To sneak a baby-conception over on a husband or not

[Leah_in_GA]

I have a friend who's strongly considering tricking her husband into making a baby with her. She asked me my opinion on the subject and because of the circumstances, it wasn't quite so clear cut to me. Here's their scoop. They are both 36 years old now. She has one son who is age 4. Got pregnant with him the first time they tried for a baby, so no apparent fertility problems. Since his birth, they've do NFP for birth control wih co_doms during her fertile time (and since she keeps up with it she knows she can easily tweek it where they'd conceive). The husband wanted to aim for another baby when that child was 6 months old. Husband wanted close-in-age babies mostly because he thought they were too old to be having babies. They'd been married 6 years and didn't start having babies earlier because he was in school and she wanted to be a SAHM and couldn't any earlier thus the waiting 6 years to have child 1. Their baby boy was a tough baby. He was born by c/ a month early, then he had colic his first 4 months, then her mom's cancer came back when he was 3 months old, and she was demand breastfeeding him. So, my friend said she was too emotionally and physically too tired when he was 6 months old to try to conceive a sibling. So, the husband gave her until he was 1 and said that if they don't conceive by the time he's one, then he'd be an only. Well, she said with her mother and his not sleeping through the night (he slept through the night the first time when he was 2 and a half years), she just couldn't do it. Well, now that he's just turned 4 and her mother has passed, she's ready for another and wants one but husband says no (she's asked to have another for over a year now). Now keep in mind that they are both in excellent health. The husband is a wonderful man -- he's a great dad and when he's not at work, he's at home with them and loves and serves them both. She says she knows that he'd love the baby and that he'd think he/she was another blessing once they conceived, but yet she feels guilty. I asked her if she'd had a long, frank talk to him about how much she wants this. She says that she has but that he's adamant. I've seen him with them both and IMO it's just a shame that they don't have more children.

 

What do you think?

Edited May 4, 2012 by Leah_in_GA

[Evergreen State Sue]

I think if he is that set on not having any more children, he should get fixed. I think a person knows when they don't want any more and if one person doesn't, then there should be no more. And above all that, what is it saying about your marriage if you have to trick your husband into having a baby? A baby is more important than your relationship with your husband? How could he trust her after that.

[mommymilkies]

No. It would not be ok to sneak in a conception! That should be something agreed upon. Unfortunately, I feel for her. I really do. But sneaking it in will just cause strife in the marriage.

[Mabeline]

I think both the parents should be involved in deciding to have a child.

[BlsdMama]

No. It would not be ok to sneak in a conception! That should be something agreed upon. Unfortunately, I feel for her. I really do. But sneaking it in will just cause strife in the marriage.

 

I can't believe someone would be sneaky like this with their husband... It doesn't bode well for the respect and care within the marriage and therefore the long term outlook, so no, I wouldn't bring encourage her to have a child in this marriage with a man she obviously doesn't respect. (And this from someone who is obviously anti-birthcontrol, *but* pro marriage.)

[KirstenH]

I couldn't live with myself if I did that. Even if he didn't know, I would. Honesty is fundamental to my understanding of marriage.

[mommaduck]

Sounds to be like they both have issues.

 

Husband: the demand that she be pregnant by the time the first child is one year or no more babies at all?! Good grief!

 

Wife: Wanting to sneak a pregnancy on a husband, especially one that is pretty adamant...and she had cancer, which places her at an increase risk of having cancer again (I'm not certain what all the risks are with her type of cancer, recurrence, and pregnancy are, but something about that would concern me and I'm sure it probably concerns her husband).

[mommaduck]

I couldn't live with myself if I did that. Even if he didn't know, I would. Honesty is fundamental to my understanding of marriage.

:iagree:

[Rhonda in TX]

No. No, no, no. Never.

[SKL]

1) No. There is no place for this kind of dishonesty in a marriage.

 

2) Sounds like she takes for granted the things he does right. If she does this in complete disregard of his wishes, she may lose what she has.

 

3) I do feel for her. But it's not just up to her. Would she like it if he forced her to get pregnant when her son was an infant, as originally planned? Sounds like he completely respected her wishes at that time and she needs to be equally respectful.

[Miss Cornelia Snook]

I think that they need some counseling at this point, more than they need a baby.

 

I consider it highly disrespectful to my husband to try to sneak a conception on him. So what if he's being disrespectful to me by disregarding my feelings? I'm responsible for how *I* act, no matter what he does.

 

Sad situation.

[Loudwater School]

No. No, no, no. Never.

