wuhan - coronavirus

[Ausmumof3]

3 minutes ago, StellaM said:

 

That's appalling.

I hope politicians are sued after all this is over, for their utter carelessness around worker safety.

To be fair he’s not in a health care field so it’s easy to see why it’s being overlooked.  But yeah.  He’s spoken to the health and safety guy (can’t remember his official title)

[JennyD]

2 hours ago, Pen said:

I heard from someone irl that Vanderbilt University has 44 students Positive for CV19– just a personal communication.  May be incorrect.  Maybe a sleuth on here will figure out whether true or not.  

If true I wonder if they were spreading it at the beach scene. 

 

There are official reports of several) Vanderbilt undergraduates testing positive, and the student newspaper is reporting 11.  Several of them are students who came back from study abroad in Europe.

It's obviously entirely possible that there are many more cases, of course, but for better or for worse very few undergrads are currently on campus.  The students came back from spring break last Monday (3/9), then classes were cancelled Thursday, and the students had to be out of the dorms by Sunday.  Distance learning started on Monday, and staff has to work from home.  

Vanderbilt University Medical Center, which is a separate entity from the university itself, has been rolling out testing around Middle Tennessee, though, and several health workers have tested positive.  

[Guest]

7 hours ago, Terabith said:

Can't believe people got on a cruise with this going on.

My friend, who is a travel agent for cruiselines, put up a FB post the day before the travel ban from Trump, encouraging people to book cruises. It was meant to illustrate how the cruises with sick people on it were a tiny percentage of cruise ships operating at that very moment. (It seemed likely to me that the cruise companies instructed agents to put up a post like this.) My friend, too, was not at home; she was down south somewhere sunny at the time. Even now, she is encouraging people to “reschedule, don’t cancel,” which seems to me like a desperate, empty hope from a cratered industry. Again - I think the cruise companies are instructing their agents to do this, to try and combat the extreme fallout from the cruise ship illnesses. (IOW, I don’t think my friend is just being dense.) But I can hardly bear to see her posts because it seems so tone-deaf. 

[Pen]

2 hours ago, JennyD said:

 

There are official reports of several) Vanderbilt undergraduates testing positive, and the student newspaper is reporting 11.  Several of them are students who came back from study abroad in Europe.

It's obviously entirely possible that there are many more cases, of course, but for better or for worse very few undergrads are currently on campus.  The students came back from spring break last Monday (3/9), then classes were cancelled Thursday, and the students had to be out of the dorms by Sunday.  Distance learning started on Monday, and staff has to work from home.  

Vanderbilt University Medical Center, which is a separate entity from the university itself, has been rolling out testing around Middle Tennessee, though, and several health workers have tested positive.  

 

Thank you. 

(I have no likes left starting out day — apparently used when it was late yesterday for me but already “today” for the Likes counting)

[73349]

At this point I think encouraging anyone to travel anywhere is predatory.

Re: schools, I know one argument in favor of closing here when we did is that students (and teachers when supervising them) are not allowed to use disinfecting products on desks, etc.--only cleaning staff. And one reason the librarians in Chicago are so furious about being forced to stay open is that they have no disinfectants. So shared computers, etc., are a risk for everyone.

[73349]

[Yet again, Carolina says too much.]

Edited October 2, 2020 by Carolina Wren

[Pen]

5 hours ago, mathnerd said:

This thread scrolls so fast! I first read about the use of Chloroquine several pages ago on this thread. I am posting again about it here because there have been some successes and there is optimism that this could be the answer. It is also something that many 3rd world countries in Asia and Africa can easily use when C-19 hits them as they have plenty of Chloroquine as an antimalarial.

https://www.fiercepharma.com/pharma/bayer-preps-u-s-donation-malaria-med-chloroquine-to-help-covid-19-fight-report

https://www.connexionfrance.com/French-news/French-lab-Sanofi-hypothetically-offers-millions-of-doses-of-potential-Covid-19-Plaquenil-anti-malaria-drug

https://www.wired.com/story/an-old-malaria-drug-may-fight-covid-19-and-silicon-valleys-into-it/

 

 

👍 I want to look at those shortly.  Just getting caught up this morning. 

8 hours ago, Seasider too said:

 

I was in our respiratory specialist’s office today for an appointment. He said to use Tylenol, not ibuprofen, for now, until we know more. He told us some initial studies indicated ibuprofen may cause issues with CV19 treatment and we need to avoid it until the evidence is clear. He did not name a study, but is highly regarded in his field. 

 

There was a BMJ (British Medical Journal) article I saw that gave a bunch of different gathered information. Some contradictory.

