Tyre Nichols - my heart is broken

[Eos]

Footage captures Nichols screaming for his mother

I can't watch the video but reading this headline has started me crying.  A traffic stop.

[Harriet Vane]

Brutal. Unforgivable. 😔

[Faith-manor]

It is staggering brutality! My feelings are all jumbled up, currently fly in the rage phase where I think they deserve to be hung in the village square. That's saying a lot because I am otherwise not normally prop death penalty since I don't like giving the powers that be quite that much power.

[lauraw4321]

I can’t make myself look at or watch any of it. I can barely read the headlines.  So heartbreaking. 

[MercyA]

And yet people still won't care. 😞 

I can't watch the video. Horrific.

Edited January 28, 2023 by MercyA

[Kassia]

17 minutes ago, lauraw4321 said:

I can’t make myself look at or watch any of it. I can barely read the headlines.  So heartbreaking. 

Same.  😞

[Grace Hopper]

I have not yet gathered the courage to find the video, even though I knew it was going to be released this evening. A part of me would like to totally ignore it but a bigger part of me feels a moral responsibility to see exactly what’s going on and be a strong advocate against this type of police brutality. I will view it before the day is done. 

[gstharr]

21 minutes ago, lauraw4321 said:

I can’t make myself look at or watch any of it. I can barely read the headlines.  So heartbreaking. 

I've avoided watching it. George Floyd was hard enough for me to stomach

[Dmmetler]

I live in Memphis. I wish I was surprised. I'm not. Partially because the reactions from the police officials and local government made it clear that they knew this one was horrific, but part of it because there's been a lot of escalation in general, and we knew this one was bad. My center sent everyone home at 5:00, and most of the businesses downtown shut down by mid-afternoon.

 

If you're not in the area, this is a reliable source for what is actually happening on the ground. 

 

[GoVanGogh]

49 minutes ago, Faith-manor said:

It is staggering brutality! My feelings are all jumbled up, currently fly in the rage phase where I think they deserve to be hung in the village square. That's saying a lot because I am otherwise not normally prop death penalty since I don't like giving the powers that be quite that much power.

I am the same. I am opposed to the death penalty, but this case is so horrible. 

[Eos]

27 minutes ago, Grace Hopper said:

I have not yet gathered the courage to find the video, even though I knew it was going to be released this evening. A part of me would like to totally ignore it but a bigger part of me feels a moral responsibility to see exactly what’s going on and be a strong advocate against this type of police brutality. I will view it before the day is done. 

I felt that way about George Floyd, and did watch it then.  I don't think I can now but I agree on principle.

[Sneezyone]

I expect swift justice will be dished out here, largely because the officers are minorities. There’s no ‘administrative leave while we investigate’ delay so they can divorce and protect their personal assets happening. Is that progress? Maybe. Maybe not. I wish there was more understanding about the history of policing and why policing itself requires more thoughtful alternatives and substantive reform.

Edited January 28, 2023 by Sneezyone

[WildflowerMom]

I tried to watch.   Just inhumane, like seriously not even human.     How do you beat him like that and then leave he slumped against the car suffering?     That's not a human response.    

[NorthwestMom]

I can't watch it, and I am devastated at the idea of another person calling for his mother while being murdered. 

[Dmmetler]

15 minutes ago, Sneezyone said:

I expect swift justice will be dished out here, largely because the officers are minorities. There’s no ‘administrative leave while we investigate’ delay so they can divorce and protect their personal assets happening. I wish there was more understanding about the history of policing and why policing itself requires more thought and substantive reform.

That is definitely the opinion of many here. That not only is this the kind of thing that shouldn't happen at all, but that the ONLY reason for the fast reaction was that the offenders were Black.  Which is why the protests here are focusing on change. Because even if Tyre's assailants are brought "to justice", it doesn't mean there IS justice. 

 

Here is Tyre's photography portfolio. It's one of the saddest things about this, because it's obvious that he found a lot of beauty in Memphis and the world. Yet, being a good guy, who worked hard and was a nice human being with a beautiful soul isn't enough. 

https://thiscaliforniakid2.wixsite.com/tnicholsphotography/about

 

[Sneezyone]

14 minutes ago, Dmmetler said:

That is definitely the opinion of many here. That not only is this the kind of thing that shouldn't happen at all, but that the ONLY reason for the fast reaction was that the offenders were Black.  Which is why the protests here are focusing on change. Because even if Tyre's assailants are brought "to justice", it doesn't mean there IS justice. 

