I hate stuff!!

[Mimm]

My two oldest just left for camp this morning and I have seven days to clean their room. It's been trashed for over a year. Clearly I'm not good at just making them do it. But it's really mostly the fault of my 14 year old and we have a high conflict relationship anyway, so a messy room takes a back seat to other things. Anyway, so now I'm going to do it while she's not around. I'm planning to remove the mountains of clothes she has on the floor and give them back... how? Make her earn them? Give her one garment a day? Only on days when the room stays clean? Go in once a week and pick up everything off the floor and take it out of the room? I don't know, I welcome input from people who have had to take drastic measures to keep a kid's room clean.

 

And no, I'm not willing to keep shutting the door and pretending it doesn't exist. I've done that entire too much as it is. She and my 12 year old share a rather small room and it's not fair to my 12 year old that probably 80% of the mess is her sister's. And how do you even go about finding your 20% when the other person's mess is in the way? So enough is enough. It's a small room but it's a perfectly workable space, one that I'm willing to do what it takes to make sure it can be organized and nice. It's due a paint job. Overdue, actually, but we've been waiting on it to be cleaned before we can paint it!

 

But how do I decide what to throw away? Old art projects, lump pots from a pottery class a couple years ago, sea shells they picked up on a beach in TX four years ago, pokemon cards they haven't played with in like five or six years, posters a friend just gave them last week but no wall space to hang them, a violin no one has any interest in playing... And on and on and on. If I had my way, I'd throw it all out. But will this traumatize them? It's pretty invasive. Should I save a tub of stuff for them to go through?

 

ETA: UPDATE in post 45.

[Guest]

I struggle with stuff, too, and my kids love accruing it.

 

I think these things go better when the kids choose what to keep and throw away. Something simple, like setting a number of personal items each person can donate or trash each week, seems to work best with the least conflict.

 

If you're going to clean it up yourself, my recommendation is to throw away obvious trash and put the rest in tubs or totes until they come back, and make THEM sort the remainder for donation, trash, or a handful of things that are still keepers.

[Tiramisu]

I'd put the stuff in a tub or large plastic bin or whatever. Maybe two. One for clothes and the other for stuff. Make it four. Two for each of the girls. Keep the clothes in a convenient place for them to go through later. But the bins of other stuff in a basement, attic, or garage.

 

I have a really messy dd. Her mess was so bad that we couldn't let our youngest dd in that room anymore due to her allergies, not to mention the fights they would get into. That dd is in school, so I can go in and sort through things fairly easily. I've fortunately never had her question my choices. She has always been relieved for me to have done it for her since she has great difficulty organizing things for herself. She disgusted herself when she found ants had actually made a nest in her trash can and filled it with eggs. 

 

The dd who moved out of that room doesn't have much space for stuff, so in addition to a dresser with clothes, we have a couple of large bins that we keep her stuff in. It's honestly not ideal. We're just trying to get by, but she seems satisfied. 

[Amira]

Do they know you'll be cleaning?  If they don't, I wouldn't throw anything out.  Dump the stuff you want to get rid of in a trash bag and let them go through it if they want to when they get home.   If they do know, I'd still not throw much out except obvious trash.

 

My boys' stuff never gets out of control because we move a lot, but there have definitely been times when it's been a relief for them to have me sort through the stuff when they're getting ready for a move and bag up the junk.  They rarely ever want to go back to get something that I thought should be thrown away.

 

I don't think I'd make her earn her clothes back, especially if you already have a high conflict relationship. A clean room isn't worth conflict in my opinion.  I might figure out a way to divide the room so your younger daughter doesn't have to deal with her older sister's stuff.  

[redsquirrel]

If you are trying to create new habits then you need to proceed slowly and logically. Taking away clothes and making her earn them back etc, especially when she didn't know that was going to happen is just going to result in a nuclear explosion. If my mom tried that with me I would happily wear one outfit for a year, just to prove my point. in fact, she tried that once with me and it didn't take more than a few days for her to give up. I just decided if I didn't have a voice in the process then I was not going to participate.

 

One kid is a housekeeper and the other one isn't. They share a room. That is pretty much a conflict as old as siblings themselves, lol. What if you do the old 'put a line of tape down the middle and each keep to their own side' solution?

 

You say that this hasn't been a priority for you for good reasons. I think that is fine. But something has changed for you, but it might not have changed for the people involved. You are going to have to tread lightly. She is old enough that it is her space, and she is going to have to have a voice in this. You have been parenting with one message and now you have a different message. How are you going to handle that?

 

Where is the problem in the system? Is it that she has too many clothes? Is there not laundry day and it only happens when she runs out of them, so she just piles them up? Is she so busy that she just never gets to it? Maybe she just isn't bothered by it?  It might be something you have to work on together.

