Son was jumped at school- what would you expect

[Soror]

I got a call yesterday from the nurse saying my son was ok but he'd been in a fight. 

Ok, not happy that I first hear from the nurse and not the school. Of course, she couldn't give me any info.

She transferred me to the Asst. Principal that tells me that he didn't see my kid throw any punches but they had to review the video, if he threw any punches he would be suspended. The other kid however did not stop hitting ds when he was told to stop so he was taken to handcuffs to the juvenile office. Normally ds rides the bus but I was picking him up yesterday so I told him I would be stopping in to talk to the Asst. Principal to find out the details.

So, the story is that there was a kid who got sent to the hall for throwing pencils and pens in one of ds' electives. He came back in and pulled up a chair by ds, he normally sits on the opposite side of the room. Ds asked him why he was sitting there and the kid lays in to ds for the last 5 minutes of class insulting ds any way he can think of. After class ds goes to the bathroom and the kid follows him in there. Kid throws down his backpack and puffs out his chest to ds, making comments that ds won't do anything. Ds pushes past him in the hall going towards the Asst. Principal because he thought the kid wouldn't do anything then. Well, the kid attacked him from behind and the Asst. Principal had to pull him off. Ds is not hurt, aside from a few bruises. Ds filed a police report.

So, ds never did hit and as such is not getting disciplined at all. 

I told the Asst. Principal that I worried for ds' safety with that kid in his class. His answer was that they would not be sitting by each other and if the kid starts talking smack to ds that he should ask to go to the bathroom and go straight to his office and he would take care of it.

The more I think about it the less pleased I am in this response. I'm sure this kid will see it as ds' fault that he gets in trouble and if it is ok that they randomly move chairs in class what is to stop him from doing the same thing again. I'd really like the kid moved to another class to be quite honest, at the very least if he makes one more peep to ds I want him gone. 

The thing is that the school policy is that you are not allowed to defend yourself, even if they are wailing away on you if you hit back at all you get suspended. If he can't defend himself I feel like they damn well better put everything in place to protect him.

Poor ds, his only concern was that this would go on his school record, seriously. He is very excited about school and doing well, he's not had any thing negative happen whatsoever until this point. Just in the wrong place at the wrong time with a kid looking for a fight.

 if you have any negative comments just keep them to yourself 

[Paige]

It might not be the best choice, but I'd tell the Principal to either get that kid out of DS's class or I'd be telling DS that it's fine with me if he gets suspended for self defense. My DS, however, is more than capable of self defense. If it were someone less capable, I'd say the same thing, but I'd be talking more with the police about what they can do to keep the kid away from my child instead of dealing with the school. 

[Another Lynn]

I agree with you that this does not seem like enough.  For one, it's no different than the original situation:  1) the kid already didn't have a seat near your ds.  2) your ds was headed towards the asst. principals office when he was jumped.  So how are those two things going to prevent an attack when they didn't prevent this one?  

[Pen]

I am sorry this is happening. I can’t see signatures—how old/what grade is this?

Some things that could help are 

if Ds has friends yet, sticking with a group to not be alone 

sit toward teacher so that it is easier to get teacher awareness of a brewing incident 

take a self defense class ( or at least get a good self defense for kids video) and practice self defense techniques that don’t involve throwing punches of his own

are there phones in class room?  If so, teachers should be instructed to contact vice principal immediately— not to put that on Ds to have to do it.  Alternatively or in addition can Ds carry a cellphone for this purpose or for calling 911 in emergency. 

Talk with police about what to do, not just school  staff

[Soror]

7 minutes ago, Arctic Mama said:

Oh, I feel for your son. I got suspended for an afternoon because a girl decided to walk up, cuss me out, and smash pizza in my face when I wouldn’t fight her.  I didn’t even know her name until AFTER this all happened.  And since we were both ‘involved’ we had the exact same length of suspension. The school not only wouldn’t do anything, they blamed me equally whether I escalated or not.  Provoked or not.

 

Come to think of it... I may have seriously begun considering homeschooling shortly thereafter.

Wowzers, I'd be livid. 

 

2 minutes ago, Another Lynn said:

I agree with you that this does not seem like enough.  For one, it's no different than the original situation:  1) the kid already didn't have a seat near your ds.  2) your ds was headed towards the asst. principals office when he was jumped.  So how are those two things going to prevent an attack when they didn't prevent this one?  

