SailorMom Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 So - Thanksgiving yesterday... two people I do not know well who are very close friends with the hosts... The woman is 6 months pregnant - and went outside to smoke 4 times while I was there. Host is a doctor. Pregnant mom speaks 5 languages and is a high paid corporate threat assessment analyst. Everyone there has (at a minimum) a graduate degree... I'm not saying educated people don't make bad choices - but I assume they all know smoking is bad, and horrible for the baby. I didn't comment a) out of respect for the host, and b) because I figured everyone there already knew it was wrong.... So - what would you have done?? I feel like there is some sort of moral responsibility to that baby, and that maybe I made the wrong choice.... I really hope we can be civil. Actually, quick "yes" or "no" poll answers would be great :) I am sure there are many who think that 3 or 4 cigarettes are less harmful to a baby than walking around LA - and I get that... So - no pointing fingers and being nasty :) Poll to follow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edelweiss Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 I abhor smoking, but there is NO way that I would've said anything. It just isn't my business. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arghmatey Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 Of course she already knows. Your opinion and any additional evidence wouldn't change her behavior. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farrar Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 It's the FOUR TIMES... IN FRONT OF OTHERS that's really getting me... was it a cry for help? I mean, what the heck? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Impish Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 Unless they live under a rock, they know smoking is bad for their health, and while pregnant. I wouldn't have said anything, b/c it wouldn't have done anything positive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haiku Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 Absolutely not. That would have been rude rude rude beyond belief and would not have changed her behavior. She smokes because she's addicted, and shaming her and publicly humiliating her would not end her addiction or do anything for her baby. (And I am someone who thinks cigarettes are completely vile, so I am not defending her smoking.) Tara Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mazakaal Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 In that situation I wouldn't have said anything. If it were family (sibling, etc) or a very close friend I might consider saying something to them in private, but definitely not at Thanksgiving dinner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haiku Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 was it a cry for help? I mean, what the heck? No. You're reading way too much into it. She's addicted. That's all. Tara Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twigs Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 As bad is smoking is, it is addictive, and head knowledge will have little effect on changing behavior. There is also a possiblitity she uses it as stress reliever / coping behavior, so there could be an emotional element as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellie Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 It is not your job to tell someone that smoking is bad for her. It has nothing to do with respect for the host. It is just not polite. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MissKNG Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 I wouldn't have said anything but I may have bursted into tears for the unborn baby. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Word Nerd Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 Absolutely not. It is not my place at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwg Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 :iagree: I would not have said anything. I used to smoke but quit with my pregnancies. Sometimes -even now- I miss it a little. I decided a while ago that I have not actually quit for good, just taking a break and when I am 80-85 I will start back up again. I figure by then I wont care how it smells or have to worry about my influence on my children.....and my health and all will be pretty much decided. But four times! You would think she would at least feel embarrassed or something and try to hide it/cut back. How long were you there? My eldest smokes but did not while she was at dinner. Her bf had to step out a few times - it was his first family dinner :tongue_smilie: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kathymuggle Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 No, I would not mention it at all. What good would it do? Education level is irrelevant - I think everyone knows smoking is bad and bad for pregnant women/their babies. If it were a close friends and if the subject came up I would let them know I would be a support person if they decided to quit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lisbeth Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 I consider that child abuse...though LEGAL child abuse. I wouldn't have said a word...but I wouldn't smooth it over or be defensively friendly about it either. I think it offensive behavior on HER part to do that around a group, if everyone knew. ICK! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kathymuggle Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 : I used to smoke but quit with my pregnancies. Sometimes -even now- I miss it a little. I decided a while ago that I have not actually quit for good, just taking a break and when I am 80-85 I will start back up again. I figure by then I wont care how it smells or have to worry about my influence on my children.....and my health and all will be pretty much decided. : Too funny! My mom quit when she was diagnosed with cancer 15 years ago. She has said if she make it to 80, she will take it up again. She misses it a little. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
