So my MIL announced that she’s flying in for a two week week visit- need advice

[Paige]

I didn't read it all but we have a similar dynamic. It drives me crazy but honestly, I would and do suck it up and try to be nice. Yes, she should have asked, but if she's like my family members, they don't feel they need an invitation to visit their children. Telling them to ask or to get a hotel would be highly insulting unless you had a really good reason that wasn't we want to sleep in and lay around in our pjs all day. 

Yes, 2 weeks is a long time, but if it's only once or twice every year or two? I'd be counting my blessings. 

I'd tell my kids to be nice. I'd tell them not to argue with Grandma- Nod and smile! We practice nodding and smiling. 

House guests make me and some of my kids anxious but they are inevitable for us because we choose to live far away. For other people in my family, house guests are invigorating and exciting! It's not the event that is the problem, it's our feelings and we can work on building patience and tolerance. Then come here and vent! 

[Halftime Hope]

20 minutes ago, Garga said:

 We’re just that little bit too different.  

 

And this is part of what I'm addressing.  While "we" wouldn't do x, or y, or z, maybe it was in the MIL's family or culture that x or y or z was normal.  Shoot, my uncle and his wife had my parents in from overseas when I was a child, and back in that day, in their world, the best way to be wonderful hosts was to give your guests the master bedroom.  (There were four other bedrooms, one with a queen, and several with two twins, all of them available.)  Go figure.  I would never roust dh out of his bed, but that was normal for my uncle.  

Also, when I was a child, my parents (and two kids) stayed for a month or several months at a time with family members, again because they were in from overseas traveling for 10-12 months.  What if my relatives had said, "Four days is my limit."  

It depends on what is normal for the family, what the MIL can afford, and the lines they draw for themselves.  I think the hardest part here is that MIL didn't ask, she told.  In my experience, that's usually a behavior that happens when there is fear involved. (I'll make the plans, because I'm afraid if I ask, they'll say no.) Fear usually leads to worse behavior, so if this relationship is worth having, the son and OP need to set some guidelines, lovingly, but first try to understand the MIL.  

And one more thing:  as elders age, all bets are off on their behavior.  Sigh.   

 

[gardenmom5]

1 hour ago, PeterPan said:

See that for me is so foreign. I wouldn't want my kids contradicting their grandparents. If there are known things that bug the grandparent (like a really brief list), then I'd just do the things their way and tell the kids to get over it. And I'd find some way to make it super awesome, like they comply and there are DONUTS in their rooms, lol. 

But I'm the same person who would tell her to get a hotel. I'm just saying if you let her in your home, the kids should be respectful and that that wouldn't quite be there for me. No adult wants to be constantly contradicted.

On the other hand, it's really good self-advocacy. Maybe tell MIL you have a new rule (make up something) that over X age they set their own rules for xyz? Like really blow her mind. That way she knows right off the bat over this age, she can't tell them to do anything. 

Yeah that's awkward. There's self-advocacy and there's rudeness. Self-advocacy is good, and needing to do it too much is awkward.

tbh: it really depends upon the grandparent.   some respect their kids have different rules for their children and go with the flow . . and requests are reasonable.

my mil . . . my kids grew up "contradicting her".   nothing new - her own children grew up contradicting her.  it was all about self-advocacy.  she's nuts and frequently engages in inappropriate behavior. . . . the day I left my tween sons with her for an opportunity to get to know them . . . she gave them each $100, and dropped them off at the local university. (in a strange city and state)  that was before cell phones, we found out when we got back to her house.  at least 1ds figured out how to get back to her house.   they loved the money.   and she bribed them to get (the WORST EVER) haircuts.   yeah - more money.  at least their hair grew back before school started.  they made so much money from her bribes - they pooled it and bought a computer

[PeterPan]

13 minutes ago, gardenmom5 said:

tbh: it really depends upon the grandparent.   some respect their kids have different rules for their children and go with the flow . . and requests are reasonable.

my mil . . . my kids grew up "contradicting her".   nothing new - her own children grew up contradicting her.  it was all about self-advocacy.  she's nuts and frequently engages in inappropriate behavior. . . . the day I left my tween sons with her for an opportunity to get to know them . . . she gave them each $100, and dropped them off at the local university. (in a strange city and state)  that was before cell phones, we found out when we got back to her house.  at least 1ds figured out how to get back to her house.   they loved the money.   and she bribed them to get (the WORST EVER) haircuts.   yeah - more money.  at least their hair grew back before school started.  they made so much money from her bribes - they pooled it and bought a computer

Is it ok to laugh at that? Pretty wow! And I thought *I* had a libertine grandma, lol. She only let us drive the car and eat all the bacon and cereal we wanted. 

