Would you leave your 3 children in the car?

[AimeeM]

Here, middle school is grades 6-8; age 11 by August 31st.

I don't consider 10 and 11 middle school age.

And trips often take longer than they should.

 

Additionally, Home Depot will let your dog shop with you if he is appropriately behaved.  

 

However, I still don't have an issue with it provided you feel you can trust the children AND the children can handle the dog should they need to roll the windows down further, get out of the vehicle for some reason, etc.  Additionally, of course, they'd need to know what to do in the case of an emergency.

 

I think parents tend to be one extreme or another these days, either way permissive/careless or overprotective.  This is a pretty middle of the road situation so there will likely be plenty judging from each end :)

 

[AmyontheFarm]

I just a posed a similar question on my facebook page, so it will be interesting what people say in Ontario.  One of my friends is an officer so she might weigh in also.

[Ellie]

This is another thread where I know opinions will vary greatly, but I would be interested to know what you think.

 

The other day, I needed to run in Home Depot and was only in there about 7-8 minutes.  My 3 children are middle school age where I live.  They are extremely responsible and mature for their ages.  VERY safe area.   The temp was high 70's and the windows were all cracked.  Also, my German Shepherd dog was with them.  I came out to the van to find this elderly lady looking in the tinted windows and talking to my children.  She approached me and said she was worried about them etc...  I told her they were middle school age and they're fine.  She said she didn't know etc...  So my kids told me when I got in the van that she was asking them if they're alright, are they hot....  They were like "No, we're fine".  She had even told a worker that was in the parking lot getting carts.  

 

My kids asked me why that lady was talking to them like they were toddlers.  But I got to thinking about it and wondering if it was not something most people do when their kids are those ages (10 and 11 years old).  I'd never let them stay in the van when it's too hot or I'll be longer than just a few mins.

 

Thoughts???

 

I never left my dc in the car, not at any age (although I did once go into a 7-11, where I parked at the curb and could still see them through the store windows). I hated it when my parents did it to me, and so I never did it to my dc.

[Susan in TN]

OP, because of the possibility of the situation you encountered, I only leave my kids in the car if one of my older teens (18yo or 15yo) is in there with them.  And they would be in the 12 passenger van which has dark tinted windows - so not easy to see into, though they would be able to see my teen in the front seat.

[NoseInABook]

That would not be legal here, so no, I wouldn't leave them in the car alone. You cannot leave a child younger than 6. If they are over 6 you can leave them if there is a child who is at least 13 with them. 

 

[AlmiraGulch]

My 11 year old starts middle school this fall.

 

I would have no issue leaving her in the car.  She can always come in with me if she wants to but often she doesn't feel like it, so I don't make her. 

[candicane]

Never. Even if it's only a certain degree outside, it's a lot hotter inside of the car.

 

Especially here in Arizona. There's countless stories on the news of people leaving their children in the car and the child dying. I wouldn't want to risk that. Same goes for a pet.

 

I'd rather just take the children in with me, and leave the dog at home where it belongs.

[TeenagerMom]

I would have left them too! My DC stay in the car all the time and they are close in age. They have gotten out, locked the door and come to find me in the store if they get hot, bored, or have to pee.

[Laura Corin]

I just read this article about the exact same topic. It definitely made me rethink my position on this issue.

http://www.salon.com/2014/06/03/the_day_i_left_my_son_in_the_car/

 

But that's about a small child, not middle-schoolers.  That's a different issue.

 

L

[wintermom]

I would have no problem with it. Typically, this age of child would be walking to and from school daily (if they lived close enough), and could legally come home to an empty house after school. Why would being left in a car for 10 minutes with mom 200 feet away in a store suddenly be a high risk situation?

[Amy in NH]

With temps in the high 70s, I'd leave my 12 and 8 year olds alone in the car together for 5-10 minutes at a time with the windows rolled down and the doors locked.  They know not to open for anyone but me.

[Χά�ων]

I left my mom in the car and came back 10 minutes later to a dead battery...

[aggieamy]

Let's go with aggieamy's safety check:

 

Responsible age?  Check.

Safety in numbers?  Check.

Gone for less than 15 minutes?  Check.

 

I would have done it and thought nothing of it.  

[Matryoshka]

Right now, considering all the things that could happen and the physical, mental and emotional stages of my children, I wouldn't leave them in the car till they were about 14. Where they can be at that age where they know what to do in most situations, and where, if it does get hot, they can happily get out of the car, lock up, and either make their way in to find me, or leave a note in the car as to where they have gone, and I can be happy enough with them going off. So all that seems around 14 to me.

