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wuhan - coronavirus

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1 hour ago, Bootsie said:

Sweden has 341 cases/M

Norway has 724 cases/M

Denmark has 388 cases/M

Sweden's first case was reported Jan 30.  Norway and Denmark's first cases were not until about 3 1/2 weeks after that.  So, Sweden has had more time for this to spread, but has had proportionately less spread even though less extreme measures have been taken.  

 

I don't think looking at cases tells you much here as I believe Sweden doesn't test unless it is a severe case (not sure about the other countries). Deaths are Sweden 105 vs. Norway 23 and Denmark 65. Per million in Sweden it is 10 vx. Norway 4 and Denmark 11. I think it is too early to tell how this will develop (though it seems obvious that Sweden will have more cases/deaths than other countries if the don't limit people meeting). Of course it could still turn out that their approach is good/better in the long run.

Edited by Twolittleboys
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Bno: Spain reports 6,549 new cases of coronavirus and 838 new deaths since yesterday, raising total to 78,797 cases and 6,528 dead

Edited by Ausmumof3

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1 hour ago, StellaM said:

 

There's also a six month moratorium on evictions (commercial and residential), and people over 70, over 60 with a chronic disease, and over 50 and Indigenous are advised to stay at home to the maximum degree possible.

Thanks was trying to listen while cooking dinner and the birds were screeching 

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It crossed my mind that Cuomo may not want to ban travel because at the moment I imagine it’s mostly going one way - out of NY - and that is probably helping them cope.

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8 hours ago, Arcadia said:

“BRUSSELS: As hospitals face an overload of COVID-19 patients struggling to breathe, innovative medical staff are turning to snorkelling masks from sports stores to stop their lungs collapsing.

I can say that since the FDA has loosened restrictions, dh has seen a lot of ingenuity from medical personnel. They’ve gone full  Macgyver and looked at what they have loads of in stock and how they can make PPE out of it. All of the ideas that have been building up all these years while they worked, they are thinking of ways to implement them. I know regulation and FDA approval is there to help protect us, but at some point it hinders good old American ingenuity. 

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Does anyone know of a list that breaks down cases by % of state population? 
 

 

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@Arcadia The Scuba mask thing is super cool. I saw an article on it as well. 

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25 minutes ago, Plum said:

The kids had something in early March that was crazy in its similarity to COVID19. So eery. But I don’t think it was, because neither DH nor myself caught it, and DH is immune suppressed and I have moderate/severe asthma. Both DH and I had headaches and fatigue during that time, which we took to mean our immune systems were successfully fighting whatever the kids had. That’s why I won’t put much stock in people’s claims that they had COVID19 last year. 

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4 hours ago, Carrie12345 said:

One of my predictions did not come true, and I wish it had. Apologies to NY, but I did think they’d truly lock it down; at least the islands. It was actually my prediction *weeks ago, and had me worried about dh getting stuck the last time he went in. I can’t even remember when that was, but it’s been a while!

With so much pride being expressed for “shutting down” travel from China, I was surprised it took so long to consider blocking travel out of NY. As much as I’m adoring Cuomo these days, the insistence on letting people freely travel around the country (not JUST from NY, but especially) is really destroying whatever hope I might have had.

Locally, where we’re supposed to only go out for essentials, people are still trying to sell on the market place, find people to do non-essential home improvement jobs, and get together in small groups in the woods because “we’re still allowed to hike”. (Meanwhile, those people are essential workers who are exposed to many people every day.). I do think all of them believe that they’re following the regulations and recommendations. 

There are cases in every state now. There’s NO POINT in locking down NY. The cat is out of the bag. Pandora’s box has long been open.

There needs to be a national strategy and need to be federal laws, like, yesterday. This is going to be an epic, unnecessary disaster. The longer we go on with toothless “guidance” from the national level (not to mention the misinformed reassurances that slow action), the worse it will be. 

Edited by square_25
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4 minutes ago, square_25 said:

There are cases in every state now. There’s NO POINT in locking down NY. The cat is out of the bag. Pandora’s box has long been open.

