So, what would YOU think after reading this?

[milovany]

Here is a notice that was in last month's 4-H newsletter:

Riding Lessons

Lessons will be offered by {Name} for all County 4-H members. This is an opportunity for all members to receive riding lessons if interested. There will be openings for eight Novice/Junior members as well as openings for Intermediate/Senior members. There will be a $2.00 charge for arena rental.

 

So do you think this means you would need to bring your own horse? Or not? (I'm in the "or not" camp). To me it says, "4-H kids here's a fun opportunity for you! Horse lessons! Come on down!" We showed up today and felt rilly silly that we didn't have a horse on which to take these lessons (and they spoke to me with a sorta surprised voice that I didn't "get" that; when I called the 4-H office I got the same reply from two other ladies -- one gal even laughed).

 

I guess I'm just disappointed for my 14yo daughter who has loved horses since she was 2 and has yet to take lessons. :glare:

 

What say ye? Where did I miss it, or DO they need to re-word this?

[hornblower]

I'm with you - they need to re-word.

 

bummer for your dd.

 

(ETA - lessons on a school horse here run 25-45$ but I thought the low cost would have been a perk of belonging to 4H. )

Edited June 1, 2010 by hornblower

[TwinMominTX]

With a $2 rental charge as the only cost listed I would assume that it meant you were to bring your own horse. Sorry.

 

I am sorry for your daughter. If you lived close you could come and ride at my house any time - and I wouldn't even charge you to use the arena!!

[Parrothead]

You know if one has a horse, one normally doesn't need lessons in an arena, would they? Wouldn't one have lessons where the horse is?

 

Dd has had horse lessons from two different people in two different states and just two days ago got an offer for lessons here. Not at any time did I have to provide the horse. Each and every time the horses were owned by the instructor and they were specially trained to teach children how to ride.

[Country Mouse]

I would have assumed it meant that you show up and get a horse riding lesson, not that you bring your own horse since it doesn't say that.

They should re-word the notice!

[TwinMominTX]

You know if one has a horse, one normally doesn't need lessons in an arena, would they? Wouldn't one have lessons where the horse is?

 

Good quality regulation sized riding arenas can be extremely extremely expensive. I know 25+ families with horses that they keep on their own property, but do not have arenas or even really adequate places to ride.

 

Also, as you get into competition riding and showing, it is helpful for both the horse and the rider to get experience riding in different arenas.

[fivetails]

Here is a notice that was in last month's 4-H newsletter:

Riding Lessons

Lessons will be offered by {Name} for all County 4-H members. This is an opportunity for all members to receive riding lessons if interested. There will be openings for eight Novice/Junior members as well as openings for Intermediate/Senior members. There will be a $2.00 charge for arena rental.

 

So do you think this means you would need to bring your own horse? Or not? (I'm in the "or not" camp). To me it says, "4-H kids here's a fun opportunity for you! Horse lessons! Come on down!" We showed up today and felt rilly silly that we didn't have a horse on which to take these lessons (and they spoke to me with a sorta surprised voice that I didn't "get" that; when I called the 4-H office I got the same reply from two other ladies -- one gal even laughed).

 

I guess I'm just disappointed for my 14yo daughter who has loved horses since she was 2 and has yet to take lessons. :glare:

 

What say ye? Where did I miss it, or DO they need to re-word this?

 

I'd have thought the same as you! ( and I think it was quite rude of them to laugh at you)

 

Why in the world does it say "for all members" if it doesn't actually mean that?

[LibraryLover]

Oh, I am so sorry your girl was upset. :( "Arena Rental" and a mere "$ 2" would have tipped me off, but I can understand how Horse Talk is confusing. I still don't get all of it.

 

LL, not (yet) a horse owner.

[jubulibee]

I think they should have been more explicit in the posting. Perhaps someone with more experience with horses, lessons, and 4-H than I might be able to read between the lines, but I certainly would have been right there with you in the embarrassed camp!

[AudreyTN]

I would have thought that the horse would be provided.

[Laurie4b]

Does it really matter? I would have read it as you did, but because the price was so low would have called to find out what the scoop was. Most things that seem too-good-to-be-true are.