Just now, Paige said:

It might not be the best choice, but I'd tell the Principal to either get that kid out of DS's class or I'd be telling DS that it's fine with me if he gets suspended for self defense. My DS, however, is more than capable of self defense. If it were someone less capable, I'd say the same thing, but I'd be talking more with the police about what they can do to keep the kid away from my child instead of dealing with the school. 

2

Well, dh had told ds before he started school that he would be in big trouble if he ever started a fight but if he defends one we'll back him 100%.(dh was not aware of the current rules at that time or would have told him dfferently) Dh was surprised that ds didn't hit back but we were very proud of his quick thinking, not only do they have video proof that ds didn't do anything but the Asst. Principal witnessed the kid jumping him.

Ironically the kid was evidently a little shrimp. Ds is not a huge kid, certainly not football size or such, but I think he could hold his own against most kids. He's had years of TKD and is nearly a black belt and is strong but skinny. 

Ds was so worried about getting in trouble and so surprised by it all that he was just trying to avoid the situation.

Lynn, that breaks it down perfectly. I don't want my kid to feel intimidated or scared in a class.

[SereneHome]

I don't know if you are going to construed this as a negative comment, but this kid sounds like a time bomb waiting to go off and school is handling really really poorly.  hope your son doesn't get seriously hurt.  

I am going to refrain myself from my soap box of how convoluted it is that defending yourself can get you in trouble and what a horrible advise and instructions your son was given by Asst. Prinicipal

 

 

 

[Pen]

And possibly contact a lawyer 

[gardenmom5]

that kid shouldn't even be in your son's class.  he already wasn't sitting by him! 

I also think it's outrageous he would be punished for defending himself.

I would think this kid shouldn't even be in the same school.  I wouldn't hesitate to take it to the superintendent. 

I know families who've had to threaten legal action against the district before they were able to get things resolved.

[HomeAgain]

1 minute ago, Pen said:

And possibly contact a lawyer 

This is what I would do.

If my kid *had* to be at that school, my first goal would be legal representation in this.  I would want the school district to know that I expect the issue to be taken seriously and will use any and all resources to get them to respond in an adequate manner.  As already pointed out, the "fix" is null - the kid already was seated away from your son and the circumstances are exactly what will happen again.  So, yeah, legal representation.

[Pen]

Johnny Gyro and 1 more  Rated: 

 NR 

Bully 911: Self-Defense to Prevent Bullying for Children Safety

 

 

4.2 out of 5 stars (6

 

I don’t know if the techniques in this film would violate school rules.  But it has potential for helping Ds stay safe within the rules   

[Soror]

1 minute ago, Pen said:

I am sorry this is happening. I can’t see signatures—how old/what grade is this?

Some things that could help are 

if Ds has friends yet, sticking with a group to not be alone 

sit toward teacher so that it is easier to get teacher awareness of a brewing incident 

take a self defense class ( or at least get a good self defense for kids video) and practice self defense techniques that don’t involve throwing punches of his own

are there phones in class room?  If so, teachers should be instructed to contact vice principal immediately— not to put that on Ds to have to do it.  Alternatively or in addition can Ds carry a cellphone for this purpose or for calling 911 in emergency. 

Talk with police about what to do, not just school  staff

Ds is 14 and 8th grade.

He does have friends but he's new, as far as I know, the only class he has with friends in it is PE and lunch. 

Noted above he does have self-defense training.

3 minutes ago, SereneHome said:

I don't know if you are going to construed this as a negative comment, but this kid sounds like a time bomb waiting to go off and school is handling really really poorly.  hope your son doesn't get seriously hurt.  

I am going to refrain myself from my soap box of how convoluted it is that defending yourself can get you in trouble and what a horrible advise and instructions your son was given by Asst. Prinicipal

 

 

 

3

ITA with all of that. 

We were in utter shock with it all yesterday, it was a bit much to process but we'd have backed ds 110% for defending himself and think that rule is utterly idiotic.

[Jann in TX]

BTDT

My youngest attends PS-- sounds like our schools have similar rules/penalties including 'do not fight back'.

In 9th grade (2 years ago) she was diagnosed with a rare neurological condition that impaired her movement and causes extreme pain-- couple this with her being stressed and sensitive (due to pain) and she was a HUGE target for some bullies.  One boy in particular actually shoved her into a desk--in front of a substitute who then laughed!  DD left the classroom without permission and went directly to nurses office-- substitute was fired.  Nurse brought in Assistant Principal.  AP told dd that she had to publicly NAME her bully or the school would not be able to take action.  The 'bully' would know exactly who named them.  The boy had done some other things directed at dd (and others) but this was the last straw.  DD was in pain for DAYS due to the incident...dd was the only one who could come forward-- we could not do it for her.  It took her a few days before she was brave enough-- and so many teachers came forward to thank her-- apparently if the TEACHERS see bullying they CANNOT report it or do anything unless the VICTIM is willing to report it and publicly name the bully!!! ( DD just told me they can report physical bullying but not verbal).

