Michelle Duggars big announcement is....

[stripe]

2) and I can't get over nursing for only a couple months because getting pregnant again is more important than the baby who could benefit from nursing another 6-18months. The "old" baby get "substandard" (standard is breastmilk so anything under is below standard even if it's "good enough") so they can fulfill whatever this is? Why not give each baby what they should have and however many kids you have, you do?

Oh. Wow. That's kind of sad. I believe children do have a right to be breastfed, and for beyond 6 mo, and that is a part of my religious beliefs -- I believe God has wisdom behind breastfeeding and lactation amenorrhea to allow the woman time to recover, and (as I understand it) provide optimal health for the next kid (a gap of at least 12 mo is associated with better health for the babies). I sure didn't feel like getting pregnant at 6 mo. post partum. I don't even know how they find the time to "try."

[Joanne]

Oh. Wow. That's kind of sad. I believe children do have a right to be breastfed, and for beyond 6 mo, and that is a part of my religious beliefs -- I believe God has wisdom behind breastfeeding and lactation amenorrhea to allow the woman time to recover, and (as I understand it) provide optimal health for the next kid (a gap of at least 12 mo is associated with better health for the babies). I sure didn't feel like getting pregnant at 6 mo. post partum. I don't even know how they find the time to "try."

 

Human acceleration of "God's timing" is not uncommon in the Quiverful subculture. It even seems, at times, competitive.

[Kate in Arabia]

Human acceleration of "God's timing" is not uncommon in the Quiverful subculture. It even seems, at times, competitive.

I remember being struck by this quote from an NPR interview I heard some time ago with some claiming to follow the "Quiverfull movement":

 

"The womb is such a powerful weapon; it's a weapon against the enemy," Campbell says.

 

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=102005062

 

I'm curious if this is a common thought? I really don't know a whole lot about it...

[Mrs Mungo]

I remember being struck by this quote from an NPR interview I heard some time ago with some claiming to follow the "Quiverfull movement":

 

"The womb is such a powerful weapon; it's a weapon against the enemy," Campbell says.

 

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=102005062

 

I'm curious if this is a common thought? I really don't know a whole lot about it...

 

In my experience with quiverfulls (which, I fully admit, is limited) it is a very common thought.

[cathmom]

Well, I could have babies that close together while still nursing (early return of fertility despite following all the "rules"), but after like 4 or 5, I think I'd be completely and totally worn out!

[Jami]

It seems this time she was still nursing and it was a surprise to her--

 

http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20301647,00.html

[busymama7]

Michelle mentions in the book a couple of key things. One is that despite breastfeeding(although we do see pacifiers) her cycles return pretty early. Secondly, she has gotten pregnant while nursing a number of times. Whether she has ever weaned to get ready for another I can't quite say, but I have always assumed that if she did it was because they knew it was inevitable and felt it would be healthier for everyone involved. I dont agree, I have been pregnant and nursing several times and have tandem nursed 2 times and preparing to most likely be tandeming again come spring. But I have not been in their shoes, my children have not come as close as theirs. Breastfeeding has given me more of a space, but it does not for Michelle. Here is a quote from MSNBC, she had not weaned Jordyn.

 

"The newest Duggar is coming a bit ahead of schedule. The average gap between the children is 18 months, and Michelle was just eight months away from giving birth to Jordyn when she noticed her body wasn’t quite right: She was following the Weight Watchers program to shed the weight she’d put on in her latest pregnancy, but wasn’t losing any pounds. Also, Jordyn would fuss every time she nursed, which wasn’t normal.

Michelle said those two clues should have registered, but they didn’t. Finally, she took a home pregnancy test and learned that, at the age of 42, she was pregnant again. "

 

She also mentions in the book that it wasn't until Jackson(#15!) that she had a nursing experience that wasn't fraught with intense pain. Yet she nursed all her babies anyways for as long as she could.

