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Moxie
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Why does my Kindergartener need 4 boxes of 24 count crayons?? When I was a kid, you bought a pencil box and all your stuff went in your box. You got one box of crayons for the year (if you were lucky and the cattle sold well that year, you got the really big box!!). Now they all share all the supplies so she needs 4 boxes?? This is a sort of expensive private school so it isn't like she is buying extra for the kids who can't afford stuff. Plus, it isn't nearly as exciting for the kids now. The list is very clear that nothing is to be labeled because it belongs to the whole class. Boo hiss.

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When Dd went to public K last year, everything was supposed to be labeled and then it just got thrown into collective buckets at back to school night anyway. If I had know I wouldn't have wasted the time labeling it all. I'm sure it drives the more fastidious kids nuts to not be able to keep their things nice and have to use the grimy shared crayons, etc. Also, wouldn't it make more sense to just charge a set supply fee and buy everything in bulk?

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It makes me wonder who paid for Kleenex and paper towels when I was in school?  I don't ever remember those being on the supply list.

 

The schools supplied all equipment and supplies for cleaning and personal care (t-paper).  Everything else was purchased by families for personal use, only, of their own child(ren).  I do not know when school systems started bungling their finances so poorly that they "must" force families to purchase supplies in industrial quantities for use by everybody (at the consumption numbers of more children than even attend the school).  Even worse are the schools where individual classroom teachers are forced to spend their own insufficient incomes on supplies for their pupils.

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It makes me wonder who paid for Kleenex and paper towels when I was in school?  I don't ever remember those being on the supply list.

 

I remember using those brown rough paper towels as PT and as kleenex. We had one of those wall dispensers in the classroom.

I also remember bringing a small box to school when I needed it to keep in my desk. And getting to pick out cool school supplies for my desk/pencil box.

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I remember using those brown rough paper towels as PT and as kleenex. We had one of those wall dispensers in the classroom.

I also remember bringing a small box to school when I needed it to keep in my desk. And getting to pick out cool school supplies for my desk/pencil box.

 

Yup, same here.  And if you needed to blow your nose several times you knew better to bring kleenex from home the next day because your nose felt like falling off after using too many of those brown paper towels. 

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I haven't looked at my kids' 4th grade supply list in a while, but one question that came to mind:  4th graders still need a big box of crayons?  When do they stop needing crayons?

 

Nowadays they want the kids to have crayons, colored pencils, markers, whiteboard markers, and regular pens and pencils.  And the pencils are all supposed to be sharpened.

 

They want 20 sharpened pencils per kid.  And then they start complaining that supplies are running out 2/3 into the year.  I remember when they used to tell us to each bring 2 pencils.

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Related rant--

Heh, at my dd's high school, they ran low on paper and could not print off anything (or, very little). I couldn't believe it. I wanted to give several teachers a few reams of paper, but couldn't afford it at the time.

I mean, come ON, a school shouldn't run out of PAPER, for Goodness' Sake!

 

 

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Related rant--

Heh, at my dd's high school, they ran low on paper and could not print off anything (or, very little). I couldn't believe it. I wanted to give several teachers a few reams of paper, but couldn't afford it at the time.

I mean, come ON, a school shouldn't run out of PAPER, for Goodness' Sake!

 

A school should not use that much lose leaf paper anyway. There are tons of paper wasted for all the stupid worksheets and handouts, and handing students something printed on paper does zero for retention. Let's go back to teachers writing on boards and students taking notes by hand and to using notebooks and proper textbooks instead of a collection of lose printouts. The stacks of paper always bugged me when my kids attended school.

I wonder how  we managed to get a great education before copy machines and printers.

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A school should not use that much lose leaf paper anyway. There are tons of paper wasted for all the stupid worksheets and handouts, and handing students something printed on paper does zero for retention. Let's go back to teachers writing on boards and students taking notes by hand and to using notebooks and proper textbooks instead of a collection of lose printouts. The stacks of paper always bugged me when my kids attended school.