annandatje Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 You should not have said anything. Anyone with intelligence in average range or possibly lower knows that smoking is detrimental to health. She went outside to smoke, so she was not sharing her poison with others. It was not happening at your house. Would you want to be told that something you were eating or drinking was unhealthy for you or your fetus? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elegantlion Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 No, I would not have said anything. Addictions can hit people at any educational level. Depending upon how long you were there 4 times would not be excessive for some smokers. I quit years ago. I'll admit sometimes I'll see someone smoking and think, wow, it's after dinner, time for that after dinner cigarette. :001_huh: I don't even want to smoke ever again and it's been at least 18 since I have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carrie12345 Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 There's truly nothing to be accomplished there. No adult is unaware of the dangers, and particularly no adult under an ob or midwife's care. The only result would be even more awkwardness. I mean, would you really expect an "OMG, I had no idea! Thanks for letting me know so I can change my ways immediately!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kalanamak Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 Of course she already knows. Your opinion and any additional evidence wouldn't change her behavior. :iagree: There is a slightly lower birthrate, and something like 1 or 2 IQ points, and slightly higher miscarriage rate, be we aren't talking fetal alcohol syndrome here. It is far more serious to smoke around a baby than it is while pregnant. Many people do both. There is a flip side to this. Anyone who goes out to smoke that much is rather likely to have something underlying, like an anxiety disorder. (Before a million smokers leap on me, I'm not saying ALL heavily addicted people have anxiety or depression or mood etc disorders, but that statistically speaking many mild-moderately ill people use cigs as their over the counter Xanax and a greater percentage of heavy smokers have a dysphoric disorder than non-smokers do.) Would it be better for her fetus for her to start blowing her stack, alienate her co-workers, have to go to anger management classes, ruin her husbands feelings for her, etc. etc. as well as really predispose her to love this baby that made her give up one of the few comforts in her life: her smokes? Just a thought to chaw on. I was married to a "stress smoker", and I was perfectly willing to face his cancer, etc 30 years down the road over his **foul** mood for weeks if he was off the stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Truscifi Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 I might have said something to someone I was very close to, but not to an acquaintance and definitely not at thanksgiving dinner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DusksAngel Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 Just a thought to chaw on. I was married to a "stress smoker", and I was perfectly willing to face his cancer, etc 30 years down the road over his **foul** mood for weeks if he was off the stuff. I have to agree with this. My mother is like this. When she tries to quit, she'll get in these horrible moods and you just want to light one for her. That said, she doesn't smoke in front of my kids. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AimeeM Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 You never know what she cleared with her doctor. I was a smoker with my last pregnancy. I was able to quit cold turkey; but I was told by my doctor that if it puts a person through significant stress and you are a heavy smoker, it is best to NOT quit cold turkey. In a nutshell - it isn't your business and you have no idea what she has discussed with her physician. As a former smoker I can tell you that your comments would only serve to annoy me; not make me want to stop something that had already been cleared with my doctor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwg Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 (edited) Once I was in the parking lot with my kids and I saw a father look frantically around for his child, spot her on the median thingy, yell at her to come over, and then when she did pull her hair :( ; her mother started to yell at her too...how horrible for her to have not just one but both parents against her. I still wish I had said something- just a little "It is really scary when they wander off in the parking lot. I hate when they do that" It may not have helped, but it may have diffused the situation a little and at least made them aware that people were watching for crying out loud! (that is the scariest part, this was their public behavior!) So, while one could say that was none of my business....and I voted the smoking is none of my business.....and it isn't.....but at the same time it is now making me think of that incident. Maybe I could have said the part about how I have not actually quit but am taking a break for the next 40 odd years. Dh doesnt miss it at all; he was more regular. I was the type that would smoke one a day but it was a definite crutch when things got stressful. Nasty little habit! ETA: heck, I recently saw a commercial for antidepressants on TV which said something like if your child was born with any of these conditions contact this lawyer for a class action suite or something. eek. I took them when I was pregnant, cleared by dr. (kiddo is fine btw) We weighed the risks. So, it is quite possible, you never know what has been discussed between patient and doctor. It is true....it isnt like she is beating the kid. false analagy there! Edited November 25, 2011 by kwg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatmansWife Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 I didn't vote yet....because I'm not sure what I would have done. This reminds me of a news segment this past summer. There was a woman who strapped this pillow thingy on to make it look like she was pregnant. Then she stood next to a friend (not pregnant), drinking a beer....at the state fair in MN. They did this most of the day and not.one.single.person said anything to her. She got a lot of looks, but no one said anything. I'm not sure what to think about that either.....again, she would know it's not good for the baby, so what's the point in saying anything. But, then again.....people don't want to get involved. This isn't said to start any argument...I was just reminded of this while reading this post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Firestar Academy Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 :iagree: I would not have said anything. I used to smoke but quit with my pregnancies. Sometimes -even now- I miss it a little. I decided a while ago that I have not actually quit for good, just taking a break and when I am 80-85 I will start back up again. I figure by then I wont care how it smells or have to worry about my influence on my children.....and my health and all will be pretty much decided. :tongue_smilie: :iagree::iagree: OMG!! i would never say this IRL, though...:leaving: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MicheleinMN Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 Of course she already knows. Your opinion and any additional evidence wouldn't