wuhan - coronavirus

[Amira]

17 minutes ago, Ausmumof3 said:

Yes I wondered about that.  Sadly in counties with poorer medical care those most vulnerable may possibly have already died from other causes.

Exactly.  It’s not a good reason at all that the median age is lower. 

[LMD]

5 minutes ago, Ausmumof3 said:

https://7news.com.au/lifestyle/health-wellbeing/us-tourists-in-quarantine-in-the-barossa-valley-after-ten-test-positive-for-coronavirus-c-756036

10 out 18 US tourists in the Barossa have tested positive.  They came in before the 14 quarantine requirement.  This is the next council area to mine and where we usually go to church.  Lots of friends/family in the area.  Church was running in a modified format tomorrow but I suspect this will change that. 

 

Ah crap, right near my elderly dad and stepmother too...

We have a confirmed case in our nearby town as well.

[Ausmumof3]

1 hour ago, Monica_in_Switzerland said:

 

Maybe reading a book like Wild Swans with your teen could help with the distinction?  

Great idea!  I actually have it here and he’s been asking for books.  Might do it as assigned school reading.   We did a junior version of Maos last dancer but it was ages ago.  Might bring it out for the younger crew.  

[Ausmumof3]

3 minutes ago, StellaM said:

NSW health minister Brad Hazzard has told reporters that in hindsight, he would have waited for coronavirus test results first before letting passengers disembark.

One of the worst things about this crisis is that I do not trust the people in charge. 

And this is an example of why. 

Likewise the message regarding the Barossa tourists today.  Literally back to back sentences.  “There is no risk to the wider public at this time.  We are tracing times and locations where the tour group may have been”

[Ausmumof3]

It appears the US group have also been through the eastern states on the way to Adelaide.

the accommodation where they are staying has closed to everyone else so will probably have plenty of space for quarantining them adequately.

[Ausmumof3]

Meanwhile, an Adelaide aged care facility also confirmed on Saturday that one of its workers had tested positive.

"St Louis Aged Care was notified by SA Health on Wednesday, March 18, that an allied health worker involved in the treatment of residents at our nursing home in Parkside has since tested positive for COVID-10," the facility's statement read.

"The worker treated residents on Monday, March 16, and was not displaying any symptoms at the time.

"Protocals set by the relevant government and health authorities were immediately implemented upon notification and all residents treated by the allied health worker were isolated to their rooms."
 

[Ausmumof3]

https://headtohealth.gov.au/covid-19-support
 

Australian government provided website with mental health resources relating specifically to COVID-19

[Ausmumof3]

“Remember who you are:  Most people are good, kind, and sensible. They care for others and the environment and want to make the world a better place. These reflect important ‘values’. Stressful times can make it challenging to act in the way that is aligned with our values. But, even when feeling stressed, remember who you are, and what you believe in. Remember to be gentle, kind, and respectful to yourself and to others; other people are probably as stressed and worried as you are. By reaching out and supporting others you will not only be helping them, but also doing something that will help you to feel good about yourself.”

From the website 

 

[Arcadia]

“A Biogen employee who allegedly flew from Massachusetts to Los Angeles to China and then tested positive for COVID-19 is under investigation in China for concealing her symptoms and putting fellow travelers at risk, the Los Angeles Times reports.
http://nbcbay.com/Fsxr8DZ”

[Ausmumof3]

Shout out to this company Adelaide General and Commercial

https://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2020-03-21/suspend-the-rent-campaign-grows-amid-coronavirus-outbreak/12077640

they’ve suspended the rent for all small business tenants in their premises for three months and are trying to start a #suspendtherent campaign to encourage other businesses to do the same.

[Ausmumof3]

BNO: Spain reports 3,355 new cases of coronavirus and 233 new deaths, raising total to 24,926 cases and 1,326 dead

[Guest]

9 hours ago, mommyoffive said:

 

So do people think the US is going to be as bad as Italy?   Or do we think somehow we are going to do better.   I had thought I read somewhere we were 4-6 weeks behind Italy?