There needs to be a national strategy and federal laws, like, yesterday. This is going to be an epic, unnecessary disaster. The longer we go on with toothless “guidance” from the national level (not to mention the misinformed reassurances that slow action), the worse it will be. 

Can you clarify what you mean here? I feel like my state is doing a fantastic job. I do not think we (in MN) need the same approach as in NY. I would love to see more guidance and stability from the federal government, but what kind of laws do you want to see enacted?

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2 hours ago, Bootsie said:

Doctors, nurses, pharmacists, air traffic controllers, director of housing at universities, engineers running oil refineries are just some of those who are working.  

Plus people keeping the water supply safe, the power on, and the farmers starting to plant their crops here in the US. Saw lots of police out and about when DH & I went for a walk. (Rural midwest. Was drizzling so no one else was out for a walk, but saw three police vehicles. We have a confirmed case in our county but are in a state that is not testing unless you are in the hospital.)

@Plum, I don't know where their data is from but CNN has a chart from a couple days ago. I like using Covidtracking.com, but they don't have a by population column. 

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9 minutes ago, TracyP said:

Can you clarify what you mean here? I feel like my state is doing a fantastic job. I do not think we (in MN) need the same approach as in NY. I would love to see more guidance and stability from the federal government, but what kind of laws do you want to see enacted?

I actually think a nationwide shelter in place would probably make sense at this point, unfortunately. It's a very blunt instrument, but otherwise, I think every place in the US is going to go on the same curve, and we won't be able to stop places from "sparking" other places because it's all over the place. I would also like to see them take care of purchasing of all the equipment nationally and of coordinating all the labs (state and private) nationally, then start distributing serious testing so that the approach can be changed. 

I would like to say that this feels like a last resort option and one that wouldn't need to be triggered, except for the failure of testing and the resulting failure of containment. We had a similar failure of containment here in NY, so it's not just at the national level. 

I know you're probably going to disagree with that, but I am terrified of what's going to happen if we don't do something like that. 

Of course, I don't actually think this will happen, so I'm guessing this will be a large-scale disaster. 

Edited by square_25
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2 minutes ago, square_25 said:

I actually think a nationwide shelter in place would probably make sense at this point, unfortunately. It's a very blunt instrument, but otherwise, I think every place in the US is going to go on the same curve, and we won't be able to stop places from "sparking" other places because it's all over the place. I would also like to see them take care of purchasing of all the equipment nationally and of coordinating all the labs (state and private) nationally, then start distributing serious testing so that the approach can be changed. 

 

Yep, I'll disagree. 😉 In a nutshell, I think we are way too big for this - the U.S. that is. Maybe regional shutdowns? Maybe guidelines for when to shut down? Some states do not seem to get it, at all...

 I believe we are going to be going through rolling shut downs to some extent for the next 18-24 mos. And yep, we are going to have places "sparking" other places the entire time. I don't know how to avoid that. I think the shut downs have to be localized though. 

On testing and equipment gathering, yeah I'd like to see that. Not holding my breath, though. 

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25 minutes ago, square_25 said:

I actually think a nationwide shelter in place would probably make sense at this point, unfortunately. It's a very blunt instrument, but otherwise, I think every place in the US is going to go on the same curve, and we won't be able to stop places from "sparking" other places because it's all over the place. I would also like to see them take care of purchasing of all the equipment nationally and of coordinating all the labs (state and private) nationally, then start distributing serious testing so that the approach can be changed. 

I would like to say that this feels like a last resort option and one that wouldn't need to be triggered, except for the failure of testing and the resulting failure of containment. We had a similar failure of containment here in NY, so it's not just at the national level. 

I know you're probably going to disagree with that, but I am terrified of what's going to happen if we don't do something like that. 

Of course, I don't actually think this will happen, so I'm guessing this will be a large-scale disaster. 

 

Contact White House (website contact form, phone line or both).  That may actually help Along with others who are also. 