 

I'm honestly stunned that so many people pick 14 as an age where a kid can sit alone in a car for a short period of time by themselves, when in one more year they can get their driver's permit and drive the car. 

 

Surely there's more than one year gap between "sit in car" and "drive the car".

 

I'd say the vast majority of middle-school-aged kids, barring some kind of huge impulse-control problem, have enough judgement to sit in a car.  If it gets hot, they can get out and come inside and find a parent.  These are not toddlers stuck in 5-point harnesses!  If they're old enough to go in the store from the car on an errand while you wait, they can just as easily make the same trip inside with you to find in there!  And heck, don't most of them have phones these days?  They could call you and wonder where you are or tell you if something's wrong.

 

And yeah, I think the absolute most dangerous thing in this scenario is busybodies.  We really are infantalizing our children...

[snowbeltmom]

Ugh, I'm so sick of busybodies. My 12 year old is a mother's helper/babysitter for littler kids, and yet somehow she's going to get hurt in a locked car on a cool day? Ridiculous. I have gotten people compaining when I walked away from my van to the gas station office, 25 feet away, to pay for gas. 

 

:iagree:

I don't understand the concern about leaving kids that age alone in the car.  If it gets too hot, they can get out of the car.  I was not aware that states have laws about leaving kids alone in the car.  When I was growing up, all the kids in the neighborhood walked to school and back without parents from K on.  If it is against the law to leave an 8 year old alone in the car, is it also against the law for an 8 year old to walk to school without adult supervision?

 

[Meriwether]

I have left my kids in the van before and they are younger. I evaluate each scenario individually. Four kids in a small town outside a small store is different than one kid in a large parking lot in a city. In the OP's situation, I don't see a high degree of risk.

[Tmhearn]

I'm pretty conservative compared to others on this board, and I think it would be fine to leave them - especially with the dog in the car. They are old enough to know how to roll down windows, get out of the car, go in and get you, etc. They are in the open if someone tried to bother them. No one in their right mind is gonna try to get into the car with the dog. :-)

 

I wouldn't care about the elderly lady. She sounds like a one-off busy body. Most people wouldn't look twice at kids that age sitting in a car.

[swellmomma]

Yes I would and I do.  As soon as they are old enough to get out of the car, come inside and get me if it is too warm/cold I feel safe leaving them, so generally 8-9 years depending on the child, or younger with an older sibling. They read, or play on their DSi/leap pad etc.  I have never had to deal with busybodies about it, but would have no patience for anyone sticking their nose in.  It's not like it is infants being left in the car for goodness sakes.  I have been known at appointments (like at the shrink, dentist, dr etc) to tell them if they can't be patient and behave in the waiting room they can go wait in the car.  Even then when they are 8+ no one bats an eye, their ped supports that decision, and his office is on the 2nd floor of a building in a very busy part of the city.  But better to be sitting quietly reading in the car than causing a disturbance in the office.  

AFAIK there is no specific law against leaving kids in the car here, beyond they can not be left "babysitting" before 12 years old.  But that is really only enforced if something bad happens or they are left for an exorbitant amount of time, and I certainly have left my nearly 11 year old to watch my almost 7 year old in the car while I run into the $ store or pay for gas etc.

The only time I have caught flack for this choice was back when my teens were younger.  When I started doing this when oldest was about 9 people on a local parent message board flipped out that I wasn't bringing all 4 in with me to pay for gas etc.

[Farrar]

Because of the weird overreaction strangers have about kids and cars, I make mine get out and sit next to the car on the asphalt if they want to wait for me. I don't actually think it's safer. If anything, it's less safe. I just worry about busy bodies.

[Matryoshka]

The car thing.  Well conditions are often not so ideal for that.  Too cold and too hot.  And some kids have died as a result.  So I do think people worry.  Maybe beyond what is reasonable. 

 

Middle school aged kids who can unbuckle, open a car door, and walk across a parking lot have died from being left in a car.  :confused1:   When was this?

 

Babies, toddlers, yeah, you can't leave them.  Middle schoolers are not babies, nor are they toddlers. I no longer worry about making sure I cut up their food really small so they don't choke.  I took the railing off their bed, as I no longer worry that they'll fall on the floor in the middle of the night.  I let them walk up and down the stairs unsupervised as well.

 

My kids often have no interest in walking around the store with me.  If they want to stay in the car, that's fine.  They are growing up.  I think as kids get older, they can be, and need to be, trusted with increasing levels of responsibility.