[PeterPan]

9 minutes ago, Seasider too said:

I think you should let her know the timing is not good for your nuclear family, and work together to decide on a better time. 

The op could check to see whether the airline she uses could change the tickets. If she happens to fly Southwest, she could easily change.

[kbutton]

23 minutes ago, Halftime Hope said:

I think the hardest part here is that MIL didn't ask, she told.  In my experience, that's usually a behavior that happens when there is fear involved. (I'll make the plans, because I'm afraid if I ask, they'll say no.) Fear usually leads to worse behavior, so if this relationship is worth having, the son and OP need to set some guidelines, lovingly, but first try to understand the MIL.  

I used to think that about my MIL, but my DH didn't want to address the very good reasons she was being told no* so that she could change. And frankly, there is zero evidence that she would have or will change--she takes everything as a Yes to her opinion, her outlook, her actions, etc. She's very "Pollyanna" to the point of living in denial about all kinds of things that are real. My MIL doesn't understand much about herself or her behavior, but she thinks she does. She talks out two sides of her mouth, at best. She came from a family that was high drama (only recently learned this via my FIL before he passed away), she is not NT (but plays this to her advantage vs. seeing areas where she could use a second opinion before doing something ridiculous, rude, etc.), and she really just kind of makes up her own version of reality while trying to act like she's just "too old" or "too x" to be compatible with the way the world is going. This complaint is really more of a shiny badge of honor for her, and it reinforces her rigidity and strangeness. 

She is also unable to be nice to me for more than 23-25 hours. Usually at hour 23, everything goes downhill. 

*which include...putting my kids in mortal danger multiple, multiple times even when relatively supervised (like I'm getting showered and dressed for 15 minutes)....saying she wanted things x way/blatantly doing something different/getting all teary about how her feelings were hurt...manipulating my kids...the list goes on and on 

[katilac]

1 hour ago, PeterPan said:

See that for me is so foreign. I wouldn't want my kids contradicting their grandparents. If there are known things that bug the grandparent (like a really brief list), then I'd just do the things their way and tell the kids to get over it.  

 

And to regard a polite explanation as being contradictory is foreign to me! I'm fine with making some accommodations. I'm relaxed about language at home but my kids didn't cuss in front of certain grandparents (and I did my best 😋). We go to restaurants that they like and plan activities that they like. But kids staying in their jammies and creating elaborate play scenes isn't doing grandma any harm, and I would not require them to give it up just because she doesn't regard it as the done thing. Bonus, the kids don't dread grandma's visits! 

 

[MEmama]

We finally--after 24 years of marriage--got rid of our guest room.

Last year there was a final straw with MIL, and now we have a home gym instead of a room that goes unused for 51 weeks a year. Win-win. The allergy inducing kitty is just the icing on the cake. :)

Good luck, OP. I'm at the point in my life where I have said nope, doesn't work for us, and offered no reasons or excuses. Offering up a list of nearby hotels would be more than generous, but only with the expectation that she doesn't get to take over your break. 

[moonflower]

1 hour ago, PeterPan said:

See that for me is so foreign. I wouldn't want my kids contradicting their grandparents. If there are known things that bug the grandparent (like a really brief list), then I'd just do the things their way and tell the kids to get over it. And I'd find some way to make it super awesome, like they comply and there are DONUTS in their rooms, lol. 

But I'm the same person who would tell her to get a hotel. I'm just saying if you let her in your home, the kids should be respectful and that that wouldn't quite be there for me. No adult wants to be constantly contradicted.

On the other hand, it's really good self-advocacy. Maybe tell MIL you have a new rule (make up something) that over X age they set their own rules for xyz? Like really blow her mind. That way she knows right off the bat over this age, she can't tell them to do anything. 

Yeah that's awkward. There's self-advocacy and there's rudeness. Self-advocacy is good, and needing to do it too much is awkward.

 

An adult doesn't want to be constantly contradicted, true - but also shouldn't be constantly giving direction to someone else's kids.

[BeachGal]

8 hours ago, East Coast Sue said:

My MIL lives across the country from us and usually tries to visit every year or two. Well, she emailed thats she’s flying in for a visit the last two weeks of December.  My youngest two will be excited she’s coming but the older two kids don’t enjoy her visits. She tends to assume a parenting role and tells the kids what to do. My kids just want to relax and sleep over the holiday break from school. They only get a week off so she’ll be here even during the week of school before break begins. I need your wisdom and encouragement so I can improve my very negative attitude.  I feel like this birthday/Christmas will be awful and I just want to cry. 

 

ETA- it’s a two week visit

 

Would she be willing to go do special activities or grab lunch with the youngest two? That way, she could spend time with at least two of the grandkids, who would enjoy it, and you'd get her out of the house. The change in scenery might be good for her disposition, too.

