I don't think we're going to get that 4th baby

[ktgrok]

I've been letting DH think about things and leaving it alone for the most part as he navigated leaving one job, getting another, etc. He'd said he couldn't talk about it while things were unstable and when his job sucked, etc. Well, now he LOVES his new job. LOVES it. He's doing exactly what he wants to do, with a boss that is no nonsense, supportive, and doesn't play games. He's on cloud nine. He's also teaching two night a week which means long hours, but he loves teaching. He spoke at two conferences in the last two months, and received lots of praise. After the last one a company that makes online courses for IT professionals (very respected) contacted him and asked him to create courses for them (money isn't huge, but would be great, and he'd enjoy doing it). He's also recently written a guest blog post for a well known cybersecurity blog and had it then requoted by another big cybersecurity guy who is well known. In other words, he's doing REALLY well in his life. 

 

The money from his signing bonus will be enough to get me in a new used van I think, which has been a worry of his. The money from teaching will help us pay off the credit cards. Again, good news. 

 

I had my 3rd book hit shelves on Monday, and just turned in the manuscript for the fourth. I'm under contract for two more this year. So that's going well. 

 

It seemed now was the time to talk about it. He had earlier said things like, "well, if we did...." and other such things. At one point even brought it up with the kids. But last night he said he "can't see how it is feasible" and "we don't have room for a baby - and don't tell me about your Pinterest plans to put a crib in the closet or something" and "we already have kids that don't get enough time with their father, why bring another child into the world that will be the same way". He does work a lot, so is gone until bedtime 2 nights a week, but only in the months he teaches, he can choose to teach every other month if he wants. Sometimes he has a work or networking function, maybe once or twice a month. When he's home he's a very involved father. The kids adore him. They do NOT feel neglected.

 

He said for me to give him reasons TO have a kid, other than because I want one. Um? There are no reasons that I know of, other than wanting one. Another sibling to love for the kids? But DH and his brother aren't very close, and his brother has been a burden ore than a joy on many occasions, so that didn't impress him. 

 

Basicaly he said, well if you can address my concerns, we can talk. But I can't make the house bigger. I can fit three kids in there, but he doesn't believe me. I can't make him have more time. there's nothing I can say I don't think. 

 

So I'm just sad. 

 

I'm still going to get my IUD out and he can get his vasectomy if that's what he wants. At least that's how I feel this minute. I'm trying not to cry or act too resentful as I don't want to blackmail him emotionally. But darn it! This is the same man who thought it wasn't logical for us to date, way back in the day, because he thought I deserved better than him (he was living on a friend's couch making not much over minimum wage), and because it was long distance. He actually broke up with me because of it, and it was a friend's advice that got him to see the light. We've been madly in love ever since. This feels similar....but maybe it isn't. I don't know. 

 

I'm just sad. 

[gardenmom5]

:grouphug:

[ktgrok]

And as much as I'm sad about not having another baby, I'm sad that we can't come to an agreement. And honestly, he is too. Which just makes me more sad, dumb as it is. I feel badly for me, and I feel badly for him because he feels badly for me. It's ridiculous, this love stuff. 

 

I did point out that love in general isn't about logic, but not sure that got me very far. 

 

 

I saw this quote recently, and basically this is our relationship, with me being the heart and him being the brain. 

 

Edited April 21, 2016 by ktgrok

[Bluegoat]

That really stinks. 

 

It sounds a bit like my friend's husband.  He just had a feeling like he couldn't manage any more kids.  I think some of these things don't really have a rational basis - things like feeling too crowded in a space, or pressed for time.  They are just intangible, so what way could a person make a rational argument?  They are just not that kind of thing.

 

If it turns out that this is the way it is really going to go, I think a lot of the stress around this for women can focus around a reduction in options - it doesn't seem to affect men the same way generally.  It's a bit like becoming a mother for the first time, having to look at yourself a different way.

