Difficult to hold my tongue

[Annie G]

14 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

I think if you were to ask dss if I love him as much as ds he would laugh and say, 'why no.'  And I don't think it has harmed him.  I mean, my step dad loves me, he is good to me, I am in his daily life more than his bio daughter....but I would never DREAM to think he loves me as much as her.  

I brought two daughters into this marriage and some friends  who have known me for years don’t know that dh isn’t the girls’ bio dad. We don’t hide it, it’s just not a topic that comes up. My girls call both dh and their father ‘dad’.  My middle dd has a much closer relationship with dh than she has with me.   I don’t think it’s that unusual to love these bonus kids as much as a bio one.

It’s worth considering that dss might be eating to cope with his feelings. Don’t assume because he seems happy that he is happy.  People often hide their true feelings and hide what they[re really going through because confronting their feelings is more than they are ready to face. Think about how after people commit suicide their friends or family say they had no idea the person was struggling. I’m NOT saying your dss is suicidal. nope. Not at all. I’m saying that he might be struggling but not even realize how much his emotions are impacting his diet. and the rest of his life, too.  

I’m just suggesting that it might be more complicated than simple willpower over diet.

[hippiemamato3]

47 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

I think if you were to ask dss if I love him as much as ds he would laugh and say, 'why no.'  And I don't think it has harmed him.  I mean, my step dad loves me, he is good to me, I am in his daily life more than his bio daughter....but I would never DREAM to think he loves me as much as her.  

 

This is probably the saddest thing you've ever posted.

[Scarlett]

43 minutes ago, jdahlquist said:

I grew up in a household where lunch was rather light and dinner was a big meal (in terms of the number of calories, the expense of the food eaten, and the complexity of preparation).  At times I have needed to flip that thinking into a larger meal earlier in the day, especially if my kids were away from home the majority of the evenings in a week or going through a huge growth spurt.  Especially my teen son appreciates a large meal earlier in the day; if he waits to consumer a larger meal in the evening he is ravenous all day long.  I also found that what I thought of as traditional "lunch foods" had to be consumed in such large quantities for my son, that it was often more expensive for him to eat them than what at first blush appeared to be a more expensive "dinner" meal.  

If you traditionally eat a heavier meal in the evening than at lunch, could you consider rearranging that and see if it addresses some of the concerns?

I prefer the bigger lunch smaller supper. Unfortunately most of us aren't home for lunch.  I do try to arrange to have good leftovers so whoever is home can eat that. ,

[Scarlett]

11 minutes ago, hippiemamato3 said:

 

This is probably the saddest thing you've ever posted.

And that fact you think this is sad just explains so much to me about the disconnect.  I am good with you not understanding my family.  

[hippiemamato3]

Just now, Scarlett said:

And that fact you think this is sad just explains so much to me about the disconnect.  I am good with you not understanding my family.  

 

I don't understand your family. I don't understand how you can feel so much loathing for your stepson and his weight issues and still claim to be a good stepmother. While you may love your son "best," it shouldn't be funny to you that your stepson would have no hesitation in saying that. It's really sad. 

[StephanieZ]

May I suggest, gently . . .

that the judging going on in this thread is really making my stomach hurt!

Scarlett TITLED her thread "difficult to hold my tongue" -- clearly indicating that 1) she was biting her tongue and 2) knows that's the best thing to do.

If someone came on here upset about their 17 year old vaping. Or their 18 year old having promiscuous unsafe sex. Or their 22 year old drinking and driving. Or ANY number of other self-destructive behavior among their adult (or close to adult) child, I'm guessing she'd be met with sympathy about how hard it is to love people who are making bad choices.

And sympathy for  . . . how hard it is to let go of responsibility for protecting our kids who we've devoted the better part of our hearts and lives to for decades.    

. . . and for how hard it is to let go of the personal pride we take in our kids' appearances and accomplishments  

Parenting is HARD, and, IME, much, much harder with adult kids. We have to learn, we have to grow, and we need support from the greater sisterhood of other mothers.

Chill, guys. Be nice. Reread your comments and be nicer. Maybe go ahead and delete your mean ones. For reals. 

None of us are perfect moms. Stop beating Scarlett up for not being the "perfect" mom who never judges, never compares, never even MINDS watching her kid eat himself to death. 

