Sk8ermaiden Posted August 29, 2017 Share Posted August 29, 2017 The freeway underpasses and freeways are designed to flood. They are our first line of defense against flooded buildings and houses. That's something people out of town don't understand either. EVERY flood we have, news/the weather channel show the buffalo bayou, which becomes an ENORMOUS lake just north of downtown. It is the quintessential Houston flood picture. That ENTIRE area is supposed to flood. It is city park and streets, and every structure, garbage can, sculpture, and bench is designed to be underwater. Now, this time it is spreading into surrounding buildings. Which obviously is not supposed to happen, but I don't recall it happening before, despite being trotted out as the OMG so flooded picture. In a city so flat that the water has nowhere to go, the roads take the brunt for us. I just heard our mayor mentioning that the Weather Channel had to ADD A NEW COLOR for rainfall for us. If you think your city would know what to do with this rain, before it happened, you're wrong. 19 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andromeda Posted August 29, 2017 Share Posted August 29, 2017 My relative is only a "victim" of poor planning. His house didn't take on any water and they won't lose a thing but neighbors around them seem totally unsurprised that the roads around them have flooded and trapped them in place for a while. And he didn't think ahead for the foster children he and his wife took in. Today he is saying that they will run out of precious coffee. I just don't get it other than the fact that they have only lived in TX for a few years and have never been through a hurricane. *Edited to add that I know no one could have predicted how bad the situation is. My relative is very lucky that he's not dealing with water in his home and I guess it just as easily could have happened to him and then the bigger issue would have been escaping and not that he didn't go to the store for more than he did! I was only asking why so many seem to be caught off guard about needing basic, bare minimum preparations so that they CAN shelter in place since that seems to be the typical thing one must do. Once the situation changes from that it's a different story, of course. Please don't take this as a criticism or a way to say that the lack of preparation was ok. It is only a comment regarding coffee, nothing else. When we had no power for 12 days after a major hurricane, the stores were empty, gas was rationed, the one thing we truly missed and would have paid a lot of money for if we could get it was non-dairy coffee creamer. We were prepared in every way but that. We had shelf-stable food, water, things to do for the kids, generator, batteries, lanterns, etc., etc. The one thing we truly felt was needed was coffee. We did have the instant stuff, but without non-refrigerated creamer it was difficult to drink. Perhaps the relative is stressed out and is reaching out for something for comfort. I know that is how it was for me. We now have the powdered creamer, by the way, as an addition to our emergency prep list. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goldberry Posted August 29, 2017 Share Posted August 29, 2017 The one thing we truly felt was needed was coffee. We did have the instant stuff, but without non-refrigerated creamer it was difficult to drink. Perhaps the relative is stressed out and is reaching out for something for comfort. I know that is how it was for me. We now have the powdered creamer, by the way, as an addition to our emergency prep list. I'm right there with you! I *need* my creamer! :thumbup1: 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hilltopmom Posted August 29, 2017 Share Posted August 29, 2017 I work in pharmacy. I quite often remind people to keep 1-2 week supply of medicine at home, and for people who are diabetic and need insulin, I suggest a month's supply at minimum. The vast majority of insurance companies allow refills 5 days early. If a patient does that a few months in a row, it is easy to get a stock pile started. It takes barely a minute of planning to make sure the pills stay rotated to keep the supply fresh. The one that is hardest for people to build up a bit, is narcotic pain meds. But even if they can't get a little supply of those on hand, at least keep Motrin/Tylenol or alternatives. A little something may be better than nothing. I know that OTC meds won't necessarily touch severe pain, but it can help take the edge off for many people. I personally keep a one month supply of all the important medicines at home. Not only for natural disasters, but for insurance complications and supply issues. Recently, dd18 started home infusion therapy. I told the supplier I wanted to build up at least a week's supply at home and they balked at me. They insisted that if there was a problem and she needed more, they would courrier them to her. My point to them, was that if there was a disaster, they wouldn't be able to courier them to us. :banghead: I am slowly getting a supply going, but it will take me awhile to get it built up to a level I am comfortable with. I keep anywhere from a week to a month of food on hand and several gallons of water per person (we always have other drinks too). We have medical kits and ways to keep warm. Basic survival needs for about a week. We don't live in common hurricane/tornado area, but we do get some bad weather that can shut the city down. Yep, this. When my medically fragile child was still alive, we learned to refill meds on the earliest day possible every time. Over several months you can build up a stash that way. Same with medical supplies. But you have to stay on top of it. It's not just natural disasters that can slow or stop pharmacy refills. You never know. Even just issues with your insurance can lead to a refill getting delayed. We also bought many items out of pocket for awhile to build up supplies that insurance would not cover extras of. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sk8ermaiden Posted August 29, 2017 Share Posted August 29, 2017 Implying that the majority did not (which is what some people on social media are trying to imply) is honestly insulting. Maybe they are basing that assessment on a few that didn't. It certainly has not been my experience with Harvey. The store shelves here are still nearly empty (supplies got cut off for a bit). They were nearly stripped clean very quickly after it became clear Harvey could become dangerous. DH got extra meds for me even though insurance wouldn't cover it, just in case. We spent several days preparing, just in case, and so did my mother and neighbors and DH's coworkers. My relatives in Houston very definitely tried to prepare. Even my brother in San Antonio was preparing, just in case. Most of what I'm seeing blaming Houstonions for not preparing comes from not understanding Texas geography. These people honestly think a hurricane was barreling for us and we just did nothing but buy bread. They do not understand that Corpus Christi is 100 miles away and that the coast is an hour away. I have had people quoting the "write your SS# on your arm" thing to friends and they literally do not realize that was for Corpus, you know, the area that took a direct hit from the hurricane. Our sheer size here, both as a city and state, is outside of some people's experience. I was also thinking today about our poor city gov't and first responders. They are responding in Katy, Dickenson, Cypresss, Greenspoint, Kingwood, and Houston. In any other place (except Cali and New York), those would be 6 different cities, managing their own crises. They must all be so tired. I feel like once we have move from rescue to recovery, everyone involved deserves an enormous party. 14 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bootsie Posted August 29, 2017 Share Posted August 29, 2017 Yep, this. When my medically fragile child was still alive, we learned to refill meds on the earliest day possible every time. Over several months you can build up a stash that way. Same with medical supplies. But you have to stay on top of it. It's not just natural disasters that can slow or stop pharmacy refills. You never know. Even just issues with your insurance can lead to a refill getting delayed. We also bought many items out of pocket for awhile to build up supplies that insurance would not cover extras of. I have worked hard with some family members to be on top of refills, given that they live in a hurricane prone area. But, this has been much easier said than done. It is difficult when it is a new medication. I had one family member with a medication recently prescribed and no time to build up a stock pile. I had one family member who had been on vacation and not able to pick up medication five days early to create a stockpile last month. I have a family member who can refill medication as soon as allowed but can only get so many refills per year. A new prescription requires a visit to the physician at the one year mark. Yes, other things can slow down or stop pharmacy refills, and IME those aren't rare events. I have seen a number of people who end up getting hit by two of these events--last month it was a problem with the insurance company, causing them to dig into their stock pile, this month it is a hurricane. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shawthorne44 Posted August 29, 2017 Share Posted August 29, 2017 I think it is typical. Common Sense isn't very common. I'm not throwing stones, since I live in a glass house that I've been meaning to do something about. Co-worker was discussing her family last week in Houston. I said, "So, they are staying with you?" We are in the Dallas area. The answer was, "No, of course not". I rolled my eyes so hard I hurt myself. Monday morning the water was up to but not in there house. I haven't heard since. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liz CA Posted August 29, 2017 Share Posted August 29, 2017 A generator takes annual maintenance. Since our kids know how to camp and we don't have a freezer full of beef, we didn't do what all our neighbors did and put one in. Instead, they invite us over after dh does the maintenance and set up on the spot when theirs won't start.they don't know how to siphon or store fuel either. Some figure they will only need it once, and they don't set it up unles the storm really happens...they will return it if it doesn't. I have never seen a generator under 1500 here...must be a special order. I think it depends how much wattage you need to power something. Ours is about 5000 Watts IIRC and could power some basic appliances. This one was around $500 - $600. You can get smaller ones that provide 2000-3000 watt. In case of powering a medical device, I'd check how much wattage is needed. A generator is a wonderful thing when you have no power. After one thing is powered up, you can plug the next thing in. :) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justasque Posted August 29, 2017 Share Posted August 29, 2017 A generator would be extremely pricey. I want to say that my parents spent something like $2k on theirs. Our out-of-pocket medical costs are too high to be sinking that kind of cash into emergency preparedness. A solar charger I would have to look into whether it would generate enough juice to recharge her battery. We have an inverter. It is basically a plug strip that hooks up to a vehicle. You run the vehicle, which generates power through the inverter, and then you can plug things into the plug strip. Ours has a long cord, so we can run it into the house to plug in the fridge and whatever devices need to be charged. It cost around $150. We just need to make sure our van is full of gas before a storm. ... As far as prep, I mentioned to a friend one year that I was glad I was in good enough shape to lug water bottles up the dorm stairs, since the U asked students to preoare for three days with no power. They laughed at me. Didn't happen that year,but it did the next and again 18 months later. Guess which kid hosted his friends who had no food in the room and not even a flashlight or enough blankets/winter coat to sleep thru a cold night? At least they had the sense to come over before the roads closed. No winter boots either...they are accustomed to dashing in sneakers and hoodies. Never occurred to them that food service is shut down if the employees can't get in when roads are closed, and never realized the dorm doesn't have back up generators to provide power. Lots of people now who didn't grow up without electric or running water. My dd's college put an emergency bag on their move-in list, with details about what it should contain. When the area was facing an emergency and the students had to shelter in place, I told dd to make sure her bag was in order in case of evacuation, and to tell her friends to do the same. She told me that she was the only one on the floor who had an emergency bag, even though the school had asked everyone to have one. They ask for the following items to be in the bag - a flashlight medication important documents and Identification cash, in small denominations feminine supplies/personal hygiene items glasses/contact lens items weather appropriate clothing We added some granola bars, a map of the area, a sheet and fleece blanket, a few basic toiletries, and a water bottle. Not the perfect list, but it would allow the student to stay overnight somewhere in relative comfort and self-sufficiency if needed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sk8ermaiden Posted August 29, 2017 Share Posted August 29, 2017 I realized my mistake after I wrote that, that it is in fact the second line of defense. I don't think the most important evac routes - 45 and 59 have been totally impassible before except maybe 45 during Ike? I'm not sure, since we have always stayed put. Of course this flood is changing everything. I believe a good number of them are designed to flood, yes, per my friends/husband in city engineering. Some of course are just in low lying areas. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seasider Posted August 29, 2017 Share Posted August 29, 2017 I am assuming that the comment about the coffee is being posted on Facebook or some other social media? I would take this comment as something being made by someone who is bored and anxious, given everything else going on around him. The problem in Houston now is that many people did plan and do what they needed to do to shelter in place, which is the prudent thing to do given what was predicted. >>>>>>>>>It doesn't matter how many gallons of water, nonperishable food, flashlights, batteries, etc. someone has if they are on the top of their roof in torrential rain. <<<<<<<<<< People in Houston are used to rain; they are used to having to remain in place while there is water in the roads. Stay put, don't travel is the best advice in that situation. Unfortunately, those who heeded that advice found that they could not leave once there plans for sheltering in place were not workable. On Saturday, it could have easily been San Antonio or the DFW area that received torrential rain and tornadic activity. Leaving Houston for one of those areas would not have been a reasonable option. Now the people in southwest Louisiana have a mess. They can't travel west if they need to evacuate. Heading east isn't reasonable. There are only so many options for traveling north and that is not necessarily getting out of the path of the storm. Yes, and yes to the inability to evacuate. Ny heart is especially heavy for those who permanently relocated to Houston after Katrina and now find themselves reliving a nightmare. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tap Posted August 29, 2017 Share Posted August 29, 2017 I have worked hard with some family members to be on top of refills, given that they live in a hurricane prone area. But, this has been much easier said than done. It is difficult when it is a new medication. I had one family member with a medication recently prescribed and no time to build up a stock pile. I had one family member who had been on vacation and not able to pick up medication five days early to create a stockpile last month. I have a family member who can refill medication as soon as allowed but can only get so many refills per year. A new prescription requires a visit to the physician at the one year mark. Yes, other things can slow down or stop pharmacy refills, and IME those aren't rare events. I have seen a number of people who end up getting hit by two of these events--last month it was a problem with the insurance company, causing them to dig into their stock pile, this month it is a hurricane. Not picking on your post, just addressing a few points you bring up, and trying to explain how to get around these issues incase anyone is interested. One thing people forget sometimes is communication with medical providers. Yep, maybe the doctor wants to see a person once a year and the doctor only gives enough to last a year (this is uncommon BTW).....but if the patient calls or emails the doctor and asks for 1 additional fill, specifically so they can keep a week ahead for their emergency kit, it would be an extremely rare case that the doctor wouldn't authorize it. Unless the doctor has a very, very legitimate reason (misuse etc) or it is a narcotic, I have Never had a doctor say no, to one additional refill in a a year. It just takes teh patient calling and letting the doctor know what is going on. Do not use the term stock pile because while that is exactly what it is, the term has negative connotations. Use emergency preparedness or emergency kit instead. Pharmacies hold medications, once filled for about 7-10 days. So, if it was filled on August 10, you have until August 17 to pick it up. Then you can fill it 5 days early next month, on September 5. Even though it wasn't picked up until the 17, the med fill date will still be August 10 (the day the pills are put in the bottle). So, while this person may have used a bit of their backstock on vacation, the extra pills go right back into to their emergency kit next month, plus the extra 5 pills from the current fill. Most people can pick up a refill within 7 days, so there is no reason that a vacation should cause too much trouble (except for rare circumstances) for building an emergency supply. If nothing else, have a friend or family member pick it up. And yes, like you said sometimes there are a few problems in a row. That is why it is nice to have them on hand. Not everyone will be able to build up and keep a supply, but the vast majority of people don't even think about it, or have no idea how to begin. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fairfarmhand Posted August 29, 2017 Share Posted August 29, 2017 I'm also thinking of the people who work in utility services. They're exhausted. My dh worked for 3 days straight with no sleep during the Nashville flood. (he's in the water department) They kept their water plants operational, but it took tons of work. But, better than letting water in and having to rebuild. Some of these same people are facing their own homes being flooded plus the demands/needs of their jobs. They're needed to repair/protect things like power plants and water/wastewater plants, but they're also needed at home. Ugh. These poor folks. 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneStepAtATime Posted August 29, 2017 Share Posted August 29, 2017 Most of what I'm seeing blaming Houstonions for not preparing comes from not understanding Texas geography. These people honestly think a hurricane was barreling for us and we just did nothing but buy bread. They do not understand that Corpus Christi is 100 miles away and that the coast is an hour away. I have had people quoting the "write your SS# on your arm" thing to friends and they literally do not realize that was for Corpus, you know, the area that took a direct hit from the hurricane. Our sheer size here, both as a city and state, is outside of some people's experience. I was also thinking today about our poor city gov't and first responders. They are responding in Katy, Dickenson, Cypresss, Greenspoint, Kingwood, and Houston. In any other place (except Cali and New York), those would be 6 different cities, managing their own crises. They must all be so tired. I feel like once we have move from rescue to recovery, everyone involved deserves an enormous party. :iagree: Exactly. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lanny Posted August 29, 2017 Share Posted August 29, 2017 That's quite rude. It's very unfortunate, but not "stupid" of those who may not have flood insurance. So many of these flooded areas are in low income( next to all the dangerous refineries, thanks to Houston being a NO ZONE city). There are places where flood insurance costs more than a mortgage, where the resale value of these low income homes are not worth the cost. Often landlords will get insurance $, do the bare minimum, and re-rent these homes knowing they will flood again. Houston floods so damn easily. Look at their highway underpasses. It cost money to elevate them, they actually are dug out below ground level, of course they flood with nearly every heavy, normal rain. Years ago there was talk in Harris County Flood Control about making the entrances to the underpasses very high, then slope down and become tunnel like, with pumps to flush out any water. DH left the department and we never found out why this was shelved, most likely money. Large neighborhood-land developers fight tooth and nail to not have their land considered flood plane, whenever flood maps are being redrawn. West of Houston, going from Waller towards Katy and Brookshire, used to be rice fields. Rice. They were perfect lowland areas that flooded easily. Now there are tons of neighborhoods, and of course they flood. It was also fairly common for land developers to aquire property that was designated wetland, spend a year or 2 draining it, then reapply for their building permits, claiming it was incorrectly labelled as such. Higher-ups in the engineering permit departments turned a blind eye to it. I lived in Houston or nearby for 50 years. As someone said,you can't really prep for 50 inches of rain. Houston freeways can barely handle their residents getting home after a day's work, getting several million people evacuated is something I can't comprehend. But its time we all accept that this is sadly going to be the new normal. What are we going to do about it? Stupid wasn't directed at those without flood insurance. It was directed at her relative for what he did or didn't do. Obviously flood insurance costs money. That's another issue. She asked about what her relative did or didn't do. Sent from my SM-G355M using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wheres Toto Posted August 29, 2017 Share Posted August 29, 2017 We get hurricanes but not flooding where we are. We almost got a generator after Hurricane Sandy. We lost power for 10 days with Sandy, and 6 days with Irene the year before. Mainly due to downed trees coming across wires. After Sandy, our whole neighborhood was rewired, and trees were removed. We haven't really lost power since and we used to ever time it rained heavy. Both storms we were able to get out and go to my mother's house or my in-laws house for the duration. The power outage was very localized. Our main problem is we have a well and the well pump doesn't work without power. If we know a storm is coming, we stock up on water and essentials but that doesn't help us with plumbing. We also only have one way out of our neighborhood and with Irene we were actually out and couldn't get back home for a couple of days. We do have a fireplace, plenty (an excessive amount) of blankets, and a large 4WD vehicle that means in a true emergency we could drive over the golf course at the end of our street to get to/from home. There probably is more we could/should do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bootsie Posted August 29, 2017 Share Posted August 29, 2017 Pharmacies hold medications, once filled for about 7-10 days. So, if it was filled on August 10, you have until August 17 to pick it up. Then you can fill it 5 days early next month, on September 5. Even though it wasn't picked up until the 17, the med fill date will still be August 10 (the day the pills are put in the bottle). So, while this person may have used a bit of their backstock on vacation, the extra pills go right back into to their emergency kit next month, plus the extra 5 pills from the current fill. Most people can pick up a refill within 7 days, so there is no reason that a vacation should cause too much trouble (except for rare circumstances) for building an emergency supply. If nothing else, have a friend or family member pick it up. Maybe it is a difference in how pharmacies work, but this is NOT the case at my local pharmacies. The payment (and thus insurance) is not process until you pick up the medication. So, calling to refill a medication is not the date from which a refill schedule is counted; it is when it is actually picked up. If you are handling medications for an elderly person who does not drive and depends on someone to pick up the medications or if someone is out of town, it makes staying ahead very difficult. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katy Posted August 29, 2017 Share Posted August 29, 2017 I know it's common to not prepare. I just wanted to throw in that those with jobs in law enforcement or disaster relief IME (at least in Florida) tend to go to the opposite extreme - masonry houses, canoes or other boats stored at home, two-four weeks worth of supplies on hand (minimum, mostly canned and ready to eat food that doesn't require fluid or cooking to eat), pantry and vehicles checked every time there's a new tropical depression forming. IME teachers frequently do this too, possibly because schools are closed and turned into shelters every time there's a threat, so they may be warned more regularly of possibilities. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TeenagerMom Posted August 29, 2017 Share Posted August 29, 2017 Not picking on your post, just addressing a few points you bring up, and trying to explain how to get around these issues incase anyone is interested. One thing people forget sometimes is communication with medical providers. Yep, maybe the doctor wants to see a person once a year and the doctor only gives enough to last a year (this is uncommon BTW).....but if the patient calls or emails the doctor and asks for 1 additional fill, specifically so they can keep a week ahead for their emergency kit, it would be an extremely rare case that the doctor wouldn't authorize it. Unless the doctor has a very, very legitimate reason (misuse etc) or it is a narcotic, I have Never had a doctor say no, to one additional refill in a a year. It just takes teh patient calling and letting the doctor know what is going on. Do not use the term stock pile because while that is exactly what it is, the term has negative connotations. Use emergency preparedness or emergency kit instead. Pharmacies hold medications, once filled for about 7-10 days. So, if it was filled on August 10, you have until August 17 to pick it up. Then you can fill it 5 days early next month, on September 5. Even though it wasn't picked up until the 17, the med fill date will still be August 10 (the day the pills are put in the bottle). So, while this person may have used a bit of their backstock on vacation, the extra pills go right back into to their emergency kit next month, plus the extra 5 pills from the current fill. Most people can pick up a refill within 7 days, so there is no reason that a vacation should cause too much trouble (except for rare circumstances) for building an emergency supply. If nothing else, have a friend or family member pick it up. And yes, like you said sometimes there are a few problems in a row. That is why it is nice to have them on hand. Not everyone will be able to build up and keep a supply, but the vast majority of people don't even think about it, or have no idea how to begin. Our insurance won't pay for a prescription ONE day before the 30 day refill due date, even my son's asthma inhalers. It must be 30 days exactly in order to get a refill. Antibiotics that are prescribed a 2 week regimen can only be refilled on the 15th day, etc. So no, it's really NOT that easy to get a surplus of medication. Just because a doctor will prescribe it, doesn't mean people can actually pay for it. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ErinE Posted August 29, 2017 Share Posted August 29, 2017 The freeway underpasses and freeways are designed to flood. They are our first line of defense against flooded buildings and houses. That's something people out of town don't understand either. EVERY flood we have, news/the weather channel show the buffalo bayou, which becomes an ENORMOUS lake just north of downtown. It is the quintessential Houston flood picture. That ENTIRE area is supposed to flood. It is city park and streets, and every structure, garbage can, sculpture, and bench is designed to be underwater. Now, this time it is spreading into surrounding buildings. Which obviously is not supposed to happen, but I don't recall it happening before, despite being trotted out as the OMG so flooded picture. In a city so flat that the water has nowhere to go, the roads take the brunt for us. I just heard our mayor mentioning that the Weather Channel had to ADD A NEW COLOR for rainfall for us. If you think your city would know what to do with this rain, before it happened, you're wrong. Many Houston soccer and football fields are retention ponds and being in Texas, they have a lot of them. In my school district, the high schools were built with massive retention ponds. All the beautiful green spaces along the bayous are intended to take on water. Man-made or reinforced bayous are everywhere. I grew up near Bear Creek Park in the Addicks reservoir. It's usually a gorgeous park until it rains and fills up. If you look at a map of Houston and see all the green parks - many are built to hold flood water. Houston is sub-tropical and gets a lot of rain - almost 50 inches a year. The city just had that amount fall of it in three days plus a storm surge that prevented the water from draining to the Gulf. Pumps fail - remember Hurricane Katrina? During Tropical Storm Allison, some Medical Center hospitals had pumps (and generators) in their basements. Those failed as the precipitation was too much for the pumps to keep up. After Allison, generators were moved out of the basement and while the pumps remain, critical supplies and resources were moved out of the basements. I grew up in Houston. Many people prep. That's why the grocery shelves are bare-bread, water, milk, and batteries gone. Every year I lived in Houston the shelves would empty whenever a hurricane threatened. But when the water is reaching the second story of a home that isn't even on the 500 year flood plain, there isn't much that can prepare you for it. And talking about disaster prep, DH was caught in the NYC blackout of 2003. He walked up five flights of stairs to his apartment in the pitch black. There were no emergency lights in the hallways and the building had just opened as apartments, having undergone a complete renovation. He filled up all the sinks and bathtubs with water and pressed his roommate to gather up cash and buy supplies. His roommate resisted. Why do we need water? Why do we need to buy more food? They'll have the power back on soon. My husband just shook his head. The city was within two years of 9/11 and some people who lived through it still weren't willing to do basic emergency prep. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zinnia Posted August 29, 2017 Share Posted August 29, 2017 We had an ice storm that shut down Atlanta in 2011. There were a lot of people that did not have 3-4 days of food in the house. I was honestly surprised. My family of origin is hard core preppers, and they make fun of me for my slacker ways. I probably have food for 3-4 weeks in the house, water for 72 hours. Before that storm, I really did think that was standard for non-prepper "regular" people. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tap Posted August 29, 2017 Share Posted August 29, 2017 Our insurance won't pay for a prescription ONE day before the 30 day refill due date, even my son's asthma inhalers. It must be 30 days exactly in order to get a refill. Antibiotics that are prescribed a 2 week regimen can only be refilled on the 15th day, etc. So no, it's really NOT that easy to get a surplus of medication. Just because a doctor will prescribe it, doesn't mean people can actually pay for it. Yep, that is why I said "The vast majority of insurance companies allow refills 5 days early" in my first post and "most people" in the second. Your insurance only allowing fills at the 30 day mark is Extremely Rare. I have 20 years experience in very high volume stores. My specialty in the pharmacy, is dealing with complications that people run into and working with the insurance companies. This is what I do for a living 40 plus hours a week, (and have done it in 2 states). I know it is hard for some people, but I can tell you, that it is a rare exception that insurance only pays on the 30 day mark. Those plans do exist.....and others on this board may have the same plan, but this doesn't apply to the vast majority of people. As for inhalers, quite often doctors have samples of inhalers because they are almost all brand name (not always, just often). So it may be worth a call to your doctor so see if they have a sample you can get to put away for emergency. My current pharmacy fills 6000 scripts a month. We have 1 patient with a plan that pays on the 30 day mark. In his case it is a catastrophic plan that he pays for himself. He chose the plan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vonfirmath Posted August 29, 2017 Share Posted August 29, 2017 Of course not all highways and underpasses are meant to control flooding. I do not even think Houston's freeways were built on this premise as a defense. It just came to be. The first line of defense is their bayou system, drainage ditches, and retaining ponds. So it's a given that all roads along Buffalo Bayou will flood. But it's also a given that Houston is built around its freeway system. Millions rely on the freeways daily. So doesn't it seem sort of stupid to have your "first line of defense" , or even second,as you say, to also be needed as an evacuation route for several million people? ...I grew up in Northwest Park -- NW of Houston, just outside City Limits (at the time). My parents bought our house as it was being built and even got to decide on some of the details. Yes, the neighborhood streets were designed to flood. I remember even at the time, the streets would fill up and my dad was not concerned. He told me that they were designed to do that. They would drain through the storm sewers to the drainage ditch on the edge of the neighborhood, and then subside into the ground over time. When the rain came down too fast, the roads held the water until the storm system was ready to handle it. I also remember getting off school one day due to the flooding in the streets. The same way some places get Snow Days. We got a Rain Day. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forty-two Posted August 29, 2017 Share Posted August 29, 2017 Not picking on you two specifically, but to me this attitude is part of the problem. Weather is not an exact science. The weather people are doing their job when they warn that a storm or hurricane *might* get really bad. Do people (general people) really think that it's possible to forecast which ones will fizzle out and which ones won't? And then when the one *doesn't* fizzle out, they could be responsible for the deaths of thousands if they didn't warn anyone? If a warning doesn't develop into something dangerous, people should count themselves lucky and not accuse the weather people of "crying wolf". There are ways and ways of warning people about potential worst-case scenarios, though. It's one thing to present possible-but-not-currently-likely scenarios as things that *might* happen - and to do so alongside the more likely and less dire predictions, where you give more time to the more likely predictions. And it's another entirely to spend 90% of the time talking about the worst-case scenario regardless of how likely it is. It's the latter that is what my family and friends in Houston mean by hyping storms. And ime the major hype doesn't come from local weather forecasters, but from the regular news and the national news (esp the latter). Certainly with Harvey, when it was a tropical depression, the national media was already trotting out stories about how bad it would be if Houston were hit by the big one - when there was no particular reason to think that Harvey would qualify. And then when it strengthened rapidly and Corpus was facing a major hurricane, but before the dire rainfall predictions, the media continued to hype how bad it would be if the big one hit *Houston* - when, again, the major hurricane *wasn't hitting Houston*. (I read a recycled-from-2016 piece in the Atlantic, about Houston's ability or lack thereof to survive the big one, that inserted a few sentences about Corpus but mostly utterly ignored the fact that Harvey wasn't making landfall in Houston.) Yeah, then the dire rainfall predictions came in, and then there were legit reasons to wonder what all that rain would do to Houston - nothing good, certainly. But by that point the non-weather-forecasting media, especially the national media, had already been hyping various worst-case scenarios re: Houston and Harvey that had little basis in anything that was actually happening. And even their coverage of what those dire rainfall totals *might* mean for Houston were filled with inaccuracies. (National ABC didn't know what a bayou was, said Houston had "drainage channels, known as bayous". Yeah, the bayous do function as drainage channels, but unlike drainage ditches and such, bayous are *actual bodies of water*.) It wasn't until the record rainfall overnight Saturday-Sunday that Harvey did anything dire to Houston - on Saturday night, my mom was starting to wonder if Harvey was another not-as-bad-as-feared storm. (And there are a *lot* of those kind of storms, that only locals know about, because *nothing happened* to make it national news.). But the most dire rainfall predictions had been treated as *guaranteed fact* by the non-weather-media for probably 36 hours before they actually happened. *That's* what people mean by hype - the media jumping on worst-case scenarios *regardless* of their likelihood. And it really does lead to hype-fatigue, because *every* storm is talked about like it's the big one, whether there's any *actual* weather-related reason to think so or not. It's *exactly* like the boy who cried wolf. Yeah, Harvey turned out to be that bad, but the media hypes the worst-case possibilities of *any* storm, whether it deserves it or not. There's a popular Houston weather site (Space City Weather), whose tag line is "hype-free predictions". (The very existence of that tag line suggests that people at least *think* hype is extremely common.) I've been reading them, and they have absolutely not minced words about the direness of the facts on the ground. But they also spend more time talking about what *is* happening and what is *likely* to happen, and they make it clear which worst-case things are real possibilities versus possible-but-highly-unlikely. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 29, 2017 Share Posted August 29, 2017 I know it's common to not prepare. I just wanted to throw in that those with jobs in law enforcement or disaster relief IME (at least in Florida) tend to go to the opposite extreme - masonry houses, canoes or other boats stored at home, two-four weeks worth of supplies on hand (minimum, mostly canned and ready to eat food that doesn't require fluid or cooking to eat), pantry and vehicles checked every time there's a new tropical depression forming. IME teachers frequently do this too, possibly because schools are closed and turned into shelters every time there's a threat, so they may be warned more regularly of possibilities. It wasn't an issue in Alaska for us but here tornados and flooding are a little more likely. You bet your bottom dollar I'm considering an inflatable boat to store with my other emergency cache of supplies. Just can't hurt. We are more on the prepper side and I don't love that my home is in a lower area right now either. The property we are buying is on one of the few hills in the area and I am honestly relieved :o You can't prepare for everything, but we sure try! If five feet of water fell and we were in our rental we'd be skunked without evacuating, but we could shelter in place if we were in whatever we built. That isn't the case with places like New Orleans or Houston where it's just not high enough for most people to manage that with this much water. It's nobody's fault when we are talking massive flooding. This is different than the normal hurricane event on the coast and only idiots are suggesting otherwise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sk8ermaiden Posted August 29, 2017 Share Posted August 29, 2017 (edited) “As bad as the April, the Tax Day flood, was this year, if you look at the number of people affected in Harris County, it's less than 1 percent of the population. Is the other 99 percent willing to pay for a much more robust system?