 

[regentrude]

I would never presume to throw away my children's belongings. If I had to empty the room, anything that I think could be thrown out would go into a box, and I'd have the children sort through the box upon return. I would throw away only obvious trash like candy wrappers and apple cores.

 

I would see if you can remove outgrown clothes or clothes no longer fit to wear and gradually reduce the amount of clothing the 14 y/o has. If the mess was really a problem, I'd put the clothes that are on the floor into a hamper. She can do laundry, fold and put away when she returns.

[happi duck]

If I went on a trip and my family pitched my stuff I'd be mad.

 

If they made sure I got to come home to a place that was dusted, tidy-ed, aired out and to clean laundry I'd be happy.

 

I would be fine with a box of "we didn't know what to do with this" stuff.

[emzhengjiu]

If they don't know you will be cleaning the room, I would not talk about any of the cleaning issues for a couple of days after they return.  My mom used to confront me about something she didn't like as soon as I walked into the door.  It turned what should have been a joyous, fun moment into something I would dread.

[Mimm]

They do not know I'm cleaning up. The oldest has a very hard time organizing. The reasons the room is a mess is that they have too much stuff in there, it's overwhelming to approach cleaning it and the way my oldest handles clothes is dysfunctional. She has a small dresser which would be perfectly adequate for pants, shorts, pajamas, socks and underwear, but she wants to put all her shirts in there as well. She insists that they'll fit and refuses to hang things up in the closet (it takes too long to hang things up). She also refuses to fold clothes, so the result is that clean clothes get tossed out all over the floor. The drawers are filled with other things and some wrinkled up clothes. Every so often my 12 year old gets sick of it and piles clothes into a couple laundry baskets but as soon as the 14 year old needs to find something to wear, she digs through the baskets scattering clothes everywhere again.

 

I don't know what she owns, she is constantly losing track of things. We'll have situations where she can't find socks and it's time to leave right now and she's freaking out and crying about it. So this really does affect me. It's very stressful. She borrows my socks a lot. :p She loses things constantly (ADHD) and her room is a big part of why she can't keep track of things. Where does anything go?

 

As far as the refusal to earn back clothes, this is part of why I'm doing this in the summer. She has enough clothes for seven days with her right now. If she wants to only wear and keep track of what she took to camp with her, so be it. People have made do with less, that's for sure. I don't really look at this like a punishment. Do you think I want to spend a week cleaning up this room? I don't actually like house work. ;) I see this as, I'm doing her a huge favor. Her room will be so much nicer and more livable and I plan to leave her with only what she can realistically take care of. When and how she will get the rest of her clothes back is something I need to work out, but just because she chooses to live in filth doesn't mean she likes it or that it doesn't cause her a lot of stress.

 

Honestly, I wish someone else would come in my house and clean it up and get rid of a bunch of stuff. And sure, they might mess up on what they throw away but you know, at the end of the day, I'll bet I wouldn't even be able to tell you what went missing. :p

[Mimm]

If they don't know you will be cleaning the room, I would not talk about any of the cleaning issues for a couple of days after they return.  My mom used to confront me about something she didn't like as soon as I walked into the door.  It turned what should have been a joyous, fun moment into something I would dread.

 

No, I picture this more like, "Hey! Look what I did for you while you were gone! Don't you love it??" Both my kids are likely to say yes. I know plenty of people here are thinking of how they would feel in that situation but my kids are going to mostly be ok with it. Especially if I do have a tub of things I'm not sure about, so I will definitely do that. :)

 

I found old squished Easter candy. :blink: :ack2:

[itsheresomewhere]

Please don't get rid of her stuff.  Just put it in a box and go through it together.  You are not doing her a favor.  I can tell you this from experience.  

[Random]

Two of my children are nearly hoarders.  I'm a minimalist.   We used to have a lot of friction, but I stumbled upon an idea recently.

 

Photograph the stuff your children love (but you think is junk, or just too much, or that you want to get rid of) and make photo albums of their memories. 

 

 

If the issue is too many clothes, there may just have to be some rules and limits put into place for the benefit of the entire household.

[wendy not in HI]

I have a messy dd.  Her clothing was out of control at one point when she was about 16 (she is 21 now and is still messy - very sweet, but soooo messy!), so I asked her to choose 10 outfits.   She chose her 10 favorite outfits, and we boxed up the rest - we did not get rid of it, we put the other things in the basement.  (I'm sure she also kept other things like a few pj's and a few exercise outfits and skirts/dresses, but the main problem was too much stuff, so...) 

 

She loved it!  Her closet stayed clean.  She could see everything and it made choosing clothes much easier.  She felt happier with a cleaner room.  It made doing laundry easier as she didn't have stuff all over the floor and have to wonder what was clean and what was dirty.  After a couple of weeks I let her choose out a few things from the basement, but by then she decided she didn't need most of it.  (I did not make her earn outfits back.  I just let her know that the items in the basement were off limits until she could get a handle on what she had - not punishment - more like help.) 

