I don't buy cage free eggs because...

[SparklyUnicorn]

I assumed that unless I happened to know the details of a particular farm, it might be about as good as a scam (to charge extra money).  And I might be right. 

 

Disturbing and not for the faint of heart:

 

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/theyre-being-eaten-alive-what-i-saw-in-a-cage_us_580a5aefe4b0b1bd89fdb1d0

 

 

[heartlikealion]

Ugh!!

 

I never thought "cage free" was necessarily a huge space for a chicken, but I didn't picture it like the article photos, either. How sad :( I think we have flip flopped a lot with eggs. Sometimes it might say cage-free or free range and other times none of the above. I just looked in the fridge to see what dh last bought. It was neither of those but it said vegetarian fed which I don't remember noticing before.

 

I keep wondering how conditions like this are allowed. I remember watching documentaries on Netflix with similar situations.

[SparklyUnicorn]

I always wonder what is so ideal about vegetarian fed eggs?  Don't they eat mostly vegetarian stuff naturally with a few bugs here or there?  So they are highlighting what they have been feeding them already? 

Like highlighting that cotton candy is "fat free". 

 

Ok... 

[Bluegoat]

In general, terms like free range and cage free don't mean chickens roaming around the coubtryside.  Just like if you buy "organic" produce in the supermarket, chances are the production is only slightly more sustainable than conventional agriculture and probably use natural but still fairly toxic chemicals.

 

This is the biggest reason local production is important (not food miles as people seem to think.)  You can actually ask the farmer what they do, or go see the farm.  And even if you have to compromise on what you would really want, you can actually tell them what you would prefer and ave them take you seriously, because there is a relationship.

 

THat being said, if I had to choose and I had unlimited cash I'd probably pick cage free over battery eggs.  If money is a factor though, I try and maximize my money - other things might take precedence.

[chiguirre]

I bought them once but IMHO they taste funny. The were a bit gamy. I wouldn't buy them again.

[kiana]

Well it means they're not feeding other chickens back to them.

 

Chickens are actually natural omnivores. Most of it comes from bugs. Lots of bugs, in the wild. They love maggots. But they'll also happily eat decaying animals that have decayed into chunks that are small enough for them to eat up. They wouldn't find cooked meat but they'll happily eat it as table scraps if it's small enough. 

 

Source: feral flock of chickens on my family's old farm. 

[regentrude]

I try to buy eggs only from local farmers to whom I can talk about the way they raise their chickens. When the farmers market closes for the season, the health food store carries them. It's pretty much the only thing I buy there - but large scale chicken farming aka egg factories is gross.

 

And yes, cage free means nothing. Nor does "access to outside". While chicken in their natural habitat do eat bugs, "vegetarian fed" means at least that they are not fed byproducts from meat processing, or dead chickens, or fish meal.

 

ETA: This is the one grocery item I splurge on, because not only do factory eggs do not taste good, the conditions are abhorrent.

Edited November 17, 2016 by regentrude

[Bluegoat]

I always wonder what is so ideal about vegetarian fed eggs?  Don't they eat mostly vegetarian stuff naturally with a few bugs here or there?  So they are highlighting what they have been feeding them already? 

 

Like highlighting that cotton candy is "fat free". 

 

Ok... 

 

Chick are omnivores.  They will eat bugs, grubs, frogs, whatever.  I saw one once catch a garter snake.

 

I think some people don't realize this and like the idea of them being vegetarian.  But the main reason is that in industrial agriculture, farmers often feed animals the waste products from other food animals or even cannibalistically, and that is a serious disease risk. 

[frugalmamatx]

And this is why I have chickens in my back yard in the city. A flock of 6, purchased in May as chicks. AND STILL NOT LAYING. Freaking freeloadders!

 

 

But there is nothing better IMO than a truly fresh egg from a truly free range hen. The flavor doesn't even compare. 

[MercyA]

Thank you for posting this, Sparkly. It's truth that needs to be seen. Those poor, poor birds. 

[SparklyUnicorn]

In general, terms like free range and cage free don't mean chickens roaming around the coubtryside.  Just like if you buy "organic" produce in the supermarket, chances are the production is only slightly more sustainable than conventional agriculture and probably use natural but still fairly toxic chemicals.

 

This is the biggest reason local production is important (not food miles as people seem to think.)  You can actually ask the farmer what they do, or go see the farm.  And even if you have to compromise on what you would really want, you can actually tell them what you would prefer and ave them take you seriously, because there is a relationship.

 

THat being said, if I had to choose and I had unlimited cash I'd probably pick cage free over battery eggs.  If money is a factor though, I try and maximize my money - other things might take precedence.

 

If you live anywhere near a farm.  And of the few farms around me they mostly grow apples and none of the farms could be certified organic. 

 

So you think the cage free conditions sound better than the alternatives?  Doesn't sound like it to me.

[Ravin]

Certifications from organizations like this one can make a difference:

 

http://certifiedhumane.org/free-range-and-pasture-raised-officially-defined-by-hfac-for-certified-humane-label/

[SparklyUnicorn]

Chick are omnivores.  They will eat bugs, grubs, frogs, whatever.  I saw one once catch a garter snake.

 

I think some people don't realize this and like the idea of them being vegetarian.  But the main reason is that in industrial agriculture, farmers often feed animals the waste products from other food animals or even cannibalistically, and that is a serious disease risk. 