 

:iagree:

 

Other people have made the i-couldn't-live-with-it and that-bodes-poorly-for-their-relationship arguments, which I definitely agree with. Also, I think no one should ever be forced to parent against their will. Practically speaking, if she's been begging for a baby for months and then "accidentally" gets pregnant, he's surely going to suspect, and that will erode their relationship further. No no no, don't do it!

[butterflymommy]

Surely he'd know she pulled one over on him? Especially after saying how much she wants another? Also how much could he serve them both if he is deaf to her pleas for another child?

[4everHis]

I can't believe someone would be sneaky like this with their husband... It doesn't bode well for the respect and care within the marriage and therefore the long term outlook, so no, I wouldn't bring encourage her to have a child in this marriage with a man she obviously doesn't respect. (And this from someone who is obviously anti-birthcontrol, *but* pro marriage.)

 

:iagree:

[Jpoy85]

I think he should be open to the idea. Maybe try for 6mo and if it doesnt happen, then it doesnt. what if NOW or even at 1yr old she had fertility issues? Then what? It does happen. Secondary Infertility.

[BigMamaBird]

No way!

 

If she wants a baby that badly, she needs to discuss it with her husband. If she's respectful and gentle with him maybe he'll change his mind.

[happypamama]

Yeah, I don't think that sounds right at all, to sneak one in. If it's a matter of "I don't want to know when your fertile time is, if it happens, it happens," that's different, IMO, but it sounds like he's really adamant, and they are actively using something to prevent a baby. Sneaking sounds wrong.

[DarlaS]

1)

3) I do feel for her. But it's not just up to her. Would she like it if he forced her to get pregnant when her son was an infant, as originally planned? Sounds like he completely respected her wishes at that time and she needs to be equally respectful.

 

I agree that she should NOT do this.

 

However, I'm not sure taking the attitude that she should get pregnant again within a year (while her mom was dying, and her son had colic) or NEVER have another baby is respect.

 

From the OP:

So, the husband gave her until he was 1 and said that if they don't conceive by the time he's one, then he'd be an only.

 

What an ultimatum!

 

I think these people need counseling. Even if they don't have any more kids. He sounds a wee bit controlling...

[catz]

I think if he is that set on not having any more children, he should get fixed. I think a person knows when they don't want any more and if one person doesn't, then there should be no more. And above all that, what is it saying about your marriage if you have to trick your husband into having a baby? A baby is more important than your relationship with your husband? How could he trust her after that.

 

:iagree: I would have loved one more, but there would have been no way I was doing it like this. I actually know a couple that ended up divorced because of a situation like this.

 

I think this couple sounds like they need counseling.

[DarlaS]

Sounds to be like they both have issues.

 

Husband: the demand that she be pregnant by the time the first child is one year or no more babies at all?! Good grief!

 

Wife: Wanting to sneak a pregnancy on a husband, especially one that is pretty adamant...and she had cancer, which places her at an increase risk of having cancer again (I'm not certain what all the risks are with her type of cancer, recurrence, and pregnancy are, but something about that would concern me and I'm sure it probably concerns her husband).

 

:iagree:

 

It was her mother who had cancer though. And her son was a colicky preemie.

[mommaduck]

:iagree:

 

It was her mother who had cancer though. And her son was a colicky preemie.

Misread it; thank you for the clarification :)

[bbmom]

While I understand the temptation to do this, I don't think it is OK for anyone to deceive their partner in order to have a child. With that said, I do think it is perfectly fair for her to say "I want another child. I understand that you don't, but I will no longer be taking any responsibility for birth control-no charting, no keeping track for NFP, nothing, so if you do not want another, you need to be 100% responsible for that." Then if he asks if he needs protection or not, she should just always answer 'I don't know, I told you I'm not keeping track anymore." If he is lackadaisical about it, he understands that a possible pregnancy could result (and likely will at some point.)

[SailorMom]

No, no, no, no, no..... I can not imagine any circumstances where sneaking a pregnancy would be ok. None.

 

It does sound like there are some control issues there with the time limit he put on her years ago... but that doesn't make it right for her to sneak a baby on someone who adamantly doesn't want one right now.

 

Sounds to me like there are communications issues here as well. With all that stress after baby #1, a compromise should have been reached. Waiting four years after the DH only wanted to wait one is not being sensitive to his desires at all. I realize that her mom had cancer, and that she was under a lot of emotional strain - but what if her mom had lived even longer? Was she going to wait indefinitely to have another child?