[Mimm]

I'm sorry. There aren't logical reasons to have a child really. Except that when you have a kid, you just make it work and they bring so much love into your life. These are emotional reasons, not logical ones. When my third came along unexpectedly, we just handled it. We don't have enough space, definitely not enough money, but she's here and things are fine. :) And we adore her. We can't imagine our family without her. But there are no guarantees you can give someone who needs logical reasons. My husband is pretty logical. Whenever we've talked about having another child, to him, all he sees are the reasons not to. Too much work, sleepless nights, all the expense of it all, space in the house, etc. He doesn't think of the potential human being he would love. That human doesn't exist. The money we're not spending on diapers and the uninterrupted sleep he's getting right now very much does exist. :)

[ktgrok]

 He doesn't think of the potential human being he would love. That human doesn't exist. The money we're not spending on diapers and the uninterrupted sleep he's getting right now very much does exist. :)

 

That's pretty much exactly what he said.

[ktgrok]

Just found this. It explains my reasons so much better than I could have. May print it for him later. I think he doesn't understand, at all, why I want another. That it's just hormones talking. But all this is why. 

 

http://www.scarymommy.com/five-reasons-to-have-one-more-baby/

[Monica_in_Switzerland]

I'm sorry.  :-(  

 

The only pro-fourth-kid thing that I can think of is that I really prefer the 4 siblings vs 3 siblings dynamic.  And they are so much fun.

 

Maybe when he is saying "The kids don't get enough time with me" what he is really meaning is "I don't get enough time with the kids".  I feel this way sometimes about 1-on-1 time with my own kids, even though I don't think they actually feel neglected int he least!  I know my DH really values 1-on-1 time with the kids, whereas I do pretty well herding the whole group most of the time.  Your DH may be int he same boat.  

 

 

[mamiof5]

I am so sorry!!! When it comes to reaching an agreement about number of children it's so hard, as there's no such thing as half a child. It seems like one party will "win or loose" type of thing. I love children, and I knew about number 5 before we left the hospital with number 4. At times it really became a matter of wills, me longing and missing that one more child, while dh being done and ready to move on. He never understood how I could miss someone who didn't exist. I am not sure at what point you are? For me it was really painful... in a way beautiful, knowing there was one more...but painful as years went by and he didn't come. Looking at pictures of our children and family was odd, since it just felt incomplete. I had even called the gender, I knew he was a boy. He eventually came...a little later for me than I would have wanted, but he came and our family is complete. What worked for me? I prayed like no other!! I prayed that if it was meant to be 4 for us, God took that longing pain away from me, and I could move on. Or, if I was right and there was a number 5, that He fulfilled His will for our family. It wasn't until I truly put it in God's hands and surrendered to His will that things happened, and a month or two later we found out we were expecting. I will pray for you very much!!! I have been in your place, and it hurts.

[J-rap]

I'm sorry.  I know someone like this, who is a really great guy!  But, he fears not having control over things in his life, and I'd guess maybe that's part of it for your husband too.  I don't mean over-controlling within the marriage or family context or anything like that, but just wanting so much to have his life in order, so that it feels safe.  Maybe he felt more anxiety than you realize when things were unstable, and life in general and the risk of even worse things happening felt very out-of-control and overwhelming for him.  It sounds like he went through some unstable conditions in the past too (living a friend's couch).  

 

So, though it may not seem logical to you, I can understand where he might be coming from.  Now that he finally feels he has a handle on everything and things are going well, he's scared to offset that balance and lose control again.   He probably wants more than anything to provide a secure environment for his family and feels very, very responsible.

 

I'm not saying that's right or wrong or good or bad, it just is what it is given his general makeup and past experiences.

[ktgrok]

Thank you, I am praying for sure. And yes, that is exactly it, I miss this person who I haven't met yet. 

[ktgrok]

I'm sorry.  I know someone like this, who is a really great guy!  But, he fears not having control over things in his life, and I'd guess maybe that's part of it for your husband too.  I don't mean over-controlling within the marriage or family context or anything like that, but just wanting so much to have his life in order, so that it feels safe.  Maybe he felt more anxiety than you realize when things were unstable, and life in general and the risk of even worse things happening felt very out-of-control and overwhelming for him.  It sounds like he went through some unstable conditions in the past too (living a friend's couch).  

 

So, though it may not seem logical to you, I can understand where he might be coming from.  Now that he finally feels he has a handle on everything and things are going well, he's scared to offset that balance and lose control again.   He probably wants more than anything to provide a secure environment for his family and feels very, very responsible.

