Moxie Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 I think the old expression that "money can't buy happiness" is wrong. I couldn't sleep at all last night so I was thinking all my random thoughts. I've recently become a FB friend with a person I know casually who I've always thought was very happy. I knew she was not poor but seeing her home on FB, yeah, they have money! So then I started thinking about the wealthy people I know. They are all pretty happy people. I couldn't think of one that I'd say was a grouch. The poor/average people I know are a mix of happy and cranky. Then I started thinking of the stress in my life (we are average-slightly above average but we have a big family) and how much of it is financial--home maintenance issues, retirement savings, college funds, etc. If we were wealthy, really the only stress that would carry over would be my son's ASD. What says the Hive? Do you know any miserable wealthy people?? I mean, I know it could happen and you can't buy health so that factors in but wealth gets rid of so many issues. I think money can buy happiness! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DawnM Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 Yes, we do know a few miserable wealthy people. But money is not a concern, unless they overspend. But then again, I am not sure what we are talking about by the term wealthy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Night Elf Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 I've heard it said that while money can't buy happiness, it can help you suffer in comfort. I don't know any wealthy people, so I can't respond to that thought. However, I would imagine that for some people, wealth might be relative. If I was richer, I'd have a more expensive house and car. I'd probably pay for my kids' educations. I can think of a number of things I'd spend money on, so I would have to be stinking rich to have all those things and not still worry if I have enough to go around, right? 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
creekland Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 No, but it sure can help. Here's my favorite quote: "Money isn't the most important thing in life, but it's reasonably close to oxygen on the 'gotta have it' scale." Zig Ziglar 17 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
creekland Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 ps The only wealthy people I have in my IRL are quite content and nice folks. I know some others who are cranky, fussy, "must be this way or they aren't happy" types. I don't care to include those in my IRL circle and I fully expect it's a mutual feeling. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slache Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 No, but having money can relieve stress leaving more room for happiness. I'm very happy, but a new car and a house with a yard would be pleasant. 11 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
momacacia Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 It will not make a miserable person happy, but I think it can make a reasonably content and otherwise happy person less stressed and possibly add a good bit of "happiness" to their lives...if in fact a beach vacation can make one happy. ;) I am related to someone who is in the top 1% of Americans as far as net worth. He is miserable. He has a completely broken relationship with his children, no access or relationship to his grandchildren and no real, true friends. As he ages and his body falls apart, all he really has is his money to keep him company. It's kind of sad, but his money is the most important thing in his life besides himself. He barely drives the beautiful Corvette in his garage, doesn't play the Steinway in his living room and doesn't travel because nobody really enjoys being with him that long and he doesn't want to travel alone. Happy he is not. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elegantlion Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 Money can buy security, which the lack of keeps me up at night. Money can buy options, what you do with them can make you happy or unhappy. Today it is snowing. I have 39 miles of hilly highway to drive to school. I am cranky and irritable because it will probably take me twice as long to get to school. If I had more money I would have moved to the town where my school is by now. I would be less unhappy because it would take me 10-15minutes to get to school instead of 45mins to 1 hour. Today, my nerves will probably be shot by the time I get to school. Stress can cause real health problems, lack of money can create stress, too much money with too much responsibility can probably do the same. Money is neutral, unhappiness/happiness are free, but there are a lot of experiences or thing that bring about happiness that I cannot afford at this time. 18 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Mousie Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 The answer I have to post before reading: Yes, I saw it on the shelf at Walgreen's next to the chocolate bars. ... Off to read and form a serious answer now.... 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lovinmyboys Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 (edited) Money can't buy happiness, but it can alleviate a lot of stress and it gives you more freedom. Last year Dh worked in another state for about 30% less than he usually makes and we had to pay his living expenses too. At first I tried to be really frugal so we wouldn't go into debt and I was really stressed. Then a friend suggested I feel a little more free to spend money in our savings or go into a little debt because we knew Dh would return to his regular job after 15 months. He makes a decent income and we would be able to build our savings back then. I was so glad I took her advice. When I got a monthly house cleaner, bought paper plates occasionally, and put my 2 youngest in moms day out one morning a week, I was so much happier. We also joined the Y and I let my older 2 kids pick an extracurricular activity each. That helped my whole family become happier. The last 9 months were much less stressful than the first 6 months and it was pretty much because I decided to dip into our savings. So, yes, I do think having money helps a lot. Edited February 8, 2016 by lovinmyboys 