[Amy in NH]

I don't consider 10 and 11 middle school age.

 

Middle school here is grades 4 through 8.  My dd would be a 4th grader at our local middle school in the fall; she turns 9 in August.

[Farrar]

Middle school aged kids who can unbuckle, open a car door, and walk across a parking lot have died from being left in a car.  :confused1:   When was this?

 

Yeah, I looked this up and the oldest I could find was 3 yo.  That's a far cry from a 10 yo.

[Mommyof4ks]

In my state it is illegal for kids under 14 to be left in a car alone, so I leave them at home where it is legal to leave them at any age. It seems silly to me too, but common sense died a while back, so we have laws that treat teens like young children. We have many busy bodies in our community, and I have no interest in getting fined or arrested.

 

ETA: Sorry, double checked, and at least one child must be 14 and no one can stay with them under the age of 7. Yay, my dd can now watch my older kids while the baby and I run into the store. Thanks for the topic, so now they can run errands with me after lessons. They will be thrilled lol.

[Barb_]

See oddly I'd think large parking lot with lots of people would mean more people were around in the event of a problem. 

 

I don't even go that route.  I just take them in.  I really don't see the point of having them sit in the car unless I'm just going to return the cart. 

 

Sometimes one of the kids has a headache, or someone has a book to read, or a younger one is acting bratty and the older one takes her back to the car.  Sometimes it's the last errand of the day and everyone is sick of following Mom around. Lots of reasons. Shrug.

[AmyontheFarm]

Ok, back from my facebook world.  A fellow homeschooling momma and police officer says that in Ontario you can't go off on vacation and leave them home alone unattended under 16.  Beyond that, it's a matter of parental judgement.  We have a local babysitting course that kids can't take until age 11 but you are allowed to babysit yourself as early as 9, it's again a matter of parental judgement.

 

There are no official laws concerning cars and kids.  

 

If the temperature gets to high inside of a car that is a different story, also it is frowned up leaving kids in the car for hours at a time.  You apparently, can't leave the kiddies in the car while you go to a concert/casino or go and play bingo for a few sessions.  <------ Who does this??????

 

So, leaving a 10-12 year old in the car is fine and no ones business as long as the temperature isn't too high and the child can fend from themselves.

[Amy in NH]

In my state it is illegal for kids under 14 to be left in a car alone, so I leave them at home where it is legal to leave them at any age. It seems silly to me too, but common sense died a while back, so we have laws that treat teens like young children. We have many busy bodies in our community, and I have no interest in getting fined or arrested.

 

ETA: Sorry, double checked, and at least one child must be 14 and no one can stay with them under the age of 7. Yay, my dd can now watch my older kids while the baby and I run into the store. Thanks for the topic, so now they can run errands with me after lessons. They will be thrilled lol.

 

I didn't find that law anywhere on this website which lists all 19 of the states which have laws related to the topic. 

[KungFuPanda]

Mine is 10 and goes into the store with me for the simple reason that I do not do short trips. When I drive into town and go to the store I am usually looking at buying a large amount of stuff and he helps me find, put in the cart and then load the truck. 

 

We never take dogs into the city and we very very rarely just run into a store for that short of time. But if we did I would probably leave him in the vehicle to keep an eye on the inside temp to make sure the dog is OK. He is large for his age and adult sized, I doubt anyone would even do a double take.

 

  

Never. Even if it's only a certain degree outside, it's a lot hotter inside of the car.

 

Especially here in Arizona. There's countless stories on the news of people leaving their children in the car and the child dying. I wouldn't want to risk that. Same goes for a pet.

 

I'd rather just take the children in with me, and leave the dog at home where it belongs.

I'd be interested to know if opinion changes based upon where you live. If you live far from stores and don't go often I'm guessing the issue doesn't come up that much and your kids are more likely to WANT to go in with you. Also, if you live in the northeast and finding shade in the parking lot is fairly easy, I wonder if that changes your opinion. I live close to EVERYTHING. I will stop at the store JUST for milk. My kids are OVER any store that isn't Best Buy.

 

I found a state-by-state map for laws about this. In Maryland, the kid has to be 8. It seems reasonable to me. At that age kids are walking to school and crossing streets on their way. I waited until at least ten because my kids never wanted to stay in the car before that age and even when older they never stayed alone.

 

http://www.kidsandcars.org/state-laws.html

 

I don't think I've ever read a single news report where a school-aged child died in a hot car!