Or, if she likes doing puzzles or a hobby/craft, maybe get her a puzzle or whatever it is she likes to do. My kids liked asking my MIL about her life growing up overseas and she loved telling them about it. Possibly something like that. Something to occupy her. If I were in your shoes, I'd even seriously consider gifting her with something like a manicure or some local gift cards so she could get out and indulge a bit.

I agree with others that if your older kids want to relax and sleep, then let them. It's also primarily your husband's job to talk about this with his mother, IMO.

[Mbelle]

8 hours ago, East Coast Sue said:

My MIL lives across the country from us and usually tries to visit every year or two. Well, she emailed thats she’s flying in for a visit the last two weeks of December.  My youngest two will be excited she’s coming but the older two kids don’t enjoy her visits. She tends to assume a parenting role and tells the kids what to do. My kids just want to relax and sleep over the holiday break from school. They only get a week off so she’ll be here even during the week of school before break begins. I need your wisdom and encouragement so I can improve my very negative attitude.  I feel like this birthday/Christmas will be awful and I just want to cry. 

 

ETA- it’s a two week visit

I think the announcing her visit without discussion is not polite nor respectful.  I would discuss this.  Preferably your dh would discuss this, but some personalities freeze up with just a plain old discussion.  Just a simple comment "hey Mom I know you want to see us and we love that, but in the future it's going to be best for us to discuss visiting dates ahead of time.  It makes us feel xyz when you don't do that"  

I would also discuss the over parenting the kids.  Again it's better if your dh does this but he may not be able too and may not see "the big deal" and just want to "put up with it while she's here".  I don't know, but if he can't do it, then you do it.

Really what is at stake here is a relationship with her and her with you.  Do you want to love her and have a relationship with her?   Your kids may avoid her once they get to be 18 if this doesn't change.  How do you and dh feel about y'all's and your kids relationship with her going forward?  If you want to have one, then these discussions need to be had with love in mind.  I feel like we need to be able to get along at least 80% with extended family for trips to work and then shrug off the rest . 

 

[Shoeless]

2 hours ago, PeterPan said:

See that for me is so foreign. I wouldn't want my kids contradicting their grandparents. If there are known things that bug the grandparent (like a really brief list), then I'd just do the things their way and tell the kids to get over it. And I'd find some way to make it super awesome, like they comply and there are DONUTS in their rooms, lol. 

But I'm the same person who would tell her to get a hotel. I'm just saying if you let her in your home, the kids should be respectful and that that wouldn't quite be there for me. No adult wants to be constantly contradicted.

On the other hand, it's really good self-advocacy. Maybe tell MIL you have a new rule (make up something) that over X age they set their own rules for xyz? Like really blow her mind. That way she knows right off the bat over this age, she can't tell them to do anything. 

Yeah that's awkward. There's self-advocacy and there's rudeness. Self-advocacy is good, and needing to do it too much is awkward.

It depends on whether the grandparents are making reasonable requests or are being busybodies.  Sometimes grandma and grandpa need to mind their own business. 

[Shoeless]

1 hour ago, MEmama said:

We finally--after 24 years of marriage--got rid of our guest room.

Last year there was a final straw with MIL, and now we have a home gym instead of a room that goes unused for 51 weeks a year. Win-win. The allergy inducing kitty is just the icing on the cake. 🙂

Good luck, OP. I'm at the point in my life where I have said nope, doesn't work for us, and offered no reasons or excuses. Offering up a list of nearby hotels would be more than generous, but only with the expectation that she doesn't get to take over your break. 

We specifically do not have a guest room because all of our out-of-town/state relatives are awful and one would semi-move in.  This relative has a habit of leaving a bunch of stuff behind at houses they stay at, and then later says "Oh I have a room at so-and-so's, so I can stay there any time I want".  Not happening here!   

It's very telling that all of my tricky out-of-town relatives have a LOT of feelings about the fact that we lack a guest room.  Lots of opinions about how we could get a convertible sofa and make it into a guest room.  No thanks!    

[Tanaqui]

To everybody saying "What if she's not toxic", I have to ask - exactly what sort of relationships do you have that have conditioned you to think there is anything at all okay about somebody suddenly and unexpectedly deciding to invite herself to your home for two weeks and then boss around your children once she's there?

The OP has posted that this impending visit makes her want to "cry". These details are enough for me to get a picture, and that picture isn't of a kind, respectful, or loving Grandma.

[Farrar]

My in-laws used to do this. It was pre-kids and it drove me nuts. They were even thinking of buying a place down here and never asked us - they just started looking at retirement communities. I was like, dh, we have to nip this in the bud. I don't mind that they visit and I might even be happy for them to be nearby once we have kids, but they need to stop just announcing and ask and coordinate instead. So we sat them down and told them to stop doing it. We were SO gentle about it. And they got all quiet, didn't speak to us for months, and didn't visit for like... I don't know... it was a long time. More than a year, that's for sure. Whatever. Have I mentioned that I love my weird in-laws? I know they think I'm weird but love me too.