Did I mention that said 'boy' was one of the schools top football players!!  He was NOT suspended but he was told if he as much as looked at her he would be expelled.  2 years later and this fall he had his schedule changed when he found out she was in one of his classes-- it actually worked out.  I hope he appreciates his second chance.

One thing OP's son did that I think dd should have done was to file a police report.  If the school does nothing so be it-- the police will. Our dd refused to file a report.

 

[Guest]

How horrible! I would be beside myself.

My two cents: I have told my kids they are permitted to defend themselves if attacked; I would not give two you-know-whats if they suspend my child.

[Soror]

Just now, Pen said:

Johnny Gyro and 1 more  Rated: 

 NR 

Bully 911: Self-Defense to Prevent Bullying for Children Safety

 

 

4.2 out of 5 stars (6

 

I don’t know if the techniques in this film would violate school rules.  But it has potential for helping Ds stay safe within the rules   

Thanks- when ds told the Asst. Principal that he had pushed the kid aside he said that was ok, there just wasn't' anything in the rules about hitting. So, I wonder if he could use his different blocks and such and that be acceptable?? Yesterday ds was just trying to get away, I don't' think it occurred to him to turn around and try to stop the kid.

[Soror]

1 minute ago, Quill said:

How horrible! I would be beside myself.

My two cents: I have told my kids they are permitted to defend themselves if attacked; I would not give two you-know-whats if they suspend my child.

Absolutely! We would not have been the least bit upset at ds if he had defended himself but ds absolutely does not want to be suspended. I'm not prone to violence but my Mama Bear side says if he ever tries that again you make sure you fight back hard enough he never ever tries it again.

[Soror]

9 minutes ago, Jann in TX said:

BTDT

My youngest attends PS-- sounds like our schools have similar rules/penalties including 'do not fight back'.

In 9th grade (2 years ago) she was diagnosed with a rare neurological condition that impaired her movement and causes extreme pain-- couple this with her being stressed and sensitive (due to pain) and she was a HUGE target for some bullies.  One boy in particular actually shoved her into a desk--in front of a substitute who then laughed!  DD left the classroom without permission and went directly to nurses office-- substitute was fired.  Nurse brought in Assistant Principal.  AP told dd that she had to publicly NAME her bully or the school would not be able to take action.  The 'bully' would know exactly who named them.  The boy had done some other things directed at dd (and others) but this was the last straw.  DD was in pain for DAYS due to the incident...dd was the only one who could come forward-- we could not do it for her.  It took her a few days before she was brave enough-- and so many teachers came forward to thank her-- apparently if the TEACHERS see bullying they CANNOT report it or do anything unless the VICTIM is willing to report it and publicly name the bully!!! ( DD just told me they can report physical bullying but not verbal).

Did I mention that said 'boy' was one of the schools top football players!!  He was NOT suspended but he was told if he as much as looked at her he would be expelled.  2 years later and this fall he had his schedule changed when he found out she was in one of his classes-- it actually worked out.  I hope he appreciates his second chance.

One thing OP's son did that I think dd should have done was to file a police report.  If the school does nothing so be it-- the police will. Our dd refused to file a report.

 

1

Oh, my, your poor daughter ? Kudos to her for standing up to him.  What crap that they didn't suspend him, thank goodness it resolved the situation, to imagine a football play pushing a girl, the other kids should have razzed him up one side and down the other for being such a cowardly bully.

One wonders who the hell makes these policies ?

Evidently, it is an automatic protocol for them to be taken by Juvenile if they dont' stop when told too and also automatic to have the kid file a police report. That might make the bully madder but so be it.

Edited September 22, 2018 by soror

[gardenmom5]

 

3 minutes ago, Jann in TX said:

BTDT

My youngest attends PS-- sounds like our schools have similar rules/penalties including 'do not fight back'.