I don’t want to utter these words but I think it will be worse in the US than in Italy afa case load and number of deaths by percentage of population. I would say we are only 3-4 weeks behind Italy. There were still massive numbers of people here still not understanding this virus just a week ago. (At first, there was massive misinterpretation of school and activity closures, speaking just anecdotally, what I observed.) There are still wide swathes of people who believe....um, strange things...about this virus and are not accurately understanding the trajectory. Someone I know on FB was just yesterday asking if NY Governor Cuomo “can do math” because “there are only a thousand cases and he’s saying he needs 10,000 ventilators.” Obviously this is a person who does not understand what this could like like just a week from now. 

I look at the numbers every day and last night, looking at Italy, Germany, Spain, France, it just felt...dreamlike. Those numbers! Hundreds more deaths every day! Thousands new cases every day! It’s starting to be difficult to conceptualize it as people. People dying in isolation from a disease they never heard of a couple of months ago. 

I feel hopeless sometimes. 

[Bootsie]

6 hours ago, StellaM said:

So, can someone good with numbers help me understand this please?

The rate of diagnosed coronavirus in my state is doubling every 3-4 days. We're at just over 1000 diagnosed cases. 

Is it the number - 1000 - that matters more here, or the speed of doubling, or a combination? I mean, in terms of trying to estimate personal risk. 

I suppose my quesrion is, how can a person look at the numbers and estimate when risk of contracting coronavirus rises from low to moderate, and from moderate to high? Is it when we hit a certain number of cases (or alternatively and optimistically, the number of new cases falls), or is the doubling an indicator of changed risk in and of itself?

 

It is really the combination that is important.  In many places, while the speed of doubling is high, the number of cases is LOW relative to the number of people in the population.  The chart below shows doubling about every 3 days.  Even if the cases went form 1000 to close to 30,000 in 15 days and there are 20 million people in your state, the odds of a particular person have the virus at that point in time is about 0.15%  And if 15% of cases are critical/severe, that still leaves only a 0.02% chance that any particular person has a severe/critical case.  The concern is not so great on an individual level.  The concern is that the medical profession will be overwhelmed in treating those critical/severe cases.

Edited March 21, 2020 by Bootsie

[Carrie12345]

As needed as it may be, I was worried about the lifting of trucking regulations. Our area had its first driver-fell-asleep accident. A whole trailer of food burned.

I did my grocery pick-up last night. WM parking lot wasn’t as full as usual. Pick up was more full than usual, of course.  The people going inside were a combination of whole families with no precautions and lone men with gloves and masks. The associate who filled my car reported that pick-up customers are usually jerks, but they’re real nice now.

No coffee to be found.

Traffic on the road in my area was pretty much the same as usual, even though we’re supposed to be on “life-sustaining business” only.

 

[Pawz4me]

I'm surprised people are posting that we're two or more weeks behind Italy. Everything I've read says we're tracking about ten days behind them.

[Pen]

8 hours ago, StellaM said:

So, can someone good with numbers help me understand this please?

The rate of diagnosed coronavirus in my state is doubling every 3-4 days. We're at just over 1000 diagnosed cases. 

Is it the number - 1000 - that matters more here, or the speed of doubling, or a combination? I mean, in terms of trying to estimate personal risk. 

I suppose my quesrion is, how can a person look at the numbers and estimate when risk of contracting coronavirus rises from low to moderate, and from moderate to high? Is it when we hit a certain number of cases (or alternatively and optimistically, the number of new cases falls), or is the doubling an indicator of changed risk in and of itself?

 

 

Please don’t quote any personal information parts below: 

I am not sure that you can assess your personal risk well from those numbers.  Though if I were trying, I’d probably take something like the official number times ten (as closer to likely real number) as the number you use, and realize it will be more or less doubling every 4 days or so. 

