org/vbm/Blog/Blog.html

 

I love this guy!

 

I respected his remarks and tone, and have marked his blog so I remember to check back for new posts. Thanks for passing him on!

[stripe]

I decided to just post my own views on that website instead of here, but I wanted to add that I totally agree, all boys seem to be getting the short end of the stick. I think boys' wiggly nature is part of the problem in elementary school, they get branded as problem children, and it's all downhill from there. This is a major concern I have about my own son.

[Jackie in AR]

1. Geeky is the new black.

 

:lol::lol::lol:

 

I love it.

[I talk to the trees]

I'm glad that others caught that. My "self-aggrandizing" posted response to the article was --

 

"You ask, "So, first of all, homeschooling parent, you think you can teach English as well as me?"

 

Apparently. At least I'm aware that the correct way to write that sentence would be with "I" rather than "me". Also, there should be a "do" before the first use of the word you.

 

If the other teachers my children would have encountered in public school have as little expertise in their subject areas, public education is in a sad situation, indeed.

 

Additionally, your ignorance about socialization and homeschooling is appalling. Before I began homeschooling, I was a public school teacher, and the brightest, most accomplished student I ever taught was a girl who had been homeschooled until entering public school at the age of thirteen. Much to the chagrin of the many faculty members who prophesied doom, she was almost immediately one of the most popular girls in our school and remained so. In fact, most of the homeschooled students I've known who've entered public school, generally for high school, have done extremely well academically and won the respect and admiration of their peers.

 

Having taught in public schools for many years, I know that there's no magic conferred by a degree in education, and now, having homeschooled for many years, I've discovered that most parents are far better teachers of their children than we so-called professionals are."

 

 

:thumbup:

 

-Robin

[PCA]

Great post by Heather!

 

I also love and recommend Voddie Baucham. He's great!

[MrsMe]

I'm always amazed how much some really have no clue. She writes about something she knows nothing about for all to see. I'm embarrassed for her. :tongue_smilie:

[katilac]

The article by the English teacher seemed to be intentionally over-the-top, merely trying for heated responses.

 

The article by the mom, sadly, seemed very sincere. Must the first point raised by non-homeschoolers always, always, be "My kids couldn't stand being around me all day, and I certainly couldn't stand being around them"?

 

That's just . . . pitiful. A pitiful point of debate in the overall debate, of course, but also a pitiful commentary on the 'normal' relationships in so many families.

[Word Nerd]

Additionally, your ignorance about socialization and homeschooling is appalling. Before I began homeschooling, I was a public school teacher, and the brightest, most accomplished student I ever taught was a girl who had been homeschooled until entering public school at the age of thirteen. Much to the chagrin of the many faculty members who prophesied doom, she was almost immediately one of the most popular girls in our school and remained so. In fact, most of the homeschooled students I've known who've entered public school, generally for high school, have done extremely well academically and won the respect and admiration of their peers.

 

 

This was my experience with a homeschooled student when I was student teaching. He was smart, mature, and quickly became a leader in the school.

[TravelingChris]

I guess we are part of that wealthy white homeschoolers who don't have our children educated with anyone else- right? Wrong. Since my girls have attended co-op classes, homeschool sports, homeschool group events, plus Sunday School, they have had teachers from Africa (2 in different continents), teachers from Asia, teachers from South America and Central America and the Caribbean,an Amerind teacher, Belgian teachers, and my son had a German teacher who taught him Russian in Ireland. They have homeschooled together with South Africans, English, Puerto Rican, Cuban, German, Philipino, and I know I am forgetting many other categories. Take that for diversity. We don't need to make special plans for diversity. We just live our lives and our children meet people.

 

As to raising the standard for public schools - my one child would not have reached that standard at PS. She is very smart but a very auditory child. Schools are not made for auditory children. If they had been checking spelling, she may not have been advanced for some years. At home, with tons of personal help, she is now spelling better than her peers. But that didn't happen until she was 14.

 

Her sister is very social. I think that if she was in school, she would be having a great time making friends and not learning very much. I doubt she would do as well since making good grades is not usually the way to getting good social attention especially a girl who is good in math and science. She wouldn't want to be categorized with geeks and would stop doing so well.

[Audrey]

 

Did anyone find this ironic?

 

"So, first of all, homeschooling parent, you think you can teach English as well as me?" :lol:

 

Yes. Yes, I do.

 

 

 

 

 

:lol: I'll show her my Ph.D, if she'll show me hers.

[cin]

Yes, I do. In fact, don't you mean "as well as I?" :lol:

:smilielol5::smilielol5::smilielol5:

[scrapbookbuzz]

 

 

Did anyone find this ironic?

