Would you move or stay put?

[DawnM]

I have been wanting to move for a long time.  We live about 30-40 minutes from EVERY activity we do.  DH is almost an hour to work.  The activities we do and DH's work are in the same direction, so moving closer to the city would allow all of us to be closer to everything.

 

I finally got DH to agree to start thinking of selling our house.  It needs some things done before we can sell (it isn't just a few outdated things, it is unfinished projects).  

 

We hired someone to come in because DH simply does not have the time.  He botched the job so badly that we are now having to find someone else to come in, but we are running out of money......LOOOONNNNNNGGGGGG story.

 

However, in the period of time that we have gotten more serious and I have started looking, I have realized a few things:

 

Negatives on moving.

 

1.  The area we are moving to is a higher priced area.  We can either downsize fairly significantly or we can have a higher mortgage.

 

2.  Mortgage rates have gone up.  We have 2.37% on a 15 year.   

 

3.  It will be costly.  Realtor fees, closing costs, etc.....

 

4.  Our bills will go up by about $300/mo more than we currently pay just because taxes are higher and we will have a water bill.  Right now we have very low taxes and no water bill.  

 

Positives on moving:

 

1. Closer in.  We drive sometimes 3 full hours per day to get to and from actives and no, we cannot stop those at this time.

 

2. Closer to friends.  I often meet friends for coffee.....popping over rather than heavy planning would be fantastic.

 

3.  Closer to Dh's work so he can spend less time on the road.  

 

4. Oldest will be looking at going to CC in a year.  Living on the bus line or the train line would be fantastic as he doesn't want to drive and driving him would be brutal.

 

5.  I am just tired of living so far out.  We have NO friends or activities where we are.  None.

[JFSinIL]

The cost in gas and all the time behind the wheel you have now is worth more than $300.  Downsize a bit and MOVE.

[PinkTulip]

Factor in lower gas prices due to less driving and less wear and tear on your cars ...

[marbel]

Gas/wear and tear, and time spent driving are what I was thinking about too.   I think people - maybe especially women? - don't think about the actual value of their time.

 

But I can see it would be a tough decision to make for many reasons. 

[DawnM]

The cost in gas and all the time behind the wheel you have now is worth more than $300.  Downsize a bit and MOVE.

 

 

Actually we have a hybrid, so at least we aren't spending $300 on gas per month.  And that is with gas prices currently low.  Dh drives a car that gets about 30mpg to and from work, so he uses about $3/day x 22 days = $66.

 

I use about $4/day (70-80 miles per day roughly) in a hybrid that gets at least 40mpg.  So, that would be about $88 per month.

 

Weekends we use approximately $100/month.

 

So we are still around $300/mo.  We will still drive some when we move, but it could go down to $100 ($150 max) using CURRENT prices.

 

Of course, if gas goes back up to $4/gallon, this will double and HAS been double in the past.

[DawnM]

And yes, wear and tear is huge.  We put a lot of miles on our cars right now.

[DawnM]

You folks that are saying option 3 aren't telling me what you are thinking that might be!  I would love an alternative idea.

[SamanthaCarter]

I think I'd put the house on the market and move if and when it sells. When you sell the house, move to a rental while you look for something to buy closer in. Moving into a rental will help you downsize your stuff so you can downsize your home. 

 

ETA: that vote was me. :)

[lllll]

..

[Chris in VA]

I think on the surface, moving sounds great. Less commute time for your hubby and for activities would be a big plus in my book.

 

OTOH, do your kids have any attachment to your current home or surroundings? Have you lived in your current place all their lives, for instance? Moving can be difficult on kids at their ages,particularly the 14yo and 10yo.

 

How are the schools where you want to go; plans change, and so I'm thinking you might want to move to a district that has good high schools just in case you decide to go the B&M route with your youngest.

 

Would this be a home you'd stay in for a long time? Can you build equity quickly? Will your current home sell easily once you fix it up?

 

Lots of questions--none of my beeswax--just questions I'd ask myself.

 

 

[DawnM]

I think I'd put the house on the market and move if and when it sells. When you sell the house, move to a rental while you look for something to buy closer in. Moving into a rental will help you downsize your stuff so you can downsize your home. 

