Need dog advice..neighbor's pitbull

[kahlanne]

We live on the outskirts of town, our property is 2 acres and borders a small subdivision and 7 acres of wooded area. From our house over it is more "country". The neighbor to our west is more of a country setting as well. This is the neighbor that owns the dogs we have issues with. We have a beagle/pit mix that we got as a baby. We didn't realize the pit mix until it grew into the the more stocky body. She is more beagle in looks and attitude but we keep her inside at all times unless on a lanyard. Occasionally she gets out if she runs past my kids at the door but she has never been violent at all. As far as I know, she has never lunged at anyone much less attempted to bite. She does her beagle bark though. She has been through obedience training as I was worried about the pit breed in her. Everyone that has met her loves her except my stepdad who thought it would be funny to taunt her during first meeting while she was in her kennel. She has never tried to bite him but has growled at him many times. We have a great Pyrenees that stays outside. She does roam our unfenced yard, which isn't uncommon in this area. She is large but not aggressive toward anything, man or beast. She will bark but will keep at least 10 feet between any new person in our yard and herself if possible. I had workers hanging siding that tried all day to get her to come close. She barked and watched but nothing else. If you win her trust, she is a big baby and just lays her head on you. When she is scared, she cowers down and covers her eyes with her paws. She won't move no matter what. We bring her inside during storms and if we are late she won't budge.

 

My issue isn't my dogs of course but more my neighbor's. We have lived here for nearly 10 yrs. The house beside us was bought by a couple with two full blooded pits, a Pomeranian, and a great Dane. They are inside dogs but are allowed into thier small back yard which is fenced on two sides by tall wood fence, an iron front fence and gate, and our 4ft chainlink on another side. The first we noticed the new neighbors, dh was out back vacuuming the pool when a pit lunged at our chainlink fence, biting and attacking. Dh walked closer speaking in a calming voice but it got worse so he came inside. When he went back to the pool, the dog was gone. The next day I was working in my front flower bed, 4 feet from my door, with my 2 yr old playing nearby. She wondered near the end of the house, 50' front the start of their property. Next thing I know their dog came tearing into our portion of the fence trying to climb and bite through it. Before I could bat an eye, Abby (Pyrenees) came running from side yard and tore into the dog through the fence. I grabbed my daughter and put her inside. I then came outside and called Abby away. She was not even in sight of their dog originally and had never been aggressive before yet I was so thankful she was. If that dog would have climbed the fence, I just don't know. I went and spoke to the owner who told me the dog wasn't aggressive or dangerous. I met the dog in owners presence and she was calm. I thought maybe I overreacted. Later the next day while my kids were at the pool, the dog attacked fence again. Dh spoke to owner and they said if she got out she wouldn't hurt anyone or animal other than cats. They said they would finish their wooden fence so dog can't see us. This was Easter. We haven't spoken since but the dog continues to lunge, dig, growl, bite, and tear at the fence any time we are in the backyard. If Abby is anywhere near it gets really bad. Abby likes to lay in the shade of of our sunroom which is 50' away from their property but visible to their backyard. Many times I have seen that dog spot her and lunge at the fence yet Abby stay where she is and bark. (Their dog is deaf so it can't hear her barks.) My teenage son weed eats the yard but can't on this side if their dogs are out as he can't come in sight of the dog without her going beserk. The little puppy pit also does it but not as bad. Our pool is actually about 75 ft from the said area of fence but visible btw. Today I was in my office and Abby was laying in front of my office window as usual due to shade during this time of day. I heard her fighting and ran to the door just feet away. All of her dogs were out. The Dane was lumbering around seeming nonchalant, the puppy jumping and barking, but the white pitt was fighting. She had to have initiated the fight as Abby wasn't visible from her yard at least 70 ft away. The fight was taking place right where Abby had been moments before. As soon as I opened the door, the pitt backed away and Abby ran to side yard to hide. Pitt came to my glass door and growled at me standing inside before running to the start of my chainlink to try to tear through to our backyard. I guess assuming Abby went there. When that failed she came back to roll around in my flowerbeds right in front of my door. (ones I was working on that day) The owner must have realized they were loose cause I spotted her walking over and dogs following. I am sure it was an accident that they got out but right in front of the flower bed is where my 4 yr old sets his tball tee and practices. Many times my children play in front yard without parents. My kids are 17, 13, 11, 6, 4, and 2. Sometimes the older are there, sometimes not. They ride their bikes feet away in our driveway. Last week there were many times that my 6 and 4 went out to hit the ball off the tee without me doing anything but checking in on them. What would have happened if they accidentally got out while our kids were outside? According to owners, nothing, they are big babies. Many times our older children supervise the younger at the pool and the dog always acts aggressive during this time even though she has been contained in her back yard. I have seen her dig so many times that I know she will eventually get through. Or what if she manages to climb. We want to have a garden in the vacant area between our house and theirs but know there is no way we could work it if their dogs are out in their fenced backyard for fear that they manage to escape. I can't enjoy this area or my pool when they are outside for fear that this will happen. When I speak to owners, they say she is sweet and won't hurt an flea. Dh suggested we fence said area somehow but that doesn't help when they accidently get out of the gate in the front. Yes, it has only happened once but it can happen again. What would you do? I hate that we have to change our life because you want what appears a violent dog.I know we have a dog roaming free on our property but have never had a complaint from any neighbor even the previous homeowners. I know they will say we can't complain if Abbey isn't controlled but honestly, I want her outside even more now. If my kids or I am outside and the dog gets out, Abby can at least protect us enough to help give me time to get the kids inside. I have never seen Abby as protective, more guarding, but I now know provoked she will as she did when 2 yr old was getting near fence and dog lunged at it. Definitely happy Abby was there.

 

Now I need advice. We can't afford to fence our yard. (Don't feel it should be our responsibility even if we could.) Hate not being able to feel free in all our property. Animal control won't do anything outside city limits. I don't know if it is something that police even handle. Neighbors don't see an issue because they have a totally enclosed fenced yard and dogs are usually inside. I am not big on a chainlink fence being able to hold an aggressive dog though. Btw, they let them stay outside for hours while the homeowners are home but not necessarily outside with them. Not sure how the dogs got out today.

[dirty ethel rackham]

Have you talked with the owners about the dog issues? I would calmly tell them that you are concerned about the aggression that some of their dogs are showing (give specific examples as you have here.) Please don't bring up the fact that they are pit bulls as that has very little to do with it. Also, let them know that having the dogs loose is dangerous, especially if they show aggressive tendencies and pick fights with dogs not on their property. Can you call the police and ask for advice? Can you at least call animal control and ask their advice?

 

BTW, this isn't a "pit bull" issue, but a poorly trained, poorly socialized dog issue. I see poorly socialized dogs at the shelter all the time and they are not all pitties. I see lots of pitties at the shelter and only a few of them had socialization issues.

[Cera]

Honestly, I would buy a gun and shoot the dog the first time I found it on my property acting aggressively. I know this is probably not a popular opinion but I have no tolerance for aggressive, uncontrolled dogs. They are too unpredictable.

[Jean in Newcastle]

If you can't afford a fence, then get some tarps and put them up around your chain link fence. You can't control the dog lunging at the fence at the smell or sound (though that sounds like it isn't an issue) of your dog but you can control the dog lunging at the fence at the sight of your dog or children. You can also control your dog being able to get her mouth through the chainlink.

 

Any dog that trespasses onto your property needs to be reported - I guess to police if animal control doesn't cover this. The owners are responsible for keeping their dog on their property. BTW you are responsible for keeping your dog on your own property too. If your dog roams your property and doesn't go on the property of others that shouldn't be an issue.

[J-rap]

I'm not quite clear if the neighbor's pit bull was behind neighbor's fence, or roaming free on your property...

 

I'll offer an easy fix suggestion, which doesn't really address the dog's aggressiveness but might help in your situation.

 

Our dog is an Aussie who is suspicious of any strangers. He sounds very vicious when he sees someone he doesn't know, or even a bike or lawn mower flying past him on the other side of the fence. We have a fenced in yard and he cannot get out of it, not a chance. But, we don't like the fact that he barks so angrily at the young sweet married couple on one side and the family with 4 young children on the other side.

 

We gave each of our neighbors a big bag of juicy treats, and told them to toss our dog a treat every time they went out back and happened to see him. Within a week, our dog was their best friend.

 

This worked the other way around, too. The family with 4 young children got an adult dog who looked like he wanted to attack me every time I went out back. There was a fence in-between our yards, so again -- I was not concerned about him actually hurting me, but I didn't like the fact that he barked at me so angrily. So...I did the same for him. I tossed him a treat every time I went out back, often several times a day. Now he is so happy to see me, I'm like his second mother. :)

 

Perhaps you can try something like this (with ALL of your children), but then I would move on to something more extreme if it didn't help.