They apparently do consider both comments in favor of closing down nationally and ones (Like from Aethylreth the Texan ) who want everything opened up. ( ETA  or from people who like TracyP want it decided local level and rolling for an extended time.)

I also signed the Hammer and the Dance Petition which is similar. 

Edited by Pen
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4 minutes ago, TracyP said:

 

Yep, I'll disagree. 😉 In a nutshell, I think we are way too big for this - the U.S. that is. Maybe regional shutdowns? Maybe guidelines for when to shut down? Some states do not seem to get it, at all...

 I believe we are going to be going through rolling shut downs to some extent for the next 18-24 mos. And yep, we are going to have places "sparking" other places the entire time. I don't know how to avoid that. I think the shut downs have to be localized though. 

On testing and equipment gathering, yeah I'd like to see that. Not holding my breath, though. 

 

What does our size have to do with it, though? The more coordinated a response, the better. The fact that we're lucky enough to be able to order lots of people at the same time is good. If Europe COULD shut all of it down, it would be a good thing, probably. 

I'm not holding my breath on any of it, anyway. 

2 minutes ago, Pen said:

They apparently do consider both comments in favor of closing down nationally and one (Like from Aethylreth the Texan ) who want everything opened up. 

 

Oh, why do people want everything opened up? 😞

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3 minutes ago, square_25 said:

Oh, why do people want everything opened up? 😞

 

So they can touch up their hair roots at the beauty salon. 

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Cross post:

 

https://medium.com/@tomaspueyo/coronavirus-the-hammer-and-the-dance-be9337092b56

Tomas Pueyo in Medium:

ScreenHunter_3924-Mar.-27-18.13-360x247.Summary of the article: Strong coronavirus measures today should only last a few weeks, there shouldn’t be a big peak of infections afterwards, and it can all be done for a reasonable cost to society, saving millions of lives along the way. If we don’t take these measures, tens of millions will be infected, many will die, along with anybody else that requires intensive care, because the healthcare system will have collapsed.

 

 

criticism of Hammer and Dance approach:

https://www.fiphysician.com/criticism-hammer-and-dance/

Edited 12 hours ago by Pen 
Added summary from 3quarksdaily.com. And addition of a contrary view

 

 

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2 minutes ago, square_25 said:

 

What does our size have to do with it, though? The more coordinated a response, the better. The fact that we're lucky enough to be able to order lots of people at the same time is good. If Europe COULD shut all of it down, it would be a good thing, probably. 

I'm not holding my breath on any of it, anyway. 

 

Oh, why do people want everything opened up? 😞

What is the long view? Unless we plan to shut down until we get a vaccine  - a minimum of 18 mos - we are going to have to get on with life at some point. Very, very unfortunately we have lost the opportunity to stop Covid. 

We need to slow the exponential growth, but I don't think anyone believes we are going to stop the growth. We need to get testing in place so we can keep the lid on outbreaks when they happen, that is certain. But I'm not sure what a blanket shutdown of areas with very few cases actually accomplishes in the long run.

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5 minutes ago, Pen said:

 

 

So they can touch up their hair roots at the beauty salon. 

That is a complete mischaracterization of some very well thought out replies on that thread. I may not agree, but geez.

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1 minute ago, TracyP said:

What is the long view? Unless we plan to shut down until we get a vaccine  - a minimum of 18 mos - we are going to have to get on with life at some point. Very, very unfortunately we have lost the opportunity to stop Covid. 

We need to slow the exponential growth, but I don't think anyone believes we are going to stop the growth. We need to get testing in place so we can keep the lid on outbreaks when they happen, that is certain. But I'm not sure what a blanket shutdown of areas with very few cases actually accomplishes in the long run.

 

Could you read both the article linked below, and the criticism linked and then could we discuss your question?

 

https://medium.com/@tomaspueyo/coronavirus-the-hammer-and-the-dance-be9337092b56

Tomas Pueyo in Medium:

ScreenHunter_3924-Mar.-27-18.13-360x247.Summary of the article: Strong coronavirus measures today should only last a few weeks, there shouldn’t be a big peak of infections afterwards, and it can all be done for a reasonable cost to society, saving millions of lives along the way. If we don’t take these measures, tens of millions will be infected, many will die, along with anybody else that requires intensive care, because the healthcare system will have collapsed.

