Inauguration - NO POLITICS, just thoughts on the ceremony

[J-rap]

9 minutes ago, Cnew02 said:

I’m confused about the poetry discussion.  I don’t know much about poetry, Ill admit.  But wouldn’t any poem read at the inauguration have to be spoken in words?   Are poems only to be read?  Should we not have poetry readings?  I thought those were common at inaugurations and weddings and things?  

"Spoken word" is a certain type of poetry.  It's more like a free-flowing oral recitation.  It often has a certain rhythm -- like a song, but without actually singing it.  It's very much about the performance of it, even more than the exact words themselves.  I'm sure someone can give a better definition though!

Edited January 21, 2021 by J-rap

[J-rap]

I loved the inauguration.  I missed the first part, but tried to catch up with video clips later.  I really liked Biden's speech.  It sounded authentic;  you can tell he's trying hard to give a strong message of unifying the country and being everyone's president.  He sounded calm and determined.

I thought Jill Biden's outfit was gorgeous (especially the color!).  I loved all the matching outfits/gloves/masks!  She and Biden seem like a very united, loving couple.  And, she must have strong wrists for having to hold such a massive Bible!

I'm sure Garth Brooks not shaking hands with Harris right away was just an oversight.  You could tell he was giddy and excited, and just enjoying the moment.  I'm not a huge Garth Brooks music fan, but I read an article about him really wanting to send a message of both parties coming together, and that Biden is everyone's president.  I like that.

I loved Lady Gaga's performance.

After such a tough year for our country, I think it was all tastefully done, uplifting and hopeful.  I haven't felt patriotic at all in years, but I did feel a twinge of it yesterday.  

 

[ieta_cassiopeia]

It's also known as "free verse", "freeform poetry" or occasionally "open forum poetry" due to its relatively low reliance on lyrical techniques or traditional formats. Typically there is no rhyme scheme, fixed metre or other type of musical pattern involved, because the poetry is designed to more closely follow the patterns of conventional cadence in speech. While there are no rules for such poetry, many of the rhetorical techniques that strengthen a speech, blank verse within a play, rap or everyday conversational statement also strengthen this type of poetry.

Some notable writers of free verse include Walt Whitman, Remy de Gourmont, Heinrich Heine and Allen Ginsberg.

[Soror]

nt

Edited January 22, 2021 by Soror

[MEmama]

30 minutes ago, J-rap said:

 

After such a tough year for our country, I think it was all tastefully done, uplifting and hopeful.  I haven't felt patriotic at all in years, but I did feel a twinge of it yesterday.  

 

I don’t believe in patriotism, and while I agree Biden’s words were important and lovely and exactly what *I* want from a leader, the fact that half our country isn’t interested in unity or honesty or even democracy itself left me feeling really empty and sad. I’m struggling a lot today, on a day my heart should be soaring. 
 

Sorry to put that out there today. I’m just not feeling optimistic when so many Americans truly hate the fundamental ideals of this country. 

[alisoncooks]

I'm cracking up over the Bernie memes...

https://m.facebook.com/nikki.milcavage/posts/pcb.10158590031820932/?photo_id=10158590029905932&mds=%2Fphotos%2Fviewer%2F%3Fphotoset_token%3Dpcb.10158590031820932%26photo%3D10158590029905932%26profileid%3D1178792682%26source%3D48%26refid%3D28%26_ft_%3Dqid.6920229321300121403%3Amf_story_key.-1037104540245670342%3Atop_level_post_id.940408882473%3Acontent_owner_id_new.157200404%3Aoriginal_content_id.10158590031820932%3Aoriginal_content_owner_id.541840931%3Asrc.22%3Aphoto_id.10158590029905932%3Astory_location.5%3Aattached_story_attachment_style.album%3Aview_time.1611241094%3Afilter.h_nor%26__tn__%3DEHH-R%26cached_data%3Dfalse%26ftid%3D&mdp=1&mdf=1

[HeartString]

Am I the only one that thought Ella Emhoff’s dress was strange?  I didn’t care for it at all and thought it made her stand out in a bad way.  