 

Here is Tyre's photography portfolio. It's one of the saddest things about this, because it's obvious that he found a lot of beauty in Memphis and the world. Yet, being a good guy, who worked hard and was a nice human being with a beautiful soul isn't enough. 

https://thiscaliforniakid2.wixsite.com/tnicholsphotography/about

 

We have family and friends in Memphis and Germantown. I’m hoping for a relatively quiet and reflective evening. I pretty much agree with what Tyre’s family said. These men dishonored their families in a MAJOR way. They’ll be pariahs.

[Ting Tang]

4 hours ago, Eos said:

Footage captures Nichols screaming for his mother

I can't watch the video but reading this headline has started me crying.  A traffic stop.

I watched for a moment. That was enough. I’m not sure what to say or how to talk this out. Horrible things are happening every which way we look. What came over these officers? (Is there an answer to that question?)

[Grace Hopper]

I watched. 
 

That was a murder. It appeared very intentional and not just an escalation of violence in the heat of the moment. Those murderers were deliberate and relentless. I don’t think murder 2 is the right charge; I think these guys were doing something they actually set out to do. I hope all the truth comes out.

Horrible, absolutely evil. 

[Carrie12345]

I forced myself to watch George Floyd’s murder, I don’t know if I can do that again.   
I know there’s an importance in bearing witness, but I also know that I don’t need to see it for the purpose of believing the horrific brutality that happened.  Nothing in me is conflicted or entertaining doubt.

I have enjoyed seeing snippets of Tyre Nichol’s beautiful life.

[4kidlets4me]

I watched.

It was absolutely a murder, they were completely unhinged from the beginning. What I find most disturbing is that they were comfortable doing this knowing bodycams were on and in full view of other officers who did nothing to intervene. This is not a few "bad apples" the entire system is rotten.

There is a Go Fund Me here: https://www.gofundme.com/f/tyre-nichols

[maize]

I can't figure out how men could engage in violence like this while wearing bodycams. What kind of culture makes them think they can get away with it? I'd believe that one man could go into a rage of some kind where he forgets himself and is so caught up in emotion that consequences don't enter his mind, but all of them at the same time? What is the group psychology at play here, and what is the group culture reinforcing it?

[TexasProud]

My spiritual director shared someone's post that I thought was very good:itual director shared this on her story yesterday.  Good for us to keep in mind

Edited January 28, 2023 by TexasProud

[Faith-manor]

1 hour ago, 4kidlets4me said:

I watched.

It was absolutely a murder, they were completely unhinged from the beginning. What I find most disturbing is that they were comfortable doing this knowing bodycams were on and in full view of other officers who did nothing to intervene. This is not a few "bad apples" the entire system is rotten.

There is a Go Fund Me here: https://www.gofundme.com/f/tyre-nichols

I agree 100%. I think for so long there was so little accountability and so much victim blaming that many police officers believe they are above the law in every way. The arrogance combined with years of power combined with protecting each other combined with prosecutor's looking the other way combined with society's determination to always blame victims had made those with the pathology to move to very unhinged behavior into monsters.

I never thought I would be in the "refund police" camp, but I am. I think the entire thing needs to be gutted and start over. While that is being figured out, put the money to hiring community mental health workers for both the health department and for our schools. 

[1234]

It’s awful. I’m so sick of the ones who continually talk of just complying. We all have valid reasons for being afraid of the police at this point. I know there are good ones, but it just doesn’t matter any more. The whole system is completely broken and things will not get better until it’s gutted and fixed. 

[Dmmetler]

18 minutes ago, Faith-manor said:

I agree 100%. I think for so long there was so little accountability and so much victim blaming that many police officers believe they are above the law in every way. The arrogance combined with years of power combined with protecting each other combined with prosecutor's looking the other way combined with society's determination to always blame victims had made those with the pathology to move to very unhinged behavior into monsters.

I never thought I would be in the "refund police" camp, but I am. I think the entire thing needs to be gutted and start over. While that is being figured out, put the money to hiring community mental health workers for both the health department and for our schools. 

