wuhan - coronavirus

[Janeway]

13 minutes ago, TCB said:

I have a hard time with all this because it is personal to me. I work in ICU. I am dreading what we may have to see. I can't help but think that anything we do to try and keep things manageable in any way is a good thing. I might feel differently if I knew that I would just be staying at home for the duration. It might seem less worth it to me. Who knows what affect the health system being over whelmed will have on the mental health of those who are working there. 

I have been wondering if, there will be a time in the near future where we will have a bunch of people who already have it so now they do not have to worry about getting it, what, if anything, they can do to help? Like...I know they would not be trained extensively, but couldn't a crash course show people how to do basic things that would need to be done in a hospital setting? In war time, long ago, nurses would be put in hospitals and front lines just weeks after starting. I know a lay person could not handle the high technology stuff, but maybe do enough to lift some of the burden from the highly trained nurses and such? Just an idea.

[prairiewindmomma]

If you aren’t concerned, why are you staying home? Why aren’t you out supporting local businesses? 
 

Several of dh’s coworkers have come down with it. Most are mostly recovered at this point. We joke it is their civic responsibility to go out for the elderly once they are fully recovered. (On a sad note, some are currently hospitalized.) 

Do you just not know someone personally affected by this. Because honestly, it is deeply offensive.

[Terabith]

3 minutes ago, square_25 said:

Do we know how long immunity lasts yet? That's also relevant. 

Not that it's necessarily relevant, but other coronaviruses immunity lasts about a year.  

[TCB]

1 minute ago, Janeway said:

I have been wondering if, there will be a time in the near future where we will have a bunch of people who already have it so now they do not have to worry about getting it, what, if anything, they can do to help? Like...I know they would not be trained extensively, but couldn't a crash course show people how to do basic things that would need to be done in a hospital setting? In war time, long ago, nurses would be put in hospitals and front lines just weeks after starting. I know a lay person could not handle the high technology stuff, but maybe do enough to lift some of the burden from the highly trained nurses and such? Just an idea.

I think that there are a number of things that they could do to make things generally easier. If they find that immunity lasts then this could be a way of easing the burden. From what I've been reading about the lack of PPE there may well be a large amount of healthcare workers in this category. It's frightening though, because I've heard that the deaths of healthcare staff may be due to the high viral load they are exposed to and that seemed to happen to those wearing hazmat suits and proper masks. I wonder what it's going to be like here with the minimal protection a lot of healthcare workers have access to. 

[Arcadia]

OT, Crosspost

“For as long as schools are closed, we're open. Starting today, kids everywhere can instantly stream an incredible collection of stories, including titles across six different languages, that will help them continue dreaming, learning, and just being kids. 

All stories are free to stream on your desktop, laptop, phone or tablet. 

Explore the collection, select a title and start listening. 

It's that easy.”

https://stories.audible.com/start-listen

ETA:

 

https://www.zdnet.com/article/audible-to-provide-free-audiobooks-for-children-teens-during-covid-19-pandemic/

“The Amazon-owned company said all titles were carefully selected by Audible editors to "offer a mix of education, entertainment, and general-interest titles."

Audiobooks are available in six languages -- English, Spanish, French, Italian, German, and Japanese.” 

Edited March 20, 2020 by Arcadia

[Arctic Bunny]

3 minutes ago, Arcadia said:

OT, Crosspost

“For as long as schools are closed, we're open. Starting today, kids everywhere can instantly stream an incredible collection of stories, including titles across six different languages, that will help them continue dreaming, learning, and just being kids. 

All stories are free to stream on your desktop, laptop, phone or tablet. 

Explore the collection, select a title and start listening. 

It's that easy.”

https://stories.audible.com/start-listen

US only? The Canadian site doesn’t  seem to be offering the same deal.

[Arcadia]

Just now, arctic_bunny said:

US only? The Canadian site doesn’t  seem to be offering the same deal.

No idea. It just launched so could be US only for now.

[Arctic Bunny]

Summary of actions taken by Canadian provinces so far.

[Shoeless]

20 minutes ago, Janeway said:

I have been wondering if, there will be a time in the near future where we will have a bunch of people who already have it so now they do not have to worry about getting it, what, if anything, they can do to help? Like...I know they would not be trained extensively, but couldn't a crash course show people how to do basic things that would need to be done in a hospital setting? In war time, long ago, nurses would be put in hospitals and front lines just weeks after starting. I know a lay person could not handle the high technology stuff, but maybe do enough to lift some of the burden from the highly trained nurses and such? Just an idea.