[coffeegal]

While I understand the temptation to do this, I don't think it is OK for anyone to deceive their partner in order to have a child. With that said, I do think it is perfectly fair for her to say "I want another child. I understand that you don't, but I will no longer be taking any responsibility for birth control-no charting, no keeping track for NFP, nothing, so if you do not want another, you need to be 100% responsible for that." Then if he asks if he needs protection or not, she should just always answer 'I don't know, I told you I'm not keeping track anymore." If he is lackadaisical about it, he understands that a possible pregnancy could result (and likely will at some point.)

 

:iagree:

[EJCMom]

IMO, there are no circumstances where it would be okay to trick someone into having a child.

[jennsmile]

No!

 

That said breastfeeding mothers sometimes can't get pregnant or have cycles till they stop nursing. So if my dh had given me that it would have been crazy as I had no cycles till my oldest was 18months. My kids are spaced with breastfeeding and a couple of miscarriages. Did he know this and that is why he gave her an unrealistic choice.

 

As for age dh wanted to be done at 40 when we got married 13 years ago. He is 42 and we just had #4....he mellowed thankfully through lots of prayer on my part.

[VeganCupcake]

No, I don't think it's respectful to one's partner. If he poked holes in a prophylactic device and didn't tell her about it until later and she conceived, then she'd (rightly) feel betrayed and violated. It's the same thing if the roles are reversed.

[Scuff]

How would she feel once she was pregnant? Would she tell him? How would he react then? Or would she claim it an accident for the rest of their married lives? If you ask her these things, will she see how this could be bad for her marriage?

 

I understand. Really, I do. DH and I talked about 4 or 5 before we were even married. Then he wanted to stop at 3. It tore me up for many years not to have #4. Then he changed his mind. But how could I live with myself if I had tricked him into another?

 

I suppose if a dh was being wishy-washy and you knew without a doubt he'd be happy, so you just got sloppy, that would be one thing. But this dh has clearly stated his wishes.

[Forget-Me-Not]

Is this question for real?

 

NO, there's never a good reason to trick a man into conceiving a baby. What a betrayal of trust. He has just as much right to say yes or no to more children coming into the family as she does.

[weyland]

Oh, I do sympathize with her. To want something so very badly, especially a child, feeling the love for child #1 and just wanting to have another one to love again. I completely understand that thought process.

But, no, it isn't right. That is such a hard situation. I would continue to talk to my husband. My husband was adamant, too, and got snipped. If he truly wanted to make sure that there would be no babies, he would get snipped... he has not, and is agreeing on a less than perfect birth control method, so perhaps there is a glimmer of hope. Perhaps, deep inside he is wanting one, too?

More conversation, definitely. He may come around :)

[dangermom]

I know a gal who did that. They didn't stay married for long after that. It's a terrible idea.

 

I do think he was pretty rotten to have all those ultimatums. Counseling sounds like a great idea. But two wrongs don't make a right, etc. etc.

[Pretty in Pink]

I am really surprised that anyone would contemplate actually doing this. Wow. No, she shouldn't sneak a baby in there. Good grief. Talk about a violation of trust. His reasons are his own. If she was the one who didn't want a baby and he was contemplating poking holes in the condoms to sneak another one in on her we would all be up in arms!

 

No. No. No.

[DawnM]

Eight whole posts and this question.......:glare:

[LucyStoner]

This will end in tears. And possibly divorce court. Under NO circumstances is it ok to trick someone into having a baby. It is also not ok to issue deadlines to postpartum women...I agree that they have issues coming and going.

[Melinda in VT]

No. No, no, no, no, no.

 

And I don't read the husband as being as controlling as some of the other posters. It sounds like the husband and wife each have strong feelings. The husband feels strongly about being done with having kids at a younger age. The wife felt strongly about delaying kids until she could be a SAHM and felt strongly about not having another child earlier (due to various circumstances) and feels strongly about having a second. She seems more demanding than he does. What has she compromised on?

[NanceXToo]

While I can't technically condone tricking him, his stance just might be a deal breaker for me. His ridiculous ultimatum followed by an adamant refusal for ttc again when it's obvious that it's important to her (and it's not like he was opposed to more kids in general) would be SO aggravating and hurtful to me that I don't know that I could ever be happy in that relationship. Maybe she should issue an ultimatum of her own! :P

[stripe]

The whole situation is weird, his condition was dumb, and I hate to think of any parent not wanting their own child. That is just awful.

 

How about if she coneived with someone else? Would he mind that?

Edited May 4, 2012 by stripe

[myfunnybunch]

Not.

 

No matter how good the reasons might be, the bottom line is deceit is wrong.

 

A child is a tremendous responsibility, and no one should be tricked into having another.