And first step, stop putting officers on traffic stops. In the whiter parts of the city, you won't see officers doing traffic stops much if at all. You'll see traffic light cameras and speed monitoring, and tickets mailed. Where you see lots of traffic enforcement is in the poorer, Blacker, parts of the city, and in areas where there's a more affluent area near a poorer one, on the edges. And often these stops are used less for actual traffic enforcement and more asan excuse-it's "this car doesn't match the neighborhood, so we'll stop and check". Or "this driver is the wrong color, so we'll stop and check".  The usual reason given is drugs...but it much more closely matches SES level than actual levels of drug use-I'd rather drive in an urban area on a weekend night than in the suburbs because you'll see a lot more possible DUI there-and no police officers to be seen.

 

 

Edited January 28, 2023 by Dmmetler

[BlsdMama]

I wonder….

 

 Does the lack of rioting illustrate just how hopeless people feel that there can be effective change?

[Dmmetler]

1 hour ago, BlsdMama said:

I wonder….

 

 Does the lack of rioting illustrate just how hopeless people feel that there can be effective change?

I don't think so. Not in Memphis, anyway. 

 

Memphis does protests well. The Civil rights movement never ended here, and, as one of my friends put it, everyone has a closet with their collection of signs. You will see "I am a man" ones from the 1960's at almost every protest. Community organizers had planned out the vigils and protests as soon as the lukewarm MPD press release was given, because it was obvious that this was another such case. And the reason Memphis does protests well is that a LOT of protesters died in the past. 

 

Part of that is that Memphis doesn't tolerate outsiders making chaos. When someone broke a window trying to get things started in the George Floyd protests, it was the protesters that stopped that in it's tracks. And, again, a lot of planning goes on behind the scenes-but it also means information spreads by word of mouth. What is public is meant to be public, is contained, and is usually basically a church service. What is planned is things like the strategic shutdown of the bridges-things that force officials to negotiate, but don't turn into riots. Big parts of the  White community have learned to take our lead from the Black community because our risk is not the same. 

 

And, to be blunt, yeah, protests in the past got more cameras. Apparently, that doesn't matter. Because even though the officers have been charged, a man is still dead. And Memphis has some really important city elections coming up. So I'm seeing a lot of focus on that. 

 

Edited January 28, 2023 by Dmmetler

[HomeAgain]

2 hours ago, maize said:

I can't figure out how men could engage in violence like this while wearing bodycams. What kind of culture makes them think they can get away with it? I'd believe that one man could go into a rage of some kind where he forgets himself and is so caught up in emotion that consequences don't enter his mind, but all of them at the same time? What is the group psychology at play here, and what is the group culture reinforcing it?

The statistics on violence within the police force is staggering.  There is so little accountability and there is a culture that encourages those with emotional issues to join, and then those issues are perpetuated through poor training.

Police have high rates of domestic abuse in their families.  They are willing to hurt those they love.  It is no shock that they also abuse those they don't know. 

[Faith-manor]

31 minutes ago, HomeAgain said:

The statistics on violence within the police force is staggering.  There is so little accountability and there is a culture that encourages those with emotional issues to join, and then those issues are perpetuated through poor training.

Police have high rates of domestic abuse in their families.  They are willing to hurt those they love.  It is no shock that they also abuse those they don't know. 

This. We know a young man from our community who was, hate to say it, the kind of person who should never have a gun and NEVER be in a position of power and authority. He still got hired at the state police post and hadn't been on the job eight weeks before he punched a woman in the mouth for simply asking why she was being pulled over. 

And no, though he did lose his job, he was never charged with assault because "reasons" and a D.A. that is a jackass. The reason he pulled her over was a taillight was out. So apparently, it is okay to assault and batter the citizens because something broke on your car and you ask,"Officer, why did you pull me over?" It was startling, due to the fact that when we are in real danger such as "man with gun in school" they are so freaking slow to respond, and then twiddle their thumbs before someone finally has an idea, but will abuse you over a traffic stop, the citizenry is afraid to call 911. They are forcing us all into a Wild West system whereby we call the army veteran next door who has a hell of a lot more fire arm experience and within a system in which one does not indiscriminately fire on people because there is accountability. That is the person who might come save your butt, not the police. I would trust my two nephews, one in Coast Guard and the other in National Guard, before I would ever trust a LEO. And sure, there are good and decent LEOs out there, but most of them are still of the "protect the brothers in blue" mindset which makes them indistinguishable from the others. No one can trust dispatch to send a reasonable human being. 