I wonder how  we managed to get a great education before copy machines and printers.

 

Ditto machines.  I can still smell a lovely warm ditto fresh from the machine!

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Ditto machines.  I can still smell a lovely warm ditto fresh from the machine!

 

Nope, didn't have these either.

Authoritarian regime under which I grew up kept any means of reproducing paper under very tight control. The closest we got in school was giant rubber stamps (parts of a flower in bio etc). For home use, there was transparent paper.

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Ditto machines.  I can still smell a lovely warm ditto fresh from the machine!

 

I remember the teacher walking into the classroom and handing out a warm set of worksheets fresh from the ditto machine.   We couldn't wait to start sniffing.  Fun memory!

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Nope, didn't have these either.

Authoritarian regime under which I grew up kept any means of reproducing paper under very tight control. The closest we got in school was giant rubber stamps (parts of a flower in bio etc). For home use, there was transparent paper.

 

Ah...DH too remembers ditto machines.

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They started doing that here before I started HSing. It took all the fun out of buying cool stuff.

This is why they do it - equalization. That way there's no issue between the ones who show up with real Lily Pulitzer pencil cases and the kids who have the Target knockoffs. Same reason for school uniforms.

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A school should not use that much lose leaf paper anyway. There are tons of paper wasted for all the stupid worksheets and handouts, and handing students something printed on paper does zero for retention. Let's go back to teachers writing on boards and students taking notes by hand and to using notebooks and proper textbooks instead of a collection of lose printouts. The stacks of paper always bugged me when my kids attended school.

I wonder how we managed to get a great education before copy machines and printers.

Amen!

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Why does my Kindergartener need 4 boxes of 24 count crayons??

One box per quarter seems okay to me. Otherwise she'll just have used up stumps by April. It's better to buy all 4 now when they're on sale rather than kick yourself when you have to pay 3 times as much in November.

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This is why they do it - equalization. That way there's no issue between the ones who show up with real Lily Pulitzer pencil cases and the kids who have the Target knockoffs. Same reason for school uniforms.

My issue with that though is the school list was very specific about certain brands and sizes, which required going to several stores to get the right ones. Then all our Pink Pearl brand erasers and jumbo Elmers glue sticks were dumped in with the Target brand that other parents decided was close enough. I'm not against store brands, but annoyed that the teachers are so particular according to the list and then it doesn't seem to matter. Anyway...another reason I'm glad we're homeschooling both kids now.

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They don't need four boxes of 24 count crayons, at least not all at once. The year my DS had 80 whiteboard markers on his list was the year that I got fed up and stopped buying class supplies. From that point on, I sent what my son needed it his pencil box, labeled with his name, and only what he needed. I checked every Sunday evening and refreshed his pencil box. When you say "no more" is when that nonsense will stop.

 

Why does my Kindergartener need 4 boxes of 24 count crayons?? When I was a kid, you bought a pencil box and all your stuff went in your box. You got one box of crayons for the year (if you were lucky and the cattle sold well that year, you got the really big box!!). Now they all share all the supplies so she needs 4 boxes?? This is a sort of expensive private school so it isn't like she is buying extra for the kids who can't afford stuff. Plus, it isn't nearly as exciting for the kids now. The list is very clear that nothing is to be labeled because it belongs to the whole class. Boo hiss.

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When my kids were in ps, the supply lists weren't that bad but it was all the constant fundraisers, charities, teacher gifts (that one I was often happy to do--it just adds up when combined with everything else).  I felt like it was never ending and I don't miss it one bit!

 

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My issue with that though is the school list was very specific about certain brands and sizes, which required going to several stores to get the right ones. Then all our Pink Pearl brand erasers and jumbo Elmers glue sticks were dumped in with the Target brand that other parents decided was close enough. I'm not against store brands, but annoyed that the teachers are so particular according to the list and then it doesn't seem to matter. Anyway...another reason I'm glad we're homeschooling both kids now.