 

One thing they can do is donate blood, so that therapies can be created using their antibodies. 

https://www.jci.org/articles/view/138003?fbclid=IwAR0QArpOV7fNNcH0XI6MXtwYusKLELNIbZHJDAPRnetp5keXdHbpLHgTXPA#.XmwUcEl7hZs.facebook

[J-rap]

Change of subject...  Is anyone taking in someone else during this period of isolation?  We're planning to invite an extended family member to come live with us during this time, someone who lives alone who we're worried about.   We'll need to set guidelines that we've committed to ourselves, mostly regarding social distancing.  I'm not sure if this person will accept our invitation, but we hope so.  

[TravelingChris]

3 hours ago, Pen said:

Some worldometer.info news jumping out at me:

•  5322 new cases and 427 new deaths in Italy. Italy's death toll surpasses China's, becoming the country with the highest number of coronavirus deaths in the world [source] [source]
  •  
  • Italian army trucks form a long line in the center of Bergamo to transport the coffins from the Bergamo cemetery to cremation sites in other regions, as morgues can't cope with more coronavirus deaths [source and video]
  • Obituaries in the local newspaper went from 1.5 pages (on Feb. 9) to 10 pages (on March 13)  [source and video]

•  3308 new cases and 193 new deaths in Spain. [source]. A 37-year-old Spanish civil guard with no underlying health conditions has died of coronavirus yesterday. He had been admitted to the Quirón hospital in Alcorcón (Madrid) for several days before being admitted to the ICU a few days ago [source]

Of course, China lies.  It just opened up another COvid19 hospital in Beijing.  It isn't over in China at all.  They have just stopped reporting it.  And they lied about initial death rates too.

[mommyoffive]

7 minutes ago, TravelingChris said:

Of course, China lies.  It just opened up another COvid19 hospital in Beijing.  It isn't over in China at all.  They have just stopped reporting it.  And they lied about initial death rates too.

 

I wish that China would be 100% honest about everything so that the world could learn from them.   

[PrincessMommy]

8 minutes ago, J-rap said:

Change of subject...  Is anyone taking in someone else during this period of isolation?  We're planning to invite an extended family member to come live with us during this time, someone who lives alone who we're worried about.   We'll need to set guidelines that we've committed to ourselves, mostly regarding social distancing.  I'm not sure if this person will accept our invitation, but we hope so.  

no, but I do continue to babysit my grandchildren and have added another grandchild into the mix.  And, my daughter's fiance is dividing his time between his apartment and our house.  Not exactly the same as what you are thinking of doing.   I think that is lovely, BTW.  

[Ausmumof3]

The Ruby Princess cruise ship arrived in Sydney yesterday after completing a short cruise around the Pacific to New Zealand.

   

Several passengers developed flu-like symptoms and the doctor on board did 13 patient swabs for COVID-19, of which three returned positive results.

 

   Supplied

 

NSW Health Minister Brad Hazzard says authorities are asking all of the 2,700 passengers to go into self-isolation.

   
i actually can’t believe they let people come in without self isolation!  So flipping ridiculous at this point.  I’m back to feeling frustrated at the number of stupid mistake that have been made over and over.

Edited March 20, 2020 by Ausmumof3

[Ausmumof3]

Abc:

Californian Governor Gavin Newsom has issued a statewide "stay-at-home order" directing residents to leave their homes only when necessary during the coronavirus pandemic.

He said that modelling had shown that 56 per cent of California's residents, or over 25 million people, were expected to contract COVID-19 over the next eight weeks, requiring nearly 20,000 more hospital beds than the state could currently provide.

Mr Newsom earlier on Thursday (local time) asked US President Donald Trump to send a Navy hospital ship to the port of Los Angeles "immediately" as the state braces for the expected surge.

He said Los Angeles, as the country's second-largest city, would likely be "disproportionately impacted" by the pandemic in the coming weeks.

California has been among the hardest hit US states, with more than 1,000 confirmed COVID-19 cases and at least 18 deaths.

[Ausmumof3]

this virus had cancelled naplan for this year - one good thing in all the crazy

[Terabith]

6 minutes ago, Ausmumof3 said:

The Ruby Princess cruise ship arrived in Sydney yesterday after completing a short cruise around the Pacific to New Zealand.