 

[Scarlett]

14 minutes ago, hippiemamato3 said:

 

I don't understand your family. I don't understand how you can feel so much loathing for your stepson and his weight issues and still claim to be a good stepmother. While you may love your son "best," it shouldn't be funny to you that your stepson would have no hesitation in saying that. It's really sad. 

I have no loathing for my step son.  None.  Not a bit.  I also don't think I have claimed to be a good step mom.  I probably have failed, I don't know.  But I am doing the best I can.  I am good with my efforts and motives.  Thankfully you aren't my judge.  

[Scarlett]

19 minutes ago, StephanieZ said:

May I suggest, gently . . .

that the judging going on in this thread is really making my stomach hurt!

Scarlett TITLED her thread "difficult to hold my tongue" -- clearly indicating that 1) she was biting her tongue and 2) knows that's the best thing to do.

If someone came on here upset about their 17 year old vaping. Or their 18 year old having promiscuous unsafe sex. Or their 22 year old drinking and driving. Or ANY number of other self-destructive behavior among their adult (or close to adult) child, I'm guessing she'd be met with sympathy about how hard it is to love people who are making bad choices.

And sympathy for  . . . how hard it is to let go of responsibility for protecting our kids who we've devoted the better part of our hearts and lives to for decades.    

. . . and for how hard it is to let go of the personal pride we take in our kids' appearances and accomplishments  

Parenting is HARD, and, IME, much, much harder with adult kids. We have to learn, we have to grow, and we need support from the greater sisterhood of other mothers.

Chill, guys. Be nice. Reread your comments and be nicer. Maybe go ahead and delete your mean ones. For reals. 

None of us are perfect moms. Stop beating Scarlett up for not being the "perfect" mom who never judges, never compares, never even MINDS watching her kid eat himself to death. 

 

 

I love tha video.  And this one

 

[EmseB]

2 hours ago, DawnM said:

 

Wow.  That is just really, really unfortunate.  The fact that you think that is normal and laugh worthy speaks volumes.  It really does.

It IS normal. Her SS has a mother in his life. Scarlett is not his mother. She did not adopt her SS, nor should she. She is a different figure entirely to him than she is to her bio son. Her SS has a bio mom in his life. He was living with her until very recently.

Loving someone in a different capacity (even less than) your own child is normal in a situation where you are, in fact, not the mother of this other child. 

That is part of the reason why blended families are so tricky, especially when the kids are older and have established relationships with both parents. If Scarlett had been on the scene when her SS was a baby and adopted him because his mother was out of his life, that would be totally different. That would be a "I love them both the same" scenario.

Scarlett can't win because the same people pointing out that this is not her concern and she needs to step away, detach, and stop being irritated by any of it because she's not his mother...are also saying that she's a horrible person because she doesn't love her SS the same as if she was his bio mom.

[DesertBlossom]

I haven't read all the replies... but I can somewhat understand your frustrstion. We just spent the last year living with my dad, who is an overweight Type 2 diabetic with some pretty serious food addictions. The whole situation was a lot more emotionally taxing than I could have anticipated. On the one hand, he's a grown man who can make his own choices. Except when I was the one doing the grocery shopping (with him paying) it was hard to find that balance between helping and enabling bad behavior. With his money do I buy the package of cookies or "forget" them?

One example, I like to add a couple tablespoons of heavy cream to my diet coke and when my dad (who can drink 2-3 2-liters of diet coke daily) discovered my trick he went through 2 PINTS of heavy cream in 24 hours. I about died. It's like an entire days worth of calories. I had to start hiding things or just not buying them at all.

It's hard. I get it. It's hard to watch someone make unhealthy choices but sometimes it's completely pointless to try to intervene because they will do what they want.

 

[TechWife]

54 minutes ago, DesertBlossom said:

 

One example, I like to add a couple tablespoons of heavy cream to my diet coke

 

Off topic -

I've never heard of doing this - is it a regional thing? I can't wrap my mind (or my taste buds) around this. What does it do to the taste of the drink? Does it affect the carbonation (like pop all of the bubbles when it's added)?

[Lady Florida.]

4 hours ago, DesertBlossom said:

 

One example, I like to add a couple tablespoons of heavy cream to my diet coke and when my dad (who can drink 2-3 2-liters of diet coke daily) discovered my trick he went through 2 PINTS of heavy cream in 24 hours. I about died. It's like an entire days worth of calories. I had to start hiding things or just not buying them at all.