That would seriously have bothered me as well. I don't love the idea of the communal pot of supplies, because children who naturally take care of their supplies should be able to use their nice ones, and children who don't take care of things should have an incentive to do so, but I suppose in the name of everyone having something, maybe the communal pot is logical. But to suggest a name brand and then not care -- that's ridiculous.

 

Today, school supplies that I buy for MY kids and that they know are theirs (because each of them has a pencil box full of their stuff, two boxes for my big two, who use lots of colored pencils) top my list of reasons to homeschool.

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I know this vent is about a private school, thus school supplies are compulsory, but for public schools, can the schools really demand the parents buy the supplies? They can make it seem like a requirement, but can they insist legally? What happened to free education? Or Atleast what happened to our tax money providing for an education? What happened to each student parents' taking responsibility that their kids have a writing utensil and a pack of paper at the start of the school year? I think the teachers ask for so much on the list because they know some parents won't buy a thing so they have to compensate for the loss. If a parent doesn't have $20-$40 to spend in school list supplies, will a child get turned away from class on the first day? I wonder what would happen if all parents just sent a few personal supplies (including tissues and wipes) in their kids' backpacks and didn't contribute to the community supply. Would they turn all the children away? Or if all the parents brought in off brand crayons because they are 1/2 less price. Off brand glue sticks or ink pens at Office Max's or Staples' penny deals back to school deals are good enough for my kids' education, it should be good enough for me to buy for the community classroom.

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Having been on the other side, I *wish* when I was teaching in public school, someone had told me you could do make demands of the parents. At the start of the year, the supply teacher for my department led me into her incredibly well-stocked closet, handed me a box of chalk and a box of pencils and, IIRC, a pad of paper. And I was like, "So, I come to you if I run out?" and she laughed at me, locked the closet, and escorted me out of her classroom.

 

My students used to steal chalk for me from all the other teachers. They were so sweet.

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I know this vent is about a private school, thus school supplies are compulsory, but for public schools, can the schools really demand the parents buy the supplies? They can make it seem like a requirement, but can they insist legally? What happened to free education? Or Atleast what happened to our tax money providing for an education? What happened to each student parents' taking responsibility that their kids have a writing utensil and a pack of paper at the start of the school year? I think the teachers ask for so much on the list because they know some parents won't buy a thing so they have to compensate for the loss. If a parent doesn't have $20-$40 to spend in school list supplies, will a child get turned away from class on the first day? I wonder what would happen if all parents just sent a few personal supplies (including tissues and wipes) in their kids' backpacks and didn't contribute to the community supply. Would they turn all the children away? Or if all the parents brought in off brand crayons because they are 1/2 less price. Off brand glue sticks or ink pens at Office Max's or Staples' penny deals back to school deals are good enough for my kids' education, it should be good enough for me to buy for the community classroom.

 

No, they cannot. On the other hand, if you don't have the $40 for the crayon extortion, you probably don't have the much greater sums for lawyers to fight this stuff. But whenever it goes to court, the school loses. They can't charge you. They can't even charge you for your diploma. They can't withhold your transcript for fees either.

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Oh, here the school district (public, in a relatively well to do area, many houses from  $400sK to in the millions) are holding a "school supply" drive at the local walmarts. They have bins at the end of the checkout and a list and they want you to buy a supply item and drop it in the bin!!!

I had to do a double take. This is the school district directly, not a charity for getting school supplies for kids on food stamps or the like. These supplies go straight to the classrooms. They even mention some things on the list directly for the teachers and not the kids (post its, file folders, reward charts/stickers, etc.).

I was a teacher and yes I used to spend my $ on the EXTRAS. Cute decorations, a read aloud I wanted to use that we didn't have, etc. But we had office supplies, borders, wall paper in bulk.

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My issue with that though is the school list was very specific about certain brands and sizes, which required going to several stores to get the right ones. Then all our Pink Pearl brand erasers and jumbo Elmers glue sticks were dumped in with the Target brand that other parents decided was close enough. I'm not against store brands, but annoyed that the teachers are so particular according to the list and then it doesn't seem to matter. Anyway...another reason I'm glad we're homeschooling both kids now.