 

I think non-horse people will misread it and horse people will read it as intended and be incredulous that it could be read any other way.

[ChristusG]

They definitely need to add a "bring your own horse" in there.

[SproutMamaK]

Does it really matter? I would have read it as you did, but because the price was so low would have called to find out what the scoop was. Most things that seem too-good-to-be-true are.

 

I think non-horse people will misread it and horse people will read it as intended and be incredulous that it could be read any other way.

 

I agree. The notice certainly makes it sound like they'll be providing the horse. However, the cost is SO low that I'd have called ahead of time to confirm what was expected, etc. It would never have occurred to me that the thing missing from these horse riding lessons would be, uh, horses. ;) I might have thought it was someone who was just getting started in the field and wanted experience/references/training as an instructor, or something else- but not that the lessons didn't include horses. ;) I would have been okay with it, though - albeit angry that someone laughed at me for THEIR poor wording.

[Carrie12345]

I'm not a horsey person, but I'm related to one and I live in the land of hack-horse touristy places.

 

The price would have made me question the arrangement ($2 lesson plus "horse rental"?), but I wouldn't have guessed "Trailer your own horse to the location." The riders I do know board their horses and don't have their own trailers.

[milovany]

You know if one has a horse, one normally doesn't need lessons in an arena, would they?

 

 

That was my thought! And on top of that why would horse 4-H'ers need riding lessons (hopefully I didn't just kill a kitten, but the alternative was 4-Hers). Don't they already have a horse that they know how to ride? They're doing a horse project right?

[joannqn]

I would have thought the same thing you did. If we were to join 4-H we'd probably do cats, or something similar, because we don't have the space or money for a horse. But, my daughter loves horses and really wants one, so I would have jumped at the opportunity for her to take lessons especially for 4-H members. Not all 4-H members own their own horses after all.

[funschooler5]

I would have assumed that they'd be providing the horses. Don't people that own horses already know how to ride them?

 

The price wouldn't have tipped me off, because our local 4-H chapter has a lot of activities for members (and non-members) that are free or are very cheap.

[AudreyTN]

In regards to the price, I would have thought it was some kind of special 4H deal.

[Audrey]

Here is a notice that was in last month's 4-H newsletter:

 

Riding Lessons

Lessons will be offered by {Name} for all County 4-H members. This is an opportunity for all members to receive riding lessons if interested. There will be openings for eight Novice/Junior members as well as openings for Intermediate/Senior members. There will be a $2.00 charge for arena rental.

 

So do you think this means you would need to bring your own horse? Or not? (I'm in the "or not" camp). To me it says, "4-H kids here's a fun opportunity for you! Horse lessons! Come on down!" We showed up today and felt rilly silly that we didn't have a horse on which to take these lessons (and they spoke to me with a sorta surprised voice that I didn't "get" that; when I called the 4-H office I got the same reply from two other ladies -- one gal even laughed).

 

I guess I'm just disappointed for my 14yo daughter who has loved horses since she was 2 and has yet to take lessons. :glare:

 

What say ye? Where did I miss it, or DO they need to re-word this?

 

 

Sorry you were disappointed and no one should have laughed at you for it, but for a 4-H ad and considering they only wanted 2$, I would assume you bring your own horse.

[milovany]

In regards to the price, I would have thought it was some kind of special 4H deal.

 

NOTE about the cost -- it's low because it's at the county fairgrounds (which is half a block from our house, another reason I hoped it worked out!). 4H is a county thing, so the fee is just sort of nominal since they're both part of the same organization.

 

Thanks, I just wanted to know I wasn't cuh-razy. :D

[mcconnellboys]

There are horseless horse clubs here and riding lessons are regularly offered for kids who don't have their own horses.

[Jen500]

I'm not a horse person, but I would have assumed it was bring your own horse. Similar to dog training classes...I'd assume we'd bring our own dog. (That was my initial reaction, but after reading the op again I could see how it might be confusing)

[Audrey]

Don't people that own horses already know how to ride them?

 

 

 

A bunch of people have said this, so I'm not picking on you, but just quoting your post...