[Blessedfamily]

Of course, there's no way to give the necessary love and attention to 19 children, for the same reason that we often complain that our children don't get personal attention in a public school class with 18 other children. It's also clear to me that massive overpopulation, misery, and environmental collapse would visit our society if every family modeled the Duggars' lifestyle.

 

Having said that, this family is better for society and provides better for their children than the many thousands of women who have multiple children by multiple men, none of whom are their husbands, and then proceed to neglect these children and/or abandon them to the foster care system.

 

So yes, the Duggar family troubles me in some ways, but other things are more worthy of my attention and disapproval.

 

I'll just agree with this post for myself. I can't see being able to give that many children the attention I would want to give. Mabybe they've figured it out...I've never even seen a commercial for the program, so I don't know.

[Mrs Mungo]

Michelle mentions in the book a couple of key things. One is that despite breastfeeding(although we do see pacifiers) her cycles return pretty early. Secondly, she has gotten pregnant while nursing a number of times. Whether she has ever weaned to get ready for another I can't quite say, but I have always assumed that if she did it was because they knew it was inevitable and felt it would be healthier for everyone involved.

 

I'm not denying anything she has said. She says this was a huge surprise because she was still nursing this time, that implies she often wasn't still nursing other times. As I said, at one time it stated on their website that she weaned her babies around 6 months to formula in order to get pregnant with the next baby. That's the only thing I've said I disagree with.

[kmacnchs]

Check out this quiverful thread

I do not think a single person would consider it a "competition" or anything like that...

 

I remember being struck by this quote from an NPR interview I heard some time ago with some claiming to follow the "Quiverfull movement":

 

"The womb is such a powerful weapon; it's a weapon against the enemy," Campbell says.

 

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=102005062

 

I'm curious if this is a common thought? I really don't know a whole lot about it...

[Scarlett]

She is. I find her serenity in dealing with the behavior gaffes inspiring.

 

But I have to say, I can't help but scream at the TV "Get off her, Jim-Bob!!!" whenever there is an announcement since, like, baby #15. I am aware that this is my own bias and am happy that they're happy, though. :001_smile:

 

I am happy for them too, but I made myself giggle when I was reading the news article about it and Jim Bob asks for the public to submit J names....I thought, 'JUST STOP IT!'

 

I'm easy to amuse though.

[stripe]

Re: "They don't TRY"

 

Uh, yes, they are trying. This is a personal pet peeve of mine. I know many married people with several children who claim a pregnancy was a surprise. If you're having intercourse without trying to prevent, then to me, you're trying to become pregnant. Pregnancy is not a by-product of intention.

[Audrey]

Yep having baby 19 next year. Wow, just wow.

 

 

Well.... since I have nothing nice to say, I'll just go revisit my lunch in private. :ack2:

[unsinkable]

She is. I find her serenity in dealing with the behavior gaffes inspiring.

 

But I have to say, I can't help but scream at the TV "Get off her, Jim-Bob!!!" whenever there is an announcement since, like, baby #15. I am aware that this is my own bias and am happy that they're happy, though. :001_smile:

 

:lol:

 

or maybe it's "Get off him, Michelle!"

[LaxMom]

Well, I could have babies that close together while still nursing (early return of fertility despite following all the "rules"), but after like 4 or 5, I think I'd be completely and totally worn out!

Me, too. 6 weeks with one nursling, 6 months with twins. :glare: Stupid "rules". (I also lost exactly 1 lb from delivery to first birthday with the singleton... grrrr)

 

If they're all 18 months or so apart, that would make complete sense, even if her body read, understood and followed the "rules". At 9 months, the babies would be eating some solid food, which is usually the warning time for the return of fertility (if it ever left... no, I'm not bitter) whether you're trying or not.

or maybe it's "Get off him, Michelle!"

Well, that's true! I just can't imagine being the instigator when it's my body that gets all out of whack. :D

[funschooler5]

I am happy for them too, but I made myself giggle when I was reading the news article about it and Jim Bob asks for the public to submit J names....I thought, 'JUST STOP IT!'