 

"So, first of all, homeschooling parent, you think you can teach English as well as me?" :lol:

 

Yes. Yes, I do.

 

 

 

 

:iagree: The original author should have proofread her argument before posting!

[cathmom]

The article by the English teacher seemed to be intentionally over-the-top, merely trying for heated responses.

 

The article by the mom, sadly, seemed very sincere. Must the first point raised by non-homeschoolers always, always, be "My kids couldn't stand being around me all day, and I certainly couldn't stand being around them"?

 

That's just . . . pitiful. A pitiful point of debate in the overall debate, of course, but also a pitiful commentary on the 'normal' relationships in so many families.

 

Yes - "I love my kids too much to make them be around me all day"

[mommaduck]

Reading the comment section of Teacher, Revised is enough to prove that her degrees in English did not benefit her much. She uses poor grammar and spelling in some of her responses to the commentators.

 

I was a geek in school. Sending a child to school doesn't prevent geekiness. Keeping them home doesn't guarantee geekiness. It may guarantee the child time to socially mature so that they will be able to handle the pressures of college, unlike high school and elementary where the pressures may simply tear them to shreds.

[Laura in VA]

 

It is times like these when I wonder if I've missed the memo on some benefit in the crack the rest of the world appears to be smoking.

 

Yes, you did miss that memo. They're handing it out in public school. :lol:

[sandellie4]

Ok, I have to laugh:

------------

Quote from article:

 

"My qualifications to teach English include a double major in English and education, two master’s degrees (education and journalism), a student teaching semester and multiple internship terms, real world experience as a writer, and years in the classroom dealing with different learning styles. So, first of all, homeschooling parent, you think you can teach English as well as me?"

------------

 

I believe the correct grammar is "As well as I" not "me".

 

(Sorry if someone already pointed this out.)

 

:smilielol5:

 

Also, it sould be "real-world experience."

[Luanne]

... I was trying to decide what I was going to say.

 

The thing that comes to mind first is that although I am white, I am not wealthy by any stretch of the imagination. I am a single mom with a very limited income who has chosen to do whatever it takes to keep my daughter out of public school.

 

When I first elected to bring her home (right after she failed 5th grade ... with a teacher who wasn't even aware she wasn't passing math even though she is the one who entered her grades for the report card) ... the head pastor at the church I was attending basically had a "talk" with me about why I should leave her in public school. His argument was similar to one number the English teacher (imposter) said about how our children should be in public school to witness to other children. He also said that she really needed to "socialize" with other children her own age. I really wish at that time I was more outspoken and had thought to say to him "and how many jobs have you held since graduating where EVERYONE you were around was EXACTLY your age?" This is not real life. I'm trying to remember the last time I was even in the same room with someone who is exactly my same age. The other thing this pastor made clear (not when he was talking with me, but other times I heard him talking with/to people) was that he obviously had NEVER set foot in any of his children's schools. Basically he and his wife just blindly trust the public school system because they are a "school system" and therefore must be a good place to send your children. I did not enter the realm of homeschooling without any research. You can bet I spend a lot of time researching everything I could find before I jumped in. It saddens me how many people (even strong Christian people) just blindly trust the public school systems. I've also seen some of these same people scratching their heads when their 15 year old is smoking and their 17 year old is depressed and wants to kill themselves. They can't even seem to see where the situation went wrong.

 

I don't know what else to say ... honestly. I guess I just wish these people would take the time to investigate what they are talking about BEFORE they try to act like they know the answers.

[Soph the vet]

Wow, just wow. :confused:

That English teacher cannot write well at all.:lol::lol::lol:

[Snickerdoodle]

I think we should use these two articles as an assignment for Logic.

 

 

I think so too. ;)

[Heather K.]

In the words of the great Junie B. Jones, "Wowie wow wow!"

Absurd, full of flawed logic, and grammatically incorrect. Wish I could have that 10 minutes of my life back.

[scrappyhappymama]

2 things pop into my head reagarding the second article. First, if I put my children in a same-sex parochial school (and there are quite a few in my area) I bet their peers would be quite similar to them. But that's still school, so it doesn't matter:glare:

 

Secondly, this quote: Quote:

7. To the homeschooling Believers out there, didn’t God say “Go therefore and make disciples of all nations� Didn’t he command, “Ye shall be witnesses unto me�

Let us not forget Deuteronomy.... Quote:

19 Teach them to your children, talking about them when you sit at home and when you walk along the road, when you lie down and when you get up. 20 Write them on the doorframes of your houses and on your gates, 21 so that your days and the days of your children may be many in the land that the LORD swore to give your forefathers, as many as the days that the heavens are above the earth.