I actually appreciate the specifics. I want to make sure that the stuff I'm spending money on is what the teacher wants so it will be used!

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You need four boxes because, inevitably, no matter what size box of crayon you have, there is only ONE red. So you need four boxes so you have four reds so that when you do math problems that involve coloring pictures according to code you don't end up with "eh, close enough" red-violet apples.

 

Edit: On a related note, I hated those math sheets with a vengeance. Inevitably the kids started coloring BEFORE I could read the instructions, and then they cried because they "did it wrong" and I had to try to fix it.

 

If they didn't specify colors, just said that each answer had to be a different one, I gleefully let them color their apples purple and blue and gray with orange polka dots. I could always tell, on open school days, which papers had been done by my kid.... The math may have been dubious at times, but nobody can fault my girls on creativity!

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Related rant--

Heh, at my dd's high school, they ran low on paper and could not print off anything (or, very little). I couldn't believe it. I wanted to give several teachers a few reams of paper, but couldn't afford it at the time.

I mean, come ON, a school shouldn't run out of PAPER, for Goodness' Sake!

My sister is a 4th grade teacher and has a limit of how many photocopies she can make per year at the school. After that, she has to make them on her dime.

A teacher from her state moved to my state to teach at a private school. He asked the dept. head "What's my copy count?". She had no idea what he was talking about. He was amazed and delighted that he could make all the copies he needed for his students and wouldn't have to pay for them!

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It is not like the teachers or school is making money off the requested school supplies.

For most Public schools the supplies are requested not demanded. There is no punishment for kids who don't bring them for whatever the reason. The name brands are given, because as we all know from threads here, the quality of pencils, crayons, glue sticks even scissors varies greatly from brand to brand. Teachers and students will use whatever brand they have, but I don't see anything wrong with the school suggesting brands.

 

At the k-2nd level group supplies are so much easier for the teacher to manages. Otherwise to the teacher ends up having to referee all day long When kids start to argue about ownership.

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You need four boxes because, inevitably, no matter what size box of crayon you have, there is only ONE red. So you need four boxes so you have four reds so that when you do math problems that involve coloring pictures according to code you don't end up with "eh, close enough" red-violet apples.

 

Edit: On a related note, I hated those math sheets with a vengeance. Inevitably the kids started coloring BEFORE I could read the instructions, and then they cried because they "did it wrong" and I had to try to fix it.

 

If they didn't specify colors, just said that each answer had to be a different one, I gleefully let them color their apples purple and blue and gray with orange polka dots. I could always tell, on open school days, which papers had been done by my kid.... The math may have been dubious at times, but nobody can fault my girls on creativity!

 

My brothers are COLOR BLIND. They hated those stupid worksheets in K and 1st grade.

 

They did teach themselves to read the crayon labels pretty quickly.

 

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Oh, here the school district (public, in a relatively well to do area, many houses from  $400sK to in the millions) are holding a "school supply" drive at the local walmarts. They have bins at the end of the checkout and a list and they want you to buy a supply item and drop it in the bin!!!

I had to do a double take. This is the school district directly, not a charity for getting school supplies for kids on food stamps or the like. These supplies go straight to the classrooms. They even mention some things on the list directly for the teachers and not the kids (post its, file folders, reward charts/stickers, etc.).

I was a teacher and yes I used to spend my $ on the EXTRAS. Cute decorations, a read aloud I wanted to use that we didn't have, etc. But we had office supplies, borders, wall paper in bulk.

 

What form of government does your town have? Mine is Board of Selectman and Town Meeting, and we go line by line through the school budget. All has to be approved by majority vote. Thankfully, most stuff passes without comment. But there is a very vocal "make the people who USE it pay for it" minority whose goal is low taxes.  Not a proper student experience.  Free public education doesn't mean free crayons, yadda yadda yadda.

