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my student was busted. how much responsibility do I have?


daijobu
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I've been tutoring a young kid online for several months.  Not long after we started, they asked to push back the start time 15 minutes.  At the same time the student claimed she needed to leave early for a music lesson.  Like 15 minutes early.  She does this every week, unprompted by me.  I believed her.  

This week she was busted.  Within minutes of ending our tutoring session (15 minutes early) I get a call from the mom.  We resumed our call, and worked an additional 20 minutes together.  The student was clearly chagrined and much less animated.  

I sort of feel some responsibility for not checking with the parent.  But I have never had the experience of a student wanting to cut out early.  Usually I run late with my students and go over time.    

What options do you recommend for recovering this relationship, including do nothing?  The mom and I have not yet communicated with each other on this issue.  

Edited by daijobu
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I'd apologize to the parent and the student. Not because the student really deserves your apology, but because I've found that if I make it clear that I hold myself responsible for the misbehavior of a kid in my care, that usually has a bigger effect on their behavior than any other thing I can say or do.

But it's important not to overdo it. If it's too obvious you're manipulating them, then it doesn't work at all. If you can't find some way to sincerely say "This is my fault. I should've double checked with your mother after the first time. After all, I'm the adult, and this was my responsibility" then don't.

Edited by Tanaqui
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Were they paying for an hour session and only getting 45 min of actual tutoring?  Tutoring is not inexpensive…as a parent of a client, I would be mad at my kid for lying but I would be frustrated that my child had also not been receiving what was paid for without me being aware. Tutoring here starts at $1/min, so in the above scenario being shorted $15/session of work time repeatedly is eyebrow raising, iykwim.

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40 minutes ago, Tanaqui said:

I'd apologize to the parent and the student. Not because the student really deserves your apology, but because I've found that if I make it clear that I hold myself responsible for the misbehavior of a kid in my care, that usually has a bigger effect on their behavior than any other thing I can say or do.

But it's important not to overdo it. If it's too obvious you're manipulating them, then it doesn't work at all. If you can't find some way to sincerely say "This is my fault. I should've double checked with your mother after the first time. After all, I'm the adult, and this was my responsibility" then don't.

Respectfully, I really wouldn’t own the responsibility of a child who is seeking to shirk responsibility. It could be seen as “undoing” the parents’ effort. I would, no kidding, fire a tutor who said this to my child. If my child lied and was sneaky and I was holding them accountable and dealing with what was certainly something that needed to be corrected, I would not want an adult whom I had given authority stating to my child, “This was actually my fault.” I understand that you’re trying to create a trusting relationship with the child and mitigate the damage there, but I just want to emphasize, as the parent, I’d see through the manipulation and feel this isn’t a healthy way to respect the child/parent relationship. A broken or at least damaged and uncomfortable relationship is the natural consequence of being untrustworthy. The kid needs to feel uncomfortable. 
ETA: Be straight. Mom, I’m sorry, I’ve never run into this scenario before. I will clear any changes with you from here on out. 
 

Taking kiddo’s word for it isn’t grievous. It turned out to be an error. You learned from it. An apology is good but that’s all I’d expect and, frankly, I’d be mad at my kids, not the tutor. 

Edited by BlsdMama
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What does it say about me that I thought your student actually got busted by the cops?!  I was trying to figure out how that could be your fault. 
 

I’d apologize to the mom because you didn’t double check with her, but I’d keep it short and sweet and see if she takes any of the responsibility too. She didn’t notice her kid was done early every week?  
Sorry it happened to you- I’m sure you weren’t trying to cheat her.  But her kid was!

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1 hour ago, daijobu said:

I've been tutoring a young kid online for several months.  Not long after we started, they asked to push back the start time 15 minutes.  At the same time the student claimed she needed to leave early for a music lesson.  Like 15 minutes early. 

 

24 minutes ago, prairiewindmomma said:

Were they paying for an hour session and only getting 45 min of actual tutoring? 

