So, why do you wear a bra?

[Wheres Toto]

22 minutes ago, ArteHaus said:

I find it interesting (but expected) that no one can really explain why nudity isn’t shameful. It is easy call a thing nonsense, but apparently, not so easy to give answer.

 

Shame at being nude is taught not innate.  Babies are born naked.  Most of us had toddlers that liked to run around naked.   Were they being shameful?  

Society expects us to be clothed when out in public and clothing is desirable for all the reasons SHP listed, but many of us were taught to feel shame about our bodies and I believe that whole attitude is very harmful.  

[nikkibelle]

1 hour ago, ArteHaus said:

I find it interesting (but expected) that no one can really explain why nudity isn’t shameful. It is easy call a thing nonsense, but apparently, not so easy to give answer.

 

Because nudity is the natural order. Biblically, clothing covers our bodies because our nature was disordered not because nudity itself is shameful.

[ArteHaus]

1 hour ago, Wheres Toto said:

Shame at being nude is taught not innate.  Babies are born naked.  Most of us had toddlers that liked to run around naked.   Were they being shameful?  

Society expects us to be clothed when out in public and clothing is desirable for all the reasons SHP listed, but many of us were taught to feel shame about our bodies and I believe that whole attitude is very harmful.  

My baby sucks my breast. If he continues to do that it will become shameful (into adulthood).

Babies can’t make moral decisions, but adults can. So, no, babies and toddlers aren’t in shame,  but if I take my baby grocery shopping, naked, that will be a shame unto me.

Whether shame in nudity is innate or not is really a whole other thing, and really an excellent point. Let us assume you are right. Even so, we still can still consider the morality/consequence/effect of a thing. We are taught that murder is wrong, stealing is wrong, lying is wrong, because these immoral actions ultimately lead to negative consequences, perhaps even death. I would contend that it (they) is (are) both innate and taught, but would concede to either one, because either way, there are negative consequences for individuals and society. Here’s looking at you Russia under Bolshevik. 

To clarify-of course, no one feels shame about nudity in the shower, or on a date night with your husband, or whatever. Feeling shame (distress caused by wrongdoing) from wearing a see through shirt with no bra, is not similar to taking a shower in the nude, or being naked with your husband, or even being born. 

It is harmful to feel shame because one is overweight or isn’t pretty or has brown skin. This isn’t what I am talking about-

 

 

Edited September 1, 2023 by ArteHaus

[Grace Hopper]

Because years ago I saw Halle Berry tell a talk show host that one of the secrets to her fabulous physique was to wear a quality bra 24/7. 
 

 

[ArteHaus]

21 minutes ago, nikkibelle said:

Because nudity is the natural order. Biblically, clothing covers our bodies because our nature was disordered not because nudity itself is shameful.

I absolutely agree. 

Nudity is not in and of itself shameful, I think I tried to clarify that in a post to @Wheres Toto.

However, in respect to that disorder….hence, my whole argument.

 

 

Edited September 1, 2023 by ArteHaus

[nikkibelle]

10 minutes ago, ArteHaus said:

I absolutely agree. 

Nudity is not in and of itself shameful, I think I tried to clarify that in a post to @Wheres Toto.

However, in respect to that disorder….hence, my whole argument.

 

 

I guess I’m misunderstanding your posts? In the post I quoted you said “no one can explain why nudity isn’t shameful”. So you don’t believe nudity is shameful?

Anyway, I mostly wear a bra because it’s humid in my neck of the woods and underBooK sweat feels gross to me.

[ArteHaus]

32 minutes ago, nikkibelle said:

I guess I’m misunderstanding your posts? In the post I quoted you said “no one can explain why nudity isn’t shameful”. So you don’t believe nudity is shameful?

Anyway, I mostly wear a bra because it’s humid in my neck of the woods and underBooK sweat feels gross to me.

Oh, I see. A couple pages back someone commented that, essentially, it isn’t disrespectful to show the shape of their breasts through clothing. I retorted that it is, and related some of my own past shortcomings. Which led to comments about Laws of Nature and whether men and women are subject to them, in which I contend that they both are. Anyway, I further stated that our nakedness is our shame, and that it is unnatural for women to dress sexually, and that men are not the only ones under a natural/moral obligation. 

It is the natural disorder that affects such things as nudity. Your statement, although pithy, is what I was trying to get at, in a nutshell, lol. Shame in nakedness is a reference to that disorder. Nonetheless, shame in nakedness would now be a Law of Nature, as is death…because that was disordered as well. It is kinda stupid simple, but patriarchy, and feminism, and liberation…oh my. 