 

I'm not saying that's right or wrong or good or bad, it just is what it is given his general makeup and past experiences.

 

This is true. He comes from a VERY unstable background. HIs father died when he was 3, his mother was mentally ill, no money, he dropped out to earn money when in high school, etc. He's made an amazing life for himself. 

 

He was also on antidepressants recently, and that was when he was seeming more on board with another child. He stopped taking them (cut back, then stopped) and although he's happy, I wonder if that makes him more anxious about all this. He felt he was under so much less stress now that he didn't need them. 

[sassenach]

I'm sorry. Dh and I had the same issue, but I was the no. It was sad! We genuinely wanted to agree, but I was at my end and I knew it. It took him many years to get over it. Really, it wasn't until our kids were out of the little kid stage and he could no longer imagine the dynamic of adding another that he was able to move on. Also (not sure if you are a Christian), at some point he realized that he was making an idol out of the family he didn't have to the detriment to the family he did have. This wasn't constant angst, but it would crop up every once in awhile. And I really did feel sad for him, but I truly never felt any regret.

 

Do get that iud out! Nothing wrong with him having to do the heavy lifting. You shouldn't feel obligated to carry around something in your body that you resent.

 

Congrats on the happy stuff. Hugs for the sad stuff.

[Xahm]

I don't want to sound like I think you should manipulate your husband, but would being around a cute baby/toddler help his brain listen to his heart? Do your best to help your heart and brain have an honest conversation to accept his valid points, but maybe also offer to babysit a cute baby for an evening he's home. Let him hold baby while you make supper and see if this sparks anything. Of course, an evening full of diapers, spit-up, and flying peas could make you both see the beauty of three kids!

[ktgrok]

I don't want to sound like I think you should manipulate your husband, but would being around a cute baby/toddler help his brain listen to his heart? Do your best to help your heart and brain have an honest conversation to accept his valid points, but maybe also offer to babysit a cute baby for an evening he's home. Let him hold baby while you make supper and see if this sparks anything. Of course, an evening full of diapers, spit-up, and flying peas could make you both see the beauty of three kids!

 

no. The neighbors have an adorable 4 month old and he refused to even hold it. Same with my friend's baby that is only a few weeks old. 

 

If anything, it just made me want another one even more. That one baby girl smelled like heaven. 

[Miss Mousie]

I'm trying not to cry or act too resentful as I don't want to blackmail him emotionally.

. 

 

I know you're sad about it, and I'm sorry.  I am glad, though, to read the above.  It is so important, IMO, not to manipulate him or badger him or try to wear him down until he knuckles under.

 

It's probably the most difficult disagreement spouses have, where there can be no compromise.  If one parent is a "no," then both parents have to be "no."  It would be so, so awful to "force" a person to change to a yes, or to ignore the no.

 

I hope peace comes for both you and your husband very soon, and you can enjoy yourselves together.

 

Hugs!

[melbotoast]

:grouphug:

[goldberry]

Just  :grouphug: ...

 

 

[Mom-ninja.]

I'm sorry. I never got baby #4 either. I'm still sad about it, but I've had to make peace with it. Someone having a baby when they don't really want to is just not a good idea. My dh wanted two. He agreed to three, but made it clear that was enough. There's nothing to do if one person doesn't want another. You just have to accept it if you are going to stay with that person.  

[TianXiaXueXiao]

I don't know what to say. I used to be firmly in the camp that believes that having small families and fewer children is the "responsible" lifestyle choice. After becoming a Christian, my outlook on this has changed dramatically. I no longer view marriage as a contract and see it now as a sacrament that leads to salvation. I no longer see children as "chosen" or "wanted," but as gifts from God. I have been completely converted to natural family planning methods over the last 3 years and firmly believe that birth control and barriers have no place (barring serious health reasons) within the sacred bonds of marriage, a life giving covenant. Outside of this understanding of marriage, I have no reliable way to argue for more children.