 

 

criticism of Hammer and Dance approach:

https://www.fiphysician.com/criticism-hammer-and-dance/

Edited 12 hours ago by Pen 
Added summary from 3quarksdaily.com. And addition of a contrary view

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2 minutes ago, TracyP said:

That is a complete mischaracterization of some very well thought out replies on that thread. I may not agree, but geez.

As  I said, we just go after each other.  Humanity is doomed.

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3 hours ago, TracyP said:

That is a complete mischaracterization of some very well thought out replies on that thread. I may not agree, but geez.

 

Ok. You are right, it’s at least an oversimplification.

(ETA And yet... if that weren’t a part of it expressed by someone on another thread, how would you link what I wrote to a particular thread? )

 

We could just as well use

“so they can party on the beach” / “go to bars” college kids

”so they can hang out at the mall” teens 

 

 

 

Edited by Pen
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12 minutes ago, TracyP said:

What is the long view? Unless we plan to shut down until we get a vaccine  - a minimum of 18 mos - we are going to have to get on with life at some point. Very, very unfortunately we have lost the opportunity to stop Covid. 

We need to slow the exponential growth, but I don't think anyone believes we are going to stop the growth. We need to get testing in place so we can keep the lid on outbreaks when they happen, that is certain. But I'm not sure what a blanket shutdown of areas with very few cases actually accomplishes in the long run.

The long view? Get testing ramped up so that containment becomes feasible again. Build more hospitals and buy more ventilators and train more people who can use them, stat. Test treatment protocols. Work on an antibody test. 

It's not like this is all theoretical. I know for a fact they are doing all this in NY. I imagine they are doing it elsewhere, too. And these aren't happening at a time scale of 18 months. 

Edited by square_25
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5 minutes ago, Pen said:

 

Ok. You are right.  

Though tbh, quite aside from that thread, I was in a Red Hat Ladies group and things like wanting to get hair colorized really was a big thing causing them to decry Stay Home Stay Safe rules - especially if they felt they had already lived a long life and “had to die of something “ 

We could just as well use “so they can party on the beach” college kids

”so they can hang out at the mall” teens 

 

 

I just replied to that thread, lol. I do agree with her that the long lines at HEB are a bigger problem than getting hair colored ;-). 

We had a babysitter come in for about a week after we stopped going out. It was probably not the optimal decision, but it was hard to give EVERYTHING up... so I get that perspective. 

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4 minutes ago, Pen said:

 

Could you read both the article linked below, and the criticism linked and then could we discuss your question?

 

 

I read the first when it was posted earlier in this thread. I'll try to read the other sometime. What if we took a more nuanced approach? Like what if each state needed to

1) get testing capacity to test any symptomatic person

2) increase icu capacity to 'x' level

3) gather sufficient levels of PPE to protect healthcare workers

My state is shut down until these 3 things happen - hopefully 2 weeks. I fully support this. I'm not sure why we should stay shut down until, say, Louisiana does the same. We are a thousand miles apart. It just doesn't make sense to me.

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4 minutes ago, square_25 said:

The long view? Get testing ramped up so that containment becomes feasible again. Build more hospitals and buy more ventilators and train more people who can use them, stat. Test treatment protocols. Work on an antibody test. 

It's not like this is all theoretical. I know for a fact they are doing all this in NY. I imagine they are doing it elsewhere, too. And these aren't happening at a time scale of 18 months. 

100% agree. But why does MN have to stay shut down until LA does this, for example?

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Just now, TracyP said:

I read the first when it was posted earlier in this thread. I'll try to read the other sometime. What if we took a more nuanced approach? Like what if each state needed to

1) get testing capacity to test any symptomatic person

2) increase icu capacity to 'x' level

3) gather sufficient levels of PPE to protect healthcare workers

My state is shut down until these 3 things happen - hopefully 2 weeks. I fully support this. I'm not sure why we should stay shut down until, say, Louisiana does the same. We are a thousand miles apart. It just doesn't make sense to me.