 

ETA: that vote was me. :)

 

 

Actually that is already the plan. It makes DH far too nervous to sell and feel pressured to buy and close both houses simultaneously.  There is a townhouse complex up near the city that we rented for 3 months in when we first moved here and we were waiting for our SoCal house to sell and close.

 

We will most likely just go back there if they have space as we can have 3 bedrooms and they will allow our dogs.  It is pricey, but for month to month AND close to the city, it is worth it.

 

However, we will need a storage unit.  We wouldn't plan to set up a complete house situation for just a few months.

[zoobie]

$300 a month for greatly improved quality of life? Start packing!

 

Also, check with homeowners insurance if the renovation is that bad. They may fix it and go after his insurance. Or you could do that directly. That's why you (and he) have insurance. :)

[regentrude]

I would consider saving  DH two hours of his life every work day and you up to 3 hours time on some days to be a huge improvement of quality of life and would try to make this work, even if it meant downsizing.

[SproutMamaK]

I would move. You time together as a family is valuable. Honestly, I would go nuts having to consistently spend that much time in a vehicle. It sounds like next year it will be all but necessary for your oldest, anyway.

[SamanthaCarter]

Actually that is already the plan. It makes DH far too nervous to sell and feel pressured to buy and close both houses simultaneously.  There is a townhouse complex up near the city that we rented for 3 months in when we first moved here and we were waiting for our SoCal house to sell and close.

 

We will most likely just go back there if they have space as we can have 3 bedrooms and they will allow our dogs.  It is pricey, but for month to month AND close to the city, it is worth it.

 

However, we will need a storage unit.  We wouldn't plan to set up a complete house situation for just a few months.

 

Sounds good! When we moved, we went from an 1800 sqft house to a 1300 sqft rental townhouse. We ended up being there for two years. The nice thing about that place was that it had a large, easily accessible attic, where we were able to store everything we hadn't gotten rid of during the move, but that wouldn't fit in the townhouse. We found that storage units were way more expensive than we anticipated, so that attic saved us a good bit of money. :)

[DawnM]

Thank you all!  So far no votes for staying put.

 

I don't want to stay put......but I do worry about the cost, etc......

 

I am so tired of feeling like I live so far out!

[Storygirl]

We are in an eerily similar situation, except that to move closer to DH's work meant moving prohibitively far from all of my children's activities. So we are moving to a city two hours away, where DH can work out of a different office (for the same company), and we can live eight minutes from his workplace instead of almost an hour. There is one particular day each week that DH and I do a combined six hours of driving, including the commute to work plus getting my kids to their activities (which are spread out in several different directions from our home). We find that to be a huge problem.

 

I say move. Your quality of life is worth a lot. We calculated that our move will potentially save us 700 hours of driving time for our family per year. That is almost 30 full 24 hour days that we will recover for our family life. We'll gain a month of our lives back every year. We are definitely sacrificing some things in order to move, but we are gaining more important things in return.

[catz]

We downsized to move into the city and into a more convenient location.  We drive a fraction of the time of most suburban friends and rarely to never in heavy traffic.  No regrets at all.  The idea of driving 3 hours to activities about makes me want to cry!  Yikes!

[DawnM]

We are in an eerily similar situation, except that to move closer to DH's work meant moving prohibitively far from all of my children's activities. So we are moving to a city two hours away, where DH can work out of a different office (for the same company), and we can live eight minutes from his workplace instead of almost an hour. There is one particular day each week that DH and I do a combined six hours of driving, including the commute to work plus getting my kids to their activities (which are spread out in several different directions from our home). We find that to be a huge problem.

 

I say move. Your quality of life is worth a lot. We calculated that our move will potentially save us 700 hours of driving time for our family per year. That is almost 30 full 24 hour days that we will recover for our family life. We'll gain a month of our lives back every year. We are definitely sacrificing some things in order to move, but we are gaining more important things in return.

 

 

That does put things into perspective.  I don't always drive 3 hours per day, but it is more often than I would like.  Today I will be in the car 3 full hours.  I have to go 3 times to church!

 

Our church school is offering driver's ed to homeschoolers this week as well as to their high schoolers on winter break.  We are taking advantage of it.

 

However, I have to get them there at 7:30, so an hour r/t.  I have to pick them up at 2pm, so another hour r/t.  Then I have to be at church at 6:15 for Wed. night church, another hour r/t.