[Just Kate]

I went through this as well (except it was baby #3 for me). I constantly went from being hopeful to being sad to being hopeful again. I finally gave up hope when my youngest started school. I knew at that point I was ready to just move on. Now that I have a 12 and an 8 year old, along with a dh who works out of town A LOT, I guess I can say that I am okay with the way things turned out. I'm sure I would have loved to have another little one, but I finally found peace with the way things are. I will be praying that the same happens for you.  :grouphug:

[Xahm]

So sorry. It hurts whenever there is an important decision like this and we don't get to make the choice we want to make. I hope you can come to peace with three kids and find plenty of ways to get baby fixes here and there.

no. The neighbors have an adorable 4 month old and he refused to even hold it. Same with my friend's baby that is only a few weeks old.

 

If anything, it just made me want another one even more. That one baby girl smelled like heaven.

[Guest]

Oh Katie, I am so, so, sorry.

 

:grouphug:

 

I choose not to engage with judgemental people or defend my choice to have ds now-8.

 

We can talk privately on PM if you ever want to, though.

Edited April 21, 2016 by Guest

[Daria]

This is true. He comes from a VERY unstable background. HIs father died when he was 3, his mother was mentally ill, no money, he dropped out to earn money when in high school, etc. He's made an amazing life for himself. 

 

He was also on antidepressants recently, and that was when he was seeming more on board with another child. He stopped taking them (cut back, then stopped) and although he's happy, I wonder if that makes him more anxious about all this. He felt he was under so much less stress now that he didn't need them. 

 

 

Is it possible that as he settles into the new job, and the new routine, his stress will decrease and his anxiety will decrease and he'll be more open to conversation about this?  

 

Could you point at your three children as the reasons?  As evidence that you make and raise wonderful humans, the kind of humans the world needs more of? 

 

For my family, sometimes the best thing for making decisions is to pick a date in the future.  Right now, we're working on the decision to have my son return to PS next year or not.  It's a big decision, and we've decided we'll make it in July.  I really want to decide now, because I don't like uncertainty, but I also know that there's more information we could gather.  So, we're just gathering information at this point, not making a decision.  And one day in July, we'll sit down talk it through and finalize the decision.

 

Could you do the same thing?  Decide on a date, maybe six months down the road, when you'll spend the day together (get a babysitter, maybe even go to a hotel overnight) and talk it through?  Use that time to see if you meet your intermediate goals -- did you get the newer more reliable mini van?  How is his job going and the workload turning out?  Can you rearrange the bedrooms to make room for a crib/toddler bed/bunkbeds whatever you need?  

 

Good luck!

[dirty ethel rackham]

I don't have much to add but :grouphug: .

 

I am one who knew that I could not handle another baby.  And that was after 2.  Neither of us felt like we were done, though.  We had baby number 3 and I felt like I was completely overwhelmed and done in.  In the last 5 years, I have had a couple of false alarms about being pregnant and I was in a total panic, trying to trust God, but most of me was saying "Really?  As if you haven't poured enough crap on me, you give me another life to mess up?"  

 

Perhaps the difficulties with your oldest, plus the history of depression have totally tapped him out.  He simply may not have more in him. 

[ktgrok]

I don't know what to say. I used to be firmly in the camp that believes that having small families and fewer children is the "responsible" lifestyle choice. After becoming a Christian, my outlook on this has changed dramatically. I no longer view marriage as a contract and see it now as a sacrament that leads to salvation. I no longer see children as "chosen" or "wanted," but as gifts from God. I have been completely converted to natural family planning methods over the last 3 years and firmly believe that birth control and barriers have no place (barring serious health reasons) within the sacred bonds of marriage, a life giving covenant. Outside of this understanding of marriage, I have no reliable way to argue for more children.

 

I hear you. And pretty much agree with you. Unfortunately he doesn't. We have very different religious beliefs...as in I have them and he really doesn't. Which makes this harder. Saying that w work out our salvation partly through trials, including those involved with kids, wouldn't do much to convince him. Even if I do believe they give me an excellent chance to improve my soul. 

[ktgrok]

Is it possible that as he settles into the new job, and the new routine, his stress will decrease and his anxiety will decrease and he'll be more open to conversation about this?  

Maybe, but honestly he's under VERY little stress now, as far as work goes. He's on cloud nine and comes home every day talking about how awesome it is. I don't know that it will get better, just more routine. 

Could you point at your three children as the reasons?  As evidence that you make and raise wonderful humans, the kind of humans the world needs more of? 