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Mousie Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 (edited) As others have said, having financial "breathing room" eases a host of stresses. But it also comes with new ones: what if someone tries to rob my fancy house and kills us in the process? What if the stock market tanks again overnight? What if the banks crumble a la "It's A Wonderful Life"? All the money disappears overnight, but the bills remain. Also, if the wealth comes from both parents having strong careers, then there are stresses and hardships that single-income families don't have (like fretting about your childcare provider or having little time to spend enjoying the kids). Happiness, IMO, is far more contingent on an individual's mindset. If you have a sunny disposition, the checkbook doesn't matter much beyond the very basics. Edited February 8, 2016 by Miss Mousie 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mama Geek Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 Having money doesn't ensure security. Once you have some money you spend more time trying to find ways so that you don't loose it to taxes, inflation, bad investments, etc. We are not super wealthy but we have no debt and some savings. If you are wealthy because of running a business then you have all the concerns of making that business successful and keeping it that way. I have known very happy people who are dirt poor and pretty rich and I have known miserable people in both situations as well. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marbel Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 Money can buy ease, comfort, and convenience, and those contribute to stress reduction and thus can lead to happiness. When I was driving a dying car I was stressed out, sometimes to the point of tears, every time I got behind the wheel. When we finally were able to buy a newer car, that stress was removed from my life. The only unhappy wealthy people I know are people for whom nothing is ever enough, or those who live with a serious fear that their money will disappear and they will be poor. Money can't buy health but it can make it easier to get really great care. Money can't directly help my kid with LDs but if I had more money I could afford to send the kid to a private high school specifically for LD kids and transitioning them to college. But the price tag is simply too high. Having the money to afford that tuition would take a lot of stress and worry out of my life. In my experience, the people who say things like "it's only money" or "money can't buy happiness" are people who have never had to worry about money. BTW I am a Christian and believe that ultimate happiness is not with earthly convenience, happiness, etc. I believe that many people make money an idol and I try not to let that happen to me. But I still have to live in this world, and sure, it would be easier if I had more money at my disposal. (Not that having an easy life is supposed to be the goal either.) 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
*lifeoftheparty* Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 (edited) ... Edited December 18, 2016 by *lifeoftheparty* 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kewb Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 No, it can not buy happiness. What it can do is make many problems easier to deal with. For example, if you get an autoimmune disease it is easier for you to have access to specialists and treatments because you have money. You don't have to worry about shelter or food because you have money. The easing of many worries leads to a sense of happiness. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 More money = more cats, which always means more happiness. Maybe it's a good thing I don't have more money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
livetoread Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 (edited) I think there is a certain number that can buy happiness (that will vary depending on where you live). Below that number, you can have stresses about meeting basic needs. If you are still unhappy beyond that number, chances are it's more your fault. You try too hard to keep up with neighbors, or you value the wrong things, or you mismanaged what you had, etc. I think I read somewhere that researchers found a cut off at roughly 70k. Making more than that doesn't change happiness - other factors do. But make less, and it does. Editing to add that if you have below that certain number, that doesn't mean you can't be happy. Obviously "happy" has complicated causes. But overall, if you have below that number and then get more, chances are it will directly affect your happiness. If you have above that number and get more, it is less likely to do so. Edited February 8, 2016 by livetoread 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marbel Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 (edited) I think there is a certain number that can buy happiness (that will vary depending on where you live). Below that number, you can have stresses about meeting basic needs. If you are still unhappy beyond that number, chances are it's more your fault. You try too hard to keep up with neighbors, or you value the wrong things, or you mismanaged what you had, etc. I think I read somewhere that researchers found a cut off at roughly 70k. Making more than that doesn't change happiness - other factors do. But make less, and it does. I'm not disagreeing or arguing with you but that makes no sense to me. $70K means different things in different places. Jackson, MS and San Francisco, CA come to mind as possible examples. (Just picking Jackson because I had been looking at housing costs there not too long ago for a potential move that didn't happen. Whoa were things cheap compared to where I live now, which is still not as high as SF.) Interesting! ETA: $70K was an average, maybe? But that doesn't make sense either, I don't think. I am pretty sure I'm not thinking about this correctly. Edited February 8, 2016 by marbel 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MommaOfalotta Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 I always tell myself money would solve all of our problems. We currently live with my mother and have for a while now. Money is the #1 stressor in my life. I am happy with my husband, my kids, my day-to-day life. So I do