It also had to some degree explained the French Health Minister’s warning.  (Iirc based on doctor’s reports from treating real CV19 cases irl, rather than a scientific study. ) 

It seemed from it even possible that at certain stages of the illness Ibuprofen makes CV19 worse, and that at others Ibuprofen makes it better.   For example, at an early stage perhaps Ibuprofen can bring on cytokine storm, but that if a cytokine storm is in progress that I buprofen could help to stop it. 

This was specific iirc to CV 19.  

Other studies I saw related to SARS1. 

I personally haven’t been using Ibuprofen for years anyway because my stomach does not tolerate it.

After reading the things I read though, I personally decided to be wary even of anti inflammatory herbs at this time.  

 

[Pen]

uill     51,191

Posted 1 hour ago

   9 hours ago,  Terabith said: 

Can't believe people got on a cruise with this going on.

My friend, who is a travel agent for cruiselines, put up a FB post...”

 

Advertising from travel industry, special offers etc, may be a part of it.  Also people’s own tendencies to see and hear what fits their own world view or own inclinations perhaps?

 I recall several people on the “not concerned “ thread insisting that they were going to be doing international travel (by plane) shortly.  Even booked travel well after the start of the CV19 crisis. 

I thought it was one thing for you @Quill to be getting caught abroad as this was unfolding.  But quite another to be planning recreational international travel at that point.  

Even the work related international travel was looking very dicey. I felt quite concerned about Yael’s Husband and his upcoming travel, for example.  Though when work was at issue I at least found it easier to understand than when travel was for just fun and recreation. 

@Terabith—you might want to read the no big deal thread now if people haven’t changed their earlier posts. 

 I found it quite disheartening to read posts from people I had formerly thought intelligent about how they *were* going to travel and no one was going to talk them out of it. One person iirc wrote that she would commit civil disobedience if government tried to stop her. Others claimed it was for the good of keeping the airline workers in jobs...  I don’t know if they have since gone back and deleted or changed those posts since.  But if not you can probably get a feeling for what might be in cruise passengers’ minds as well.   

Or listen to the party hearty college students interviewed on Florida beaches.  It’s probably pretty much the same as the older cruise goers in the time of Cv19

 

[Pen]

4 hours ago, StellaM said:

Nm, better in other thread.🙂

 

That’s true! 🙂 perfect for the other thread.

I wanted to let you know that while it took state mandate to close schools, and then was left to individual districts how to handle things, our district is now giving childcare for infants to age 12 (it didn’t previously have any care for below K)  of people who don’t have other options with priority for parents working in critical jobs (EG first responders, medical), and then, apparently starting with space separation in mind not cram kids in, for others who show proof of employment such that no one can be home with child. 

Plus a meals program for those who rely on that, pick up or drop off. 

This was being said to be virtually impossible around 1.5 weeks ago. 

But now it appears that with required mandate from state to work it out that it is happening.

program was supposed to start at end of month, but looks like it is already up and running

(Our district started with childcare and food, hasn’t yet addressed learning while at home.) 

 

Edited March 20, 2020 by Pen

[Arcadia]

https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/asia/covid-19-china-medical-supplies-malaysia-hospital-sungai-buloh-12560656

“KUALA LUMPUR: China on Thursday (Mar 19) sent its first batch of medical supplies to the Sungai Buloh Hospital in the Malaysian state of Selangor.

Malaysia on Friday reported 130 new COVID-19 cases, taking the national total to 1,030 and making it the country with the highest number of infections in Southeast Asia.”

[Arcadia]

“#BREAKING: The deadline for Americans to file their taxes will shift from April 15 to July 15, Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin announces on Twitter. http://nbcbay.com/K3y20qz”

[TCB]

2 hours ago, whitehawk said:

I'm concerned that even if my test is positive, DS won't get a test until next week and will likely come up negative even though he sick first and presumably got sgave it to me--simply because it was over two weeks before he was eligible. Having already tested positive and recovered is going to matter a lot for people until an antibody test is available.

If you test positive I think you can absolutely just assume he was positive too.

[73349]

9 minutes ago, TCB said:

If you test positive I think you can absolutely just assume he was positive too.

*I* definitely would assume it--two members of the same household with respiratory symptoms starting in within 48 hours of each other very reasonably should be supposed to have the same thing--but will other people? Or will he be kept away from other people for an extended time since we didn't get it documented because my federal, state and local health authorities were wildly late to get their act together?

First of March was the report of someone who'd brought it back to Seattle to my county, tested positive, and was isolating at home. My county board of health claimed it didn't need to do contact tracing for the four days between when he got back and when he developed symptoms because he wouldn't have been contagious yet. That was already bad information at the time and I, a layperson, recognized it as such, but we carried on as usual (making sure to have a good stock of food on hand, though) until the morning of the 8th, having caught it (I assume, results not in yet) and very possibly spread it that week. Other people with similar symptoms will have carried on longer either because they had to or because they still were being told No Fever, No Problem. This is a four-county metro area with upwards of a million people, and not getting it right at the beginning was a significant error.