[Ivey]

I don't even think twice about leaving my 11-year-old alone in the car. He's exactly my height. He has a cell phone. He stays home alone and even babysits his younger brothers without a problem. If I couldn't leave him in the car for 5 minutes outside the corner store or the drug store, I might as well send him in alone and read a book.

[Laurie4b]

With kids that age, absolutely, that sounds fine. If they get hot, they can roll the windows down further, come in the store, etc. They are not toddlers. 

 

Back in the day, my mother left us in the car when she went into a dress shop in a small town to pick something up, while stopping by the deli, and sometimes while grocery shopping. It was normal. There was no AC. We had the windows down--just like at home. I was probably kindergarten to early elementary. People didn't think kidnapping was a real and present danger. Honestly, I think we are hyper-sensitive about this in this day and age.

 

My guess is that the elderly woman may have lost a sense of what kids can do at what ages and one hears so much on the news about *little* kids (toddlers and preschoolers) dying in hot cars that she probably was not differentiating well.

[Χά�ων]

  

I'd be interested to know if opinion changes based upon where you live. If you live far from stores and don't go often I'm guessing the issue doesn't come up that much and your kids are more likely to WANT to go in with you. Also, if you live in the northeast and finding shade in the parking lot is fairly easy, I wonder if that changes your opinion. I live close to EVERYTHING. I will stop at the store JUST for milk. My kids are OVER any store that isn't Best Buy.

 

I found a state-by-state map for laws about this. In Maryland, the kid has to be 8. It seems reasonable to me. At that age kids are walking to school and crossing streets on their way. I waited until at least ten because my kids never wanted to stay in the car before that age and even when older they never stayed alone.

 

http://www.kidsandcars.org/state-laws.html

 

I don't think I've ever read a single news report where a school-aged child died in a hot car!

I am in the Midwest. 

 

It doesn't really come up because short trips to pick up one or two small items just do not happen that often. A few weeks ago I went to the small grocer in town to find out the debit card machine was down. I ended up paying an arm and a leg for the same item at the gas station. I do not even recall what it was now, but since that was the ONLY time I have done that in 2+ years of living here it must have been something I really wanted or needed.

 

He skates so I have been known to leave him at the rink and run to the store to pick up the one or two small items I need. Though when he was 9 and we were house sitting in the suburbs I found myself making more trips for an item. I usually just sent him in alone while I stayed in the car. He enjoyed it. If I had three I would probably just send one or two into the store. But I am more likely to send a child into the store to grab one or two items than I am to leave a child in the car. Sitting in the car is usually my only down time. I am not giving that up!

 

Disclosure: I leave DS in the car when I run into the bank if he wants to stay in the car. He usually likes going into the bank so he comes with me. I have no clue what is so fun about the bank but whatever.  

[wintermom]

I believe in my province, there would be more people worried about the dog than the kids!

[AmyontheFarm]

I believe in my province, there would be more people worried about the dog than the kids!

 

Isn't that the truth!

[1GirlTwinBoys]

 

 

I don't consider 10 and 11 middle school age.

[1GirlTwinBoys]

Middle school here is 5th-8th grade.  That's why I specifically stated their ages because it's a broad range.

[Pawz4me]

With kids that age, absolutely, that sounds fine. If they get hot, they can roll the windows down further, come in the store, etc. They are not toddlers. 

 

Back in the day, my mother left us in the car when she went into a dress shop in a small town to pick something up, while stopping by the deli, and sometimes while grocery shopping. It was normal. There was no AC. We had the windows down--just like at home. I was probably kindergarten to early elementary. People didn't think kidnapping was a real and present danger. Honestly, I think we are hyper-sensitive about this in this day and age.

 

My guess is that the elderly woman may have lost a sense of what kids can do at what ages and one hears so much on the news about *little* kids (toddlers and preschoolers) dying in hot cars that she probably was not differentiating well.

 

A home and a vehicle are in no way comparable when it comes to how fast they can get dangerously hot.

[nd293]

I would do the same. If it's very hot I would leave the windows wide open but the car locked. To be honest, depending on where we are, I might leave the car running with the a/c on. They know not to move about the car, they know to get out if there was a problem in the car (like getting too hot) and they know to hit the hooter to draw attention if there is a problem with someone outside the car bothering them. I usually leave my phone with them so in the event of a concern they could contact their father.

[Word Nerd]

A home and a vehicle are in no way comparable when it comes to how fast they can get dangerously hot.