[Dory]

Please don't mention they are pit bulls if you bring it up with the neighbour again, that really has very little to do with the problem. If the dog was calm meeting you when there was no fence, I would make bets that it's more of an intensity and poor training problem than true aggression. By some treats and when you go out in the yard DO NOT even look a the dogs, just throw a treat over the fence and continue on your business. It often works. Otherwise, you need to have some more talks with the neighbour and see if they are willing to brainstorm ways to help solve the problem.

 

Apologies for the horrific spelling and lack of punctuation. My phone likes to fight me with every response I make. Lol

[jenn-]

First I would get some video of the dog going crazy in their backyard. Use your cell phone or a digital camera or something. Then with evidence in hand, go talk to the neighbors again.

[Anne]

I love the "throw a treat over the fence" suggestions and Jean's "put up a tarp" suggestion. I would start with the treat idea and then move on with the tarp idea if the treats don't work.

 

Anne

[kahlanne]

Thanks so much for the advice. I would not have thought of the treats nor the tarp.

As for where the dog was, it typically is in his own backyard which is visible through a 10 foot long section of our chain link fence. Our outside activities can be seen from this area both in portions of back and front yard. This morning, the dogs were at my front door. Yes, my dog roams free but has never tried to enter their backyard or came near their front door. I haven't seen her in their front yard but can't guarantee it hasn't happened. She has roamed the woods next to our land and stays close. As I said, it isn't roaming dogs that bother me as this isn't the first dog to roam our property but aggressive dogs scare me. Yes my dog has gotten her nose thru our fence to get to that dog but only when the dog is acting aggressive towards my family. Even with today's fight she fought but used the first opportunity to run away to side yard. I love that she is protective of us yet not aggressive. The homeowners told us the only time the dog shows aggression is when there are cats nearby and you can't stop her til she kills it. We don't have any cats but occasionally a stray shows up on our property.

[JustEm]

Are you sure they are being aggressive? Barking and jumping at a fence isn't necessarily a sign of aggression. My dogs do these things but the second they are near a person they are all licks and begging for love. That is what the barking and jumping is when they aren't near the person but can see them or hear them. They want to be near them and the barking and acting wild is the only way they know how to get that point across. I'm not saying this is the case but have you looked up signs of aggression in dogs and made sure that these dogs are truly showing signs of aggression and not just trying to get attention from you.

[Acadie]

The Rottweiler next door to us was doing the same thing, lunging at the fence and barking, teeth bared, every time we were in our backyard. The owner gave us the same line--oh he's a sweet dog, he wouldn't hurt anybody--and took no responsibility for it. That's BS. The owner may experience the animal as a lapdog, but that doesn't mean it won't act as a guard/attack dog in situations with strangers. I've seen the dog loose in our yard twice, so I knew he could get out. You absolutely must listen to your gut on this. Definitely throw treats over the fence, but make sure all your children know they must not let their hands go over or near the fence. If you feel comfortable, have some time to socialize with the dog with the owner present. Those two things have made our situation work for now--the dog doesn't bark at us and seems to be looking for a treat when he sees us. But we have to repeat the process every spring, though it takes less time. I wouldn't let the littles out alone until this is resolved to your comfort. My kids know that even though the dog seems familiar, and we pet him when the owner is present, they can never approach the fence or enter his enclosure without the owner present. I'm not sure if the tarp is a good idea--maybe some dog psychologist could chime in on that. I felt like we needed the dog to recognize us as part of his house/people in order to make the situation safer for my children.

 

Amy

[kahlanne]

Egregg23, I know that when I entered the neighbor's home, the dog was reserved but later very nice with my husband and myself. Yet outside it is different. When I say barking and jumping at the fence I mean biting the chain link and shaking head back and forth trying to tear it apart, lunging at fence trying to climb it, barking and growling, and even digging as fast as possible under fence. This is when we are far away at our pool but in sight of dog. My husband tried to walk closer to fence speaking calmly but it only got worse. The day that my 2 yr old was between me and dog while I was weeding, the dog didn't stop when I made Abby leave sight and took daughter inside. I walked over to confront neighbors about it and once I came into view, the dog showed same behavior until I left. My issue is more what if she gets out and someone is outside. I know not all pits are bad but they can do major damage quickly. I own a part pit and know they are territorial and animal aggressive by nature. Not all but for most part. Btw, the oldest is a pit they have had for a whole but the youngest is a rescue. She said she would love to continue rescuing pits which I think is noble but makes ne fearful under the circumstances.

[StephanieZ]

I like the treat idea. It won't hurt, and it might solve the problem.

 

I'd also video ALL THE TIME every chance you get. Make a log. Video, video, video.

 

Talk to the neighbors again, now that the dog has gotten out at least once.

 

Frankly, it IS relevant that it is a pitt. In many areas, there are extra layers of laws targeting them. Find out the laws in your area.

 

Talk to the non-emergency line at your local law enforcement about the laws and how they can help.

 

If nothing else, you can probably file a civil complaint for a "private nuisance" (google it), and likely get the owners to improve their control of the dogs noise/etc. The dogs are inhibiting your "private enjoyment" of your property.

 

And, FWIW, I would find the money to reinforce your fencing and secure the areas where your children play.

 

I'd also get a couple canisters of pepper spray and keep them very handy.

[ILiveInFlipFlops]

And, FWIW, I would find the money to reinforce your fencing and secure the areas where your children play.

 

I'd also get a couple canisters of pepper spray and keep them very handy.

 

 

This. In my experience, people with dangerous dogs will simply never see your side of the issue. They do not consider their dogs a problem and won't even it actually injures someone.

 

We have an aggressive dog (a very large GSD) behind us. We tried the treats route, with the owner present even, and all that dog would do was back away from the treats on the ground, growling a deep, low growl. Thankfully, our side neighbor had his chain link replaced by 6-foot PVC fencing, and in doing so, the small gap that allowed the dog to see into our yard (and potentially GET INTO our yard) was closed up. But a few weeks ago, I was out in the street teaching DD7 to ride her bike, and they had the dog in the side yard unleashed (which is a HUGE pet peeve of mine, even for "good" dogs). As soon as that dog saw us, it went low to the ground and started to growl deeply and slink toward us. I started to back away and put myself between it and DD7, saying a firm but quiet, "No. No. No." repeatedly. The adult son was there, and he laughed and said, "Oh, don't worry, he's a sweetheart." Um. NO. Do you not hear the sound your dog is making? That's not a sweetheart, that's an aggressive dog. And these neighbors are a university professor and a Rhodes scholar, for pete's sake.

 

Anyway, my point is that I too would find the money for the fencing, even if I had to borrow the money from family or use a CC and pay for it over a few years. I would never trust someone else's assessment of their aggressive dog, not when my small children were involved. And I would never let that neighbor put me in a position of feeling restricted in my family's use of our own yard. I would also make sure my own dog wasn't free-roaming anymore also, because even though she's never left your yard, this sounds like a fight waiting to happen.

 

I love love love dogs. I just don't understand why so many dog owners are so clueless or in denial about their pets' temperament and the risk they pose to noisy children and other dogs.

[ILiveInFlipFlops]

Double post.

[BrookValley.]

I wouldn't throw treats over a fence to a dog exhibiting undesirable behavior--that is only providing positive reinforcement for the behavior you *don't* want.

[songsparrow]

Re the pepper spray, my trainer did not recommend it (and in our area, it may be illegal to have it). Instead, I have a bottle of "SprayShield Animal Deterrent Spray" that I take with me on walks. It says on the bottle "Sprayshield . . . will not increase aggression in dogs. Unlike other spray deterrants, Sprayshield's unique formula will not injure the user if accidentally 'blown back' into the eyes."

 

And I'd be putting up a tall, strong fence - preferably solid to keep the dog from seeing family members or pets - around at least a portion of the property where we spend most of our time. My dogs would no longer be free roaming.

[Alia_in_FL]

Warning: this is lengthy, but I feel I have some important stuff to share....and since this is life and death, I let my passion shine forth here.

 

 

Firstly, let me say that I fully empathize with your plight; this describes our neighbors perfectly complete with the wandering pit bull (who, by the way, did indeed kill my cat 2 months ago).

 

 

I haven’t read the other posts, so I’m quite likely echoing, but here goes my 2 cents (in this case I feel my 2 cents are worth $2 billion dollars as I FIRMLY believe in the accuracy of what I have to say on this issue).