 

Because the testing ramp up also needs to happen at a federal level. It would happen faster, for one thing. And because unless you enforce no travel across state lines (you won't), the states will continue to affect each other. 

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Just now, TracyP said:

100% agree. But why does MN have to stay shut down until LA does this, for example?

But why should these be done locally in the first place? 

Also, you're going to be affected by what happens in the states near you. Maybe not LA, but if some state near you is being a problem, you're going to have a harder time than you do otherwise. It may also be harder for you to buy equipment if it's not bought on a nationwide scale. 

To be clear, I think doing this nationwide and ramping up quickly will be less disruptive to the economy overall, not more. Having to put out giant fires for 18 months (which may be where we are going) is going to be awful. 

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55 minutes ago, square_25 said:

I actually think a nationwide shelter in place would probably make sense at this point, unfortunately. It's a very blunt instrument, but otherwise, I think every place in the US is going to go on the same curve, and we won't be able to stop places from "sparking" other places because it's all over the place. I would also like to see them take care of purchasing of all the equipment nationally and of coordinating all the labs (state and private) nationally, then start distributing serious testing so that the approach can be changed. 

I would like to say that this feels like a last resort option and one that wouldn't need to be triggered, except for the failure of testing and the resulting failure of containment. We had a similar failure of containment here in NY, so it's not just at the national level. 

I know you're probably going to disagree with that, but I am terrified of what's going to happen if we don't do something like that. 

Of course, I don't actually think this will happen, so I'm guessing this will be a large-scale disaster. 

Agreed, on all points. 
But not the kind of wussy “shelter in place/stay at home” garbage many of us have now. ACTUAL stay on your own dang property except for medical care, and possibly limited food trips. The only other people out to be the ones doing the things to keep truly essential services working (including food to people who need it.)

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5 minutes ago, square_25 said:

But why should these be done locally in the first place? 

Also, you're going to be affected by what happens in the states near you. Maybe not LA, but if some state near you is being a problem, you're going to have a harder time than you do otherwise. It may also be harder for you to buy equipment if it's not bought on a nationwide scale. 

To be clear, I think doing this nationwide and ramping up quickly will be less disruptive to the economy overall, not more. Having to put out giant fires for 18 months (which may be where we are going) is going to be awful. 

I have to move on, the kids want to play a game 🙂. We are going to have to agree to disagree. My governor is working closely with the states around us to join forces to gather supplies and coordinate their responses to some extent. You won't convince me that the federal government could do this better.

Edited by TracyP
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1 minute ago, square_25 said:

 

I just replied to that thread, lol. I do agree with her that the long lines at HEB are a bigger problem than getting hair colored ;-). 

We had a babysitter come in for about a week after we stopped going out. It was probably not the optimal decision, but it was hard to give EVERYTHING up... so I get that perspective. 

 

I go into a city to shop, but it is a small city.  I have to think back to picture lines and crowding at Fairway market or Zabars or the like.  

However, face to face contact with a hair dresser for an extended time is likely quite high risk if either person has an easily spread respiratory virus.

And shopping could be spread out more as in Italy so that people aren’t crowded together.  

There no doubt are people getting sick from virus on surfaces to 3 days, virus wafting in air up to 3 hours, etc.  Still, faces near to faces and droplets is believed in what I have read to account for far more transmission. 

 

 

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Just now, TracyP said:

I have to move on, the kids want to play a game 🙂. We are going to have to agree to disagree. My governor is working closely with the states around us to join forces to gather supplies and coordinate their responses to some extent. You won't convince that the federal government could do this better.

I don't think this one can, anyway. I hope your area doesn't get hit hard and that your preparations are adequate :-). 

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Just now, Pen said:

And shopping could be spread out more as in Italy so that people aren’t crowded together.  