[Matryoshka]

52 minutes ago, ieta_cassiopeia said:

It's also known as "free verse", "freeform poetry" or occasionally "open forum poetry" due to its relatively low reliance on lyrical techniques or traditional formats. Typically there is no rhyme scheme, fixed metre or other type of musical pattern involved, because the poetry is designed to more closely follow the patterns of conventional cadence in speech. While there are no rules for such poetry, many of the rhetorical techniques that strengthen a speech, blank verse within a play, rap or everyday conversational statement also strengthen this type of poetry.

Some notable writers of free verse include Walt Whitman, Remy de Gourmont, Heinrich Heine and Allen Ginsberg.

What she does isn't, I think, exactly free verse.  There's no stanzas or set rhyming scheme, but there's a ton of poetic devices used.  She uses a lot of alliteration and internal rhyme/near rhyme (there's better words for the other stuff but I'm not breaking out the MCT right now to figure it out... 🙃). But it's very noticeable to me how much attention is paid to poetics in her work - it's just not in the same manner as traditional poetry, or I'd say, what I've seen of free verse.  

While I greatly enjoyed her speech, I don't think this is her strongest work - as others have said, she finished most of it since the Capitol insurrection, so had less time to polish than other pieces she's performed.

[alisoncooks]

8 minutes ago, Cnew02 said:

Am I the only one that thought Ella Emhoff’s dress was strange?  I didn’t care for it at all and thought it made her stand out in a bad way.  

I wouldn't wear it...but I'm 40+ and overweight. She's young and thin and artsy and quirky. The dress worked...for her. 

[catz]

I really enjoyed the inauguration.  I thought the whole thing was lovely and optimistic and a nice diversion and spectacle.  ❤️  

I thought Amanda Gorman was great.  As the parent of a young adult, I thought of her parents and how that must have felt for them.  I'm sure they almost exploded.  ❤️  🙂 

That said, as someone who has kids in the arts and who seeks out these types of performances and know young people that have done this (I actually know a young poet recognized nationally this year), she was great but not really unexpected to me?  I always worry when someone gets the overnight interest and celebrity she has gotten, especially as a young person who is going to trip and make mistakes and changes directions now possibly in the public eye and may acutely feel outside pressure.  I also think choosing to feature a young person who attended a high end LA private high school and Harvard is a pretty in the box choice and I do wish they would more often think more out of the box for opportunities like that.  Don't get me wrong, I wish her every success and think she was a bright light in the ceremony.  As a 22 year old with an eye to the future.  On par with Maya Angelou?  No,maybe someday.

Edited January 21, 2021 by FuzzyCatz

[HeartString]

14 minutes ago, alisoncooks said:

wouldn't wear it...but I'm 40+ and overweight. She's young and thin and artsy and quirky. The dress worked...for her. 

I think I just don’t care for the orange jewels and the pattern but no one would accuse me of understanding fashion. She’s adorable and would look amazing in a paper sack.  

[Moonhawk]

30 minutes ago, Cnew02 said:

Am I the only one that thought Ella Emhoff’s dress was strange?  I didn’t care for it at all and thought it made her stand out in a bad way.  

I'm not saying this in a bad way, I instantly thought of the girl from Lemony Snicket's Series of Unfortunate Events. (Not the movies, I haven't seen the, but like this book cover.) Looking it up now Idk if it actually matches past the coat collar and the dress color, but I think the character would have worn this for sure. 

[dirty ethel rackham]

I was at clinicals yesterday so I didn't get a chance to watch it live.  I did watch the replay later in the evening and was so moved, with a sense of relief and hope.  Unfortunately, I fell asleep before I could watch the parade. Will do so later today.  

20 hours ago, historically accurate said:

Bernie Sanders' coat and mittens were pretty awesome. I'm always in awe at the lighter jackets in DC in January, although Michelle Obama's outfit was superb. Sanders actually looked like he was prepared for winter. I saw it described on Twitter as "Vermont grandfather chic". LOL.

Yep, Amanda Gorman was the hit. Lady Gaga did a great job today.

 

It was so stereotypical Bernie!  I'm dying at the bolded.  (I miss out on so much not being on Twitter and rely on you all and my kids to let me know whats up.)

18 hours ago, Terabith said:

Bernie is pretty ancient though.  I mean, my grandfather was always cold when he was that age.  But I looked it up, and it was like 39 degrees, which isn't all that cold, really.  

Being a Midwesterner, 39 degrees isn't all that cold if you are moving around, but if you are sitting in the shade, yeah, I'd want to be dressed like Bernie.  I froze at way too many of my kids' soccer games, but was content to walk in sub-freezing temps with my dog.  