 

PLEASE listen to your red flags in this situation and DO NOT TRUST that those dogs will not severly injure or even kill your children (or you adults).

 

I’m not putting you in this category, but I anticipate the pit bull defenders showing up on this thread and going into what a bad rap pit bulls get. It’s interesting that pit bull defenders will gladly tout any other specific breeds “gifts†or “natural inclinationsâ€, but they dismiss a pit bull’s. What do I mean? They’ll gladly admit that a Collie is good at shepherding/herding, or that a Retriever is a good swimmer, or a Pointer is a good bird dog, or a Bloodhound has a superb sniffer. But, when it comes to what a pit bulldog is bred for, then we toss all of that out and only focus on what “sweet puppies†they are and ignore what they are CAPABLE of. The data is irrefutable and clear – they are a risky breed of dog. Sure, there are exceptions to the rule and not every pit is aggressive, but a pit bull LIKE ANY BREED of dog (even my own little rat terrier) is C A P A B L E of inflicting injury. And, in a pit’s case, because of their size, and genetic STRENGTH and athleticism, they are capable of inflicting worse injury than many other breeds of dog.

 

As a person who used to own a pit bull, we learned the hard way; now, armed the that 20/20 hindsight, I’ve wised up and fully admit how dangerous they are. When I was a teenager (I was probably 14 ish), my dad bought a pit bull (female) puppy. She was sweet, kind-natured to us and acted normally when a stranger pulled into our yard – she’d bark the usual barks, but never acted aggressively. But, one day, we were outside grilling (we lived on 14 acres in the country and our house sat about 100 yards (a football field length) off of the main country road. On this one occasion a man pedaled his bike down the road (he didn’t even look our way or engage us at all) and, for no reason at all, she BOLTED off our porch the entire distance to the road and knocked him off his bike and mangled his legs so badly that he had to get 100s of stitches (I want to say it was 400 stitches). My strong dad COULD NOT get her off of him. When he finally did (he was bit in the process), the ambulance came and took that man to the hospital and my parents were sued and settled out of court (THANKFULLY) for $46,000. (this was back in the 80s when lawsuits were much less expensively settled than they are now). And, my parents GLADLY paid it. He suffered significant injury. My dad put her down that night. And my mom cried as she realized how foolish she had been and that that dog could have easily killed anyone of me or my siblings. She snapped for no apparent reason. NONE of us saw this coming. An hour before it happened, we would have sounded EXACTLY like your neighbors do and would have sworn up and down that our little sweetie wouldn’t hurt a fly.

 

My brother-in-law went hunting back in November with a friend. The friend took his pit bulldog along. He said as they were walking in the woods a wild boar hog (male) crossed their path and the pit broke away from his (man) owner who COULD NOT hold her and she got into it with that MALE HUGE wild boar hog. (I don’t know if you know how big and aggressive wild boar hogs are, but they are DANGEROUS in their own right). She KILLED the wild boar hog. My brother-in-law said he had never seen such a fight in his life and he said he had NO idea who would be the victor and he said it was like the scene in OLD YELLER where his friend couldn’t fire the gun as he couldn’t get a clear shot off. He said she finally pinned the hog and bit and held its neck until it bled out. Said she was drenched in blood and was like a wild animal – in like state where she COULD NOT de-escalate her wild trance for all of her adrenaline.

 

A friend of mine's sister was attacked by a pit bull who ran across the street at her in her own yard; her husband thankfully was home and heard it and ran out and couldn't get it off of her. She was in the hospital for WEEKS. When last I heard, she had had her 4^th reconstructive surgery on her FACE and her husband had gotten numerous stitches also.

 

I share all this to say: PIT BULLDOGS are powerful creatures with strong jaws and a strong attack instinct. They are (like ANY dog) unpredictable. Your neighbor’s dog sees NO difference in your 2 year old or your 4 year old being a homo eructus or a feline domesticus and your neighbor even admitted the dog might kill a cat.

 

Abby may serve to help steer the attack her way but she is NO sure protection for your children. If that pit gets to them AT ALL, neither you nor one of your older kids nor ABBY is CAPABLE of stopping a ripped cornea, or a ripped jugular vein, (you get my point). You do not have TIME to redirect this type of animal. You don’t have time to get a gun. You (or even a man) CANNOT physically pull it off. They are capable of locking their jaws where they themselves CANNOT open them.

 

My neighbor had 2 pit bulls – now they’re down to 1. We learned his AFTER we purchased our 8 acres. The mama dog and her puppy would come over to our land while we were working and that ended my and my kids’ abilities to go over there at all as the adult dog saw that as HER turf. She had lived next to it for years, so she’d come and stare us down. We put everything on hold and put ALL our money into fencing. Thankfully, the mama dog died in a car accident and that left the 4 month old puppy. We continued with the fencing efforts knowing that soon the puppy will be grown. We even BURIED the fencing ---- welded wire --- so she CAN’T dig under it. These neighbor’s aren’t going to spay the dog, so it’s a matter of time before she has a litter and doubtless they’ll keep one or two (likely males!), so we're prepared. They forced it to be our #1 priority, because LIKE YOU our freedom ENDED because of it. Now the little 4 month old puppy acts sweet and affectionate, and even if she grows up to be the same sweet and affectionate dog (like my own pit was as an adult), she’s still CAPABLE of turning on a moment’s notice and she has the POWER to inflict serious injury.

 

You know in your heart that for all intents and purposes, your freedom there is over as things are now as there's no way you are worry-free when your kids are out in your front yard. There’s no way you feel “FREEâ€(peace/calm/tranquil) anymore knowing of what potentially could occur. So now that you KNOW this, you have to find a way to feel free on your own property.

 

You know you can’t TRUST your neighbor not to let them out (or that they won’t get out on their own) as they do not think she's capable of hurting anything, so that's a dead end road, so I'd leave them out of the solution as that's a lost cause. They feel the EXACT same way WE did about our little precious pit).

 

When these stories are on the news have you ever seen the owner say, “Well, it didn’t surprise me at all; we knew Buster was capable of this.†No, it’s always the disbelief and the stories of the dog’s sweet and calm disposition.

 

You can move and hope that you won’t end up with similar neighbors (quite an expensive gamble).

 

Or, you can do what is likely the ONLY solution, you can protect YOUR PROPERTY and allow your kids to ONLY go where there’s no way in Hades that that dogs CAN get to them and this takes fencing. And you don't have to spend a mint on fencing. You can get a roll of welded wire at Lowe's/Home Depot/Farm Supply stores for about $1 per foot -- not including the metal rods). The fencing has to be impenetrable by even a digging dog. IT’s the only way you’ll have FREEDOM and peace of mind.

 

My own dog is 14 lbs and is 13 years old and he’s such a wimpy, cowardly acting dog that we’ve always called nicknamed him “Tender†and “Peacelilly†and “WussDogâ€. This was his natural temperament since birth. The night before last (when the moon was HUGE), he ran after an opossum and killed it with a few viciously powerful shakes to its neck. I would have N E V E R thought my little “WussDog†was capable of tossing a grown opossum around like a ragdoll, but he did. Even I was shocked. We assessed the opossum afterwards thinking perhaps it was “playing opossum†but it wasn’t. He had snapped its neck with a few violent shakes. Now that’s a 91year old dog (in dog years) --- who’s 14 lbs that was bred to kill RATS. So, what do you think a pit bull’s genetic musculature is CAPABLE of doing? These dogs were used to control BULLS (in cattle yards) and for hunting and killing wild hogs among other reasons, but a dog that is CAPABLE of controlling a 1800 lb. BULL and is CAPABLE of killing a wild hog is CAPABLE of hurting a person.

 

Did you hear about that couple who went into their bedroom for intimate relations and had left their baby in a chair along with their indoor Pit Bulldog. They heard a commotion and came out and found that the dog had attacked the child and had eaten his testicles off. I think it was in Texas a few years ago. It was in the paper.

http://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2010/04/08/Baby-mauled-by-two-pit-bulls/UPI-67771270771553/

 

Please heed your mama Bear instincts and realize how serious COULD potentially be. It may NEVER occur but the potential for serious, even fatal, injury is very real.

 

And, please don't let anyone talk you into thinking that all you need to do is go over there with the dogs and their owners and let their dogs befriend you all. Even if they ACT like they like you/them on MANY occasions, they are still unpredictable enough to be deadly. A maimed or dead child is NOT worth the risk.