In 9th grade (2 years ago) she was diagnosed with a rare neurological condition that impaired her movement and causes extreme pain-- couple this with her being stressed and sensitive (due to pain) and she was a HUGE target for some bullies.  One boy in particular actually shoved her into a desk--in front of a substitute who then laughed!  DD left the classroom without permission and went directly to nurses office-- substitute was fired.  Nurse brought in Assistant Principal.  AP told dd that she had to publicly NAME her bully or the school would not be able to take action.  The 'bully' would know exactly who named them.  The boy had done some other things directed at dd (and others) but this was the last straw.  DD was in pain for DAYS due to the incident...dd was the only one who could come forward-- we could not do it for her.  It took her a few days before she was brave enough-- and so many teachers came forward to thank her-- apparently if the TEACHERS see bullying they CANNOT report it or do anything unless the VICTIM is willing to report it and publicly name the bully!!! ( DD just told me they can report physical bullying but not verbal).

Did I mention that said 'boy' was one of the schools top football players!!  He was NOT suspended but he was told if he as much as looked at her he would be expelled.  2 years later and this fall he had his schedule changed when he found out she was in one of his classes-- it actually worked out.  I hope he appreciates his second chance.

One thing OP's son did that I think dd should have done was to file a police report.  If the school does nothing so be it-- the police will. Our dd refused to file a report.

 

that's horrible.

 

what's frustrating is there are school districts/areas where football is "the religion".  they have particularly large high schools - JUST to get a bigger pool of boys for football.

in those areas - a good football player can do no wrong that will get him suspended.   not even rape.  e.g. the maryville missouri rape case.  (my mother's family is from nw missouri, so it caught my attention)  someone eventually burned down the victims house because they were pressing the case.

[Pen]

1 minute ago, soror said:

Thanks- when ds told the Asst. Principal that he had pushed the kid aside he said that was ok, there just wasn't' anything in the rules about hitting. So, I wonder if he could use his different blocks and such and that be acceptable?? Yesterday ds was just trying to get away, I don't' think it occurred to him to turn around and try to stop the kid.

 

If pictures of bruises on Ds were not yet taken, take them now and keep in case evidence is needed later to show this situation as prior to later self defense 

Read the school rules carefully. Then brain storm with Ds what techniques he has that are okay within the rules 

Possibly send a letter to school (best with legal assistance on this) informing them that it is unacceptable to passively accept being beaten up and that since school is not taking adequate measures that will keep your son safe, your son will be using self defense techniques if he is attacked in future  

Again, I would contact a lawyer on this because there could be additional implications for your Ds if he hurts the other boy even if it is self defense... especially if your Ds is nearly a black belt. Your Ds tkd instructor may also have helpful knowledge or ideas about irl use of tkd. 

 

[gardenmom5]

8 minutes ago, soror said:

Thanks- when ds told the Asst. Principal that he had pushed the kid aside he said that was ok, there just wasn't' anything in the rules about hitting. So, I wonder if he could use his different blocks and such and that be acceptable?? Yesterday ds was just trying to get away, I don't' think it occurred to him to turn around and try to stop the kid.

is he still in TKD?   can he talk to his master for suggestions?  I know in karate the sensi will suspend students who use their skills outside class aggressively, but not defensively.

I would think he should be able to use his blocks.

if he's not still doing it, would it be possible to get him back in to keep his skills fresh and continue to develop them?   usually kids doing ma carry themselves in a way that is a turn off for bullies.

[Soror]

1 minute ago, gardenmom5 said:

is he still in TKD?   can he talk to his master for suggestions?  I know in karate the sensi will suspend students who use their skills outside class aggressively, but not defensively.

I would think he should be able to use his blocks.

if he's not still doing it, would it be possible to get him back in to keep his skills fresh and continue to develop them?   usually kids doing ma carry themselves in a way that is a turn off for bullies.

2

 

1 minute ago, Pen said:

 

If pictures of bruises on Ds were not yet taken, take them now and keep in case evidence is needed later to show this situation as prior to later self defense 

Read the school rules carefully. Then brain storm with Ds what techniques he has that are okay within the rules 

Possibly send a letter to school (best with legal assistance on this) informing them that it is unacceptable to passively accept being beaten up and that since school is not taking adequate measures that will keep your son safe, your son will be using self defense techniques if he is attacked in future  

Again, I would contact a lawyer on this because there could be additional implications for your Ds if he hurts the other boy even if it is self defense... especially if your Ds is nearly a black belt. Your Ds tkd instructor may also have helpful knowledge or ideas about irl use of tkd. 

 

8

Yes, ds is still in TKD, nearly a black belt now. Excellent ideas to talk to his teacher, ironically she's really worked with him on being less forceful in sparring. Also, a very good point to check the handbook, I'll be rereading it straight away. Will be taking pictures, good idea. 