not think money would cause me to be happier- but would remove stress & anxiety causing me to be happier MORE of the time. Literally the ONLY things that stress me out can always be traced back to worrying about money. I always fantasize about hitting the lottery and how it would feel to totally have that burden erased forever! I always think it wouldn't change me-we've experienced a foreclosure, stress from unreliable vehicles, I actually slept on the FLOOR of my mothers house for over a year. Now, we are so much better off than that now-and it gives me perspective. But I am not blind to human weaknesses and I'm sure even if we hit the lottery (we don't even play) eventually I would end up taking it for granted in some way and find something else to stress over. My old vehicle caused me so much stress.. I never wanted to go anywhere because I was afraid of not being able to get home. Buy a new car and it doesn't take long before I forget how BAD I used to feel wishing I could have a car like I do now. I remember that often and stay appreciative, but I catch myself taking it for granted more often than I imagined I would. I feel the same way about having our money worries taken away. Eventually I would find something else to have anxiety over. I'd definitely still take the millions though! :laugh: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3 ladybugs Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 I'm not disagreeing or arguing with you but that makes no sense to me. $70K means different things in different places. Jackson, MS and San Francisco, CA come to mind as possible examples. (Just picking Jackson because I had been looking at housing costs there not too long ago for a potential move that didn't happen. Whoa were things cheap compared to where I live now, which is still not as high as SF.) Interesting! ETA: $70K was an average, maybe? But that doesn't make sense either, I don't think. I am pretty sure I'm not thinking about this correctly. Totally agree! It still boggles my mind that anyone could buy any kind of quality of house that is under $100K. Yet I know for most of the country, $100K can purchase a nice middle class home. Around here, 100K purchases you a home in a crime infested area and you would be lucky if it was a detached home! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
creekland Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 More money = more cats, which always means more happiness. Maybe it's a good thing I don't have more money. More cats, more travel - they would both work for me. ;) In all seriousness, when we first got married I recall a middle aged couple at Sunday School talking about how much easier life was for them then than when they were first married. They were relatively poor when they were just starting out (as many are) and something going wrong (an appliance) was a big deal due to finances. It could and did add stress. When one is more settled and making more to where one can just replace the appliance and it's not a big deal, that eliminates a ton of stress. As many others have pointed out, reducing stress makes it far easier to enjoy life. It's not impossible to enjoy life with stress if you're with company to share it (misery does love company), but it's just easier. It's not impossible to be stressed by non-monetary things too. Money (and what can come from it) is merely one dimension. When one has no money - living on the street, going to shelters for food, wearing the same clothes day in and day out, you rarely see them singing life's praises or glowing with pleasure. Money is pretty close to oxygen in that respect. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedmom4 Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 I believe that anything that reduces major amounts of stress definitely improves one's quality of life. When quality of life improves and stress decreases, happiness can, but doesn't necessarily, increase. So yes, money can buy happiness. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaybee Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 Not sure I can word this in a way that I won't want to come back and change five minutes from now. :P But...my family growing up was not extravagant, except with books, but from my perspective as a child, we never worried about money. As an adult, my dh and I have lived from hand-to-mouth as well as fairly comfortably. Not wealthy, by any means, but able to do some things. This has not been due to a lack of wisdom or carelessness, but due to some value choices we made early on about career field. Financial stress affects me. A lot. So I do find that I like having some cushion and being financially where I don't have to freak over every little thing. On the other hand, because we haven't had a lot of leeway most of the time since we've been married, I have had more time to think about material goods before becoming a slave to them. That has been good for me, as I tend to lean toward materialistic, but haven't been able to "feed" that due to a mobile lifestyle. I look at family members and how much their lives and finances are tied to their homes, furniture, expensive vacations, etc., and I am thankful not to have gone down that path. We hope to buy our first house in the next few months (we are in our 50s, but due to above mobile lifestyle, this has not been something we needed to do). As I look at houses, I am glad to be limited by funds a bit, because when I am honest, I would be tempted to buy bigger and better than I "really" want. I am somewhat forced to be content with less, and I like that. Again, I really really really do not like being down to the wire financially, and that stresses me out considerably. But for me personally, having some limits to wealth actually makes me happier, because it protects me from becoming too focused and too tied up with things that take time and energy (and money) away from what I feel is truly important. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gardenmom5 Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 money can only buy freedom from financial stress. it can bring a new kind of financial stress .. . . 