Moms of girls: college bound or keeper of home? (Christian related)

[ChristusG]

***Ummm....oops! I meant to post this on the general board LOL! Is there any way that someone can move it? I'm sorry!! ***

 

 

My mom and her friend sort of have an unspoken disagreement on this topic. They are both Christians and they both homeschool daughters...my little sister is 14 and my mom's friends daughter is 11. As Christians, should we prepare our daughters to be keepers of the home? Or college bound? I just thought it would be interesting to gather some perspective from you guys. My daughters are only one and four....so I dont have to worry about this quite as much until they get a bit older.

 

My mom's friend says that her daughter will go to college, no questions asked, and she will not "allow" her to refuse to go to college. Not sure how that will work when her kid becomes an adult, but that's what she says.

 

My mom believes that the Bible instructs women to be keepers of the home and wants to train my sister more in those matters. Not that she does not want her to go to college, but she wants her to have the option and not feel like she is being pushed either way. My sister wants to get married as soon as she can and have some kids. So my mom is including child development and family living into her schooling this year.

 

What do you guys think? The Bible does instruct women to be keepers of the home. Here's what I think.....if you graduate high school and have no prospective husband, you should probably go on to college. I mean, what else are you going to do? If you decide to get married shortly out of school, you can go to college or work up until you decide to have kids. Once having kids, I think that if at all possible, a woman should become a keeper of the home. I know there are circumstances that do not allow this....but I believe that the Bible does intend for women to take care of their homes and families while the man earns the money for the family.

 

What do you guys think about it? Guide our daughters towards college....or towards being a keeper of the home?

[Veritaserum]

Both. :) I am a SAHM of 4 dds and I have a college degree. I met dh in college and had dd#1 in between my junior and senior years. I see no reason why girls who intend to be SAHMs shouldn't also pursue academic studies, especially since those further studies provide valuable education and life lessons.

 

Also, should my husband ever fall ill or die or something, I like knowing that my income earning power is significantly greater given my college degree. It gives me a sense of security.

 

I plan on raising my dds the way I was raised--to become well-rounded, well-educated women who will be a wonderful asset to any future husband and children. :)

[swellmomma]

:iagree: I am raising my daughter to do both. I want her to go to university and get an education but will also train her to be a keeper of the home because as a woman even if well educated that will ultimately fall upon her reguardless.

[Vida Winter]

I want them to go to college and be able to support themselves. I also want them to be able to be good mothers and wives at some point. I think if they are educated and self-reliant, they will have the freedom to choose among the best candidates for husbands, with the full knowledge that they can support themselves quite nicely if they decide that the current fellow is not "the one." I hope this makes sense; it sort of follows the model of my own life, which I am very satisfied with.

[Anne]

I wanted my daughters to be prepared, as much as possible, for whatever God has in store for them. To me, this meant a firm spiritual training, a good grasp of the practicalities of life and an excellent education. I want my daughters prepared for a satisfying life even if God does not call them to marriage. I want them prepared as much as possible to earn a good living if something happens to their husband if they do marry. I want them prepared to be good helpmeets to their husbands, and I want them prepared to give my grandchildren an excellent education!

 

My daughters have both graduated from our home school. One has graduated from college and the other is finishing her first year at college.

 

Anne

[teachmom3]

Both!

 

A lot of good points have been made already, including employability (?sp). Even if a girl is planning on getting married early, there is no guarantee that her dh won't die or become disabled/chronically ill or abandon her. (The divorce rates are sobering.)

 

A couple of other points:

 

All other things being equal, it is probably easier on a marriage if both spouses are at least somewhat educationally matched. Dh watched his parents' marital conflict, a small part of which was contributed to by the fact that his mom couldn't keep up intellectually with his dad. Dh's dad felt that he couldn't talk about a number of issues with his wife, and I'm betting that his wife felt, at times, inferior and inadequate because of this. Obviously, this was only a minor point in an already unhealthy marriage, but it didn't help.

 

I know that dh is grateful that we are both approximately equally educated (both have doctorates in the same field), and so, even though I am "only" a SAHM, I can keep up with him even when he discusses some of the issues that deal with the more esoteric areas at his work. Again, I'm not saying that a marriage can't work and work well if the spouses have a large discrepancy in educational attainment--it's just that a large difference, like a large difference in any cultural area, is a potential stress to a marriage.

 

Another point: If a young woman is planning on homeschooling her own children, it's a lot easier to homeschool one's children through high school if one has a college degree. I'm obviously not saying that it can't be done without a college degree!--just that it's easier if the homeschooling parent has gone through college. I've watched too many of my homeschooling friends who did not attend college struggle with college prep high school homeschool with their children. They tend to end up having to outsource more classes and earlier, and they're more chronically stressed/worried about how they're going to teach their children higher math or science or composition, etc.

 

JMHO!

[CLHCO]

I think it depends a lot on the child. I know my daughters well enough to know they would not thrive in a large, secular university. There is no way I would "send" them there.

 

On the other hand, I want them to be well educated so we are looking at college in more non-traditional ways. One wants to go into graphic design. If that desire stays, college is not necessary. A technical school would be just as appropriate. Classical study can easily be gained on the side to be educated, even if a piece of paper in the classics does not accompany the education. The piece of paper in graphic design would be more valuable if that's her interest.

 

My guidance is more toward making sure college isn't some place they go to get far into debt and "grow up". If they need advanced studies that will cost a fortune, they need to have a way to pay for the fortune, not put stress on a future marriage to do so if their goal is to stay home. Thankfully, not all schooling costs a fortune. Small schools and distance learning works well too.