 

I'm easy to amuse though.

 

 

:lol:

 

Honestly, to me that's the thing that bugs me about them the most. Enough with the J names! It's almost like they are naming pets...no thought going into it at all, as long as it starts with J. Why not just give the kids numbers instead of names?

 

I do wonder about Michelle's health though (and the health of her children). A woman's body needs some time to recover between pregnancies, let alone 19. What kind of toll is this taking on her body? Doesn't her husband care about her health at all? :001_huh:

[sunshine]

I will admit it: I am just jealous. Huge house, huge land, financially secure, loving, admiring, totally involved husband, close knit kids that cheerfully help each other, and as many children as she wants.

Yep, I am just jealous.

[HRAAB]

First off, love is limitless, boundless. However, time is not. There are only so many hours in the day; you cannot increase time. Otherwise, they show themselves to be a loving, devoted, responsible family.

 

I'm probably a bit biased since dh comes from a family of 14. Just because my mil could give birth 14 times with no complications, did not mean she had the personality, ability to deal with 14 children. In their family you had clean clothes on Monday, a bath on Saturday, three meals a day (not necessarily in a timely fashion - dinner at 9 PM sometiems) and swift kick to remind you to behave, and that was all she could get done. Many of the emotional needs were not well met. That is not to imply that my mil did not love her children; she most certainly loved them. Being human, she was limited though. None of her children wanted a large family. When I was pregnant with our twins (5 children total) my sil was very worried about me; she reminded me more than once, "You don't want to end up like mom."

 

I will admit that Michelle seems to have it all under control, though. Based on what I've seen of their TV show, they're a happy, loving family.

 

They still make me uneasy, but there is nothing concrete to point to.

 

Janet

[Happy]

Getting to be the old lady I am, I wonder how she will feel when this new baby is 18. My youngest came into our lives when I was 33...I was 51 when he graduated from high school. Believe me, I'm much more tired than I thought I would be.

 

Is it just all about babies...what about having time for a relationship with your adult children? All of them.

[cathmom]

First off, love is limitless, boundless. However, time is not. There are only so many hours in the day; you cannot increase time. Otherwise, they show themselves to be a loving, devoted, responsible family.

 

I'm probably a bit biased since dh comes from a family of 14. Just because my mil could give birth 14 times with no complications, did not mean she had the personality, ability to deal with 14 children. In their family you had clean clothes on Monday, a bath on Saturday, three meals a day (not necessarily in a timely fashion - dinner at 9 PM sometiems) and swift kick to remind you to behave, and that was all she could get done. Many of the emotional needs were not well met. That is not to imply that my mil did not love her children; she most certainly loved them. Being human, she was limited though. None of her children wanted a large family. When I was pregnant with our twins (5 children total) my sil was very worried about me; she reminded me more than once, "You don't want to end up like mom."

 

I will admit that Michelle seems to have it all under control, though. Based on what I've seen of their TV show, they're a happy, loving family.

 

They still make me uneasy, but there is nothing concrete to point to.

 

Janet

 

Yes, with my 7, I feel I am at the absolute maximum of children I can handle and meet all their needs. And one of them is grown up already LOL! The Duggars' spread is about what mine is from oldest to youngest - I cannot imagine having another 10 or 11 dc in between!!!

[TravelingChris]

A good friend of mine had two children very close apart because she thought that breastfeeding would keep her infertile for that time. SHe got pregrant about nine weeks after the birth of the older one.

[msjones]

I wonder if we're just biased in our birth-control culture. My mother had something like 113 cousins. I can't remember all the numbers, but a few of her aunts had more than 14 kids who lived to adulthood. (I bet the grammar gals on this board could rip that sentence to shreds! I can't get it right...)

 

I suppose these same women may have had 19 if they had had access to modern medicine, like Michelle Duggar. Maybe even more, since they married younger. Who knows?

 

I've never seen the show, but have seen a few interviews. My sense was that they were enjoying their unusually large and lovely family, and caring for them quite well.