[Jen500]

Wow, that was terrible and I'm sorry it happened to your son. Our schools have the same policy. Which I think is a bit ironic considering how they are now teaching the kids to 'fight back' in case of a shooter. I would make an appt to talk to the principal....in our middle schools the asst principals are more of the disciplinarians and the actual principal makes things happen when you have a problem. YMMV. Does the other boy have a history of fighting? 

[Annie G]

I understand that schools have rules like that because usually both kids are fighting. But in this case, if your son had thrown any punches, he would have been defending himself, not really fighting. In the real world, on the street, we are allowed to defend ourselves if attacked.  What would I do? I would be livid, but no idea what else because what helps and what hurts in this situation?

I think it’s pretty serious at that age- many 14 year olds are adult size and can do some real damage throwing punches. But it sounds like they already know the kid is a behavior problem- I hope he doesn’t get special treatment just because he’s a football player.

[Pippen]

Medically it would be important that you be contacted ASAP.  That should take priority over who makes the call, so the nurse might be the one to make the call if the principal was busy dealing with other student. 

The concern for your DS's safety isn't limited to this one class, it's schoolwide.  You need to ask what the plan is to keep your son safe in the remaining classes, the hallways, the cafeteria, and the restroom. If you've handled all of this by phone, you should schedule an appointment to discuss with the principal and teacher in person. Unless he's a transfer student, this wouldn't likely to be a first time incident for the kid who attacked from behind.

[Chris in VA]

24 minutes ago, soror said:

Absolutely! We would not have been the least bit upset at ds if he had defended himself but ds absolutely does not want to be suspended. I'm not prone to violence but my Mama Bear side says if he ever tries that again you make sure you fight back hard enough he never ever tries it again.

I told my son he should never start a fight, but he has my permission to finish one. Don't throw the first punch, throw the last. But that isn't really good advice. 

In his case, if he had fought back, the gang members might have killed him. Again, not your situation, but I agree totally with your philosophy,  how you are handling it, and your son's admirable reluctance to get suspended.  

[Soror]

Just now, Jen500 said:

Wow, that was terrible and I'm sorry it happened to your son. Our schools have the same policy. Which I think is a bit ironic considering how they are now teaching the kids to 'fight back' in case of a shooter. I would make an appt to talk to the principal....in our middle schools the asst principals are more of the disciplinarians and the actual principal makes things happen when you have a problem. YMMV. Does the other boy have a history of fighting? 

I don't know if the other kid has a history of fighting but ds said he is in trouble all the time in the class they share. (thankfully they don't have any other classes together)

 

Just now, Annie G said:

I understand that schools have rules like that because usually both kids are fighting. But in this case, if your son had thrown any punches, he would have been defending himself, not really fighting. In the real world, on the street, we are allowed to defend ourselves if attacked.  What would I do? I would be livid, but no idea what else because what helps and what hurts in this situation?

I think it’s pretty serious at that age- many 14 year olds are adult size and can do some real damage throwing punches. But it sounds like they already know the kid is a behavior problem- I hope he doesn’t get special treatment just because he’s a football player.

Doesn't look like he was given special treatment, that would add a whole new level. I can understand the policy to a certain degree but taken to the logical conclusion it is utterly ridiculous. 

Here is the section in the handbook on fights:

Quote

 

Any student planning, participating in, or causing a fight or act of physical violence may be suspended from school for a minimum of 5 days, with a possible referral to the superintendent for long-term suspension; law enforcement officials may be notified.

Principals will strive to make direct contact with the parent/guardian of any student who is involved in a fight, who assaults another student, or who is the victim of an assault. Assaults and severe fights could result in a referral to the juvenile office, and a parent would pick up their child at the juvenile office.

 

 

Hmmph, so they will *try* to contact me if my kid is assaulted? Really? I keep thinking surely they were going to call me and let me know, I was very not happy to hear from the nurse first.

Seems like blocking would not be construed as physical violence but I dont' know.

 

[Soror]

6 minutes ago, Pippen said:

Medically it would be important that you be contacted ASAP.  That should take priority over who makes the call, so the nurse might be the one to make the call if the principal was busy dealing with other student. 

The concern for your DS's safety isn't limited to this one class, it's schoolwide.  You need to ask what the plan is to keep your son safe in the remaining classes, the hallways, the cafeteria, and the restroom. If you've handled all of this by phone, you should schedule an appointment to discuss with the principal and teacher in person. Unless he's a transfer student, this wouldn't likely to be a first time incident for the kid who attacked from behind.