 

My daughters will be expected to know how to sew, garden, cook, clean and balance finances but we don't know who God has planned for our daughters to share their lives with. If God calls one to be the wife of a missionary physician, would a woman who knows how to iron and host a party be more or less valuable than a woman who also has a degree in a health related field out there with him? The same can be said for the wife of a small business owner, scientist, etc. There is a fairly high chance she will meet a future husband in the field she's either studying in or working in. (Not to mention the fact that she may not get married at all and be called herself, though I realize that's the exception, not the rule.)

 

For that reason, I want them educated to be a good help meet, not a fluffy wall flower for their husband. She should also be prepared to educate her own children.

 

I have no problem with a woman who makes the womanly arts her career either, of course. There will certainly be plenty of men who need a woman to be able to throw those parties, be wonderful hostesses and iron his shirts primarily. I would never "expect" my daughter to go to college if she feels called in other areas.

[CactusPair]

Both! One does not exclude the other. In the progressive period early last century there was a social ideal built up around the concept of "the educated mother".

 

Sitting in the college lecture hall, I thought "now, that's what I'd like to be when I grow up!" and that's what I am.

 

Of course, the ultimate decision will be the young lady's when she's grown up.

[GreenKitty]

I would have to say both. I wanted to get married and have children right away also. Turns out I went to college and the month after my graduation I got married. :)

[PeterPan]

You know, I think this is a pretty common issue, but it kind of makes me wonder if people have been to some good christian colleges and talked with the girls there. I knew TWO girls in my whole time (4 years+) at a christian college who were really interested in a career, both had medical interests, and both are now happily married. ALL the girls I hung out with had marriage on the mind, every single one. College is a place to grow up, mature, gain some skills to serve the Lord (we're talking christians here), have some experiences you wouldn't have in your local church (leading Bible clubs in poor neighborhoods, going on missions trips, developing leadership and mentoring relationships with others, etc.), and to MEET A HUSBAND. Going to a christian college is, at it's heart, pre-marriage, not pre-career, for a girl, lol!

 

The reality is there is a real disconnect between college life and life on the outside. I lived in dorms for 6 years before getting married, so it was a real surprise to me when I realized dishes don't disappear on conveyor belts, supper doesn't magically appear when I'm hungry, and *I* have to clean it or it won't get cleaned, hehe... That said, you're at home and have time to make those things happen. All I'm saying is this feminist mystique about a girl going away to college baffles me. Send your dd to a good christian college, one where she can meet a man of similar beliefs, one where she can gain some skills that will be useful to her husband, useful in the church, useful in teaching her children. Chose a place that is safe and has a philosophy "en locos parentes" (if I have that spelled correctly, lol), meaning they take seriously upholding the values and moors you've taught your dd; the kids aren't running wild.

 

I've known a few girls to want to get married right out of high school, and usually they had guys in the waiting who were older and wanted that. That's their business. I know I've told my dd from the very beginning she IS going to college and it IS going to be a christian college. In fact, we were talking about it just a day or two ago. I told her we'd go around to various colleges when she is say a freshman or sophomore so she could start to visit, get a feel for them, etc. There are SO many good christian college options: big ones, small ones, bible colleges (where all you study is say Bible and education), etc. I think moms here who have been to college and are now happy at home know what a value it was to them. Our dd's will act on the light they are given, so while we want to nurture their sensitivity, we are also forming that with our counsel. It's obviously possible to go to college in a way that is totally driven by career desires, however I didn't see that in the christian college I went to. Girls WANTED to be married, longed to be married, and viewed college as a chance to grow up, mature, meet guys, and gain skills to be used in marriage and in the church. I know I use the things I learned all the time!

 

BTW, the widow thing is very real. My dh has already had that happen in his small high school graduating class (20?), where the dh died very unexpectedly. Sure the church ought to step in and support this homeschooling mother of many littles, but will they? Sure is nice if the mom has a degree. I also know SEVERAL women who fear God, keep their homes, and have to work on the side. Life isn't always perfect and having some skills is a really wise thing. I remember in elementary school attending a chapel where the special speaker asked us why we couldn't just go to the mission field now (remember people are dying NOW, needs are real NOW), and he pointed out that Christ prepared 30 years for ministry. Christ was perfect and omniscient from the beginning, but He grew in maturity and waited till he was READY before starting his ministry. It's a good thing for a young person to prepare as well as they can for their calling. You'll never regret having tools.

[8filltheheart]

This is the reply that is probably the closest to my philosophy. I got married to my high school sweetheart while we were still in college. ;) I have never really worked in my field since graduation. (I did for a very short time but I had our oldest about a yr after graduation)

 

However, I am extremely glad I went to college. I love theology and intellectual pursuits. I love evaluating/investigating different perspectives. My educational background has proven invaluable in my quests. My higher education has definitely increased my abilities in interpretting difficult writing.

 

I also homeschool with complete confidence b/c I know my educational background is superior to the majority of teachers. I don't second guess myself. That alone saves vast amounts of energy. ;)

[Plaid Dad]

I'm not a mom, but I do have a dd.

 

I don't consider college and being a homemaker mutually exclusive although I probably interpret Titus 2:5 differently than the OP.

 

I think all children need to learn life skills, including the skills needed to run a home. I've known enough bachelors - and widowers - to know that the need for domestic skills is not limited to girls. I also think that all young people need to have some skill that allows them to earn a living, outside the home if necessary. Unless a girl's family is prepared to support her and her children should she be widowed or abandoned, it is unwise to deny her the knowledge and skills necessary to earn her own living. College is, however, not the only way to gain those - in fact, it can be a very expensive and inefficient way to prepare for the job market, if that is your only goal.