 

Alia

 

P.S. I'm adding an edit. When I got finished posting this, I went in and sat with my husband and he asked what in the world I had been typing. I told him about your situation and how I'd recommended the welded wire and he said, "well, make sure she knows that regular 4 foot welded wire and a regular height chain length fence is NOT enough protection as they get over that height and, quite possible push them over. He bought 5 foot welded wire than was tougher grade/gauge (made for large animals -- cattle, goat, etc.). He said the 4' welded wiring is more flimsy. He said pits can't get over or push over hat we have. He reminded me how large male pits were as it's been a while since I've seen one in person; he said that our neighbor's females are peewees by comparison (which is hard to fathom as when I look at their large muscular jaws/teeth) -- that's hard to imagine. My husband is a very level-headed, educated man, so please take this into consideration. Again, welded wire is the least expensive option in fencing that is strong enough to prevent their getting through it. And, quite honestly, I don't think it's as unattractive as chain-length.

 

Best wishes!

[Scarlett]

Two women locally were badly attacked by a pit that rushed past his owner and through the front door. A man down the street heard the screams and rushed down and shot the dog. One woman lost an eye and an ear and has hundreds of stitches.

 

 

And just last week a friends sweet pit inexplicably attacked their dachshund and killed it....with three teen boys trying to stop it. Her teen daughter loved that pit and often played rough with it....it could have easily been her instead of the other dog.

[*lifeoftheparty*]

I really really REALLY wish I hadn't googled that story about the baby :(

 

That will haunt me for a while :-(

 

I am ever so thankful to live in a community with an HOA that forbids dog breeds like pitbulls.

[Sisyphus]

A few things:

 

The number one dog breed responsible for bites is the Labrador retriever.

 

If your dogs are free range, it's awfully disingenuous to be upset their dogs are too. Google Pyrenees dog bites.

 

A dog "protecting" it's land (ie, inside a fence) is very different than a dog somewhere else.

 

You have a right to feel safe, and pit bulls can and do kill. It is totally within your rights to ensure the neighbors dogs are fenced, leashed, or otherwise contained. If not, a shotgun is not unreasonable. And I'm a vegan for ethical reasons, so I don't say that lightly.

 

Talk to the neighbor about your concerns. If they are responsible owner of this breed, they should be open to that. If not, you know where they are at, and can adjust accordingly (ie, shotgun). I had a chow, and they are very unpredictable and can be vicious. One incident of aggression, and she was on watch- another, and I had her put down. It was my only choice, and as the owner of a dangerous breed (IMO, much more dangerous than a pit bull, which at least gives warning signs) I stand by my decision, as much as it broke my heart. The people I know with dangerous breeds of dogs go far, far out of their way to ensure the dog is socialized, safe and most importantly under control at all times. if the neighbors are not, well then, they are part of the problem. But please give them the courtesy of knowing your fears and concerns first.

 

 

[JBJones]

Warning: this is lengthy, but I feel I have some important stuff to share....and since this is life and death, I let my passion shine forth here.

 

 

Firstly, let me say that I fully empathize with your plight; this describes our neighbors perfectly complete with the wandering pit bull (who, by the way, did indeed kill my cat 2 months ago).

 

 

I haven’t read the other posts, so I’m quite likely echoing, but here goes my 2 cents (in this case I feel my 2 cents are worth $2 billion dollars as I FIRMLY believe in the accuracy of what I have to say on this issue).

 

PLEASE listen to your red flags in this situation and DO NOT TRUST that those dogs will not severly injure or even kill your children (or you adults).

 

I’m not putting you in this category, but I anticipate the pit bull defenders showing up on this thread and going into what a bad rap pit bulls get. It’s interesting that pit bull defenders will gladly tout any other specific breeds “gifts†or “natural inclinationsâ€, but they dismiss a pit bull’s. What do I mean? They’ll gladly admit that a Collie is good at shepherding/herding, or that a Retriever is a good swimmer, or a Pointer is a good bird dog, or a Bloodhound has a superb sniffer. But, when it comes to what a pit bulldog is bred for, then we toss all of that out and only focus on what “sweet puppies†they are and ignore what they are CAPABLE of. The data is irrefutable and clear – they are a risky breed of dog. Sure, there are exceptions to the rule and not every pit is aggressive, but a pit bull LIKE ANY BREED of dog (even my own little rat terrier) is C A P A B L E of inflicting injury. And, in a pit’s case, because of their size, and genetic STRENGTH and athleticism, they are capable of inflicting worse injury than many other breeds of dog.

 

As a person who used to own a pit bull, we learned the hard way; now, armed the that 20/20 hindsight, I’ve wised up and fully admit how dangerous they are. When I was a teenager (I was probably 14 ish), my dad bought a pit bull (female) puppy. She was sweet, kind-natured to us and acted normally when a stranger pulled into our yard – she’d bark the usual barks, but never acted aggressively. But, one day, we were outside grilling (we lived on 14 acres in the country and our house sat about 100 yards (a football field length) off of the main country road. On this one occasion a man pedaled his bike down the road (he didn’t even look our way or engage us at all) and, for no reason at all, she BOLTED off our porch the entire distance to the road and knocked him off his bike and mangled his legs so badly that he had to get 100s of stitches (I want to say it was 400 stitches). My strong dad COULD NOT get her off of him. When he finally did (he was bit in the process), the ambulance came and took that man to the hospital and my parents were sued and settled out of court (THANKFULLY) for $46,000. (this was back in the 80s when lawsuits were much less expensively settled than they are now). And, my parents GLADLY paid it. He suffered significant injury. My dad put her down that night. And my mom cried as she realized how foolish she had been and that that dog could have easily killed anyone of me or my siblings. She snapped for no apparent reason. NONE of us saw this coming. An hour before it happened, we would have sounded EXACTLY like your neighbors do and would have sworn up and down that our little sweetie wouldn’t hurt a fly.

 

My brother-in-law went hunting back in November with a friend. The friend took his pit bulldog along. He said as they were walking in the woods a wild boar hog (male) crossed their path and the pit broke away from his (man) owner who COULD NOT hold her and she got into it with that MALE HUGE wild boar hog. (I don’t know if you know how big and aggressive wild boar hogs are, but they are DANGEROUS in their own right). She KILLED the wild boar hog. My brother-in-law said he had never seen such a fight in his life and he said he had NO idea who would be the victor and he said it was like the scene in OLD YELLER where his friend couldn’t fire the gun as he couldn’t get a clear shot off. He said she finally pinned the hog and bit and held its neck until it bled out. Said she was drenched in blood and was like a wild animal – in like state where she COULD NOT de-escalate her wild trance for all of her adrenaline.

 

A friend of mine's sister was attacked by a pit bull who ran across the street at her in her own yard; her husband thankfully was home and heard it and ran out and couldn't get it off of her. She was in the hospital for WEEKS. When last I heard, she had had her 4^th reconstructive surgery on her FACE and her husband had gotten numerous stitches also.

 

I share all this to say: PIT BULLDOGS are powerful creatures with strong jaws and a strong attack instinct. They are (like ANY dog) unpredictable. Your neighbor’s dog sees NO difference in your 2 year old or your 4 year old being a homo eructus or a feline domesticus and your neighbor even admitted the dog might kill a cat.

 

Abby may serve to help steer the attack her way but she is NO sure protection for your children. If that pit gets to them AT ALL, neither you nor one of your older kids nor ABBY is CAPABLE of stopping a ripped cornea, or a ripped jugular vein, (you get my point). You do not have TIME to redirect this type of animal. You don’t have time to get a gun. You (or even a man) CANNOT physically pull it off. They are capable of locking their jaws where they themselves CANNOT open them.

 

My neighbor had 2 pit bulls – now they’re down to 1. We learned his AFTER we purchased our 8 acres. The mama dog and her puppy would come over to our land while we were working and that ended my and my kids’ abilities to go over there at all as the adult dog saw that as HER turf. She had lived next to it for years, so she’d come and stare us down. We put everything on hold and put ALL our money into fencing. Thankfully, the mama dog died in a car accident and that left the 4 month old puppy. We continued with the fencing efforts knowing that soon the puppy will be grown. We even BURIED the fencing ---- welded wire --- so she CAN’T dig under it. These neighbor’s aren’t going to spay the dog, so it’s a matter of time before she has a litter and doubtless they’ll keep one or two (likely males!), so we're prepared. They forced it to be our #1 priority, because LIKE YOU our freedom ENDED because of it. Now the little 4 month old puppy acts sweet and affectionate, and even if she grows up to be the same sweet and affectionate dog (like my own pit was as an adult), she’s still CAPABLE of turning on a moment’s notice and she has the POWER to inflict serious injury.

 

You know in your heart that for all intents and purposes, your freedom there is over as things are now as there's no way you are worry-free when your kids are out in your front yard. There’s no way you feel “FREEâ€(peace/calm/tranquil) anymore knowing of what potentially could occur. So now that you KNOW this, you have to find a way to feel free on your own property.