Though real life is far more complicated, I think If you do try to use numbers, you are going to have to look at it as something like a Rolling dice or drawing card from deck sort of analogy  For each exposure being like one dice roll or one card draw of whether you will encounter CV19 or not (and separate issue is whether you would catch it even if you did encounter it).  If there are 100 cases and a population of 1200 (I know that’s ridiculous but I wanted example to be easy) and none of the cases is isolated, but rather is out going same places as you, then each time you go out it is sort of like rolling a pair of dice.  Will you come up with your losing combination on that outing (roll of dice) or not?

[(cut)]

 I would tend to look first of all at your own city and the places you are going, rather than your state.

By analogy, I think if figures are available for New York City, the risks for someone who lives or works in the city are  very different than for someone living in some rural part of the New York state with as yet zero cases. And even the risks within NYC can be different for a dense high rise area in Manhattan versus a small more working class community area out at the edge of the ocean in Queens borough.  I think the same would apply in Australia. (And while your city is probably still well behind NYC, I think it too will probably be far riskier than some remoter part of your state. No absolute guarantee of that— in Italy some small towns got hit hard early, while Rome was still fine.) 

Second, I would look at your particular exposures  and thus personal risk in that regard. 

 

No K students is a help as is wearing protection while on transportation. And as much as you can while working.  Nonetheless it seems to me from what you have described that your personal risk remains relatively high compared to the average in your city. 

In my state within USA, part of what led schools to be closed, at least for awhile was that they were having staffing trouble as some teachers / staff (enough for impact) were not going to work.  

Is there any possibility of organizing with others to try to help achieve similar where you are?

 Is there any way to use your own leave days strategically to try to help this situation?  To try to be part of what moves them into shutting down schools?  

Or Maybe not gone all week, but two days at first, for example?  Perhaps to use the leave days you have to significantly cut down numbers of days you go in perhaps fitting what you notice as times you have the most exposures and hope that by time you have no more leave days, they will have decided to close?  Maybe letting them know you are feeling too unwell to go in but will do what you can by online delivery?

Are you calling your elected officials and voicing your concerns?   Writing letters to editor? Talking to union leaders if any? Etc.? 

Edited March 21, 2020 by Pen

[Pen]

For someone who wanted articles for a relative?

 

https://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-they-call-it-the-apocalypse-inside-italys-hardest-hit-hospital-11960597

 

https://www.vox.com/future-perfect/2020/3/20/21179040/coronavirus-us-italy-not-overreacting

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2020/03/19/im-an-er-doctor-coronavirus-is-already-overwhelming-us/

 

other people probably have more to contribute 

and more have been posted upthread

 

Edited March 21, 2020 by Pen

[Pen]

25 minutes ago, Pawz4me said:

I'm surprised people are posting that we're two or more weeks behind Italy. Everything I've read says we're tracking about ten days behind them.

 

https://www.vox.com/future-perfect/2020/3/20/21179040/coronavirus-us-italy-not-overreacting

 

some useful graphs and discussion

(to me it looks like 10 days or so... and based on already moved into overwhelm reports from New York, less in some places.  And my area of one is just a few days away probably. But US is larger country so maybe 2 weeks for nation as a whole due to larger population.) 

Edited March 21, 2020 by Pen

[gardenmom5]

am I the only one who is watching the numbers as percent of population?  the link has critical cases vs total cases vs new, etc., but also how many per million of population.

Switzerland is a tiny country, but like Italy - they're also over 700/1M cases per  population.  (2dd was supposed to go to a friend's wedding in Switzerland in May - I'm skeptical she's going to be making that trip. - or that I'll be going to play with the baby.)

 

[Pen]

6 minutes ago, gardenmom5 said:

am I the only one who is watching the numbers as percent of population?  the link has critical cases vs total cases vs new, etc., but also how many per million of population.

Switzerland is a tiny country, but like Italy - they're also over 700/1M cases per  population.  (2dd was supposed to go to a friend's wedding in Switzerland in May - I'm skeptical she's going to be making that trip. - or that I'll be going to play with the baby.)

 

 

I’ve been watching the percent per population column since Worldometer.info put that on the chart.