[Lizzie in Ma]

I wanted my daughters to be prepared, as much as possible, for whatever God has in store for them. To me, this meant a firm spiritual training, a good grasp of the practicalities of life and an excellent education. I want my daughters prepared for a satisfying life even if God does not call them to marriage. I want them prepared as much as possible to earn a good living if something happens to their husband if they do marry. I want them prepared to be good helpmeets to their husbands, and I want them prepared to give my grandchildren an excellent education!

 

Anne

 

:iagree:

[Quiver0f10]

I wanted my daughters to be prepared, as much as possible, for whatever God has in store for them. To me, this meant a firm spiritual training, a good grasp of the practicalities of life and an excellent education. I want my daughters prepared for a satisfying life even if God does not call them to marriage. I want them prepared as much as possible to earn a good living if something happens to their husband if they do marry. I want them prepared to be good helpmeets to their husbands, and I want them prepared to give my grandchildren an excellent education!

 

 

 

:iagree: I started a reply until I saw this and this is exactly how we feel and deal with our DDs.

[mommaduck]

Both...

 

They should be trained to be Keepers at Home. One day they might have their own home or will still have to help at home.

 

They also might go to college. But for us "go to college" means living at home and attending college. We don't believe in young ladies out on their own. Just a personal belief of ours.

[skissugar]

well my opinion is this.. They should be trained for both. no matter what they will have a home at some point to care for. and at some point be it right after high school or later in life they might want to have a college education.

[Trivium Academy]

I can't see separating the two, my dd will be a woman who will have some sort of "home" no matter what that picture will eventually be. She needs to be equipped for that. She has the ultimate decision in going to college but she needs to be equipped for making that decision too. I will not train her to seek a husband above all else, I hope to instill enough in her to make good decisions about people, life and her pursuits.

 

Whether she becomes a stay-at-home mother or a career-minded woman, that is her decision. All I can do is prepare her to be able to make those decisions and how to facilitate her decision to the fullest.

 

Can I just say that reading the thoughts of going to college to find a husband reminds me of when women first started going to college? I don't feel a woman's main objective in life is to find a husband but to live a life that is God honoring.

[dirty ethel rackham]

I couldn't have said it better. I also have sons, and I believe that they need to be trained in all 3 areas (spiritually, academically, and life skills including homemaking) for the same reasons. They are fortunate to have a father who is an example of all 3 (probably even better than their mother.)

[summer]

I think a child should be trained in both, girl or boy. You never know when a man will lose his wife and have to take over 100% the care of the children and running the home. You never know when the wife might lose her husband and need to take over the financial care of the home. Regardless, there is a much bigger purpose to college than just a job. I am a stay at home mom and doubt I will ever work again, yet, I have my degree. The same argument against college could be made against high school or any level of education.

 

I would be a little concerned about how your sister cannot wait to get married and have children. As you already know, these are not just job openings. She is primed for running fast in to an abusive marriage. Going to college will train her well for marriage as well as help her find a suitable husband. Hopefully, while educating her more, it will help her mature and grow to a young woman who is truely ready for marriage. All the books in the world on child development and cooking and such cannot possibly replace growing up and maturing and becoming a little more realistic about things.

 

I want to add...even Michelle Duggar went to college. That is how she met Mr Duggar. Think she would ever have met Mr Duggar if she had not gone to college or be able to do the job she does as a wife and mother without it?

 

College is not 100% neccesary, but there is nothing at all about being female that should make it considered bad or wrong.

[Jugglin'5]

Both here as well...I expect my girls will probably marry educated men, and a good help meet to them will need to be educated as well to be the best companion she can be. I also want them to be well-educated for my grandchildren's sakes. Then there is the what if...widowhood, disabled husband factor.

[bettyandbob]

But the reality is that a woman (or man) may have to take on roles they never imagined or desired.

 

I grew up in a house where there was no question of whether I was going to college. The question was where, but not when or if. I also grew up in a house where my brother cooked and cleaned just as much as my sister and I. When you go to college and don't buy a meal plan you have to be able to feed yourself cheaply--this is a basic life skill.

 

From a Christian perspective you cannot decide what God's plan is. You can only be well prepared. You may want to get married, but that may not be God's plan for you. You may want children, but that may not be God's plan for you. And if you get married, there may be struggles you could never have predicted.

 

I honestly believe male or female, everyone should know how to keep a home. I know men who have had to raise children alone. I know women who have been faced with trying to meet the financial needs of their families, due to injury, layoff, disability, death or divorce (this happens even to Christians, who thought it would never happen to them). I've noticed churches and community groups make a big push to help at first, but the charitable help cannot be maintained longterm. And honestly, most people want to take care of themselves and don't want to face longterm dependency on charity. So, I strongly feel women should have education and skills to earn and income should the need arise.

 

While I know some people can get these skills without education the women I know who do not have a degree have very little earning power. They would only be able to seek lay paying retail or administrative work if they needed work. I have a friend who returned to work a few years ago. It took a long time fore her to find someone who would hire her and she was paid $8/hour, with no benefits. This is someone who has strong administrative skills with all current office computer programs and before being a SAHM was a legal secretary (which is hard work). She makes more now, but it's a struggle.

 

I don't know why a SAHM shouldn't be well educated. I certainly feel confident in teaching my dc.

 

Finally, a girl who is college educated is more likely to marry a man who is college educated. This is the least important reason for college. However, the family will have more financial security if this is the case. I know college degrees do not garantee financial security, but on average families in this situation have significant earning power.