​I tried, but he doesn't see it that way. Although I have made an argument that the world needs more people like our kids and out of everything that may have had the most sway. 

For my family, sometimes the best thing for making decisions is to pick a date in the future.  Right now, we're working on the decision to have my son return to PS next year or not.  It's a big decision, and we've decided we'll make it in July.  I really want to decide now, because I don't like uncertainty, but I also know that there's more information we could gather.  So, we're just gathering information at this point, not making a decision.  And one day in July, we'll sit down talk it through and finalize the decision.

 

Could you do the same thing?  Decide on a date, maybe six months down the road, when you'll spend the day together (get a babysitter, maybe even go to a hotel overnight) and talk it through?  Use that time to see if you meet your intermediate goals -- did you get the newer more reliable mini van?  How is his job going and the workload turning out?  Can you rearrange the bedrooms to make room for a crib/toddler bed/bunkbeds whatever you need?  

 

Good luck!

I actually thought that we had agreed to discuss it once he got hired on permanently, which he has, and found out about the bonus, which he has. My worry about waiting longer is that I'm now 40. Getting older will just make it harder and riskier to get pregnant, as well as draw out how long until we are actually out of diapers and such. But maybe. I can talk to him and see if this is a "never going to happen" or a "let's talk in a month" thing. But it feels like the reasons he gives won't change. I'll just get older. 

[8circles]

I'm so sorry that you are struggling with this so much. Please read this as gently as possible.

 

Where I'm coming from: we have 4 children. We would both have wanted more, but I know that I cannot handle more - maybe I could if it happened, but I'm not choosing it. Dh would have liked more but respects that I feel stretched already. He would never ask me or pressure me and I would feel horribly disrespected if he did.

 

I think you should respect his point of view and drop it. Do what you need to do to get past your disappointment. I understand that there's a spiritual aspect to this for you, but he doesn't agree. You don't really have a right to weigh your side heavier than his. His point of view matters just as much as yours does.

[kroe1]

Being from the Deep South where roles of husband and wife are more defined by society than individual couples, it is hard for me to understand why a DH gets to decide how many kids one has. That would be only the wife's final decision, with input from hubby, in the environment I was raised.

 

For example, my own DH envisioned a wonderful childless marriage with lots of travel, art openings, and charity balls. What he got was two kids, soccer tournaments and dance competitions. (Actually, I did not decide either as both were "oops" babies.)

 

Nonetheless, while stuff and people are obviously different, isn't this no different than a wife wanting a new car and a hubby saying we cannot afford it? Can you just look at it the same as other desires you cannot have? Therefore, you can remove the disappointment and resentment of your DH and just blame it on life's circumstances.

 

Big hugs to you.

[Spryte]

Do get that iud out! Nothing wrong with him having to do the heavy lifting. You shouldn't feel obligated to carry around something in your body that you resent.

 

Congrats on the happy stuff. Hugs for the sad stuff.

That is so true. You absolutely don't need to have something in your body that you resent. If this is important to your DH, he will make the choices he needs to make. But, for you, you don't have to carry the pain of resentment on top of the grief that is present in your posts. It's ok for you to grieve. ((Hugs))

 

I'm sorry, too, that your DH isn't on board with you, for your sake. I thought the parts I snipped from the above post was very helpful, too. It's hard not to be in the same place. It's probably hard on your DH, too.

 

I can't offer any advice re: changing your DH's mind. I wouldn't try to do that, I'd only try to move forward and find peace. Which I hope you find soon. ((More hugs))

[heartlikealion]

Sorry he got your hopes up and then things didn't pan out as you had hoped. He might be thinking long-term stuff that you didn't discuss (or maybe you did) like well a crib is one thing but what about when they need a twin bed (bunk beds and everyone in one room?) or more space for clothes or whatever. I sorta think the house is an excuse, though. Maybe he doesn't want to give up the classes but would feel guilty about his home to work ratio of time

 

My hubby and I don't quite see eye to eye on number of children. He would like another in a couple years, but I can barely handle the ones we have. So unless I have a change of heart or we have an unplanned pregnancy (or adopt an older child), I just don't see it happening. And it's so much easier for him because I'm over here trying to figure out how to do my dumb charting again and he's opted out of the vasectomy idea (which I support. I understand).