 

IMO, she needs to sit down and tell him that she's so desperate to have another child that she actually considered conceiving without his consent, and ask him to either agree to another child or get a vasectomy so it's not an option.

 

And I agree that he doesn't necessarily sound controlling. Or they both do. It sounds like they have equally strong feelings. I say that with full understanding that he should respect and honor her feelings....but she should respect and honor his too. (My dh and I had to navigate this issue, and I know full well how tricky it can be on both sides.)

 

Cat

[SKL]

And I don't read the husband as being as controlling as some of the other posters. It sounds like the husband and wife each have strong feelings. The husband feels strongly about being done with having kids at a younger age. The wife felt strongly about delaying kids until she could be a SAHM and felt strongly about not having another child earlier (due to various circumstances) and feels strongly about having a second. She seems more demanding than he does. What has she compromised on?

 

I kind of feel this way too. Yes, he sounds kind of arbitrary as described in the OP, but do we know that he would have said "no" when the 1st was 13mos? She was not ready to even consider having #2 until #1 was 2.5+ (and she also postponed #1 for 6 years).

 

We haven't considered what his reasons might be. There is something to be said for having kids close together and/or as younger parents. And, it sounds like #1 was a precarious birth and a high-maintenance baby/child. (My SIL had one like that and would not even discuss #2.) Maybe he will even reconsider given some more time.

 

But even if he is being a bit rigid, that's a separate issue. You don't fix that kind of problem by thrusting an unplanned child on the man.

 

I like the idea of putting him in charge of birth control since he is the one who doesn't want a child. I would be completely straightforward about it, though. And remember, that could backfire if he is extremely adamant.

[mommaduck]

No. No, no, no, no, no.

 

And I don't read the husband as being as controlling as some of the other posters. It sounds like the husband and wife each have strong feelings. The husband feels strongly about being done with having kids at a younger age. The wife felt strongly about delaying kids until she could be a SAHM and felt strongly about not having another child earlier (due to various circumstances) and feels strongly about having a second. She seems more demanding than he does. What has she compromised on?

It's not necessarily a control issue. It's more a matter of the ultimatum being a bit ridiculous in timing. Close together siblings is one thing. TTC within the same year as having just had a child (within that child's first year...particularly the initial, within the first 6mos) is not rational. Yes, it happens, but to set that as the ultimatum, that is just wrong. A woman's body needs a chance to heal. Technically, that can take up to two years and should not rushed into in the first year.

[Unscripted]

Just another vote for "absolutely wrong" here. The fact that she is even seriously considering the idea gives huge insight as to the state of their relationship... And that needs to be addressed before any procreation, IMO.

 

And I am another that doesn't see her wishes to be a SAHM or his wishes on spacing to be controlling at all. He made his preferences pretty clear before #1 even came along (as did she). Life happens and she made her own choices as things came up. It DOES suck... But I think he did try to bend a little bit- by going to a year (which would make the children nearly 2 years apart)... And she wanted to pass at the time. The natural consequence is pretty evident- he may not bend any further. That's life.

But to force your own way about something so huge, so permanent... Is just beyond terrible.

[CroppinIt]

How would she feel in this case? She did NOT want a baby, so he told her he'd been fixed but he hadn't. Baby comes. What would that do to her trust in him?

 

As much as I love kids and all, I have to vote no.

[MamaT]

Deceiving a spouse is never, ever okay.

[LaxMom]

I'm trying to conjure a circumstance where this would EVER be ok... I can't. It is not ok to deceive your spouse in the conception of a child. Ever. Full stop.

[swellmomma]

I would say their marriage is already on rocky ground. Just his ultimatum alone could be enough to end things. No she should not trick him. I actually see them ending up in divorce court because of his demands and refusals to even listen to her. He didn't repsect her wishes before, he gave her an ultimatum. I know that when I was still married I knew I wanted another child one day. My ex announced not only did her not want more but that he should have never had the first 2. That day was the first day in the end of our marriage. We stayed together for a couple more years but things got progressively worse.

 

Resentment can and will eat a marriage apart. That goes for resentment on his part if she tricks him. But also resentment on her part for him issuing ultimatums and refusing to even openingly discuss this with her now.

 

THey need some serious counselling.

[happyhomemaker]

I'm trying to conjure a circumstance where this would EVER be ok... I can't. It is not ok to deceive your spouse in the conception of a child. Ever. Full stop.

 

:iagree::iagree: She might gain a child, but she would very likely lose her husband.