 

Tomorrow will be better, only 2 hours in the car!  :crying:

 

Friday will be 2 hours.

 

Saturday the kids go on a campout, so I will not have to leave the house!  And I think I won't!  I have an activity but I think I am bailing on it.

 

Sunday 2 hours.

 

Monday 3 hours

 

You get the idea........

[Anne in CA]

We live above the restaurant, our work, but drive at least 30 minutes to anything else. We are happy where we live, and there is no work commute at all, so we deal with it. In your case, I would move. The higher mortgage will also be paying for your time that you are getting back. If you had worked a part time job all the hours you have spent driving, how much money would you have now? Something to think about, for sure. We also have a hybrid so that gas is not really the issue, but your time is still gone. 

[gardenmom5]

when you calculate your costs on moving - do you include

• the cost of fuel?  you won't be driving as far so you won't need to buy as much gas. 
•  the wear and tear cost on a car?  you won't be putting as many miles on a car, the frequency of service will drop, and you won't need to replace one as often.
• lower car insurance rates because you are driving less
• you will have more time for preparing meals from scratch - which are healthier and cost less
• your dh will have more time at home to spend with his children

[lllll]

..

[Audrey]

I would move, and I would downsize to keep the moving cost and living costs down.  It would be worth the cozier space to be closer to the city, but IMO it wouldn't be worth the financial stress if you had to increase your living expenses that much.   

[Runningmom80]

Location, location, location.

[kroe1]

I would need more information before I vote.

 

1. Have you realized the huge cost anytime anyone takes on a new mortgage, even when downsizing? Mortgages pack all the interest on the front end of a loan. Principal only gets paid more and more as the loan progresses. If you have had your current loan for awhile, then you are paying more on your principal than a new loan on a lower priced home. That is a huge cost most people fail to realize.

 

2. Your youngest is 10. Therefore, you only have about 8 to 10 nest years left. You need to start planning your empty nest life. Where do you want to be? What kind of place do you want your grandchildren to come visit? Do you need space for hobbies? Do you have medical conditions that need nearby physicians?

 

3. Where is your church? Chances are your life will revolve around the church more after the empty nest begins.

 

4. How stable is your DH's job? How close is he to retirement or just being fed up?

 

At any rate, Inwould go ahead and repair your current home so moving at least remains an option. Lesson learned is that we should always strive to keep our homes in repair and somewhat updated. Life is always full of surprises, right?

[MysteryJen]

Okay, I am a lone voice for staying put. We faced a similar situation. Dh has a 40 minute commute and we drive 30 minutes to the major activities. And this is twice a day activity.

But, when we ran the numbers on the cost of moving to a more expensive area (selling, new mortgage, the costs of going to a "new" house-window treatments, various repairs, etc, the rise in property taxes, all the miscellaneous stuff that causes money to fly out of your hands when you move), we realized that even when gas was high, we could drive to the city in question, twice a day, for 20 years, for the cost of moving. Even with needing new cars earlier. My youngest is 10 now, even if he stays with the same team, we were looking at a max of 8 years of driving. 

 

So we stayed put, it is not ideal, but it works. Dh and I will be looking at the next move as the "downsizing, ready for retirement" move.

[DawnM]

I would need more information before I vote.

 

1. Have you realized the huge cost anytime anyone takes on a new mortgage, even when downsizing? Mortgages pack all the interest on the front end of a loan. Principal only gets paid more and more as the loan progresses. If you have had your current loan for awhile, then you are paying more on your principal than a new loan on a lower priced home. That is a huge cost most people fail to realize.

 

2. Your youngest is 10. Therefore, you only have about 8 to 10 nest years left. You need to start planning your empty nest life. Where do you want to be? What kind of place do you want your grandchildren to come visit? Do you need space for hobbies? Do you have medical conditions that need nearby physicians?

 

3. Where is your church? Chances are your life will revolve around the church more after the empty nest begins.

 

4. How stable is your DH's job? How close is he to retirement or just being fed up?

 

At any rate, Inwould go ahead and repair your current home so moving at least remains an option. Lesson learned is that we should always strive to keep our homes in repair and somewhat updated. Life is always full of surprises, right?

 

 

1.  Yes, we have actually fixed up and sold 3 other homes for profit in CA before moving here.  We have a 15 year mortgage on a 2.37% loan.  From the first payment, 2/3 of the check went to principal.  We know how it works.