[Heather in OK]

Wonderful news! :)

 

I wouldn't appreciate people judging my family so I have no beef with their choices at all.

[HRAAB]

Wonderful news! :)

 

I wouldn't appreciate people judging my family so I have no beef with their choices at all.

 

You are right about that. I don't care to be judged, but then I don't have my own television show broadcasting into millions of living rooms. It's hard to not form some opinions since they're so public. Most of us don't announce pregnancies on national television. It sort of goes with the territory.

 

Still they are an amazing family.

 

Janet

[cin]

I wonder if we're just biased in our birth-control culture. My mother had something like 113 cousins. I can't remember all the numbers, but a few of her aunts had more than 14 kids who lived to adulthood. (I bet the grammar gals on this board could rip that sentence to shreds! I can't get it right...)

 

I suppose these same women may have had 19 if they had had access to modern medicine, like Michelle Duggar. Maybe even more, since they married younger. Who knows?

 

I've never seen the show, but have seen a few interviews. My sense was that they were enjoying their unusually large and lovely family, and caring for them quite well.

 

 

Yup, my great aunt had 10 or 11 kids, at least. My grandmothers both had 7 or 8. And those kids did help out around the house. They older kids helped out with the littles. And they grew up to be responsible adults who knew what was needed to run a household.

 

I sometimes feel guilty for having my 8 yr old make her own lunch, but then I think back to when I was starting a home. I had no stinkin' clue about what to do. But I grew up as an only child. In the 70's and 80's.

 

And yes, I am insanely jealous :( I paid 20 k for each of our girls. I would love to 'look at my husband' and get pregnant. At least she has the choice to "turn it off." I tried everything and couldn't "turn it on." No Pun Intended. :D

[Lovedtodeath]

 

And yes, I am insanely jealous :( I paid 20 k for each of our girls. I would love to 'look at my husband' and get pregnant. At least she has the choice to "turn it off." I tried everything and couldn't "turn it on." No Pun Intended. :D

Yeah, put me in the jealous line up as well. Being told having another baby could kill you and then struggling like all get out to meet the needs of your two kids and failing is a far cry from her life.

[LibraryLover]

Getting to be the old lady I am, I wonder how she will feel when this new baby is 18. My youngest came into our lives when I was 33...I was 51 when he graduated from high school. Believe me, I'm much more tired than I thought I would be.

 

Is it just all about babies...what about having time for a relationship with your adult children? All of them.

 

 

LOL Most of my friends & I didn't even have our first babes until we were nearly/over 30 & more!

 

I think 33 is different now than it used to be, for sure! One of my friends had two babies between 41 and 44. She's a triathlete!

 

My oldest is 20 and my youngest is 10. I feel really strong & healthy. I always hope I won't 'get sick' , of course.

 

And ETA PS: *No*. I don't want to expericene the sad state that could be Michelle D's bladder. No way in hades.

Edited September 2, 2009 by LibraryLover

[Rosie_0801]

Seeing someone pregnant with their 19th makes me glad to be me :D

 

Rosie

[mommaduck]

A friend once said that you just *know* when you are done. I wanted an average-large family. That is the desire the Lord gave me. I have that. I know my body, I know my abilities, and I know my family. I have both kudos and critcism for the Duggars. I'm sure they might of me also, if they knew me. When it comes down to it, I'm glad to see that they are making it work for them. I don't agree with them on some things and I do agree with them on others.

 

I can be happy that they are happy with another baby and I'll hold my tongue on the rest ;)

[katemary63]

I don't care if she is the heartiest woman in the world, having 19 babies cannot be good for the body.

 

:iagree:

[stripe]

I know people who had a very nice childhood with very large families. However, they tended to have simpler lives, often people to help them with the kids (extended family) and kids helping out more around the house. So I wouldn't be quick to say what a big family is like -- I think I saw Chris Rock who said something about how easy it is to have a big family, because the older ones raise the younger ones. Certainly one wouldn't have 19 babies at the same time! Seriously, though, the women I know with a very large number of children tend (not all, but most) to have a lot of health problems.