16 hours ago, Terabith said:

Bernie is so hilarious.  He's just always so completely himself.  Have you seen the Trevor Noah segment about his cable access show in the 80's?  It's HILARIOUS.  

 

🤣🤣 I'm dying!

[Sneezyone]

14 hours ago, Matryoshka said:

I only found out about the book earlier today, but honestly there's something about her delivery that I think appeals to me as much as the words.  I can usually only take poetry in small bits.

Spoken word poetry seems to be having a moment.  I hadn't really encountered it before her - I'd heard of slam poetry, but I think that's different.  Then this year a spoken word poet won America's Got Talent - I mean, who'd've thunk?  

We had an ‘Underground Cafe” where jazz greats played with music students and poetry was recited on the USC campus 25 years ago, both boring limericks and biting free verse. I hope it’s still there. My friends and I loved that place.

Edited January 21, 2021 by Sneezyone

[Sneezyone]

I did think the poem could use a bit of editing. It’s not the best representation of that style I’ve ever seen or heard but, for her age and given the time constraints, I thought she did a remarkable job. She was poised and confident on an international stage. I immediately heard the echoes of Angelou, Miranda, and pop culture in it. The references to ‘shade’, history having its eyes on us, Christianity, Ms. Angelou’s epic poem about the rock, tree, and river inviting us to do and be better because the price has been paid. There was a lot to like in it for those inclined to do so. She’s the inaugural YOUTH Poet Laureate and her poem reflects that.

Edited January 21, 2021 by Sneezyone

[Matryoshka]

2 minutes ago, Sneezyone said:

I did think the poem could use a bit of editing. It’s not the best representation of that style I’ve ever seen or heard but, for her age, and given the time constraints I thought she did a remarkable job. She was poised and confident on an international stage. I immediately heard the echoes of Angelou, Miranda, and pop culture in it. The references to ‘shade’, history having its eyes on us, Christianity, Ms. Angelou’s epic poem about the rock, tree, and river inviting us to do and be better because the price has been paid. There was a lot to like in it for those inclined to do so. She’s the inaugural YOUTH Poet Laureate.

I'd be curious to hear what you think of her other work.  I have a feeling that any editing difficulties had more to do with the time constraints than her age.

[Sneezyone]

2 minutes ago, Matryoshka said:

I'd be curious to hear what you think of her other work.  I have a feeling that any editing difficulties had more to do with the time constraints than her age.

I haven’t read or seen them but I’m inclined to check them out. I think, in general, some of the pop culture references won’t age as well as other bits but that’s her point of reference right now and it totally makes sense. She is a phenomenal talent tho and has tremendous potential.

Edited January 21, 2021 by Sneezyone

[AbcdeDooDah]

I thought the whole thing was lovely. Glad there were no interruptions.

Sotomayor mispronouncing Harris’ first name, appalling.

Calling black people articulate is racist.

 

Edited January 21, 2021 by AbcdeDooDah

[Matryoshka]

2 minutes ago, Sneezyone said:

I haven’t read or seen them but I’m inclined to check them out.

I linked a couple upthread. 😁

[Ali in OR]

13 hours ago, MercyA said:

Nice little article about All the Coats here: https://www.latimes.com/entertainment-arts/story/2021-01-20/inauguration-coats-where-ella-emhoff-amanda-gorman-and-more-got-their-looks

And a great article including details about the symbolism in Amanda Gorman's outfit: https://www.vogue.com/article/inaugural-poet-amanda-gorman-interview

(Yeah, I like clothes. Even though I've been wearing sweats every day for months and personally shop thrift stores...)

Thank you so much for sharing...I love knowing the backstory. Amanda is so inspiring--I want posters of her with quotes from her work in every classroom I work in.

[Jaybee]

7 minutes ago, AbcdeDooDah said:

 

Calling black people articulate is racist.

 

?? You didn't include who you were quoting, and I didn't go looking for context. I have used this word to describe my very white young adult son. I'm not sure why you see it as racist or maybe patronizing. I use it as descriptive to describe someone who is a wordsmith and who uses language in a precise and accurate (and possibly interesting, as well) way.

Personally, I enjoyed the poem, and liked reading the transcript so I could examine it further. I feel like there are lots of layers in there.