You are Merely “skeptical” about Switzerland trip in May?  You sound like a great optimist! 

Edited March 21, 2020 by Pen

[Bootsie]

Know what to make of the Italian statistics is difficult.  If we increased cases at a rate of 27% per day in US we would be at the percent of population infected about equal to that of Italy.  Not only has the rate of infection in Italy been high, but the number of severe/critical cases and deaths have also been high.  Even if you do not want to compare that to questionable Chinese numbers, the numbers in Italy look much different than they do in South Korea which early on was an area of high concern.  Also, the majority of Italy's cases are in the Lombardy region.  Even though many people fled to the other areas of Italy as the lockdown was being announced, these other areas have not seen the same kind of spread that Lombardy has.  

[livetoread]

   
I, too, have been watching Switzerland. You don’t hear about them, but they are being hit so hard.

[Selkie]

I read an interesting theory about the role that Italy's multigenerational households may play in the spread of the virus. Many young adults in Italy live under the same roof as their parents and grandparents, and they also often travel into the cities for work and socializing. The speculation is that young adults have been catching the virus while in the cities, then bringing it home and spreading it to the rest of their households - many of whom are/were frail and elderly.

Sorry if this has already been discussed. Yesterday was busy and I wasn't able to keep up with this thread.

[Pen]

56 minutes ago, StellaM said:

@Pen, I do appreciate your patient advice, even if I sound a bit flippant.

I know I shouldn't be working in a school right now, and should be at home.

But there's no money otherwise.

I am still taking my Vit D 🙂

 

I think you are in a really and truly difficult situation.

 

I know local to me the powers that be didn’t want to shut down schools — but did so due to pressure of letters from voters, parents, some staff  (other teachers/  staff were still telling kids the “CV19 is less bad than flu, no big deal, all media hype” line) and increasing difficulty with teachers staying home and substitutes not wanting to go in.  

 

It really did seem to make a difference.

 

Glad you are taking your vitamin D!!!  Don’t forget your A, K2, E to go with it if dosing high 🙂

[Bootsie]

16 minutes ago, Selkie said:

I read an interesting theory about the role that Italy's multigenerational households may play in the spread of the virus. Many young adults in Italy live under the same roof as their parents and grandparents, and they also often travel into the cities for work and socializing. The speculation is that young adults have been catching the virus while in the cities, then bringing it home and spreading it to the rest of their households - many of whom are/were frail and elderly.

Sorry if this has already been discussed. Yesterday was busy and I wasn't able to keep up with this thread.

There is also much intergenerational living in South Korea, with many people traveling between densely populated Seoul and the outer regions.  While I haven't been able to find statistics on the differences in intergenerational living, South Korea has had a very different outcome.

[HeartString]

I found this on thus difference between S. Korea and Italy. It seems like it comes down to early and wide spread testing. S.Korea also has some ways of monitoring those in self quarantine that might not fly every where.  
 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.aljazeera.com/amp/news/2020/03/italy-south-korea-differ-tackling-coronavirus-outbreak-200313062505781.html

[BusyMom5]

https://www.kansascity.com/news/coronavirus/article241376141.html?fbclid=IwAR3FsvtQ6G7V2fpCFMmaflgDyBqfeF9R9dPKUMqj8fPvO6fvPYpku6m82Dk

This article discusses rural issues, lack of hospitals,  resources, ect.  Rural areas also have s larger elderly population.   I know we would need to drive an hour to the local hospital- and its z small rural one, few ventilators, low bed count.  Normally they transfer anyone with serious issues.  That hospital serves several counties.

[Arcadia]

@mathnerd

https://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/coronavirus/santa-clara-county-stockpiling-supplies-ahead-of-massive-testing-increase/2259085/

“Santa Clara County is running a stockpile drive for medical equipment as healthcare workers prepare to handle large numbers of patients when novel coronavirus testing begins ramp up in the region.

...