That’s what confused me. Did the parents ask to start lessons 15mins later, in which case the tutoring session was short by 30mins or did the parents ask to start the lessons 15 mins earlier, in which case the child gets the promised duration?

Either way I would just do a simple apology for not checking with the parents since the child is young. If the child is older, like middle school age, I would have leave it be. 

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I'm in the do nothing camp. If my child is old enough to be working with you without my presence, then I expect they can handle the responsibility. The child has clearly broken the trust, but you have done nothing wrong, just followed the lead of the family. Resolution would be between me and my child.

As the parent I would not expect anything from you monetarily or time-wise.

Edited by SusanC
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BLSDmama, I don't think you actually understand the point.

When you say "This is my responsibility", those words make the child feel uncomfortable. As well they should! You are accepting your end of the burden - because, let's be serious, it IS the responsibility of the person in charge to double check stories like this - and reminding them that they have not, in fact, gotten away with anything.

Put yourself in this kid's shoes. How would you feel, quite honestly, if you lied to your mom or your teacher, and then your mother said "You know, this is my fault. I should not have just trusted your words"?

I'd feel uncomfortable to be confronted with the truth so baldly.

I don't care one whit about creating a trusting relationship with the child. They blew it. I care about making sure they know they blew it in the most uncomfortable way possible.

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As a parent, I'd be upset with my kid and would be irked that I had missed it, but I wouldn't assume it was the tutor's fault. There are plenty of people out there who would be willing to pay for an hour slot and only use 45 minutes.  I generally trust my kids, but I also check in on some things - ask how a class was going or what they talked about in a 1:1 meeting or check on their grades intermittently.  You never know what kind of response you will get if you do contact a parent - it could be a thanks for letting me know, or it could be a 'how dare you not trust my kid'...she says, speaking from experience, and it's reasonable to assume that the parent is keeping up with what is going on or knows whether their kid needs monitoring and will contact you if there is an issue. If a generic 'I'm sorry this situation happened' would make you feel better, that's fine, but I wouldn't offer anything financial or time-wise - you were available for what they paid for and it's not your fault that that the kid ended the sessions.  

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I've done a fair amount of tutoring and caught co-op classes.  I have run into similar problems.  Sometimes kids don't report things accurately.  I don't even think they necessarily always do it on purpose.

 I have gotten into a habit of doing a follow up email every week with parent and student copied with a bulleted list.  I also encouraged parents to follow up with me between sessions if there are any questions

  • We discussed changing start time to 1:15 to accommodate Suzie's schedule
  • We went through Chapter 3 section 1 on polynomials
    • Here is more information on random website ... link here
  • This week Suzie will work on the odd problems in Chapter 3 section 1 and bring those back next week.  

I might put questions in for the parent or report that we had to repeat a lesson because the student came unprepared.

You may want to consider doing something like this.  I know at least the engaged parents REALLY appreciated not having to rely 100% on their kid for accurate information and if their kid came home and said something like "I don't have homework this week! Awesome!" the parent could follow up.  I also want parents to know that if their kid isn't doing their homework and following up, there is just not a whole lot I can do about that.  Successful tutoring is a 2 way street.  I do think if parents don't have info, it is easy for them to assume all is going well.

Anyway, obviously you know the situation best and YMMV.  I would just maybe think about how you want to structure any policies if you are thinking tutoring/teaching may be a regular gig for you.  I had written policies I'd give new classes or new students I was tutoring up front so there wouldn't be surprises.  

Edited by FuzzyCatz
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Answer this: Do I charge extra for going 15 minutes extra?  Do you also charge for 15 minutes less? 

if you anwer no to both - let it go. Or if the answer is yes to both - let it go?  but.....

FYI - I would ALWAYS rather believe people rather than doubt them. Don't beat yourself up. I have been totally duped by kids. 