 

2.  Where do I WANT to be?  Back in Southern California in the hills overlooking LA.  Will that happen?  No.

 

I am not sure I fully understand this question.  Where we retire has little to do with where we need to be for the next 20 years.  We are a min. of 20 years away from retirement.

 

We have NO IDEA where we want to retire.  I say the mountains and DH says the beach.  We will probably end up just staying in town, but will see where our kids end up.  There is no way to know what 20 more years will bring us.

 

3.  Church is the area we are wanting to move TO.

 

4. Very stable.  He has been there almost 10 years and has moved up the ladder as far as he can go, but moving jobs won't help, so he is staying.  They love him there and barring some unforeseen event, he will be staying there very long term.

 

As for repairing our home and us not having learned a lesson......we have always bought fixers, mostly cosmetic.  DH has always had time to fix them and loves doing it.  Now that he has moved up the ladder to his current position, he has far less time and things just haven't gotten done.  Nothing is horrible, but the basement is finished, all but the baseboards and door frames.  Bathroom still needs baseboards.  Kitchen needs lighting and painting......nothing major at this point.  

 

So, no real lesson to be learned, we knew full well we were getting a fixer, we just didn't anticipate Dh's time and DH is an accountant so parting with his money is difficult for him.  He hates paying someone to do a job that he can do AND he is a perfectionist, so if it isn't done right it drives him crazy.

 

I don't see us EVERY buying a fully 100% fixed up home with no equity.....we just can't.  

[DawnM]

Another thing to consider is group living situations (townhouses, apartments, etc.).  In a house, there is generally a buffer between you and the neighbor.  But in a townhouse, there is usually at least one shared wall.  Suppose the neighbors are smokers (and you don't smoke), or love to play their music loudly, or yell at anything that moves, or have barking dogs or whining cats or screaming kids - or whatever.  And you've signed a lease and can't get out of it.  Also, there can be a high turnover in such places; which might be a curse or a blessing in disguise. 

 

I'd say to have a Plan B just in case.

 

 

You mean for the 2-3 months we need to live there?  

 

Our problem is in finding a situation temporarily month to month.  Most places don't allow for that.  And the other issue is our two large black labs.  

 

I have never, ever found a rental house that would allow 2 large dogs and month to month only.

 

We are a bit stuck.

 

Thankfully these town homes are in one of the best areas of the city so the tenants are a bit higher caliber, most working in professional type jobs and just need a temporary living situation.

[QueenCat]

Lifestyle is very important to us.......... so spending more time at home or with people, and less driving, would be a huge factor for a situation that would last more than a year or two. I'd move closer to where everything we do is, even if it cost a little more. As long as you can afford it, and it is where you will be happier, do it.

[bettyandbob]

Earlier I voted for moving. Then, you posted about moving to a rental and putting stuff in storage. I think moving to a rental is a good idea. Storage not good. Start downsizing now, before you make your final decision. Get rid of all the clutter you can. Sell stuff that might have value that you do not use. Use this as your push to get rid of stuff you've been holding onto simply because you have space. 

 

Storage is such a money suck, I would not move if that had to be the plan. You forget about and keep paying the fees. By the time you get back to it and sort through it your lives have moved on.

[Tsuga]

Less time in the car is less stress and you can't buy time. Move.

 

I wish you the best of luck no matter what you decide.

[MysteryJen]

For me, the time in the car with the kids (especially the teens) is golden. It has been a great way to just talk about all kinds of things. It was an unexpected bonus to our decision. I am convinced conversations in the car with teens are the way to tackle the stuff which makes them stressed.

[MistyMountain]

I would move for sure. It sounds like 300 a month is affordable for you or you could downsize. Plus with all the gas costs and vehicle wear and tear it really won't be more. Gas prices will go back up. I would move for the lifestyle reasons. I would hate to spend so much time in a car. I personally also do not like long commutes for environmental reasons.

[lllll]

..

[Catwoman]

As long as the whole family is in favor of the new location, I would move. :)

[Seasider]

We have faced similar decisions (specifically about whether or not to purchase rural land) and for us, the bottom line was how cut off our teens would feel. DH and I decided we did not want our near young adult kids to have to make long commutes, especially late at night or in bad weather. In our circumstance, we feel we missed the window; country living would have been great for young growing children. But the benefits seemed to change/diminish once they started driving and entering into a larger social circle on their own.