FWIW. I wear a bra too, lol. It feels great, but I try to go braless at home. I read years ago that some bras can impede the lymphatic system from doing it’s thing. So who knows🤷🏻‍♀️

 

 

 

 

Edited September 1, 2023 by ArteHaus

[Lady Florida.]

I have a number of reasons for wearing a bra but the main one involves two words:

boob sweat

It's not just a matter of discomfort. In my climate under breast sweat can cause yeast infections. I don't wear one to bed because we keep the house cool overnight and because I find it comfortable to let them breathe a while.

I only had one baby but I had him at an advanced age, which changed my body forever. If I still had my perky small to average (34B) breasts I might go braless more often. But the way they fall now makes it too easy to get hot and uncomfortable.

I can't wear underwire. I hate it. I also hate sports bras but I wear one when swimming. It's the only way I found to be comfortable in a UV SPF swim shirt.

On 8/30/2023 at 6:17 PM, ktgrok said:

Well, patriarchy is annoying to a lot of people. Those "rah rah" women are the reason you can get a credit card in your name now, or a bank account.

Bingo. When my mom and stepfather split up in 1973 she could not get a credit card. She could not get a check cashing card at the grocery store which was a big deal back then or you had to bring cash to the grocery store all the time and be careful not to go over what was in your wallet. Oh, and she was lucky to have found a bank that actually let her open an account on her own. It wasn't until 1974 that banks were forced to allow women to open accounts. She couldn't buy life insurance. As a single mom without the kids' father in the picture (my dad died 3 years earlier) she wanted to know we were taken care of. One life insurance salesman told her "If you want life insurance get a husband". She kicked him out of the house. Finally, even though she was financially capable of making payments she couldn't get a car loan without a man's signature. My grandfather, a retired man on a fixed income, had to cosign for her. 

Thank you rah rah women for seeing to it that I never had to go what my mother went through.

On 8/31/2023 at 8:23 AM, fairfarmhand said:

I have noticed more women of all ages going out w/out a bra in the last few years. I wonder if Covid had something to do with that.

I don't always notice but when I do, it's usually younger women. Good on them! I'm glad to see women choosing to wear or not wear a bra based on their own desires, not some arbitrary social pressure.

On 8/31/2023 at 9:35 AM, marbel said:

I never used a cover either. I think a cover just brings more attention.

Especially if you had a baby who liked to play with the cover! I tried using a cover but ds would always grab it in his little fist and wave it around. 😂 I gave up. While I never got any comments I did get some side eye now and then, and sometimes giggling teens (girls and boys). One time we were at the IL's for a big family thing. I took ds in the other room out of what I figured was respect. I heard dh's Tennessee Mamaw ask where I went and heard him answer. I heard her reply "I guess I'm just a ol' country mountain girl. I fed my babies wherever they were hungry". 

Edited September 2, 2023 by Lady Florida.

[Clarita]

As for breastfeeding, I use a cover to protect others from getting sprayed. My books were enthusiastic about feeding babies. I basically would wear a cover while out because they would start producing when any baby (doesn't even have to be mine or human) looked at me with potentially hungry eyes. 

[kbutton]

19 hours ago, Lady Florida. said:

 

I took ds in the other room out of what I figured was respect. d s Tennessee Mamaw ask where I went and heard him answer. I heard her reply "I guess I'm just a ol' country mountain girl. I fed my babies wherever they were hungry". 

I’ve actually wondered if once formula became widely available, BFing in public became seen as lowbrow and then eventually immodesty was the preferred excuse to cover societal snobbishness. And then the modesty idea took off independently due to other cultural forces.

Not everyone finds it a meaningful experience (Queen Victoria said it made her feel like a cow, IIRC), but lots of women are made to feel guilty if they don’t.

I can see many factors creating multiple streams of cultural weirdness over time as those factors overlap and interact.

[ktgrok]

21 hours ago, Lady Florida. said:

I have a number of reasons for wearing a bra but the main one involves two words:

boob sweat

It's not just a matter of discomfort. In my climate under breast sweat can cause yeast infections.

yup. Last week I had to break out some anti fungal cream because I could tell things were about to start. It's just so hot and humid. 

[SKL]

I find a sweaty bra more uncomfortable than just sweaty skin.

I will also admit to using antiperspirent "there" a couple times, knowing it was going to be that kind of day.  That probably isn't healthy to do regularly though.