My mother does the thing with the ordering about sometimes and gets really prickly when my kids correct her about things. Oyvay. It's not helping her relationship with the kids. Like, mom, just stop it. You're not in charge of them. They're good kids. Let it all go.

[Halftime Hope]

28 minutes ago, Tanaqui said:

1) To everybody saying "What if she's not toxic", I have to ask - exactly what sort of relationships do you have that have conditioned you to think there is anything at all okay about somebody suddenly and unexpectedly deciding to invite herself to your home for two weeks and then boss around your children once she's there?

2) The OP has posted that this impending visit makes her want to "cry". These details are enough for me to get a picture, and that picture isn't of a kind, respectful, or loving Grandma.

1) Straw man.   None of us said it's OK; we said it might or might not bother people depending on their FOO or culture. Clearly it bothers the OP; so many of us said it might--depending on the MIL--be actionable, leading to a better relationship.  We don't know.  

2) Some of us use hyperbole to express emotion.  You may not, and you might be part Vulcan.😉 Often when venting, people express things strongly as catharsis and then swing back to center, allowing logic or differing perspective to moderate their initial knee-jerk reaction.  

It's my hope that a variety of opinions, ideas, and strategies might help the OP sort out if there is anything salvageable vs. throwing the baby out with the bathwater. 

From the mother-in-law's perspective: learning to moderate ones own plans, to consult, and not to just go off and act is actually a step back from what had been normal for an adult raising her children. Some of us transition into having adult children with more grace than others do, and I think it's a lot harder when the older parents live far away from and have no visibility to the younger generation.  How else would they observe and naturally learn that the young family is functional, capable and healthy, all while doing things differently than dear old mum and dad did?

[shawthorne44]

3 hours ago, PeterPan said:

Is it ok to laugh at that? Pretty wow! And I thought *I* had a libertine grandma, lol. She only let us drive the car and eat all the bacon and cereal we wanted. 

 

See that is how I think Grandparents should behave.  My parents and I even joke that Doritos is the 'Breakfast of Champions', because that is what DD eats when visiting them.   But, paying grandkids $100 each to go away (basically), that has crossed over into bat-poo crazy.   

[Slache]

20 minutes ago, shawthorne44 said:

See that is how I think Grandparents should behave.  My parents and I even joke that Doritos is the 'Breakfast of Champions', because that is what DD eats when visiting them.   But, paying grandkids $100 each to go away (basically), that has crossed over into bat-poo crazy.   

I agree that grandparents can spoil but for some of us it can be too much. If I make a specific request (no R rated movies, no candy after dinner because they don't sleep) I am told "I'm the grandma I can do what I want." Spoiling and going against the parents wishes are not the same thing.

[gardenmom5]

1 hour ago, shawthorne44 said:

 

See that is how I think Grandparents should behave.  My parents and I even joke that Doritos is the 'Breakfast of Champions', because that is what DD eats when visiting them.   But, paying grandkids $100 each to go away (basically), that has crossed over into bat-poo crazy.   

 

no, not even close.   proving just how bat-guano crazy she is - she was living with us when 1dd was a baby.  (nightmare central.)  dh and I took baby, and went away for a week.  we came back a day early . . . . . . . . she came running outside, YELLING, we weren't supposed to be back yet.  um . . . . . . .she decided she wanted to "deep clean" (brand new house).   my bedroom.   the bed, night tables, lamps, dressers .. . iow: e.v.e.r.y.t.h.i.n.g. . . . . had been removed from our bedroom - and was in the living room.  (I take it back - the mattress was leaning against the closet doors) . . .

I have many more stories about what a fruitcake this woman is .

 

eta:  the next time dh and I went away for a couple days - we locked our door. . . . when we came home, she told us if we didn't want her to go in our room, we could have just told her.  and yes, it was unlocked.  but at least everything was still inside.

Edited December 11, 2018 by gardenmom5

[Melissa in Australia]

for many years my MIL came for a month long visit. She came from Canada- half way around the world . We managed to make it work. eventually she got too old to travel 

[Tanaqui]

Halftime Hope, if you think that being an older woman who has trouble adjusting to your child's adulthood means that you forget that it is never okay, barring sudden emergencies, to just invite yourself to stay over at somebody else's house for an extended period of time then... well, I don't even know what to say about that, but this lady needs a serious lesson in manners. She needed one several decades ago, sounds like. I don't care who this person is in relation to you, it's never okay to invite yourself over to stay at another person's house for even one night, much less fourteen of them! And it is perfectly reasonable, no matter who it is, to say "We can't do this on such short notice, you'll have to stay in a hotel, next time ask first." If that's going to destroy the relationship then it wasn't much of a relationship to begin with.