 

So, my vote is to move, with the caveat to closely scrutinize the financial impact before making a permanent decision.

[DawnM]

I would move for sure. It sounds like 300 a month is affordable for you or you could downsize. Plus with all the gas costs and vehicle wear and tear it really won't be more. Gas prices will go back up. I would move for the lifestyle reasons. I would hate to spend so much time in a car. I personally also do not like long commutes for environmental reasons.

 

 

$300 would not break us, I would prefer not to spend it, but...... it is doable.

 

The truth is, I don't know why I am stressing so much about money.  We aren't wealthy, but we do just fine.  We do Crown Financial and there is a part of me that would like everything paid off NOW, including mortgage, but I need to balance that with the ability to live and enjoy life too.  I can't always seem to do both.

 

Dawn

[DawnM]

Here is all we will be closer to.

 

Church (4-5 times per week with various youth groups, kids' programs, special activities)

Scouts (1-2 times per week depending on activities and events)

Work (5 times per week, during busy season, 6)

Therapy (2-3 times per week)

Homeschool Co-op (once per week)

Homeschool Group/Outings (1-2 times per week)

Friends for coffee (1-3 times per week)

Game night for son (Friday nights)

Costco (once per week)

Soccer- 2-3 times per week

All shopping

 

 

 

 

Here is all we do close to our home:

 

Listen and you can hear the crickets chirping........

 

[aggieamy]

I would downsize and move tomorrow.  You will love being close to things.  We were out in the boonies and sold our house and didn't have time to buy another one before we had to be out so we rented a place that was literally within walking distance of most of our friends and almost all our activities.  We lived there for a year and loved it.  DH and I still talk fondly about that.  Then we found our "perfect" house and moved about five miles away into the suburbs.  Oops.  Wish we had settled for a less "perfect" house in the part of town we loved.  

[Tammyla]

Dawn, I would probably want to move.  However, I would consider where you and dh will want to live once the kids are grown.  

 

I wish...well, I wish I had considered that and living in a home as retired-seniors when we purchased our current home.  Just something to consider, as it creeps up on you faster than you thing.

[DawnM]

I would rather live in a small two bedroom apartment vs. a newer house with yard - just to have no to less car time. 

 

Personally if it was me I would find the location that would have the least amount of driving. Then buy whatever I could afford in that spot. 

 

 

We pretty much know the area we want.  It is right around the corner from church, and within a 7 mile or so radius from all that we do.  It is a bit pricey, but it is a nice area.

 

Another bonus is that the schools there are good, so resale will stay ok.  The area we are in now has excellent schools and I am hoping that will be a good selling point.

 

An interesting point:   Our youth pastor lived 9 miles SouthEast of church.  He said sometimes it took him 45 min. to drive to work in the am.  He moved to an 8 mile away house on due West.

 

I asked him why he moved if it only saved him a mile.  He said the commute from that area to work took a MAXIMUM with heavy traffic, 20 min., usually 12-15 on average compared to the heavier trafficked area.

 

I had no idea where he lived before was so heavily trafficked.

 

Dawn

[gardenmom5]

DawnM, on 14 Jan 2015 - 12:15 PM, said:

 

 

I had no idea where he lived before was so heavily trafficked.

 

Dawn

in the area we live - commute distance is measured in minutes.  (not miles or blocks.)

time can vary widely just depending upon the *direction* you are going.

[DawnM]

We will not live within walking distance by minutes......this city just isn't as accommodating for that as the city we moved from.

 

If we lived close enough for DH to bike to work, we would HAVE to live in an apartment or condo.  There are no free standing houses near at all.  And he would bike through very heavy city traffic.  After finding the dead body 2 years ago on the sidewalk with no face (he was hit by a bus), he has no desire to do anything dangerous on his commute to work.

[QueenCat]

$300 would not break us, I would prefer not to spend it, but...... it is doable.

 

The truth is, I don't know why I am stressing so much about money.  We aren't wealthy, but we do just fine.  We do Crown Financial and there is a part of me that would like everything paid off NOW, including mortgage, but I need to balance that with the ability to live and enjoy life too.  I can't always seem to do both.

 

Dawn

 

Balance is important; not everything is about money. I'm glad you recognize the need for balance.