 

Yes, or you could set up delivery services with protection for the people doing deliveries. There are lots of better solutions than the current makeshift and uncoordinated ones we're putting in place.

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2 minutes ago, Carrie12345 said:

Agreed, on all points. 
But not the kind of wussy “shelter in place/stay at home” garbage many of us have now. ACTUAL stay on your own dang property except for medical care, and possibly limited food trips. The only other people out to be the ones doing the things to keep truly essential services working (including food to people who need it.)

Yeah, that would be better. But I think the time to do something like this is rapidly running out. 

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2 hours ago, Plum said:

Does anyone know of a list that breaks down cases by % of state population? 
 

 

Not by state, but this site allows you to input a zip code and it will tell you the percent of cases in that county.

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2 minutes ago, Pawz4me said:

Not by state, but this site allows you to input a zip code and it will tell you the percent of cases in that county.

Of course, you have to assume that your county is bothering to test... 

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9 minutes ago, TracyP said:

I read the first when it was posted earlier in this thread. I'll try to read the other sometime. What if we took a more nuanced approach? Like what if each state needed to

1) get testing capacity to test any symptomatic person

 

You would also need testing and public health capacity for contact tracing and testing to be in operation Afaik for a state short shut down and reopen to be successful 

9 minutes ago, TracyP said:

2) increase icu capacity to 'x' level

3) gather sufficient levels of PPE to protect healthcare workers

 

And for emergency responders and for teachers and for _____ many occupations, not just healthcare.  Or at least the ~ 40% of adult population with higher risk factors 

9 minutes ago, TracyP said:

My state is shut down until these 3 things happen - hopefully 2 weeks. I fully support this. I'm not sure why we should stay shut down until, say, Louisiana does the same. We are a thousand miles apart. It just doesn't make sense to me.

 

If you will have your state borders shut (effectively) to arrivals from other states until  21 days after all were in compliance with same types of things your state does, so already with their transmission under control for a state with very little CV19 and to take a hard quarantine and contact tracing period then to open up in itself, but not to outside, that could possibly work, I think.  But it would depend on your states being like a little self sufficient country  unto itself, I think.  No trucking supplies in from elsewhere, no Amazon, no UPS etc, bringing in cases, no tourists or business travelers  from New York or Louisiana .  Otherwise it might be like your state being Taiwan, but open to people coming in from Wuhan. 

By instead shutting all “nonessential” activities it allows for essential goods and services to move between states as an activity of risk, but for that to be to some degree balanced with far less opportunity for viral transmission internally.  

And you may be 1000 miles from New Orleans, but not so far in time and access by modern travel , nor so far from other places with problems like NY, Chicago... (what is happening in Detroit?)    

 

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4 minutes ago, Pen said:

No trucking supplies in from elsewhere, no Amazon, no UPS etc, bringing in cases, no tourists or business travelers  from New York or Louisiana .  Otherwise it might be like your state being Taiwan, but open to people coming in from Wuhan. 

That's what Cuomo was saying -- that closing state borders is a logistical nightmare. What about the mail? What about supplies? This can't be done without careful planning. I can imagine it being a good idea, but it can't be spur of the moment. 

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25 minutes ago, square_25 said:

That's what Cuomo was saying -- that closing state borders is a logistical nightmare. What about the mail? What about supplies? This can't be done without careful planning. I can imagine it being a good idea, but it can't be spur of the moment. 

 

I am inclined to think keeping essential production and supplies chains open (with increasing PPE available for workers in those areas and Nat Guard help too if needed eg young people to do trucking instead of at risk older commercial drivers)  is better approach.

And to shut down nonessentials for time needed.

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“Starting Sunday, UCSF Medical Center adopted a universal mask rule, meaning that everyone who enters the hospital will be given a mask that must be worn inside the building. Salesforce is providing the supplies to make this possible.
http://nbcbay.com/PupP43z”

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10 minutes ago, Arcadia said:

“Starting Sunday, UCSF Medical Center adopted a universal mask rule, meaning that everyone who enters the hospital will be given a mask that must be worn inside the building. Salesforce is providing the supplies to make this possible.
http://nbcbay.com/PupP43z”

Excellent idea. I'm glad you have the supplies for that. 