If our children aren't home, how do we teach them these things? :001_huh:

 

Oh, and rescuing the misguided underachievers will NOT be placed on my or my children's shoulders. They have parents. Let their PARENTS guide and direct them. And fixing a school district is also not child's work or play.

 

I SO totally agree here. This is the #1 argument against homeschooling that I get from my Christian, public-schooling friends. That by pulling my kids out of school, I am not giving them the opportunity to "witness to their friends." Does anyone else notice who the first scripture above is directed to? To apostles and Christians- adults- many of whom had been sitting at the feet of Christ for three years, preparing for this time. NOT to children. While the second verse IS speaking about children- about parents teaching their children and doing it all day long.

 

I don't know why it's so hard to understand that children are in the learning and training phase of life, not the evangelical, missionary phase. I'm not saying that children cannot be examples and witnesses to others- far from it. In fact I can't count the number of comments we've received from friends, neighbors and strangers about our sons' love of singing gospel songs and quoting scripture. We don't put them on display, they just randomly sing songs in stores or incorporate scripture into their prayers. No need to drop them off somewhere, outside of our influence for hours a day in order to be examples to others.

 

It's hard to be a light as an adult! It's hard to stand up for principles in the workplace in the face of peer pressure. I see no reason why I should purposely subject my kids to that, instead of spending my days filling their hearts with the principles we do believe in.

 

OK, I'll :chillpill: now. And this isn't even the MAIN reason we homeschool... :lol:

[KrissiK]

I just had to laugh. The first article was silly enough. I will not sacrifice my child just to balance out the public schools. My child's education is waaay to important to me. And the second one... holy cow. She's just flailing wildly. Throwing it all out there, without a rational thought. Whew! I won't even begin to address her. But, I will say,that (besides the fact that I am my children's parent, which is the only qualification I need, and the fact that there are so many good "boxed" curriculums out there anyone who is diligent can provide their child with an excellent education) I hold a MA in Education and 2 teaching credentials, so I think I'm qualified to teach my children.

[lionfamily1999]

The comments to both were great and worth reading on :)

[AuntPol]

I posted on the second blog last week. I thought it hiliarious.

 

This article was funny because it is filled with broad generalizations about homeschoolers. I know several outstanding homeschooling families that spin circles around other kids their age. I can rant and rave all day about misconceptions but to be honest, the best thing I can do to promote homeschooling is do my best. Homeschooling is a job for me and I treat it as such. I work hard to make sure my children get the best available education that I can give them and lots of opportunities to grow on their own. I know I am doing a good job when people who naysayed our decision come up to us and congratulate us on how well we are doing.

 

However, on the flip side, I know an equal amount of homeschoolers that live, eat, and breathe the stereotypes -some to the point that I worry about the children being able to adapt in the real world. So whenever we read these diatribes, we must ask ourselves are we perpetuating the myths or are we superseding it? Everytime we go out, I remind my children that we carry an extra responsiblity. Not only do we represent ourselves and family, but we are representing the entire homeschooling community. If we are the examples of homeschooling for the mainstream of America, let us be shining examples and not fodder for a SNL skit.

[stripe]

I SO totally agree here. This is the #1 argument against homeschooling that I get from my Christian, public-schooling friends. That by pulling my kids out of school, I am not giving them the opportunity to "witness to their friends."

I think one also must consider the degree to which people actually seek out the opportunity to help others or discuss their faith with people whose lifestyles are repugnant to them. For example, how many religious people (of any religion) regularly visit prisons? or go to try to help prostitutes leave that life behind? volunteer to help people with "unwanted pregnancies" instead of issue platitudes on one side or the other.... or whatever, pick your social issue. I do know adults who do this, but not many! Don't put it all on kids.

[Caraway]

 

6. Yep. I'll admit to being a little arrogant. He forgot controlling.

 

 

 

:smilielol5:

[JWSJ]

On the second author, the article is embarrassing. I'll print and save it for the next homeschool critic I encounter. It's a perfect example of what's wrong with the public school system.

[battlemaiden]

Am I the only one cracking up at the ad placement for FL Virtual Charter school and Calvert?

 

:lol::lol::lol:

 

Jo

 

Oh, btw, Amy Platt is an fool. :D

[Marylou]

Well, Jesse might be shocked to learn that we eat Fruit Loops, play Wii and do our math facts ALL AT THE SAME TIME! Let's see . . . 10 bowling pins, two fell down . . . he needs to get a life.

[stripe]

Yeah, I wonder how to explain product placement in schools such as the Cheerio and M&M counting books etc.