 

Now, what if worst case scenario doesn't hit, but the family is like mine. We live in a very expensive area due to dh job. However, the economy, gas and health issues have taken a toll on us. I have 2 part time jobs that I schedule about when dh and 13 year old son can help with childcare for my youngest. I work about 12 hours a week and manage to bring in about $300 a week after taxes. That's small compared to the cost of living where I am, but it's significant for us. One the jobs has a huge hourly pay, which would not be available to me without my degrees.

[...................]

I would most likely encourage her to attend college locally, so that she can live at home. Living at home is much safer in every aspect!!

 

Additionally we will hope to encourage our dc to pursue professions in which she will not usually have to be superior over a man. Careers that would regularly put her in charge of men would, we believe, make it harder for her later to submit to the leading of a Godly husband.

 

And lastly we hope to encourage her to pursue a degree that she can use on the mission field or at least in the home, or use part time such as interior decorating, graphic arts, nursing, etc.

 

We believe all women are to be first and foremost Keepers of the Home, even single women. THerefore we are not likely to encourage our dd to pursue a degree or career that is extremely time consuming or takes years and years of education. Two to Four years of college, in our mind, would be sufficient to ensure that she could bring in part time income if she has to do so once she's married, or that if for some reason she had to work full time, she would be able to support herself.

 

I plan on using Training our Daughters to be Keepers of the Home alongside a light high school roster that would be enough for college admissions to the local community college.

[FloridaLisa]

Both, both, both. A stay-at-home mom, in the normal course of business, can be required to make decisions on budget, economics, insurance, taxes, political issues, medical issues, child development, nutrition, and so much more. She will be teaching her children (even without homeschooling) and discussing theological issues, current events, local, national and world politics, books. Having been to college will help the stay-at-home mom prepare her children and guide them into college. Many, many SAHM work with their husbands in a business.

 

Yes, much of this could be learned without going to college. There is always room for self-teaching. College gives a young person a focused, uninterrupted time to learn a field which, after having kids, will not be available.

 

I am so very glad that I 1) went to college and law school before having children; and 2) worked for a while before staying home. Not only am I well prepared should I ever need to go back to work, but I am compassionate about my dh's work, and am capable of handling any or all of our home business decisions.

 

Lisa

[LizzyBee]

[quote=ChristusG;263354

What do you guys think about it? Guide our daughters towards college....or towards being a keeper of the home?

 

I haven't read the other responses, but why not both? My 14 yo dd can cook, clean, and do laundry, but she is also planning to go to college. There are too many variables in life for women to be unprepared to support themselves if they have to (not that college is the only way to prepare for that). On a personal note, I married young, but my xh was a cheat and I found myself single again at 24 yo. I've had friends who were widowed at a young age and had to support themselves and their children.

[OnTheBrink]

I think a child should be trained in both, girl or boy. You never know when a man will lose his wife and have to take over 100% the care of the children and running the home. You never know when the wife might lose her husband and need to take over the financial care of the home. Regardless, there is a much bigger purpose to college than just a job. I am a stay at home mom and doubt I will ever work again, yet, I have my degree. The same argument against college could be made against high school or any level of education.

 

I would be a little concerned about how your sister cannot wait to get married and have children. As you already know, these are not just job openings. She is primed for running fast in to an abusive marriage. Going to college will train her well for marriage as well as help her find a suitable husband. Hopefully, while educating her more, it will help her mature and grow to a young woman who is truely ready for marriage. All the books in the world on child development and cooking and such cannot possibly replace growing up and maturing and becoming a little more realistic about things.

 

I want to add...even Michelle Duggar went to college. That is how she met Mr Duggar. Think she would ever have met Mr Duggar if she had not gone to college or be able to do the job she does as a wife and mother without it?

 

College is not 100% neccesary, but there is nothing at all about being female that should make it considered bad or wrong.

 

I'm not trying to pick on you at all, but I'm confused as to what the connection is between wanting to marry young and have children and being primed for an abusive marriage. I don't think marrying young = marrying an abuser.

 

As for the Duggars, neither went to college. From an article in the San Diego Union Tribune http://www.signonsandiego.com/uniontrib/20060105/news_lz1c05duggar.html

 

"The Duggars met as teenagers. She was a cheerleader at the public high school here. He attended a private Christian school.

 

They first crossed paths when he and a friend were visiting prospects for their church, First Baptist of Springdale. She had just become Christian. They didn't see each other again until much later, when she was hired to work in a frozen yogurt shop that was managed by Jim Bob's mother, Mary.

 

The couple married just after she graduated from high school. He was 19, she 17. Neither went to college. Together, they launched a used-car business, then towing and real estate businesses. Both are licensed real estate agents."

[Kathy in MD]

I haven't read all of the posts but I agree with the ones I've read. (However you might want to add vocational school as an alternative to to college for training for a career.

 

There's no reason your dd's can't do both. And there are very good reasons for doing both. I'll toss in a couple I haven't seen listed.

 

First and most important is that the woman doesn't have to get married to make a living. She can afford to wait to find Mr. Right.

 

Second and very minor, is that when she's having a STRONG disagreement with her dh, she never can say or think to herself "I'd leave if I could afford it" I've often thought that the idea that "I can't afford to be on my own" has to be slow poisen to a relationship. (I also feel sorry for people who "had" to get married because I wouldn't want the phrase "Well, if you hadn't gotten pregnant" to come up in an argument.)

 

But I'll take your agrument a step further. I want my ds to also have the skills of a homemaker. I don't want him feel the need to get married so he can have a home and not a batchlor pad. (when ds was 7 he announced that he couldn't leave home till he got married because he didn't know how to cook :) ) And what happens if his wife becomes ill, or dies, or deserts him and leaves him with children? He needs to be able to fullfill both the "male" and "female" roles. All too often we forget that the wife is vunerable to the same mortality problems as the husband.