I did come in straight away yesterday to speak to them but it looks like I'll be going back again next week. It has crossed my mind, what if they pass in the hall, will he come after him in the bathroom? 

[shawthorne44]

Your original question of, "What would you expect?"   My answer, precisely what happened.    That is one of the reasons we homeschool.   

[Soror]

5 minutes ago, Chris in VA said:

I told my son he should never start a fight, but he has my permission to finish one. Don't throw the first punch, throw the last. But that isn't really good advice. 

In his case, if he had fought back, the gang members might have killed him. Again, not your situation, but I agree totally with your philosophy,  how you are handling it, and your son's admirable reluctance to get suspended.  

I honestly don't know how big of a presence gangs have of the school, the town only has one Jr. High, the reputation is not bad. 

I do think he acted admirably as well, we have told him several times that we are exceedingly proud of him, he could not have done better. Dh told him he would have not have done so well, it was quick thinking to head to the asst. principal.

[shawthorne44]

15 minutes ago, soror said:

I did come in straight away yesterday to speak to them but it looks like I'll be going back again next week. It has crossed my mind, what if they pass in the hall, will he come after him in the bathroom? 

 

You can point out that he has already done that.   

Does your state have alternative schools?   If so, you could push to have the other kid sent there.   They are schools for violent kids.   Police all over the place. 

eta:  I am not a fan of my state's public school system.   But, I do think that having those is an excellent thing.   I don't think that they had them when I was a kid.  

In 4th grade, this girl decided to pick on me.  I'd really done absolutely nothing to her.  At one point she shoved me hard from behind and my pants were ruined by my knees rubbing on the sidewalk.   I agreed to fight her 'at the church' after church on a different day.   Ironically the church was the nearest land off church property, so that was where fights happened.  I showed up at the appointed time figuring I'd be beat up.   She never showed.  I think she honestly forgot.  The next day I asked her "Where were you?  I was there."   She never bugged me again.   Later in maybe 7th or 8th grade I saw saw several police officers dragging her out of the school in handcuffs.  They had come to arrest her, and nothing had happened at school.   By their expressions, she had to have murdered someone.    

Edited September 22, 2018 by shawthorne44

[Soror]

1 minute ago, shawthorne44 said:

 

You can point out that he has already done that.   

Does your state have alternative schools?   If so, you could push to have the other kid sent there.   They are schools for violent kids.   Police all over the place. 

I know they have an alternative for highschool in town but I'm not sure about Jr. High. Who knows how many incidents this kid has had either, they wouldn't tell me anything about him of course.

[Lecka]

I skipped to the bottom, but if there is one in town this boy may be in the process of transferring to an alternative high school.  

The way privacy works, they aren’t going to tell you that if it is the case.

 

 

[Pen]

I would tend to want to document situation in writing, not just talk about it. “ On September 21, 2018 at approximately —— pm, my son, Name, was assaulted and battered from behind by Name outside the Vice-principal’s office at Schoolname. Photos taken the following day show bruises on my son’s Bodypart names.  “ etc. 

“PersonName, OfficialTitle, has told my son to _____, if _____ attacks him in future [or whatever the actual plan is supposed to be ... if “starts talking smack” were actual words used by Vice-principal, I ‘d put it as a quotation ].  This plan is insufficient and unacceptable for the following reasons:”

ennumerate reasons for it being unacceptable. 

Express need for an acceptable solution. 

Consider Copy to higher ups in system, possibly in area government and or local newspaper/ tv etc. 

Possibly include that your child did not use self defense because of rules, but another child who is attacked may not be able to fight back even if they wanted to. 

[Annie G]

Soror, the more I think about it, the more I think a better description is that your son was harassed and then he was assaulted. I would phrase it that way and not that they had a fight. And then talk about what procedures and policies are in place to prevent harassment and assault. 

[El...]

I think I'd write a "memo for record", restating what happened, how you were notified, what you were told would/should happen next, and attach copies of the bruise photos.  I'd reiterate that your son was attacked from behind and that you expect the school to prevent any more such attacks.  

I'd deliver a copies to the vice principal, the principal, and the superintendent.  They may need to be scared into sensible action.  It doesn't need to be a threatening letter; the documentation itself is powerful.

Then, I'd have your kid work on some open-handed tactics against that sort of attack.  There are a lot of good things a person can do without making a fist.  If he's ok with the training (not excessively freaked out), I'd run drills for being grabbed from behind, being grabbed by the backpack, being shoved into a wall, being choked, etc.  It's not tournament TKD, but I think most instructors can offer this kind of application training.  He needs to practice protecting his head and escaping.  He should practice making a scene, yelling for help, etc.  The instructor needs to be someone he trusts and respects.  