 

 

 

3 hours ago, TechWife said:

 

Off topic -

I've never heard of doing this - is it a regional thing? I can't wrap my mind (or my taste buds) around this. What does it do to the taste of the drink? Does it affect the carbonation (like pop all of the bubbles when it's added)?

I don't know about diet coke and heavy cream but I understand the basic idea. When we lived in New Jersey I used to love egg cream. It has no eggs or cream but is chocolate soda with milk. Basically it's seltzer, chocolate syrup, and milk. It tones down the carbonation a little but not a lot. It's really good. 

[DesertBlossom]

4 hours ago, TechWife said:

 

Off topic -

I've never heard of doing this - is it a regional thing? I can't wrap my mind (or my taste buds) around this. What does it do to the taste of the drink? Does it affect the carbonation (like pop all of the bubbles when it's added)?

I don't know. But it's magical.

[TechWife]

44 minutes ago, Lady Florida. said:

 

I don't know about diet coke and heavy cream but I understand the basic idea. When we lived in New Jersey I used to love egg cream. It has no eggs or cream but is chocolate soda with milk. Basically it's seltzer, chocolate syrup, and milk. It tones down the carbonation a little but not a lot. It's really good. 

Here we have "floats."

Root beer + vanilla ice cream = root beer float

Root beer + chocolate ice cream = brown cow

Any carbonated beverage can used, not just root beer, but it's the most common.

I wonder if the flavor is similar.

 

[Wheres Toto]

5 minutes ago, TechWife said:

Here we have "floats."

Root beer + vanilla ice cream = root beer float

Root beer + chocolate ice cream = brown cow

Any carbonated beverage can used, not just root beer, but it's the most common.

I wonder if the flavor is similar.

 

I was wondering if it would be like a root beer float too.  I LOVE root beer floats, but part of the love is the cold smoothness of the ice cream with the root beer.  I wouldn't think regular cream would be the same.  Wouldn't it mix with the soda more, rather than stay somewhat separate?

[moonflower]

It's an egg cream!  I had one in NYC when we went in my late teens.  Very tasty.  It is fully mixed.  It's like the stuff left at the end of your rootbeer float that you drink, only smoother and simpler and creamier.

[Frances]

1 hour ago, Lady Florida. said:

 

I don't know about diet coke and heavy cream but I understand the basic idea. When we lived in New Jersey I used to love egg cream. It has no eggs or cream but is chocolate soda with milk. Basically it's seltzer, chocolate syrup, and milk. It tones down the carbonation a little but not a lot. It's really good. 

Growing up in the Midwest people would sometimes mix equal parts Pepsi and milk, saying it tasted like root beer. I guess it’s not that different than a float after the ice cream melts.

[Carrie12345]

Only read the first few pages.

I get that people are aghast with how Scarlett communicates her feelings on this topic. It makes me uncomfortable too, and I've responded on that in the past. My hope is that it's a written form issue that doesn't "read" this way IRL, but who knows?

That said, I don't see how bringing SO MUCH conflicting and scatttered health advice is expected to fix that.  I understand that there's a delicate relationship to be navigate, and it probably would benefit from a willingness to learn more and understand better, but it's still a parent and a child, whatever the background. I cant wrap my mind around a parent being told to ignore a child's major health issue. I just can't !

I know there's a serious societal problem of mixing size and shame. Scarlett, I too worry that you come across to your step-son as shaming.  If that is the reality he's perceiving, then, yeah, probably doing more harm than good. But I really, really hate the idea that talking about and working on health, particularly with a child, but also overall, = shame.

I'm navigating tricky ground, too. It's hard. How it's handled mattters. But ignoring a minor child's crisis? I know. I'm speaking with some extreme feelings of my own right now, but I feel like that boils down to "I don't want to make you uncomfortable, so here's a potential lifetime of struggle for you. Good luck."

[Scarlett]

57 minutes ago, Carrie12345 said:

Only read the first few pages.

I get that people are aghast with how Scarlett communicates her feelings on this topic. It makes me uncomfortable too, and I've responded on that in the past. My hope is that it's a written form issue that doesn't "read" this way IRL, but who knows?

That said, I don't see how bringing SO MUCH conflicting and scatttered health advice is expected to fix that.  I understand that there's a delicate relationship to be navigate, and it probably would benefit from a willingness to learn more and understand better, but it's still a parent and a child, whatever the background. I cant wrap my mind around a parent being told to ignore a child's major health issue. I just can't !