[SKL]

As for breastfeeding attitudes, my mom used to tell me how breastfeeding was very frowned upon when she was having her babies (~60 years ago).  She used to say she knew better because she read a lot more than most young women.  So she breastfed.  I think even one or both of my grandmothers had an attitude about it ... like why would you do that when you don't even have to?

So I assume that fed into the attitudes about public breasfeeding too.

Like many things, I think profit motive fed a trend that was not best for humanity.  Though, on the other hand, mass demand / mass production provide reasonable baby formula options for those who need them.  I just want everyone to be able to make an informed choice.

[Pawz4me]

31 minutes ago, SKL said:

 

I will also admit to using antiperspirent "there" a couple times, knowing it was going to be that kind of day.

I do that sometimes, too.

[lynn]

Comfort.  Preference. I like things to be and where they should be.

Edited September 2, 2023 by lynn

[maize]

On 8/31/2023 at 10:55 AM, regentrude said:

 

Women have been lusted over, groped, and raped who were wearing baggy sweatshirts or a burka.

 

Yep. This happened to a friend of mine when she was living in Saudi Arabia as a teen. She was wearing sack-shaped clothing that covered her entire body, and was groped by a man while engaging in the extremely provocative activity of walking through a marketplace as a female.

[marbel]

2 hours ago, SKL said:

As for breastfeeding attitudes, my mom used to tell me how breastfeeding was very frowned upon when she was having her babies (~60 years ago).  She used to say she knew better because she read a lot more than most young women.  So she breastfed.  I think even one or both of my grandmothers had an attitude about it ... like why would you do that when you don't even have to?

So I assume that fed into the attitudes about public breasfeeding too.

Like many things, I think profit motive fed a trend that was not best for humanity.  Though, on the other hand, mass demand / mass production provide reasonable baby formula options for those who need them.  I just want everyone to be able to make an informed choice.

My mother (born in 1916) related to me that by the time I came around in 1956, people were encouraged to use formula rather than breastfeed. I was her third kid, born 10 years after her first, and attitudes had changed during that time. But she breastfed - she never fully bought into the "better living through chemistry" notions of the time. I remember her telling me her sisters-in-law hassled her about it. They also smoked throughout their pregnancies to avoid gaining too much weight. 🙄

My MIL (born in 1939) thought 8 weeks of nursing was quite enough for my first kid, and so did one of my husband's cousins. "You should be giving him cereal in a bottle by now." And when we visited, I was shoved into a room alone so I didn't bother anyone. Which was fine, actually, because I didn't really like the people all that much! MIL came to help when our first was born - my mother was a bit elderly by then, plus she had a bunch of grandchildren already, so I thought I'd let MIL come to help with her first. She fussed me out over nursing too much, nursing for comfort - basically I think she found it upsetting to be around breastfeeding. (But then again, eating in general seemed vaguely disgusting to her, so... 🤷‍♀️

[maize]

My husband's aunt has a funny story about breastfeeding in the 60's. She was breastfeeding her baby, which was very much not the norm in her community at the time. One day her neighbor came running over waving a newspaper and calling out "(...) you've got to stop nursing that baby! They've tested breastmilk and there's nothing in it!!!"

Somehow I have no doubt at all that whatever study she was reading about was funded by a formula manufacturer...

I do wonder though how that poor neighbor woman thought human infants had survived throughout history on nutritionless breastmilk?!

[Lady Florida.]

2 hours ago, SKL said:

As for breastfeeding attitudes, my mom used to tell me how breastfeeding was very frowned upon when she was having her babies (~60 years ago). 

That's what my mom told me. By that time breastfeeding was seen as done if you couldn't afford formula. She said when I was born they gave her a shot to dry up her milk (not sure what they used back then) without even asking her what she wanted to do. When my brother was born via c-section 5 years later they told her you can't breastfeed if you had a c-section. 

[kbutton]

35 minutes ago, Lady Florida. said:

That's what my mom told me. By that time breastfeeding was seen as done if you couldn't afford formula. She said when I was born they gave her a shot to dry up her milk (not sure what they used back then) without even asking her what she wanted to do. When my brother was born via c-section 5 years later they told her you can't breastfeed if you had a c-section. 

When I had trouble feeding my firstborn (that I now know had lip ties top and bottom), I asked for that shot. My mom had one. The OB swore up and down that nothing like this existed. 