Also, I'm guessing her child has been an adult for at least one decade by now. If she hasn't gotten with the program then it sounds like she's awful, her ideas about family are awful, and I'm back to asking what all the rest of you have gone through to make you think that it potentially isn't. People are saying "Well, I'm assuming she isn't generally toxic and unreasonable" and you yourself suggested she might "normally be respectful" of the OP's wishes. People who suddenly spring a two week visit on you can be assumed to be unreasonable and disrespectful and are quite frequently very toxic.

You talk about what the OP is teaching her children with regards to how to treat their parents when they're grown. How about what the OP is teaching her children with regards to how they should expect to be treated?

Edited December 11, 2018 by Tanaqui

[gardenmom5]

1 hour ago, Tanaqui said:

You talk about what the OP is teaching her children with regards to how to treat their parents when they're grown. How about what the OP is teaching her children with regards to how they should expect to be treated?

This.

I think people who haven't deal with an overbearing grandparent who ran roughshod all over their parent and then starts on the next generation -and the parent NEVER stood up to them (and never protected their children from them) - may not understand - it teaches the grandchildren they can't/aren't-allowed-to stand up for themselves, with anyone.  that there is no expectation of being treated with respect by those closest to them. that transfers into all other aspects of life.

and yeah - my grandmother was that way, we were all nothing but pavement to her.   1dsil will complain about her mother/mil, but the woman lived with me for 11 months when I was a young mother. I got to know her pretty well.  and yes, she's nuttier than a fruitcake and very over bearing. (and she's finally reached that magic stage of losing her mind with age, and confined to a wheelchair has slowed her down significantly. though not entirely. . . . .)

I shared a few anecdotes about her - but tbh, she didn't do nearly the damage to her own children and none to her grandchildren, compared to what my grandmother did to her daughter and grandchildren.   I really think it's because my fil pushed back against her ploys, and her children grew with the message it was ok to push back against her unreasonable ploys. the grandchildren all grew up with it was ok to push back against unreasonable demands. it kept her under control. I actually love my mil and appreciate her good points - though I'm certainly not blind to her nuttiness.   my grandfather was more pavement.  my grandmother . . . as far as I'm concerned, she can burn in hell.

[Tanaqui]

Quote

But I'm the same person who would tell her to get a hotel. I'm just saying if you let her in your home, the kids should be respectful and that that wouldn't quite be there for me. No adult wants to be constantly contradicted.

 

I can't believe I missed this. No adult wants to be constantly contradicted? Neither do children! All variations on "My parents allow me to do this in this home" are a perfectly reasonable and respectful response to somebody who is suddenly trying to make up new rules for a child (and certainly an adolescent) that aren't about safety. If you don't want kids telling you that they're allowed to wear their PJs until noon (or whatever) then you should restrict yourself to only correcting your own children.

[PeachyDoodle]

I don't know. I think there is a pretty big leap between someone who is annoying/doesn't mesh with our family's general style and someone who is toxic. I think the OP has the latter.

My MIL is annoying. She doesn't mesh AT ALL with our family. She has sometimes made decisions that we vehemently disagree with, even decisions involving our children. We have had to have *those* talks with her. It has gone well, sometimes. Other times, not so much. Like screaming and crying and veiled threats to kidnap our daughter and take her across state lines not-so-much.*

She isn't toxic. I wouldn't relish the idea of her spending two weeks in my guest room, but she still isn't toxic.

I think you have to know your enemy here. For a truly toxic person (and there are certainly some stories I've heard on this board that would qualify as toxic), I absolutely want to demonstrate to my kids how to stand up for themselves and not be doormats. But I really don't see that here. Announcing a visit that only occurs every two years without asking (and there's no indication this is a pattern, just that it's happening this time) and possibly being a little bossy/having different expectations about how a family's culture is or should be doesn't rise to that level of awful, IMO. In a situation like this, I'm much more concerned about teaching my kids love and grace and respect for someone who may annoy the heck out of us all, but is still their GRANDMOTHER. 

Our family has all kinds of jokes about dh's mother. He's usually leading the charge. We love when he talks to her on the phone because he always comes in with some story of something ridiculous she's said. But when she's present, we treat her respectfully. Our kids know to smile and nod and if they have any questions about anything she wants, to check with us first. But mostly we just chalk her weirdness up to "that's Mimi." Thankfully she doesn't live with us, so we can all afford to be gracious during the times we do see her.

 

*The key here is that we knew she was just pissed off and ranting. There was no actual threat. We stood firm and she eventually got over it.