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlsdMama Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 Have you watched that "Happy" documentary on Netflix? It talks about this very thing. Many studies have shown that money can make you happy when it lifts you out of poverty, when you no longer have to worry about where your next meal will come from, being homeless, etc. When money provides food and shelter security where it previously wasn't, the jump from not happy to happy is big. But past that, it really doesn't make you that much more happy. In general, money doesn't always solve money problems. People who overspend, can't/don't budget, who go out to much, and so on, will always have issues, no matter the amount of money they have. I am one such person, lol. When we were making $45,000 a year, and had all kinds of credit cards to pay, I thought, "If only DH would get a job with better pay, everything would be fine, we'd never have financial problems again." Well, he did get a better job. We went from making $45k a year, to $80k a year just like that. And it was great at first. We paid off the cards. We went in vacation. Moved to a better apartment. But it didn't take long before we were right back in debt, and I was wishing he made more. Now he makes six figures- still have CC debt, and now we have a house that always needs something fixed- and I'm wishing he made more!! Ha! It will never be enough... that Happy documentary related it to a treadmill somehow... you should watch it :) All that said, going from $45k to $80k DID make me happier, because we live in a very high COL area, so it meant we could move out of the semi-ghetto apartment with no dishwasher into a nice neighborhood. I have learned to just be happy with what I have. I don't mind the house projects that need fixing, because it's a better problem to have than being homeless, or constant worry about being evicted, etc. Things that make me happier revolve around being a part of community, making/having friends, etc. which the documentary also talked about ;) ETA: Yes, I know miserable wealthy people and happy poor people, and vice versa... I know people who make $70k a year, with few bills and no kids, and they are always broke- and constantly complaining about their miserable lives. IMO, being Happy is a choice and has nothing to do with money, except in the "bringing you out of poverty" instance. You know, I think your post is just so important. We've had a $70k flux in income over our marriage. so - "cool" statistic - almost 70% of lottery winners are broke within seven years. And then what? Honestly, 1st world consumption/consumerism is totally out of control. The truth is most of us like to live on the edge - to the brink of what we can afford. What would one do with more money? Buy a more expensive house, car, travel, etc. In other words, we'd push to the brink of THAT income. I have a friend who is married to a man who moved here as a child from a remote village far, far away. So I was curious... what do his parents live like? Were they able to avoid stuff-itis? Nope. They accumulated crap just like the rest of us. We live on a mediocre income considering our family size. My EFC for college isn't zero, but it isn't 100% of tuition either, lol, so that must make us about in the middle. :P But you know, five years ago, we lived on about $30k less. We lived in a much smaller house. I simplified our meals and grocery shopping. When we made more, we spent more, and we always say, "Well, if we had $x more each month..." But you know what the truth is? We'd spend it. Maybe not..... Maybe not now that we realize we'd like more savings, more padding, more flex-room. But that's a relatively new revelation - that we spend to the brink because we do. Do we have an extravagant house? No. But it's not a box either. Now... medical. Money just for paying medical could make me happy, lol. Just thousands in a medical account for the catastrophes that always happen. So I take back all my waxing philosophically and say that contentment and a medical savings account could make me happy. :P :D 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Mousie Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 More cats, more travel - they would both work for me. ;) In all seriousness, when we first got married I recall a middle aged couple at Sunday School talking about how much easier life was for them then than when they were first married. They were relatively poor when they were just starting out (as many are) and something going wrong (an appliance) was a big deal due to finances. It could and did add stress. When one is more settled and making more to where one can just replace the appliance and it's not a big deal, that eliminates a ton of stress. As many others have pointed out, reducing stress makes it far easier to enjoy life. It's not impossible to enjoy life with stress if you're with company to share it (misery does love company), but it's just easier. It's not impossible to be stressed by non-monetary things too. Money (and what can come from it) is merely one dimension. When one has no money - living on the street, going to shelters for food, wearing the same clothes day in and day out, you rarely see them singing life's praises or glowing with pleasure. Money is pretty close to oxygen in that respect. I completely agree with you. But the bolded reminded me: where I work, there are lots of "street people," mostly regulars. One regular frequently whistles happy tunes as he's fishing around in the trash can. And once I saw a different guy standing in the median of a very busy street belting out Barry Manilow's "I Write the Songs." You are completely correct (IMO) that it is rare - but I just had to share those two rare tidbits. :) I think they illustrate humanity's propensity for hope and pleasure in small things. Even the downtrodden recognize a beautiful day, you know? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bolt. Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 There are two ways that money contributes to happiness: one is pretty clear above, that it eliminates lack-of-money based problems, and creates plenty of freedom and breathing space. The other is that you can "buy" happiness through finding an excellent (qualified) therapist who is s good got for you -- and paying them copious (appropriate) amounts of money to walk you through the hard work of dealing with issues that are causing unhappiness. Psychology is real, and finding someone who knows the shortcuts (or the effective hard work) towards happiness is worth good money. