Chick-fil-a taking a stand on biblical marriage

[Jenny in Florida]

I don't see anything hateful in that. A different point of view, but not hateful. FOTF is one of the few organizations that has supported me and given me help when I was ready to sign out of life. They might not have agreed with my views, but they never made me feel hated or unloved because of that.

 

It's not the statements, themselves. It's the organization's actions in support of those statements that is problematic for me.

 

For example, they started a "ministry" called Love Won Out that had a mission identical to that of Exodus International and was eventually sold to EI.

 

They were active in supporting California's infamous Proposition 8.

 

They started the Day of Dialogue, which is specifically intended to counter the Day of Silence (which raises awareness about bullying of LGBT kids).

Edited July 22, 2012 by Jenny in Florida

[EducationX2]

I don't know what "I'm a Barbie Girl" has to do with this thread, did people really start getting high? I thought that was a joke. :lol:

 

:lol::lol: hehehe. I didn't even notice the tag until now, now I'm laying on the floor, laughing.

 

Totally random, but I'm starting to wonder if outlawing giant sodas wouldn't be a good thing. :D

 

Get your contraband 64oz Dr. Pepper here! :leaving:

 

DR.PEPPER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :party::drool5:

Sorry. I'm okay now. Recovering Dr. Pepper addict here. I was forced into remission when a medication I needed to take for migraines made sodas unpalatable. :glare:

[Lucy the Valiant]

If they are fighting for/against certain laws *based upon a Christian belief*, then, yes, they are trying to impose their beliefs onto someone else.

Well, then wouldn't that also apply to those pushing the gay marriage agenda?

 

From Katie:

 

 

That doesn't have anything to do with it. If Mary Sue believes that X is wrong, then the fact that CF also does Y is not going to fix the issue with X.

 

 

 

If CF doesn't think it is legal, then they can go to court with Wal-Mart and strip clubs and bars and dirty magazines and whatever other businesses people fight.

 

Oh, the strip clubs and bars and casinos and dirty magazines are fine - it's just Wal-Mart and Chik-fil-a (and the Catholic adoption agency) that are restricted. Mayor Menino doesn't think Chik-fil-a is ILLEGAL (he has nothing against them legally), he just doesn't LIKE them. That is my constitutional problem, the violation of free speech (Mr. Cathy's personal and the company's charitable support of agencies that support traditional marriage).

 

I love soda. But, cities that have outlawed giant sodas can do so because it has nothing to do with religion. Heck, there are still tons of dry counties in the south.

 

Well . . . some people think that soda is religion. :tongue_smilie:

 

 

 

 

My 2 disclaimers before I'm outta here -

 

1. I hope my comments have come across as a thoughtful discussion, not a hateful rampage; I have gay friends who discuss this with me all the time, but I realize that that camaraderie may not translate to the internet. I disagree with them, but I don't think they hate me, and they know I don't hate them.

 

2. It's 3:00am. I must. go. to. sleep.

 

I have such a huge respect for all the home schooling gurus on this site, and I'm tremendously thankful for the advice and tips and links shared here. I don't often enter the political-debate threads (and maybe shouldn't have tonight), but I love WTM and the interesting perspectives shared here. So - good night all. If I have offended you personally, that was not my intention, and I'm sorry for it.

[Jenny in Florida]

No, my argument was that Chik-fil-a has done nothing at all illegal, and is a company that gives millions of dollars to people who are hurting and need the help. To paint them as "rabidly anti-gay" is laughable, when you look at the numbers and the types of people they are helping. (If it's ok for our taxes to fund Planned Parenthood even though they perform abortions, then it should also be ok for a PRIVATE COMPANY to fund organizations that "you" (generic you) find reprehensible, especially because you don't have to participate (unlike the Christians who HAVE to support PP through taxes.)

 

Did you miss the part where I said repeatedly that I think Chick-Fil-A should be allowed to do whatever they want with their money? I never, ever said or suggested that they had done anything illegal.

 

As I understood your argument, you were saying Chick-Fil-A was being treated unfairly because they contributed to good causes along with the ones of which we disapprove. Personally, I don't find that argument compelling.

 

But I do understand your unhappiness about taxes going to Planned Parenthood. Imagine how this here pacifist feels about the "defense" budget.