Forgive my cranky tone, please, if y'all will; I haven't been out of my house except for medical purposes since the 6th and have been sick since the 9th, and it's getting old. At least local people are now catching up a bit--DS had chess class online today, his first contact with other children (or anyone at all other than DH & me except his drum teacher, 30 minutes online this Tuesday) since the 7th.

[mom2scouts]

A 4th member of that NJ family died last night. How horrible for them.🙁 Three more are still hospitalized.

[TravelingChris]

9 hours ago, Melissa in Australia said:

Quite frankly I think that China was way more open about Coronavirus than USA has been

Totally disagree.  US is fumbling.  China\s deception is purposeful and ongoing. US is trying to be open.  All states are reporting positive tests. We simply are lagging in getting results but not because of deception,.   Totally unlike China- in Beijing they have opened up another COVId hospital this week.  But they claim they have no new cases.  They also are claiming the US started this virus which is an outright lie.  It came from the weird animal market in Wuhan.  How the weird animals got to the market- some Chinese are claiming that workers at the Biosafe site that is located there were selling animals from that site to that market to make extra money or was it just the bats the people ate since a very similar COVID virus exists in bats that are in caves in China.  Nonetheless, Chinese lie= they lie about all their imprisoned politlcal prisoners and Uighers and Tibetans and on and on with who they imprison.  And they are lying about the disease too.

[TravelingChris]

12 hours ago, Terabith said:

Can't believe people got on a cruise with this going on.

They got on this cruise 4 months ago.  This was a very long cruise.  4 months ago, no one had heard of this virus here is US and China was keeping things silent and arresting doctors who were trying to get the message out.

[TravelingChris]

7 hours ago, StellaM said:

 

NSW government can get f*cked, as can anybody who decided now was a great time to take a short cruise.

I'm sorry for the language, but I am so angry.  I get home from watching not a single recommedation being implemented in schools to protect the health of staff and students. and find out some people decided in the last few weeks to go on a cruise.  I believe a majority are Australian residents. Does anyone think there's any supervision of the supposed isolation? Not bloody likely. 

I can cope with coronovirus. I cannot cope with stupidity and incompetence.

Those people got on the cruise four months ago.  It was a world cruise.  Four months ago, life was normal.  They have been trying to get off for more than a month now.

[TCB]

6 minutes ago, whitehawk said:

*I* definitely would assume it--two members of the same household with respiratory symptoms starting in within 48 hours of each other very reasonably should be supposed to have the same thing--but will other people? Or will he be kept away from other people for an extended time since we didn't get it documented because my federal, state and local health authorities were wildly late to get their act together?

First of March was the report of someone who'd brought it back to Seattle to my county, tested positive, and was isolating at home. My county board of health claimed it didn't need to do contact tracing for the four days between when he got back and when he developed symptoms because he wouldn't have been contagious yet. That was already bad information at the time and I, a layperson, recognized it as such, but we carried on as usual (making sure to have a good stock of food on hand, though) until the morning of the 8th, having caught it (I assume, results not in yet) and very possibly spread it that week. Other people with similar symptoms will have carried on longer either because they had to or because they still were being told No Fever, No Problem. This is a four-county metro area with upwards of a million people, and not getting it right at the beginning was a significant error.

Forgive my cranky tone, please, if y'all will; I haven't been out of my house except for medical purposes since the 6th and have been sick since the 9th, and it's getting old. At least local people are now catching up a bit--DS had chess class online today, his first contact with other children (or anyone at all other than DH & me except his drum teacher, 30 minutes online this Tuesday) since the 7th.

I think maybe I'm not sure what you are asking but I guess what I'm meaning is that I don't think it matters what anyone else thinks about it now. If you are positive he was too. He needs to stay isolated for whatever the current guidelines are. So many people have it now that I really think that, if you are positive, you can hopefully feel relief that you and he have had it and recovered and now don't feel such concern about coming down with it. I know there is some question about how long immunity lasts etc but I think it is reasonable to feel relief for having it and recovering. Sorry if I have completely missed your question on this!

[BeachGal]

A little sign of something good that hopefully we'll continue seeing.