[dangermom]

I wanted my daughters to be prepared, as much as possible, for whatever God has in store for them. To me, this meant a firm spiritual training, a good grasp of the practicalities of life and an excellent education. I want my daughters prepared for a satisfying life even if God does not call them to marriage. I want them prepared as much as possible to earn a good living if something happens to their husband if they do marry. I want them prepared to be good helpmeets to their husbands, and I want them prepared to give my grandchildren an excellent education!

 

This. I strongly believe in education and in the value of being a SAHM. I have a master's--my daughters can too if they like. I'm the first to admit a lack of prowess in the homemaking arena, but that's not my (very educated) mom's fault--she did her best! I try though. If I had sons, which I don't, I'd train them in housekeeping too.

 

I see no reason at all why a girl cannot train to run a home and get as much education as she can. (Come to think of it, my favorite housekeeping book was written by a lawyer!) Education is hugely important for girls for so many reasons.

[Kathy in MD]

I'm not trying to pick on you at all, but I'm confused as to what the connection is between wanting to marry young and have children and being primed for an abusive marriage. I don't think marrying young = marrying an abuser.

 

 

 

 

Marrying young doesn't mean you'll marry an abuser but the phrase "can't wait to get married" can imply a desperation to get married. Sometimes the goal to get married is so important that severe problems seen during the dating stage are ignored.

 

This can happen at any age. Our neighbor's son died and his widow with elemetary age boys was desperate to get re-married. Her new fiance was abusing her before the wedding, but she tried to hide it from her in-laws and still married the bum. It's the "can't wait to get married" phrase that runs up red flags.

[farmwife]

My issue isn't the education itself. My beef with college for girls is sending them away from the family to become very independent single adults, not being under the protection of their father. I honestly don't think sending young girls away from home is an ideal situation. I think there needs to be authority in our lives to protect us from evil. Girls/Women are so easily deceived. I know I was when I left home to go to college, I was taken advantage of by employers and boyfriends alike. It was not a safe place and I don't want my daughters in the same compromising situations I was in as a young girl. Thankfullly, I met my future husband and he was the protection I needed.

 

I honestly think higher education can be really good for girls but I would like them to be under their father's protection and live at home while pursuing their education. :)

[LadyAberlin]

I say both. I was homeschooled and that was how we were. My parents wouldn't have made me go to college, but it was highly recommended. My mom always thought we should have a degree in case the homeschool laws changed and said we had to have a degree to teach. My sister is going to be a Speech Pathologist because she can support herself well and if she gets married she can easily continue doing it from home to bring in income. I was taught that my dh would be the sole provider. Well in the ideal world that is what we would like, but dh makes under $40K a year and we aren't extravagant spenders and it sure would be nice for me to have a way to bring in income working from home part time to help cover the bills. Also my sister is 21 and hasn't dated anyone. She would love to get married and have kids, but that isn't happening at the moment. I have friends that marriage didn't come as soon as they would have liked or hasn't come at all yet and they are stuck barely squeaking by because they really didn't plan on supporting themselves and either didn't go to college or didn't get a degree that was very practical. So I think that it is important to teach your daughter to be a wife and a mother and also have a back up plan for if that doesn't come as soon as hoped or not at all. Also I would encourage a career choice that can be done from home so that she can supplement dh's income if needed. You just don't know what will happen. My dh's income didn't need supplementing when we first got married, but he got laid off a year later and it took 10 months to find the job he has now because they were phasing out his position. My aunt was widowed at 27 and is having to support herself and a daughter. She went back to college after he dh passed away.So I think it is important to be prepared for whatever may happen. I sure wish my degree had been more practical.

[dragons in the flower bed]

My mom and her friend sort of have an unspoken disagreement on this topic. They are both Christians and they both homeschool daughters...my little sister is 14 and my mom's friends daughter is 11. As Christians, should we prepare our daughters to be keepers of the home? Or college bound?

 

I hope this isn't an either/or question. Everyone needs a way to take care of themselves financially, especially if they will be having children. No one knows for sure that their husbands will be around to provide for them, all throughout their lifetimes. The intellectual freedom one gains from a good classical education is equally wonderful in a homemaker, a plumber, or a lawyer.

[Chris in VA]

What an interesting thread. A friend of mine put it well when she said that nothing is wasted--Surely the benefits of higher education go far beyond being able to support yourself if need be. I want my dd to have a chance to expand her mind, to think deeply, to wrestle with issues and to see new perspectives, keeping ever close the Christian perspectives in which we are leading her. I want her to have the luxury of a time apart spent in pursuits such as reading excellent literature, philosophy, and other soul-widening subjects. I want her to meet some interesting people who do not have the same backround (tho I'd prefer she go to a Christian college, even there people are not homogenous). Traditional, after-high school College provides a place and a time to do these things, without the burden of taking care of family. It's not the only way--but it's a good one, I think.

 

If God calls her to a ministry (and I view a job as a ministry) outside the home, she may need a degree. But even if she choses to be a SAH wife (because it's not just moms who stay home), I know God will use whatever she has learned to form her into the person he'd like her to be. I don't think the primary purpose in going to college is to find a husband. I think one of the primary purposes is to grow into the person you are meant to be, and perhaps one of the purposes for that is to become your husband's blessing and helpmeet.

 

My boys are learning to keep house, too, but I'm pretty traditional in that I want the man to be the primary breadwinner, and the woman to take charge of the home. I guess I have a mixed view of the whole "role" thing--I tell my boys to get an education that will facilitate them getting jobs that will support a family, so that their wives have a choice about whether to work or not. I sincerely hope their wives will value staying at home. I hope my dd will marry a wonderful man who can give her a choice, too. I echo those who believe there's something wonderful about having a ministry at home--my soul is most rested when I follow what I think is God's plan, for me to be home, and for dh to provide (God providing, of course, thru both of us--dh, the $, me, other intangibles).