 

You know you can’t TRUST your neighbor not to let them out (or that they won’t get out on their own) as they do not think she's capable of hurting anything, so that's a dead end road, so I'd leave them out of the solution as that's a lost cause. They feel the EXACT same way WE did about our little precious pit).

 

When these stories are on the news have you ever seen the owner say, “Well, it didn’t surprise me at all; we knew Buster was capable of this.†No, it’s always the disbelief and the stories of the dog’s sweet and calm disposition.

 

You can move and hope that you won’t end up with similar neighbors (quite an expensive gamble).

 

Or, you can do what is likely the ONLY solution, you can protect YOUR PROPERTY and allow your kids to ONLY go where there’s no way in Hades that that dogs CAN get to them and this takes fencing. And you don't have to spend a mint on fencing. You can get a roll of welded wire at Lowe's/Home Depot/Farm Supply stores for about $1 per foot -- not including the metal rods). The fencing has to be impenetrable by even a digging dog. IT’s the only way you’ll have FREEDOM and peace of mind.

 

My own dog is 14 lbs and is 13 years old and he’s such a wimpy, cowardly acting dog that we’ve always called nicknamed him “Tender†and “Peacelilly†and “WussDogâ€. This was his natural temperament since birth. The night before last (when the moon was HUGE), he ran after an opossum and killed it with a few viciously powerful shakes to its neck. I would have N E V E R thought my little “WussDog†was capable of tossing a grown opossum around like a ragdoll, but he did. Even I was shocked. We assessed the opossum afterwards thinking perhaps it was “playing opossum†but it wasn’t. He had snapped its neck with a few violent shakes. Now that’s a 91year old dog (in dog years) --- who’s 14 lbs that was bred to kill RATS. So, what do you think a pit bull’s genetic musculature is CAPABLE of doing? These dogs were used to control BULLS (in cattle yards) and for hunting and killing wild hogs among other reasons, but a dog that is CAPABLE of controlling a 1800 lb. BULL and is CAPABLE of killing a wild hog is CAPABLE of hurting a person.

 

Did you hear about that couple who went into their bedroom for intimate relations and had left their baby in a high chair (in the kitchen) along with their indoor Pit Bulldog. They heard a commotion and came out and found that the dog had attacked the child and had eaten his testicles off. This was in Texas a few years ago. It was in the paper.

 

Please heed your mama Bear instincts and realize how serious COULD potentially be. It may NEVER occur but the potential for serious, even fatal, injury is very real.

 

And, please don't let anyone talk you into thinking that all you need to do is go over there with the dogs and their owners and let their dogs befriend you all. Even if they ACT like they like you/them on MANY occasions, they are still unpredictable enough to be deadly. A maimed or dead child is NOT worth the risk.

 

Alia

 

P.S. I'm adding an edit. When I got finished posting this, I went in and sat with my husband and he asked what in the world I had been typing. I told him about your situation and how I'd recommended the welded wire and he said, "well, make sure she knows that regular 4 foot welded wire and a regular height chain length fence is NOT enough protection as they get over that height and, quite possible push them over. He bought 5 foot welded wire than was tougher grade/gauge (made for large animals -- cattle, goat, etc.). He said the 4' welded wiring is more flimsy. He said pits can't get over or push over hat we have. He reminded me how large male pits were as it's been a while since I've seen one in person; he said that our neighbor's females are peewees by comparison (which is hard to fathom as when I look at their large muscular jaws/teeth) -- that's hard to imagine. My husband is a very level-headed, educated man, so please take this into consideration. Again, welded wire is the least expensive option in fencing that is strong enough to prevent their getting through it. And, quite honestly, I don't think it's as unattractive as chain-length.

 

Best wishes!

 

I agree with Alia. I use to own two pits. They can be unpredictable (as can ANY dog), but with a vengeance. I had one that was an English Pit that was extremely docile, loved children, and never exhibited any aggression, towards people or other animals. The other Pit was a total devil, didn't like to be on a leash (was put into obedience training to get control of him), and children were not safe around him. Both dogs were purchased at 8-10 weeks old. Neither was abused. The aggressive one charged a plate glass (sliding) door to reach a friend's three year old. It was like he viewed this child as another animal intruding into his territory. My ex-husband was pondering what to do with the dog when the bad one attacked the good one. The good one killed him. Please proceed with extreme caution. I did want to add that if you don't plan on getting fencing, etc., then I would never leave your dog and/or children outside alone EVER, buy a gun, practice quite frequently with this gun, and be ready to shoot to kill. I was raised on a farm with the belief that if ANY aggressive animal came onto our property and threatened people and other animals, it would be shot dead.

[Seasider]

We lost our freedom to be outside when the house then next door sold to a family with 2 large pit bulls. They chained them to the deck posts, from where they lunged and growled every time one of us set foot in the yard. They were convinced the dogs were gentle babies, wouldn't hurt a fly. I witnessed them escape their leashes on several occasions and run down neighbors. The only reason they didnt actually complete an attack was because the neighbors quickly realized it was not safe to be out any farther than a quick dash back to the door. We were out of city limits in an unrestricted area. So, no law enforcement assistance.

 

The owners refused to put up a large fence, and finally put in a small chain link kennel area. Those dogs still had a view and considered our yard their territory. The wife kept a lovely interior and did not want the dogs inside while they were at work, so those dogs were on outdoor sentinel duty 8am to 5pm weekdays and much of the weekend. It was miserable, and they were not open to discussing the issue at all.

 

We finally put in a privacy fence to the tune of $5K (money we really needed to spend elsewhere). Two other neighbors had to do the same thing. Even so, my kids were then prisoners in our back yard. No bike riding in our street or driveway, because those dogs went nuts when they heard the sounds and they were able to escape if they got worked up.

 

It was torture. I felt like a prisoner. I was never so happy about a corporate relocation as I was when we finally got out of there. In fact, I had just asked dh about the possibility of making a voluntary relocation just to get our freedom back.

 

I don't know what to tell you, OP, we never came up with a great solution. Taking responsibility to fence our own space was the best we could do.

[trulycrabby]

My son required stitches after being bitten by a ten-pound dachsund. Imagine the damage a large dog of any any breed is capable of doing. I also support the idea that you should reinforce your fence, and stop allowing your dog from wandering. It's a shame, but they are unlikely to stop allowing your dogs to wander if yours does the same, and their dogs would likely kill yours if they caught him loose outside.

[Mom0012]

I would be proactive and get whatever fencing you need to keep your pets safe. Or, I would move. I wouldn't count on the neighbors to do anything.

[Melissa in Australia]

I cannot imagine a property without fencing.

[ChristusG]

A Pitt bull acting like that very time I set foot outside? I'd be terrified. I don't care what all the Pitt lovers say....there are way too many instances of Pitts just snapping and maiming or killing someone. They are powerful dogs. My children would never be outside within a few feet of the house and certainly not alone. The owners will probably not change, so unless you want to move, I'd start thinking if putting money into some solid fencing.

[Pawz4me]

I think a sturdy wooden fence is your only good option.

 

I would NOT involve animal control or law enforcement in any way as long as you're allowing your Great Pyr to roam.

[Callie]

Hot wire. I live on 60 acres and have approx. 1 acre around my home in double stranded hot wire to keep my Great Pyr and Cur dog in and roaming dogs out. After being stung once most dogs greatly respect the wire.

 

We keep our cow pasture in triple stranded (some barbed) hot wire to keep cows in and roaming dogs out.

 

A solar charger will work nicely for the area around your home.

 

Children will learn to never touch it..

[Callie]

And I wouldn't hesitate to shoot any dog coming after my children or livestock.

 

The problem you may have is that Great Pyr is roaming you will need to keep her contained if you are going to complain about others dogs. Great Pyrs love to roam and they are scary looking to others because of their size.

 

Mine are always contained either in a fenced pasture or around our fenced yard.

[ktgrok]

I wouldn't throw treats over a fence to a dog exhibiting undesirable behavior--that is only providing positive reinforcement for the behavior you *don't* want.

 

This used to be the thinking, but has since been disproved. When actually eating the dog has to stop growling/barking, so it does reinforce the right behavior. But more importantly, it works on the classical conditioning level of changing emotions rather than the operant conditioning level of changing behavior. The idea is the dog starts to associate the people with happy happy fun time and it DOES often work really well. I had two big mastiff type dogs that would fence charge me on my way to the bus stop as a kid. I started feeding them each half a sandwhich and in a week or so they would run up happily wagging their tails :) And there are lots of books on it..."click to calm" comes to mind off the top of my head.