A preprint shows that in a small sample of Covid patients from Singapore, the virus appears to be becoming milder. This doesn't mean we would be out of the woods -- people will still develop pneumonia and a smaller subset of those will develop cytokine storm -- but it's much better than the virus becoming stronger. Keep in mind that this has not been peer-reviewed yet.

https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.03.11.987222v1.full.pdf

Quote

 

To date, the SARS-CoV-2 genome has been considered genetically more stable than

21  SARS-CoV or MERS-CoV. Here we report a 382-nt deletion covering almost the entire

22  open reading frame 8 (ORF8) of SARS-CoV-2 obtained from eight hospitalized patients

23  in Singapore. The deletion also removes the ORF8 transcription-regulatory sequence

24  (TRS), which in turn enhances the downstream transcription of the N gene. We also

25  found that viruses with the deletion have been circulating for at least four weeks.

26  During the SARS-CoV outbreak in 2003, a number of genetic variants were observed in

27  the human population [1], and similar variation has since been observed across SARS-

28  related CoVs in humans and bats. Overwhelmingly these viruses had mutations or

29  deletions in ORF8, that have been associated with reduced replicative fitness of the

30  virus [2]. This is also consistent with the observation that towards the end of the

31  outbreak sequences obtained from human SARS cases possessed an ORF8 deletion that

32  may be associated with host adaptation [1]. We therefore hypothesise that the major

33  deletion revealed in this study may lead to an attenuated phenotype of SARS-CoV-2.

 

 

[73349]

1 minute ago, TCB said:

I think maybe I'm not sure what you are asking but I guess what I'm meaning is that I don't think it matters what anyone else thinks about it now. If you are positive he was too. He needs to stay isolated for whatever the current guidelines are. So many people have it now that I really think that, if you are positive, you can hopefully feel relief that you and he have had it and recovered and now don't feel such concern about coming down with it. I know there is some question about how long immunity lasts etc but I think it is reasonable to feel relief for having it and recovering. Sorry if I have completely missed your question on this!

I'm saying, new guidelines will come out (probably by May) that limit people, and especially kids, from attending/participating in things unless they are verified to have had it and recovered. Those who had it but couldn't get tested would then be stuck at home indefinitely as if they are potential vectors until they can get an antibody test.

[SeaConquest]

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/20/nyregion/coronavirus-new-york-update.html

Governor Cuomo told New Yorkers to stay indoors as much as possible and ordered all nonessential businesses to keep all workers home as cases topped 7,000.

[J-rap]

7 hours ago, StellaM said:

 

Personally, I think schools should stay open for a very limited number of families - children in families where both parents are health care workers, children from single parent homes where the parent cannot work from home, and children with special needs, if the environment can be made safe for them, and safe for staff. There should be a maximum of ten children to a room. 

I think these schools, which will be offering childminding and not education, should be staffed by teacher and OOSH volunteers, who are low risk. These teachers should be paid well above their normal salary for the time they work in these schools, and they should be supported with health training and protective gear.

Everyone else should be working from home, and if the staff member is available for work, but they cannot be on campus and cannot be supplied with work from home duties, they should be paid on at least 50% of their usual wage until they are able to return to at-school duties safely.

Chances of this happening?  Low.

I think this is a great idea...  I've also wondered if teachers who have already had the virus could do something like this, assisted by community volunteers (who have also already had the virus).   I do know that immunity once having it is still unknown though.

[SeaConquest]

Since shelter in place orders, and closures of all nonessential businesses, will likely be coming to all of us in the near future, I thought it helpful to clarify what that actually means in practice. We own a small business, so trying to understand what that meant for us was obviously critical. This is the guidance from the federal government that California is using, and I assume other states will likely follow similar guidelines. It centers around critical infrastructure. We were given no warning to prepare, as time is obviously of the essence at the moment -- the order went into effect last night at midnight -- so take this opportunity to prepare now, if this will affect you.

https://www.cisa.gov/sites/default/files/publications/CISA-Guidance-on-Essential-Critical-Infrastructure-Workers-1-20-508c.pdf

ETA: It appears to me that campgrounds stay open (we are still here), as do businesses that repair marine vessels (which is what we do, so while we have closed our physical office location, our workers are still out fixing boats while maintaining social distancing and taking appropriate precautions with respect to potentially contaminated surfaces). The grandparents also left this morning to begin their journey back to Canada. 

Edited March 20, 2020 by SeaConquest

[BeachGal]

16 hours ago, Acadie said:

 

@BeachGal Does Randy Cron, MD, advocate for the use of CytoSorb? 

 

I don't know. 

The CytoSorb has been used in over 44 countries with good success, though.

I think it's in clinical trials here in the US that are supposed to end soon and then FDA approval would follow. (I'm not 100% sure about the time frame but I think it's along those lines.) I would hope approval could be fast tracked. We will sure look foolish if other countries are using it to treat cytokine storm but it's not available here to treat our own citizens. Crazy.