 

I hope dd will grow to be a thoughtful, well-educated woman with much to offer back to God. When she is 18, I pray she will be adult enough to handle the various temptations and worldly influences that going to college will expose her to, without losing her relationship to Jesus Christ. But when she's that old, I believe it will be her responsibility, and I will give her space to fail.

[Lisawa]

I have a few thoughts...:) and a question I would pose back.....

 

 

I would ask this question.... who is to say, that God has marriage in this girls future? What if she is to be single? How will she support herself? Live at home forever? Is that Gods plan? We dont know Gods plan for our kids... our job is to train them up....

 

Sometimes God calls woman to be single... just like men.... I feel its a bit unfortunate that we put this pressure (marriage) on our girls..... only because of the sadness it can bring... when Mr. right doesn't come along and sweep her off her feet.... if he comes... I'm not saying he wont. I think preparing our daughters to accept what God has planned for their lives is what I would do. Teach to be content....

 

I train my daughters to dependent on God, and independent in taking care of them selves. They are being taught to cook, basic sewing *Ü*, caring for others needs, and submission to authority.... God being that authority... us too...*Ü* they are just kids....:D

 

Christian talks about being a wife and a mom. Its something she looks forward too.... but I also mention that sometimes God has other plans on our lives... not to burst her buble... but to plant a seed that will remind her later... our plans dont always work out....

 

Christian has a part time job right now and getting ready to take a class at our bank. The class will teach her about her checking account, savings account and other financial areas she needs to hear and learn about.... I do believe these traits are part of the Provers woman... College, financial responsability.....My girls might need to consider a field and decide to buy it some day *Ü* married or not.

 

College is so important... especially now a day.... There are skills that can aid them if single, or can also bless their husband... Also, if they home school their peeps... and if requirements change over the years... having a degree could help her then too... *Ü* Just a thought...

 

Oh another point... and I'm not trying to foresee in anyones future... but what if this girl marries and never goes to college, or pursues a trade and her husband dies.... how will she support her family then?? These are all things I think about... and why I want my girls to be prepared.

Its a slippery slope when there are such varring opinions... love each other through them.... and ask more questions.... *Ü*

[clwcain]

I'm not a mom, but I do have a dd.

 

I don't consider college and being a homemaker mutually exclusive although I probably interpret Titus 2:5 differently than the OP.

 

I think all children need to learn life skills, including the skills needed to run a home. I've known enough bachelors - and widowers - to know that the need for domestic skills is not limited to girls. I also think that all young people need to have some skill that allows them to earn a living, outside the home if necessary. Unless a girl's family is prepared to support her and her children should she be widowed or abandoned, it is unwise to deny her the knowledge and skills necessary to earn her own living. College is, however, not the only way to gain those - in fact, it can be a very expensive and inefficient way to prepare for the job market, if that is your only goal.

:iagree:

I would add that, in looking for a wife, I had a preference with a woman who could be my intellectual equal. That meant she had to have an education comparable to mine.

 

By the grace of God, I found such a precious woman while at college. After we married, she decided to become a homemaker, and set about learning all the domestic skills she was not raised to have. But our marriage is stronger for her having a solid education, expanded upon in college (liberal arts BA) and graduate school (corporate finance MBA).

 

I'll further add that I think it presumptuous for any parent to rear their child with a partial education on the assumption that the parent knows where in the Vineyard the Good Lord will call that child, male or female, to labor.

[RoughCollie]

We are teaching all of our children, male and female, to be both college-bound and keepers of the home.

 

My daughter wants to be a surgeon. I can't see myself ever telling her no, you will have to prepare for life as a wife and mother instead.

 

My sons do not want to do housework, cooking, laundry, yard work, or any of the other things that are involved in "keeping a home". Yet they will have homes of their own one day, and whether or not they have a wife, they will need to know how to do those things.

 

I want all of my children to be prepared for their lives, which will probably look vastly different than mine. College is in all of their futures. Marriage may not be -- who knows? I want my children to have choices, and a lack of education will limit their choices.

 

RC

[Retired]

activities. I don't know if they will ever marry, or will there wife want to stay home, she may not. I pray they will marry someone who wants to home school etc.

Most of the women I know including home school mom don't cook, because they were raised during the feminist onset. I was raised during that time but my mom stayed home. I am a throw back and even still hang out clothes. My dad didn't think women should work. I was so confused during the time. I didn't want anything to do with my moms life. I wanted the job etc. I didn't realize, that you have different stages of life and can have both.

 

I did go to college at 21. If I did have girls I would very much incourage them attending college or trade school. I love being at home but I also love having a education. My mother is 56 when my dad had a stroke. She had never worked, had no skills, except cleaning house. She was like a child who lost a parent.

Anyway, I am a Christian and my father a pastor. I agree with all scripture but I go with the Proverbs 31 Woman. The Lord guides our path.

[angela in ohio]

My dd will go to college, and they will be keepers at home. I find my college education immensely helpful in homeschooling, and I assume my dd will, also. They will not need it to support themselves (we believe girls - and boys - go directly from our family home to their own family home.)

[nmoira]

I wanted my daughters to be prepared, as much as possible, for whatever God has in store for them. To me, this meant a firm spiritual training, a good grasp of the practicalities of life and an excellent education. I want my daughters prepared for a satisfying life even if God does not call them to marriage.