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crimson Wife Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 We've never been wealthy, but our income over the past decade has experienced wide variations. Over a certain level it doesn't make a difference in our happiness. Below a certain level it causes financial stress because we're worried about keeping our house, paying medical and therapy bills for our SN child, etc. I do know some wealthy people who are miserable but it's due to personal issues. Lots of relationship drama and divorces. We attended a wedding of one of DH's business school classmates in 2010. The guy is a hedge fund manager and that year made $8M. He apparently got into a fight with his fiancee the night before the wedding but married her anyways. Unsurprisingly, they divorced before their 1st anniversary. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bettyandbob Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 Having money can relieve stress and make being able to be happy easier. Some people can be happy even when they are barely able to cover rent and groceries. Some people need more security, some savings, some feeling that income will be consistent. When these types of people are less worried about security they are able to enjoy happiness. I think it would be a truly rare individual who was happy and homeless, jobless, experiencing hunger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gardenmom5 Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 People who overspend, can't/don't budget, who go out to much, and so on, will always have issues, no matter the amount of money they have. I am one such person, lol. When we were making $45,000 a year, and had all kinds of credit cards to pay, I thought, "If only DH would get a job with better pay, everything would be fine, we'd never have financial problems again." ETA: Yes, I know miserable wealthy people and happy poor people, and vice versa... I know people who make $70k a year, with few bills and no kids, and they are always broke- and constantly complaining about their miserable lives. IMO, being Happy is a choice and has nothing to do with money, except in the "bringing you out of poverty" instance. this was my sister. two incomes, one kid, my grandmother was constantly supplementing their income becasue they spent more than they made. I constantly heard (mostly from my grandmother) how "poor" they were. she was constantly encouraging her to "keep up with kristen". at the time, her dh was making more than mine. we bought our own house, had two+ kids, etc. but we didn't have electronic toys, only had one car, etc. but we paid our own bills. if we could't afford it - we didn't buy it. and even my mother . . . dh had her set up. he invested her money in such a way she had a comfortable income - if she would just live *within* her income. . . . she was selling off the investments to pay her bills. then she came begging dh (finance major) to 'bail her out'. it took him six months to completely get her finances under control. for awhile - he was afraid he'd have to sell her condo. he took control of her finances away from her and gave her a weekly cash allowance of spending money. (he tried doing it a month at a time, but it would be gone in under a week.) he made sure everything that needed to be paid, was paid. she was actually grateful to not have to think about it . . . and she was able to be comfortable until she died. he's currently doing similar for his mother. (does NOT matter how much money this woman makes - she will blow more than she takes in if she's allowed to do what she wants. her last dh *was* WAS (note past tense) a millionaire when they got married. he had to keep her on a very tight leash, but then his health failed and no one was controling her. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmseB Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 I know that having it relieves a lot of stress. On the other hand, I know people who are wealthy and cranky and complain about everything. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twolittleboys Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 Sorry, didn't have time to read the other posts yet but here are my thoughts: I don't think money can buy happiness but it can buy freedom from certain worries (how to pay rent, doctors bills etc.). Once you have enough not to really worry about these things (or if you are the type not to worry much anyway) money doesn't make any difference in happiness. I took this online class and there it said that happiness increases with increasing income up to a certain level (I want to say 80k per year but don't quite remember and it would depend on where you live/number of family members etc.), after that it doesn't help any more. Not sure I know unhappy rich people per se but there are so many devastating events/conditions (seriously ill children, drug abuse, mental illness etc.) where money might help a little bit but it would still suck. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seasider Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 Money can take away worries about the basics, the four walls: food, clothing, shelter and transportation. It can also reduce worries about health care and educational costs. These 6 categories and budgeting for them are where my own money concerns are found. Money can provide for higher quality of food and clothing, and allow for more discretionary recreational spending, things which I can see as making one happier. I don't think the best way to look at it is "money makes people happy." I would agree that "proper funding can alleviate anxiety." That said, money cannot buy sane and rational family members, it cannot curb approval seeking, it can fuel keeping-up-with-the-joneses syndrome. So even if you have a lot of money, it won't necessarily make you happy. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