[5KidzRUs]

Geeky - That's funny. This article reminds me of a conversation my adult son had at work with his peer. My son mentors this man and he really does look up to my son. Anyway, the man was ranting because a school counselor told him that his 4 year old daughter was too academically advanced for kindergarten and that they would better serve her by homeschooling her.

He then went on to rant about maladjusted, unsocialized homeschoolers ... basically what was in the two above articles.

My son let him rant, nodding and agreeing with everything. When the the man was done my son told him "You know I was homeschooled, right?"

[dangermom]

:lol: Well, what was the reply?

[5KidzRUs]

LOL! My sons reply changed the mans perspective. My son mentors this man at work and is teaching him how to weld, restore and rebuild his classic Mustang. So he has seen my son function at work and at leisure - that was testamony enough I guess.

It seems to me that some tend to judge homeschoolers and homeschoolees by stereotypes. Over the years I have even met some creepy homeschoolers; but I believe they are the minority.

 

... can you believe the author of the one article wants us to leave our children in public school to benefit the less fortunate?

[lionfamily1999]

One minute we're selfishly depriving our kids, not putting them first, the next we're selfishly depriving every one else's kids... not putting them first....

 

I wonder what that author will do when she has kids.

[LUV2EDU]

Wow! Shame on us for being so selfish. How dare we feel that our children deserve the best education.:001_huh:

 

:lol::lol: A mind is a terrible thing to waste!

[Word Nerd]

His (Jesse is a he, not a she) reactions to the comments, which he dismisses as a "runaway train of diatribes," are almost as frustrating as the original post. Now he claims he was being satirical and we shouldn't have taken him so seriously.

[elw_miller]

If he was being satirical, he needs to reread Jonathon Swift for a lesson in well-done satire.

 

I guess he couldn't argue against logic, couldn't admit his error and had to turn the blame on others.

 

Did the first article have a response from the author? She, at least, seemed more uninformed than outright hostile.

 

I'm gonna go try to answer my own question now... :)

[Elizabeth Conley]

His (Jesse is a he, not a she) reactions to the comments, which he dismisses as a "runaway train of diatribes," are almost as frustrating as the original post. Now he claims he was being satirical and we shouldn't have taken him so seriously.

 

 

I'm pretty sure Jesse Scaccia is cut from the same cloth as Andrea Peyser, Rush Limbaugh and various other jerk/commentator/journalists people love to hate. I wouldn't get too caught up in his drivel.

[punchbuggyblue]

OK.

 

The second article

#5. is obviously the main reason that she wrote the article:

 

I quote:

<<

5. As a teacher, homeschooling kind of pisses me off. (That’s good enough for #5.)

>>

 

And number 6. She implies that it could breed intolerance...um, look who's talking!

 

Lisa

check me out on handmadenews.org a great spot for ideas for crafters and crafty kids.

[stripe]

So a badly written rehash of the same old stuff is now "satire"? In other words, Jesse was trying to show that the criticisms of homeschooling are so sill because homeschooling really is fabulous? Hmm.

[lionfamily1999]

Imo, this goes so well here...

 

"... With school turning out more runners, jumpers, racers, tinkerers, grabbers, snatchers, fliers, and swimmers instead of examiners, critics, knowers, and imaginative creators, the word 'intellectual,' of course, became the swear word it deserved to be. You always dread the unfamiliar. Surely you remember the boy in your own school class who was exceptionally 'bright,' did most of the reciting and answering while the others sat like so many leaden idols, hating him. And wasn't it this bright boy you selected for beatings and tortures after hours? Of course it was. We must all be alike. Not everyone born free and equal, as the Constitution says, but everyone made equal. Each man the image of every other; then all are happy, for there are no mountains to make them cower, to judge themselves against... Who knows who might be the target of the well-read man? Me? I won't stomach them for a minute...

 

"You must understand that our civilization is so vast that we can't have our minorities upset and stirred. Ask yourself, What do we want in this country, above all? People want to be happy, isn't that right? Haven't you heard it all your life? I want to be happy, people say. Well, aren't they? Don't we keep them moving, don't we give them fun? That's all we live for, isn't it? For pleasure, for titillation? And you must admit our culture provides plenty of these...

 

"Heredity and environment are funny things. You can't rid yourselves of all the odd ducks in just a few years. The home environment can undo a lot you try to do at school. That's why we've lowered the kindergarten age year after year until now we're almost snatching them from the cradle..."

 

First published in 1950, "Fahrenheit 451" if anyone has not read it.

 

Just thought the author, through his character, Beatty, said with greater clarity, what the two articles writers meant.

 

Chilly.

[Tea Time]

Imo, this goes so well here...