[Tanaqui]

PeachyDoodle, hold on. Are you saying that threats of kidnapping aren't toxic - or, honestly, abusive - just because you were reasonably sure she wouldn't follow through on them?

Because, I have to say, if a spouse or romantic partner did that, that would absolutely be considered abusive. It is, in fact, one of the top signs of emotional abuse in partners, whether or not the threat is credible. It's not just "not normal".

Edited December 11, 2018 by Tanaqui

[PeachyDoodle]

I'm saying that in this ONE instance, she was mad and crying and screaming, and we didn't take anything she said seriously. She wanted to take dd on an out of state trip, we said no, and she was hollering that maybe she'd do it anyway. 

Her being extremely upset like that has happened exactly twice in the 25 years I've known her. I think everybody gets to be angry and hurt and say things they don't mean once in a blue moon without being labeled toxic. At least, I hope so. Otherwise I will have to label myself toxic.

ETA: And I think that announcing a visit that was not pre-arranged is even less toxic than what I've described above. Which is why I've advocated grace in this situation.

Edited December 11, 2018 by PeachyDoodle

[Tanaqui]

Toxic or not, it's both presumptuous and rude. It's all right to tell rude people that they cannot stay in your home. Again, no matter who they are. This is how they learn not to do that anymore.

[PeachyDoodle]

Sure it is. But it's also okay to decide to let it go and make the best of it. Nobody's in danger here.

And since the OP asked for encouragement to do just that, I think we should honor it.

[Tanaqui]

Honestly, she'd be doing this woman a favor by putting her foot down. If more people had told her over the years that she's not welcome to invite herself to their homes on short notice for weeks at a time then she wouldn't still be doing it today and nobody would talk about her behind her back. It's kinder for her to set a boundary than let her MIL keep on being rude to presumably everybody she knows.

[Junie]

Yes, it was rude for MIL to invite herself without checking dates.  Several people has suggested that the OP or her dh talk to the MIL that this is to be the last time that she comes without checking first.

I really don't think that it's reasonable to destroy a grandparent/grandchild relationship over it.

Some of my children never got to meet their grandmother, but it was because of cancer, not rudeness.

[73349]

17 minutes ago, Junie said:

I really don't think that it's reasonable to destroy a grandparent/grandchild relationship over it.

Why would it destroy a relationship to tell her this month is not good?

They can look at their calendars and say, "Hey, how about Easter?" or whatever would be mutually agreeable.

[Junie]

5 minutes ago, whitehawk said:

Why would it destroy a relationship to tell her this month is not good?

They can look at their calendars and say, "Hey, how about Easter?" or whatever would be mutually agreeable.

Yes, that would be ok unless the grandmother's financial situation or health or whatever can't take the hit.  I still think it would be better to just deal with it this time and talk about doing better going forward.

 

[SKL]

11 hours ago, Tanaqui said:

To everybody saying "What if she's not toxic", I have to ask - exactly what sort of relationships do you have that have conditioned you to think there is anything at all okay about somebody suddenly and unexpectedly deciding to invite herself to your home for two weeks and then boss around your children once she's there?

The OP has posted that this impending visit makes her want to "cry". These details are enough for me to get a picture, and that picture isn't of a kind, respectful, or loving Grandma.

I'm still not sure the husband didn't say something to make Granny think she should go ahead and do exactly what she did.

Lots of people get stressed out over having houseguests.  That does not mean the guests themselves are horrible people.

The OP says her little ones will be thrilled to see their granny.  The things she says about Granny don't sound so awful to me that I couldn't survive it for a couple weeks.  I do understand the desire to just be lazy and sloppy for a week, but that is not a requirement of life.  In my world, it is more important to have a relationship with Granny than to have total freedom on the holiday break.

IMO the sooner they all get used to the idea, the happier they will be in the end.  At least they have time to plan and adjust their expectations.

If indeed she made these plans without consulting with her son, then she needs to be asked not to do that again.  I would wait until mid-2019 to mention it.

[SKL]

I might as well mention that I've had numerous times when it was announced to me suddenly that we had houseguests coming.  (Different culture.)  Sometimes we had just a day or two to prepare.  We all work and our house is not shipshape on a daily basis.  Is it stressful, yes.  Does it kill us, no.

[SKL]

I get that people need boundaries, but some of the comments strike me as too rigid for normal healthy relationships.  A rigid boundary is needed in extreme cases, but not as a general rule IMO.

[Tanaqui]

1. If telling Grandma to check into a hotel because she simply cannot make two week plans on such short notice without asking will "destroy the relationship" then that's Grandma's fault. That ship has completely and utterly sailed, because Grandma cares more about her right to presume on people than she does about her grandkids.

2. A relationship where somebody feels it's okay to just impose on you for two weeks is not normal and healthy to begin with.