[AbcdeDooDah]

7 minutes ago, Jaybee said:

?? You didn't include who you were quoting, and I didn't go looking for context. I have used this word to describe my very white young adult son. I'm not sure why you see it as racist or maybe patronizing. I use it as descriptive to describe someone who is a wordsmith and who uses language in a precise and accurate (and possibly interesting, as well) way.

Personally, I enjoyed the poem, and liked reading the transcript so I could examine it further. I feel like there are lots of layers in there.

Just putting it out there. I saw it a couple times in this thread. The history of the word as a micro aggression is there for the looking

Edited January 21, 2021 by AbcdeDooDah

[Jaybee]

2 minutes ago, AbcdeDooDah said:

Just putting it out there. I saw it a couple time in this thread. The history of the word as a micro aggression is there for the looking

It's like (more than) a full-time job these days to look at every word used, its history, how it has been distorted, how it might be misunderstood or labelled as non-pc, racist, hurtful, etc. As one who loves language, I find this very sad--and almost impossible to figure out how to write anything anymore. 

[Sneezyone]

It is too early in the thread to strike up the  ‘well I never!’ rage machine b/c someone expressed disagreement. We need at least four more pages and some wine first.

Edited January 21, 2021 by Sneezyone

[Sneezyone]

3 hours ago, Jaybee said:

It's like (more than) a full-time job these days to look at every word used, its history, how it has been distorted, how it might be misunderstood or labelled as non-pc, racist, hurtful, etc. As one who loves language, I find this very sad--and almost impossible to figure out how to write anything anymore. 

One of the beautiful things about language is its fluidity; it’s always changing. Missing out on its changing uses and nuances limits the ability to effectively communicate across differences (and understand how others communicate too). Some of the references in the, apparently controversial, poem draw upon forms/styles of communication and references popularized by minority groups in this country. While one needn’t enjoy them, it’s always worthwhile to endeavor to be familiar with them.

Edited January 21, 2021 by Sneezyone

[MercyA]

6 minutes ago, Kinsa said:

Omg... are you serious??? 🤣

 

It's seen as racist because it can imply an element of surprise.

I have personally used the word to describe black people, many times. I'm embarrassed about that now, but I didn't know better. I hadn't thought about how it sounded and the connotations it held.

I take you at your word that you were not using it that way, but please just think about it a little bit rather than laughing. Put yourself in someone else's shoes.

[vonfirmath]

15 hours ago, kiwik said:

3 questions for US people.

3/  Why have you had 46 Presidents and no women yet?

No women on the ticket that won.

We've had several women on losing tickets in the Presidential battle.

 

[J-rap]

2 hours ago, MEmama said:

I don’t believe in patriotism, and while I agree Biden’s words were important and lovely and exactly what *I* want from a leader, the fact that half our country isn’t interested in unity or honesty or even democracy itself left me feeling really empty and sad. I’m struggling a lot today, on a day my heart should be soaring. 
 

Sorry to put that out there today. I’m just not feeling optimistic when so many Americans truly hate the fundamental ideals of this country. 

I've definitely felt that same sadness and discouragement this past year, and I generally don't think of myself as a patriotic-type person.  My own faith belief suggests that patriotism can be more of a trap than a good thing.  Still, I'm an optimist at heart, and I always believe everyone has a chance of being a better version of themselves, and that finding authentic means of coming together can still happen.  (In any situation.)

And I think that in any situation, sometimes the only thing to judge is the direction the entity is facing.  And right now, it seems like the direction our country is facing -- though difficult and complex and exhausting -- is more positive than it has been in awhile, focused on being better together than it was divided.  

You're either facing one direction or the other, and whichever direction you face, you'll hopefully take the first step.  That's always something to hope for, anyway!

[ktgrok]

I think her poem resonated because a lot of us are having these weird feelings we struggle to put into words, and she put them into words for us. The idea of a new day but not being sure what do now resonated. And other parts were just hugely reassuring and offered a more optimistic perspective without downplaying the grief and fear many have been feeling. To say we not broken, but unfinished, was just really reassuring. To say that we are tired, but still tried, it felt like someone acknowledging the hard times but also showing the goodness that comes from it. 

If those were not your feelings, I can see how it wouldn't resonate nearly as much. 