 

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Why does my Kindergartener need 4 boxes of 24 count crayons?? When I was a kid, you bought a pencil box and all your stuff went in your box. You got one box of crayons for the year (if you were lucky and the cattle sold well that year, you got the really big box!!). Now they all share all the supplies so she needs 4 boxes?? This is a sort of expensive private school so it isn't like she is buying extra for the kids who can't afford stuff. Plus, it isn't nearly as exciting for the kids now. The list is very clear that nothing is to be labeled because it belongs to the whole class. Boo hiss.

In our school district, the teachers ask for this because only 1 out of 5 parents will actually buy school supplies. Essentially, you are helping to supply the entire class because there is no budget for it in the school. A small group of dedicated parents here end up supplying all of the Kleenex and toilet paper for the buildings as well. So a school supply list will say something like - 100 rolls of toilet paper and 10 boxes of tissues, 12 rolls paper towels, five boxes crayons, ....

 

No joke. It's ridiculous.

 

On top of which they require one, exactly one, specific model of graphing calculator for algebra 2 and trigonometry that generally runs pretty close to $100.00 at Staples, Office Max, and such. Can't afford it? Student is not allowed to take the class!!!!

 

I hate my school district.

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Oh, here the school district (public, in a relatively well to do area, many houses from  $400sK to in the millions) are holding a "school supply" drive at the local walmarts. They have bins at the end of the checkout and a list and they want you to buy a supply item and drop it in the bin!!!

I had to do a double take. This is the school district directly, not a charity for getting school supplies for kids on food stamps or the like. These supplies go straight to the classrooms. They even mention some things on the list directly for the teachers and not the kids (post its, file folders, reward charts/stickers, etc.).

I was a teacher and yes I used to spend my $ on the EXTRAS. Cute decorations, a read aloud I wanted to use that we didn't have, etc. But we had office supplies, borders, wall paper in bulk.

 

Geez, you were lucky. In my district, they built a hugely expensive administrative building and then couldn't afford adequate office supplies. And yes, we ran out of paper every single semester and they severely limited our copy keys.

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Why do you need a graphing calculator for trig? My teacher made us lug around log tables.

 

(Wait, what am I saying? I hated that teacher!)

 

I remember failing a test because I left a table in my locker and the teacher wouldn't let me go back to get it. Before I took that class, I wanted to major in math. By the time she finished with me, I hated math. I still don't like it, but I see the necessity of it. 

 

 

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What bothered me about it is that they aren't giving the non-consumables stuff back at the end of the year. My son has been using the same pair of scissors since we started homeschooling and the same binder since 4th grade. I resented the idea that I had to buy new stuff every year. It also doesn't explain why they need 30 pairs of brand new fiskars scissors when they have bins of nearly a 100 usable pairs from the last few years.

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Lucy, the waste is staggering! A friend of mine's father is a custodian for a building in the next district over that was being closed and put up for sale. He was told to throw away the contents of all of the closets. Since friend was homeschooling young students, he saved out all kinds of manipulatives, art supplies, student clocks, books, you name it. Friend estimates that he gave her $500.00 worth of supplies. It was a "drop in the bucket" compared to what was thrown into the dumpster. No sale. No offering it to the parents. No donations. Nothing. Just heave it in the garbage. He could have been fired if they had known he saved out supplies for her because his exact instructions were that all of it must be thrown away.

 

I do not have any respect for that kind of waste. None.

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Related rant--

Heh, at my dd's high school, they ran low on paper and could not print off anything (or, very little). I couldn't believe it. I wanted to give several teachers a few reams of paper, but couldn't afford it at the time.

I mean, come ON, a school shouldn't run out of PAPER, for Goodness' Sake!

For my local K-8 public school, the teacher has to bring his/her own ream of paper to use the photocopier. The general office reams of paper is for the school admin.

Also they have a quota for the photocopier. My boy's teacher asked parents if they could help print a few copies each. She gets $100 per hear to use on school supplies.

Only K is communal though so my boy came back at the end of 1st grade with all his supplies including Kleenex :) We didn't need to label his supplies. They stay at his desk's underside drawer all year.

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