 

 

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To me, it's a money issue.  If they pay you for X amount of time then you needed to provide X amount of tutoring.  If that changed, then I would have contacted the parent and worked out a new arrangement for Y amount of time (thereby telling the parent at the same time that the student was leaving early.).  If you were receiving money that you didn't work for, I would offer a refund. 

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27 minutes ago, SusanC said:

I'm in the do nothing camp. If my child is old enough to be working with you without my presence, then I expect they can handle the responsibility. The child has clearly broken the trust, but you have done nothing wrong, just followed the lead of the family. Resolution would be between me and my child.

As the parent I would not expect anything from you monetarily or time-wise.

Same. In fact as a parent of one child who I can envision maybe attempting such a stunt, I would be mortified at my kid. 
As a tutor, I would be on high alert for shenanigans forever more 🤣

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If it were me, I would just text the mom that I had not been aware of what was going on and that the student has been asking you to push back the start time by 15 minutes and leaving the lesson 15 minutes early and that they have been effectively receiving only 30 minutes of instruction for which I apologize for not checking with the parent if it was acceptable or not. And then I might state that all future shifts to start and end time should be requested by the student with a cc (or group text) to the mother to avoid this situation repeating.

It is not the tutor's fault that the kid decided to do this. But, if I were the tutor, I would have complained to the parent about the student missing and said that it was disrupting my lesson plans and asked for rescheduling of the lesson to a more convenient day for everyone 😉 I have witnessed situations like this a lot - where the kid is busy playing electronic games, is on social media or discord and vanishes with a "BRB ..." and never shows up for the rest of the session. I am more suspicious than you are, @daijobu!

 

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7 minutes ago, Jean in Newcastle said:

To me, it's a money issue.  If they pay you for X amount of time then you needed to provide X amount of tutoring.  If that changed, then I would have contacted the parent and worked out a new arrangement for Y amount of time (thereby telling the parent at the same time that the student was leaving early.).  If you were receiving money that you didn't work for, I would offer a refund. 

The OP did not deny services. The customer (in this case, the student) refused to take up the services and decided to cut class. I don't think that a refund is necessary. But, offering one is a friendly gesture. And the OP is a busy tutor as well who might not have so many 15 minute vacant time slots for makeup lessons for no fault of theirs - the makeup policies that I have seen always say that the teacher is not responsible for forfeited lesson time.

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33 minutes ago, Catwoman said:

 

If anyone is to blame here, it’s the mom for never bothering to check up on what her kid was doing. 

Coming at it from the other side, as a mom i too would blame myself. But you know in some situations we are hiring tutors for most subjects because of work or whatever. My order of “blame” would be my kid, myself, and then I’d passingly wonder how naive this tutor was not realizing kid was playing gamesBut after kid1, I was also super naive. My eyes have been opened lol. OP, I would tell the mom exactly how long this has been going on. Just so she knows what’s she’s dealing with.

Edited by madteaparty
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1 hour ago, daijobu said:

I've been tutoring a young kid online for several months.  Not long after we started, they asked to push back the start time 15 minutes.  At the same time the student claimed she needed to leave early for a music lesson.  Like 15 minutes early.  She does this every week, unprompted by me.  I believed her.  

This week she was busted.  Within minutes of ending our tutoring session (15 minutes early) I get a call from the mom.  We resumed our call, and worked an additional 20 minutes together.  The student was clearly chagrined and much less animated.  

I sort of feel some responsibility for not checking with the parent.  But I have never had the experience of a student wanting to cut out early.  Usually I run late with my students and go over time.    

What options do you recommend for recovering this relationship, including do nothing?  The mom and I have not yet communicated with each other on this issue.  

As the parent of a kid who gets tutoring, I think you should have double checked with the parent. If nothing else to say, "would you like to change the time, since student is coming late and leaving early each day?". Cutting tutoring short on both ends seems suspicious to me, especially if you only heard about it from the student. I get a short text every few sessions on my daughters progress or to ask me questions. If it involves longer communication, I get an email. Any skipped sessions, I get a text relaying that information to me. (I am not home during tutoring sessions.)