[MEmama]

9 minutes ago, J-rap said:

I've definitely felt that same sadness and discouragement this past year, and I generally don't think of myself as a patriotic-type person.  My own faith belief suggests that patriotism can be more of a trap than a good thing.  Still, I'm an optimist at heart, and I always believe everyone has a chance of being a better version of themselves, and that finding authentic means of coming together can still happen.  (In any situation.)

And I think that in any situation, sometimes the only thing to judge is the direction the entity is facing.  And right now, it seems like the direction our country is facing -- though difficult and complex and exhausting -- is more positive than it has been in awhile, focused on being better together than it was divided.  

You're either facing one direction or the other, and whichever direction you face, you'll hopefully take the first step.  That's always something to hope for, anyway!

Thanks. Very well said. 

I’m an optimist too but I think the past year especially just broke me. I’m stunned by the depth of the desires that such a huge percentage of the population has for being intentionally misinformed and wilfully ignorant. It feels insurmountable—how can we as a country come together when half of us simply don’t want to? How can we beat this virus when so many people still—a year in—won’t take the simplest precautions and actively argue against taking care of one another?

Sadly, I’m spending far less time here on the board as a result, not to live in an echo chamber but because I just can’t with them anymore. I have no more f...s for the cruelty too many  justify inflicting on others.

I apologize for laying all this out here. I’m exhausted. Maybe I’m just detoxing all the negative energy of the past 4 years. I want nothing more than for the healing to begin. 

[ktgrok]

4 minutes ago, MEmama said:

Thanks. Very well said. 

I’m an optimist too but I think the past year especially just broke me. I’m stunned by the depth of the desires that such a huge percentage of the population has for being intentionally misinformed and wilfully ignorant. It feels insurmountable—how can we as a country come together when half of us simply don’t want to? How can we beat this virus when so many people still—a year in—won’t take the simplest precautions and actively argue against taking care of one another?

Sadly, I’m spending far less time here on the board as a result, not to live in an echo chamber but because I just can’t with them anymore. I have no more f...s for the cruelty too many  justify inflicting on others.

I apologize for laying all this out here. I’m exhausted. Maybe I’m just detoxing all the negative energy of the past 4 years. I want nothing more than for the healing to begin. 

Broken is how I feel too. Certain political events bruised me, but then the Kavenaugh hearings and commentary really did me in. I have not come back from that fully - it just brought up a lot of trauma from my past and reignited it. More than that, I lost hope. Or admitted I had no hope, more likely, for particular things to change. Then add in the pandemic and I'm a shell of who I was. 

I think hat is why the line, not broken, but unfinished, from the poem resonated with me. I want to believe that about myself. 

[Sneezyone]

I know people don’t think men’s fashion gets much attention but VP Harris’s party included her nephew wearing very, very expensive, LE Air Force 1s from Christian Dior. Sneaker heads everywhere rejoiced at having their rare gems make prime time. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.chron.com/politics/amp/Jordan-Dior-1s-Biden-inauguration-Nikolas-Ajagu-15884775.php

Edited January 21, 2021 by Sneezyone

[J-rap]

9 minutes ago, MEmama said:

Thanks. Very well said. 

I’m an optimist too but I think the past year especially just broke me. I’m stunned by the depth of the desires that such a huge percentage of the population has for being intentionally misinformed and wilfully ignorant. It feels insurmountable—how can we as a country come together when half of us simply don’t want to? How can we beat this virus when so many people still—a year in—won’t take the simplest precautions and actively argue against taking care of one another?

Sadly, I’m spending far less time here on the board as a result, not to live in an echo chamber but because I just can’t with them anymore. I have no more f...s for the cruelty too many  justify inflicting on others.

I apologize for laying all this out here. I’m exhausted. Maybe I’m just detoxing all the negative energy of the past 4 years. I want nothing more than for the healing to begin. 

I completely get it.  I've been stunned, shocked, and utterly disgusted.  And then lastly, baffled.  How?  How did it come to this?  My (online) church small group has been discussing this question over and over again, for almost a year now.   We've come to realize, I think, that people are not our enemy, as much as it seems like they are.  Systems, our brains, our upbringing...  We all get caught up in it in one way or another.   Those things form so much of us.  But as Martin Luther King so aptly said, "Hate cannot drive out hate.  Only love can do that."   I think you do that by bringing value to a person.  It's something to strive for.  It's hard.