 

 

 

 

[6packofun]

I'm sorry.  :(  It's a tough thing to come to agreement on no matter what the circumstances...there is no "right" answer and both spouses feelings matter.  Praying God can ease your disappointment!

[MistyMountain]

I really wanted more kids but dh adamantly does not and there are other things too that make it a bad idea. I always will long for more but it will not happen. It is hard to go through that and I am sorry you are going through it.

 

It does not sound hopeless in your case. It sounds like he has not shut the door on discussing it it or coming up with reasons. The space thing is actually something I do not think is bad for kids. Kids do not need a lot of space. Learning to share is not a bad thing. Much of the world has much less space and in the not so distant past people here did too. Lots of people grow up sharing rooms.

[Another Lynn]

I'm not sure I agree with the idea that the one who wants the baby has to give in to the one who doesn't.  I see no reason why it couldn't go the other way. 

[Lolly]

I am sorry. My belief is that (absent an accidental pregnancy) the choice to make a baby is dependent on both wanting one. If one does not want, their want should prevail. I wanted as many as would come. Dh wanted 2. I got #3 because I was pg with twins. I told dh that since he didn't want more, he was responsible for preventing it. (I had undergone many years of fertility treatments and miscarriages to have the ones we had.) I was done with medications and surgeries. He said that was fair. He figured, I admit I did too, that getting pg without help wasn't an issue. #4 came fairly quickly. Dh immediately got a vasectomy. So, I vote that you tell him that since he doesn't want any more it is his responsibility to prevent it. Get that iud out.

[heartlikealion]

I'm not sure I agree with the idea that the one who wants the baby has to give in to the one who doesn't.  I see no reason why it couldn't go the other way. 

 

Because you don't want the parent to resent the child? I mean I don't know that they would, but there's this negativity associated with the whole situation. I still get upset that my family basically dumped a pet on me and am basically the main provider for. I don't hate the pet, but I do carry a grudge. It affects how we use space in the home (litter box, etc.), travel (we take her with us), finances (vet, supplies)...

 

and that's just a cat. Not a baby.

[bettyandbob]

Because you don't want the parent to resent the child? I mean I don't know that they would, but there's this negativity associated with the whole situation. I still get upset that my family basically dumped a pet on me and am basically the main provider for. I don't hate the pet, but I do carry a grudge. It affects how we use space in the home (litter box, etc.), travel (we take her with us), finances (vet, supplies)...

 

and that's just a cat. Not a baby.

 

 

This.

 

Children should have every chance to be wanted from the start. Not hope one parents comes to like the child. Suppose the parent grows to love the child, but also resents the other parent for forcing another 20 year commitment on him. So, the parent loves the child and now doesn't want to be married to the other parent because trust is an issue. Is that good for the child? Is that good for the family? 

 

OP, I'm sorry you will not have one more baby. That must be really hard. Do think about the advice earlier in the thread to enjoy the family you have. 

[ktgrok]

Oh, I would never trick him into a kid or anything. On the other hand, i do not think he feels overwhelmed with caring for the kids, not the sense that say, a mom at home with a hassle of kids feels. I do the heavy lifting with child care. Honestly, with babies he changes maybe a few diapers a week? NEVER gets up with them during the night. Never bathes them. Maybe changes an outfit a week? 

 

It's more about the loss of control, the inability to plan what if, etc. 

 

Honestly, he never "tried" for the other two kids. (third, oldest, is from my previous marriage). With my DD we discussed it. He was on the fence, not sure we were ready, etc etc. House wasn't ready, this that and the other. I finally said, "You knew I wanted a baby when we married. I've waited. I'm stopping birth control. If YOU don't want a baby, you know how to prevent them. Figure it out." He would use condoms most of the time, or at least as if I was fertile, then eventually one time didn't ask and didn't use a condom and we got my daughter. Who is the light of his life, a totally daddy's girl. He lives and breathes for her.  With my youngest we were not trying, again, the house wasn't ready, we didn't have enough money, etc etc, and using FAM. Turns out I'm fertile even on dry days, and his sperm lives forever. Got DS. Who he adores, although they are not as close as him and DD, partly due to age. He likes them older, when they make more sense. 