 

[Lady Florida.]

1 hour ago, HomeAgain said:

 

Police have high rates of domestic abuse in their families.  They are willing to hurt those they love.  It is no shock that they also abuse those they don't know. 

And because they're police the domestic abuse gets swept under the rug. It's extremely difficult for the abused partner of a cop to get help. 

[mom2scouts]

I watched the video. There were multiple points were he was under their control, maybe not in complete compliance ('lay on your stomach" when he was on his side but docile or when he didn't "give me your hands" because he was too busy wiping the pepper spray out of his eyes) and they used that as an excuse. There was absolutely no reason for them to continue to beat, kick, baton, pepper spray, and scream at him. Those were 5 large police officers who shouldn't have had any trouble at all handcuffing him. That was a total failure of police work! As someone above said, one person losing it might be believeable, but all five of them for that length of time? How in the heck are the police trained (or not) in that city?

[HomeAgain]

32 minutes ago, mom2scouts said:

There was absolutely no reason for them to continue to beat, kick, baton, pepper spray, and scream at him.

Fixed that for you.

[Ting Tang]

"Hi Sir, license and registration?  I pulled you over because..."

Unless you're the Highland Park parade shooter, isn't that how the traffic stop should have gone?  

[DawnM]

I am so saddened by all of it.

[Dmmetler]

1 hour ago, mom2scouts said:

I watched the video. There were multiple points were he was under their control, maybe not in complete compliance ('lay on your stomach" when he was on his side but docile or when he didn't "give me your hands" because he was too busy wiping the pepper spray out of his eyes) and they used that as an excuse. There was absolutely no reason for them to continue to beat, kick, baton, pepper spray, and scream at him. Those were 5 large police officers who shouldn't have had any trouble at all handcuffing him. That was a total failure of police work! As someone above said, one person losing it might be believeable, but all five of them for that length of time? How in the heck are the police trained (or not) in that city?

The answer is, often not well.  The TN basic police academy is 12 weeks, and Memphis has reduced requirements to qualify at all.

https://www.fox13memphis.com/news/local/memphis-police-changes-some-requirements-offers-signing-bonuses-recruit-new-officers/DOYRWIE3QJDGJGEMJ6ZWFKQBHM/

 

Every time Memphis appears on one of those "most dangerous cities" lists, there's a big recruiting push for the police, and they're pushed out into the field quickly. (Most of Memphis's homicides are domestic violence, which has a lot more to do with a lack of social services and a social safety net so women can get out of bad situations, but for some reason, they never increase funding and push to hire more social workers or open more beds in DV shelters...). 

 

[Faith-manor]

2 hours ago, mom2scouts said:

I watched the video. There were multiple points were he was under their control, maybe not in complete compliance ('lay on your stomach" when he was on his side but docile or when he didn't "give me your hands" because he was too busy wiping the pepper spray out of his eyes) and they used that as an excuse. There was absolutely no reason for them to continue to beat, kick, baton, pepper spray, and scream at him. Those were 5 large police officers who shouldn't have had any trouble at all handcuffing him. That was a total failure of police work! As someone above said, one person losing it might be believeable, but all five of them for that length of time? How in the heck are the police trained (or not) in that city?

I have to wonder if any amount of training would have fixed these monsters. I have a feeling they were enjoying the blood thirsty, cold hard power they had over him.

[Mrs Tiggywinkle Again]

30 minutes ago, Faith-manor said:

I have to wonder if any amount of training would have fixed these monsters. I have a feeling they were enjoying the blood thirsty, cold hard power they had over him.

At least one had been sued before, when he was a CO, for beating an inmate.  I don’t know how he’d have cleared a background check or psych exam. Maybe they didn’t do one or it didn’t matter because the lawsuit was tossed on a technicality. https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna67861

I worked with a paramedic who wanted to be a police officer, got a criminal justice degree, and took multiple tests but no department would hire him.  He always said it was because he didn’t run fast enough on the physical test, but after working with him on the ambulance for years, I am convinced that he didn’t pass the psych exams.  He was always on a power trip, had awful temper and would get physical with anyone that challenged what he perceived as his authority.  There were so many complaints but that job had a union that protected him for twenty years. He was literally just a terrible person, and I don’t say that lightly.  If any police department had ever hired him, I firmly believe he’d have done horrible things.  He did anyway and was protected by the union.