[AbcdeDooDah]

41 minutes ago, MercyA said:

It's seen as racist because it can imply an element of surprise.

I have personally used the word to describe black people, many times. I'm embarrassed about that now, but I didn't know better. I hadn't thought about how it sounded and the connotations it held.

I take you at your word that you were not using it that way, but please just think about it a little bit rather than laughing. Put yourself in someone else's shoes.

I was called out online many years ago for using the word “Oriental.” It the word we always used and somehow I had missed that it was not okay. I immediately edited my post and did some research. It was embarrassing but I got over it and not once did I scoff at it. 

Back to the inauguration. Sorry for the derail. I would love some discussion on the mispronunciation.

[ktgrok]

2 hours ago, Sneezyone said:

We had an ‘Underground Cafe” where jazz greats played with music students and poetry was recited on the USC campus 25 years ago, both boring limericks and biting free verse. I hope it’s still there. My friends and I loved that place.

My very first time to any kind of adult nightclub/etc was to a place called The Underground. It was downtown in West Palm Beach and they did an all ages night with poetry readings. My parents took a LOT of convincing as I was still in highschool, and the downtown area had only recently undergone gentrification - before that it was a very high crime area with shuttered storefronts. Explaining that it had changed took time (likely my mom made my dad go drive around at night and check it out, knowing them) but they let me go with friends, and I felt SO grown up drinking an espresso flavored milkshake (coffee!) and listening to poetry. 

Later in college I went to somewhere similar, and all I remember is the clove cigarrette smell. I know there are so bad for you, but man I loved that smell. Even my now DH smoked them back then. Miss that smell!

[Sneezyone]

8 minutes ago, ktgrok said:

My very first time to any kind of adult nightclub/etc was to a place called The Underground. It was downtown in West Palm Beach and they did an all ages night with poetry readings. My parents took a LOT of convincing as I was still in highschool, and the downtown area had only recently undergone gentrification - before that it was a very high crime area with shuttered storefronts. Explaining that it had changed took time (likely my mom made my dad go drive around at night and check it out, knowing them) but they let me go with friends, and I felt SO grown up drinking an espresso flavored milkshake (coffee!) and listening to poetry. 

Later in college I went to somewhere similar, and all I remember is the clove cigarrette smell. I know there are so bad for you, but man I loved that smell. Even my now DH smoked them back then. Miss that smell!

This was very much like our hangout spot. We didn’t have cars and had no money to speak of so a cheap black coffee bought us hours of entertainment. The entry fee was only a buck. lol. Decades later, DH and I were in DC and went to an underground dinner/jazz venue in this off the beaten path area (the cave/cavern?). It was fantastic. I love those places.

Edited January 21, 2021 by Sneezyone

[wathe]

42 minutes ago, Kinsa said:

Omg... are you serious??? 🤣

I said she was articulate to directly counter that I insinuated that she sounded drunk. So, "I didn't say she sounded drunk. She was articulate." Meaning, exactly, that she sounded the opposite of drunk. There was no, none, zip, microaggression in that statement.  

But now I'm remembering why I took a very long leave of absence from this forum. My sanity might require it of me again. 

I think "articulate" has become a loaded word when used to describe people who are Black. 

It's racist when it's used to imply articulate for a Black person.  And that's not at all how I think you meant it in this context.  But that doesn't mean that it's not how a Black person (or other sensitized person) might hear it, or think maybe that's how you meant it.  Because the word has been used so often as a micro-aggression that it's become loaded.  It's probably best avoided, no matter how innocent the intent.

The other thing about microaggressions is that they don't have to be intentional.  I think many of us commit microaggressions subconsciously (not saying that's what you did here, Kinsa) or are completely unaware that some of the things we say are microaggressive.

For example, "Where are you from?" is a loaded question in the Asian-Canadian community (implying that you look different, so you must be from somewhere else, and is often a kind of code for "what kind of Asian are you?").  The asker of the question thinks they are just curious and interested, and may not be consciously aware that what they are doing is othering the askee.   The askee, who has been singled out with this question eleventy billion times, and has noted that the white people he's with don't get the same treatment, definitely feels this as a microaggression. 

 

[mathnerd]

7 hours ago, AbcdeDooDah said:

I was called out online many years ago for using the word “Oriental.” It the word we always used and somehow I had missed that it was not okay. I immediately edited my post and did some research. It was embarrassing but I got over it and not once did I scoff at it. 