[Slartibartfast]

No, my argument was that Chik-fil-a has done nothing at all illegal, and is a company that gives millions of dollars to people who are hurting and need the help. To paint them as "rabidly anti-gay" is laughable, when you look at the numbers and the types of people they are helping. (If it's ok for our taxes to fund Planned Parenthood even though they perform abortions, then it should also be ok for a PRIVATE COMPANY to fund organizations that "you" (generic you) find reprehensible, especially because you don't have to participate (unlike the Christians who HAVE to support PP through taxes.)

 

 

 

By law Federal funding cannot go towards abortions.

[Jenny in Florida]

My 2 disclaimers before I'm outta here -

 

1. I hope my comments have come across as a thoughtful discussion, not a hateful rampage; I have gay friends who discuss this with me all the time, but I realize that that camaraderie may not translate to the internet. I disagree with them, but I don't think they hate me, and they know I don't hate them.

 

2. It's 3:00am. I must. go. to. sleep.

 

I have such a huge respect for all the home schooling gurus on this site, and I'm tremendously thankful for the advice and tips and links shared here. I don't often enter the political-debate threads (and maybe shouldn't have tonight), but I love WTM and the interesting perspectives shared here. So - good night all. If I have offended you personally, that was not my intention, and I'm sorry for it.

 

I really should have been asleep so long ago! But this conversation has been very interesting and, for the most part, so thoughtful and civil that I had trouble walking away from it.

 

Thank you all for the discussion, and I wish everyone a good night!

[Lucy the Valiant]

Did you miss the part where I said repeatedly that I think Chick-Fil-A should be allowed to do whatever they want with their money? I never, ever said or suggested that they had done anything illegal.

 

As I understood your argument, you were saying Chick-Fil-A was being treated unfairly because they contributed to good causes along with the ones of which we disapprove. Personally, I don't find that argument compelling.

 

But I do understand your unhappiness about taxes going to Planned Parenthood. Imagine how this here pacifist feels about the "defense" budget.

 

So because they contribute to perfectly legal organizations that the mayor doesn't like, he should be allowed to block their business from opening in his city?

 

Would that extend to say, a Christian mayor, blocking a LGBT-friendly chicken restaurant?

[Slartibartfast]

Oh, the strip clubs and bars and casinos and dirty magazines are fine - it's just Wal-Mart and Chik-fil-a (and the Catholic adoption agency) that are restricted. Mayor Menino doesn't think Chik-fil-a is ILLEGAL (he has nothing against them legally), he just doesn't LIKE them. That is my constitutional problem, the violation of free speech (Mr. Cathy's personal and the company's charitable support of agencies that support traditional marriage).

 

 

But there are cities that do not permit strip clubs, casinos and bars.

 

A company isn't a person. He said the company donated money.

 

 

My 2 disclaimers before I'm outta here -

 

1. I hope my comments have come across as a thoughtful discussion, not a hateful rampage; I have gay friends who discuss this with me all the time, but I realize that that camaraderie may not translate to the internet. I disagree with them, but I don't think they hate me, and they know I don't hate them.

 

2. It's 3:00am. I must. go. to. sleep.

 

I have such a huge respect for all the home schooling gurus on this site, and I'm tremendously thankful for the advice and tips and links shared here. I don't often enter the political-debate threads (and maybe shouldn't have tonight), but I love WTM and the interesting perspectives shared here. So - good night all. If I have offended you personally, that was not my intention, and I'm sorry for it.

 

:grouphug:

[Jenny in Florida]

So because they contribute to perfectly legal organizations that the mayor doesn't like, he should be allowed to block their business from opening in his city?

 

Would that extend to say, a Christian mayor, blocking a LGBT-friendly chicken restaurant?

 

I've said a few times that I don't know and haven't taken the time to research the legality of the Boston mayor's block. And I've also admitted I have mixed feelings about it at first blush.

 

I'm trying to remember . . . I seem to recall seeing a piece on a TV news program about a city or town that is run (maybe owned?) by a religious organization. The big controversy was that they had refused to allow one of the major fast food chains to open there. I think they were justifying it on grounds of protecting the health of the residents, but I don't remember the details.

 

If I remember tomorrow, I'll try to look up the information. It might make an interesting compare and contrast exercise for this situation.

[Mrs Mungo]

From Kaite:

Well, then wouldn't that also apply to those pushing the gay marriage agenda?