 

She was able to keep her clothes better under control for a while, but she needed help going through her clothes and choosing her favorites a few more times when she was in high school.  She is home for the summer right now, and I can see that she needs some help going through her things, again....  She says that she just really doesn't "see" messes.  

 

 

[Stacia]

I think wendy in HI's suggestion for the clothes sounds like a good plan.

 

Not sure about all the other stuff. My dd has a lot of stuff. Periodically, I'll tell her to find a dozen things in her room to get rid of -- it can be books, t-shirts, old magazines, etc.... I don't care what the dozen things are, just that she brings out a dozen. Somehow that seems to work. And, I try to stem the incoming flow. If she gets something else (or is contemplating getting something or bringing something home), I'll remind her that she needs to get rid of that many items (or double the amount) before getting/brining the 'new' thing to her room. It's a longer-term approach, but (I hope) is one that is teaching her skills for the longer-term to be able to handle this on her own.

[purplejackmama]

Out of curiosity, is your messy daughter creative? Would you consider her "artistic?"

[Chris in VA]

I can understand being frustrated.

 

I was wondering, does your 14yo have executive function problems? It can go along with ADD. It doesn't seem like a gentle and kind approach to just go in and throw things away that you don't know the value of (to her). It also seems like punishment to me to be controlling about the clothes (doling out one at a time).

 

Can you maybe box things up after throwing away the kind of trash that ANYONE would toss (not projects or even broken things, but old food and wrappers and kleenex and things like that)?

 

Could you wash that giant mound of clothes, fold them neatly, and then put them in a box to go thru with her? That will help you feel you are doing something.  If she needs more space in her dresser and won't hang things on hangers, could you get a hanging set of shelves (the soft kind) to put in her closet? Maybe you could even do that while she is away. Present it like, "Hey, we have a surprise for you! We did a closet mini-makeover!" And then when she gets back (after a day) sort through them and give away what she doesn't want or doesn't fit (and box those that are out of season, and store elsewhere).

 

Just calmly setting aside time to help her pare down and then giving her extra storage could go a long way to solving the problem.

 

I just think doing it together would be better for your relationship.

[OneStepAtATime]

:grouphug:  :grouphug:  :grouphug: 

 

Read Smart but Scattered and ADD Friendly Ways to Organize Your Life to come up with a better plan for helping your very messy daughter get a better handle on her things.  Seriously, just run to the library or get them on your Kindle or something and read through those books before you do anything with their stuff.  Then try to come up with a workable plan.  I wouldn't touch a thing until I had at least read one of those books.

 

Good luck.

[fairfarmhand]

I'd approach it like this:

 

"Hi! Did you have a great trip? So glad you are home!  Well, I did try to help you out while you were gone. Don't panic! I didn't throw anything away except things that were obviously trash. Here's what I did...."

 

I'd put all the clothes in a bin, one for shirts, one for pants, etc. I'd get rid of anything that doesn't obviously fit.

 

Then I'd point out to my dd. "Look how much space you have in your dresser. Lets look through the clothes together in the next few days and choose which things you really like and will wear. After all, it's so silly to keep all that stuff around if you don't wear it, right?"

 

Then over the next few days, I would sort it with her. I'd think of how often laundry is done and try to have about a weeks worth of clothing in the dressers/closets. Id reassure her "We'll keep this tote of stuff in the attic until we are sure you don't need it. You may find out that you need clothes to paint in or if you ruin one of your faves, you may want to replace it."

 

The key is to not tackle this when she's rushed, tired or emotional. I have a prickly one too, and I often just overlook certain things because cleaning the room can be such a source of conflict. Also, she does need me to do it with her. Otherwise, she tends to speed through it to just get it done, keeping too many things crammed in the dresser.

 

 

Id do the same kind of things for the books, papers, folders, and stuff, and then just put the miscellaneous things in a big tote for her to go through when she gets a bit of time.

 

I understand how quickly things like this can go downhill, so try to approach it with a positive attitude and a cooperative mindset.

 

[fairfarmhand]

Can you put hooks in her closet instead of a curtain rod and hangers for her shirts?

[6wildhorses]

I did something similar last month. I actually took everything out of two bedrooms that were terribly messy. Items only went back into the rooms if there was space for them. You could do the same thing. Take everything out. Yes, it will make a huge mess! Then decide what goes back in. Since they aren't there to help, pick the best you can. Get bins for toys and clothes that you think they've outgrown. Make a bin for sentimental objects that you think they might be willing to part with. Make a bin for miscellaneous stuff. Or just use trash bags if you don't have bins.