[Tree Frog]

I always used to wear a bra except when I slept. Then I was the only female chaperone at a church camp. None of the other women volunteered, so I thought I would help out so about 8 girls could go. I didn't wear a bra when I was in bed and apparently that was such an awful thing that 2 years (yes, years!) later, the mothers of the girls and boys were still gossiping about it loudly enough that the youth pastor overheard. So, I decided to do something about it. I stopped wearing bras unless I was going to work. I wore camis under my shirts and chose patterns so the nips wouldn't be as visible. Unfortunately, I haven't run into any of those busybodies since. 😆  (It was one of the reasons I left the church.) 

I'm a b cup. I jiggle some and if I'm going to exercise, I put on a bra. I prefer the boob sweat I can wipe off instead of the sweat held in place. I noticed when I visited Colorado there were many women without bras. Here in my state, there are very few.

[fairfarmhand]

2 hours ago, Lady Florida. said:

That's what my mom told me. By that time breastfeeding was seen as done if you couldn't afford formula. She said when I was born they gave her a shot to dry up her milk (not sure what they used back then) without even asking her what she wanted to do. When my brother was born via c-section 5 years later they told her you can't breastfeed if you had a c-section. 

Aha! This is why both my grandmothers were supportive of nursing. We come from a long line of dirt poor country mamas.

(My mothers mother was a nurse and she was smart and thought nursing was great)

[historically accurate]

On 9/1/2023 at 4:39 PM, Lady Florida. said:

I have a number of reasons for wearing a bra but the main one involves two words:

boob sweat

 

In my household, that's known as "swoob" - sweat o' the boob.

 

[theelfqueen]

So today I put on a new sundress and the bra I was planning to wear with it totally didn't work. I took off the bra and realized that it worked just fine without a bra... so I went out to lunch with no bra! Crazy talk! 

[Corraleno]

On 8/30/2023 at 8:08 PM, marbel said:

I checked the size. I had said I bought them one size smaller than my usual size, but I was wrong. I bought XL. For t-shirts I wear L to XL, depending on the brand. So I bought my usual size/a size up. They fit snugly but not tightly if that makes sense. More snugly than I would wear a shirt. Perfectly comfy and everything is held in place.

I hope that helps? Clothing sizes are so hard!

Thanks so much for recommending these! I sized up to a medium, which is "snug but not tight" as you said, and they're super comfortable.

[marbel]

8 minutes ago, Corraleno said:

Thanks so much for recommending these! I sized up to a medium, which is "snug but not tight" as you said, and they're super comfortable.

Oh I am so happy to hear that! Thanks for letting me know! 

[ktgrok]

14 hours ago, kbutton said:

When I had trouble feeding my firstborn (that I now know had lip ties top and bottom), I asked for that shot. My mom had one. The OB swore up and down that nothing like this existed. 

They stopped giving it because it was unsafe -   it was linked to heart attacks, strokes, seizures, and psychosis. 

[Halftime Hope]

I have my own bodily reasons for wearing a bra some of the time.  However, when I am around people with whom I'm not family, it's important to me to be courteous to the public and keep my private stuff private, in keeping with the social norms when and where I live.

When I was in college, I had a hirsute prof who wore cheap poplin shirts in white or pale pastel colors. It was always ick to have to see, through the fabric, things I had no interest in seeing. (He did not wear the customary men's undershirts for whatever reason.) It was unavoidable seeing him, as he was lecturing and moving, writing on a whiteboard. I was grateful on the days he came to class wearing a lab coat, and I switched to a different prof the next semester.

Similarly, there have been occasions when men have worn clothing items that made the outlines of their bits visible, and I would have preferred not having seen those flashes. (You can't always look away or avoid seeing stuff.)

I prefer to dress so I'm not putting other people in the same position, having to see bits they would rather not see, and I'm especially conscious not to dress in a way that would put children in that position.

Bras and half-slips  are a courtesy to the public.

Edited September 9, 2023 by Halftime Hope

[Halftime Hope]

14 hours ago, Tree Frog said:

I always used to wear a bra except when I slept. Then I was the only female chaperone at a church camp. None of the other women volunteered, so I thought I would help out so about 8 girls could go. I didn't wear a bra when I was in bed and apparently that was such an awful thing that 2 years (yes, years!) later, the mothers of the girls and boys were still gossiping about it loudly enough that the youth pastor overheard. So, I decided to do something about it. I stopped wearing bras unless I was going to work. I wore camis under my shirts and chose patterns so the nips wouldn't be as visible. Unfortunately, I haven't run into any of those busybodies since. 😆  (It was one of the reasons I left the church.) 