I know there's a serious societal problem of mixing size and shame. Scarlett, I too worry that you come across to your step-son as shaming.  If that is the reality he's perceiving, then, yeah, probably doing more harm than good. But I really, really hate the idea that talking about and working on health, particularly with a child, but also overall, = shame.

I'm navigating tricky ground, too. It's hard. How it's handled mattters. But ignoring a minor child's crisis? I know. I'm speaking with some extreme feelings of my own right now, but I feel like that boils down to "I don't want to make you uncomfortable, so here's a potential lifetime of struggle for you. Good luck."

Right, I saw your other thread and I wanted to say I disagree with a parent ignoring serious weight gain. I didn't want to derail your thread though so I refrained from posting.  I do feel for you though.  When another parent has been involved and or continues to be it further complicates it. 

He came to our room last night after he got home from working at 11:15 and chatted about his evening.  He hasn't spent the night at his moms for about 6 weeks and he is going tomorrow bcause he has 3 days off in a row.  He told us all about his brothers (he is almost 22) latest less than great decisions.  I could see he is really beginning to understand that all the excuses made at the other house for bad behavior might not be legit.  We praised him for how hard he has worked at his job this summer and reminded him that sticking it out with a low level job often pays off in the end and who knows what this would lead to for him someday.  

Phe seems happy and relaxed to me.  Tired.....lol...washing dishes for 8 plus hours would make anyone tired.  

[maize]

He's a good kid Scarlett.

He's lucky to have you and your husband in his corner encouraging him.

[BeachGal]

3 hours ago, Carrie12345 said:

Only read the first few pages.

I get that people are aghast with how Scarlett communicates her feelings on this topic. It makes me uncomfortable too, and I've responded on that in the past. My hope is that it's a written form issue that doesn't "read" this way IRL, but who knows?

That said, I don't see how bringing SO MUCH conflicting and scatttered health advice is expected to fix that.  I understand that there's a delicate relationship to be navigate, and it probably would benefit from a willingness to learn more and understand better, but it's still a parent and a child, whatever the background. I cant wrap my mind around a parent being told to ignore a child's major health issue. I just can't !

I know there's a serious societal problem of mixing size and shame. Scarlett, I too worry that you come across to your step-son as shaming.  If that is the reality he's perceiving, then, yeah, probably doing more harm than good. But I really, really hate the idea that talking about and working on health, particularly with a child, but also overall, = shame.

I'm navigating tricky ground, too. It's hard. How it's handled mattters. But ignoring a minor child's crisis? I know. I'm speaking with some extreme feelings of my own right now, but I feel like that boils down to "I don't want to make you uncomfortable, so here's a potential lifetime of struggle for you. Good luck."

 

I agree with you about not ignoring the health issues. The younger generation is not expected to live as long as their parents largely due to health problems associated with diet and lifestyle. The statistics are sobering. We are already seeing increasing cases of aggressive, difficult-to-treat cancers rarely seen in 20 year olds that are strongly linked to diet (microbiome) as well as increasing rates of diabetes which wreaks havoc throughout the body.

What got us into this mess was years of faulty science and the hubris from the giant egos who could not analyze data very well and the profiteers who pushed it.

[katilac]

On 7/5/2018 at 5:57 PM, Ausmumof3 said:

Love my own son

care deeply for my step son.

The language is different.

1

 

The language is different, and that is fine. The feelings are different, and that is fine. 

I think that the idea that people in blended families all need to love each other or care for each other in the same way is very harmful, and puts a tremendous amount of unnecessary pressure on all sides. A stepparent is not the exact same as a biological parent, and that's just fine. Kids benefit from a variety of caring adults in their life. 

This isn't a case where the stepparent has adopted the child, or even been his main carer since a young age. Her dss got through most of his childhood before meeting Scarlett, didn't live with them until some point in his teens, and has a bio mom who is still a parent and still in his life.    

The fact is, if a blended family doesn't stay together (and about 60% to 70% don't), the stepparent rarely remains a parental figure of any kind, if they continue to see the child at all. Can you see how harmful that is if the child has been told they are exactly the same as a bio parent? They aren't. They have responsibilities toward their stepchildren, but not the same responsibilities. There's a reason the Brady Bunch killed off the first spouses.