Neither are 2-year-olds and 11-year-olds in a vehicle comparable when it comes to handling the situation if the vehicle does get too warm.

[magnificent_baby]

Ages 10-11? No. The only way I would do that was if it was a gas station, and I could clearly see them through the windows. I live in a semi large metropolitan area though, where crime and carjackings are not uncommon. 

[Guest inoubliable]

Only if I was just running into Kinko's.

[Dory]

I have left my kids in the car and I probably will again. They are all old enough they will come get me if needed. They know not to unlock the door for strangers. They know how to roll down windows if they need to. Usually it's just while I quickly pay for something. I did leave them in the vehicle once during a therapy appointment but that's because they begged to be allowed to stay in the car instead of the waiting room and the office was on the first floor and I could see the car the entire time. I watched my kids get out of the car all together and go to the bathrooms because the youngest had to go and they aren't allowed to go anywhere alone. They locked the car when they left and locked it again when they got back in. They have shown themselves to be good with it. I wouldn't leave them if I was doing a bunch of shopping or couldn't see the car though.

 

I also don't leave them no matter what in some areas of town.

[sassenach]

Based on what you've described, yes, I would leave them.  No hesitation.

 

[Joker]

I have left my middle school age dds in the car to run quickly into the store or to get to go food at places with no drive thru. They are 14 and just turned 12. We're in FL and I leave them with the keys so can press the alarm if they need me or help - they also each have a cell phone.

 

We have had zero issues with it. I don't find that surprising since they stay home alone and also walk alone the 1.5 miles to the same store and food places.

[Farrar]

I still don't understand how anyone could think 11 isn't middle school.  11 yos are in 6th grade.  I know middle school has different ages in some places, but I've never heard of anywhere where 6th isn't middle school.  10 is more borderline, but I don't object to the designation.

 

Not that it matters.  My boys are 9 and I leave them.

[Guest submarines]

I leave children, ages 12, 9, 6 in the car for up to 30 minutes--they play games or draw or read and they often prefer to stay in the car than run into a store with me, especially if it a short in and out errand. I started doing this when my oldest was 9--for up to 10 minutes at those ages.

 

I also don't see a problem with someone being concerned and asking them if they were okay in a non-confrontational way. If I saw children unattended in a car I'd probably stick around for a little bit to see how they were doing. If I thought they were younger or if the windows were tinted and I couldn't see them well, I'd probably ask if they were okay. Just in case, you know?

 

My problem is when people start calling the police in the first 60 seconds of noticing a child in a car and imagining themselves a hero / good Samaritan. :glare:

[Joker]

I still don't understand how anyone could think 11 isn't middle school. 11 yos are in 6th grade. I know middle school has different ages in some places, but I've never heard of anywhere where 6th isn't middle school. 10 is more borderline, but I don't object to the designation.

 

Not that it matters. My boys are 9 and I leave them.

Where I grew up all the middle schools were, and still are, only 7th and 8th grade. I was surprised it started at 6th grade here.

[SKL]

Yes, I would, and I think it's a shame people even have to ask this question.

 

PS, my kids will begin 7th grade at age 11.  Not that I'd wait that long to leave them in the car for under 10 minutes.

 

It's a sad statement when we're more scared of what "concerned" strangers will do vs. other things that should impact our parenting decisions.

[Farrar]

Where I grew up all the middle schools were, and still are, only 7th and 8th grade. I was surprised it started at 6th grade here.

That was always called junior high though, I thought.

[Joker]

That was always called junior high though, I thought.

Mine was middle school, as were/are most of the surrounding counties.

[Freckles]

I grew up in Oklahoma.

 

Middle School 6-8th grades

JR High 7-9th grade

 

 

[Annie Laurie]

I left my kids in the car just a few days ago. I had been grocery shopping in Target, my 3 yr old was having a huge tantrum in the checkout lane because I wouldn't buy him a badmitton set from the dollar spot, and I got to my car and realized that a pair of earrings and a pack of notebook paper had ended up smooshed in a weird spot in my cart and I hadn't paid for them. So I left my 13 year old son, my 3 year old son, and my 10 year old son in the van while I ran back in to pay. My 3 yr old was still having a fit and I wasn't hauling a 3 yr old in the middle of a tantrum back into Target with me. I would bet the people of Target preferred not hearing his tantrum again too. I was hugely paranoid about someone reporting me and almost just left the stuff on the closest shelf and ran back out. My 13 year old is extremely responsible, my 3 year old was safely buckled in his car seat, and I wasn't worried about my kids. I was worried about other people.