 

There is no gay marriage agenda. There is a civil rights agenda versus "you should do as my religion says." It is not as if Christians would be forced to be gay. :confused:

 

Oh, the strip clubs and bars and casinos and dirty magazines are fine - it's just Wal-Mart and Chik-fil-a (and the Catholic adoption agency) that are restricted. Mayor Menino doesn't think Chik-fil-a is ILLEGAL (he has nothing against them legally), he just doesn't LIKE them.

 

But bars, casinos and such are illegal in *plenty* of places. That was my point, both sides restrict certain types of commerce. It is not illegal or unconstitutional for local governments to do so.

 

That is my constitutional problem, the violation of free speech (Mr. Cathy's personal and the company's charitable support of agencies that support traditional marriage).

 

Mr. Cathy's right to free speech hasn't been violated any more than Tim Robbin's was when he whined on television that the Baseball Hall of Fame was violating his right to free speech. Nobody has prevented Mr. Cathy from saying whatever he wants.

[Slartibartfast]

:lol: While HRC is claiming CFA gave "a near jaw-dropping $2 million," the stats they're quoting aren't even reaching half a million. And a $1000 donation is a *highlight* of $2mil? yikes That's a stretch.

 

 

 

 

Exactly. FCA a hate group?!

 

That "article" is a great example of sensationalism (rabidly anti-gay) and twisting definitions to support their cause. blah

 

???

 

http://www.businessinsider.com/heres-how-much-money-chick-fil-a-gives-to-anti-gay-groups-2012-7

 

Marriage & Family Foundation: $1,188,380

Fellowship Of Christian Athletes: $480,000

National Christian Foundation: $247,500

New Mexico Christian Foundation: $54,000

Exodus International: $1,000

Family Research Council: $1,000

Georgia Family Council: $2,500

 

I don't really know that FCA has any involvement in politics or things of that nature. I don't think that should be included in that list.

Edited July 22, 2012 by Sis

[Frances]

Yes, I looked them up before posting.

 

Exodus International is pretty blatant. Focus on the Family requires a little more digging to find the information.

 

For an example of one family's tragic outcome when they followed FOTF teachings on homosexuality, see the documentary "For the Bible Tells Me So" (it's available on Netflix). The specific portion concerning FOTF starts with 16 minutes left, but you may need to watch most of it as numerous stories are interwoven throughout the film.

 

Another interesting video is one by a gay conservative Christian Harvard student who took two years off from college to deeply study biblical teachings on homosexuality:

 

http://www.advocate.com/op-ed/2012/05/01/opinion-do-not-give-christian-gays

[Priscila]

They can have whatever opinion they want but I will definitely not be setting a foot in their establishment.

 

ETA: to call this a moral choice is subjective.

 

:iagree:

We already don't patronize any fast food establishment and very occasionally any restaurants. So it isn't as if anyone would be affected by my boycott anyhow. But, I respectfully disagree with their standing on this issue. :auto:

[Jenny in Florida]

 

http://www.advocate.com/op-ed/2012/05/01/opinion-do-not-give-christian-gays

 

That's a very touching and well-written piece. I may have to go look up the video (tomorrow, after I get some sleep!).

 

Thanks for posting the link.

[ShannonS]

I believe the passages cited from OT Leviticus to support the oppression of LGBT community and gay marriage are legalistic, misinterpreted and completely taken out of context, and in this instance, have no relevance to my calling as a Christian.

 

We all <Christians> recognize the authority and importance of God's word. The issue here is interpretation.

 

 

 

"Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed,

rightly dividing

the word of truth." II Tim 2:15.

 

 

"Rightly dividing" means to discern and apply the scripture in its proper historical setting.

 

As in Leviticus' proper historical setting.

 

This also applies to the Pauline condemnation of 'homosexual offenders'. I interpret this as a denouncement of coercive activities, not of homosexuality itself. It is analogous to calling a heterosexual relations a sin because God does not like rape.

 

Chick-fil-a's position is not a reflection of all Christian thought. I believe that people of all sexual orientations and gender identities share the worth that comes from being unique individuals created by God.

 

Respectfully to all,

and with love in Christ,

Shannon

[Mom in High Heels]

Man, being in the Central European Time Zone means I miss ALL the good stuff.

 

We don't have CFA in Germany, but if we did, I'd have to boycott them. They are free to do what they want as they are a private company, but I am also free to not support them in their endeavors.