3. Talk is cheap. Actions are what get results. If you say "You can do it just this once, but never again" then nobody takes you seriously, whatever the subject is.

Edited December 11, 2018 by Tanaqui

[SKL]

Maybe I'm wrong, but I'm assuming that if Granny had called OP and discussed plans for the holiday, she probably would have still come as a houseguest, though perhaps not for the whole 2 weeks.  The only thing that would be different would be that OP had more of a say up front.  The kids would feel the same either way, I assume, depending on how OP talks to them about it.

[Tanaqui]

What would be different is that Granny would have shown her son and daughter-in-law a modicum of respect and courtesy.

[SKL]

4 minutes ago, Tanaqui said:

If telling Grandma to check into a hotel because she simply cannot make two week plans on such short notice without asking will "destroy the relationship" then that's Grandma's fault. That ship has completely and utterly sailed, because Grandma cares more about her right to presume on people than she does about her grandkids.

A relationship where somebody feels it's okay to just impose on you for two weeks is not normal and healthy to begin with.

I'm from Midwest US, so I don't think my culture is super familistic, but we still expect to spend a lot of time and address a lot of demands and expectations from our parents as they get older.  Many people I know have either moved in with their parents or had parents move in with them as they needed more help, or they visit them most days or do their cooking and cleaning on the weekends or whatever (year round).  In my world view, a two week stay once every two years or so is hardly a blip.

[Tanaqui]

Those situations aren't even remotely comparable to the one the OP describes. I can't even imagine why you think they are. Visiting your parents often and doing their housework, or even moving in together, has nothing to do with unwanted houseguests inviting themselves at the very last minute and then staying for two weeks and bossing around your children. I would say "apples and oranges", but apples and oranges are at least both fruit and taste good! This is more like "apples and pond scum". (And to reiterate, I can't believe I have to explain this to you.)

Edited December 11, 2018 by Tanaqui

[SKL]

7 minutes ago, Tanaqui said:

Those situations aren't even remotely comparable to the one the OP describes. I can't even imagine why you think they are. Visiting your parents often and doing their housework, or even moving in together, has nothing to do with unwanted houseguests inviting themselves at the very last minute and then staying for two weeks and bossing around your children. I would say "apples and oranges", but apples and oranges are at least both fruit and taste good! This is more like "apples and pond scum". (And to reiterate, I can't believe I have to explain this to you.)

This isn't the "very last minute" and this is a close family member.

As everyone agreed, there should have been discussions in advance about when and how long, but we don't kick people out for every indiscretion they commit.  Also I still have not heard what the husband said that may or may not have been taken by Granny as an invitation to do exactly what she did.

[73349]

42 minutes ago, Junie said:

Yes, that would be ok unless the grandmother's financial situation or health or whatever can't take the hit.  I still think it would be better to just deal with it this time and talk about doing better going forward.

It's not her son and DIL's fault if she made plans contingent on them without calling to check first. If she couldn't afford to change her plans, she should have made sure they would be okay. What does that poster for classrooms say? Something like, Failure to plan ahead on your part doesn't constitute an emergency on my part.

It might be preferable to just deal with this time, and the OP and her DH should feel free to do that if they choose, but they aren't obligated to do so.

[SKL]

And if OP really can't do this, she is free to ask Granny to change her dates.  I got the impression, though, that OP doesn't have an actual conflict with the dates.

[Roadrunner]

Every time I read about unwanted in-laws I wonder if I am the only one feeling sadness. I have young boys. I would be devastated if one day my visits were received in such a way.  

They are family. Tell them to lay off the kids and enjoy the family. Time will come when we will lose our parents and all we will have are memories.  😞 

Edited December 11, 2018 by Roadrunner

[vonfirmath]

22 hours ago, gardenmom5 said:

we did that with the boys last christmas  they went and visited 2dd and dsil.  it was super cheap to fly out christmas noonish - after we had presents here.  so it worked out great.  they arrived around dinner their time.

but that was all pre-planned with both ends agreeing this is what would work.

 

Agreed. We drove and arrived on Christmas day a few years back (In ARizona). It was what worked with job situations and Grandparents knew and were okay.

We celebrated Christmas the next day instead.

 

[PeachyDoodle]

I think this would be vastly different if it were described as a pattern of behavior. It isn't. Maybe there is a pattern, but I haven't seen where the OP has said her MIL *repeatedly* makes plans to visit without first clearing them with her son and DIL. It has happened ONCE, so far as we know. And the MIL only visits every couple of YEARS! The MIL is probably excited about her visit and assumes her son and his family will be as happy to see her as she is to see them.