 

These dogs probably ARE sweet hearts in the right circumstances, but fence charging is an issue of boundary frustration. It is really common even in normally nice dogs. My dog will do it at the neighbor's dog, but the difference is that their dog does the same thing, and if I hear it I stop it immediately, so it isn't an ongoing problem. I don't argue that my dog is a big baby blah blah blah. That's not the point. The point is that even a nice dog will fight along a fence line or in a doorway, and It is my job as a dog owner to prevent this and prevent the annoying barking that goes with it.

[ktgrok]

Fencing is good, but dogs can dig under fencing...more needs to be done. Not sure what, short of the treats idea.

[gardenmom5]

listen to your instincts. I have seen a GSdog jump a 6' fence - I wouldn't consider 5' safe. the owners are in denial, and have a disaster waiting to happen. Just this week, in IL two pitbulls charged and broke down a neighbor's screen door and killed their dog in THEIR home. The husband was bit. This was an older couple who were very grateful their grandchildren weren't there that day as it could have been even worse.

 

I would consult the police, animal control, lawyer to see what recourse I had, and what behavior would be actionable.

 

Great Pyr's are used in agriculture to be raised by ewes so they think they're a sheep. they are free to wander with the flock and consider the flock family, and the sheep are not afraid of them. But when a coyote comes around . . . their instincts kick in and they will hunt it down and kill it.

[Rebel Yell]

If you put up a fence, make sure it goes a bit underground. Our neighbor's pitbull broke through the basement door inside their home, crashed through the kitchen door AND the storm door, dug under their chain-link fence, and was in *MY* yard scaring my children. :cursing:

[Callie]

.

 

Great Pyr's are used in agriculture to be raised by ewes so they think they're a sheep. they are free to wander with the flock and consider the flock family, and the sheep are not afraid of them. But when a coyote comes around . . . their instincts kick in and they will hunt it down and kill it.

 

Yes we use our GP in with our cattle. They protect our calves from coyotes. The scary thing about a GP is they do not bark or sound any alarm when they are chasing away a predator. They silently go from standstill to 50mph. If my GP is barking it usually at some other dog off in the distance.

 

And they are big. Mine is taller than me when he stands on his hind legs (I'm 5'4") and he is approx. 125lbs.

[gardenmom5]

UPDATED to add details. warning:

here's something that should be eye opening to those claiming pits are safe and sweet. there have been 16 fatal dog attacks this year. 14 were by one breed. the youngest victim was 14months, the oldest 91. some of the dogs were the family pet, other's were the babysitter's pet. one even had a history of attacking people. at least one pair had been spayed and neutered.

(Nephi Selu, 6 Years Old - family's own dog

(Carlton Freeman, 80 years old - four dogs, dragged him from his wheelchair

(Pamela Marie Devitt, 63 years old - jogging. attacked by pack of seven dogs that belonged to one person. owner was arrested on drug charges.

(Beau Rutledge, 2 years old - family's own dog

(Jordyn Arndt 4 years old - her babysitter's dog

( Claudia Gallardo, 38 years old - killed by a dog with a history of attacking people

(Tyler Jett, 7 years old - mixed breeds that came in his own yard

(Monica Renee Laminack, 21 months old) - mauled her family's seven dogs

(Daxton Borchardt, 14 months old - unexpectedly knocked from his babysitter's arms and killed by her two dogs. the babysitter-owner was also attacked.

( Ryan Maxwell, 7 years old - playing in a friends yard. (didn't specify if homeowners)

(Isaiah Aguilar, 2 years old - retreived balloon, dog was tied up in unfenced yard.

Esile Grace, 91 years old -

(Christian Gormanous, 4 years old - cilimbed fence to retrieve toy, dog was a mix

(Betty Todd, 65 years old - killed by her son's pitbull while babysitting his children

[gardenmom5]

If you put up a fence, make sure it goes a bit underground. Our neighbor's pitbull broke through the basement door inside their home, crashed through the kitchen door AND the storm door, dug under their chain-link fence, and was in *MY* yard scaring my children. :cursing:

consider yourself very lucky that's all it did.

[nmoira]

here's something that should be eye opening to those claiming pits are safe and sweet.

 

There is one study I'm aware of suggesting that pit bulls are more likely to attack unprovoked than are other breeds, but only one. The problem is that when you take mixed breeds and "looks like" into account, it can be difficult to pinpoint breed. You also have to compare bite statistics to the general dog population for them to be meaningful.

 

I feel for the OP. There's a lab down the street, male and neutered, that is just crazy when people walk by. It waits in ambush and then rushes the fence, snarling and growling... it sounds rabid Old Yeller vicious. Owner thinks it's a darling dog, and this behaviour "cute." And it's indeed a friendly dog when not fenced in... a bit too friendly for my tastes and not under voice control. I avoid her block when I walk the dog at night because I don't appreciate unleashed dogs bounding up to me; I don't care how friendly it is. So, sure, friendly dog, but I'm still scared of it because of the snarling. I don't don't trust it, rational or not, and maybe it knows that. Someday somebody not familiar with the neighborhood is going to have a heart attack when they're ambushed by that dog.

[zoobie]

Don't feed anyone else's animals without the owner's permission. Someone without dog training expertise randomly tossing treats over a fence is not the solution. Nor will the treat offering cross over to stop an enraged, loose dog from charging. Think about this: we have manslaughter laws because society recognizes there is such a thing as blind rage in humans. Dogs do not have the complex reasoning skills that humans do. Once they are in attack mode, a Milk Bone memory is not going to stop them. Yes, any dog will bite. However, HOW they bite is important. An ill-trained Labrador retriever is a completely different creature from a Pit Bull. We had to put down a lab/beagle mix who snapped (mentally snapped) and became aggressive. Our vet believed she may have had a pituitary tumor or something, but after watching her attack my other, larger, stronger dog, it was clear we had no choice. An unhinged lab/beagle mix is nothing like an unhinged pit.

 

OP, you say animal control doesn't come out past city lines. Does the police or sheriff's dept handle it then? Charging your glass door would terrify me, as would the fence issue. 4 ft chain link is nothing. I agree with the others who've said you need to keep your GP restrained as well. I hope you find a workable solution. I'd be putting up a very solid fence even if I had to put it on credit. :(

[gardenmom5]

randomly tossing treats over a fence is not the solution. Nor will the treat offering cross over to stop an enraged, loose dog from charging. Think about this: we have manslaughter laws because society recognizes there is such a thing as blind rage in humans. Dogs do not have the complex reasoning skills that humans do. Once they are in attack mode, a Milk Bone memory is not going to stop them.

 

I agree. of those 14 deaths this year (that's only six months) related to one breed, six of them were the family's own, or babysitter's dog.

[PinkyandtheBrains.]

Now I need advice. We can't afford to fence our yard. (Don't feel it should be our responsibility even if we could.) Hate not being able to feel free in all our property. Animal control won't do anything outside city limits. I don't know if it is something that police even handle. Neighbors don't see an issue because they have a totally enclosed fenced yard and dogs are usually inside. I am not big on a chainlink fence being able to hold an aggressive dog though. Btw, they let them stay outside for hours while the homeowners are home but not necessarily outside with them. Not sure how the dogs got out today.

 

 

 

Unfortunately it is your responsibility, even if it doesn't seem fair. You need a secure fence that can keep your dogs in, and their dogs out. Pitbulls are high risk dogs. But any dog can attack for no apparent reason, this includes your own dogs.

 

There have been some good fencing ideas suggested above, including less costly but still sturdy options.

[ktgrok]

UPDATED to add details. warning:

here's something that should be eye opening to those claiming pits are safe and sweet. there have been 16 fatal dog attacks this year. 14 were by one breed. the youngest victim was 14months, the oldest 91. some of the dogs were the family pet, other's were the babysitter's pet. one even had a history of attacking people. at least one pair had been spayed and neutered.

(

 

Yes, and before that it was rotties, and before that shepherds, etc etc etc.

 

Bad people like to own pitbulls. They end up raising bad pitbulls.

 

Pitbulls, if they do attack, are very pain insensitive so unlikely to stop if you hit them, like another breed might.

 

MANY times, the dog in question in an attack is not actually a pitbull at all.

 

But the biggest issue is that stupid people with attitude problems tend to prefer pits right now. Which is unfortunate. That said, I've worked in veterinary medicine since I was 17, and pit bulls in general do not scare me the way some other breeds do. In fact, most veterinary professionals love the breed. That pain intolerance makes for a great patient when it is time for shots, lol.