 

Before you start putting things back in the room, think about whether or not the furniture is functional. For instance, my son hated putting his stuffed animals in toy bins because he couldn't see them, so we put a big wire shelf in his room, and he likes using it. Maybe instead of a dresser for clothes, a shelf would work better. We got rid of all the wood furniture in our son's room and put a loft bed with an attached desk and the big wire shelf. We put organizers in the closet. The room is completely different in a good way. I also rearranged my daughter's room to be more functional.

 

When your kids get back and see their new room, explain that if they want to bring anything back into the room that you left out, there must be a good spot for it. They may need to exchange it for another item in order for it to work.

 

Also, each person in my family has a laundry basket for clean clothes in the laundry room. They can keep the clothes in there unless it gets full. If it starts looking full, I tell them to please carry the basket to their room, put away the clothes, and put the basket back. Having a place for clean laundry to go before it gets put away in a bedroom helps the laundry to not end up on the floor.

 

In order to break messy habits, we have a reward system. If the floor of your room is clean at night, then you get a ticket. At the end of the week there's a ticket drawing for a prize. My kids are finally keeping their rooms clean, but it has taken a lot of commitment on my part as well as theirs.

[ikslo]

They do not know I'm cleaning up. The oldest has a very hard time organizing. The reasons the room is a mess is that they have too much stuff in there, it's overwhelming to approach cleaning it and the way my oldest handles clothes is dysfunctional. She has a small dresser which would be perfectly adequate for pants, shorts, pajamas, socks and underwear, but she wants to put all her shirts in there as well. She insists that they'll fit and refuses to hang things up in the closet (it takes too long to hang things up). She also refuses to fold clothes, so the result is that clean clothes get tossed out all over the floor. The drawers are filled with other things and some wrinkled up clothes. Every so often my 12 year old gets sick of it and piles clothes into a couple laundry baskets but as soon as the 14 year old needs to find something to wear, she digs through the baskets scattering clothes everywhere again.

 

I don't know what she owns, she is constantly losing track of things. We'll have situations where she can't find socks and it's time to leave right now and she's freaking out and crying about it. So this really does affect me. It's very stressful. She borrows my socks a lot. :p She loses things constantly (ADHD) and her room is a big part of why she can't keep track of things. Where does anything go?

 

As far as the refusal to earn back clothes, this is part of why I'm doing this in the summer. She has enough clothes for seven days with her right now. If she wants to only wear and keep track of what she took to camp with her, so be it. People have made do with less, that's for sure. I don't really look at this like a punishment. Do you think I want to spend a week cleaning up this room? I don't actually like house work. ;) I see this as, I'm doing her a huge favor. Her room will be so much nicer and more livable and I plan to leave her with only what she can realistically take care of. When and how she will get the rest of her clothes back is something I need to work out, but just because she chooses to live in filth doesn't mean she likes it or that it doesn't cause her a lot of stress.

 

Honestly, I wish someone else would come in my house and clean it up and get rid of a bunch of stuff. And sure, they might mess up on what they throw away but you know, at the end of the day, I'll bet I wouldn't even be able to tell you what went missing. :p

 

Can you retro fit the closet with open shelving and a few bins on the floor?  I am so much happier and more organized now that I can see all my clothes at a glance, or at least thumb through the piles without having to open and close drawers. I utilize my shelving for the stuff that used to be in a dresser, and hang the rest, but I would be just as happy with more shelves and nothing hanging. So if she can have them in the closet but not hanging, it may make her life that much simpler.

 

 

ETA:  What 6wildhorses said.  I guess I should have finished reading the thread first. :)

[OnTheBrink]

As someone who's mother would clean out her room when she was at camp, DON'T. It IS invasive and I felt very disrespected when my mother did this. If you have a high conflict relationship with the 14 year old, this is going to exacerbate it. If you want them to distrust you, invade their space and throw things out. 

 

Take out any trash that may draw pests and make the girls clean it themselves. My daughter has a very hard time keeping up with her things and her room is frequently messy. About once a month or so, I make her go through clothes and prepare bags for donation. I make her remove trash and any glasses weekly. And, I pick my battles. For me, an untidy room isn't a huge deal, but dishes, trash, and laundry is, so those are the things I enforce. If she wants to live in an unorganized mess, fine; but it won't be unsanitary. Sometimes I do get resistance and I just ask her if she'd like me to clean it out myself and the answer is always, "NO!" So there are no other options for her. 

[Renai]

My mom used to clean my room, and I did find it relieving (as you say your girls might feel). However, it did not help me with my messy habits. I fight messy every day because I was never taught how to keep or cull things to keep it neat. I think training while I was young would have been very beneficial for  me.

 

The ideas above about putting stuff in bins and helping her go through them will probably go a long way in establishing good habits, or at least learning (culling) skills.