Some people are mentally ill and some are plainly evil.  While it probably crosses all professions, I think some jobs hide it better than others. I am glad they’re charged, even if all the officers are now out on bail, just like I’m glad the two paramedics who murdered a mentally ill patient in Illinois a few weeks ago were charged with murder. 

I did watch the body cams and it almost looked personal to me.  I have to wonder if there’s a lot more information yet to be released.

Edited January 28, 2023 by Mrs Tiggywinkle Again

[Sneezyone]

35 minutes ago, Mrs Tiggywinkle Again said:

At least one had been sued before, when he was a CO, for beating an inmate.  I don’t know how he’d have cleared a background check or psych exam. Maybe they didn’t do one or it didn’t matter because the lawsuit was tossed on a technicality. https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna67861

I worked with a paramedic who wanted to be a police officer, got a criminal justice degree, and took multiple tests but no department would hire him.  He always said it was because he didn’t run fast enough on the physical test, but after working with him on the ambulance for years, I am convinced that he didn’t pass the psych exams.  He was always on a power trip, had awful temper and would get physical with anyone that challenged what he perceived as his authority.  There were so many complaints but that job had a union that protected him for twenty years. He was literally just a terrible person, and I don’t say that lightly.  If any police department had ever hired him, I firmly believe he’d have done horrible things.  He did anyway and was protected by the union.

Some people are mentally ill and some are plainly evil.  While it probably crosses all professions, I think some jobs hide it better than others. I am glad they’re charged, even if all the officers are now out on bail, just like I’m glad the two paramedics who murdered a mentally ill patient in Illinois a few weeks ago were charged with murder. 

I did watch the body cams and it almost looked personal to me.  I have to wonder if there’s a lot more information yet to be released.

Complaints made by inmates are regularly downplayed or dismissed. They’re seen as likely to be working an angle—early release/vengeance toward an officer/seeking a transfer, etc. After all, they’re convicted criminals. The officers aren’t.

Edited January 28, 2023 by Sneezyone

[Murphy101]

Another day, another mass shooting. 
Another day, death by abuse of power.
Not going to watch the videos.
Not surprised.
Not expecting anything to change.
I’ve got nothing good to say.

[Farrar]

7 hours ago, BlsdMama said:

I wonder….

 

 Does the lack of rioting illustrate just how hopeless people feel that there can be effective change?

I think it reflects that there was accountability quickly for the individuals (even if wider systemic issues need addressing) and that the police didn't riot in return. A lot of "riots" start as protests where police get violent at protesters, pen them in, antagonize them, and curtail their right to protest in various ways. At least from my limited understanding, the Memphis police didn't do that in this case.

[HomeAgain]

21 minutes ago, Farrar said:

I think it reflects that there was accountability quickly for the individuals (even if wider systemic issues need addressing) and that the police didn't riot in return. A lot of "riots" start as protests where police get violent at protesters, pen them in, antagonize them, and curtail their right to protest in various ways. At least from my limited understanding, the Memphis police didn't do that in this case.

Honestly, I don't know if this is a good reflection.

Police brutality culture is largely against minorities.

These cops were also minorities, but were within police culture.

Does police brutality extend to the minorities in their ranks that were caught?  Is it a matter of racism in ranks?

I'm not sure there is an outcome here that can ignore the systemic racism and the response of law enforcement as a whole.  Either way, it's a reflection of the culture.

[Spy Car]

The murder of Tyre Nichols and the release of the videos yesterday was really the last straw for me on a day when I was already feeling as emotionally-heavy as I have in a long (long) time.

With mass shootings, terrorist attacks, atrocities on Ukraine, Holocaust remembrance, and Tyre Nichols, it all felt like too much. As if the world is irredeemably broken.

His killing was horrifying. Heart breaking.

Today I'm trying to dust myself off and summending up the spirit of tikkun olam.