At a news conference Friday outside the Santa Clara Valley Medical Center in San Jose, Silicon Valley Leadership Group CEO Carl Guardino said that a call for supplies and cash the previous day led to total donations of about 171,300 surgical masks, 4,000 pairs of gloves, 2,000 bottles of hand sanitizer, 2,000 hazmat suits, 1,200 respirators and $596,551 in cash. 

But that won't be enough, and the county's health system needs more supplies, officials said Friday. 

Specifically, medical staff is in need of face shields and surgical masks, gowns, gloves, and sanitizing wipes, among other items.

A full list of needed supplies can be found at https://vmcfoundation.org/covid19list/.

By Friday afternoon, there were eight deaths from the COVID-19 coronavirus disease and the number of confirmed cases in Santa Clara County had reached 196.”

[Joker]

Do we know what the truly mild symptoms are? It seems like many of the wealthy/celebrities say they have really no symptoms but are positive.

I'm just curious because I started with a sore throat and bad headache last week (which I've seen many recently mention as symptoms) them I had two days with an uncomfortable tickle in my chest. Never had that before. Now it's still a tickle when I take a breath but not as bad. I also have been coughing but not constant, just more than normal. I don't know if I've ever had fever but I also honestly can't remember the last time I did as I normally don't get one. It just seems like there isn't a lot of info about the really mild cases and some things I've read recently have me wondering. 

[mommyoffive]

3 hours ago, Quill said:

I don’t want to utter these words but I think it will be worse in the US than in Italy afa case load and number of deaths by percentage of population. I would say we are only 3-4 weeks behind Italy. There were still massive numbers of people here still not understanding this virus just a week ago. (At first, there was massive misinterpretation of school and activity closures, speaking just anecdotally, what I observed.) There are still wide swathes of people who believe....um, strange things...about this virus and are not accurately understanding the trajectory. Someone I know on FB was just yesterday asking if NY Governor Cuomo “can do math” because “there are only a thousand cases and he’s saying he needs 10,000 ventilators.” Obviously this is a person who does not understand what this could like like just a week from now. 

I look at the numbers every day and last night, looking at Italy, Germany, Spain, France, it just felt...dreamlike. Those numbers! Hundreds more deaths every day! Thousands new cases every day! It’s starting to be difficult to conceptualize it as people. People dying in isolation from a disease they never heard of a couple of months ago. 

I feel hopeless sometimes. 

 

I agree with you sadly.

[mommyoffive]

11 hours ago, SeaConquest said:

 

I am still getting emails from every single summer camp, claiming that they will go on and asking us to continue making our payments.

 

Yeah, I don't get that.  I am too.   I wonder when they will decide to close?  Some of these camps are in areas with SIP right now.  I know that may not happen in June, but still.  Life is not what it was a month ago.   This will still be there in June.  I don't know where on the curve we are going to be, but most likely a lot higher than now.  Our state has a ban on gatherings of more than 10 people, schools closed.  How do they think summer programs can even run?   And would we feel ok even sending our kids?  

[Arcadia]

@Pen@Quill

https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/world/coronavirus-covid19-army-joins-production-line-ventilator-makers-12563620
“COVID-19: Army joins the production line as ventilator makers scramble to meet demand in Italy

(Updated: 21 Mar 2020 10:06PM)

ZURICH: On Mar 6, Gianluca Preziosa, the head of an Italian ventilator maker, received an urgent request. The Italian authorities wanted his help for an all-out effort to meet a desperate need for ventilators.

Now, his Bologna-based company, Siare Engineering International Group srl, has 25 army technicians working with its production supervisors to manage the expanded production and help assemble machines. The army also has made personnel available to the company’s suppliers, Preziosa said.

"Usually we produce 160 machines a month. The goal is to produce 2,000 in four months, so more than triple our monthly production," Preziosa told Reuters in an interview. The executive added that companies involved in the supply chain of producing ventilators "cannot respond to the enormous demand because this is a niche industry".

Siare belongs to a normally quiet corner of the medical equipment market that has found itself on the front line of the century’s biggest health crisis caused by the rapid spread of the new flu-like virus, which can lead to breathing difficulties and pneumonia in severe cases.