 

So these are some of the same arguments he had for the other kids. Honestly, if we'd never had kids until/unless he was willing to actively say "let's have a kid" we wouldn't have any together. But when they are here he does great with them. It's just frustrating. We have MORE money (like, more than double), we have more time (I was working part time for a while and he was in school on top of working). 

 

And actually, part of me would love to have the experience of actually TRYING to get pregnant. 1st and 3rd I was trying NOT to get pregnant, and with DD it was that I wanted one but he didn't and I had to wait to see what happened. And then be worried telling him that I was pregnant. I'd like once to show off a positive test and get a happy response from him. The only happy response was from my ex with my first, and that time I was the one sobbing and in panic. 

 

Either way, I'll get over it. But I'm heartbroken. I have been on the edge of tears all day, and it doesn't help that my daughter kept pointing out all the cute babies at Target when we were shopping. She would love another baby in the house. If anything she might be my best hope of changing his mind, since he is so convinced the kids would suffer if we had another one. 

Edited April 21, 2016 by ktgrok

[Guest]

I'm sorry. I have been there and I was very upset about it. My DH wasn't even as nice about it as your sounds like he is being. And we had more significant hurdles than it sounds like you have.

 

I will say (not that it would have consoled me at the time), now I am 45 and I am glad we don't have another baby/toddler/presschooler.

[prairiewindmomma]

***hugs***

 

I truly understand wanting more and be impatient for another and coming to the never-again place with sadness.

 

Given the craziness that is happening with Zika virus in Puerto Rico, and the likelihood of the virus coming to your neighborhood (and mine) this summer, perhaps this is a very sad mixed blessing. I hear CDC is contemplating recommending warning women not get pregnant this summer (where Aedes Aegyptii is present) given that a novel virus's impact is generally higher in that first year or two of incidence in a new community. There was a piece on PBS newshour about it a few nights ago.

[Outdoorsy Type]

I completely understand where you are coming from ((hugs)).

[Katy]

 I think it is the same as dating.  He's afraid.  Everything is going well, so any change at all is going to destroy everything.  It comes from growing up in turmoil, you have no faith that life should be happy.

 

I'd get the IUD out and have the same conversation you had re DD, but only if you think it really is the same thing, and not that he genuinely doesn't want a baby.

[Guest]

Because you don't want the parent to resent the child? I mean I don't know that they would, but there's this negativity associated with the whole situation. I still get upset that my family basically dumped a pet on me and am basically the main provider for. I don't hate the pet, but I do carry a grudge. It affects how we use space in the home (litter box, etc.), travel (we take her with us), finances (vet, supplies)...

 

and that's just a cat. Not a baby.

Yes, I agree. While most people adore their children, planned or not, I do believe there is a dark reality that a parent can resent the imposition the unplanned-for child brings into his or her life. In my own case, my huz is eight years older than I am, so the thoughts of retirement/no longer being able to work do loom much larger for him than they do for me. I also believe there is a reality in which falling hormone levels decrease parental patience and forbearance.

[Another Lynn]

For the record, I never mentioned tricking anyone.  I just think either side is capable of sacrifice and actually, he is asking a higher sacrifice of her than she is asking of him.  Throw tomatoes if you want, but a little risk and inconvenience is a small thing to ask, imho, in return for a precious soul whom you will soon never be able to imagine your family without.  I think he should reconsider.   

[Guest]

For the record, I never mentioned tricking anyone. I just think either side is capable of sacrifice and actually, he is asking a higher sacrifice of her than she is asking of him. Throw tomatoes if you want, but a little risk and inconvenience is a small thing to ask, imho, in return for a precious soul whom you will soon never be able to imagine your family without. I think he should reconsider.

I'm sorry, but I don't agree. Every child brings liabilites, even if they bring many beautiful qualities as well. By that logic, we should all have children continually until menopause, or die trying. Having a child is a permanent decision that affects all family members, and society too. Yes, every human being is of infinite value, but each human being has real effects on everyone/everything.

 

It isn't necessarily "a little risk and inconvenience." One never knows what hand is going to be dealt.

[Tsuga]

I empathize with your DH more than I identify with you KT but I agree that asking him to take control of his fertility and actively make this decision is more than fair. He has options.