I'm a b cup. I jiggle some and if I'm going to exercise, I put on a bra. I prefer the boob sweat I can wipe off instead of the sweat held in place. I noticed when I visited Colorado there were many women without bras. Here in my state, there are very few.

Geez. That's ridiculous!

[Laura Corin]

On 8/31/2023 at 7:16 PM, ArteHaus said:

You should have kept your original sentence, it made your retort somewhat less vapid, while simultaneously indicating a lack in your intellectual prowess.🤪

 

 

Addressing a physics professor who is also a published poet eta in her second (third?) language. 

Edited September 3, 2023 by Laura Corin

[Grace Hopper]

2 hours ago, Halftime Hope said:

I have my own bodily reasons for wearing a bra some of the time.  However, when I am around people with whom I'm not family, it's important to me to be courteous to the public and keeping my private stuff private, in keeping with the social norms when and where I live.

When I was in college, I had a hirsute prof who wore cheap poplin shirts in white or pale pastel colors. It was always ick to have to see, through the fabric, things I had no interest in seeing. (He did not wear normal male undershirts for whatever reason.) It was unavoidable seeing him, as he was lecturing and moving, writing on a whiteboard. I was grateful on the days he came to class wearing a lab coat, and I switched to a different prof the next semester.

Similarly, there have been occasions when men have worn clothing items that made the outlines of their bits visible, and I would have preferred not having seen those flashes. (You can't always look away or avoid seeing stuff.)

I prefer to dress so I'm not putting other people in the same position, having to see bits they would rather not see, and I'm especially conscious not to dress in a way that would put children in that position.

Bras and half-slips  are a courtesy to the public.

This post reminded me of the “modesty” policy (loose term lol) I use with my daughters:

You have the right to dress how you like. 
You have the right to express your opinions.

HOWEVER,

there are many people who will let your appearance distract them from your message. If you want to be heard - on big issues and in places where it’s important to be heard - consider your appearance. You don’t have to dress like a Puritan, or make your hairstyle match theirs, but consider dressing to a level of NONdistraction, in whatever way suits the circumstance. 
 

And that’s my advice to them about attire, because (referring to myself in a previous thread) people around us are still split between Old Barbie World and New Barbie World. And when and where and why I wear base layers (beyond Halle Berry’s compelling advice gleaned years ago) fits into that policy.

 

[kbutton]

5 hours ago, ktgrok said:

They stopped giving it because it was unsafe -   it was linked to heart attacks, strokes, seizures, and psychosis. 

Good to know! I am glad they pulled it in that case, but it’s so weird to me that multiple women remember getting it while docs act like no such thing ever existed. 

[Halftime Hope]

1 hour ago, Grace Hopper said:

This post reminded me of the “modesty” policy (loose term lol) I use with my daughters:

You have the right to dress how you like. 
You have the right to express your opinions.

HOWEVER,

there are many people who will let your appearance distract them from your message. If you want to be heard - on big issues and in places where it’s important to be heard - consider your appearance. You don’t have to dress like a Puritan, or make your hairstyle match theirs, but consider dressing to a level of NONdistraction, in whatever way suits the circumstance. 
 

And that’s my advice to them about attire, because (referring to myself in a previous thread) people around us are still split between Old Barbie World and New Barbie World. And when and where and why I wear base layers (beyond Halle Berry’s compelling advice gleaned years ago) fits into that policy.

 

I guess I need to go figure out Barbie world. (Do I have to? -- I never gave a fig for Barbie)  Similarly, I missed the Halle Berry advice.

 

[Halftime Hope]

I think I've related this before, but several summers I worked at a uniform shop for private schools. In that role, I did customer service for families at several very pricey day schools, schools with yearly tuition in the mid 5 figures.

The girls at two of the three priciest schools all, uniformly, wore sports bras, the kind in which an average teen looked like she was wearing a binder. Many of these kids also carried no cell phone, as cell phones were considered a waste of time, something bougie, but I digress. (That last bit was to underscore that they had a unique culture, with quite a bit of uniformitarian thinking or peer pressure.)

We had darling plaid jumpers for one of the schools, a beautiful solid gray on gray plaid, that would go over any of several approved blouses in white or bright blue. The jumpers came to mid-thigh, were cut with princess seams so they flattered almost every body type, and they were particularly cute when paired with a shirt and  skinny tie tied with a sailor knot. However, the girls hated the jumpers with a fiery passion -- they were cut for girls' or misses figures, and they just didn't hang well over a sports bra. It was kind of sad that the perfectly cute jumpers weren't feasible. It would have been a nice alternative to a pant or skirt.