[Rebel Yell]

My thoughts inside in red...

I have been wanting to move for a long time.  We live about 30-40 minutes from EVERY activity we do.  DH is almost an hour to work.  The activities we do and DH's work are in the same direction, so moving closer to the city would allow all of us to be closer to everything.

 

I finally got DH to agree to start thinking of selling our house.  It needs some things done before we can sell (it isn't just a few outdated things, it is unfinished projects).  

 

We hired someone to come in because DH simply does not have the time.  He botched the job so badly that we are now having to find someone else to come in, but we are running out of money......LOOOONNNNNNGGGGGG story. Just do what needs to be fixed to code or whatever, don't focus on upgrades/updates unless it;s reallllllly bad.

 

However, in the period of time that we have gotten more serious and I have started looking, I have realized a few things:

 

Negatives on moving.

 

1.  The area we are moving to is a higher priced area.  We can either downsize fairly significantly or we can have a higher mortgage. Downsize if you can't afford the mortgage. Some houses can be smaller but set up 'smarter' KWIM? Plus you don't need a nursery, Lego room, play room, or even probably a separate school room.

 

2.  Mortgage rates have gone up.  We have 2.37% on a 15 year.   

 

3.  It will be costly.  Realtor fees, closing costs, etc.....

 

4.  Our bills will go up by about $300/mo more than we currently pay just because taxes are higher and we will have a water bill.  Right now we have very low taxes and no water bill.  

 

Positives on moving:

 

1. Closer in.  We drive sometimes 3 full hours per day to get to and from actives and no, we cannot stop those at this time. gas and time, plus wear/tear on your cars is more significant than you probably realize.

 

2. Closer to friends.  I often meet friends for coffee.....popping over rather than heavy planning would be fantastic.

 

3.  Closer to Dh's work so he can spend less time on the road.  same as my reply to #1. Plus huge gain in family time.

 

4. Oldest will be looking at going to CC in a year.  Living on the bus line or the train line would be fantastic as he doesn't want to drive and driving him would be brutal. Diamond lives 6 miles from our community college- and on days when I need the car it;s a massive pain to drive in circles all day to do whate we need to do. Plus the college schedule will change every semester, wrecking any sort of schedule you had the one before.

 

5.  I am just tired of living so far out.  We have NO friends or activities where we are.  None. Just move already!

 

[Guest]

I have always considered gas to be half the cost of driving a vehicle.  

I know that is a wide-ranging marker, bu it has worked out for me in the past.  When I paid myself the per-mile rate the IRS allows on tax forms, I always had the money I needed for insurance, repairs, maintenance and gas--and replacement.  Use that number (less a little bit because insurance is insurance no matter how many miles you drive, for the most part) to count the cost of driving.  

 

The time back in your day would be worth something, but you can't really put a dollar amount on it because that is a false measurement.  It's a real but not necessarily monetary benefit.  

 

And I am all about being close in.  I feel positively rural when it takes longer than 7 minutes to get to a grocery store.  So bear that in mind when I give you my thought:  move and downsize.  

[DawnM]

I have always considered gas to be half the cost of driving a vehicle.  

I know that is a wide-ranging marker, bu it has worked out for me in the past.  When I paid myself the per-mile rate the IRS allows on tax forms, I always had the money I needed for insurance, repairs, maintenance and gas--and replacement.  Use that number (less a little bit because insurance is insurance no matter how many miles you drive, for the most part) to count the cost of driving.  

 

The time back in your day would be worth something, but you can't really put a dollar amount on it because that is a false measurement.  It's a real but not necessarily monetary benefit.  

 

And I am all about being close in.  I feel positively rural when it takes longer than 7 minutes to get to a grocery store.  So bear that in mind when I give you my thought:  move and downsize.  

 

 

Yeah, and you know what?   When I drive to soccer practice or a church activity, or whatever, I could drop them off and go home for a while!  I can't do that right now,  not enough time and way too far.

[Nart]

Can you rent your house and move closer to town and rent a place to live for a year? You have such a great mortgage rate.

[HeWillSoar]

A friend of mine just moved out to the country and her life is like that, but she likes it.  You don't sound like you like it so much, except for the cost, so I say move.

[Scarlett]

I don think this is a black and white issue.....30 min is not that bad.....probably I would put the house up for sale and not take less than the best price.