   

Several passengers developed flu-like symptoms and the doctor on board did 13 patient swabs for COVID-19, of which three returned positive results.

 

   Supplied

 

NSW Health Minister Brad Hazzard says authorities are asking all of the 2,700 passengers to go into self-isolation.

   
i actually can’t believe they let people come in without self isolation!  So flipping ridiculous at this point.  I’m back to feeling frustrated at the number of stupid mistake that have been made over and over.

Can't believe people got on a cruise with this going on.

[TravelingChris]

1 hour ago, happysmileylady said:

I think that we, as a people here, have to recognize that we already have an acceptable level of death.

And how willing are we to change that acceptable level before we destroy our world economy.  How many deaths will the coming recession/depression cause and are we willing to add that to the baseline suicide rate, in order to save people from corona virus?  If 1.5 million people die this year due to suicide (vs the 800k on average) is that worth saving 2 million from CV?

I am not suggesting that I have that answer.  I am saying that all the real policy makers and people at the WHO and CDC....these are things that they are really thinking about.  

Where are you getting this doubling of suicide rate???? If one thing we do know about suicide rates is that they decline with true emergencies.  Also, one of the benefits that I see with this crisis is that telehealth is happening in a big way including mental health.  Lots of people are discussing mental health of everyone in this crisis.  But one thing is sure to tank the reserves of people--- people like you deciding that all of us chronically ill are not important.  Because as you well know, many, if not most of us on this thread are either chronically ill people who are at higher risk or have family members who are or most likely both.  Neither you nor I will be making life or death decisions---- it will be left to medical staff and the national policies which, for once, all parties seem to be in much agreement- Republican, Democrat and libertarian,  and that is amazing,  and except for a few oddballs and outliers--- no one responsible is saying let everyone die from Covid19..  ANd in another thread here as to why we care about it, I said that even if you don't care about dying or think you won't die- having life long lung damage doesn't seem like a great result.

[J-rap]

11 minutes ago, PrincessMommy said:

no, but I do continue to babysit my grandchildren and have added another grandchild into the mix.  And, my daughter's fiance is dividing his time between his apartment and our house.  Not exactly the same as what you are thinking of doing.   I think that is lovely, BTW.  

I read the post where you talked about everyone you're looking after!  WOW!!

[J-rap]

2 minutes ago, Thatboyofmine said:

Not taking her in, but doing things for my neighbor.  Picking up things at the store, visiting, taking food over.   I would for others, but honestly don’t really know many people here.  Our house is too small to bring someone else in. 

I love hearing things like that.  Thank you!

[TravelingChris]

Oh in my state, Alabama, the governor must have looked at the same photo I saw this morning- one of throngs of spring breaker's partying on an Alabama beach-- because first, she closed all public and private beaches.  Then later on this afternoon- she said all business with over 25 employees must close unless an essential business.  All restaurants and bars with food service have to move to carry out or delivery only.  All companies need to istitute social distancing in the workplace.  There will be more guidelines about that and manufacturing lines tomorrow.  I think the most of the automotive manufacturers already closed (at least for cleaning).  I have not heard about chicken processors, which are major suppliers of chicken to the US.  

 

Someone asked up thread about potential changes--- much quicker adoption of more fully automated factories and certain other workplaces.

[Pen]

@Terabith was it your daughter(s) with concern about mental health/ suicide?

and also where you were considering taking in a child of s critical services worker?

If so, perhaps instead you could take in someone who needs a place and would be companionship for your daughter(s) ???

There are for example lots of kids who age out of foster care and may be finding getting going on their own in these circumstances extremely hard.

 

[Terabith]

6 minutes ago, Pen said:

@Terabith was it your daughter(s) with concern about mental health/ suicide?

and also where you were considering taking in a child of s critical services worker?

If so, perhaps instead you could take in someone who needs a place and would be companionship for your daughter(s) ???

There are for example lots of kids who age out of foster care and may be finding getting going on their own in these circumstances extremely hard.

 

I do have concerns about my daughter's mental health.  Wasn't so much thinking of taking in child of critical services worker as babysitting for them; their kids are pretty young, but they don't need help they said.  I don't want to just randomly take in a kid I don't know, and our house is NOT laid out in such a way that it is conducive to doing so.  