  

[Pen]

I just heard another interesting to me piece of research related to “hunger “ where memory was shown to be significant by using people with amnesia.

If people who could not remember having eaten were presented with another full meal soon after eating a first full meal they ate it.

Whereas people who could remember recently eating would not usually eat  Another full meal soon after the first one. 

[Scarlett]

4 minutes ago, Pen said:

I just heard another interesting to me piece of research related to “hunger “ where memory was shown to be significant by using people with amnesia.

If people who could not remember having eaten were presented with another full meal soon after eating a first full meal they ate it.

Whereas people who could remember recently eating would not usually eat  Another full meal soon after the first one. 

I suspect this has something to do with people who 'forget to eat'.  I go both ways.....sometimes all I want to do is eat.  Other times I only remember when I feel lighthheaded.  

As a side note....a new gallon of whole milk is in the fridge sine Tuesday.  One glass has been drank.  Ds keeps forgetting to drink it.  I may just need to stop buying milk altogether.

[I talk to the trees]

16 hours ago, DesertBlossom said:

I don't know. But it's magical.

(Sorry Scarlett, gotta follow the derailment of your thread for a minute.) 

Agree x 1000. And if you like cream soda, you have to try it with a splash of cream. Oh....dang! Now I want a cream soda!

(Ok, back to the thread.) 

[PeachyDoodle]

5 hours ago, Danae said:

 

If there were something you could say that would actually help fix the problem, then not saying it, even if it was uncomfortable, would be unconscionable.  Do you think there is? 

This.

My concern here is that there is a lack of understanding of what binge eating is. And I could be totally wrong: maybe this young man does not have a problem with binge eating/compulsive overeating. But it seems that he may. If you don't have any experience with compulsive behaviors or suffer from them, it will be hard to know what he is going through.

Binge eaters do not eat because they have a disregard for their health. They don't do it because they just like to eat or because it's a bad habit. They do it because they have a COMPULSION to eat. Discussing the health implications of weight with a binge eater is as helpful as discussing it with an anorexic. It adds to the cycle of guilt and shame and knowing that you shouldn't keep eating -- which fuels the compulsion, which in turns fuels the suffering and shame. IT IS NOT HELPFUL.

Counseling would be of the utmost help, if he agrees to seek it. But understanding the psychological features of this compulsive behavior is the next best thing, and just about the only thing anyone else can do for a binge eater. 

[Scarlett]

7 minutes ago, PeachyDoodle said:

This.

My concern here is that there is a lack of understanding of what binge eating is. And I could be totally wrong: maybe this young man does not have a problem with binge eating/compulsive overeating. But it seems that he may. If you don't have any experience with compulsive behaviors or suffer from them, it will be hard to know what he is going through.

Binge eaters do not eat because they have a disregard for their health. They don't do it because they just like to eat or because it's a bad habit. They do it because they have a COMPULSION to eat. Discussing the health implications of weight with a binge eater is as helpful as discussing it with an anorexic. It adds to the cycle of guilt and shame and knowing that you shouldn't keep eating -- which fuels the compulsion, which in turns fuels the suffering and shame. IT IS NOT HELPFUL.

Counseling would be of the utmost help, if he agrees to seek it. But understanding the psychological features of this compulsive behavior is the next best thing, and just about the only thing anyone else can do for a binge eater. 

I would not describe him like that at all.  

[moonflower]

The basic vibe I get from these threads is that Scarlett thinks her DSS is obese because he eats too much, and maybe because he also doesn't exercise enough.

Then some people tell her that's not true, or that she shouldn't think or say or imply that.

Well, it is almost certainly true.  He is obese because he eats more calories than his body needs to perform the energy-requiring functions he does.  

But to stop there doesn't address the problem at all.  The question is not whether he eats too much.  It is why he eats too much - either why does he eat more calories than a person his size and activity level needs, or why does he eat foods that don't satisfy his hunger well enough to make him no longer hungry, or why does he eat when he's not hungry, or why is he always hungry, or why doesn't his body need the number of calories for which he hungers, or a million other whys.  