change her behavior. :iagree::iagree::iagree: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AimeeM Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 *A* beer isn't bad for baby in most cases. *A* glass of red wine isn't bad for baby. To say that everybody *knows* such-and-such is bad for baby is a false assumption when it is the consensus of many professionals that smoking while pregnant may be less harmful than a heavy smoker quitting; and that a glass of red wine once or twice a month is an okay way to relax during pregnancy. I didn't vote yet....because I'm not sure what I would have done. This reminds me of a news segment this past summer. There was a woman who strapped this pillow thingy on to make it look like she was pregnant. Then she stood next to a friend (not pregnant), drinking a beer....at the state fair in MN. They did this most of the day and not.one.single.person said anything to her. She got a lot of looks, but no one said anything. I'm not sure what to think about that either.....again, she would know it's not good for the baby, so what's the point in saying anything. But, then again.....people don't want to get involved. This isn't said to start any argument...I was just reminded of this while reading this post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cassy Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 I smoked until I was thirty, giving up after having watched two close relatives die slow, very horrible deaths from smoking. I'm generally a non-confrontational person, and try very hard to be polite, but if the subject had come up in that situation, I would have said something, gently and with compassion, but I would have said something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justamouse Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 (edited) Of course she already knows. Your opinion and any additional evidence wouldn't change her behavior. :iagree: She knows and she's doing it anyway. Most people do know the risks. Smoking is an emotional addiction, too, and a very difficult thing to quit. It's not as easy as putting down a cigarette. I'm watching a great aunt die of emphysema. It's ..disgusting and horrible and awful and so incredibly sad. But she herself says she'd still smoke if she could. Edited November 25, 2011 by justamouse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OnTheBrink Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 Absolutely not. That would have been rude rude rude beyond belief and would not have changed her behavior. She smokes because she's addicted, and shaming her and publicly humiliating her would not end her addiction or do anything for her baby. (And I am someone who thinks cigarettes are completely vile, so I am not defending her smoking.) Tara :iagree: And to add to it, you were a guest at someone else's home for a holiday meal. NOT the time or place to confront someone who's scarcely an acquaintance on the hazards of smoking. Absolutely nothing good would have come of that and chances are, you'd have made the rest of the day uncomfortable for all. As horrendous as I think smoking while pregnant is, I'd have not said anything (I'd have THOUGHT it though!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Night Elf Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 Absolutely not. She's a big girl, and likely a really smart lady. She knows the dangers. I also consider it an inappropriate situation for such a confrontation. That conversation wouldn't have been gentle in any fashion no matter how you couched it in gentle terms. And you could have upset the hosts for accosting their guests. If I was that bothered by something I saw, I would remove myself from the situation. Honestly? It would be a big job to go around correcting the mistakes you see other parents making. I love all children and hate to see them being mistreated in any way, but I can't imagine taking it upon myself to march up to strangers and impart my wisdom. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ester Maria Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 No, you should not have said anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NanceXToo Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 No. She was doing something dumb and I'm sure she knew it was dumb but it was absolutely none of your business. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jennifer3141 Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 No. She was doing something dumb and I'm sure she knew it was dumb but it was absolutely none of your business. :iagree: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Word Nerd Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 For those who said they would say something, what specifically would you have said? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KatieH Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 Stupid, disgusting thing to do, but she's an adult and it's not your business. So no, I wouldn't have said anything. (FTR, I smoked while I was pregnant with my first, and I'm ashamed of it and think it was a stupid, disgusting, trashy thing to do, but I knew it was wrong and dangerous and did it anyway-someone saying something wouldn't have made me quit). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hope in God Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 *A* beer isn't bad for baby in most cases. *A* glass of red wine isn't bad for baby. To say that everybody *knows* such-and-such is bad for baby is a false assumption when it is the consensus of many professionals that smoking while pregnant may be less harmful than a heavy smoker quitting; and that a glass of red wine once or twice a month is an okay way to relax during pregnancy. New research strongly suggests that not even a single glass of beer or wine is okay during pregnancy. Even if you have just one drink your child could be born with severe FAS. I guess researchers found that some heavy drinkers could have children without FAS but also some mothers that only had one drink could have a baby with FAS. The amount of alcohol was not directly relevant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cassy Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 For those who said they would say something, what specifically would you have said? It's hard to know specifically what I might have said without knowing the person and without knowing how the subject might have come up. I would have wanted to let her know that I understand how hard it is to give up smoking, anything further would depend on her response. For example, she might reply that she didn't want to give up, that she was quite happy continuing smoking while pregnant, in which case I would let her know that in her place I would feel guilty towards my unborn child. If she agreed that she was struggling trying to give up, then I'd offer words of support and encouragement. While smoking is an addiction, I believe that it's also a choice, it certainly was for me. Having seen two close relatives die I realised that in continuing to choose to smoke then I might also be choosing to end my life early in a very painful, undignified way. I chose to live. This woman's child's life could have been her choice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renee in NC Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 New research strongly suggests that not even a single glass of beer or wine is okay during pregnancy. Even if you have just one drink your child could be born with severe FAS. I guess researchers found that some heavy drinkers could have children without FAS but also some mothers that only had one drink could have a baby with FAS. The amount of alcohol was not directly relevant. Do you have links or specific info regarding the studies? I'd be interested to see the methodology. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pfamilygal Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 I would have said something like, "Do you know what sex your baby is? Because I read that if your baby is a girl, when you smoke it changes the DNA in the tiny eggs forming in her ovaries, making your grandkids more likely to have asthma." Sometimes having facts helps give inspiration to quit. But it probably won't help. When folks don't give a crap they aren't going to change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AimeeM Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 Do you have any links? New research strongly suggests that not even a single glass of beer or wine is okay during pregnancy. Even if you have just one drink your child could be born with severe FAS. I guess researchers found that some heavy drinkers could have children without FAS but also some mothers that only had one drink could have a baby with FAS. The amount of alcohol was not directly relevant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justasque Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 I would have said nothing. Sometimes when folks are trying to quit another, worse addiction, ciggies can help get them through. You just never know what someone else, especially a stranger, is going through. Your hostess may have been fully aware of the whole situation. (If it were a friend, in another setting, there may have been a way to gently ask about it, and gently provide encouragement and a non-judgmental sounding board/space in which to explore possible ways to move forward. But not a stranger, and not at Thanksgiving.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hope in God Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 Do you have links or specific info regarding the studies? I'd be interested to see the methodology. I'm sorry, I don't. My friend, who is a nurse in the maternity ward was telling me about these new studies. This was a number of years ago though and I thought there were public education campaigns about this issue. March of dimes says no amount of alcohol is safe during pregnancy: http://www.marchofdimes.com/pregnancy/alcohol_indepth.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caribbean Queen Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 I wouldn't have said anything. Later, if I heard the baby was born with health problems from the mother smoking I would feel ashamed for not speaking up.:sad: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AimeeM Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 I understand what march of dimes says but, frankly, I've been told during two different pregnancies (two different doctors) that a glass of wine every once in a while wasn't a problem. Both are highly respected OBs. I'm sorry, I don't. My friend, who is a nurse in the maternity ward was telling me about these new studies. This was a number of years ago though and I thought there were public education campaigns about this issue. March of dimes says no amount of alcohol is safe during pregnancy:http://www.marchofdimes.com/pregnancy/alcohol_indepth.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carrie12345 Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 I'm sorry, I don't. My friend, who is a nurse in the maternity ward was telling me about these new studies. This was a number of years ago though and I thought there were public education campaigns about this issue. March of dimes says no amount of alcohol is safe during pregnancy:http://www.marchofdimes.com/pregnancy/alcohol_indepth.html The MOD position is based on the fact that there is no official line that has been proven to cross from safe to dangerous. Not because one drink can cause damage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatCyndiGirl Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 Years ago I used to smoke. I quit when I was pregnant with my first. Before anyone pats me on the back for that, I only stopped smoking b/c every one of them left me so nauseated that I would put it out. (Didn't know I was pg yet). I smoked off and on between each baby, outside, away from my kids. At the height of my smoking I smoked a pack a week, so never a heavy smoker. I do cringe when I see a pg woman smoking, but....I don't know what it is like to face an addiction like that THAT CAN IMPACT ANOTHER PERSON'S HEALTH SO BADLY and feel like I can't stop. I told my Dr. recently that I keep an unopened pack of cigarettes on my nightstand, in the drawer and sometimes when I have a really bad day I think, "I'm sooo gonna smoke when the kids are in bed tonight!" and, rarely, I get to a point where I go in and look at them. I just like that they are there. I don't like the taste anymore and I have asthma now so they would make me feel like crap. But,....for some odd reason I like their presence. My Dr. said to me, "If that is how you feel like you need to use cigarettes, I am in full support of that!" :tongue_smilie: I wouldn't have said anything to her. She likely feels like she has no control over the addiction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Georgiana Daniels Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 I wouldn't intend to say anything, but knowing me something would have popped out. I have self control issues when it comes to defending those who can't defend themselves. Is it my place to do so? Absolutely NOT, but sadly that has never stopped me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mommyfaithe Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 I would not have said anything...but I would have been the Dirty Look Quuen! :glare: YUCK!!! and STUPID. I am good at dirty looks....she would know just what I was thinking. Faithe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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