 

ETA: My 15yo dd, however, would find it invasive if I went into her room to clean it. Thankfully, she's seen my struggles (she's also a natural messy), BUT she's seen the systems I've used to declutter and clean. She's helped me on occasion. So, she has been able to use a system herself to clean out and maintain her room since she's been trained along with me and knows how to deal with it. I have hope for her. :)

[regentrude]

 She has a small dresser which would be perfectly adequate for pants, shorts, pajamas, socks and underwear, but she wants to put all her shirts in there as well. She insists that they'll fit and refuses to hang things up in the closet (it takes too long to hang things up). She also refuses to fold clothes, so the result is that clean clothes get tossed out all over the floor. The drawers are filled with other things and some wrinkled up clothes. Every so often my 12 year old gets sick of it and piles clothes into a couple laundry baskets but as soon as the 14 year old needs to find something to wear, she digs through the baskets scattering clothes everywhere again.

 

OK, so hanging up things in the closet does not work for her. Can you put shelves and wire baskets in her closet so she can store her clothes in the baskets? If the room is small, getting rid of the dresser may be good, too.

[Guest]

i deleted. My post is redundant and I should have read the replies first. Sorry!

[Ausmumof3]

I think I'd box stuff rather than chucking.

 

If you had given them due warning before they left with enough time for them to get to it, then I'd say go for it. But I know if I was your daughter and came home to find a tonne of stuff thrown away I'd be upset.

 

Throw away any obvious trash and get rid of clothes that are definitely too small. The rest can go in boxes and they can spend a bit of time deciding what to keep.

[Ausmumof3]

Also there is a blog post floating around called teach your kids to clean their rooms in 10 minutes. I've been finding it helpful with mine.

[Mimm]

I have gone through her room in the past and thrown things out. I was perhaps a bit too mean about it in the past and threw away things like happy meal toys that the neighbor gave her and this upset her at the time (this was years and years ago). Things that were very much trash to me, but not to her. I'm trying to show some respect but at the same time, I'm no longer willing to allow the room to stay in it's current state. The suggestions to have her do it aren't really going to work for me. I've tried and it's nothing but a source of conflict. I have asked her to find things she needs to get rid of and she does, sometimes, but I personally think she needs to be more willing to throw things away, and it's also not very helpful to go digging in the piles of things she needs to keep to look for things to throw away.

 

Seriously, I wonder what you guys would be saying if I uploaded pictures of the room. You literally can not see the floor. It's not like that Hoarder's show, but almost. But at the same thing, I don't think she has actual hoarding tenancies. It's a big source of emotional turmoil for her to misplace things. When she can't find things, she's upset with herself for losing them. She's very self critical. Talking to her about the room, telling her how SHE needs to change and fix it and so on, even if done in a positive, encouraging approach, with a "Hey, let me help you fix this!" overwhelms her and upsets her. My husband hates to deal with problems and ignores them till he can't anymore, and she kinds of gets this from him and I'm not sure how to help her in that. :)

 

Out of curiosity, is your messy daughter creative? Would you consider her "artistic?"

 

Yes, very much so. She's very much like me actually. I'm messy and I kept my room messy as a child and my mother went through and cleaned it up several times and it was always a relief. So that's the perspective I'm coming from. I've had this done for me and I was fine with it.

 

OK, so hanging up things in the closet does not work for her. Can you put shelves and wire baskets in her closet so she can store her clothes in the baskets? If the room is small, getting rid of the dresser may be good, too.

 

I do like this idea a lot! 12 year old can hang her things, and I can put baskets on the floor where she can fold and put away her shirts.

 

I will follow the advice in this thread and only throw away obvious trash and pack up her clothes and go through them with her. We will get rid of things she doesn't like and neatly store the things she does. :)

[Joules]

Maybe she just needs to understand that there is a limit to what a room can hold. If you organize what will fit, maybe 12 shirts, 10 pair of pants, etc., then if she wants something from the crates, she needs to trade. She gives you a less favorite pair of pants and gets one from the crate. Organize what's there, and then when you wash the clothes from camp, you can start letting her trade selections.

 

Just because clothes compress doesn't mean you can keep stuffing more and more in. The concept is easier with things like books; once you run out of bookshelf space, you have to get rid of one to add one.

[6wildhorses]

You're not alone with not being able to see the floor. My daughter's room was constantly like that until I did what I described above. Previously we would clean it up and within days the floor would disappear again! It was so bad that I refused to even go in there. She is also very creative, and she liked it that way. I'm happy to say that her room has been clean every night for about a month now, so there is hope! She still stacks things on surfaces in her room, and she has bins in her closet for all of her miscellaneous things, but her floor is kept clean, and that's what I really care about.