[Terabith]

1 minute ago, square_25 said:

It sounds like such a hard situation for you :-(. 

Do you think reaching out towards public school friends might actually be helpful, or will just make her feel worse? I assume they just felt awkward and disappeared :-/. 

I suspect that's a big part of it and not malice.  They're teens and just pretty much full of their own lives.  But, at 16, I can't make social contacts or set up play dates, real or virtual.  I don't even have contact information for the people she hung out with.  She's doing okay right now.  I'm just not sure that she'll do well long term with this.  

[Paige]

1 hour ago, square_25 said:

Can you just answer my question about HOW MANY people this virus is going to kill, using current models, assuming lack of treatment?? This is why people are freaking out, because the numbers dwarf other numbers. 

It's not just the number of people it will kill, but also the number who need critical care for weeks and recover. If approximately 20% of those infected need hospitalization, that is a tremendous burden on families, hospitals, insurance companies, uninsured, the economy, etc. That doesn't even consider the possibility of disability after people have recovered and the long term health costs. 

I don't know why we have had a policy of mitigation instead of suppression and elimination. We should be trying to wipe it out like smallpox. It's not something we want coming back in a slightly different form every year, hoping our annual vaccine is a match. It's much worse than the flu.

Edited March 20, 2020 by Paige

[LMD]

45 minutes ago, TravelingChris said:

Oh in my state, Alabama, the governor must have looked at the same photo I saw this morning- one of throngs of spring breaker's partying on an Alabama beach-- because first, she closed all public and private beaches.  Then later on this afternoon- she said all business with over 25 employees must close unless an essential business.  All restaurants and bars with food service have to move to carry out or delivery only.  All companies need to istitute social distancing in the workplace.  There will be more guidelines about that and manufacturing lines tomorrow.  I think the most of the automotive manufacturers already closed (at least for cleaning).  I have not heard about chicken processors, which are major suppliers of chicken to the US.  

 

Someone asked up thread about potential changes--- much quicker adoption of more fully automated factories and certain other workplaces.

 

Dh went to work this morning. He works in a chocolate factory. They had people in full protective gear testing temperatures before they were allowed onsite. Enforced social distancing in break rooms. Most of the office staff stayed home. Otherwise, business as usual for the floor staff. They already have a good cleaning regime - being food production.

I know it's a different country (Aus), just thought it was interesting.

I also got a call from one of our elders, church services are cancelled.

[Pen]

26 minutes ago, Terabith said:

I suspect that's a big part of it and not malice.  They're teens and just pretty much full of their own lives.  But, at 16, I can't make social contacts or set up play dates, real or virtual.  I don't even have contact information for the people she hung out with.  She's doing okay right now.  I'm just not sure that she'll do well long term with this.  

 

I’m not sure that’s entirely true.  In cases with kids who have ASD or FASD (etc) I do still see parents making social arrangements for kids.  Stage seems more important than calendar years. 

In any case I am glad she is doing okay now.  Maybe she will surprise you and pull out some strengths you did not know she had. 

 

[Paige]

17 minutes ago, square_25 said:

Well, how are we going to eliminate it? The reason smallpox could be eliminated is because immunity lasts a long time. Things for which immunity lasts a year aren't nearly as amenable to vaccines. And we don't even know if we get a year here. 

I'm not an epidemiologist but a virus needs a host. If you get the Rho down to 0-1, it will exhaust itself. The problem, like with smallpox, is you'd need to do that globally, but it would be a lot easier if everyone acted like South Korea rather than us. You'd have to be proactive, be looking for it, and do extensive contact tracing and quarantines whenever it popped up so you could prevent the spread as much as possible. 

The longer it lasts in the wild, the harder that gets. It may be too late, but it wasn't too late in February. 

[Terabith]

10 minutes ago, Pen said:

 

I’m not sure that’s entirely true.  In cases with kids who have ASD or FASD (etc) I do still see parents making social arrangements for kids.  Stage seems more important than calendar years. 

In any case I am glad she is doing okay now.  Maybe she will surprise you and pull out some strengths you did not know she had. 

 

Yeah, but she's my neurotypical kid.  Just has anxiety that seems to be related to noise.  Even my kid with ASD has been making her own social arrangements for several years, but she's pretty high functioning.  