 

But most of all, I wouldn't want a TV show made about my life. Yikes. I agree that she should write a book about pelvic strength training. I'd buy that book for sure!

[mommaduck]

I don't care if she is the heartiest woman in the world, having 19 babies cannot be good for the body.

 

The fact is, it's not when you are having back to back babies. But then, there are some of us that having babies has had it's health benefits also. There's pros and cons on both sides of the argument. I do believe that, though it seems they've tried to keep the focus off of it, some of her health issues have been brought up time to time (repetitive c-sections being one).

[Pink Fairy]

I am a huge fan of the Duggars. They just seem like such genuinely nice people. They have their own way of doing things and of looking at the world, but I've never seen them be the tiniest bit uncharitable to or about people that believe differently. I suppose that might be edited out of the show, but since it would make such "good" tv I doubt it would be.

 

I also don't get the feelling that they really care if other people think their family is too big. They just announce it like we all do (although on a larger scale) because it's news, not because they are looking for feedback.

Edited September 2, 2009 by Mamabegood

[stripe]

They just announce it like we all do (although on a larger scale) because it's news

I have never really announced my pregnancies, nor am I certain that each pregnancy is really news, worthy of being on television and in the newspapers.

[i.love.lucy]

Compared to all the absolute cr*p that's on tv, I think it's refreshing to see a family with Christian values and a happy home. Every now and then I get the idea that the producers are poking fun at them by showing certain things, like how naive they are sometimes. But I can let my dd watch the show and see a family that enjoys spending time together, and puts home education as a priority.

[Pink Fairy]

I have never really announced my pregnancies, nor am I certain that each pregnancy is really news, worthy of being on television and in the newspapers.

 

Okay, I figured most people do announce to their friends and family when they are expecting.

 

Obviously, announcing it to just friends and family wouldn't work for them. The Duggars are public figures, so it makes sense that they won't be able to keep it a secret from the rest of the world. Better they announce it in a way that communicates their joy, rather than let the media speculate about it.

[LibraryLover]

I'm just glad Michelle dumped the bangs poof and got highlights.

 

I also really like the child-like curls on her daughters.

 

Woot, you guys!

 

I'm thinking Queer Eye for the Straight Quiverfull Family played a role?

[Joanne]

I'm just glad Michelle dumped the bangs poof and got highlights.

 

I also really like the child-like curls on her daughters.

 

Woot, you guys!

 

I'm thinking Queer Eye for the Straight Quiverfull Family played a role?

 

LMAO. What a great line.

 

I think Michelle and the girls look great.

[Lilymax]

I think the Duggars seem genuinely happy, even the kids. They seem to get what they need, even if it isn't the same amount of one-on-one time most of us think kids should have.

 

I agree about wondering over Michelle's health. Seems like I recall on the show when she was pg with this last one, her talking about having morning sickness on one of their trips somewhere. And I wonder how many c-sections one can have before it becomes a real health concern to have another?

 

Being nine months pg with my third, at age 41, makes me wonder how she does it!! I am so much more tired this time around, and have had more complications (PIH and gestational diabetes). I think it's amazing that she's had so many healthy kids...not one of them appears to have any birth defects or other problems. Statistically, that risk is likely to increase the older she gets. I wonder if they were to have a special needs child, if that would change their decision to keep on having babies? Probably not...and they seem loving and capable enough to handle whatever comes their way.

 

Even though I always dreamed of having 4 kids, all the scares, etc. associated with my "advanced maternal age" this time makes me afraid to leave the door open for another baby. (However, because of past infertility issues, I have a hard time imagining shutting it permanently, too.)