This is OT, and I apologize. Please feel free to PM me rather than derail this thread. I'm curious as to whether those with this mindset also prepare their sons to be keepers at home in case they don't get married.

 

Edited to add:

I hadn't refreshed to see Plaid Dad's and RoughCollie's responses.

[RoughCollie]

Yes, it can be. My brother does not have a college degree and he is an extremely successful businessman.

 

But most of the people I know who are not able to support themselves very well do not have educations and cannot do anything except unskilled and semi-skilled labor. Their choices are very limited as are their incomes and their lifestyles. I do not want that for my children.

 

I think a lot depends on the individual: how smart they are, how much initiative they have, and how hard they are willing to work, for starters.

 

 

 

College is, however, not the only way to gain those - in fact, it can be a very expensive and inefficient way to prepare for the job market, if that is your only goal.

[Storm Bay]

Both are important. I think if you look at the entire scope of the Bible you'll see that not every woman got married; I Corinthians 7 even discusses those who choose to remain single and the benefits of that. Also, keeper of the home needs to be tied into the qualities of a virtuous woman. In addition, that word keeper can be accurately translated guardian, too. Plus, Lydia was a business woman, most likely a widow who took over her late husband's business. There are so many examples!

 

However, I will say that after doing a lot of research, I also believe that I Tim 2 does NOT teach that women shouldn't teach, but rather that they shouldn't teach that Eve came before Adam. Also, that the last verse in that chapter was not to say that women need to have children to be made whole, but that they can be made whole even with children--most of this epistle was written to counter gnostic and pagan teachings. Most of those taught that Eve was created before Adam and many that childbearing was dirty/bad.

[Anne]

My dh was 32 when we married. He could clean anything (well, except bathrooms...:tongue_smilie:) and he was, and is, a much better cook than I am. If we had had sons, they would definitely have been taught homemaking skills because we believe every person should be able to feed, clothe and clean up after themselves!

 

Anne

[OnTheBrink]

Marrying young doesn't mean you'll marry an abuser but the phrase "can't wait to get married" can imply a desperation to get married. Sometimes the goal to get married is so important that severe problems seen during the dating stage are ignored.

 

This can happen at any age. Our neighbor's son died and his widow with elemetary age boys was desperate to get re-married. Her new fiance was abusing her before the wedding, but she tried to hide it from her in-laws and still married the bum. It's the "can't wait to get married" phrase that runs up red flags.

 

Ok, that makes sense. Desperation can lead to unwise choices, certainly.

 

Oh, and I never answered the OP. I want my dd to be educated and have the skills necessary to run a home. No one knows the future and there's nothing wrong with being prepared for as many situations as possible.

[Catherine]

I only have boys, but doesn't it make sense to equip all children with the basic skills to thrive, alone or married, employed for pay or not? No one knows what the future holds and I consider it neglect to raise a child who cannot take care of themselves. I have aquiantances whose daughter, a brilliant young woman working on an Ivy League degree, express pride in her total inability to do the most simple household tasks. They are practically crowing that she'll be rich enough to hire someone to do those tasks. How sad and pathetic-not to mention impractical.

[abreakfromlife]

interesting thread.......although parts of it are slightly insulting, even though I'm sure that wasn't the intent.

or be able to do the job she does as a wife and mother without it?

that, and the comments made about being able to teach your children well b/c of having a degree.....it is a little bit offensive. A college degree is not needed to be a good wife and mother and homeschool teacher. It obviously can be helpful, but it is not a necessity, and people without degrees can be excellent wives, mothers, and teachers. I've had 1 year of college, and then I stopped, and it's very apparent now that it's God's plan that I am a SAHM, taking care of the kids and educating them. But just b/c I don't have a degree doesn't mean I'm inadequate or don't know as much as college graduates - I'd wager in somethings I know plenty more than college grads, and in any case, education doesn't stop when the diploma arrives. I can educate myself and learn a lot more than I would in school, and for a lot cheaper :D:D However, I'm practical enough to know that the job market wouldn't see me that way, which is why we have a hefty life insurance policy on dh :lol: Not to mention that my dh has an engineering degree - he is great in math and science, but doesn't know much about history, literature, dislikes reading, etc.............Which are the foundations of a classical education, and so it is I who has been reading and researching and will be teaching the kids most of it. I'm the one who is going to learn latin and read through the great books, etc......although he is going to try listening to some of them on audio. But the point that just b/c he has a degree makes him better qualified to teach the kids, is just not true.

 

So, in relation to my dd's, I'm kind of torn. I think we'll probably fall under the 'both' category, but we are very open to God's plan and know that college might not be in every person's future. We do want all of the kids to have some type of apprenticeship/work experience before they go to college. A lot of kids are going to college and racking up huge bills, and they have no idea what they want to do. Our kids aren't going to do that. (if they are, we're not paying anything :lol:) We want them to have experience in different fields and know who they are and what they want to do before they go to college, or trade school, or mission field, whatever.......and all the kids, boys and girls are going to learn housekeeping skills. And, since we are only 26 and have 5 kids - we are very well aware of the financial burden of college. We don't want the kids to suffer the same way we are.....so we probably will do a lot of community college, online classes, etc. 'going away' to college isn't the only way to grow up and mature and find out who you are.