[Pen]

1 hour ago, square_25 said:

Can you just answer my question about HOW MANY people this virus is going to kill, using current models, assuming lack of treatment?? This is why people are freaking out, because the numbers dwarf other numbers. 

 

It can’t be precisely answered, obviously, because it is, as they say, “fluid” with rapidly changing developments and the course of what happens depends hugely on human actions as well as the virus itself and other potentially unpredictable factors, as well as nature.

 

Very, very broadly, you could assume that 40-60% of earth’s population will get it.  18% will get cases bad enough to not be able to survive without medical intervention. Assuming medical system gets basically wiped out, instead of just a death rate of 1% who die despite excellent medical care, We’d be looking at something around, say, 15% case fatality rate.  

There will be other indirect deaths as well—perhaps more of some types of deaths (things that are other problems that can’t get care from overwhelmed medical system, for example) and fewer of others (perhaps fewer vehicle crash deaths given less driving) because of changed circumstances. 

But anyway the fear of an out of control, curve not flattened situation guesstimate could  be something like, very, very, very roughly with fairly easy numbers: 7billion population x 50% x 15% .      Or take 7- 7.5 billion population estimate x 30% x 5% for a lower ballpark guesstimate. 

[Arcadia]

https://abc7news.com/health/grand-princess-passengers-in-quarantine-refuse-covid-19-tests/6029729/

“Grand Princess cruise passengers in quarantine refuse COVID-19 tests at Travis AFB

SAN FRANCISCO (KGO) -- The ABC7 News I-Team has confirmed that a majority of passengers from the Grand Princess who are quarantined at Travis Air Force base are refusing to be tested for coronavirus.

Their release is just days away.

After 21 passengers and crew aboard the Grand Princess tested positive for coronavirus, the rest of the passengers were quarantined off the coast of San Francisco for five days, then went into quarantine at Travis Air Force Base in Fairfield for 14-day; it ends next week. But, the Grand Princess passengers are ready to go home and that's one big reason why two-thirds of them are refusing to be tested for coronavirus.

86-year-old Carmen Kilcullen spoke with the I-Team by phone about why she's declining the test. "We didn't know for sure when we would get the results, in case results came in later, we'd have to stay."

Carmen and her 84-year-old husband, Larry, lost their house in the 2017 Tubbs Fire and they can't wait to get back to their new home.

In this notice to "all quarantine residents" at Travis, they were given "the opportunity to be tested for COVID-19. You are not required to be tested. It will be your choice."

Only 300 of the passengers at Travis took the test; 545, including the Kilcullens, refused.

Dan Noyes: Aren't you interested in knowing your status? Your coronavirus status for sure?"

Carmen Kilcullen: "Well, we don't have any symptoms. They take our temperature, the medics take our temperature twice a day and we have- everything's normal."

"There is a potential risk especially if someone is positive or is carrying the virus and has no symptoms," says ABC7 News medical expert Dr. Alok Patel.
Patel says much uncertainty surrounds the coronavirus and that its incubation period could be longer than the 14-day quarantine. "We've also seen people have no symptoms and still test positive. And this is really tricky because we're still trying to figure out how long these asymptomatic people could still spread the infection."
In a video from Travis AFB quarantine, Alan Brast told the I-Team, As you can see, Dan, this is our room."

Grand Princess passengers Alan and Fran Brast of Danville agreed to be tested, and expect the results back any time now, well before they're set to leave quarantine this coming Tuesday.

"We definitely want to know ether or not we're putting anyone else at risk, and want to make sure we are protecting our family and friends and anybody else we cone in contact with," said Brast. "To us it was important to know what the score is."

Dr. Patel tells us that no one can force the passengers to get tested at this point, but that could change if the crisis worsens. Meanwhile, other states like Florida are allowing Grand Princess passengers to quarantine at home, very frustrating to the passengers at Travis AFB we spoke with today.”

[Pen]

13 minutes ago, Paige said:

I'm not an epidemiologist but a virus needs a host. If you get the Rho down to 0-1, it will exhaust itself. The problem, like with smallpox, is you'd need to do that globally, but it would be a lot easier if everyone acted like South Korea rather than us. You'd have to be proactive, be looking for it, and do extensive contact tracing and quarantines whenever it popped up so you could prevent the spread as much as possible. 

The longer it lasts in the wild, the harder that gets. It may be too late, but it wasn't too late in February. 