[Tiramisu]

They do not know I'm cleaning up. The oldest has a very hard time organizing. The reasons the room is a mess is that they have too much stuff in there, it's overwhelming to approach cleaning it and the way my oldest handles clothes is dysfunctional. She has a small dresser which would be perfectly adequate for pants, shorts, pajamas, socks and underwear, but she wants to put all her shirts in there as well. She insists that they'll fit and refuses to hang things up in the closet (it takes too long to hang things up). She also refuses to fold clothes, so the result is that clean clothes get tossed out all over the floor. The drawers are filled with other things and some wrinkled up clothes. Every so often my 12 year old gets sick of it and piles clothes into a couple laundry baskets but as soon as the 14 year old needs to find something to wear, she digs through the baskets scattering clothes everywhere again.

 

I don't know what she owns, she is constantly losing track of things. We'll have situations where she can't find socks and it's time to leave right now and she's freaking out and crying about it. So this really does affect me. It's very stressful. She borrows my socks a lot. :p She loses things constantly (ADHD) and her room is a big part of why she can't keep track of things. Where does anything go?

 

As far as the refusal to earn back clothes, this is part of why I'm doing this in the summer. She has enough clothes for seven days with her right now. If she wants to only wear and keep track of what she took to camp with her, so be it. People have made do with less, that's for sure. I don't really look at this like a punishment. Do you think I want to spend a week cleaning up this room? I don't actually like house work. ;) I see this as, I'm doing her a huge favor. Her room will be so much nicer and more livable and I plan to leave her with only what she can realistically take care of. When and how she will get the rest of her clothes back is something I need to work out, but just because she chooses to live in filth doesn't mean she likes it or that it doesn't cause her a lot of stress.

 

Honestly, I wish someone else would come in my house and clean it up and get rid of a bunch of stuff. And sure, they might mess up on what they throw away but you know, at the end of the day, I'll bet I wouldn't even be able to tell you what went missing. :p

 

This sounds really bad but dh put a lock on our bedroom door. There were many reasons but dd could not manage her clothing and would come in a take our clothes. She would also use all the towels and leave them on the floor, so I had to hide towels so dh would have a towel for his shower before work. After we put the lock on, she started washing her clothes everyday but would wash tremendous loads of clean clothes AND dirty clothes. She'd put them in at night and sometimes they wouldn't dry before the bus came in the morning. It seemed like OCD kicked in to deal with the ADHD problem. 

 

Anyway, this is to tell you that I completely understand. I also have a super neat dd. I didn't make my super neat dd super neat and I didn't make my unorganized dd that way either. But we do what we have to do with love to help them function and keep life normal for everyone else.

[Renai]

I'm trying to show some respect but at the same time, I'm no longer willing to allow the room to stay in it's current state. The suggestions to have her do it aren't really going to work for me. I've tried and it's nothing but a source of conflict. I have asked her to find things she needs to get rid of and she does, sometimes, but I personally think she needs to be more willing to throw things away, and it's also not very helpful to go digging in the piles of things she needs to keep to look for things to throw away.

 

 

 

I wouldn't suggest that she go through the stuff on her own either. It is very overwhelming when it is so much. (And more than likely drag on into infinity and beyond. Ain't nobody got time for that!) As you box things up, could you put away (drawers, closet) what you know she wears, then box the rest? Then, when she gets back, help her with the boxed stuff?

 

On the same note, put in boxes like items - things you know are too small, things that you think really should be trashed, etc. Then as you go through it, you will be helping her with the "willing to throw things away" as there will be reasons given for why something should go. If she doesn't already have the mindset (I know I didn't), training in this will go a long way. I really wish someone had taught it to me sooner. You can just do a box a week if you don't want to deal with it everyday.

[Garga]

Throw away obvious trash.

Put stuff you know she'll keep back in the room.

Sort everything else into some sort of categories.

Buy bins for the categories and bin it up.

Put bins in basement.

 

You can offer to go through the bins with her and if she says ok, then go through them with her--only about 1 every few days or 1 a week.

 

OR she can keep her stuff in the bins until she moves out and takes them with her.

 

That is honestly what I would do.

[Garga]

Oh, and once the room is clean, you need to help her with it daily. Every stinkin' day, the two of you need to go through the room and tidy it up. Every day. Don't tell her to do it. Go in there and show her how it's done, every single day.

 

After a year of this, maybe she'll be able to do it on her own if you say, "Go clean the room." Maybe not. If not, then you go in there with her. She needs training. I wish, wish, wish someone had done this with me. I still struggle with knowing how to get things done efficiently.

[Storygirl]

I agree with Garga. My son has ADHD, and it is extremely frustrating for me when I go through his room, helping him organize, only to have him toss things around willy nilly the very next day, essentially undoing all of the work that we did. He needs daily help with his room. And he cannot do his laundry on his own. I can give him a basket of laundry to fold, and he just can't handle it; it is overwhelming to him. He needs someone to sit and do his laundry with him. We put it away together. "Where is your underwear drawer? Yes, put this stack of underwear there." It's not fun.