[TCB]

16 minutes ago, whitehawk said:

I'm saying, new guidelines will come out (probably by May) that limit people, and especially kids, from attending/participating in things unless they are verified to have had it and recovered. Those who had it but couldn't get tested would then be stuck at home indefinitely as if they are potential vectors until they can get an antibody test.

Maybe but there will be many in that position because we are testing so few. Honestly I think it would be very difficult a policy like that because of the lack of testing. Many places are reporting that they are only able to test those that are critically ill and maybe healthcare workers. Maybe by then there will be some sort of antibody testing that can confirm immunity.

[vonfirmath]

5 minutes ago, TCB said:

Maybe but there will be many in that position because we are testing so few. Honestly I think it would be very difficult a policy like that because of the lack of testing. Many places are reporting that they are only able to test those that are critically ill and maybe healthcare workers. Maybe by then there will be some sort of antibody testing that can confirm immunity.

 

Dr. John Campbell says they are working on an antibody test in the UK and there are promising leads that way

[BeachGal]

22 minutes ago, SeaConquest said:

Since shelter in place orders, and closures of all nonessential businesses, will likely be coming to all of us in the near future, I thought it helpful to clarify what that actually means in practice. We own a small business, so trying to understand what that meant for us was obviously critical. This is the guidance from the federal government that California is using, and I assume other states will likely follow similar guidelines. It centers around critical infrastructure. We were given no warning to prepare, as time is obviously of the essence at the moment -- the order went into effect last night at midnight -- so take this opportunity to prepare now, if this will affect you.

https://www.cisa.gov/sites/default/files/publications/CISA-Guidance-on-Essential-Critical-Infrastructure-Workers-1-20-508c.pdf

ETA: It appears to me that campgrounds stay open (we are still here), as do businesses that repair marine vessels (which is what we do, so while we have closed our physical office location, our workers are still out fixing boats while maintaining social distancing and taking appropriate precautions with respect to potentially contaminated surfaces). The grandparents also left this morning to begin their journey back to Canada. 

 

We are planning to bring our youngest home when they order the shelter in place (SIP) in Chicago which is probably just days away.

So that none of us have to think much about what to pack, we made a list of items. Ds has been working 12-14 hour days and last night started work at 2 am and won't be done until 6 pm today (a weird financial quarterly event). He doesn't have much time to pack in the little bit of spare time he has after work. He also needs a lot of it on a daily basis. So, for anyone in a similar situation, you might want to consider making a list already.

Btw, I heard a rumor from someone who knows someone at Homeland Security who said some places may have a SIP or lockdown for a very long time. Probably big cities which is why we're bringing our son to our place.

[Terabith]

41 minutes ago, TravelingChris said:

They got on this cruise 4 months ago.  This was a very long cruise.  4 months ago, no one had heard of this virus here is US and China was keeping things silent and arresting doctors who were trying to get the message out.

That's fair, if they got on the cruise four months ago.  But, if it's been a four month cruise, how on earth did people on board contract it?  This virus didn't exist four months ago.  I would think that would be the safest possible place, unless they were stopping at ports where this was unfolding and contracting it there?  

@Pen, as far as my oldest being neurotypical, I mean there's probably some broad autistic phenotype stuff going on, but other than sensory sensitivity to noise, she literally had NO issues social or relating to depression or anxiety, until she started at the large public high school just before she turned 15.  Younger kid has had significant anxiety since birth and is definitely on asd spectrum, but oldest had no issues until this school started, which was just a really, really bad fit for her.  Her depression and anxiety actually presents more like ptsd than anything.  And it's possible there was some traumatic incident there, although she claims there wasn't, and she didn't report to her counselor.  But I've been in that school, and it is incredibly, unbelievably loud. Her counselor thinks for someone with a minor lifelong noise sensitivity, the day after day assault on her senses operated like a physical assault psychologically.   

[JadeOrchidSong]

4 hours ago, whitehawk said:

I'm concerned that even if my test is positive, DS won't get a test until next week and will likely come up negative even though he got sick first and presumably gave it to me--simply because it was over two weeks before he was eligible. Having already tested positive and recovered is going to matter a lot for people until an antibody test is available.

How do you and dh quarantine yourselves while your dc live in the same house? We have a small house. If I use our bedroom, dh has nowhere to go but the living room couch. In fact he has work computer station in our small bedroom. So it will be hard to quarantine if one of us gets it. 

[Janeway]

13 minutes ago, Dotwithaperiod said:

 I guess that’s sorta similar with  the level of children’s deaths we’re willing to accept before actually doing something that reduces the happiness, rights, or economy of gun owner/manufacturers. Interesting.