 

Afaik, It still isn’t too late.  But people have to act sensibly.

Not like college kid party hearty doofuses On the Beach. 

[Pen]

3 hours ago, happysmileylady said:

I think that we, as a people here, have to recognize that we already have an acceptable level of death.

And how willing are we to change that acceptable level before we destroy our world economy.  How many deaths will the coming recession/depression cause and are we willing to add that to the baseline suicide rate, in order to save people from corona virus?  If 1.5 million people die this year due to suicide (vs the 800k on average) is that worth saving 2 million from CV?

I am not suggesting that I have that answer.  I am saying that all the real policy makers and people at the WHO and CDC....these are things that they are really thinking about.  

 

Where have you gotten your figures? 

“In 2018, there were 48,344 recorded suicides, up from 42,773 in 2014, according to the CDC's National Center for Health Statistics (NCHS).”  According to guru google. 

 

I would not be surprised if suicide rates were to go up in a health crisis, and would guess that health care workers staring so much death in the face might be particularly prone to it— doctors already tend to have high suicide rate.

 

[Pen]

21 minutes ago, square_25 said:

Yeah, that's about the calculation I did :-). 

 

3 minutes ago, Pen said:

 

Where have you gotten your figures? 

“In 2018, there were 48,344 recorded suicides, up from 42,773 in 2014, according to the CDC's National Center for Health Statistics (NCHS).”  According to guru google. 

 

I would not be surprised if suicide rates were to go up in a health crisis, and would guess that health care workers staring so much death in the face might be particularly prone to it— doctors already tend to have high suicide rate.

 

 

So if one takes the rough CV19 % guesstimates  and applies that for US population rather than world and compares to ~50,000 US suicides (even if that doubles rather than maybe some of the depressed people doing better in crisis), the numbers aren’t even close to being a same rough equivalent as @happysmileylady suggested—do you agree?

[Pen]

https://foreignpolicy.com/2020/03/18/america-united-states-lockdown-coming/

an interesting first person opinion piece, I thought. 

[Pen]

44 minutes ago, Terabith said:

Yeah, but she's my neurotypical kid.  Just has anxiety that seems to be related to noise.  Even my kid with ASD has been making her own social arrangements for several years, but she's pretty high functioning.  

 

I am not sure that the degree of depression tendency and noise sensitivity would be considered “neurotypical”.

[Pen]

6 minutes ago, square_25 said:

Are you asking me? Yeah, that’s the point I was making. too. We agree here.

She was using worldwide suicide stats, I think.

 

She was Comparing worldwide suicide rates to a projected USA CV19 mortality rate?  🤔 sounds like an oops. 

[mathnerd]

This thread scrolls so fast! I first read about the use of Chloroquine several pages ago on this thread. I am posting again about it here because there have been some successes and there is optimism that this could be the answer. It is also something that many 3rd world countries in Asia and Africa can easily use when C-19 hits them as they have plenty of Chloroquine as an antimalarial.

https://www.fiercepharma.com/pharma/bayer-preps-u-s-donation-malaria-med-chloroquine-to-help-covid-19-fight-report

https://www.connexionfrance.com/French-news/French-lab-Sanofi-hypothetically-offers-millions-of-doses-of-potential-Covid-19-Plaquenil-anti-malaria-drug

https://www.wired.com/story/an-old-malaria-drug-may-fight-covid-19-and-silicon-valleys-into-it/

 

[Melissa in Australia]

3 hours ago, mommyoffive said:

 

I wish that China would be 100% honest about everything so that the world could learn from them.   

Quite frankly I think that China was way more open about Coronavirus than USA has been

[Pen]

I heard from someone irl that Vanderbilt University has 44 students Positive for CV19– just a personal communication.  May be incorrect.  Maybe a sleuth on here will figure out whether true or not.  

If true I wonder if they were spreading it at the beach scene. 

[Ausmumof3]

2 hours ago, square_25 said:

Well, how are we going to eliminate it? The reason smallpox could be eliminated is because immunity lasts a long time. Things for which immunity lasts a year aren't nearly as amenable to vaccines. And we don't even know if we get a year here. 

Yes would that mean a yearly vaccine like for flu and trying to figure out which strain?