I wouldn't apologize to the student, but I would casually apologize to the parent. Be honest and let them know that you haven't had the experience before.  I would say something like: "Sorry I didn't check with you.  It didn't occur to me that the student wasn't being fully honest." Ask the parent what they would like to do about moving forward as far as communication. On one had, offering a few make up sessions would be generous on your part, but I also hate to turn tutoring into a punishment. If you do this, make it a couple sessions and let that be the end of it. Do not add time to each session to make up time! As a parent who wants my student to engage with tutoring, I would not want my student to feel punished every week, by something that happened months ago.  I would expect changes going forward, now that both the parent and tutor know the student may try to skip out of tutoring. Absolutely, do not let the parent put you in a position of enforcing a punishment (even if it is just adding time). That is a parenting issue, not a tutoring issue. 

To the student, I would simply say that you will now will be having more regular communication with the parent, which will include the hours they attend and participate in the session. I would encourage them to utilize the full time offered but what they get out of tutoring is up to them. I might ask the student if there was something that would make the student feel more engaged....And then move on. Seriously, unless the student engages with more effective tools, this conversation would only last about a minute or two. 

Showing any emotion that my daughter would perceive as emotional weakness, like apologizing to her, would get you eaten alive by her every whim.  I have seen teachers, tutors and therapists try every trick with her. If student was my 15yo daughter, she would need more accountability, tempered with kindness and forgiveness. Then for the events to be forgotten and for time to move on. 

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9 minutes ago, mathnerd said:

The OP did not deny services. The customer (in this case, the student) refused to take up the services and decided to cut class. I don't think that a refund is necessary. But, offering one is a friendly gesture. And the OP is a busy tutor as well who might not have so many 15 minute vacant time slots for makeup lessons for no fault of theirs - the makeup policies that I have seen always say that the teacher is not responsible for forfeited lesson time.

That is not how I ran my tutoring business.  It's an ethical issue for me.  YMMV. 

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How young is the kid?  Does the mom not regularly check in with you?  Here if the kid is young, the tutors often either email or chat with the parents once a week.  
 

This kid reminds me of the young girl who filmed herself and would put it on during zoom lessons she didn’t like or found boring or use the footage to make it look like it froze. They had to wear uniforms so the teacher didn’t notice right away. 

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I never alert the parents if a kid is late or leaves early for a particular session, coming late and leaving early every session? Absolutely I would ask the parents if there were a better time. 

I would offer some make-up time, in whatever way is most convenient for me (extra 15 minutes here and there, or extra hours, whatever worked for me). Not necessarily the whole amount, but a significant amount. 

The parent would get an I'm-sorry-I-didn't-suspect apology. 

Edited to add that I mostly tutor teens, and I see you said 'young kid.' The younger they are, the quicker I would check with the parents. 

Edited by katilac
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As a parent of kids who will/do/have used every trick in the book to try to get one over on ME, and I have both fallen for it and willingly capitulated, there would be a part of me that was irked with the tutor, but only as an attempt to deflect my feelings about my own responsibility and my child’s deviance. I wouldn’t truly blame the tutor, I’d just wish they’d given me a heads up sooner, as a courtesy.

Ultimately, though with some leeway depending on age, it’s the kid’s fault. I’ve put my kids in others’ care for various academic and enrichment purposes, and I’ve expected those services to be provided, but I wouldn’t (and haven’t) held them responsible if my child didn’t participate as expected.

As a co-op teacher, I have reached out to parents when their child wasn’t meeting expectations as an overall trend, and I do think it’s wise to do that, even if only as a CYA precaution. I think it would have been a good idea to reach out and ask about finding a schedule that would work better for that student’s “conflicts”. 
Good ideas can backfire, though. I’ve definitely had parents who did not appreciate having things brought up, either because they didn’t want to be bothered or because they would get offended if I questioned the legitimacy of their child’s repeated tardiness. So you can’t win!