Why is gun ownership even a part of this equation? 

[Guest]

8 hours ago, StellaM said:

 

NSW government can get f*cked, as can anybody who decided now was a great time to take a short cruise.

I'm sorry for the language, but I am so angry.  I get home from watching not a single recommedation being implemented in schools to protect the health of staff and students. and find out some people decided in the last few weeks to go on a cruise.  I believe a majority are Australian residents. Does anyone think there's any supervision of the supposed isolation? Not bloody likely. 

I can cope with coronovirus. I cannot cope with stupidity and incompetence.

The idea that anyone would get on a ship right now is amazing to me. Especially one with "Princess" in the name.... Of course, I feel the same about people who went to Florida for Spring Break-THIS WEEK!!!! And I know quite a few families who did because "we already booked the trip, and don't want to waste money". Since the parks were closed, I'm betting they were all on the beach. Not college students, mature adults with kids, like DD's former cheer coach, who has two in college and a high school senior. Like, seriously, we're going to end up with National Guard enforced lockdowns so we can't even walk around the block because people just won't stop BEING STUPID!!!

[Sk8ermaiden]

1 hour ago, TravelingChris said:

They got on this cruise 4 months ago.  This was a very long cruise.  4 months ago, no one had heard of this virus here is US and China was keeping things silent and arresting doctors who were trying to get the message out.

Two members of my kid's gymnastics team got on cruises within the last 8 days. 

[Janeway]

17 minutes ago, Terabith said:

That's fair, if they got on the cruise four months ago.  But, if it's been a four month cruise, how on earth did people on board contract it?  This virus didn't exist four months ago.  I would think that would be the safest possible place, unless they were stopping at ports where this was unfolding and contracting it there?  

@Pen, as far as my oldest being neurotypical, I mean there's probably some broad autistic phenotype stuff going on, but other than sensory sensitivity to noise, she literally had NO issues social or relating to depression or anxiety, until she started at the large public high school just before she turned 15.  Younger kid has had significant anxiety since birth and is definitely on asd spectrum, but oldest had no issues until this school started, which was just a really, really bad fit for her.  Her depression and anxiety actually presents more like ptsd than anything.  And it's possible there was some traumatic incident there, although she claims there wasn't, and she didn't report to her counselor.  But I've been in that school, and it is incredibly, unbelievably loud. Her counselor thinks for someone with a minor lifelong noise sensitivity, the day after day assault on her senses operated like a physical assault psychologically.   

4 month cruises generally involve stopping off at various ports.

[Katy]

We've managed to keep this thread open for 163 pages.  If you must discuss potentially political topics such as the value of life vs guns, the mental health ramifications of being isolated or quarantined, or other topics that have nothing to do with coronavirus, please start a spin off thread.

[Arcadia]

@TCB

Email from a neighbor to the neighborhood mailing list 😞

Don’t quote below as I am going to delete later 

“We had items miraculously walked away from our hospital, in all departments. Masks, gloves, wipes, boxes, thermometers all disappear etc. These are our essentials in our line of duty.  We are having to use our mask, one mask entire shift. Try wearing it for 12 hours lol. 

When you do arrive and a mask has been handed to you as a patient or visitor please please I don’t want to see them on the floor. We are so short of supplies nurses, doctors, transporters, xray technicians, CT, ultrasound technicians,  cleaners, food services etc or all at risk.”

[JadeOrchidSong]

56 minutes ago, TravelingChris said:

Totally disagree.  US is fumbling.  China\s deception is purposeful and ongoing. US is trying to be open.  All states are reporting positive tests. We simply are lagging in getting results but not because of deception,.   Totally unlike China- in Beijing they have opened up another COVId hospital this week.  But they claim they have no new cases.  They also are claiming the US started this virus which is an outright lie.  It came from the weird animal market in Wuhan.  How the weird animals got to the market- some Chinese are claiming that workers at the Biosafe site that is located there were selling animals from that site to that market to make extra money or was it just the bats the people ate since a very similar COVID virus exists in bats that are in caves in China.  Nonetheless, Chinese lie= they lie about all their imprisoned politlcal prisoners and Uighers and Tibetans and on and on with who they imprison.  And they are lying about the disease too.

You nailed it, TravelingChris. 

China=liar

At the very beginning they loudly claimed and propagandised that it was the bat at the wet market. At almost the same time, they started spreading rumor that the US is so fearful and jealous of China's power and fast growth to be a challenging world that the US planted the virus in Wuhan. All of this happened at the very beginning when they locked down Wuhan. 