†he said. That's from the head of Flood Control about the recent Tax Day flood. I wonder if he could say the same statement today, about Harvey. So it's not really climate change affecting things, Houston's problem is the agenda of conservationists, the anti-development, as he calls them. Thank you, Mr Talbott. This asinine, backwards thinking is what led my husband to take early retirement from Harris County, he was sick and tired of dealing with corrupt morons like you. I thank my lucky stars we were able to get the heck out of Texas when we did. In 2.5 years: FIFTY INCHES OF RAIN over the weekend. Million year rain event Tax day was 16+ inches in 12 hours - 800 year rain event Memorial Day flood - 200+ year rain event I'm going to put my money on the idea that climate change has something to do with it. I do hope though that this will spurn the city into more improvements. Because I suspect the thousand year rain event is the new hundred year rain event. Edited August 29, 2017 by Sk8ermaiden 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valley Girl Posted August 29, 2017 Share Posted August 29, 2017 Our insurance won't pay for a prescription ONE day before the 30 day refill due date, even my son's asthma inhalers. It must be 30 days exactly in order to get a refill. Antibiotics that are prescribed a 2 week regimen can only be refilled on the 15th day, etc. So no, it's really NOT that easy to get a surplus of medication. Just because a doctor will prescribe it, doesn't mean people can actually pay for it. I don't think Tap was attempting to solve every problem with trying to keep extra medicine on hand. But her suggestions may work for the majority of people. (I'm taking notes.) If so, that's a few more people who may be able to be proactive in having meds for emergencies. I've run into what you've described myself. It's incredibly frustrating. In our situation, I don't know why but I suspect pharmacy policy was at play. Pharmacy A wouldn't refill a certain med until 30 days were up. Pharmacy B--a different chain--let me fill it next month two days in advance without a problem. I'm not suggesting your insurance company isn't the culprit in your situation. Just sharing mine own weird experience with trying to get meds filled. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheReader Posted August 29, 2017 Share Posted August 29, 2017 Yes, 45 floods often. I'm not familiar with 59, but I know 59 south often floods down near El Campo. 290 floods where it joins with 6 towards College Station, and I know that's an evacuation route. I heard a couple exits off of 290 into Brenham flooded, and that's a brand new highway. You'd think they would have somehow been more interested in that, given the growing threat of super storms. Most of the time, the flooding on 45, 59, 290, Hwy 6, etc, are on the access roads/feeder roads, NOT the mainlane of the highways, and not to an impassible level. I've lived here (on various sides of the city) my entire 40+ years (minus 6 yrs in Brazil), and have been through all of the storms except Ike (we lived in Brazil during that one) and have never in my life seen 45 -- the main lanes of the highway overpass -- impassible like they were this time. In 2.5 years: FIFTY INCHES OF RAIN over the weekend. Million year rain event Tax day was 16+ inches in 12 hours - 800 year rain event Memorial Day flood - 200+ year rain event I'm going to put my money on the idea that climate change has something to do with it. I do hope though that this will spurn the city into more improvements. Because I suspect the thousand year rain event is the new hundred year rain event. I have wanted to shout "ditto" or "amen" to everything you've said in this thread, except this one :) Minor corrections: This event is the 800 yr event, last year's Tax Day flood was a 500 yr event, and the Memorial Day flood was a 100 yr event. Which is still freaking insane....I mean, 3 separate "100 yr events" in the last 3 years???? Definitely *something* is going on with the climate, for sure. For sure. But also, I think the growth and addition of so much concrete, which the water can't drain through, changing the flood plains. Not that this is the only factor....I definitely agree climate change is going on, or something, too. Because really, this is just nuts, to have THREE such events in three years. But I do agree with you, and to every single other thing you've said -- YES. EXACTLY THAT. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Word Nerd Posted August 29, 2017 Share Posted August 29, 2017 (edited) Not picking on you two specifically, but to me this attitude is part of the problem. Weather is not an exact science. The weather people are doing their job when they warn that a storm or hurricane *might* get really bad. Do people (general people) really think that it's possible to forecast which ones will fizzle out and which ones won't? And then when the one *doesn't* fizzle out, they could be responsible for the deaths of thousands if they didn't warn anyone? If a warning doesn't develop into something dangerous, people should count themselves lucky and not accuse the weather people of "crying wolf". (Side note: MIL stated before the hurricane that weathermen are always over-hyping now just to advance their global warming agenda. :glare: Yeah, let's just ignore them instead...) I think you're reading way too much into the word "hype" and wrongly making assumptions about my attitude about weather forecasting. I didn't say *I* think forecasts are overhyped and shouldn't be taken seriously, which the part of my post that you ignored should have made clear. Edited August 30, 2017 by Word Nerd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HS Mom in NC Posted August 30, 2017 Share Posted August 30, 2017 We have to be careful not to lump everyone together. People at ground zero/the epicenter/ in the path of the hurricane or tornado/blizzard aren't going to be able to plan their way out of it. There was no way to get all 7 million people out of Houston and off the roads by the time it hit. If the water is forcing you onto your roof, you're just stuck in a sh!t happens situation brought to you by nature. You're absolutely going to need emergency services. But imagine ripples on the pond radiating out from the epicenter and that's where a culture of preparedness pays off. When people on the periphery of ground zero aren't reasonably prepared, then they drain already overwhelmed emergency services of precious limited resources. And since predicting the future is really hard, having it on hand at all times makes sense.If we as a culture normalized and practiced having a supply of say...a week's worth of non-perishable food, water, medicine/first said supplies, a few battery operated lights, camp stoves and propane tanks, blankets, and maybe some gasoline in the appropriate containers on hand when services (electricity, water, grocery/gas supplies) are interrupted we could hunker down and keep ourselves going while emergency services helps those who couldn't avoid the worst of it and the poor. It can take a while to stock up some supplies, but if people who could financially manage it did, it could help keep more people calm, it could reduce the burden of first responders, we could have something on hand for our neighbors, like the elderly couple a few doors down who aren't as able to fend for themselves, and it would reduce price gouging and fighting in stores in the days leading up to the major event. 10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MommyLiberty5013 Posted August 30, 2017 Share Posted August 30, 2017 We have to be careful not to lump everyone together. People at ground zero/the epicenter/ in the path of the hurricane or tornado/blizzard aren't going to be able to plan their way out of it. There was no way to get all 7 million people out of Houston and off the roads by the time it hit. If the water is forcing you onto your roof, you're just stuck in a sh!t happens situation brought to you by nature. You're absolutely going to need emergency services. But imagine ripples on the pond radiating out from the epicenter and that's where a culture of preparedness pays off. When people on the periphery of ground zero aren't reasonably prepared, then they drain already overwhelmed emergency services of precious limited resources. And since predicting the future is really hard, having it on hand at all times makes sense. If we as a culture normalized and practiced having a supply of say...a week's worth of non-perishable food, water, medicine/first said supplies, a few battery operated lights, camp stoves and propane tanks, blankets, and maybe some gasoline in the appropriate containers on hand when services (electricity, water, grocery/gas supplies) are interrupted we could hunker down and keep ourselves going while emergency services helps those who couldn't avoid the worst of it and the poor. It can take a while to stock up some supplies, but if people who could financially manage it did, it could help keep more people calm, it could reduce the burden of first responders, we could have something on hand for our neighbors, like the elderly couple a few doors down who aren't as able to fend for themselves, and it would reduce price gouging and fighting in stores in the days leading up to the major event. Exactly. So well stated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vonfirmath Posted August 30, 2017 Share Posted August 30, 2017 Most of the time, the flooding on 45, 59, 290, Hwy 6, etc, are on the access roads/feeder roads, NOT the mainlane of the highways, and not to an impassible level. I've lived here (on various sides of the city) my entire 40+ years (minus 6 yrs in Brazil), and have been through all of the storms except Ike (we lived in Brazil during that one) and have never in my life seen 45 -- the main lanes of the highway overpass -- impassible like they were this time. I have wanted to shout "ditto" or "amen" to everything you've said in this thread, except this one :) Minor corrections: This event is the 800 yr event, last year's Tax Day flood was a 500 yr event, and the Memorial Day flood was a 100 yr event. Which is still freaking insane....I mean, 3 separate "100 yr events" in the last 3 years???? Definitely *something* is going on with the climate, for sure. For sure. But also, I think the growth and addition of so much concrete, which the water can't drain through, changing the flood plains. Not that this is the only factor....I definitely agree climate change is going on, or something, too. Because really, this is just nuts, to have THREE such events in three years. But I do agree with you, and to every single other thing you've said -- YES. EXACTLY THAT. My dad told me something I had not realized. During the time we lived in Houston (1977-1988 or thereabouts) there were three times (he remembers) that our neighborhood had 35" of rain in 8-12 hours. That was the type of rain the street system handled well. But, as he said. When we were getting that kind of rain 1) it was pretty localized. It was not the whole Greater Houston area+ getting the rain and 2) it was on dry ground, not saturated. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bootsie Posted August 30, 2017 Share Posted August 30, 2017 My dad told me something I had not realized. During the time we lived in Houston (1977-1988 or thereabouts) there were three times (he remembers) that our neighborhood had 35" of rain in 8-12 hours. That was the type of rain the street system handled well. But, as he said. When we were getting that kind of rain 1) it was pretty localized. It was not the whole Greater Houston area+ getting the rain and 2) it was on dry ground, not saturated. Really?? Fri - Sun, both Houston Hobby and City of Houston report under 25 inches for the three days--setting the highest 3 day record for the city. This would mean that a neighborhood got about 1 1/2 times what Houston got over the three day period in only 8-12 hour. The average annual rainfall for Houston is under 50"; so this would be 75% of the average daily rainfall coming down in less than 1/2 of a day. I lived near Houston during that time period and while I remember heavy rains, that amount would be extreme. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retired Posted August 30, 2017 Share Posted August 30, 2017 I live on the gulf coast for years. The hurricanes you learn which ones to say or go depending on how far off shore your are and what side of the hurricane eye your are on. The summer of 05 before Katrina we were told to evacuate for cindy and ?dennis someohting like that. When you live in teh zone you have the list for quick evacuation and then if you stay "shelfter for weeks with out clean water or electiricy" I know for some they just ocund afford to leave for a 3rd time that summer. It's expensive. I had neigburs that couldn't afford hotel room so they just decided to drive and stay in their car a few days. I actaully ended up staying for Katrina and I lived on a bayou which thankfully didnt' flood. They have differnt zones for evacuation. I was in the non manutarory but advised. There were lots of us that stayed. We moved computer and imporatnt stuff upstairs just in case. We had a flat bottom boat. So what I'm saying is you are prepareid. I now live on a lake and we get flooding. I happen to be on a hill so it want be my house but I could be cut off for a while. So I'm ready. I think for people in houston. The parts that flooded probably were in the zone that has never flooded before with previous storms . But the fact this one parked and didnt leave just flooded with people that just never saw it coming. The official were in a tough situation. I've been on an interstate with all lanes going north waiting to evacuate. It hell and then when you have a inner city I'm thinking there are poor folks that don't even drive. So public bus would need to run. But you don't know what gonna a flood or not. Its just a gamble do we spend the money get all the people out or chances it. The city gamble and people gamble. If you are living paycheck to paycheck you have to decide do I take the money and evacuation and it not be a big event or take my chances. Like I said I evacuate twice the summer of Katrina. There were a lot of that had 2 false alarms that summer. THe hurricane were suppose to be a 4 or 5 and actually only a 3. Which a 3 you usually don't leave you just ride it out. Seriously if your got shutter and in a not food zone or on piling its a party kwim Houston chanced it because of the death after rita and all the bad unpreparedness of rita and katrina. I know the rest of the country just wonder how does this happen. I ask that about our barrier island that only wealthy can afford to build on again and again. The storms take it away and fed flood insurance keeps rebuilding for them.(that's our tax dollars) 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carrie12345 Posted August 30, 2017 Share Posted August 30, 2017 If we as a culture normalized and practiced having a supply of say...a week's worth of non-perishable food, water, medicine/first said supplies, a few battery operated lights, camp stoves and propane tanks, blankets, and maybe some gasoline in the appropriate containers on hand when services (electricity, water, grocery/gas supplies) are interrupted we could hunker down and keep ourselves going while emergency services helps those who couldn't avoid the worst of it and the poor. It can take a while to stock up some supplies, but if people who could financially manage it did, it could help keep more people calm, it could reduce the burden of first responders, we could have something on hand for our neighbors, like the elderly couple a few doors down who aren't as able to fend for themselves, and it would reduce price gouging and fighting in stores in the days leading up to the major event. YES. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heartlikealion Posted August 30, 2017 Share Posted August 30, 2017 Yes and no. A lot of people seem to go to the stores at the same time looking for items like bread and water, but it's not like everyone has a deep freeze to keep extra bread or that everyone wants to keep a stockpile of water jugs in their home year round. Bread goes bad easily in Mississippi, at least in some homes I have lived in. And not everyone likes to store it in the fridge. We try to keep some batteries on hand year round, but other people flock to the stores to buy batteries at once. Now if you have say, a 3 day window to buy supplies before you need to stay indoors or evacuate, you may go on day 1 but find that people are already picking over the aisles because everyone in town is aware that they need stuff. Then again, it may not be bad on day 1. We always joke about hurricane parties, so yes, even if you don't think there will be a disaster at your home, you stock up because you're planning on staying home and probably hanging out with others that aren't going to work. When I lived through most of the hurricanes I lived through I was younger. Mom and Dad did the shopping and such. Dh and I have both worked at retail places that sold batteries so we keep in mind places to shop for them that aren't as overrun. My parents, grandmother, and I evacuated for Hurricane Katrina. No one expected it to be as bad as it was. It affected homes that Camille did not. For that storm we drove to FL and were blessed that this hotel had one room for us. All the hotels were full basically. Anyway, when we drove back to our home it was destroyed. Then we were homeless and my dad met a man at some place that was serving meals. The man invited our family to stay with him. Ironically we slept in a trailer park while our brick house was missing an exterior wall and interior walls and had about a foot of water damage among other damage. Our house was located closer to the water. He took it upon himself to drive to Alabama? and bring back a cooler of food for us to share. It was so nice. It was hard to get gas. The gas stations were overrun or out of gas completely. I don't know if any of the local stores had reopened yet but if they had people probably couldn't get to work or the shelves were bare. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HS Mom in NC Posted August 30, 2017 Share Posted August 30, 2017 Yes and no. A lot of people seem to go to the stores at the same time looking for items like bread and water, but it's not like everyone has a deep freeze to keep extra bread No one is suggesting a stockpile of something perishable like bread. We're talking about shelf stable foods: canned goods, dried fruits, protein bars, powdered milk, etc. or that everyone wants to keep a stockpile of water jugs in their home year round. Bread goes bad easily in Mississippi, at least in some homes I have lived in. And not everyone likes to store it in the fridge. Keeping a week's supply of drinking water (cases of bottled water) isn't a huge burden if you put some in closets, under beds, in the pantry, in the garage, under cabinets, etc. We try to keep some batteries on hand year round, but other people flock to the stores to buy batteries at once. Now if you have say, a 3 day window to buy supplies before you need to stay indoors or evacuate, you may go on day 1 but find that people are already picking over the aisles because everyone in town is aware that they need stuff. Then again, it may not be bad on day 1. We're talking about having a stash of batteries as a matter of course, unopened until an emergency, not getting them when a disaster is looming on the horizon in the next few days. Last minute, reactive culture is something we need to end and shift to well beforehand proactive culture. We always joke about hurricane parties, so yes, even if you don't think there will be a disaster at your home, you stock up because you're planning on staying home and probably hanging out with others that aren't going to work. When I lived through most of the hurricanes I lived through I was younger. Mom and Dad did the shopping and such. Dh and I have both worked at retail places that sold batteries so we keep in mind places to shop for them that aren't as overrun. My parents, grandmother, and I evacuated for Hurricane Katrina. No one expected it to be as bad as it was. It affected homes that Camille did not. For that storm we drove to FL and were blessed that this hotel had one room for us. All the hotels were full basically. Anyway, when we drove back to our home it was destroyed. Then we were homeless and my dad met a man at some place that was serving meals. The man invited our family to stay with him. Ironically we slept in a trailer park while our brick house was missing an exterior wall and interior walls and had about a foot of water damage among other damage. Our house was located closer to the water. He took it upon himself to drive to Alabama? and bring back a cooler of food for us to share. It was so nice. It was hard to get gas. The gas stations were overrun or out of gas completely. I don't know if any of the local stores had reopened yet but if they had people probably couldn't get to work or the shelves were bare. Gasoline is another example of something that can be stored and on hand before disasters sneak up on people. I think it can be stored for up to 2 years if I remember correctly. You can have approved storage containers for it and write the use by date on it. As the time draws near you can fill your tank with the gas that's going to expire soon and refill them at the gas station with fresh gasoline. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FaithManor Posted August 30, 2017 Share Posted August 30, 2017 I wouldn't call someone without specific insurance coverage stupid. There are a lot of factors. If one can get it and can afford it that is one thing. But insurance is designed to make sure it doesn't have to pay out on expensive stuff if it can possibly help it. That's the nature of the beast. Profit. In our area it is wind damage that is an issue. Many, many homeowners can't get coverage for wind. They also can't sell and move because this is where their jobs are, or in our case we'd love to move but house values plummeted in the mortgage bubble scandal and never recovered. We can't sell it for anything. When we finally do move, we will probably give the home away. So many of us are stuck living in specific areas because that is where the job is, or that is where our elderly parents are, or the house won't sell, or whatever. And with that "stuck" comes the added bonus of only being able to insurance your home for what is available, and what you can afford and still pay the other bills, eat, and buy your medicine. It is a complex problem. We have a town 17 miles from here whose river has been known to flood in the past. While the city and state have done some great engineering things to make the likelihood almost non-existent now except under the rarest of circumstances, most of the town - including city government buildings - cannot get flood insurance. And of course none of these buildings and homes can be sold to anyone who needs a mortgage because the banks have tightened down the hatches and require flood insurance in order to get a loan which means real estate does not move in that town, and people are absolutely stuck! Be careful about assuming people can store gasoline. Many homeowner policies deny fire insurance coverage if you store more than a five gallon can of gas on the property and it can't be stored in your house or attached garage. We get away with having 40 gallons for our generator in case we have a prolonged period of power outage because we have an empty 2 acre lot that we own and keep it there in a metal shed so it isn't actually anywhere near the house. Otherwise we would be limited to five gallons. Now you think you might be able to hide something like this except that IF you have a fire, which is when you really need your homeowner's insurance to kick in, the fire inspector and insurance adjuster is required to go looking for stashes of fuel, and if they find it, you no longer have insurance coverage for your fire even IF it had nothing to do with the blaze because you violated the policy. So don't fault people for not keeping gas on hand beyond what it takes to run the mower and weed whacker. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emzhengjiu Posted August 30, 2017 Share Posted August 30, 2017 We live in an apartment. Keeping gas is not possible. I have a small flood policy just in case because areas near us flooding a couple of years ago. We've on the first floor. My coverage is just enough to help replace essentials. Even though it's sort of cheap, it's more expensive per unit coverage than my renter's insurance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heartlikealion Posted August 30, 2017 Share Posted August 30, 2017 It won't let me quote. Not everyone has a garage. Not everyone has extra cabinet space. Not everyone is willing to keep things like gasoline in their home. We do have an approved gasoline container. Dh uses it to get gas for the lawn mower. I'm not talking months' worth of bread. We literally buy about 4 loaves each week and keep two in a deep freeze. That's our norm. But not everyone can do that. And bread sells out fast so that's why I brought it up as a stock up item. Canned food... yeah, not too much of that being used during a hurricane with no power unless you like cold Spaghetti Os and such. I mean if you're lucky you have a gas stove but here the prime source seems to be electric. When I lived in one home in Miss. out of several, we had gas. We used it to cook during a hurricane but nothing great about a hot kitchen when everyone is sweating because there's no A/C. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FaithManor Posted August 30, 2017 Share Posted August 30, 2017 It won't let me quote. Not everyone has a garage. Not everyone has extra cabinet space. Not everyone is willing to keep things like gasoline in their home. We do have an approved gasoline container. Dh uses it to get gas for the lawn mower. I'm not talking months' worth of bread. We literally buy about 4 loaves each week and keep two in a deep freeze. That's our norm. But not everyone can do that. And bread sells out fast so that's why I brought it up as a stock up item. Canned food... yeah, not too much of that being used during a hurricane with no power unless you like cold Spaghetti Os and such. I mean if you're lucky you have a gas stove but here the prime source seems to be electric. When I lived in one home in Miss. out of several, we had gas. We used it to cook during a hurricane but nothing great about a hot kitchen when everyone is sweating because there's no A/C. True. I have known numerous people say "store rice and beans, store rice and beans". Well, good luck with that if you are dependent on electricity. Good luck with your frozen foods when you are dependent on electricity. Good luck with.... We have a two burner camp stove and keep ten of those little propane tanks out in the shed. We also have some lamp oil. But all of that combined pretty much limits out on fuel storage we can have here without being zoned commercial or agricultural. People think you can just do whatever you want with your property until you find out that insurance, zoning, and township ordinance controls what you can and cannot do. We are super lucky to have just enough solar panels and batteries to run the place, limited, for several days, and the forty gallons for our generator as well. Most people in our little town do not get enough sunlight to run solar (we are the tallest roof in the town by a LONG shot because this house is a former church), and that little bit of property where we can store things without breaking the law. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heartlikealion Posted August 30, 2017 Share Posted August 30, 2017 True. I have known numerous people say "store rice and beans, store rice and beans". Well, good luck with that if you are dependent on electricity. Good luck with your frozen foods when you are dependent on electricity. Good luck with.... We have a two burner camp stove and keep ten of those little propane tanks out in the shed. We also have some lamp oil. But all of that combined pretty much limits out on fuel storage we can have here without being zoned commercial or agricultural. People think you can just do whatever you want with your property until you find out that insurance, zoning, and township ordinance controls what you can and cannot do. We are super lucky to have just enough solar panels and batteries to run the place, limited, for several days, and the forty gallons for our generator as well. Most people in our little town do not get enough sunlight to run solar (we are the tallest roof in the town by a LONG shot because this house is a former church), and that little bit of property where we can store things without breaking the law. Good point. Depending on where you are and how bad the weather is, etc. you may be able to pull out a grill to cook. But that's mainly right after a disaster when you are trying to use up the stuff in the freezer that is about to defrost. This is also when people may choose to use up items from their fridge as well. They might have ice or cold ice packs in a cooler, but no way to get more ice. Yes, stuff like granola bars are handy. Slim Jims, etc. I think of that more as snack food. I don't know what people buy but I suppose I would buy some perishable stuff (within days of hurricane) like extra bananas. Then you could make a peanut butter and banana sandwhich. Whether you have a stocked pantry or not, people will go to the store right before impending hurricane because there are some items they will want like bread and that case of water or extra diapers or whatever. That's just my observation, anyway. Maybe that's the day they decide okay FINE I'll spring for the radio that you can charge by winding up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