Written and signed policies are the best way to go. Student-signed, too.

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8 hours ago, Annie G said:

What does it say about me that I thought your student actually got busted by the cops?!  I was trying to figure out how that could be your fault. 
 

I’d apologize to the mom because you didn’t double check with her, but I’d keep it short and sweet and see if she takes any of the responsibility too. She didn’t notice her kid was done early every week?  
Sorry it happened to you- I’m sure you weren’t trying to cheat her.  But her kid was!

Ooooh! Me too! Until I read your post, I still thought that. I thought leaving 15 minutes early was part of the deception, not all of the deception! 

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I'm also wondering if the parents were paying for 30 min more than they got. I would offer to the mom to do some free sessions to make up the time. I would not own this for the sake of the kid. They manipulated you and their parents and got caught. I would definitely make it right financially with the parents. 

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I think I'd send a follow-up email or text, however you communicate with the family, (to the parents) and just summarize/verify the info going forward. Something like this:
 

Hi (Mom), 

Just to confirm the details of our conversation earlier - going forward, Susy will begin tutoring at (insert here the time + 15 mins that Susy had asked for previously and you've been doing), and will end at the newly agreed upon time of (original time, not the 15 mins early stop time that Susy has been lying about), for a total instruction time of (x minutes) per session, at the fee of (whatever amount you charge). Is that all correct?

As I (have or have not) been charging based on actual time served, I will now (either a, be charging more to accommodate the newly re-lengthened amount of time, or b, apply a credit of x amount to equal the minutes/time that Susy has not been getting instruction when she should have been, since I did not verify that time change with you before making that change). 

If I have any of this wrong still, please let me know, and rest assured I will verify all changes with you going forward rather than take Susy at her word. Thanks,

Me

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I was so hoping for a Breaking Bad episode. She was tutoring in Chemistry, told the student how to perform the labs with ordinary household objects and stuff purchased at Walmart, and the student used those skills for illicit purposes but was taken down in a sting and told the police "It's my tutor's fault. If she wouldn't have been so good, I never would have done it."

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I have been a tutor, and hired tutors for my kid.

Part of my answer depends on what you mean by "young".  I would respond differently to a 5 year old, and a 15 year old.  

I like to think that after a couple sessions, when it seemed like a pattern, I'd ask the parent how they wanted to handle the fact that they weren't getting what they paid for.  But I can also see letting that slip and the shortened sessions piling up.  Because of that, I'd probably feel guilty and offer to add a little onto the sessions, if that was an option time wise.  

If I was the parent, I'd want some kind of logical consequence for my kid.  If they were older, I might have them pay me for the time missed.  If they were younger, I'd ask you for some boring make up work, to bring home the idea that it's more fun to work with a tutor than on your own.  I wouldn't be mad at you, I'd be mad at my kid. 

Can you just call the parents and apologize, and see how they're feeling?

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I see this as primarily between the parent and the child. In the future I would seek confirmation from the parent if the child says a class time needs to be changed or shortened.

I don't see a need to apologise.

Edited by maize
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The elementary age girl was just so delightful, it was really shocking to me that she would do this.  She was enthusiastic during our meetings and actively participated in solving math problems.  But also...she was my last student late in the day, and when she cut out early I was happy for the extra time.  So I felt guilty about that, like I should have made an extra effort to contact the parents but didn't because I was I was lazy.  So I offered 2 hours free (approximately the time they paid for but I didn't spend with their student).  The mom says her daughter was nervous about being on time to her music lesson, which it turns out was a real music lesson, but maybe not so critical time-wise that she legitimately needed to end early.  

I need those Breaking Bad students who can make that sweet blue crystal meth.  Or at least be able to sell an unsliced pizza and "pass the savings on to you."  

 

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