Then they used race card to slander Americans for travel restrictions. They pressurized WHO to name the virus and enforced it to called COVID-19 and criticize anyone who called it Wuhan virus or China virus. Meanwhile Zhong Nanshan an expert and official in medical field in China, started claiming that "the infection started in China, but it may not originate from China" all just to prepare for their next lie that US army brought the virus to Wuhan in October, 2020. 

As an immigrant from China, I would like the world to remember it is Wuhan virus, China virus, Chinese virus simply because of all the cover up, the lies, the slanders Chinese government committed regarding this novel coronavirus. 

Nobody knows the real death number in China. For what I learned, 60% died in their own homes, 40% in hospitals. Those that died at home were never tested nor confirmed. Even in the hospitals, they did not have time to test everyone and many died before a test could be done and they were NOT recorded in the death number. 

In Wuhan, the government showed the world that patients recovered and hospitals were emptied. In fact, friends told me that new hospitals were built in the suburb away from public eyes. They can hold 4000 patients there. 

Any place in China that reports infected case is generally punished for telling the truth now. 

Now China refuses to ship 3M face masks and other medical supplies to the US while selling supplies to Malaysia and other Belt-and-Road #BowToChina countries. If this is not malicious evil towards the US, I don't know what is. 90% of American medicines and medical device production is done in China. When China uses this as a weapon against the US, the US suffers tremendously just like now. 

ChinaCommunistParty(CCP)=liar. "Do not even believe a punctuation mark CCP uses.” "Even the whole world's dirty words cannot describe the evil of CCP". 用尽世上所有的脏话，都不能描述中共的邪恶 These are direct quotes from people in China. 

[73349]

31 minutes ago, JadeOrchidSong said:

How do you and dh quarantine yourselves while your dc live in the same house? We have a small house. If I use our bedroom, dh has nowhere to go but the living room couch. In fact he has work computer station in our small bedroom. So it will be hard to quarantine if one of us gets it. 

Simply put, we're not. DH works all day in his office, which DS and I don't enter; but he's been sleeping on the couch (haha, I typed "cough" first) in the living room, where DS and I spend most of the day. That's our school room, my office, etc. There's no basement or anything. So if my test is positive, he will have to stay home for whatever duration instructed and will probably qualify for a test even though he doesn't have symptoms--and again, may have gotten the infection and cleared it, which we wouldn't be able to establish until the antibody test gets here. I've still been cooking dinner for all of us, even (mostly boiled stuff like soups). DS and I are using paper towels instead of hand towels, and that's about all we can do.

[mom2scouts]

People in my area are waiting in car lines for 7-8 hours to be tested. These are people who have a doctor's order because they have symptoms or are at very high risk.

Our county just reported its first confirmed case. It's one of our city firefighters.

[Sk8ermaiden]

9 minutes ago, Seasider too said:

 

😡

I was really worried because the type of person who does that is the type that also waltzes back into practice without quarintining. But hey. The gym is closed. 😪

[prairiewindmomma]

Several mask sewing campaigns have been started.  In some cases, people are donating supplies. In others, they are being provided to them.  If you are in the Renton area and are willing to sew, here's a link: https://www.providence.org/lp/100m-masks  Providence is providing the materials and is rolling out its campaign to other hospitals in its chain in time. 

[itsheresomewhere]

3 minutes ago, whitehawk said:

Simply put, we're not. DH works all day in his office, which DS and I don't enter; but he's been sleeping on the couch (haha, I typed "cough" first) in the living room, where DS and I spend most of the day. That's our school room, my office, etc. There's no basement or anything. So if my test is positive, he will have to stay home for whatever duration instructed and will probably qualify for a test even though he doesn't have symptoms--and again, may have gotten the infection and cleared it, which we wouldn't be able to establish until the antibody test gets here. I've still been cooking dinner for all of us, even (mostly boiled stuff like soups). DS and I are using paper towels instead of hand towels, and that's about all we can do.

You may not be tested again.  Here they are telling people to stay home for 3 weeks or until symptoms are gone as they don’t have enough tests for retests.  
 

Someone we know has it but haven’t seen in years. He has been posting on FB his symptoms as he thought he had something else.  Dizzy spells, severe migraine, body aches and feeling off.  After doing all kinds of tests that came back fine or negative, they tested him for covid 19.   

[73349]

1 minute ago, itsheresomewhere said:

You may not be tested again.  Here they are telling people to stay home for 3 weeks or until symptoms are gone as they don’t have enough tests for retests.  
 

I don't need a retest, as we will wait the recommended duration; I just want to verify that we have it.

[TCB]

Arcadia - I think that is going on a lot. I don't know if it has happened where I work now but I know that they are distributing PPE much more carefully now.

JadeOrchidSong - thank you for your post. It is very helpful to hear from someone who has more background knowledge of what is happening there.