regentrude Posted August 30, 2017 Share Posted August 30, 2017 (edited) I have known numerous people say "store rice and beans, store rice and beans". Well, good luck with that if you are dependent on electricity. Good luck with your frozen foods when you are dependent on electricity. Good luck with.... We have a two burner camp stove and keep ten of those little propane tanks out in the shed. We also have some lamp oil. But all of that combined pretty much limits out on fuel storage we can have here without being zoned commercial or agricultural For emergency supplies, I strongly recommend a fuel efficient pocket camping stove with gas cartridges. One cartridge lasts us several days on a backpacking trip. They take up little space and you can store quite a few. Better than oil lamps are LED headlamps and camping lantern. They use little electricity and take normal rechargable batteries. No need to store extra oil. One vital item I have not seen on the recommendations here is a water purification device. That would make the top of my list of emergency supplies. A katydin filter is great, life straws are versatile, and some iodine tablets are good as a backup. This will save fuel in case of a water boiling advisory. Water is more important than food. In response to the comment of another poster about canned SpaghettiOs: in a true emergency, when you are cut off from help and supply lines for several days or over a week, it is a question of having something to eat, anything. While I would never consume SpaghettiOs under normal circumstances, I would after several days without provisions. Or eat beans straight from a can. It's about survival, not enjoyment. If space is an issue, freeze dried foods store well and for long times, and only require hot water to rehydrate. The canned food is for when you have eaten everything in your fridge and your freezer, and are still cut off from civilization. Edited August 30, 2017 by regentrude 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carrie12345 Posted August 30, 2017 Share Posted August 30, 2017 The point of emergency preparedness isn't that everyone can do everything the same or that we can maintain a typical day. It's that we investigate what can keep us alive and do what we can within our means so the focus can go to those who can't. And sometimes we may be those who can't, depending on the scenario. The resignation doesn't help anyone. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FaithManor Posted August 30, 2017 Share Posted August 30, 2017 The point of emergency preparedness isn't that everyone can do everything the same or that we can maintain a typical day. It's that we investigate what can keep us alive and do what we can within our means so the focus can go to those who can't. And sometimes we may be those who can't, depending on the scenario. The resignation doesn't help anyone. Very true. But I think some posts have come across as judgmental towards those that can't. Thus the other perspective being presented. I also think that many people are unaware of local laws and ordinances which may prohibit a certain level of preparedness that some residents could otherwise afford. No matter what, Harvey was just one of those things that it is hardly possible to be truly prepared for other than maybe evacuating well in advance, say, before the order comes down the pike. I cannot imagine the suffering. Then again, I can't imagine what people are going through due to that Monsoon in Nepal/India/Bangladesh. Sometimes mother nature is such an overwhelming force to reckon with. I suspect that some of these discussions have, at the heart, our need to simply hash out our emotions or assuage them by thinking that things would be different for "us" because "we" would do x,y, z differently. Human nature. For what it is worth, if you want to help from long distance, contact your local county EMS. Many EMS companies have a "deployment" list. This is a list of medics who volunteer to be deployed in the event of natural disaster. Often the EMS company is collecting first aid items, food, bottle water, blankets, etc. to send along. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heartlikealion Posted August 30, 2017 Share Posted August 30, 2017 For emergency supplies, I strongly recommend a fuel efficient pocket camping stove with gas cartridges. One cartridge lasts us several days on a backpacking trip. They take up little space and you can store quite a few. Better than oil lamps are LED headlamps and camping lantern. They use little electricity and take normal rechargable batteries. No need to store extra oil. One vital item I have not seen on the recommendations here is a water purification device. That would make the top of my list of emergency supplies. A katydin filter is great, life straws are versatile, and some iodine tablets are good as a backup. This will save fuel in case of a water boiling advisory. Water is more important than food. In response to the comment of another poster about canned SpaghettiOs: in a true emergency, when you are cut off from help and supply lines for several days or over a week, it is a question of having something to eat, anything. While I would never consume SpaghettiOs under normal circumstances, I would after several days without provisions. Or eat beans straight from a can. It's about survival, not enjoyment. If space is an issue, freeze dried foods store well and for long times, and only require hot water to rehydrate. The canned food is for when you have eaten everything in your fridge and your freezer, and are still cut off from civilization. Of course. As I have stated on this form in the past, I lost my job, car and house in Katrina. I don't think you need to preach to me about what you do in an emergency. We literally stayed with a complete stranger after the disaster because our home was wrecked when we returned to town. I'm just saying in my experience, canned food is not ideal. As for water, our local water is so bad I don't drink it when there's NOT a hurricane. But I live further north now so this is actually where family is invited to come to evacuate in a disaster. And the main reason we buy bread in bulk is not for disaster, but because Sam's club sells them in packs of two and we don't all eat the same kind. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
regentrude Posted August 30, 2017 Share Posted August 30, 2017 (edited) Of course. As I have stated on this form in the past, I lost my job, car and house in Katrina. I don't think you need to preach to me about what you do in an emergency. We literally stayed with a complete stranger after the disaster because our home was wrecked when we returned to town. I'm just saying in my experience, canned food is not ideal. As for water, our local water is so bad I don't drink it when there's NOT a hurricane. I am sorry about your experience, and I did not mean to preach anything to you. I was picturing a situation where one is trapped. For a while. And where the only water available is the local water. or the puddles. That's why I mentioned filters, because this recommendation seems to be absent in many pertinent posts about disaster preparedness. I imagine it might be difficult to routinely store sufficient water for a family to last long periods of time. Edited August 30, 2017 by regentrude 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heartlikealion Posted August 30, 2017 Share Posted August 30, 2017 I am sorry about your experience, and I did not mean to preach anything to you. I was picturing a situation where one is trapped. For a while. And where the only water available is the local water. or the puddles. That's why I mentioned filters, because this recommendation seems to be absent in many pertinent posts about disaster preparedness. I imagine it might be difficult to routinely store sufficient water for a family to last long periods of time. After Katrina we saw that some of our neighbors had stayed. They were living in their home still! The direct next door neighbor had a two story home and was living upstairs, running a generator and doing their best to clean up the downstairs. The man had built the house so they probably had a much better idea how to deal with it than the average person, though I worried for them being around mold. I ran outside with my neighbor to collect water bottles that were dropped by FEMA. They dropped a pallet near our homes by the water. I'm sure lots of people don't have a drop site they can get to. The row of houses closer to the water than ours was pretty much all flattened. You could see the piers, maybe part of the foundation, where they had stood. I think it was some time before electricity and water returned to the affected neighborhoods. The guy we stayed with had water, but no electricity so we were able to take a shower and lucked out with some warm water from residual heat I guess. Heck, I would eat cold spaghetti Os, but that's assuming I could open the can. I guess you could use a pocket knife or such if you couldn't get to a can opener. But with people traveling you might be stuck in traffic or somewhere like a hotel without basic items. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carrie12345 Posted August 30, 2017 Share Posted August 30, 2017 Very true. But I think some posts have come across as judgmental towards those that can't. Thus the other perspective being presented. I also think that many people are unaware of local laws and ordinances which may prohibit a certain level of preparedness that some residents could otherwise afford. I think some of us (and I include myself in that sometimes) do feel a degree of judgment when people get stuck on what they can't instead considering what they can. Just because that stretches resources even further. A lot of my family members are very "Why bother if I can't X, Y, Z." But I feel a little bit of that now and then, too. Trying to convince myself that a water filter is good for the lake that's a mile and a half away when the idea of hauling water is something I will avoid at all costs is not a fun internal dialogue, lol. But I don't have a generator for a 240 well pump or excessive storage space for long term water for 7 people and 2 animals, but I do have the money for a stupid filter! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FaithManor Posted August 30, 2017 Share Posted August 30, 2017 I think some of us (and I include myself in that sometimes) do feel a degree of judgment when people get stuck on what they can't instead considering what they can. Just because that stretches resources even further. A lot of my family members are very "Why bother if I can't X, Y, Z." But I feel a little bit of that now and then, too. Trying to convince myself that a water filter is good for the lake that's a mile and a half away when the idea of hauling water is something I will avoid at all costs is not a fun internal dialogue, lol. But I don't have a generator for a 240 well pump or excessive storage space for long term water for 7 people and 2 animals, but I do have the money for a stupid filter! Agreed. It is a lot like talking about pollution. I know a lot of people who won't say reduce the use of plastic bags, or any number of small, not life altering changes because this alone can't counter balance say the pollution of coal fired electrical plants or what car companies have dumped in the water. It is a little maddening because small changes made by 300 million people really would add up, it is just convincing people to make the small changes that are easily within their power to do that is hard, and yes, that means it can be very hard to NOT be judgmental. I get that. I really do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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