 

 

This has nothing to do with anything, but I'm just going to say it (because it's on TV right now). As much as I adore the movie WALL-E, the end credits are my hands down favorite part and I wish they were longer. Isn't that weird?

[dansamy]

MA won't let you have wine shipped to your own home. I've tried many times to have CA organic wines shipped, and it won't happen.

 

Freedoms are limited. You can yammer about the injustice, and nobody will arrest you, but you still can't have wine sent to your residence. Or apparently a dildo sent to dansamy's state --that's not a problem in MA).

 

Not that that is Old Boy politics or anything. ;)

 

Yeah, but you can buy wine at a liquor store in your state, right? Not gonna happen here with our situation. It's definitely Good Ol' Boy politics butting their noses into private citizens bedrooms. It's all good. I just cross state lines if I feel like I need/want. :tongue_smilie: (Wonder if that makes me a felon? :D)

 

That and Canada must have much more liberal marriage laws than I thought.

 

What's next? Dogs and cats living together?

 

Human sacrifice! Mass hysteria! Who ya gonna call?

Edited July 22, 2012 by dansamy

[Mama Geek]

I haven't read all 37 pages of this thread, probably only 2 or 3 total. The owners of Chick-Fil-A have as much right to have a public opinion as anybody else. They took a stand when they decided to be closed on Sundays. They encourage Christian groups to meet in their store. Overall their employees are better and they are more kid friendly than any other fast food chain I can think of. It was pretty obvious to me long before they made their statements what their stance was. It will not change how often I eat there.

 

My guess is they may loose some customers over this, but they will probably also pick some up. They won't loose their core customer group.

[Gentlemommy]

I'm only on page four of the replies, but is it bad that I don't care one iota? :001_huh:Same with JCPenny. There was a huge uproar about Ellen being JCPennys spokesperson and about her not being a good rolemodel, blah blah. Honestly? I don't really care. Im not dependent of any store, celebrity, or political figure to be a role model for my children. Unless they are promoting violence, I pretty much people the same freedoms to their opinions as I'd like. Neither point of view is promoting anything hateful, harmful, or anything like that.

 

Maybe I'm just oblivious as to the ramifications of the cfa president voicing his opinion, but I don't think it has anything to do with the company. We will continue to patron both CFA and JCPennys, not based on their spokespeople or their lifestyle choices, but based on their products and customer service. :001_smile:

[Margaret in GA]

I am really conflicted about this. I have seen so much good come from Chick fil A over the years. Truett Cathy is famous for saying, " It is better to build boys than mend men" And a child I know very well has been given a real chance at life because of their Winshape organization. So, they honestly put their money where their mouth is. However, I think it's so wrong to be so hateful about a group of people. I am not boycotting them because of the good I've witnessed all over Georgia, with so many families. But, I am hoping they get a strong message from those that do.

 

Margaret

[melissad2]

I haven't read all 37 pages of this thread, probably only 2 or 3 total. The owners of Chick-Fil-A have as much right to have a public opinion as anybody else. They took a stand when they decided to be closed on Sundays. They encourage Christian groups to meet in their store. Overall their employees are better and they are more kid friendly than any other fast food chain I can think of. It was pretty obvious to me long before they made their statements what their stance was. It will not change how often I eat there.

 

My guess is they may loose some customers over this, but they will probably also pick some up. They won't loose their core customer group.

 

:iagree:

 

I go there because it's the only fast food place I can take my kids and get help to the table. The employees are super friendly and helpful!

[cdrumm4448]

By law Federal funding cannot go towards abortions.

 

Yes, but it pays for the electricity, heat, staff, medicine, equipment, disposal of the body, and everything else associated with abortion.

[amy g.]

I would never go there anyway. How moral is it to put a neurotoxin like MSG in people's food?

 

I feel like poisoning the public is actually more evil than loving someone society thinks you should not love.

[flyingiguana]

Companies aren't people, why would they get Civil rights!?!?

 

Citizens United says they are.

[cdrumm4448]

I went to sleep last night and this morning found this to be an interesting thread. What stood out the most was this: people who claim they are open minded and socially liberal in their views tend to tell conservative Christians they're crazy and their views are wrong. Telling someone they should change their views to match yours, no matter how strongly you hold them and believe them to be correct, is not open minded.