Ventilator makers are under pressure to sharply increase production even as the pandemic has disrupted the transport and supply of crucial parts, such as hoses, valves, motors and electronics – some of which come from China, the original epicentre of the outbreak that has killed more than 10,000 people across the globe.

Amid shortages, governments are turning to help from the military, enlisting other manufacturers and even looking to 3D printing in the hopes of ramping up production of the potentially life-saving breathing machines.

In Italy, a team of doctors has developed a way to provide oxygen to two people from one ventilator, therefore doubling capacity, according to the Italian region of Emilia Romagna’s commissioner for coronavirus.”

[Pen]

16 minutes ago, Joker said:

Do we know what the truly mild symptoms are? It seems like many of the wealthy/celebrities say they have really no symptoms but are positive.

I'm just curious because I started with a sore throat and bad headache last week (which I've seen many recently mention as symptoms) them I had two days with an uncomfortable tickle in my chest. Never had that before. Now it's still a tickle when I take a breath but not as bad. I also have been coughing but not constant, just more than normal. I don't know if I've ever had fever but I also honestly can't remember the last time I did as I normally don't get one. It just seems like there isn't a lot of info about the really mild cases and some things I've read recently have me wondering. 

 

I’ve been reading descriptions of symptoms from people who have it.  Can be nothing. Can be like what you describe. Can seem like a cold. 

[Pen]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/w3csym38

BBC Science in Action programs related to CV19 

👍

 

[Pen]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/w3csym38

science in action: Are You Carrying the Virus?

 

@Arcadia @Quill @Ausmumof3 @lewelma @mathnerd @regentrude @square_25  

Or tag at  any of you with engineering oriented family or acquaintances 

The end of radio program is a section on ventilators  and a crowd sourcing request for people to come together— people with design ideas, people who know what’s needed medically in the field, manufacturers with capacity to make them or parts etc

Edited March 21, 2020 by Pen

[PrincessMommy]

22 minutes ago, Pen said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/w3csym38

science in action: Are You Carrying the Virus?

 

@Arcadia @Quill @Ausmumof3 @lewelma @mathnerd @regentrude @square_25  

Or tag at  any of you with engineering oriented family or acquaintances 

The end of radio program is a section on ventilators  and a crowd sourcing request for people to come together— people with design ideas, people who know what’s needed medically in the field, manufacturers with capacity to make them or parts etc

listening now.  It is very informative.   The Italian Dr. in England "No one ever won a war by building new hospitals, we need to build up our weapons - testing and..."  I can't remember the last one.  

[JadeOrchidSong]

9 hours ago, Ausmumof3 said:

I am trying to have a conversation with my teen that emphasises that I dislike the way the Chinese government handled this while respecting the Chinese citizens who have suffered and fought and particularly the doctors who were brave enough to speak out.  Hard to get the right distinction here because both my dh and son tend to just hear China - bad.  On the other hand the Chinese government seems very keen to make any criticism of the communist party a racial issue rather than a political thing.  I hope I’m doing it right.

When the general population in China believed since day 1 that this virus was brought over to harm China, when I was kicked out of a China chat group for speaking against this assumption, when now three months into this plague the Chinese official openly blamed the US army and every average Chinese believes and hates America, when the American donations were taken with no gratitude on the Chinese part, it is OK for Americans to lump them all together, and I say this with a heavy heart exactly because my own family in China are exactly among those believing lies and hating Americans. 

I do not blame your dc and your dh AT ALL. It is almost hard to distinguish the Chinese government and the Chinese people at this point. 

[SeaConquest]

https://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-experts-say-new-symptoms-could-be-loss-taste-or-smell-11961439

 

News you can use: 30% of people testing positive lose their sense of smell, even if otherwise asymptomatic. UK NHS (correction: not NHS, but a British medical society of nose doctors) is recommending self-quarantine if you lose your sense of smell.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited March 21, 2020 by SeaConquest

[mlktwins]

1 hour ago, Joker said:

Do we know what the truly mild symptoms are? It seems like many of the wealthy/celebrities say they have really no symptoms but are positive.