[clarkacademy]

I would say their marriage is already on rocky ground. Just his ultimatum alone could be enough to end things. No she should not trick him. I actually see them ending up in divorce court because of his demands and refusals to even listen to her. He didn't repsect her wishes before, he gave her an ultimatum. I know that when I was still married I knew I wanted another child one day. My ex announced not only did her not want more but that he should have never had the first 2. That day was the first day in the end of our marriage. We stayed together for a couple more years but things got progressively worse.

 

Resentment can and will eat a marriage apart. That goes for resentment on his part if she tricks him. But also resentment on her part for him issuing ultimatums and refusing to even openingly discuss this with her now.

 

THey need some serious counselling.

 

Yes this :iagree: If they cannot come to an agreement I see it ending badly. You never want to force a child on someone. That can cause so many problems down the road. That can cause not only marriage issues but when faced with having that child forced upon him no one knows hoe he will react to it. Sure he is a great dad with his planned child but until it goes the other way we have no idea how he would behave.

[UnsinkableKristen]

It's not necessarily a control issue. It's more a matter of the ultimatum being a bit ridiculous in timing. Close together siblings is one thing. TTC within the same year as having just had a child (within that child's first year...particularly the initial, within the first 6mos) is not rational. Yes, it happens, but to set that as the ultimatum, that is just wrong. A woman's body needs a chance to heal. Technically, that can take up to two years and should not rushed into in the first year.

 

 

I guess I see this less as being controlling and more as being naive. It's quite possible that a first time father knew absolutely none of what a woman's body actually goes through during pregnancy and how arbitrary his timing preferences were.

[Peaceful Isle]

Wow, ...just wow. :glare: Definitely no tricking in marriage.

[Leah_in_GA]

No!

 

That said breastfeeding mothers sometimes can't get pregnant or have cycles till they stop nursing. So if my dh had given me that it would have been crazy as I had no cycles till my oldest was 18months. My kids are spaced with breastfeeding and a couple of miscarriages. Did he know this and that is why he gave her an unrealistic choice.

 

As for age dh wanted to be done at 40 when we got married 13 years ago. He is 42 and we just had #4....he mellowed thankfully through lots of prayer on my part.

 

She did tell me about this...that she got her period back when he was 11 months old.

 

 

No, I don't think it's respectful to one's partner. If he poked holes in a prophylactic device and didn't tell her about it until later and she conceived, then she'd (rightly) feel betrayed and violated. It's the same thing if the roles are reversed.

 

All this is what has kept her from doing so. She keeps bringing up the whole Sarai sending Abraham in with Ishmael's mom (whats her name) and what mess came of that.

 

 

I am really surprised that anyone would contemplate actually doing this. Wow. No, she shouldn't sneak a baby in there. Good grief. Talk about a violation of trust. His reasons are his own. If she was the one who didn't want a baby and he was contemplating poking holes in the condoms to sneak another one in on her we would all be up in arms!

 

No. No. No.

 

Deep emotional pain drives many people to do things that they wouldn't otherwise.

 

Eight whole posts and this question.......:glare:

 

I've been looking looking at these boards for years and just now got internet in my home to join. Now what are the rules? If you've got 0 - 10 posts you can ask a level 1 question. If 10 - 50 posts then you can ask a level 2 question. If 20 - 100, a level 3. I guess if I post 200+ times (even if its a mere icon), I'll be mature enough on here to ask a question on behalf of a friend who doesn't have internet access. Please direct me to these rules so I can avoid freshman postings.

 

While I can't technically condone tricking him, his stance just might be a deal breaker for me. His ridiculous ultimatum followed by an adamant refusal for ttc again when it's obvious that it's important to her (and it's not like he was opposed to more kids in general) would be SO aggravating and hurtful to me that I don't know that I could ever be happy in that relationship. Maybe she should issue an ultimatum of her own! :P

 

His reasons mostly have to do with his age and the nature of his work which zaps him mentally and he just doesn't think he'd have a drop more to give if he added to their family.

 

Oh, I do sympathize with her. To want something so very badly, especially a child, feeling the love for child #1 and just wanting to have another one to love again. I completely understand that thought process.

But, no, it isn't right. That is such a hard situation. I would continue to talk to my husband. My husband was adamant, too, and got snipped. If he truly wanted to make sure that there would be no babies, he would get snipped... he has not, and is agreeing on a less than perfect birth control method, so perhaps there is a glimmer of hope. Perhaps, deep inside he is wanting one, too?

More conversation, definitely. He may come around :)

 

 

 

I just called her with the responses. She cried as she spoke and said she knew this was the right thing (not to do this). She says she's going to fast about it for one day per week and ask him for the last time in a few months.

 

 

 

Thanks all for the replies.