While I certainly think that the OP is within her rights to say, "No, that isn't going to work for us," if she so chooses, I *personally* wouldn't do that unless I had a good reason (serious schedule conflict, etc.). I would try to make it work, while also having a conversation with MIL after or during the course of the visit as to why we'd prefer that this not happen again. (Okay, let's be honest: I'd make dh have that conversation...)

And no, @Roadrunner you aren't alone. I've often thought how devastated I would be if my son grows up to think I am as crazy as dh thinks his mother is. I hope to have a good enough relationship with my future DIL (waaaay future, lol!) that she will be willing to overlook my quirks and give me grace. 

[Bambam]

I tend to agree with most that think this is rude to invite yourself over to stay for such an extended period of time, but if I had to suck it up and deal with it, this is what I'd do:

I'd make a detailed schedule for each and every day along the lines of:

 Monday - sleep in until 10:30 am. Breakfast is on your own, no noise until 10:30 am. Lunch will be at 1 in our kitchen. Outing to park from 2-3:30 (assuming weather is fine). 4-5:30 - dinner prep - these people are assigned to help me (name a kid or two), free time for all others. Dinner 5:45-6:30, after dinner cleanup assigned to child #3 & #4. 7 pm -9 pm - family movie time (pick a movie ahead of time!), 9 pm - bedtime/free time.

Etc, and etc. I would specify when you can make noise every morning. I would plan out activities for every day. I would do the things my family would *want* to do. If Grandma can't keep up that pace, Grandma can elect to stay at your home (or motel) for that time. 

I would include things that Grandma might enjoying doing with the kids (making cookies to take to the Fire station, looking at old photo albums, playing games, whatever). I might schedule that per child or it might just be "fun time with Grandma". 

I'd probably also schedule a thing or two that my kids enjoy but that Grandma would not like so we can all have a break (i.e. 5 mile hike in the National Forest). Because for my family, we'd need a break. 

I would have DH explain to Grandma that the kids are on break, and she is not the parent, and she is not allowed to tell them what to do/not do (excepting safety for little ones). If she oversteps this boundary, personally I'd tell her then that she has to stay in a motel (because I will protect my kids before I consider her hurt feelings), and that we will post a schedule of when she can come over. If she does it again, I'd go pick her up for lunch/supper, and then return her. I'd severely limit access to my kids because she is not respecting my authority as the parent in this situation. 

BTW, all this makes me appreciate my MIL much more. 

[Scarlett]

3 hours ago, PeachyDoodle said:

Sure it is. But it's also okay to decide to let it go and make the best of it. Nobody's in danger here.

And since the OP asked for encouragement to do just that, I think we should honor it.

I haven’t read every post but yes I would make the best of this trip.  Then after she goes home insist dh have a frank conversation with her about discussing future visits so that it works for everyone.  

It is also ok to kindly enforce boundaries in one’s own home especially.  

I guess I am much closer to being a MIL than a young mother with a MIL......so there is that.  Time goes so fast......we should do our best to enjoy our parents and allow our spouses to enjoy theirs before it is to late.

[unsinkable]

2 hours ago, Roadrunner said:

Every time I read about unwanted in-laws I wonder if I am the only one feeling sadness. I have young boys. I would be devastated if one day my visits were received in such a way.  

They are family. Tell them to lay off the kids and enjoy the family. Time will come when we will lose our parents and all we will have are memories.  😞 

Agree.

And to expand on your point, I'm sure I'll make mistakes as a MIL, just as I do as a mom. I hope I'll be allowed grace and forgiveness.

What the OP's MIL did does not fall into the unforgivable category to me. But given the sledgehammer responses in this thread, I can see this isn't a universal feeling. 

We don't know WHY she made the plans first without asking. We haven't heard it was a pattern. IMO, there has to be a reason. Maybe it is a very sad reason, like she's lonely and just wanted to be with family. 

[Farrar]

I might be willing to make the best of it, but not until after there had been a really serious conversation. Like I said above, my in laws used to do this and while things were crazy tense after we told them in very clear terms that they absolutely had to stop it, I am so, so glad we did. And my relationship with them is better for it.

We know this is a pattern of (at minimum) rude or (more likely) toxic behavior by grandma. I'm not clear if the OP has ever made everyone sit down and verbally made the boundaries she needs clear. It doesn't take two to tango when you've got a toxic person in the mix, and there's no excuse for doing any kind of rude tangoing in the first place, but if you keep partnering with them, it certainly doesn't help.

I wouldn't personally make grandma get a hotel room unless I missed somewhere that the OP told her to stop doing this in clear terms previously. I would try to make the best of it. But part of the reason for drawing these lines is so that this grandma can have a better relationship with the kids. It may make you sad to think of them not welcoming her... but it doesn't really matter if they're welcoming or not when she upsets the household and bickers with the older kids. She's not going to have a great relationship with them long term anyway. Boundaries will actually help her do that if it's done right.