 

Hugs to you both.

[heartlikealion]

You never know, maybe he is worried that there could be a health situation or whatever where he's in charge of all the kids at once and still trying to financially support the family to the same extent. That's more than a little inconvenience. Not trying to be negative here.

[bettyandbob]

I'm sorry, but I don't agree. Every child brings liabilites, even if they bring many beautiful qualities as well. By that logic, we should all have children continually until menopause, or die trying. Having a child is a permanent decision that affects all family members, and society too. Yes, every human being is of infinite value, but each human being has real effects on everyone/everything.

 

It isn't necessarily "a little risk and inconvenience." One never knows what hand is going to be dealt.

 

 

Lots of risk. I have three dc. One is 2E. One is intellectually disabled. One had health issues when small, but appears OK now. These aren't twenty year commitments. For my intellectually disabled child it is forever. We will never reach the stage of just time as a couple. Never. Some people mourn the empty nest. I see my neighbors packing up for spur of the moment weekends hiking and biking together. There will be no spur of the moment weekends for us. We took a weekend for our 25th anniversary. Being able to do so was made possible because our 18 year old could stay home with our ds. She is going to college in the fall. So, we will not have a weekend again. Honestly, it is nice to even get to the stage where dc have some independence and you aren't their sole entertainment, companionship. I'm not sure I'll get there. 

 

Do I love my dc, all of them? Yes. Does my dh? Yes. When we decided to have children we wanted to be parents no matter what happened. As messy as our family is, they are really cool people. I wanted 4. After 3 it was quite obvious that we'd reached the limit of what we could handle and be the best parents we could be to the dc we had. 

[SproutMamaK]

It sounds like he feels guilty that he doesn't have more time to spend with your kids as it is, and that another child would just compound that guilt. Baby questions aside, this is something that he should be dealing with. If he can either get past the guilt he feels for having his own fulfilling life, or find a way to make more time with the children, it sounds like he'd be happier overall. Either way, saying "I feel guilty about this now so no more kids that I'll feel more guilty about!" does nothing to deal with the problem as it stands now. He's ignoring his CURRENT guilt over his CURRENT children and focusing on the possible future guilt over a possible future child. He needs to work through this, and maybe once he's come to a place where he's happy with that issue, he'll be more amenable to talking about another child.

Aside from that, it seems as though he keeps waiting for life to be perfect to want a child. He said it with your first child, your second child, and now he's saying it again. If it were up to him, you wouldn't have your DD and your DS because he's waiting for everythig to be *just so*, and then (as evidenced by this time around) even when everything IS *just so* he still comes up with reasons to be stressed out about things not being perfect enough. I think that's something that also warrants a discussion with him. It sounds like his anxiety over possible future problem prevents him from making any positive decisions about life, even when everything is life is going fantastic. Maybe going off the anti-depressants was a bad idea, it sounds as though they may be necessary for him if he's still caught in these pervasively negative thought patterns when life is exactly the way he's always wanted it to be. That seems like a really BIG thing that needs to be talked about, and the discussion about having another child is just the way it came to light, not the issue itself.

Edited April 21, 2016 by SproutMamaK

[Guest]

Lots of risk. I have three dc. One is 2E. One is intellectually disabled. One had health issues when small, but appears OK now. These aren't twenty year commitments. For my intellectually disabled child it is forever. We will never reach the stage of just time as a couple. Never. Some people mourn the empty nest. I see my neighbors packing up for spur of the moment weekends hiking and biking together. There will be no spur of the moment weekends for us. We took a weekend for our 25th anniversary. Being able to do so was made possible because our 18 year old could stay home with our ds. She is going to college in the fall. So, we will not have a weekend again. Honestly, it is nice to even get to the stage where dc have some independence and you aren't their sole entertainment, companionship. I'm not sure I'll get there.

 

Do I love my dc, all of them? Yes. Does my dh? Yes. When we decided to have children we wanted to be parents no matter what happened. As messy as our family is, they are really cool people. I wanted 4. After 3 it was quite obvious that we'd reached the limit of what we could handle and be the best parents we could be to the dc we had.

Not "liking" because I like this situation, just liking for support and yes, it is true. Not all outcomes are as rosy as they seem to be when it is only a possibility.