 

For the record, I am a proponent of the traditional family. What people do in their own lives is none of my business; they don't answer to me.

[NotSoObvious]

I will boycott businesses like Chick-fil-a that promote bigotry.

 

I don't think it is the "moral" choice, but the opposite. Immoral hate-mongering and bigotry.

 

Bill

 

:iagree: a thousand times over.

[twinmami01]

Sigh.

 

I really would like to buy a chicken sandwich without it delving into my beliefs regarding civil rights.

 

:iagree:

[twinmami01]

I'm only on page four of the replies, but is it bad that I don't care one iota? :001_huh:Same with JCPenny. There was a huge uproar about Ellen being JCPennys spokesperson and about her not being a good rolemodel, blah blah. Honestly? I don't really care. Im not dependent of any store, celebrity, or political figure to be a role model for my children. Unless they are promoting violence, I pretty much people the same freedoms to their opinions as I'd like. Neither point of view is promoting anything hateful, harmful, or anything like that.

 

Maybe I'm just oblivious as to the ramifications of the cfa president voicing his opinion, but I don't think it has anything to do with the company. We will continue to patron both CFA and JCPennys, not based on their spokespeople or their lifestyle choices, but based on their products and customer service. :001_smile:

 

:iagree:

[Jenny in Florida]

I went to sleep last night and this morning found this to be an interesting thread. What stood out the most was this: people who claim they are open minded and socially liberal in their views tend to tell conservative Christians they're crazy and their views are wrong. Telling someone they should change their views to match yours, no matter how strongly you hold them and believe them to be correct, is not open minded.

 

I hope I'm not one of those people you mention?

 

I don't think I've told a single Christian that he or she is "crazy" or "wrong." I've said several times that I respect every individual's right to have his or her own beliefs and to state those beliefs. Since I value my own rights in that area, I'd be hypocritical to try and squash those of anyone else.

 

And, for the record, I absolutely believe Chick-Fil-A's owners have the right to donate money to causes they believe in and to work for the change they want to see in the world.

 

But, the beauty of the system is that I also have the right to refuse to give them any of my money to use for that purpose.

 

As others have said, if you don't believe in gay marriage, don't have one. I don't see why any American has the right, though, to impose religiously-based laws upon the rest of us. That's not what is supposed to happen here. And I will not support any business or organization that believes it should.

[FiveOaksAcademy]

I went to sleep last night and this morning found this to be an interesting thread. What stood out the most was this: people who claim they are open minded and socially liberal in their views tend to tell conservative Christians they're crazy and their views are wrong. Telling someone they should change their views to match yours, no matter how strongly you hold them and believe them to be correct, is not open minded.

 

For the record, I am a proponent of the traditional family. What people do in their own lives is none of my business; they don't answer to me.

 

:iagree: So very true. I don't have the time, energy, desire, whatever to read everything. I feel you summed it all up nicely!! :001_smile:

[mom2denj]

Love Chick-fil-a. I'm proud that they are willing to stand on this. I'm also thankful for the millions of those who agree with them who will frequent their establisment more in order to show support!! :001_smile:

 

:iagree:

[DawnM]

Good grief. I go to bed before midnight and wake up to THIS! You folks are very active at night.

[abacus2]

Not being open on Sunday is a good moral stand. It's saying "we believe a person shouldn't work on Sunday, and we won't make any of our employees do so either." It follows the spirit, as well as the letter, of the law. That's putting your money where your mouth is.

 

Saying you're anti-gay and donating to anti-gay organizations? That's not moral, that doesn't help anyone; all that does is try to push religious belief for the sake of religion. It's hateful, not helpful.

 

:iagree: and I'm a conservative Christian.

[cdrumm4448]

I hope I'm not one of those people you mention?

 

I don't think I've told a single Christian that he or she is "crazy" or "wrong." I've said several times that I respect every individual's right to have his or her own beliefs and to state those beliefs. Since I value my own rights in that area, I'd be hypocritical to try and squash those of anyone else.

 

And, for the record, I absolutely believe Chick-Fil-A's owners have the right to donate money to causes they believe in and to work for the change they want to see in the world.

 

But, the beauty of the system is that I also have the right to refuse to give them any of my money to use for that purpose.

 

As others have said, if you don't believe in gay marriage, don't have one. I don't see why any American has the right, though, to impose religiously-based laws upon the rest of us. That's not what is supposed to happen here. And I will not support any business or organization that believes it should.

