FaithManor Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 I am entirely agreeing with Katie. You are doing the right thing, but the buck stops there. Its okay to offer a hug, to sit with her, to hold her hand while she cries, to provide small comforts. But you don't need to do more than that. It is up to her and her alone to make the next step whatever she decides that should be, and this does not involve and should not involve putting you in the middle of this triangle of drama. And you shouldn't give her money. For one thing, that isn't what she needs now. There are many decisions to be made before it comes to that and one would naturally assume that she has parents, siblings, aunts and uncles, people who should be providing the safety net if she needs it. If Zarah is a problem from this point on, that's not on you either. She has made the very unfortunate, stupid choice of bedding down with a married man for three years. That has consequences. You can be nice. You can continue to take food to her or provide transportation to the grocery store or something if you like. That is a very kind, generous thing to do. However, if you want to completely distance yourself from this since it is likely to be ugly, that is more than acceptable to, and if you want to go the extra mile, you could leave Zarah with phone numbers for community mental health and social services. Since she can't drive due to eyesight, even in rural areas like mine, they provide handicap accessible van services and drivers for free to people with disabilities like hers. So there are likely alternatives to her being dependent on you. 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haiku Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 What if she wants me to do things (that other people would recognize as stupid, but I might think 'hey, anything to help her!') like maybe she would want to see my messages from Zarah, or have me phone Yan in front of her, or prove my sincerity in some way... What sorts of things should I think twice about? In my opinion, your only responsibility is to offer her the truth as you know it. Zarah has told you she is having an affair with Yan. You are reporting to her that Zarah states she is having an affair with Yan. It is not your job to prove that this is happening or fix things for Xena. All you can (and should) do is tell her what you know. Do not offer money, do not try to fix things, do not try to prove your case, and do not try to prove your sincerity. Tell her what you know, say you're sorry, and let her handle things from there. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bolt. Posted August 16, 2016 Author Share Posted August 16, 2016 (edited) Deleted Edited August 18, 2016 by bolt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnnE-girl Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 I keep checking for an update. I hope you're doing ok, bolt. 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FaithManor Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 Bumping for update. Poor Bolt. Poor Xena. Uck uck uck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 I keep checking in hoping for the best, but what a bad situation all the way around! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lauraw4321 Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 I'm hoping for a "oh, they've got an open marriage and she's totally fine." 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scarlett Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 Yikes, I am worried, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ktgrok Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 Seriously.....hoping the meeting wasn't faked by the husband, who has now hog tied her and is driving her to the middle of nowhere.... Stupid vivid imagination... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnnE-girl Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 Seriously.....hoping the meeting wasn't faked by the husband, who has now hog tied her and is driving her to the middle of nowhere.... Stupid vivid imagination... I didn't want to be the one to say something like this, but it crossed my mind. I just hope bolt is too busy with her own real life to update us yet. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SproutMamaK Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 Waiting patiently... who am I kidding, WAITING VERY IMPATIENTLY! :willy_nilly: 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean in Newcastle Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 Maybe Bolt decided to do a Thelma and Louise with the wife. . . . 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FaithManor Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 Maybe Bolt decided to do a Thelma and Louise with the wife. . . . Snort!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marbel Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 They were meeting in a public place, yes? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madteaparty Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 Bolt should just live stream her meeting with wronged wife and spare you guys the refresh button. 16 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 Bolt should just live stream her meeting with wronged wife and spare you guys the refresh button. That would have been more considerate :p Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DesertBlossom Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 I've been worried all day for the wife and didn't even think about the odds of Bolt being hog tied in the back of a car. Oh goodness. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ravin Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 They were meeting in a public place, yes? Yes. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean in Newcastle Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 Just for the record, no one is making light of what must have been a very stressful time for both Bolt and the wife. We understand that but are trying to bring some humor into a difficult situation. (Not that anyone has suggested that but just putting that out there. ) 11 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8circles Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 Thinking of you, bolt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seasider Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 Okay now, I could imagine a lengthy conversation but this is too long. Hoping bolt is just waiting to update when she has an uninterrupted block of time to spare. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 The best outcome of all would be that Xena knew, and then with that out of the way they had a lovely time of catching up and went for icecream afterward to commiserate the drama llamas in their lives. Thinking of you, Bolt! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