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16 minutes ago, Pen said:

 

I am inclined to think keeping essential production and supplies chains open (with increasing PPE available for workers in those areas and Nat Guard help too if needed eg young people to do trucking instead of at risk older commercial drivers)  is better approach.

And to shut down nonessentials for time needed.

I tend to agree. 

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30 minutes ago, Pen said:

 

You would also need testing and public health capacity for contact tracing and testing to be in operation Afaik for a state short shut down and reopen to be successful 

 

And for emergency responders and for teachers and for _____ many occupations, not just healthcare.  Or at least the ~ 40% of adult population with higher risk factors 

 

If you will have your state borders shut (effectively) to arrivals from other states until  21 days after all were in compliance with same types of things your state does, so already with their transmission under control for a state with very little CV19 and to take a hard quarantine and contact tracing period then to open up in itself, but not to outside, that could possibly work, I think.  But it would depend on your states being like a little self sufficient country  unto itself, I think.  No trucking supplies in from elsewhere, no Amazon, no UPS etc, bringing in cases, no tourists or business travelers  from New York or Louisiana .  Otherwise it might be like your state being Taiwan, but open to people coming in from Wuhan. 

By instead shutting all “nonessential” activities it allows for essential goods and services to move between states as an activity of risk, but for that to be to some degree balanced with far less opportunity for viral transmission internally.  

And you may be 1000 miles from New Orleans, but not so far in time and access by modern travel , nor so far from other places with problems like NY, Chicago... (what is happening in Detroit?)    

 

I can't break up quote on my phone; hopefully you can follow my replies.

Yes, and the capability to contract trace would be a part of that.

Well, teaching is online here officially until May 1 and likely for the remainder of the year. I would consider first responders to be health care providers so, yes to that. I'm not sure what PPE for "high risk" populations means in this context.

I am watching people from high risk areas come to their cabins in my area. I am so not thrilled about it... sigh. But my state isn't putting these measures in place so we can stop covid. It is putting them in place so we can slow covid. So we can identify pockets when they pop up and control them before they get out of hand. Again, the long view.

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Just now, TracyP said:

am watching people from high risk areas come to their cabins in my area. I am so not thrilled about it... sigh. But my state isn't putting these measures in place so we can stop covid. It is putting them in place so we can slow covid. So we can identify pockets when they pop up and control them before they get out of hand. Again, the long view.

Yeah, no one's going to stop it. The question is whether we'll slow it down enough to cope, that's all. 

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@Jenny in Florida and all the Florida people, this news is scary 

https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/world/covid19-coronavirus-zaandam-passengers-transferred-12587478

“The ship's Dutch owner Holland America said Friday four passengers had died and two more had tested positive for COVID-19.

...

Passengers showing no signs of the virus were ferried from the Zaandam to the Rotterdam on Saturday, a French tourist told AFP by telephone.

...

Panama's Maritime Affairs Minister Noriel Arauz told AFP that 401 passengers who had tested negative for COVID-19 would be allowed to leave the Zaandam.

People who were ill and those who had been in contact with them will not be transferred.

The Zaandam will now head to Fort Lauderdale in Florida, where the remaining passengers will be able to disembark, according to Holland America and Panamanian officials.

The Rotterdam is expected to return to San Diego, Arauz said.”

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2 hours ago, TracyP said:

100% agree. But why does MN have to stay shut down until LA does this, for example?

 

Wouldn’t there at least be a need for travel restrictions?

nvm I see this was addressed up thread 

Edited by Seasider too

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10 minutes ago, RootAnn said:

The call is going out for people with 3D printers to help by printing the frames for face shields. I've seen a few on YouTube. 


FYI info and the STL files needed for 3D printing   🙂

https://www.prusaprinters.org/prints/25857-prusa-protective-face-shield-rc2

https://formlabs.com/covid-19-response/

https://www.carbon3d.com/covid19/

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