[Pen]

1 hour ago, TravelingChris said:

Those people got on the cruise four months ago.  It was a world cruise.  Four months ago, life was normal.  They have been trying to get off for more than a month now.

 

Ah , sorry, my bad.  I didn’t even know there were 4 month cruises at all! 

 

1 hour ago, SeaConquest said:

Since shelter in place orders, and closures of all nonessential businesses, will likely be coming to all of us in the near future, I thought it helpful to clarify what that actually means in practice. We own a small business, so trying to understand what that meant for us was obviously critical. This is the guidance from the federal government that California is using, and I assume other states will likely follow similar guidelines. It centers around critical infrastructure. We were given no warning to prepare, as time is obviously of the essence at the moment -- the order went into effect last night at midnight -- so take this opportunity to prepare now, if this will affect you.

https://www.cisa.gov/sites/default/files/publications/CISA-Guidance-on-Essential-Critical-Infrastructure-Workers-1-20-508c.pdf

ETA: It appears to me that campgrounds stay open (we are still here), as do businesses that repair marine vessels (which is what we do, so while we have closed our physical office location, our workers are still out fixing boats while maintaining social distancing and taking appropriate precautions with respect to potentially contaminated surfaces). The grandparents also left this morning to begin their journey back to Canada. 

 

I’ve been getting messages from businesses about changes they are making.  Like showrooms and office’s not open, but phone support and repair crew still available etc.   and how to contact them.  

It seems to combine an ad with a useful heads up as to new systems.  

And sometimes new  products — like our heating people called offering a special air filter, for example. 

 

 

1 hour ago, Terabith said:

That's fair, if they got on the cruise four months ago.  But, if it's been a four month cruise, how on earth did people on board contract it?  This virus didn't exist four months ago.  I would think that would be the safest possible place, unless they were stopping at ports where this was unfolding and contracting it there?  

@Pen, as far as my oldest being neurotypical, I mean there's probably some broad autistic phenotype stuff going on, but other than sensory sensitivity to noise, she literally had NO issues social or relating to depression or anxiety, until she started at the large public high school just before she turned 15.  Younger kid has had significant anxiety since birth and is definitely on asd spectrum, but oldest had no issues until this school started, which was just a really, really bad fit for her.  Her depression and anxiety actually presents more like ptsd than anything.  And it's possible there was some traumatic incident there, although she claims there wasn't, and she didn't report to her counselor.  But I've been in that school, and it is incredibly, unbelievably loud. Her counselor thinks for someone with a minor lifelong noise sensitivity, the day after day assault on her senses operated like a physical assault psychologically.   

 

Sorry T, I am pretty sure I had you mixed up with someone else.

Or else perhaps misinterpreted idea of worries about child not making it through year as indicating depression, if that was you.

 Or something.  

Distegard my posts. 

[Pen]

53 minutes ago, Katy said:

We've managed to keep this thread open for 163 pages.  If you must discuss potentially political topics such as the value of life vs guns, the mental health ramifications of being isolated or quarantined, or other topics that have nothing to do with coronavirus, please start a spin off thread.

 

Yes please.  Or use the parallel “discussion “ thread I started for this purpose. 

 

https://forums.welltrainedmind.com/topic/696805-covid-19-discussion-arguments-please-be-nice-👍-thread/

Edited March 20, 2020 by Pen

[Pawz4me]

I just finished watching a briefing by NC emergency management. They said they're in discussions with companies here to perhaps begin manufacturing PPE and N95 masks. I've wondered if they would pursue that. We have a long history of textile manufacturing here. It seems to me it wouldn't be that hard to ramp up and start producing. Hopeful . . .

[Selkie]

Not sure if this has been posted yet, but the Illinois governor is reportedly set to announce that the entire state is being put under a shelter in place order, starting tomorrow.

[TracyP]

45 minutes ago, Selkie said:

Not sure if this has been posted yet, but the Illinois governor is reportedly set to announce that the entire state is being put under a shelter in place order, starting tomorrow.

 

Hmm, interesting. Rumors are flying that MN governor will announce the same at 2 pm news conference today. It seems our cases are too low to take that step, but I wouldn't be completely shocked either.

ETA: I listened to press conference and MN is not issuing a SIP order.

Edited March 20, 2020 by TracyP

[BeachGal]

13 minutes ago, Selkie said:

Not sure if this has been posted yet, but the Illinois governor is reportedly set to announce that the entire state is being put under a shelter in place order, starting tomorrow.

 

I heard the same.

[kbutton]

Regarding theft of supplies in hospitals, it's an ongoing problem, not just with COVID, and it's in doctors' offices too. It's rampant and has been going on for years. It just happens to be getting more attention right now.