38carrots Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 Hoping for a good update, bolt.. :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carol in Cal. Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 Getting worried. I am really trying not to, but I'm at least, um, concerned. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cuckoomamma Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 Thinking that maybe afterwards, Bolt needed to take care of things with her children. Then, there was dinner. Sometime during dinner or as they were cleaning up, Zahra called. Bolt is engaged in a 2 hour conversation with her while we're all waiting for an update. That's my guess! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FaithManor Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 Omay, I liked Carol's post but not because I like...wrong sentiment. I am on my phone and cannot pull up the agree emoticon. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StephanieZ Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 Yeah, I'm an atheist & I'm judgemental. Since you asked, I'd tell her this is weighing on you & you cannot continue the friendship until something changes. Fwiw, I was once entrusted with information about a relationship. I lasted about 5h before I called the person and told them they had to tell their s/o or I would. It was wrong, it was immoral & I wanted nothing to do with it. I wouldn't have looked for this info, I wasn't snooping; they chose to tell me. Once I became aware of it, I couldn't NOT act. It wouldn't have been fair to the other person. I agree that it is enabling & it is enabling something that is wrong & that hurts people. Exactly! Count me as another judgmental atheist. You can have strong morals and strong opinions on right and wrong without attributing those morals to a deity. I think you nailed it when you realized that maybe you overlooked a major moral problem in your quest to be non-judgy. Your heart is in the right place . . . but it's making a mess for you. Hornblower nails the difference . . . This cheating is doing *major* harm to innocents. It's not a lifestyle choice or a personal moral thing . . . It's doing serious harm to other human beings. It's wrong. It's OK for you to express that, and to handle it however you feel is right from here on out. Just because you, in error, went along (somewhat) with her bad behavior in the past does NOT mean you have to keep doing so. Say it's wrong. Say you can't support it. Say it makes your stomach and heart hurt to be in the middle of this. Remove yourself from this aspect of her life. You can keep being friends without discussing her affair. If you have nothing else to talk about, then maybe you've been enjoying the seedy aspect of her drama a bit too much. If that's the case, find some really trashy Netflix series to watch to get your bad-behavior-thrills. (That's not a judgy thing . . . I enjoy trashy behavior on TV as much as anyone . . . I just try to avoid it IRL. On TV, the collateral damage is imaginary . . . IRL, it's real living little kids and spouses . . .) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bolt. Posted August 17, 2016 Author Share Posted August 17, 2016 (edited) deleted Edited August 18, 2016 by bolt. 14 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 Well enough is good enough - thanks for putting us out of our misery and popping back in. If you're safe and not hog tied we are a happy hive. :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heatherwith4 Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 I'm glad you're ok! We were about to send the WTM posse after you! :) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bolt. Posted August 17, 2016 Author Share Posted August 17, 2016 (edited) Aw, you guys have been fantastic through this.Remainder deleted. Edited August 18, 2016 by bolt. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bolt. Posted August 17, 2016 Author Share Posted August 17, 2016 (edited) Deleted Edited August 18, 2016 by bolt. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zoobie Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 I guess being in denial is normal, but Xena asking him straightaway is not the strategic move, that's for sure. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnnE-girl Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 Thanks for updating. What a mess of a tangled web! I think the only thing you need to tell Zarah is that you couldn't in good conscience not tell once you realized that you knew her affair partner's wife. And maybe add that you shouldn't have been acting as supportive as you may have seemed of her relationship. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shred Betty Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 (edited) deleted quote cause Bolt deleted her posts. Lol! Wow, after all that you decided to text dates and details in follow up? Guaranteed she is going to be either blaming you to remain in denial, or using you as a sounding board as her only contact, or trying to access you as a verification method... You are opening yourself up to more ongoing craziness here. IMHO, time to drop out of it. Doing your duty to tell was enough, no? As you've texted her evidence, I'm not sure if you can, but please try to separate yourself. Edited August 20, 2016 by Shred Betty 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DesertBlossom Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 She thought being "Bible-thumped" would have been worse? :crying: The denial is strong. I feel really bad for her. 10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 I wouldn't say anything more to Zarah about it but that your conscience couldn't abide this anymore. The denial is pretty typical, but you've done your part. I'd decline any further information sharing on the topic and tell her you want to stay out of it, but maybe offer to listen to her vent a bit if needed? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haiku Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 Were it me, I would never respond to Zarah. I'd see what a rotten mess she dragged me into and let the friendship die. I would also make sure, if Xena asked for more info, to tell her that I'd told her all I know. I would not get dragged into that mess, either. I would never, ever, ever ever ever speak to, contact, or respond to Yan again. I'm not surprised Xena was skeptical. I'm not surprised Yan acted innocent. I'm not surprised Zarah called you right away. But you have done what you can, and I think it's time to walk away. Good luck. 14 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haiku Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 She thought being "Bible-thumped" would have been worse? :crying: I thought the same thing. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IfIOnly Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 I guess being in denial is normal, but Xena asking him straightaway is not the strategic move, that's for sure. Yep. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LMD Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 You're a brave person bolt. You did the right thing, now you can disentangle from the drama. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marbel Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 Thanks for the update, Bolt. I hope you are able to relax now and get your (drama-free) life back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valley Girl Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 You did a difficult thing. What happens next is in others' hands and their responsibility. Now it's time to take care of you. Personally, I'd step back from everything and everybody involved. It's not your responsibility to see Zarah through what comes next. She's going to need to step up and take responsibility for herself. I know you feel sorry for her and feel some obligation to help her with her other issues. You can do that without letting her drag you back into this mess. If you feel you must do something, give her referral numbers for groups, services, or other resources that can help, then walk away...at least for a few months until this situation sorts itself out. Who needs that kind of stress and drama? 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denisemomof4 Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 Igh, that poor woman. My stomach is all twisted up with concern for her. I admire you for standing up and doing what is right. Well, what I think, or thought, was right before reading this thread. It has been eye opening and thought provoking for sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluegoat Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 What a mess - yes, don't get more into it if at all possible. I'm not really surprised that Xena asked her husband about it directly. Given that she thought the whole thing was very unlikely, that kind of makes sense - that is probably what I would do as well. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garga Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 (edited) I hope you give up future updates, but only because I'm being terribly nosey. It's very much like a soap opera and I wonder what will happen next. Of course, the best thing to do is for you to stay out of it, so then you can't update us, because you're out of it. But if you hear of anything... I do feel pretty bad for Xena. I know that when I am faced with something huge, it takes me a day or so to process and actually figure out how I feel about it. I wonder if it's all starting to really sink in today for Xena. It's like it didn't sink in yesterday at all. As nosey as I am, I do feel bad for Xena. Edited August 17, 2016 by Garga 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IfIOnly Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 Not apples to apples, but I was in shock and really thought it was a misunderstanding after the officer came knocking on my door to tell me my dad had died in a motorcycle accident. I was in a sort of denial for even months after and had dreams for years that it was all just a misunderstanding and he came home and all was well. I think this was partly because I never got to see his body, but I don't know. Maybe that's normal? All that to say, I can relate vto shock and denial and very much feel for the wife. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mathnerd Posted August 17, 2016 Share Posted August 17, 2016 Were it me, I would never respond to Zarah. I'd see what a rotten mess she dragged me into and let the friendship die. I would also make sure, if Xena asked for more info, to tell her that I'd told her all I know. I would not get dragged into that mess, either. I would never, ever, ever ever ever speak to, contact, or respond to Yan again. I'm not surprised Xena was skeptical. I'm not surprised Yan acted innocent. I'm not surprised Zarah called you right away. But you have done what you can, and I think it's time to walk away. Good luck. I agree. Please don't continue having a close relationship with people who think that adultery is fine for whatever reasons. If I were you, going forward, I would spend all that energy, time, effort and thought on things that are more important to me - not on a friend who cheats with a married man. If I were in your situation, I would think: Couldn't Yan offer Zarah all the help, support and friendship that I am providing (for e.g. getting her groceries, providing a shoulder to cry on etc.) since they are already having a long term affair? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
musicianmom Posted August 18, 2016 Share Posted August 18, 2016 I think at this point I would block all their numbers from my phone, block them on FB, and let them sort out their own messes without any assistance from me! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bolt. Posted August 18, 2016 Author Share Posted August 18, 2016 (edited) About to start deleting these posts (for privacy) but I'll update with final details: Xena contacted me to thank me for being a good friend, and that Yan is denying everything (but he contacted Zarah immediately -- allegedly to tell her to stop telling lies about him and never contact him again). She seems to be taking his word, but also has her suspicions aroused. Zarah has not re-contacted me after asking to know exactly what I told Xena (and I replied, that I told about the affair but no details). I told Xena that I'd let her know if Zarah made any further allegations. Looking forward, my plan is: - On the day I would normally do groceries next (after a vacation) I will send one message to Zarah to the effect of 'we've had drama, but do you still need food?' - If I see Zarah over groceries, I might refuse to discuss any of the results of me telling and the state of her relationship with Yan... Or I might let her spill, in case there is anything that might help Xena take the situation more seriously. (Advice on this? I'm strongly motivated to help Xena.) (Also, I feel curious/analytical about the results of my actions. I *want* to know. That's not good, right?) - If desired, I will keep doing errands for/with Zarah, in particular getting her to a counsellor or therapist -- but I very firmly won't be a sounding board for the issues in her affair with Yan (if the affair continues). - I will rekindle a normal casual friendship with Xena. Edited August 18, 2016 by bolt. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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