Scarlett can't answer the why, and neither can we.  A doctor might be able to or a psychologist might be able to or DSS might be able to or no one might be able to.  In the meantime, it's frustrating but also pointless to be astounded that he is still eating more calories than he needs.  Obviously either no one has figured out why he does this or no one has figured out how to fix his body/brain's compulsion to do this.  Shaming him for it - in fact mentioning it at all, unless he's asked you to as a part of fixing it (and even then I'd hesitate)  - is worse than pointless.  It's damaging because it suggests he has some control over the thing that he obviously has not figured out how to control (nor has his doctor or his psychologist).

[PeachyDoodle]

5 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

I would not describe him like that at all.  

You certainly would know better than I would.

FWIW, nobody who knows me well, including my husband whom I've been with for 25 years, would describe me like that either. It's not something you really share.

ETA: It's true of me, nonetheless. The secretive, personal nature is part of the disorder.

[Kassia]

1 hour ago, PeachyDoodle said:

You certainly would know better than I would.

FWIW, nobody who knows me well, including my husband whom I've been with for 25 years, would describe me like that either. It's not something you really share.

ETA: It's true of me, nonetheless. The secretive, personal nature is part of the disorder.

 

Yes, me too.  I'm a compulsive eater who binges regularly but no one would describe me that way since most of it's done in secret.  

It's a HARD battle.  I'm hungry most of the time and I have no idea why.  It might be physical or it might be psychological (or both) but it feels like real hunger to me and I experience it even when I *shouldn't* feel hungry (like after a meal).  Eating is a trigger for me - it just makes me want more.  Like an alcoholic with alcohol.  I'm sitting here hungry right now and  know I shouldn't eat any more tonight but don't know how I'll make it until morning without eating.  ?  

[Bluegoat]

On 7/5/2018 at 8:57 PM, DawnM said:

 

Wow.  That is just really, really unfortunate.  The fact that you think that is normal and laugh worthy speaks volumes.  It really does.

 

I don't find it weird at all.  I have a step-dad, since I was seven.  He is a good guy and has always done well by us, he was in many ways a more stable father than my own dad.  But I don't doubt that his feelings for my half-sister were different.  I was 12 when she was born, and I though it seemed pretty natural even at the time.  

 

[moonflower]

Many people in the US get mental health care for non-desperate situations.  Many don't.  It is expensive, is my understanding.

[PeachyDoodle]

11 minutes ago, StellaM said:

People can't get decent mental health care for their desperately ill children; I think it's beyond unrealistic to suggest that there's some mental health care out there for an otherwise OK-adjusted teen who eats too much. Maybe if you're wealthy.

It's covered by my insurance, same as any other mental health care, after our deductible. We are not anywhere close to wealthy.

[Pen]

13 minutes ago, PeachyDoodle said:

It's covered by my insurance, same as any other mental health care, after our deductible. We are not anywhere close to wealthy.

 

Sounds like you are fortunate to have excellent insurance coverage. 

 

[Pen]

Off topic but out of curiosity, @ PeachyDoodle Is that the Narnia book cover Lamp post?

[AmandaVT]

31 minutes ago, StellaM said:

What is ? Specialist counselling for teens with eating issues ? Lucky.

 

 

I believe that all ACA approved plans cover mental health now. If there's a counselor in the right area with a specialization in eating issues, it would be covered. I have a crummy marketplace plan and we only have a $25 copay for therapy visits. Part of my job entails determining benefits for people coming to our practice. I've never seen a plan that doesn't cover mental health treatments here.

[Pawz4me]

38 minutes ago, StellaM said:

What is ? Specialist counselling for teens with eating issues ? Lucky.

 

??

I’m pretty sure most insurance policies in the U.S. cover mental health care. It’s one reason so many here post recommending counseling for various situations. And eating issues are very common. I suspect most therapists have some experience in that area.  Still, it can be a challenge for any individual to find a therapist who is a good fit for them. 

[AmandaVT]

4 minutes ago, StellaM said:

 

But I hear people here all the time who can't find decent mental health care for their kids. What's up with that ? If not money, what are the access problems ? I assume those people are not fibbing. They've been pretty distressed over it, over the years.

 

My best guess is finding a therapist may be the tricky part. Insurance companies can set their allowable reimbursement rates and if the allowed rates are too low, therapists can decide not to contract with those companies, reducing the number of available therapists. We are lucky in VT that reimbursement rates are enough to make a living on, including Medicaid. I have heard in other states that many therapists (and dentists) cannot take Medicaid because they don't pay enough to even cover the cost of running an office. So, if Medicaid (or another insurance company) will only pay $30 for an appointment with a therapist, in state A, but $80 in state B, a therapist in state A will be much less likely to contract with them - or move to a neighboring state that pays better. We just had a therapist join our practice from a neighboring state and she was thrilled to learn that she's going to be earning between 25-30% more than she did in her home state from the same insurance companies. Cost of living is similar in both states too. 