[Tap]

While I agree that the children may not have a lot of one-on-one time with the parents, but I do believe that the relationships fostered among the children in big families have immense value too. The children are close in age, so it is likely that each child has a sibling or two that they have a deep bond with. That doesn't happen in all the time in families with a smaller amount of children. This relationship among siblings shouldn't be overlooked because it can be just as important as the parental/child bond. Not to replace the parent/child bond, but along with it.

[Impish]

*haven't read whole thread, too tired*

 

I admire them whole heartedly. I don't know if its been mentioned, but its not Jim that needs to leave her alone, but rather the other way round, according to an interview I saw with them, that they admitted she chases him :lol:

 

If MY kids could behave as well and be as happy as the Duggar's seem to, I'd be incredibly blessed.

[Reya]

They have the older children raise the younger children. That's how it's worked historically. My mother was the 7th of 8 children, she was raised by her older sisters.

 

My great-grandmother was the 1st of 12, and that's why she was an early proponent and user of birth control. She believed that children are entitled to a childhood.

[Reya]

The break from endometriosis sure is nice!

 

Medically ideal birth spacing is at least 18 months and no more than 5 years for minimal correlation with complications. :-)

[Reya]

Yeah, put me in the jealous line up as well. Being told having another baby could kill you and then struggling like all get out to meet the needs of your two kids and failing is a far cry from her life.

 

In very large families, the kids must conform to the families, the families don't alter for the children. So "meeting their needs" means "making sure they take their place."

 

There's no searching for just the right curriculum for a child. Kids get in step. That's it. No options. No square pegs, because you're rubbed round.

[Melissa in Australia]

My great-grandmother was the 1st of 12, and that's why she was an early proponent and user of birth control. She believed that children are entitled to a childhood.

 

:lol:

I am the oldest of 8. the youngest 2 were twins. I always said that I was only having 2 children and no twins. I ended up with 5 though.:D

[Reya]

:lol:

I am the oldest of 8. the youngest 2 were twins. I always said that I was only having 2 children and no twins. I ended up with 5 though.:D

 

My g-grandmother had only 3--and #3 was an accident! (He was born in 1917.)

 

I really wish A) she'd been alive and B) I'd had the guts to ask her what method she used.

[mommaduck]

I'm the oldest of 10 once all is said and done, but I was raised with two brothers (5 and 14 yrs younger than myself) and a cousin (I was 10 when he was born, on monitors when he came home, and special needs...by 11 I had full time care of him till he was three.

 

I wanted a large family still. I missed out on the closeness. Some of my siblings and I have been working to make up for that. My kids will tell you, even the oldest two, that they love having a large family. In fact the oldest complained when he found out that we weren't planning to continue to grow our family. Sure they complain now and then, they are kids. It's nothing more, in fact less, than the complaints out of my brother and I growing up (and people did think that the one 14yrs younger than me was my child). My children will have each other when we're senile or gone. But I know when I'm done.

 

I will say that I find 7 children easier to raise than 2 ;)

[Renee in NC]

In very large families, the kids must conform to the families, the families don't alter for the children. So "meeting their needs" means "making sure they take their place."

 

There's no searching for just the right curriculum for a child. Kids get in step. That's it. No options. No square pegs, because you're rubbed round.

 

At what point does this start? I have 7 and this is definitely not true for my family (nor the other post about not having a childhood - I don't expect my olders to raise my youngers.) I doubt we will ever have more, but I was curious as to when "square pegs" have to be "rounded off"?

[angela in ohio]

There's no searching for just the right curriculum for a child. Kids get in step. That's it. No options. No square pegs, because you're rubbed round.

 

This is not true of any large homeschooling family I know IRL. I know a family of 7 who individualizes each child's entire high school based on their career goals. Another family of 10 who sends some children to different schools and homeschools some based on their needs. And a few families of 7-9 who I have talked with about finding a new curriculum for this or that child who learns differently. And they all have children with very different personalities (the funny one, the artistic one, the shy one, etc., etc.) just like the small families I know.

[IsabelC]

I am hoping that with more birthing experience than any obstetrician around, she might choose to have this baby at home.