happypamama Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 I don't think money can buy happiness, but it sure can buy comfort and can relieve stress. It's one thing to be content with what you have, whether it's lavish or meager, but it's another to worry about how you're going to pay for necessities. Like, a person might be perfectly content with a small home and non-fancy car, but if that small home also needs a new roof and that non-fancy car needs a new engine, you can be content but not happy if you don't know how you're going to pay for those things. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theelfqueen Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 Money can't buy happiness but it can buy Disney tickets and scrapbook paper, so that's a pretty good substitute. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 Here's an article of the "perfect" amount of wealth mentioned above. Being poor sucks and there's no way around it. Being not-poor is the best ever! Being in no danger of being poor is, I imagine, would be an immeasurable relief. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catz Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 I don't think it buys happiness but I think it can eliminate a huge stressor. We actually live very modestly for our income level. We hve good savings. I know other people who are at a similar economic bracket but always want a bigger house, better car, longer vacations, latest gadgets, etc. I think there's also a bunch to be said for being content with what you have as well. There's no doubt that living pay check to pay check is highly stressful. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seasider Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 Something else about money: having much of it enables one to be generous. It does make me happy to give when I can, and I've been heard saying that I'd love to be one of those secret millionaire types. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
regentrude Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 (edited) Money cannot buy happiness. As is evidenced by unhappy rich people. Money can, however, buy peace of mind. Not having to be worried and stressed about money should make the person feel much happier. Not having to be anxious about paying for food, shelter, health care, and education should be a relief. Edited February 8, 2016 by regentrude 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluegoat Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 I think one of the things that really contributes to happieness is security. You know you can depend on a place to live, on food, on people to help you out. Money can help with those things, but on the other hand there are potentially other ways to make them happen. Say - you want to live mortgage free so you build your own house. That's an investment of time rather than money, but you have the security of a house at the end just as if you'd bought it. Money can mean you are able to pay for baby-sitters and other services, but living in a tight-knit community can also give those things. Money can mean you can buy great health insurance, or you can band together and create a universal health program. My point being, money here is a means to an end, and there is more than one way to skin a cat. And after all - maybe you have two high incomes in your family, but if you are living in a very expensive home with a mortgage and spending most of what you earn, you may not actually have much more security but your tastes and expectations may be much higher than someone earning less. I think there is also the question of how acquiring the money impacts your happiness. A friend of mine for example who is a lawyer got a job at one of the more prestigious firms in our city. After he had a child, he took a much lower paying government job, because the QOL in the first job just sucked. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrsWeasley Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 To a certain point, yes. I think it's very difficult to find happiness with unstable living conditions, food insecurity, lack of access to healthcare. However, I think once people have basic financial security, money plays a much smaller role in happiness. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annie G Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 Money doesn't buy happiness but how many times have we heard that the #1 thing couples fight about is money? So I think having enough money might relieve a lot of stress. If a guy hates his job and his wife complains that they don't have enough money to pay bills, it can get ugly fast. The guy can feel like he's doing the best he can with his miserable job. He's not happy, she's not happy. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
regentrude Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 (edited) I think this is a bit too simplified. Money can help with those things, but on the other hand there are potentially other ways to make them happen. Say - you want to live mortgage free so you build your own house. That's an investment of time rather than money, but you have the security of a house at the end just as if you'd bought it. You have to build the house from something, and that costs money. (I have friends who are homesteading and doing as much as possible with their own hands, but affording supplies is costly, even then) Money can mean you are able to pay for baby-sitters and other services, but living in a tight-knit community can also give those things. Only if those other people have enough money so they can afford to babysit for you instead of working for pay. Money can mean you can buy great health insurance, or you can band together and create a universal health program. And how is that universal health program paid for? Somebody has to have money. Sure, you can live fine with little money if society is structured to take care of you or if other people choose to spend their money on you. Then it's somebody else's money that buys your happiness. Edited February 8, 2016 by regentrude 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carrie12345 Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 People with money can still face problems that have nothing to do with money (abundance or lack of.) I'm not wealthy, but I've definitely faced more difficulties while having a higher household income than I did with a lower one. Things that money can't actually fix. Because I'm human, and life comes with challenges whether you have money or not. Which isn't to say that money can't make certain things more enjoyable/happy. It just can't make EVERYTHING more enjoyable/happy. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