 

[ArteHaus]

On 9/3/2023 at 10:54 AM, Laura Corin said:

Addressing a physics professor who is also a published poet eta in her second (third?) language. 

deleted by mod 

 

Edited September 5, 2023 by answerdeskwtm
Deleted by mod for rudeness.

[Laura Corin]

10 minutes ago, ArteHaus said:

You see, comments like this.

This is why there are so many dolts and followers and ignorant people in the world.

This just made me wince. I am even embarrassed for you, genuinely. I teach my children not to be a respecter of persons for reasons just like this- 

I mean, Ted Kaczynski had some pretty impressive credentials, too. 

 

I was only referring to your characterisation of her - your words  - intellectual prowess.  That is different from the uses to which someone might put that ability.

[maize]

🚫🍽🧌

[ArteHaus]

On 9/3/2023 at 3:21 PM, Laura Corin said:

I was only referring to your characterisation of her - your words  - intellectual prowess.  That is different from the uses to which someone might put that ability.

deleted by mod 

 

Edited September 5, 2023 by answerdeskwtm
Deleted by mod for rudeness.

[SKL]

2 hours ago, kbutton said:

Good to know! I am glad they pulled it in that case, but it’s so weird to me that multiple women remember getting it while docs act like no such thing ever existed. 

I didn't know the reason they pulled it, but I did know that they used to give it if a woman said she didn't plan to breastfeed, and also if a baby was stillborn.

I wonder why it wasn't in the news when they pulled it.

[WildflowerMom]

Nm… making a new post.

Edited September 3, 2023 by WildflowerMom

[Rosie_0801]

41 minutes ago, ArteHaus said:

Laura, you need to value yourself, and stop being a fan girl. 

 

You need to use your manners.

[kbutton]

36 minutes ago, SKL said:

I didn't know the reason they pulled it, but I did know that they used to give it if a woman said she didn't plan to breastfeed, and also if a baby was stillborn.

I wonder why it wasn't in the news when they pulled it.

I have no idea when they pulled it, but I would guess doctors who were educated afterwards just weren’t told about it. But one would assume they’ve been asked enough that they’d be curious and look for an answer to why women ask, lol!

[ArteHaus]

2 hours ago, maize said:

🚫🍽🧌

Sure, @Rosie_0801. You mean, like this? Your right, I am being so rude:)

[Melissa Louise]

I'm just going to suggest again, that for really good reasons, including that people aren't always as they represent themselves to be online, and some people enjoy actively trolling and harassing, say, partners or ex-partners, people should investigate the ignore button and make good use of it. 

[El...]

I have a book of regentrude's poetry, and it is exquisite. I'm gonna figure out the above-mentioned button.

To the topic at hand, I've been thinking. I feel unprotected doing work or going places without a bra. Not morally, but physically! I feel like I'm going to bump or hurt myself on the furniture somehow! I am a bit of a klutz, and I'm not used to things swingin' free. 

[Ginevra]

On 9/2/2023 at 2:47 PM, ktgrok said:

yup. Last week I had to break out some anti fungal cream because I could tell things were about to start. It's just so hot and humid. 

Awesome. Reason #467 why I don’t want to move to FL…😉

[Faith-manor]

It isn't so much "why do I wear a bra" but "how do I wear a bra". I wear a bra with great disdain and hatred. Therefore I avoid as much as possible. But I am also not a books girl so much as a pamphlet girl, and after nursing kids, more like a pamphlet left out into rain, saggy mess kind of a girl. I can usually get away with a good shelf camisole. But now and again, basically when I am performing at the piano and am wearing an evening gown or cocktail dress, I don a bra and then mentally cuss the crap out of it.

I would describe my chest as having two, children's tube socks with a golf ball in each toe sewn to my chest wall. I would be happy to do without them.

[Kassia]

@Faith-manor I have the same chest and feelings as you described.  

[Kassia]

I thought of this thread today when I went for an MRI.  I was wearing a tank with a shelf bra with a cardigan over the tank.  The male technician asked me if I was wearing a bra.  I knew he was asking because I couldn't wear anything with hooks/zippers during the MRI so all I had to say was no, but I got all awkward and grabbed my breasts and said I had a bra built in the tank.  😂 If it had been a female technician, I would have just said I was wearing a shelf bra but I was caught off guard with the man because I thought he wouldn't know what a shelf bra was so I was grabbing myself to...show him I was kind of wearing a bra? I don't even know, but I thought it was funny when I thought about it later.