I'm just curious because I started with a sore throat and bad headache last week (which I've seen many recently mention as symptoms) them I had two days with an uncomfortable tickle in my chest. Never had that before. Now it's still a tickle when I take a breath but not as bad. I also have been coughing but not constant, just more than normal. I don't know if I've ever had fever but I also honestly can't remember the last time I did as I normally don't get one. It just seems like there isn't a lot of info about the really mild cases and some things I've read recently have me wondering. 

I'm responding to this just so you know you aren't alone!  I haven't had a sore throat, but had a headache in my forehead (middle part) for 3 days.  I get bad sinus headaches, but those are usually on the right side at the temple.  I've also had a little tickle in my throat and very occasional coughing.  Better in the morning and worse as the day goes on.  I've been a bit freaked out to be honest having read how the symptoms are all over the place.  I've been home since Sunday night with my DH and 2 boys so at least we are quarantined.  If one of us has it, we will all have it at this point because we are a close family.  I don't think I've had a fever, but not sure.  I am feeling better today!  Allergies are also bad with tree pollen here.  I'm trying to eat healthy, take my vitamins and drink lots of water.

With symptoms like this, unless they test, we will not know if we have/had it unless we get much worse.  Sorry you are going through this too!

[SoCal_Bear]

This is helpful for those in your circles who just can't process the math. I don't know how you can make it any more obvious.

 

[mellifera33]

WA Gov. Inslee's press briefing last night seemed more off-the-cuff than usual. He suggested threatening teen who are congregating with being written out of the will, and encouraged old ladies to stop going to sewing needle clubs (or something similar. DH and I were actually giggling at this point and missed some of the particulars.)

 

[Pen]

2 hours ago, PrincessMommy said:

listening now.  It is very informative.   The Italian Dr. in England "No one ever won a war by building new hospitals, we need to build up our weapons - testing and..."  I can't remember the last one.  

 

He said “quarantine”

At our stage that may mean lockdowns/shelter in place until / unless testing can correctly tell who needs to be quarantined. 

He gave the example of town of 3000 where every single person was tested and every single positive person quarantined (might have been Vo, don’t think he said name, so maybe there’s somewhere else). 

But if “freedom” to be tested or not is a right in our society — and it seems like even if coming in from o/s or on cruise ship with known cases many people are refusing to get tested, Then  even if we get high capacity and inexpensive and fast turnaround tests, if people don’t get tested even when highly suspect situations exist, or if we cannot get enough tests to do large populations (as compared to a town of 3000) then lockdowns are pretty much all we have got. 

Edited March 21, 2020 by Pen

[Jean in Newcastle]

8 minutes ago, mellifera33 said:

WA Gov. Inslee's press briefing last night seemed more off-the-cuff than usual. He suggested threatening teen who are congregating with being written out of the will, and encouraged old ladies to stop going to sewing needle clubs (or something similar. DH and I were actually giggling at this point and missed some of the particulars.)

 

I think that he's trying hard to keep from going to lockdown.  He wants the effect of a lockdown - no unnecessary contact with others - but still voluntary.  But unfortunately, while I think a good chunk off the populace is being responsible, there are those who aren't getting it either on purpose ("la-la-la, I can't hear you!") or because they truly don't really understand. 

[Garga]

1 hour ago, JadeOrchidSong said:

When the general population in China believed since day 1 that this virus was brought over to harm China, when I was kicked out of a China chat group for speaking against this assumption, when now three months into this plague the Chinese official openly blamed the US army and every average Chinese believes and hates America, when the American donations were taken with no gratitude on the Chinese part, it is OK for Americans to lump them all together, and I say this with a heavy heart exactly because my own family in China are exactly among those believing lies and hating Americans. 

I do not blame your dc and your dh AT ALL. It is almost hard to distinguish the Chinese government and the Chinese people at this point. 