Back to the inauguration. Sorry for the derail. I would love some discussion on the mispronunciation.

I remember reading a commentary on racism (in sports) once where the author said that western media could manage to pronounce correctly the name of then Tennis Great Slobodan Živojinović while they fumbled to pronounce most names that are from “ethnic” or non-western cultures. I have never forgotten that comment through the years. To me, learning how to pronounce someone’s name is a form of respect to the person and their culture. It also signifies tolerance and acceptance.

Edited January 22, 2021 by mathnerd

[OH_Homeschooler]

2 hours ago, FuzzyCatz said:

I really enjoyed the inauguration.  I thought the whole thing was lovely and optimistic and a nice diversion and spectacle.  ❤️  

I thought Amanda Gorman was great.  As the parent of a young adult, I thought of her parents and how that must have felt for them.  I'm sure they almost exploded.  ❤️  🙂 

She was raised by a single mom. She also overcame a speech impediment.

 

55 minutes ago, MercyA said:

It's seen as racist because it can imply an element of surprise.

I have personally used the word to describe black people, many times. I'm embarrassed about that now, but I didn't know better. I hadn't thought about how it sounded and the connotations it held.

I take you at your word that you were not using it that way, but please just think about it a little bit rather than laughing. Put yourself in someone else's shoes.

Thank you for this. My masters research (more than 20 years ago) was in the area of racial subtyping-where you essentially create a whole new category for people who do not fit the stereotype for members of a group. For example, when a person spews racist things but thinks it's okay because they have a black friend, they've essentially created a new category for this friend. There are all those other black people who fit the stereotype, then there's this special person who is my friend. This is a way to maintain the negative stereotype of black people as a group. 

So the idea that calling a black person "articulate" can be racist is rooted in the unspoken part of that statement-"for a black person," as a common stereotype of black people includes the notion that they are not articulate.  

Is it always racist to say a black person is articulate? Of course not. But it is something to consider. When you say that, are you silently comparing that person to your stereotype of a black person, or would you consider this person especially articulate as compared to the entire population? 

[wathe]

Microaggressions are so insidious because, individually, they seem so innocent.  It's the cumulative effect of microaggression after micoraggresion over time that's damaging.

Asking "Where are you from?" really feels like an innocent question, doesn't it?  And sometimes it's totally appropriate (like when meeting new people at a conference and everyone is actually from somewhere else).  But when one is frequently the victim of being singled out with WAYF because of the way one looks, one develops the habit of reacting defensively to the question even when the context is innocent. It's a conditioned response.

 

[mommyoffive]

22 minutes ago, wathe said:

I think "articulate" has become a loaded word when used to describe people who are Black. 

It's racist when it's used to imply articulate for a Black person.  And that's not at all how I think you meant it in this context.  But that doesn't mean that it's not how a Black person (or other sensitized person) might hear it, or think maybe that's how you meant it.  Because the word has been used so often as a micro-aggression that it's become loaded.  It's probably best avoided, no matter how innocent the intent.

The other thing about microaggressions is that they don't have to be intentional.  I think many of us commit microaggressions subconsciously (not saying that's what you did here, Kinsa) or are completely unaware that some of the things we say are microaggressive.

For example, "Where are you from?" is a loaded question in the Asian-Canadian community (implying that you look different, so you must be from somewhere else, and is often a kind of code for "what kind of Asian are you?").  The asker of the question thinks they are just curious and interested, and may not be consciously aware that what they are doing is othering the askee.   The askee, who has been singled out with this question eleventy billion times, and has noted that the white people he's with don't get the same treatment, definitely feels this as a microaggression. 

 

Very much agree.  As a person who is of mixed race, I grew up with everyone asking me "What are you?"   Adults still ask me this to this day.  It is really offensive to me.  

[Pawz4me]

44 minutes ago, AbcdeDooDah said:

 

Back to the inauguration. Sorry for the derail. I would love some discussion on the mispronunciation.

I was almost stunned. I still can't figure out the how or the why of it. By now anyone who has been paying any attention should know how to pronounce her name. So Sotomayor getting it wrong just flabbergasts me. Is she not paying attention? Did she just . . not bother to look it up? Had a momentary brain blip? What???