 

Jenny, I agree with most of what you said. I'm not a proponent of gay marriage. I believe marriage is between one man and one woman. Everyone is entitled to believe what they want and act accordingly. And I was not referring to you when I mentioned the hypocrisy in the thread. I also believe government's role should only include those specifically enumerated in the Constitution. Wars, borders, etc.

[Lisbeth]

Love Chick-fil-a. I'm proud that they are willing to stand on this. I'm also thankful for the millions of those who agree with them who will frequent their establisment more in order to show support!! :001_smile:

 

We don't live in a particularly religious area and the politics are 50-50, but the Chik Fil A I go by was PACKED the morning after the statement was made. As in 3 or 4X the business for that time of day. I don't think the statement/stand will hurt them.

[Lady Florida.]

They can have whatever opinion they want but I will definitely not be setting a foot in their establishment.

 

 

 

I would say I'd boycott them, but I don't like their food anyway.

 

 

If those of us with a conscience were tolerant of bigotry, fundamentalist Christians would still be denying marriage to interracial couples along with gays. It's not about tolerance, but about standing up to hate.

 

:iagree: Discrimination couched in religious belief is still wrong.

 

Companies aren't people, why would they get Civil rights!?!?

 

According to the Supreme Court, they are people.

[Parrothead]

Hi Mods :seeya: Wanna chicken dance with me before you delete this whole thread?

Please not until I catch up.

[Mrs Mungo]

I went to sleep last night and this morning found this to be an interesting thread. What stood out the most was this: people who claim they are open minded and socially liberal in their views tend to tell conservative Christians they're crazy and their views are wrong. Telling someone they should change their views to match yours, no matter how strongly you hold them and believe them to be correct, is not open minded.

 

It is strange to accuse one side of thinking that the other is wrong. Obviously, both sides think the other is wrong? :confused:

 

I don't think conservatives are crazy. I don't recall anyone saying anything like that? Can you quote it? I may have missed it.

 

I never said anyone should change their views to match my own. What I have said is that if one is arguing that marriage is a sacred sacrament, then I don't see why the government should be in the sacred sacrament business to begin with. I don't think people can argue 1) marriage is a sacred sacrament, 2) h*mosexuality is against the Bible and 3) therefore gay marriage should be illegal. If that is the argument, then it clearly goes against the separation of church and state. I don't want someone else's beliefs pressed upon me, therefore, I cannot press my religious-based beliefs upon others.

[EKS]

I will boycott businesses like Chick-fil-a that promote bigotry.

 

I don't think it is the "moral" choice, but the opposite. Immoral hate-mongering and bigotry.

 

Bill

 

This.

[mama2cntrykids]

This is a great post, PITB, and would that others could learn to be more gracious like this in their opposite opinion. Many of the posts I see in reply here are just as harsh/unloving and of subjective morality as Chick-fil-A is perceived by them to be.

 

I was thinking along these same lines. Holy cow...where's the LOVE?

[kalanamak]

I What I have said is that if one is arguing that marriage is a sacred sacrament, then I don't see why the government should be in the sacred sacrament business to begin with. I don't think people can argue 1) marriage is a sacred sacrament, 2) h*mosexuality is against the Bible and 3) therefore gay marriage should be illegal. If that is the argument, then it clearly goes against the separation of church and state. I don't want someone else's beliefs pressed upon me, therefore, I cannot press my religious-based beliefs upon others.

 

This gets my vote as "in a nutshell" of the year.

[Parrothead]

Doing good doesn't undo something bad. Christians should be able to agree upon that, at the very least.

 

 

 

Uh, there are *plenty* of businesses that are blocked from opening in this city or that due to people and reasons on both sides of the fence. It *is* perfecty legal, whether I like it or not.

 

 

 

There are lots of things that the majority *cannot* just decide upon. Those are civil rights issue. I am strogly against a constitutional ban on gay marriage because the Bill of Rights (the first 10 amendments) was written to clarify inalienable rights-rights that are inherent and cannot be taken away. It wasn't used to *take away* rights from any group. That is wrong, IMO. If it can be done to one group, then it could be done to another.