[Mbelle]

Oh my goodness.  I would be furious.  I did not know kids could not defend themselves anymore.  Wow, that is shocking and so frustrating.

[JFSinIL2.0]

10 minutes ago, elroisees said:

I think I'd write a "memo for record", restating what happened, how you were notified, what you were told would/should happen next, and attach copies of the bruise photos.  I'd reiterate that your son was attacked from behind and that you expect the school to prevent any more such attacks.  

I'd deliver a copies to the vice principal, the principal, and the superintendent.  They may need to be scared into sensible action.  It doesn't need to be a threatening letter; the documentation itself is powerful.

Then, I'd have your kid work on some open-handed tactics against that sort of attack.  There are a lot of good things a person can do without making a fist.  If he's ok with the training (not excessively freaked out), I'd run drills for being grabbed from behind, being grabbed by the backpack, being shoved into a wall, being choked, etc.  It's not tournament TKD, but I think most instructors can offer this kind of application training.  He needs to practice protecting his head and escaping.  He should practice making a scene, yelling for help, etc.  The instructor needs to be someone he trusts and respects.  

I would also cc copies of the memo of record to your attorney and the police.  Let the school administration see those have been also sent copies and attention WILL be paid.

and the martial arts folks need to know what is going on, perhaps they can work a bit on how to take down an assailant without hurting them.  Son could put that punk on the ground repeatedly without hitting him ( judging by what I saw the students do when dd got her black belt)

[itsheresomewhere]

Based on our experience-  typical. And in our case, the bully got nothing due to his parents donating money. They took DS down on the playground and beat him up.  DS got in trouble for using a “curse” word against them instead of fighting.  One of the reasons we homeschool.

Go through your state’s bullying laws with a fine tooth comb.  And I am not opposed to contacting a lawyer.

[umsami]

So last year, my then second grader was attacked by another kid who he didn't even know.  Every teacher and student said that he didn't do anything, the guy just attacked him.  He had a very badly cut lip from the encounter.  He was seven--and quite traumatized by the whole experience.  The school told me that this other kid got a "referral"....which means that they called his parents.  "That's it?", I inquired.  "Yup.  For a first offense..... but we'll try and keep them apart.   "But DS3 didn't do anything?"  "We know."

After a day or two, I just made the decision to pull him.  It wasn't worth it.  According to my other kids who were still at the school, that boy attacked two other kids before he was suspended. 

[mims]

 

+6543w2q

[Pen]

Does the school or district have a school psychologist or similar counselor ?

[Pen]

3 hours ago, soror said:

So, the story is that there was a kid who got sent to the hall for throwing pencils and pens in one of ds' electives. He came back in and pulled up a chair by ds, he normally sits on the opposite side of the room

 

To me,

First, the teacher needs a way to contact vice-principal or other relevant staff to come to classroom and take the kid elsewhere and deal with him rather  than merely to send him into hall.   

Secondly, there need to be assigned seats and if kid is still in class with your Ds the teacher needs to deal with the kid being out of his proper seat. 

Kid needs some sort of counseling and not to go back into regular classroom until he is calm and sorted out. There could be a physical problem causing him to act out as well as emotional / behavioral. 

Possibly the kid is acting out because the class is too hard and he belongs in an easier class or a study hall or a SPED room, for himself, quite aside from your son’s safety. 

[wintermom]

What is the "juvenille office?"  This sounds like a police matter. Get a lawyer involved and try to access some video of this event. Seems to me that this lad needs some serious intervention and perhaps the police is the only way for him to get help. 

[Junie]

Your son needs to be moved to the far side of the room away from the door.  The other kid likely sat next to him because it was near the door and he didn't want to walk the whole way across the classroom.  His new seat should be near the door.  If your son sits on the other side they should never have to sit near each other.

Yes, you should have been called by school administration, but I would have wanted the call from the nurse ASAP.  She would have the best information about your ds's condition.

It sounds like your ds did the right thing.

[Faith-manor]

Sadly, I would not expect the school to care two hoots about my child's safety. It is easier to intimidate victims into putting up with abuse or get their parents to remove them from school, than it is to deal with bullies so they take the easy route.

I would press charges, and be pretty demanding with the prosecutor about it. I would get a lawyer so that you can get your hands on the videotape evidence, and then use that to get a restraining order against the aggressor. The restraining order may then put a ton of liability on the part of the school to keep the perp away from your child. I would also tell the school that you will be taking legal action and seek monetary damages for any future incidents if the school shows any signs of negligence in dealing with the situation.