We need to do better.

Bill

[Farrar]

15 minutes ago, HomeAgain said:

Honestly, I don't know if this is a good reflection.

Police brutality culture is largely against minorities.

These cops were also minorities, but were within police culture.

Does police brutality extend to the minorities in their ranks that were caught?  Is it a matter of racism in ranks?

I'm not sure there is an outcome here that can ignore the systemic racism and the response of law enforcement as a whole.  Either way, it's a reflection of the culture.

A good reflection of what though? I'm just responding to the expectation that riots would be the expected and natural response to these events. I think that needs to flip on its head a little bit. In most cases the police exacerbate and even create riots. The police are the ones who riot. In this case, the police stood back and let people go out and protest for the most part. And in most cases where there is violence at protests, it's in part because zero action was taken to deal with the officers who committed murder or assault. In this case, some action has already been taken. And the Memphis police just took more action - disbanding the unit that the protesters have been criticizing.

I'm not saying it's enough. Obviously it's not. Or that the Memphis police are somehow doing some amazing job. Letting people just exercise their right to gather and protest is baseline. It's not some huge victory. And the cynical part of me says that some police forces are getting savvy to the fact that if they say the right things and talk the right talk and let people vent their anger in protests where the most violent thing that happens is some spray painting of public property, then they can quietly set up task forces and then do very little to change their overall approach and then quietly go right back to what they were doing once the furor dies down. And that may work more for them than coming at rightfully angry, grieving communities with a ton of violent, rioting police.

[HomeAgain]

15 minutes ago, Farrar said:

A good reflection of what though? I'm just responding to the expectation that riots would be the expected and natural response to these events. I think that needs to flip on its head a little bit. In most cases the police exacerbate and even create riots. The police are the ones who riot. In this case, the police stood back and let people go out and protest for the most part. And in most cases where there is violence at protests, it's in part because zero action was taken to deal with the officers who committed murder or assault. In this case, some action has already been taken. And the Memphis police just took more action - disbanding the unit that the protesters have been criticizing.

I'm not saying it's enough. Obviously it's not. Or that the Memphis police are somehow doing some amazing job. Letting people just exercise their right to gather and protest is baseline. It's not some huge victory. And the cynical part of me says that some police forces are getting savvy to the fact that if they say the right things and talk the right talk and let people vent their anger in protests where the most violent thing that happens is some spray painting of public property, then they can quietly set up task forces and then do very little to change their overall approach and then quietly go right back to what they were doing once the furor dies down. And that may work more for them than coming at rightfully angry, grieving communities with a ton of violent, rioting police.

I think I talked too softly around the issue so I'll try again.

Police culture is inherently racist.  At its core, policing in the U.S. is so freaking racist that it seems normal for the police to brutalize minorities.  The first question is usually "what did they do to deserve it?".

These police officers, who are part of the culture, are black.  Their fellow law enforcement is still racist.  The fact that they, unlike many of their white counterparts, were immediately charged with murder and the police unions are quiet, still shows that law enforcement is racist.  If they were white officers the outcome may have been very different in the response by the courts and law enforcement as a whole. 

I am NOT saying that these 5 did not absolutely deserve to be charged with murder.  They did.  I am saying that 5 black officers charged is not a good indication of change in police culture.  There is no indication that there is a shift in perception or that law enforcement should change.  All it means is that racist cops will still be racist - rallying around white murderers but condemning black ones.

[Ting Tang]

1 hour ago, Spy Car said:

The murder of Tyre Nichols and the release of the videos yesterday was really the last straw for me on a day when I was already feeling as emotionally-heavy as I have in a long (long) time.

With mass shootings, terrorist attacks, atrocities on Ukraine, Holocaust remembrance, and Tyre Nichols, it all felt like too much. As if the world is irredeemably broken.

His killing was horrifying. Heart breaking.

Today I'm trying to dust myself off and summending up the spirit of tikkun olam.

We need to do better.

Bill

I don't know if we see more because of social media and the Internet, or if things really do seem to be getting so much worse.  😞  I have grown quite cynical lately.  Sometimes I feel bad I brought children into the world. I feel like we're all in a big game of roulette---surviving on luck.

[Sneezyone]

1 hour ago, HomeAgain said:

I think I talked too softly around the issue so I'll try again.