 

Dog breeds that make me nervous include some Chows, many Akitas, lots and lots of cattle dogs. That doesn't mean a pit roaming and growling wouldn't scare me, ANY large breed dog doing what hte OP says this dog is doing is scary. Only twice in my veterinary and training career did I truly truly fear for my life...both those dogs were labradors. Both were unhinged mentally and owned by people that had no freaking clue. One was euthanized after it almost killed their child...this was after us warning/begging/pleading for them to do something and them ignoring us. Later they told anyone that would listen that the dog "turned without warning". Um..no. I don't know what happened to the other one. OH, and there was a giant schnuazer that wanted to eat me for breakfast,almost forgot that one. Oddly, the dog was fine with anyone but me, and I'd never even approached it. Every time it came in the clinic it would go nuts towards me, and only me. I finally started hiding before it came in, and stayed out of site. Shows dogs can be CRAZY just like people.

That said, whatever the heck breed that dog is, it is a large breed dog and acting aggressively, and the situation needs to be fixed in some way.

[Mergath]

Pitbulls may very well be no more aggressive than some other breeds. But that's like saying that a buffalo isn't any more aggressive than a mouse. It just doesn't matter when you're talking about an animal that was bred for strength and can literally rip a child limb from limb. I've heard a lot from pitbull lovers about how dachshunds are even more aggressive than pits, but so what? Last time I checked, there haven't been any cases of a dachshund pinning down a grown man and ripping out his throat. The massive strength of a pit DOES make them more dangerous than other breeds, and when you factor in their unpredictability, I don't think they're safe around kids or other animals. Period. I realize I disagree with some people on this, and that's fine.

 

If it was me, I'd get a gun and the next time one of the dogs came into my yard, I'd shoot it. And as a lot of people around here know, I'm not a fan of guns in general.

[Dory]

Good grief people! I've heard the hype jumper from one breed to the next over the years. Hitting everything from Cockers, GSD, Pyraneese, and now Pits. The problem is that when one breed is targeted, any breed that looks similar is automatically added to that breed in people's minds.

The danger with Bully breeds is the sheer size and amazing focus. They need good training or they have huge potential to do serious damage. That being said, out of the hundreds of dogs that I have rehabilitated and re-homed, I only had troubles with one pit, and yes he was put down. I've seen aggressive, dangerous retrievers, nasty miniature Eskimos, aggressive Cockers, and numerous other dogs that I refused to rehome. One of those retrievers even got into my ds pit bull pen and tore the poor dog up. The pit wouldn't fight back as soon as I got there so he ended up pretty shredded.

[Firefly]

Unfortunately I think there's been a lot of bad/backyard breeding of Pits which has resulted in a propensity for aggression and being unstable. Of course not all Pits are like that, but with their size and strength, those are not odds I'd want to play. As others have pointed out many times, there is bad breeding, instability and aggressive behavior in all breeds, but few can cause the kind of damage a Pit can (although I imagine Rotties are pretty close). I don't care how "sweet" someone tells me their Pit is; I give them all a wide berth if I can't avoid them altogether.

 

OP-- trying to bite its way through your fence? Storming you on your own property? I would take NO chances. In addition to some of the other suggestions here, I would record, record, record. Show it to the owners if they don't believe you; at the very least you will have it as corroboration if you ever need it. I hope that you don't.

[StephanieZ]

Warning: this is lengthy, but I feel I have some important stuff to share....and since this is life and death, I let my passion shine forth here.

 

 

Firstly, let me say that I fully empathize with your plight; this describes our neighbors perfectly complete with the wandering pit bull (who, by the way, did indeed kill my cat 2 months ago).

 

 

I haven’t read the other posts, so I’m quite likely echoing, but here goes my 2 cents (in this case I feel my 2 cents are worth $2 billion dollars as I FIRMLY believe in the accuracy of what I have to say on this issue).

 

PLEASE listen to your red flags in this situation and DO NOT TRUST that those dogs will not severly injure or even kill your children (or you adults).

 

I’m not putting you in this category, but I anticipate the pit bull defenders showing up on this thread and going into what a bad rap pit bulls get. It’s interesting that pit bull defenders will gladly tout any other specific breeds “gifts†or “natural inclinationsâ€, but they dismiss a pit bull’s. What do I mean? They’ll gladly admit that a Collie is good at shepherding/herding, or that a Retriever is a good swimmer, or a Pointer is a good bird dog, or a Bloodhound has a superb sniffer. But, when it comes to what a pit bulldog is bred for, then we toss all of that out and only focus on what “sweet puppies†they are and ignore what they are CAPABLE of. The data is irrefutable and clear – they are a risky breed of dog. Sure, there are exceptions to the rule and not every pit is aggressive, but a pit bull LIKE ANY BREED of dog (even my own little rat terrier) is C A P A B L E of inflicting injury. And, in a pit’s case, because of their size, and genetic STRENGTH and athleticism, they are capable of inflicting worse injury than many other breeds of dog.

 

As a person who used to own a pit bull, we learned the hard way; now, armed the that 20/20 hindsight, I’ve wised up and fully admit how dangerous they are. When I was a teenager (I was probably 14 ish), my dad bought a pit bull (female) puppy. She was sweet, kind-natured to us and acted normally when a stranger pulled into our yard – she’d bark the usual barks, but never acted aggressively. But, one day, we were outside grilling (we lived on 14 acres in the country and our house sat about 100 yards (a football field length) off of the main country road. On this one occasion a man pedaled his bike down the road (he didn’t even look our way or engage us at all) and, for no reason at all, she BOLTED off our porch the entire distance to the road and knocked him off his bike and mangled his legs so badly that he had to get 100s of stitches (I want to say it was 400 stitches). My strong dad COULD NOT get her off of him. When he finally did (he was bit in the process), the ambulance came and took that man to the hospital and my parents were sued and settled out of court (THANKFULLY) for $46,000. (this was back in the 80s when lawsuits were much less expensively settled than they are now). And, my parents GLADLY paid it. He suffered significant injury. My dad put her down that night. And my mom cried as she realized how foolish she had been and that that dog could have easily killed anyone of me or my siblings. She snapped for no apparent reason. NONE of us saw this coming. An hour before it happened, we would have sounded EXACTLY like your neighbors do and would have sworn up and down that our little sweetie wouldn’t hurt a fly.

 

My brother-in-law went hunting back in November with a friend. The friend took his pit bulldog along. He said as they were walking in the woods a wild boar hog (male) crossed their path and the pit broke away from his (man) owner who COULD NOT hold her and she got into it with that MALE HUGE wild boar hog. (I don’t know if you know how big and aggressive wild boar hogs are, but they are DANGEROUS in their own right). She KILLED the wild boar hog. My brother-in-law said he had never seen such a fight in his life and he said he had NO idea who would be the victor and he said it was like the scene in OLD YELLER where his friend couldn’t fire the gun as he couldn’t get a clear shot off. He said she finally pinned the hog and bit and held its neck until it bled out. Said she was drenched in blood and was like a wild animal – in like state where she COULD NOT de-escalate her wild trance for all of her adrenaline.

 

A friend of mine's sister was attacked by a pit bull who ran across the street at her in her own yard; her husband thankfully was home and heard it and ran out and couldn't get it off of her. She was in the hospital for WEEKS. When last I heard, she had had her 4^th reconstructive surgery on her FACE and her husband had gotten numerous stitches also.

 

I share all this to say: PIT BULLDOGS are powerful creatures with strong jaws and a strong attack instinct. They are (like ANY dog) unpredictable. Your neighbor’s dog sees NO difference in your 2 year old or your 4 year old being a homo eructus or a feline domesticus and your neighbor even admitted the dog might kill a cat.

 

Abby may serve to help steer the attack her way but she is NO sure protection for your children. If that pit gets to them AT ALL, neither you nor one of your older kids nor ABBY is CAPABLE of stopping a ripped cornea, or a ripped jugular vein, (you get my point). You do not have TIME to redirect this type of animal. You don’t have time to get a gun. You (or even a man) CANNOT physically pull it off. They are capable of locking their jaws where they themselves CANNOT open them.

 

My neighbor had 2 pit bulls – now they’re down to 1. We learned his AFTER we purchased our 8 acres. The mama dog and her puppy would come over to our land while we were working and that ended my and my kids’ abilities to go over there at all as the adult dog saw that as HER turf. She had lived next to it for years, so she’d come and stare us down. We put everything on hold and put ALL our money into fencing. Thankfully, the mama dog died in a car accident and that left the 4 month old puppy. We continued with the fencing efforts knowing that soon the puppy will be grown. We even BURIED the fencing ---- welded wire --- so she CAN’T dig under it. These neighbor’s aren’t going to spay the dog, so it’s a matter of time before she has a litter and doubtless they’ll keep one or two (likely males!), so we're prepared. They forced it to be our #1 priority, because LIKE YOU our freedom ENDED because of it. Now the little 4 month old puppy acts sweet and affectionate, and even if she grows up to be the same sweet and affectionate dog (like my own pit was as an adult), she’s still CAPABLE of turning on a moment’s notice and she has the POWER to inflict serious injury.