I would also have the lawyer notify the parents that should there be any incidents in the future, you will be suing them. That is the number one way to get them to take action with their own child. Seriously. I wish this were not true, but so often the parents of bullies defend their child, and sometimes even promote the behavior. At least, that is the case around here. You can see it as a generational thing. The moms were nasty, bully mean girls, the dads were aggressors, and their kids go down the same path. Potentially having a judgment against them for money/restitution is the only thing that seems to count. It is a very sad state of things, but all you can do is pursue what works because you can't change family culture.

Unfortunately, legal action and potential loss of money is about the only thing that motivates schools, companies, etc. to do what they should be doing. The morals and ethics just do not seem to exist anymore. There are alternative schools and online schooling for the perpetrator. He doesn't have to be in the general school population, it's just easier to get you to cave than to force the issue or make the parents of the bully take action.

[katilac]

How sad is it that my first thought was, oh no, never head to the bathroom after an argument! (using the word 'argument' for convenience, I know your ds didn't argue)

I was in school in the 1970s and 1980s. We treated bathrooms and stairwells with extreme caution, but at least no one would get in trouble for defending themselves if it was proven on video! 

 

[displace]

Personally I’d view it as if DS was at a job and expect the employer to act accordingly to a physical fight in the workplace.  If they cannot “fire” the student, then the attacker should suffer severe repercussions.  You should also expect all day safety for your DS (that takes your DS out of the decision tree).  An employer should never say, “avoid person X so you don’t get bullied/beaten up.”  The employer would be expected to fire the individual (in a school that may mean changing classes or schools).  If the school won’t do that, press charges against the school.  

Edited September 22, 2018 by displace

[Liz CA]

4 hours ago, Arctic Mama said:

Oh, I feel for your son. I got suspended for an afternoon because a girl decided to walk up, cuss me out, and smash pizza in my face when I wouldn’t fight her.  I didn’t even know her name until AFTER this all happened.  And since we were both ‘involved’ we had the exact same length of suspension. The school not only wouldn’t do anything, they blamed me equally whether I escalated or not.  Provoked or not.

 

Come to think of it... I may have seriously begun considering homeschooling shortly thereafter.

 

How idiotic as well as soror's school's policy. You cannot defend yourself??? Poppycock. I have been removed from schools and current school policy for so long that I have never heard of something like this. Do they really expect a student to just stand there and be beaten up?

[Soror]

Thank you all for your thoughts and words.

to clear up a few things:

I would pull my son out of school in a second if that is what he wanted, I would have done it Friday, I've got no qualms about that. BUT he is there because he wants to be there. He is enjoying school and doing well. He is 14 so he gets some say in this and it has been his only negative experience thus far.

30 minutes ago, katilac said:

How sad is it that my first thought was, oh no, never head to the bathroom after an argument! (using the word 'argument' for convenience, I know your ds didn't argue)

I was in school in the 1970s and 1980s. We treated bathrooms and stairwells with extreme caution, but at least no one would get in trouble for defending themselves if it was proven on video! 

 

Good point and one I would not think about and certainly not ds. He didn't realize this was an ongoing thing, he thought it was done, he went to the bathroom because he needed to go. He's just not had that life experience to think about this. 

[Soror]

1 minute ago, Liz CA said:

 

How idiotic as well as soror's school's policy. You cannot defend yourself??? Poppycock. I have been removed from schools and current school policy for so long that I have never heard of something like this. Do they really expect a student to just stand there and be beaten up?

One wonders, we will certainly be seeking clarification.

1 hour ago, wintermom said:

What is the "juvenille office?"  This sounds like a police matter. Get a lawyer involved and try to access some video of this event. Seems to me that this lad needs some serious intervention and perhaps the police is the only way for him to get help. 

Juvenile Office is who deals with youth that break the laws here. 

[sassenach]

1) press charges

2) call a meeting with the principal and insist on the kid being removed from the class *at least* until the justice system is done with him. Refer to the student as the *alleged* perpetrator and your son as the crime victim. “Principal, are you saying that the school will keep crime victims in the same classroom as the alleged perpetrators? Is this a school board policy? Is the school board aware that this is how YOU choose to handle criminal situations?”

 

I say this as the mom of a kid who has gotten in a fight where he was an equal participant (and got suspended and I didn’t feel sorry for him). That is not the situation you are describing here. You’re describing an unprovoked criminal attack.