If anyone reading is looking for a therapist and can't find one in their area, there are some good online options available now. 

https://www.mdlive.com/ 

https://amwell.com/ (my BCBS will pay for a visit with American Well. They have Dr's on call as well as therapists. I was able to skip a visit to urgent care this winter for a UTI and had a Dr's visit on my couch at 9pm on a Saturday night)

Talk Space This one is different because it's asynchronous. One of the therapists I work with also works with Talk Space and she loves it. This is therapy based on e-mails and texts. It's neat and can be very helpful, especially if you want someone to help you but don't have the time/ability to set aside time to meet in person or online. 

[Pawz4me]

1 minute ago, StellaM said:

 

Why do I constantly hear from US posters that mental health care - decent mental health care - is hard to access ? 

I don’t know? I’m here all the time and I’ve never had that impression. Or at least certainly not constantly. Sometimes—yes. Constantly—no.

[AmandaVT]

Adding on - if you (anyone that's reading and may find this helpful at some point) find a therapist and think the rates are more than you can afford, it doesn't hurt to ask for a sliding scale rate. Therapists go into the profession because they want to help people and as such, they can be very generous with their time when they are able. We have a number of cash pay clients in our practice, some pay as little as $20 a visit. If you have insurance with a very high deductible, you can ask if a counselor would be willing to see you as a cash pay client and ask about a sliding scale fee. They can't take on too many clients at such reduced rates, but many will take on some, as they can afford it. 

[Joker]

Access to mental health care doesn't mean one can afford it. We pay several hundred dollars a month, with insurance, for ds's therapy. His hospitalization years ago sent us to bankruptcy but we did it because it was necessary.

[freesia]

Also, Stella, some of access is where you are. Where we are, it is very accessible. For folks who are more rural or in a different area of the country, it is not as easy. 

[moonflower]

My impression was that there are not enough providers (esp in some places) for the number of people needing care.  So appts can take a long time to get, for non-acute issues.

[moonflower]

And of course, if you have $ you can afford to take off work, travel to a different city or part of the state, pay out of pocket of an out of network provider who does have an opening, pay cash for hours or services not covered by insurance, etc etc.

 

 

[katilac]

2 hours ago, PeachyDoodle said:

It's covered by my insurance, same as any other mental health care, after our deductible. We are not anywhere close to wealthy.

 

You're lucky! 

1 hour ago, Pawz4me said:

I’m pretty sure most insurance policies in the U.S. cover mental health care.  

 

 

There's coverage on paper, and then there's practical coverage. The reality is that any type of ongoing therapy is going to cost most families a tremendous amount of money. By ongoing, I mean more than four to six sessions. This is a short article that outlines some of the practical considerations: 

https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2017/11/29/567264925/health-insurers-are-still-skimping-on-mental-health-coverage

[GoodGrief]

6 hours ago, katilac said:

 

You're lucky! 

 

There's coverage on paper, and then there's practical coverage. The reality is that any type of ongoing therapy is going to cost most families a tremendous amount of money. By ongoing, I mean more than four to six sessions. This is a short article that outlines some of the practical considerations: 

https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2017/11/29/567264925/health-insurers-are-still-skimping-on-mental-health-coverage

 

Yes, that's exactly right. We have mental health coverage via military insurance, but, even in the huge urban area where my daughter resides, finding adequate care is a challenge, and ultimately we paid out of pocket for a therapist and psychiatrist who were able to provide the care she required.

As someone else stated, not all therapists/physicians accept insurance, and those who do take insurance may not participate in the common government plans. Typically the mandatory hoops are onerous and the reimbursement is often lower than the standard charge.

Therapists vary considerably in their personalities and areas of expertise. Finding a good fit is no small thing even with resources to pay.

Waiting lists for therapists, even in urban areas, can be lengthy. We waited six months to get my daughter into the place that ultimately helped her. That was not the only waiting list she was on. At one specialty clinic, there wasn't even a waiting list. One was required to call in randomly to see if another patient had dropped out, thus creating an opening. No lie. And we were so desperate, I was calling that place all the time (ultimately with no luck.)