 

but no... just the fact of owning a horse does not mean you know how to ride properly, nor does it mean you know how to ride in various styles (English, Western, etc.) and it certainly doesn't mean you know all there is to know about riding. Most people who have horses could use some riding lessons and would appreciate the chance. There is WAY more to riding than just sitting on a horse and being able to make it go without falling off of it.

[Carrie12345]

 

... just the fact of owning a horse does not mean you know how to ride properly, nor does it mean you know how to ride in various styles (English, Western, etc.) and it certainly doesn't mean you know all there is to know about riding. Most people who have horses could use some riding lessons and would appreciate the chance. There is WAY more to riding than just sitting on a horse and being able to make it go without falling off of it.

 

Right. My aunt has been taking care of horses for more than 2 decades and has owned several in the past 15 years or so. She still takes lessons. And when she couldn't ride due to injury, her horse continued to take his own lessons with a trainer. :)

[LauraGB]

I'm sorry your dd was upset and disappointed, but I would have thought the same as you did. I mean, I grew up with horses, and honestly it never occurred to me to pay anyone for lessons; lessons were for people who didn't own them and wanted to learn because they loved them but couldn't keep them where they lived or some other circumstance. Even at $2 a lesson, if they provided 6-8 horses for those lessons, it would still be a $12-$16 an hour profit for the lesson giver. So, by reading the ad, I would have assumed the horses were provided.

[LauraGB]

... just the fact of owning a horse does not mean you know how to ride properly, nor does it mean you know how to ride in various styles (English, Western, etc.) and it certainly doesn't mean you know all there is to know about riding. Most people who have horses could use some riding lessons and would appreciate the chance. There is WAY more to riding than just sitting on a horse and being able to make it go without falling off of it.

 

This is true, but in this case, I would have brought someone to me, rather than taking a lesson elsewhere, where I had to transport my horse.

 

Even though this could easily be valid, I still feel the ad was poorly worded.

[TwinMominTX]

Even at $2 a lesson, if they provided 6-8 horses for those lessons, it would still be a $12-$16 an hour profit for the lesson giver.

 

How is that a $12-16 per hour profit by the lesson giver? The ad specified that there was space for 8 junior riders and 8 intermediate riders. That would be 16 horses that someone would have to provide.

[LauraGB]

How is that a $12-16 per hour profit by the lesson giver? The ad specified that there was space for 8 junior riders and 8 intermediate riders. That would be 16 horses that someone would have to provide.

 

Oh. In which case I would assume the facility had 16 rideable horses, and then my math would be entirely too conservative (or just plain wrong :001_smile:). So, instead of $12-$16, it would be up to $32.

 

ETA We have several ranches like this around here, so it doesn't seem odd to me that someone providing riding lessons has enough horses to accommodate such a thing.

[OnTheBrink]

I would have thought that the horse would be provided.

 

Me, too.

 

My dd takes riding lessons at an arena and they provide the horse. They also have an equestrian 4H club, and you don't have to own a horse to participate. And, dd's lessons are $20/hr.

[katemary63]

With a $2 rental charge as the only cost listed I would assume that it meant you were to bring your own horse. Sorry.

 

:iagree::iagree: Yeah, this is probably some really nice person volunteering their time to teach 4-hers. But honesly think about what they would have to be volunteering in order to provide horses for every one who showed up without one? It just doesn't make sense. We don't even have anyone who is willing to teach our 4-H kids lessons. We don't even have an arena to use. I am the leader of our county 4-H horse club and I pay $25/ hour for lessons for my DH. (Yeah, I know it's cheap, but this is AR.) Free lessons on a free horse is just something that would be too good to be true.

 

Sorry for your DH. I wish she lived near by, I'd give her free lessons on my horse. (I can teach beginners.) :001_smile:

[katemary63]

This is true, but in this case, I would have brought someone to me, rather than taking a lesson elsewhere, where I had to transport my horse.

 

Even though this could easily be valid, I still feel the ad was poorly worded.