Police culture is inherently racist.  At its core, policing in the U.S. is so freaking racist that it seems normal for the police to brutalize minorities.  The first question is usually "what did they do to deserve it?".

These police officers, who are part of the culture, are black.  Their fellow law enforcement is still racist.  The fact that they, unlike many of their white counterparts, were immediately charged with murder and the police unions are quiet, still shows that law enforcement is racist.  If they were white officers the outcome may have been very different in the response by the courts and law enforcement as a whole. 

I am NOT saying that these 5 did not absolutely deserve to be charged with murder.  They did.  I am saying that 5 black officers charged is not a good indication of change in police culture.  There is no indication that there is a shift in perception or that law enforcement should change.  All it means is that racist cops will still be racist - rallying around white murderers but condemning black ones.

I dunno. The history of law enforcement includes racialized animosity/narratives. Not sure that's in dispute except in highly polarized corners of the interwebs. As that culture evolved tho, I think the links between history and the 'hunt/chase, control/comply, dominate' ethos of today are less obvious. It's implicit/inbred. Is it 'racist'? Maybe but everyone's at risk right now, not just (albeit disproportionately) racial/ethnic minorities.

We've systematically (through SCOTUS) denied humans the ability to react instinctively/humanly to LEO violence or provocation while protecting the rights of those supposedly trained officers to overreact to even objectively non-threatening situations. Do y'all remember the discussion over the disability service worker/aide who was shot by police in the middle of the street while sitting next to his charge and trying get him to surrender a knife? The culture and the bonds within LE are stronger than any racial/ethnic connections the officers may have. I saw a retired chief today on TV say that there comes a point where every officer has to decide whether they want to prioritize their people group or the badge.

The harrowing stories of disrespect for the chain of command I've heard about the city I work in are just...ugh. People like to compare it to the military but there's no way in Hades anyone DH works with would be permitted to openly demonstrate the behaviors LEOs get away with. 

Edited January 29, 2023 by Sneezyone

[Faith-manor]

1 hour ago, Spy Car said:

The murder of Tyre Nichols and the release of the videos yesterday was really the last straw for me on a day when I was already feeling as emotionally-heavy as I have in a long (long) time.

With mass shootings, terrorist attacks, atrocities on Ukraine, Holocaust remembrance, and Tyre Nichols, it all felt like too much. As if the world is irredeemably broken.

His killing was horrifying. Heart breaking.

Today I'm trying to dust myself off and summending up the spirit of tikkun olam.

We need to do better.

Bill

I feel that, Bill! I really do, the extreme brokenness. My preemie grandson had a cardiac incident today. He seems to be okay now, but honestly, I just feel like he has been born into horror, and that the horror comes from every corner. But my other two grandsons who are in my care for now need me to buck up. It is so damn hard!

[Spy Car]

8 minutes ago, Faith-manor said:

I feel that, Bill! I really do, the extreme brokenness. My preemie grandson had a cardiac incident today. He seems to be okay now, but honestly, I just feel like he has been born into horror, and that the horror comes from every corner. But my other two grandsons who are in my care for now need me to buck up. It is so damn hard!

We just can't give in. Those who are coming up need us to stay strong. And speaking to myself here.

My best wishes for your grandson.

(((((Hugs)))))

Bill

[Faith-manor]

Just now, Spy Car said:

We just can't give in. Those who are coming up need us to stay strong. And speaking to myself here.

My best wishes for your grandson.

(((((Hugs)))))

Bill

Thank you, Bill!

[KSera]

22 minutes ago, Sneezyone said:

We've systematically (through SCOTUS) denied humans the ability to react instinctively/humanly to LEO violence or provocation while protecting the rights of those supposedly trained officers to overreact to even on-threatening situations.

Yes! I’ve been very much struck by the first part in this case (I’ve only read the play-by-play of what happens in the videos, but have not watched the videos themselves). I was immediately struck by the absolutely understandable fight or flight response that seems so clear and instinctive to me. What person wouldn’t try to run if they could when being attacked like that? But my brain hadn’t made the leap to the fact of what you say in the second part, that the police on the other hand are forgiven for jumping immediately to excessive force—deadly force even—even if it’s in response only to a fear that they might possibly face some kind of danger.