livetoread Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 I'm not disagreeing or arguing with you but that makes no sense to me. $70K means different things in different places. Jackson, MS and San Francisco, CA come to mind as possible examples. (Just picking Jackson because I had been looking at housing costs there not too long ago for a potential move that didn't happen. Whoa were things cheap compared to where I live now, which is still not as high as SF.) Interesting! ETA: $70K was an average, maybe? But that doesn't make sense either, I don't think. I am pretty sure I'm not thinking about this correctly. I agree. I live in a low cost area of the country and 70k will get you not only the basics but a comfortable middle class life as long as you have affordable health care coverage and live within your means. I would put that magic number lower for here and higher elsewhere. I am guessing the 70k was an average of the sample they took, but I don't remember from what population they drew their sample. There are so many variables to consider when talking about a cut off. When do they live, what's the lifestyle of their friends, how much debt to they have, how good/affordable is their health insurance? So giving a number is tentative, but I think the basic point is sound. Money often (but not always) directly affects the happiness of people if they have less than a certain amount. Above that amount, and it has much less of an effect. Also, that number is smaller than many think. If you are comfortably middle class, having more money is not likely to bring near the happiness it would if you were not. More money brings diminishing returns regarding happiness, the more you more beyond a certain point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squawky Acres Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 This question reminds me of one posed by a Bible study leader twelve years ago or so . . . while I was an unmarried 20-something attorney in NY. She asked us: "Has anything you bought ever *really* made you happy?" I think the answer was supposed to be "No, things can't make one happy," but I felt like that wouldn't be quite honest as I had just bought myself a beautiful Prada overcoat that made me very, very happy. So at the risk of sounding shallow, I pointed out that absolutely, things can make one happy. I would never make such an extravagant purchase now as a SAHM, but I still like having a lovely overcoat. It continues to make me happy every time I wear it! 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SKL Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 I have learned that money finds people who are in the right mindset to receive it. Someone who can't ever be happy because they feel like victims etc. do not find money, or if they do find it, they don't keep the wealth long. I used to be one of those people. Then I realized a few things and became a different kind of person. A more giving, trusting person. A happier person. I was beyond broke by anyone's definition at that time. But I decided not to concentrate on what I didn't have / couldn't do, but rather to do what I could with what I had. Including significantly increasing what I gave away. At that point, my financial worries started to gradually disappear. So no, I don't know too many miserable rich people, especially not ones who earned their money (vs. inheriting it). I know you can still worry like crazy even if you are rich, but I don't know many who do. Of course, there is less to worry about when you own a home without a mortgage, and have a "nest egg" in the bank. When your choices aren't between basic nutrition and paying for utilities. When you have the means to get care for health problems. No doubt about it. But that's not the only reason why wealthy people are often also happy people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluegoat Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 I think this is a bit too simplified. You have to build the house from something, and that costs money. (I have friends who are homesteading and doing as much as possible with their own hands, but affording supplies is costly, even then) Only if those other people have enough money so they can afford to babysit for you instead of working for pay. And how is that universal health program paid for? Somebody has to have money. Sure, you can live fine with little money if society is structured to take care of you or if other people choose to spend their money on you. Then it's somebody else's money that buys your happiness. You're still thinking within a particular cultural context. Money is a stand-in for other things, and it or those things can be made to work more efficiently depending on things like cultural structures or way of life. What, for example, if we decided to think quite differently about the private ownership of land? What if instead of valuing an economy with a very mobile workforce we valued very stable community life? What if we expected many people would not be in paid employment and the economy was structured that way. To put it another way, where does the money come from, really? If your mom babysits your kids, or someone you pay, is there really less work being done in the first case? In our culture, yes, money is often necessary for security. But it isn't actually the source of the security. Even in our money dominated society, we can think about ways we can set up our lives to make us less dependent on cash money for security, and we can see how, even with a lot of cash-flow, someone might not actually be very secure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Susan in TX Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 Having recently inherited a very large sum of money, I can assure you that money cannot buy happiness. Susan in TX 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LucyStoner Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 The research on this topic is very mixed. Many studies have indicated that past an income level that allows one to meet their basic needs and not feel deprived, there is not a direct connection between more dollars and more happiness. yet there are other studies which dispute that claim. When I look back on my life up to this point I have been happy and not that happy at all income points. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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