 

If marriage is a *sacred sacrament* (and I think it is), then government has no business officiating it. Everyone should get a civil union and then they can choose an optional religious ceremony, if they wish. I don't want the government telling me that I cannot eat a bacon cheeseburger or go out on the Sabbath or that I must wear a hijab, therefore I should not be telling other people that they must follow the rules of my religion.

:iagree::iagree:

[Word Nerd]

 

I never said anyone should change their views to match my own. What I have said is that if one is arguing that marriage is a sacred sacrament, then I don't see why the government should be in the sacred sacrament business to begin with. I don't think people can argue 1) marriage is a sacred sacrament, 2) h*mosexuality is against the Bible and 3) therefore gay marriage should be illegal. If that is the argument, then it clearly goes against the separation of church and state. I don't want someone else's beliefs pressed upon me, therefore, I cannot press my religious-based beliefs upon others.

 

:iagree:

[Hockey Mom]

To be fair I wouldn't be anymore impressed if they took a stand on being liberal towards marriage. I guess I just don't look to fast food restaurants as spokespersons for those sorts of issues.

 

:iagree:

[Parrothead]

I would never go there anyway. How moral is it to put a neurotoxin like MSG in people's food?

 

I feel like poisoning the public is actually more evil than loving someone society thinks you should not love.

I was thinking the same thing after reading the article about Boston banning sugared drinks. No sugar allowed but sure, go ahead and put that neurotoxin (aspartame) into your body.

 

ETA: Now I'm caught up. :D

Edited July 22, 2012 by Parrothead

[Soror]

I was thinking the same thing after reading the article about Boston banning sugared drinks. No sugar allowed but sure, go ahead and put that neurotoxin (aspartame) into your body.

 

ETA: Now I'm caught up. :D

 

:iagree: Although, if we are excluding every place that sells MSG and aspartame that knocks out most restuarants. We don't generally eat out anyway though. My go to place is a local place that uses real ingredients but we cannot afford that much.

 

We don't have even have a CFA here so it is a non-issue besides the fact that I don't know if they have anything safe for us (gf). I don't generally boycott places though(with rare exception that I cannot think of now). I think according to some I'm supposed to boycott Home Depot as well but we don't.

[Joanne]

I read all 41 pages before posting. In the interest of self-disclosure, this is one of the reasons I left the formal Christian church settings, began doubting Christianity, and eventually dropped Christian/Jesus follower as an identifying spiritual label.

 

I believe that "being against" homosexuality, or "being against" gay marriage is hate. I believe that thinking someone's sexual orientation is sin is hate. It is incongruous to me to believe in a loving God and believe that God percieves homosexuality as sin.

 

I studied the Bible passages, and the Bible and Bible history in general for a long, long time. I do not agree (the Christian God) says what many Christians say He does.

 

From a clinical perspective, the type of hate represented by Chik-fil-A's type of "stand" fuels, creates, sustains, and drives the culture in which sexual minorities are bullied, have higher suicide rates, higher substance abuse rates, more family dysfunction and estrangement.

 

I won't be frequenting Chik-fil-A; I will be doing research on what companies *support* basic human rights such as marriage.

[Dustybug]

Chick Fil A took a stand when they did not open on Sundays and they are going strong. This just makes me support them more.

 

:iagree:

[Scrub Jay]

I went to sleep last night and this morning found this to be an interesting thread. What stood out the most was this: people who claim they are open minded and socially liberal in their views tend to tell conservative Christians they're crazy and their views are wrong. Telling someone they should change their views to match yours, no matter how strongly you hold them and believe them to be correct, is not open minded.

.

 

Where was any of this said on this thread? Please quote.

 

In fact, all I remember was those darn socially liberal folk saying believe what you believe but keep your religious agenda out of consenting adults' bedrooms and relationships.

[clarkacademy]

I will boycott businesses like Chick-fil-a that promote bigotry.

 

I don't think it is the "moral" choice, but the opposite. Immoral hate-mongering and bigotry.

 

Bill

 

I am so not trying to get in a bicker match with you:001_smile: But in my mind your saying they are wrong for not supporting gay? They are saying you are wrong for supporting it Well isn't it a right to believe however you want? Why do they have to be bigots because they feel this is sinful and why do you have to be the sinner because you think it is OK?

 

I am not gay, I don't care if your gay that isn't my business but since I am not gay does that mean I am a bigot? I hope you can understand what I am saying. It is suppose to be religous freedom right? Why don't they have the right to be free with their choice just because it is different from yours?