[Ausmumof3]

Stephen McDonell (BBC correspondent In Beijing)

In #China for the second day in a row official #coronavirus figures have registered zero new home-grown infections. There are claims on Chinese social media that patients are being treated but not tested any more. It’s a difficult thing to prove either way.

[Ausmumof3]

https://mobile.twitter.com/florian_krammer/status/1240432285184405505
 

Only a pre-print but steps towards being able to test for antibodies 

[LMD]

10 minutes ago, StellaM said:

 

Your dh's workplace is doing 200% more than schools are doing. 

No temp tests. No social distancing. All staff have to be at school unless they have a sick note. Cleaning is a bottle of detergent and a cloth and DIY.

 

 

He said that by the end of the day the social distancing went from 4 to a table, to 2 to a table - which they delineated using placemats... that no one bothered to disinfect between usage 🙄 

So, they're doing something but it's debatable how effective it will be.

The private schools around here are all closing from today onwards.

I cannot fathom trying to teach, disinfect and implement social distancing in a classroom. Impossible.

[Ausmumof3]

10 minutes ago, StellaM said:

 

NSW government can get f*cked, as can anybody who decided now was a great time to take a short cruise.

I'm sorry for the language, but I am so angry.  I get home from watching not a single recommedation being implemented in schools to protect the health of staff and students. and find out some people decided in the last few weeks to go on a cruise.  I believe a majority are Australian residents. Does anyone think there's any supervision of the supposed isolation? Not bloody likely. 

I can cope with coronovirus. I cannot cope with stupidity and incompetence.

I’m not one to use language but I had pretty much the same thoughts.  Plus why the heck were they not told to self isolate when they disembarked.  I thought that was the new rule.  

[Ausmumof3]

7 minutes ago, LMD said:

 

He said that by the end of the day the social distancing went from 4 to a table, to 2 to a table - which they delineated using placemats... that no one bothered to disinfect between usage 🙄 

So, they're doing something but it's debatable how effective it will be.

The private schools around here are all closing from today onwards.

I cannot fathom trying to teach, disinfect and implement social distancing in a classroom. Impossible.

Yes.  Anyone who can afford to pull kids out and stay home is pulling kids out here.   They may as well say that schools actually don’t exist for the well being of the kids and families but to enable more adults to be economically contributing units.  
 

[Ausmumof3]

Just now, StellaM said:

 

Everyone's given up trying to do anything other than hand washing reminders (the soap's running out!) You cannot keep small children 1.5m apart in a small classroom. It's physically impossible. There is nothing to disinfect with! The cleaners, whose contracts have been cut to the bone so that they barely have time to run a vacuum over the carpet, cannot clean properly overnight.

Yes, it's one rule for our betters, another for the plebs.

The friend I helped today is hoping they stay open because her kid has autism and she can’t cope with him all the time and all the usual supports like OT are drying up because the OT has a sore throat and has to stay home.  But he has eczema now from the amount of hand washing they are doing - probably worse because he’s very sensory.  
 

the school here (Unley High) that has had a teacher and a student infected is still staying open because supposedly the student wasn’t at the school while infectious.

[Ausmumof3]

For DH at work there’s a tonne of stuff for office workers - work from home, Skype meetings but literally no extra protections for field workers at all.  They are in a field that definitely puts them at higher risk.

[Ausmumof3]

1 minute ago, StellaM said:

 

Do they have protective gear ? 

I actually don't understand why the unions haven't called for a walk out of at-risk workers working without protection. It's criminal.

Nope.  They may have some p2 masks for dust and they have gloves but the Kevlar type not disposables.

[Ausmumof3]

3 minutes ago, StellaM said:

 

Personally, I think schools should stay open for a very limited number of families - children in families where both parents are health care workers, children from single parent homes where the parent cannot work from home, and children with special needs, if the environment can be made safe for them, and safe for staff. There should be a maximum of ten children to a room. 

I think these schools, which will be offering childminding and not education, should be staffed by teacher and OOSH volunteers, who are low risk. These teachers should be paid well above their normal salary for the time they work in these schools, and they should be supported with health training and protective gear.

Everyone else should be working from home, and if the staff member is available for work, but they cannot be on campus and cannot be supplied with work from home duties, they should be paid on at least 50% of their usual wage until they are able to return to at-school duties safely.

Chances of this happening?  Low.

Yes I agree.  Even if school was made optional for a while to reduce crowding that would help and also enable teachers to pay better attention to hand hygiene.