 

Your girls may appreciate the work that you do cleaning out their room when they are gone (I hope they do!), but I think what will really help everyone is to establish daily habits to keep it under control. This will pay off now and in the future, as they will develop better habits. It's hard. I'm not good at the daily supervising, and I'm still working on it. But I'm offering my advice anyway, because I think that if you do not make new family routines, the room will quickly devolve into another mess.

[Mimm]

Oh, and once the room is clean, you need to help her with it daily. Every stinkin' day, the two of you need to go through the room and tidy it up. Every day. Don't tell her to do it. Go in there and show her how it's done, every single day.

 

After a year of this, maybe she'll be able to do it on her own if you say, "Go clean the room." Maybe not. If not, then you go in there with her. She needs training. I wish, wish, wish someone had done this with me. I still struggle with knowing how to get things done efficiently.

 

I know she'll need daily help and I'm not good at that type of thing. I am working on it, and getting a lot better this year. I wish I had had some kind of training in how to manage my housework better, but I don't know what my mother could have done. She was naturally neat, and didn't seem to need anyone training her how to be neat. She just couldn't understand how someone could be as messy as me. So I'm actually very sympathetic to my daughter's difficulties, and know what it's like to feel overwhelmed and unmotivated. I'm willing to deal with a certain amount of mess, but it's just too much for too long in this situation. :) She needs help.

[AHASRADA]

You've gotten excellent advice. I just wanted to recommend a podcast and blog that addresses getting a household clean, decluttered and under control, particularly for creative types who don't "see mess."

 

A Slob Comes Clean

[Mimm]

Thanks, I will check it out. :)

[Twigs]

…. I wish I had had some kind of training in how to manage my housework better, but I don't know what my mother could have done. She was naturally neat, and didn't seem to need anyone training her how to be neat. She just couldn't understand how someone could be as messy as me. …

:grouphug:  :grouphug:  :grouphug:

 

My mom didn't teach me to be clean and neat, so I understand!

 

As far as training in managing the clutter and cleaning, have you looked at the FlyLady site? She has lots of tips on how to develop habits and routines to keep a neat and clean house.

 

Her site can be pretty overwhelming, so start small. I will suggest the 31 Beginner Baby Steps. The 1st baby step is "shine your sink". That means just go to the kitchen and clean and shine the sink. FlyLady has the directions to do that. For your daughter, you might substitute "put all your clothes where they belong" for the 1st baby step.

 

Since you will be training your children, you will need to be with them while they are learning. The 31 baby steps are listed by day, but don't hesitate to stay on a single step for several days to really get it down. Don't think you have to do everything exactly as FlyLady says; do what works for you and let the rest go.

 

Best wishes.

[Stacia]

You've gotten excellent advice. I just wanted to recommend a podcast and blog that addresses getting a household clean, decluttered and under control, particularly for creative types who don't "see mess."

 

A Slob Comes Clean

I was just going to recommend this too.

[ElizabethB]

Buy another dresser or stacking drawers for her closet, big box store or container store will have stacking drawers, here is a picture:

 

http://www.containerstore.com/shop/storage/drawers?productId=10006900&ci_src=%7Bifpla:17588969%7D%7Bifpe:27500988%7D&ci_sku=10014931&srccode=cii_17588969&cpncode=42-57977311-2&utm_source=channelintelligence&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=google

 

I would pick a few clothes and things she likes to set out and pick a few, tell her she can replace with things she likes better if she does not like your selections, store the rest in a basement or attic or garage until she is ready to part with them. But, have a number or box size or something to limit or she will try to pick them all.

 

I would set up the room so they each have a clear half and anything on the wrong half gets taken away with some type of chore or $ or something to get it back, put down that tape someone mentioned. They also each get a clearly marked half of the closet with similar rules.

[Grantmom]

Just wanted to chime in an suggest the Konmari book that is all the rage right now.  (And I second, third, fourth all the suggestions to help her do it, do it together, don't just say, go do it.)  How did it turn out?

 

[Twigs]

Mimm,

Any update? I'd love to hear the cleanup went.

[bettyandbob]

I haven't read many responses, I just wanted to add my approach. When my dc go away and I decide to clean their rooms I:

1. Wash all the clothing

2. Sort random debris into recycling and trash

3. Sweep and vacuum.

 

When laundry is done I sort out too small or beat up stuff and determine if new clothing is needed.

 

I do not get rid of the trash or recycling. When the dc returns they are permitted to go through the trash or recycling if they wish. Sometimes it takes a awhile for dc to decide to do this, but they decide when to take these things to the curb.

 

With the folded, clean laundry, dc is enlisted in deciding if old system of storage is still working or a new one should be developed with dc's input. Same with books, craft stuff, and other things. This part of room cleaning and organizing can be hard, but I think it's important to get dc's input to get a system he/she can try to maintain. Since you've already done the cleaning part it is a little less daunting than sending dc into horribly messy room and saying clean it. You do the first few steps alone yo get pass the overwhelming point.