 

"... With school turning out more runners, jumpers, racers, tinkerers, grabbers, snatchers, fliers, and swimmers instead of examiners, critics, knowers, and imaginative creators, the word 'intellectual,' of course, became the swear word it deserved to be. You always dread the unfamiliar. Surely you remember the boy in your own school class who was exceptionally 'bright,' did most of the reciting and answering while the others sat like so many leaden idols, hating him. And wasn't it this bright boy you selected for beatings and tortures after hours? Of course it was. We must all be alike. Not everyone born free and equal, as the Constitution says, but everyone made equal. Each man the image of every other; then all are happy, for there are no mountains to make them cower, to judge themselves against... Who knows who might be the target of the well-read man? Me? I won't stomach them for a minute...

 

"You must understand that our civilization is so vast that we can't have our minorities upset and stirred. Ask yourself, What do we want in this country, above all? People want to be happy, isn't that right? Haven't you heard it all your life? I want to be happy, people say. Well, aren't they? Don't we keep them moving, don't we give them fun? That's all we live for, isn't it? For pleasure, for titillation? And you must admit our culture provides plenty of these...

 

"Heredity and environment are funny things. You can't rid yourselves of all the odd ducks in just a few years. The home environment can undo a lot you try to do at school. That's why we've lowered the kindergarten age year after year until now we're almost snatching them from the cradle..."

 

First published in 1950, "Fahrenheit 451" if anyone has not read it.

 

Just thought the author, through his character, Beatty, said with greater clarity, what the two articles writers meant.

 

Chilly.

 

Excellent! Thanks for sharing! I don't have a copy of that books, so I'll have to put it on my list. I just read Brave New World (again). It was written in 1932. It isn't like we haven't been warned, is it?

[lionfamily1999]

At one point, he mentions having won two atomic wars since 1990, implying (although never actually stating), that the book is set in around 2000-2010. Of course, we haven't reached the point he was concerned about, reading is still legal and books haven't disappeared, but the enforced ignorance is a little scary.

[Kfamily]

I read Fahrenheit 451 when I was younger (so that was awhile ago:D) and remembered that it had left an impression on me. When lionfamily quoted from the book I was reminded how much I wanted to reread the book. Yesterday was my b-day so I used my gift card to Barnes & Noble and bought Fahrenheit 451 along with a couple of other books. I started reading last night and am already 1/3 the way through it. It is a fascinating book!!

[Word Nerd]

Another Fahrenheit 451 quote (Clarisse, a teen, is talking about why she isn't in school):

 

“Oh, they don’t miss me,” she said. “I’m antisocial, they say. I don’t mix. It’s so strange. I’m very social indeed. It all depends on what you mean by social, doesn’t it? Social to me means talking to you about things like this.” She rattled some chestnuts that had fallen off the tree in the front yard. “Or talking about how strange the world is. Being with people is nice. But I don’t think it’s social to get a bunch of people together and then not let them talk, do you? …”

Edited June 9, 2009 by WordGirl

[lionfamily1999]

I'm considering reading it with my ds and then giving it to dd to read. He can read well, but does not read voluntarily, I'm hoping this book will give him a reason to read, lol. As for dd, she would read it, as long as it was sitting still long enough.

[Tea Time]

I'm considering reading it with my ds and then giving it to dd to read. He can read well, but does not read voluntarily, I'm hoping this book will give him a reason to read, lol. As for dd, she would read it, as long as it was sitting still long enough.

My son is like that, an excellent reader, but he has trouble getting into books at times. He is also very tender hearted, so books or movies that are really disturbing bother him a lot. It makes it hard to make suggestions. One of my dd's favorite book series is the one by Lois Lowry - The Giver is the first one. Excellent introduction into the utopia theme!

[tricia]

Oh darn, my 12 homeschooled kids didn't put any money in her pocket. Lets see if this self-aggrandizing, society-phobic mother can do the math. 12 kids homeschooling for 12 years each equals to, um, um, nope, I can't do it. No wonder she's Pi**ed off.

[jujsky]

Reading both of those really made me angry :mad: I noticed how both articles essentially said that we are doing the system a disservice by removing our children from it. I read that part of the 2nd article to DH. We both had the same reaction. Hello?!?!?!?!?!?!?! My obligation and responsibility is to my children and THEIR education, NOT to the education of everyone else. Isn't up to the professional educators to mentor and teach the children in a classroom and NOT up to my child to be a role-model and mentor? The schools get my tax dollars and I don't complain about that, but there is no way they're getting my children. If anything, keeping my kids out of PS is allowing less-advantaged kids to have more resources and time with the teacher.

 

Ignorance like this seriously fries my butt!