"Getting help" of the right sort is frequently a monumental task.

[Carrie12345]

7 hours ago, StellaM said:

 

But I hear people here all the time who can't find decent mental health care for their kids. What's up with that ? If not money, what are the access problems ? I assume those people are not fibbing. They've been pretty distressed over it, over the years.

 

My mental health copay is $170 with a many thousand dollar individual deductible. I think that's closer to the norm these days than a $25 copay.

Mine used to be $70 with a $500 individual and $1500 family.  It was amazing, and we were able to move practices and therapists until we found the best fits.  I would have put my cat in therapy if it had been allowed, lol.

Our "best fits" are no longer in the region, so it's back to square one and rice and beans if an issue is severe enough.

The hardest (imo) department of mental health care is the most life threatening and dramatically debilitating issues. Finding care for disordered eating or moderate depression TENDS to be (not always, of course) much easier than, say, suicidal tendencies or severe personality disorders.  Specialists are limited, facilities are limited, an individual's rights are an enormous component, and there's a whole other (limited) billing and coverage system for that type of need/care.  I don't like the idea of "grading" mental health issues but, yeah, the families in the most distress TEND to be the ones with the most trouble getting adequate help.

[Carrie12345]

17 hours ago, Danae said:

 

If there were something you could say that would actually help fix the problem, then not saying it, even if it was uncomfortable, would be unconscionable.  Do you think there is? 

I wrote a long response yesterday that I apparently didn't send @@. But I didn't specify *saying* something.  In fact, in my own situation, I posted that I *wasn't* going to say anything right now.  That doesn't have to mean ignoring the problem. 

[Guest]

11 hours ago, PeachyDoodle said:

It's covered by my insurance, same as any other mental health care, after our deductible. We are not anywhere close to wealthy.

Not for everybody, though. I’m sure you are aware of that. 

The last time I accessed mental health care under my insurance, there was a way to have some things covered. I was able to get a few months of counseling, but only after I was able to “prove” that it was necessary. I had to go to multiple doctor appointments while they decided that, yes, I did appear to be struggling with depression. I was also covered for some medications for a period of time, maybe a year. 

And that was a better insurance plan than my current one. I haven’t checked recently; it is possible that they cover less. 

[PeachyDoodle]

10 hours ago, StellaM said:

What is ? Specialist counselling for teens with eating issues ? Lucky.

 

I'm not a teen, so I can't say for sure. I don't have any reason to think that it would be covered for me and not my 13yo.

It's not CHEAP. But that's not really the point. It does exist. That some people have trouble getting mental healthcare for eating disorders in the US or elsewhere doesn't mean that it's "beyond unrealistic" to expect that it's available. It may very well be unrealistic for this family. I have absolutely no way of knowing that.

Regardless, I have no interest in a healthcare debate. My point in this thread has always been that it's possible, even likely, that this young man has an eating disorder IRRESPECTIVE OF THE FACT THAT HE SEEMS OTHERWISE "WELL-ADJUSTED". The reality of this disorder is that people who have it cannot deal with their feelings (most especially their feelings about themselves and their bodies), and they self-medicate with food, usually at least some of the time in total secrecy. People, even well-meaning ones, who suggest that these folks are otherwise well-adjusted but just eat too much are only reinforcing the cycle of guilt and shame that the compulsive eater is under and will only make it worse. 

I cannot diagnose this young man. I couldn't even if I'd met him a dozen times in person and I certainly can't over the internet. I'm only saying -- because no one else has, that I've seen -- based on my own personal experiences as the overeating-but-otherwise-well-adjusted-yet-still-100+-lbs-overweight teen: There may be something else going on here. And I've provided resources that shouldn't cost more financially than gas to make it to the library. So I don't appreciate the insinuation that I have something to feel guilty for now that, at almost 40, I am finally getting the help I need. I don't. And I don't feel guilty for suggesting that Scarlett consider the possibility that repeatedly reminding her stepson, even in a loving way, that he needs to better control himself is counter-productive.

This is my last visit to this thread, for the sake of my own mental health. As you might imagine, this is a difficult topic for me. I wish Scarlett and her stepson all the luck in the world as they face this challenge together. He is lucky to have a family that cares so much for him and hopefully they will all find a way forward together.