I believe you, but I do want to share a story.

We have hosted Chinese exchange students for a few summers. 

I asked one of them on Instagram how he was faring and he is fine. He asked us how we are. I told him that we’re in a sort of lock down, in that our state has shut most businesses.

He asked if we had face masks and I told him no and he insisted on sending me some.  He has bought them and is mailing them to me.

So, while I believe what you’re writing, I also know that there are Chinese people who don’t completely hate Americans.  Perhaps he doesn’t like “Americans” as a whole, but he is doing his best to take care of the Americans he knows personally.

 

[Jean in Newcastle]

Regardless of how the virus started, it is here now and the entire world needs to deal with it.  I don't think that blame really helps us at this point.  I also don't think that blaming Asians in general or Chinese in particular is helpful to our society.  We have a very large Chinese population here and I knew back when the reports were first coming from Wuhan that we would get it eventually.  It's just the nature of a global economy etc. that wasn't shut down by any government until way too late.  I don't have a problem calling it COVID19.  I see absolutely no benefit from calling it the Wuhan Virus or Chinese Virus.  It doesn't make people safer.  It doesn't make people better.  And it has led to some discrimination and violence.  (Some of Asian descent have been targets in places and there were social media rumors not to go to Chinese markets here early on with absolutely no proof that anyone was actually ill.  Now of course, we all have to have social distancing etc. regardless of our race or ethnicity.) 

What matters is working together.  What matters is education.  What matters is helping others - giving blood, offering practical assistance, observing the social distancing rules and just simply being kind. 

[kbutton]

4 hours ago, Carrie12345 said:

As needed as it may be, I was worried about the lifting of trucking regulations. Our area had its first driver-fell-asleep accident. A whole trailer of food burned.

It might be more than just the long hours. I hear they are suffering from a lack of places to have a meaningful break--rest areas shut down and truck stops not allowing showers, etc. 

I know PA has opened up some rest areas with port a pots, but I think at least half are still shut down.

[Pen]

1 hour ago, mellifera33 said:

WA Gov. Inslee's press briefing last night seemed more off-the-cuff than usual. He suggested threatening teen who are congregating with being written out of the will, and encouraged old ladies to stop going to sewing needle clubs

 

😳

(Vent warning ⚠️)

State of Emergency.

 Why entreat or beg parents to make probably idle threats?   Make clear they are breaking law and enforce it. 

😼 Jail.  The teens or partying college students etc etc  can enjoy much social closeness while quarantined together in holding cells packed as tight as they seem to enjoy being in beach pictures. (and get notations on permanent records, and maybe lose scholarships if any )  Pending hearings in court after the epidemic is over. 🤨

(Similar for terns deliberately coughing on store goods, or old folks (whether ladies or gentlemen, let’s not be sexist) refusing to keep social distance rules for elective activities )

 

and let them know if they do get sick they will be last priority for scarce hospital resources 😖💩

Edited March 21, 2020 by Pen

[Pen]

13 minutes ago, kbutton said:

It might be more than just the long hours. I hear they are suffering from a lack of places to have a meaningful break--rest areas shut down and truck stops not allowing showers, etc. 

I know PA has opened up some rest areas with port a pots, but I think at least half are still shut down.

 

Sounds like more letter writing and calls —  like truck stops and rest areas need to be essential services ... 

How can citizens possibly help? 

[kbutton]

Just now, Pen said:

Sounds like more letter writing and calls —  like truck stops and rest areas need to be essential services ... 

How can citizens possibly help? 

I think the re-opening of some in PA is the result of calling and testing.

Maybe disaster-relief shower trailers at rest stops? 

I think the problem is cleaning. They are closing rest stops so that people don't have to clean them and probably so others won't feel as free about traveling. 

[Arcadia]

41 minutes ago, Garga said:

He asked if we had face masks and I told him no and he insisted on sending me some.  He has bought them and is mailing them to me.

We know people working in FoxConn China and they were given plenty of masks for family use by their employer.