And this is probably a risky comment, but if it had been a white male judge--or maybe even any of the male judges--who got it wrong we'd still be hearing about it, and we wouldn't be giving him the benefit of the doubt.

Edited January 21, 2021 by Pawz4me

[AbcdeDooDah]

7 minutes ago, Pawz4me said:

I was almost stunned. I still can't figure out the how or the why of it. By now anyone who has been paying any attention should know how to pronounce her name. So Sotomayor getting it wrong just flabbergasts me. Is she not paying attention? Did she just . . not bother to look it up? Had a momentary brain blip? What???

And this is probably a risky comment, but if it had been a white male judge--or maybe even any of the male judges--who got it wrong we'd still be hearing about it, and we wouldn't be giving him the benefit of the doubt.

Exactly. It’s been called racist for months when it’s mispronounced. Now its largely ignored. There is no excuse.

Edited January 21, 2021 by AbcdeDooDah
Adding “largely”

[wathe]

Just now, mommyoffive said:

Very much agree.  As a person who is of mixed race, I grew up with everyone asking me "What are you?"   Adults still ask me this to this day.  It is really offensive to me.  

My kids get "What are you?".  Their strategies for how they deal with this are evolving (and can be quite funny, in a tragic sort of way.  And not always polite).

[mommyoffive]

2 minutes ago, wathe said:

My kids get "What are you?".  Their strategies for how they deal with this are evolving (and can be quite funny, in a tragic sort of way.  And not always polite).

When I was a child I didn't even understand what they were asking.  I had a single mom that was white and never did she ever talk about me being mixed.  In middle school when I had been teased enough to know what they meant I would answer "I am human."

[Junie]

I thought the First Lady's ivory evening gown and coat were just stunning.  Such beautiful embroidery.

https://www.etonline.com/jill-bidens-inauguration-evening-dress-featured-a-subtle-message-of-unity-159340

[ktgrok]

14 minutes ago, Junie said:

I thought the First Lady's ivory evening gown and coat were just stunning.  Such beautiful embroidery.

https://www.etonline.com/jill-bidens-inauguration-evening-dress-featured-a-subtle-message-of-unity-159340

Lovely!

[Jean in Newcastle]

17 minutes ago, Junie said:

I thought the First Lady's ivory evening gown and coat were just stunning.  Such beautiful embroidery.

https://www.etonline.com/jill-bidens-inauguration-evening-dress-featured-a-subtle-message-of-unity-159340

anyone else think of Meghan Markle's wedding veil?  Not saying that the dress looked like a veil.  Just the embroidery details that had the flowers of the Commonwealth on the veil and the embroidery details that had the flowers of the states on the gown. 

[RootAnn]

4 hours ago, Cnew02 said:

Am I the only one that thought Ella Emhoff’s dress was strange?  I didn’t care for it at all and thought it made her stand out in a bad way.  

As I missed the first half or so, I had no idea who she was, but thought she looked just like my lockerpartner (LP) from high school -- including her hair, glasses, & style of dressing. It crossed my mind that it was my L.P. except LP is not that tall & just a "few" years older now. (She still looks like she's in her early 20s but she's in her early 40s.) All that to say that I thought her dress was quirky, but I admire those willing to go out on a fashion limb as part of their identity. And obviously, I was friends in high school with such a quirky individualist so I didn't think it was strange or bad.

I didn't have the uplifting/hopeful reaction many on this thread did, but I really enjoyed watching  the process (and pageantry --but, ya know, I'm Catholic, so that's stereotypically fitting, isn't it? *wink*).

I missed the mispronounciation, but as someone who struggles with remembering names & especially getting the cadence of certain easy-to-mess-up names correct, I feel for the Justice. (I'm not sure I could pronounce her last name correctly.) If I were given that honor (introducing), I'd have worked really hard to get it correct & then probably brain-blipped it in the stress of the moment. From what I know of the VP, I would bet she forgave the Justice in her head right away.

[vonfirmath]

2 hours ago, vonfirmath said:

No women on the ticket that won.

We've had several women on losing tickets in the Presidential battle.

 

One more thing: Women have been campaigning for the role of Vice President since 1884 -- before they can vote, evidently.

(I knew it was a long time. I didn't know it was that long)

 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/who-was-the-first-woman-to-run-for-vice-president-females-have-been-campaigning-for-the-role-since-1884/ar-BB17Q4XQ