 

The vast majority of those who take lessons on thier own horse either board their horse at the training barn or trailer their horse to the training barn. Riding instructors don't come to your home. We trailer our horses once a week to the training barn.

[AHASRADA]

Definitely poorly worded. "Horse people" would probably think the meaning was obvious, but it certainly wouldn't be to me.

 

I have never known anyone who owned their own horse, but any time I have seen horse lessons advertised, it most certainly included the horse.

 

True, I was surprised by the $2 price, but I also would have assumed this was somehow subsidized by 4-H or something. It would never occur to me that they expected people to have their own horse and bring it to the lesson.

 

Rather than saying "open to all 4-Hers", it should have said "open to all 4-Hers with access to a horse and trailer for transportation to lessons". I don't think that disclaimer would be unreasonable to expect.

[dirty ethel rackham]

I was surprised that they would expect you to transport your horse for lessons. The price was probably a give-away, but really. Wouldn't it be easier and less stressful to do lessons where the horses are. From what I understand, moving horses isn't like plopping a bike in the trunk.

[simka2]

As a 4-h leader I'm sorry you were treated this way!!! If it helps...I myself as a proffessional trainer/rider and competitor at the international level have been treated badly by the leadership of 4-h. It can be sorta a clicheish group at times and difficult to break in to ;(

 

The post is very vague and would be confusing to non-horsey people. That said...in 4-h most horse activities are done once you are enrolled in specific project. The horse project or the horseless horse project would probly be a great way to start.

 

Again, sorry you and your dd had to go thru this!!!

[ereks mom]

I would have assumed it meant that you show up and get a horse riding lesson, not that you bring your own horse since it doesn't say that.

They should re-word the notice!

 

:iagree:

[elegantlion]

I would have assumed it meant that you show up and get a horse riding lesson, not that you bring your own horse since it doesn't say that.

They should re-word the notice!

 

The price wouldn't have tipped me off, because our local 4-H chapter has a lot of activities for members (and non-members) that are free or are very cheap.

 

:iagree::iagree:

[Just Robyn]

I'm with you - they need to re-word.

 

bummer for your dd.

 

(ETA - lessons on a school horse here run 25-45$ but I thought the low cost would have been a perk of belonging to 4H. )

 

I think they should have been more explicit in the posting. Perhaps someone with more experience with horses, lessons, and 4-H than I might be able to read between the lines, but I certainly would have been right there with you in the embarrassed camp!

 

:iagree::iagree:

[Meriwether]

:iagree::iagree: Yeah, this is probably some really nice person volunteering their time to teach 4-hers. But honesly think about what they would have to be volunteering in order to provide horses for every one who showed up without one? It just doesn't make sense. We don't even have anyone who is willing to teach our 4-H kids lessons. We don't even have an arena to use. I am the leader of our county 4-H horse club and I pay $25/ hour for lessons for my DH. (Yeah, I know it's cheap, but this is AR.) Free lessons on a free horse is just something that would be too good to be true.

 

Sorry for your DH. I wish she lived near by, I'd give her free lessons on my horse. (I can teach beginners.) :001_smile:

 

 

I'm not disagreeing with you in particular, but I had a different experience with 4H projects. In our group, parent leaders taught all kinds of things. One parent, who owned a lumberyard, taught woodworking. We showed up for a lesson. He provided the materials for a very basic fee. One mother taught baking but provided everything needed at the lesson. No one did riding lessons, but if there had been interest, several of the dad's would have taught anyone in the club for free. If it had said anything except riding, I would have expected it to be a project like showing a steer or pig, etc. But, riding, I would have read it as a leader providing free lessons, horses provided.

[katemary63]

From what I understand, moving horses isn't like plopping a bike in the trunk.

 

Actually, it is. In under 15 minutes I can have my truck hooked up to the trailer, my horse loaded and be on my way to lessons. I do it every week. We also trailer just to go ride a different trail and then come home. Many, many people trailer their horses several times a week to shows and such.

[ThatCyndiGirl]

They really should add a

 

BYOH to the email.

[Remudamom]

It's the rare owner that can't benefit from lessons. I'd love to have someone dissect my riding and fuss at me from the center of an arena, and I've been riding/breaking/training for over forty years.