 

You know in your heart that for all intents and purposes, your freedom there is over as things are now as there's no way you are worry-free when your kids are out in your front yard. There’s no way you feel “FREEâ€(peace/calm/tranquil) anymore knowing of what potentially could occur. So now that you KNOW this, you have to find a way to feel free on your own property.

 

You know you can’t TRUST your neighbor not to let them out (or that they won’t get out on their own) as they do not think she's capable of hurting anything, so that's a dead end road, so I'd leave them out of the solution as that's a lost cause. They feel the EXACT same way WE did about our little precious pit).

 

When these stories are on the news have you ever seen the owner say, “Well, it didn’t surprise me at all; we knew Buster was capable of this.†No, it’s always the disbelief and the stories of the dog’s sweet and calm disposition.

 

You can move and hope that you won’t end up with similar neighbors (quite an expensive gamble).

 

Or, you can do what is likely the ONLY solution, you can protect YOUR PROPERTY and allow your kids to ONLY go where there’s no way in Hades that that dogs CAN get to them and this takes fencing. And you don't have to spend a mint on fencing. You can get a roll of welded wire at Lowe's/Home Depot/Farm Supply stores for about $1 per foot -- not including the metal rods). The fencing has to be impenetrable by even a digging dog. IT’s the only way you’ll have FREEDOM and peace of mind.

 

My own dog is 14 lbs and is 13 years old and he’s such a wimpy, cowardly acting dog that we’ve always called nicknamed him “Tender†and “Peacelilly†and “WussDogâ€. This was his natural temperament since birth. The night before last (when the moon was HUGE), he ran after an opossum and killed it with a few viciously powerful shakes to its neck. I would have N E V E R thought my little “WussDog†was capable of tossing a grown opossum around like a ragdoll, but he did. Even I was shocked. We assessed the opossum afterwards thinking perhaps it was “playing opossum†but it wasn’t. He had snapped its neck with a few violent shakes. Now that’s a 91year old dog (in dog years) --- who’s 14 lbs that was bred to kill RATS. So, what do you think a pit bull’s genetic musculature is CAPABLE of doing? These dogs were used to control BULLS (in cattle yards) and for hunting and killing wild hogs among other reasons, but a dog that is CAPABLE of controlling a 1800 lb. BULL and is CAPABLE of killing a wild hog is CAPABLE of hurting a person.

 

Did you hear about that couple who went into their bedroom for intimate relations and had left their baby in a chair along with their indoor Pit Bulldog. They heard a commotion and came out and found that the dog had attacked the child and had eaten his testicles off. I think it was in Texas a few years ago. It was in the paper.

http://www.upi.com/T...67771270771553/

 

Please heed your mama Bear instincts and realize how serious COULD potentially be. It may NEVER occur but the potential for serious, even fatal, injury is very real.

 

And, please don't let anyone talk you into thinking that all you need to do is go over there with the dogs and their owners and let their dogs befriend you all. Even if they ACT like they like you/them on MANY occasions, they are still unpredictable enough to be deadly. A maimed or dead child is NOT worth the risk.

 

Alia

 

P.S. I'm adding an edit. When I got finished posting this, I went in and sat with my husband and he asked what in the world I had been typing. I told him about your situation and how I'd recommended the welded wire and he said, "well, make sure she knows that regular 4 foot welded wire and a regular height chain length fence is NOT enough protection as they get over that height and, quite possible push them over. He bought 5 foot welded wire than was tougher grade/gauge (made for large animals -- cattle, goat, etc.). He said the 4' welded wiring is more flimsy. He said pits can't get over or push over hat we have. He reminded me how large male pits were as it's been a while since I've seen one in person; he said that our neighbor's females are peewees by comparison (which is hard to fathom as when I look at their large muscular jaws/teeth) -- that's hard to imagine. My husband is a very level-headed, educated man, so please take this into consideration. Again, welded wire is the least expensive option in fencing that is strong enough to prevent their getting through it. And, quite honestly, I don't think it's as unattractive as chain-length.

 

Best wishes!

 

Thank you for sharing all this. I know it gets tiring to hear the "it's not the dog; it's the owner" chorus, but I totally agree that the data is very clear that certain breeds are MUCH more dangerous than others. You related your concerns very eloquently.

[Supertechmom]

I hear this same line of crap from our neighbors. They wouldn't hurt a flea! The problem is their pits have decided that my driveway, garage and side yard is "theirs" and that my little girl is prey. they will absolutely run her down on sight or smell. They are in a wood fence but they know she is out there in the backyard and have nearly come through that fence twice and under it three times. Last time I beat the devils back with a scooter and the other time with a shovel when they cornered us in the garage.. I do two things. I now shoot them on sight wherever they are. IN front of the neighbors or not, I no longer give a rat's pootie! If I see the dogs outside the fence, I shoot if I have a clear shot. that at least convinced the neighbors to keep them in the fence now. Second thing is when they start their barking, growling and attacking the fence, we shoot fireworks. We bought a ton and the oldest throws firecrackers at the fence. They at least have stopped attacking the fence. I grew up with pits so I don't have that "pits are just bad" mentality but these two are the devil's own! And the owners refuse to think or consider their dogs might hurt someone. And I refuse to consider that a dog tearing across the yard with hackles raised with snarling mouth is going to stop and sit down and ask to be petted and not bite my kid. Yea.... if you believe that I have some beach property in Arizona.

[Jeannie in NJ]

it was in our local paper today that in our area 2 pitbulls escaped from their yard and went to another street, went thru a screen door, attacked and killed the Golden retriever in the house and attacked the 73 year old owner when he tried to help his dog. The man is in the hospital. The police showed up, shot one of the pits and the other one was put down. THese dogs scare me.

[gardenmom5]

I would pursue multiple options at once. The dog is warning you!

 

Kids not outdoors without a parent.

If not gun owners, parent keeps at least a metal shovel at hand.

Video dog's behavior.

Start slinging treats.

Put the tarp up.

Ask for neighbor's cell number(s) if you don't already have it, and put it in your phone(s).

Buy a can of bear spray.

Call for an estimate on an 8-foot wooden fence with anti-digging wire under it.

Talk to the police/sheriff.

Consider a chain for your own dog with a lot of freedom, but to keep it at least a couple of feet from their fence.

 

I hate it when people don't control their dogs. I've had to call animal control because dogs were making it unsafe to leave my own house (i.e., even from porch to car), let alone take stroller out for a walk.

I brought this up with dh. He commented some homeowner's insurance policies will not cover pit bulls. if an owners pit attacks someone, etc. - the homeowner's policy will not bail out the owner - it will be their own pocket. I would consider asking the owners just what kind of coverage they have, and if it covers a lawsuit from a pit attack? they may think their homeowners policy covers them, but it may well not. Just as different car makes/models have different insurance costs associated with them because insurance companies have found there are makes/models they are more likely to pay out on - so those cost more to insure.

[jeninok]

If there is an aggressive dog on my property I will shoot it. We had a husky with a screw loose, we had had him since 8 weeks, and as he matured he truly became unstable and dangerous. Knowing what I know now, I should have shot the dog after the first unprovoked attack, after 2 years of trying to fix him my husband had to take him to be put down while my other dog and I had to go to both animal and human ERs to be patched up.

 

 

My neighbors where we used to have had a scary pitbull that charged me and would have attacked had I not made it back to my car. DH started carrying a gun when we walked, I would take a golf club if not with DH. Where we live now there were two collie mixes constantly out of their yard. They would come and stand in the street in front of my fence so that my 2 would go nuts at the fence line, just stand and watch.

I shot them with blue paint guns. They weren't being aggressive, but they were being a nuisance, the owner didn't care, so I sent a message, plus if one of mine was to injure them protecting their property from unknown dogs I would have been held responsible. Those dogs stay in their newly reinforced fence now, I am no longer running them off 3 times a day, or having to swerve to miss them chasing my car everytime I left the house.

 

Any dog can be aggressive, but the strength, poor breeding, and idiot owners who all too often own Pits make it a dangerous situation in many cases.

 

I LOVE dogs, I will pull over on the road and rescue them, mine live kings and are my best friends, I help with transporting and caring for rescues, but I have NO misunderstanding that a dog attacking is a true danger and that owners will not likely take care of the issue.