[Mimm]

:grouphug:  :grouphug:  :grouphug:

 

My mom didn't teach me to be clean and neat, so I understand!

 

As far as training in managing the clutter and cleaning, have you looked at the FlyLady site? She has lots of tips on how to develop habits and routines to keep a neat and clean house.

 

Her site can be pretty overwhelming, so start small. I will suggest the 31 Beginner Baby Steps. The 1st baby step is "shine your sink". That means just go to the kitchen and clean and shine the sink. FlyLady has the directions to do that. For your daughter, you might substitute "put all your clothes where they belong" for the 1st baby step.

 

Since you will be training your children, you will need to be with them while they are learning. The 31 baby steps are listed by day, but don't hesitate to stay on a single step for several days to really get it down. Don't think you have to do everything exactly as FlyLady says; do what works for you and let the rest go.

 

Best wishes.

 

I'm a FlyLady flunky. Frankly, she just drives me nuts. :p I'm way too snarky to deal with her on a daily basis.

 

Mimm,

Any update? I'd love to hear the cleanup went.

 

The clean up went well but the room isn't perfect yet. We are slowly working our way through the laundry, packing away winter clothes, getting rid of things they don't like, or have outgrown. We still have drawers to go through and the tub of things I saved for them to go through still sits untouched.

 

They were thrilled when they got home. My oldest in particular stood in the middle of the room, her mouth hanging open, then threw her arms around me. It was very satisfying and an even better reaction than I expected. :) Middle child is a little more uptight about her things being messed with, which is one reason I didn't go through the drawers (aside from just running out of time and energy). I mentioned some things that I got rid of and they were fine with them, and just today she asked if I threw something away and I told her to check the tub of things I saved and sure enough, it was in there. I also found lots of things that were lost and they were happy to have back.

[Reefgazer]

I sneak into DD room (she's the slob of the family) and cart 1 item out every few days. She doesn't even notice. I've told her repeatedly to clean that pigsty and she doesn't, so I do it now. I don't toss anything of heavy sentimental value or stuff that was a long term project for her.

My two oldest just left for camp this morning and I have seven days to clean their room. It's been trashed for over a year. Clearly I'm not good at just making them do it. But it's really mostly the fault of my 14 year old and we have a high conflict relationship anyway, so a messy room takes a back seat to other things. Anyway, so now I'm going to do it while she's not around. I'm planning to remove the mountains of clothes she has on the floor and give them back... how? Make her earn them? Give her one garment a day? Only on days when the room stays clean? Go in once a week and pick up everything off the floor and take it out of the room? I don't know, I welcome input from people who have had to take drastic measures to keep a kid's room clean.

 

And no, I'm not willing to keep shutting the door and pretending it doesn't exist. I've done that entire too much as it is. She and my 12 year old share a rather small room and it's not fair to my 12 year old that probably 80% of the mess is her sister's. And how do you even go about finding your 20% when the other person's mess is in the way? So enough is enough. It's a small room but it's a perfectly workable space, one that I'm willing to do what it takes to make sure it can be organized and nice. It's due a paint job. Overdue, actually, but we've been waiting on it to be cleaned before we can paint it!

 

But how do I decide what to throw away? Old art projects, lump pots from a pottery class a couple years ago, sea shells they picked up on a beach in TX four years ago, pokemon cards they haven't played with in like five or six years, posters a friend just gave them last week but no wall space to hang them, a violin no one has any interest in playing... And on and on and on. If I had my way, I'd throw it all out. But will this traumatize them? It's pretty invasive. Should I save a tub of stuff for them to go through?

 

ETA: UPDATE in post 45.

[PrairieSong]

I'm a FlyLady flunky. Frankly, she just drives me nuts. :p I'm way too snarky to deal with her on a daily basis.

 

 

The clean up went well but the room isn't perfect yet. We are slowly working our way through the laundry, packing away winter clothes, getting rid of things they don't like, or have outgrown. We still have drawers to go through and the tub of things I saved for them to go through still sits untouched.

 

They were thrilled when they got home. My oldest in particular stood in the middle of the room, her mouth hanging open, then threw her arms around me. It was very satisfying and an even better reaction than I expected. :) Middle child is a little more uptight about her things being messed with, which is one reason I didn't go through the drawers (aside from just running out of time and energy). I mentioned some things that I got rid of and they were fine with them, and just today she asked if I threw something away and I told her to check the tub of things I saved and sure enough, it was in there. I also found lots of things that were lost and they were happy to have back.

I'm so glad they were thrilled to see what you had done! It sounds like you're making good progress. I totally understand the messy kids' room struggle!