 

I don't do 4H, but I might have thought the price was a special fee just to cover.........something???? When I gave lessons I did it for my own enjoyment, provided the horses and charged just enough to buy a pizza for the kids the evenings I was teaching.

[Cindyg]

Riding Lessons[/b] Lessons will be offered by {Name} for all County 4-H members. This is an opportunity for all members to receive riding lessons if interested. There will be openings for eight Novice/Junior members as well as openings for Intermediate/Senior members. There will be a $2.00 charge for arena rental.

 

 

I would have assumed...

 

1. That the $2 arena charge was not the full cost of the lesson. I would have assumed the $2 was to rent the facility and that I would pay the instructor on top of that.

 

2. I would have assumed they were providing lesson horses. I would never assume I could just bring my own horse without very specific permission. I mean, if you bring a horse, you've got to bring a negative Coggins, etc., and there's no mention of that!

 

3. I would have called for more information and to reserve a spot. This ad doesn't tell me everything I need to know. Surely the topic of what to bring (helmets required?!) would come up in the conversation. And BYOH is pretty big!

 

Sorry for your daughter's disappointment.

 

ETA: Remudamom, this is the second time I've posted right under you this evening!

 

ETA2: Serious equestrians take lessons as often as they can afford to. It's not something you get too good for.

Edited June 2, 2010 by Cindyg

[KidsHappen]

Well, if I had never paid for lessons before I would have assumed the same as you but since I have paid $25 per hour for riding lessons (on their horse) the price would have clued me in to the fact that something wasn't quite right there. They should reword the ad to make it clearer though.

[LizzyBee]

The price wouldn't have tipped me off, because our local 4-H chapter has a lot of activities for members (and non-members) that are free or are very cheap.

 

:iagree: The last time my kids went to a 4-H horse thing, it was free or very cheap, and we didn't have to bring our own horse.

[NanceXToo]

Oh wow, I'm with you. When I hear "horseback riding lessons" I always just assume you show up and they bring out some gentle, tame horse for you to ride for a half hour or an hour or so and you go back home. I never in a million years would have thought I was supposed to own and bring my own horse to 4H horseback riding lessons!

 

If I paid attention to the arena fee thing at all, I would assume it was something the families were supposed to help absorb, that the 4H club or whoever needed to pay that to use that particular arena to give the lessons in or something.

 

And that certainly would have been embarrassing enough without someone laughing at you, how rude!

 

They definitely should reword.

[angela in ohio]

They really should add a

 

BYOH to the email.

 

:D

 

Yes, when you say "opportunity for all members," you make it seem like a horse is not needed. Not all members have horses.

[JFSinIL]

I would have assumed that there was a special arrangement to offer riding lessons at a very cheap rate to the 4-H kids. Since riding means horse - I would also have assumed a horse would be provided! Clarification that "you bring your own horse" should have been included.

 

I mean, if a studio offers piano lessons, they do not expect you to bring the piano to the studio, right?

[mommaduck]

Does it really matter? I would have read it as you did, but because the price was so low would have called to find out what the scoop was. Most things that seem too-good-to-be-true are.

 

I think non-horse people will misread it and horse people will read it as intended and be incredulous that it could be read any other way.

:iagree:

[NanceXToo]

I would have assumed that there was a special arrangement to offer riding lessons at a very cheap rate to the 4-H kids. Since riding means horse - I would also have assumed a horse would be provided! Clarification that "you bring your own horse" should have been included.

 

I mean, if a studio offers piano lessons, they do not expect you to bring the piano to the studio, right?

 

Yeah, really! Come to think of it, I just signed my daughter up for swimming lessons. Maybe I should call and ask them if I'm supposed to bring my own pool. Just to make sure! :lol:

[KS_]

There are horseless horse clubs here and riding lessons are regularly offered for kids who don't have their own horses.

 

My dd is in our local 4-H horse club and they provide the horses (she would *love* to have a horse, but we can't). So I would have thought the riding lessons were similar, especially with the wording that it was an opportunity for all members. They certainly can't expect that all 4-H members have their own horses.