 

The bottom line is we want our kids to be wise. We want them to be wise about God's plan for them, and what the best way is to go about fulfilling it. My BIL is 21 and his parents pushed him to go to a christian college. Which is great, except for it is $$$$$, and they can't help pay for it. And, he doesn't know what he wants to do, really. He has now, after 3 years of school, changed his degree, and has to go a couple more years - and when he is all said and done, will still not be any more marketable than he would with an associates degree. And his field is one that it will be hard to find a good job. And, he's not a very academic person at all..............so he is going to come out of this ordeal deeply in debt, and will have a hard time finding a good job. And he could have done the same thing in a trade school, or with an associate's degree. Dh and I are just amazed at the lack of wisdom that BIL has, and that the in-laws have. It is the most foolish thing we've seen, and b/c it's $$$$, it will have deeper, longer consequence. That is not what we want for our kids. We want them to be wise and obedient to God, and if he calls them to something, and they are faithful to him, he will provide the ways and means.

[Heather in Neverland]

Both for BOTH genders.

 

My mom did not go to college, married and had 3 kids before she was 25yo. When we three kids were young my father had a long-term affair that my mom found out about after it had been going on for a year (my father was a youth pastor, so no, she never suspected it). She wanted to leave him but she had no skills and no way to support 3 small children. So she stayed and was miserable for another 15 years.

 

But she raised me from that moment on that I would go to college and be able to support myself so that I would never be stuck in a marriage like that. I have a master's degree and I am working on my doctorate right now and my husband knows I am married to him because I want to be not because I have to be.

 

I have friends who are in miserable marriages and their husbands take advantage of the fact that they cannot support themselves. That will NEVER happen to me. My husband helps out in the house every day without me asking him and is involved in homeschooling our children. We have a marriage of equals and we are happy that way.

 

I do not have daughters (yet) but I would never encourage my son to go to college and encourage my daughter not to. And I would not tell my daughter to go to college just to meet a husband. That is not why I went. I went to get an education and I did not meet my husband until I was 25yo.

 

Now which college I would send my daughter or son to is a whole different thread....:tongue_smilie:

[Alice]

This is a perhaps a little off-topic but dh and I were just discussing the role of education this past weekend. I think the bottom line behind this post is what is the purpose of college. Is it to train you for a specific job? Or is there value in education just for the sake of education? I definitely believe there is value in education just for the sake of education (and yes, it doesn't have to be college or a degree...but college can and often does provide opportunities not found elsewhere). I want my kids (both genders) to be life-long learners. That's one of our main reasons for home-schooling. I'm sure somehow I'm going to offend someone who doesn't have a college degree...and my intent is not at all to say that you have to have a college degree. Only, that I would want any child of mine who desires more education to pursue it. And that I would hope that all my kids would be active learners, even if they aren't in a formal educational setting.

 

Oh, and Plaid Dad and Chris in VA I tried to rep you guys as I thought your responses were great. But I guess I've repped you in the past so I couldn't.

[AudreyTN]

I took one year of college, dropped out, got married and had kids right away. If I had to do it all over again, I would have finished college before having kids.

 

In saying that, I would probably lean towards finishing college before having a family. BUT my daughter will make her own choices and I will support her either way.

[abreakfromlife]

 

Only, that I would want any child of mine who desires more education to pursue it.

I agree. I think my big thing with the whole degree thing is the money. If a person's goal in college is just to become more educated, there are better and wiser ways of doing it than going off to a 4yr school. If the goal is to be employable, then yes, a degree is pretty much a necessity. For us, with me not having a degree, it does make my faith stronger and really trust that God will provide for us now, and in the future if something happened to dh. I think that to get a degree 'just in case' can hinder faith sometimes in some people, b/c they can rely on their degree for provision instead of God. If something did happen to dh and I had to support the family, I would take some of the insurance money and go back to school. But I'm not going to spend tens of thousands of dollars on a 'just in case' scenario, and I'm not going to encourage any of my kids in that direction, either.

[Lisawa]

interesting thread.......although parts of it are slightly insulting, even though I'm sure that wasn't the intent. that, and the comments made about being able to teach your children well b/c of having a degree.....it is a little bit offensive. A college degree is not needed to be a good wife and mother and homeschool teacher.

 

 

:iagree: agreed, but I wonder if the OP of that comment was meaning something different. I mean, I don't think that the op was saying college will prepare you to teach your children at home or be a better mom.... but simply implying having a college education can, in this day and age... open others doors career and or job wise.

 

I think we can all attest that having a degree isn't what makes us good home schoolers and moms, but its the desire behind it....

 

I cant say my kids have a desire to go to college, but they completely get that education is important if they want to think on their own, form opinions on their own, and career wise help them get a little ahead...

 

My son wants to be a State Trooper, and college or degrees are not a must....but my son knows that if he has an AA, its an automatic pay raise by 2%, bachelors degree 4% pay increase.

 

Its not the fact that college makes us better peeps, it aids us in furthering skills and knowldge....

 

I just dont think it was intended the way you though... but then I have not read all the posts in this thread... so forgive me if I misinterpret this.:)

[Kathy in MD]

Maybe this comment should be another thread, but I'll ask it here anyway. Several individuals posted that they wanted to have their dd's live at home and commute to college. Only one mentioned that they wanted the same for their ds's. Yes, there is the problem that girls are more likely to be physically attacked. But other than that, I don't understand the fear of sending a daughter away to college but not a son. From my college years, it was the boys that got into trouble more often. They're the one's that had the wildest parties, their the ones that threw a vending machine out the dorm window, they're the ones who........

 

To me it seems more sensible to look at the individual. Is the individual strong in his/her faith, morals and values? Is the individual able to stand up to friends and others when they urge the individual to violate those values? Can the individual select good friends? Is the individual likely to get swept up into the action without thinking? Is the individual highly social AND a follower?

 

I don't see that girls are inheriently weaker than boys at standing up to and avoiding problems. I've seen girls and women with very strong moral background. I also have a highly social SON who is a follower. I worry about him in college, not my eldest niece.