 

Ah I didn't know they'd eat frogs.

 

I would assume it would be best to have them eat what is natural to them. 

 

I think you could imagine issues with a vegetarian diet too though.  Who knows where their vegetarian sludge comes from or what weird stuff is harbored in it.  I don't know if I'd assume it was so much safer just because it has the word "vegetarian" in it.

 

I think some of this stuff is a darn scam.  They aren't being upfront and honest about the fact cage free is not special and extra good for the birds.  But they are charging a lot of money for it. 

[SparklyUnicorn]

And this is why I have chickens in my back yard in the city. A flock of 6, purchased in May as chicks. AND STILL NOT LAYING. Freaking freeloadders!

 

 

But there is nothing better IMO than a truly fresh egg from a truly free range hen. The flavor doesn't even compare. 

 

I'd be interested in doing a blind tasting.  I wonder if I'd notice.  I don't recall ever having a truly fresh egg.

[Dmmetler]

I get eggs from a 10 yr old homeschooler-her mom had always had backyard chickens and ducks, and about a year ago, she let her DD take on full responsibility for them in exchange for whatever money she can make selling the eggs that the family doesn't need. She's making quite a business of it, and they are definitely nice, big eggs with thick shells and really orange yolks.

 

When DD still had pet frogs, she raised crickets and mealworms for them, and every now and then the chickens would get a feast of the extra bugs. When DD's last frog died and she went to just keeping outdoor frog ponds, her chicken-raising friend got the insect colonies :).

[Bluegoat]

If you live anywhere near a farm.  And of the few farms around me they mostly grow apples and none of the farms could be certified organic. 

 

So you think the cage free conditions sound better than the alternatives?  Doesn't sound like it to me.

 

I don't worry about certified organic.  I look for places that are trying to farm sustainably and morally.  I don't have a problem finding them at the farmer's market.

 

But for eggs, you could look for someone with a backyard type flock if that isn't an option.

 

Cage free might or might not be better, but I don't think they are worse.  But the fact that it's unsure, at best, is why it isn't my first choice for how to spend funds if conventional/cage free is my only choice.

[SparklyUnicorn]

I don't worry about certified organic.  I look for places that are trying to farm sustainably and morally.  I don't have a problem finding them at the farmer's market.

 

But for eggs, you could look for someone with a backyard type flock if that isn't an option.

 

Cage free might or might not be better, but I don't think they are worse.  But the fact that it's unsure, at best, is why it isn't my first choice for how to spend funds if conventional/cage free is my only choice.

 

I live in a city.  And not a fancy one.  Backyard birds aren't allowed.  Nobody has yards here anyway.

[Bluegoat]

Ah I didn't know they'd eat frogs.

 

I would assume it would be best to have them eat what is natural to them. 

 

I think you could imagine issues with a vegetarian diet too though.  Who knows where their vegetarian sludge comes from or what weird stuff is harbored in it.  I don't know if I'd assume it was so much safer just because it has the word "vegetarian" in it.

 

I think some of this stuff is a darn scam.  They aren't being upfront and honest about the fact cage free is not special and extra good for the birds.  But they are charging a lot of money for it. 

 

There are specific issues with feeding animal waste, especially if it is the same animal.  It's a really good way to spread infectious diseases really quickly, and over a lot of farms.  That's why they ran into such problems with mad cow disease - it was being spread by feeding waste from cows to other cows.

[Bluegoat]

I live in a city.  And not a fancy one.  Backyard birds aren't allowed.  Nobody has yards here anyway.

 

Outside the city, though?

[SparklyUnicorn]

There are specific issues with feeding animal waste, especially if it is the same animal.  It's a really good way to spread infectious diseases really quickly, and over a lot of farms.  That's why they ran into such problems with mad cow disease - it was being spread by feeding waste from cows to other cows.

 

Yeah my husband is freaked out by mad cow.  He rarely eats beef because I think he is afraid of it.

[SparklyUnicorn]

Outside the city, though?

 

I live in a city surrounded by cities. 

I'm not driving 2 hours for eggs. 

 

I once did go to a farm relatively nearby (not nearby enough that I'd go there regularly, but there was a festival there).  I wasn't impressed with their cage free set up.  It was nothing like I imagined.

[JustEm]

I took a poultry production course in college. All large scale commercial egg and poultry farming is utterly disgusting, it doesn't matter what label they put on the product.

 

I have tried for years to go local farms. We started with getting a side of beef each year and splitting it with my brother. That has worked out wonderfully and is reasonably priced. We plan on splitting a pig this year as well, which is reasonably priced.

 

Chickens are the issue for me. Eggs and chickens aren't reasonably priced. I can not budget $15/per bird when I can get one on sale at the store for $5-$7. I can't budget $5 for a dozen eggs from a farm when I can get them for about $1 at the store.

 

My biggest goal for our next house is land to have chickens for eggs and meat.

[Guest]

Buy pastured eggs!!! Do not buy "vegetarian fed" chicken eggs. It results in chickens missing out on a vital enzyme that they must then be supplemented with an artificial enzyme (which probably defeats the reason most people think vegetarian fed anything is good). The deficiency causes them to be cannibalistic and is one of the reasons they have to debeak some chickens. Vegetarian feed is a huge problem with chickens. As stated multiple times above, they are natural omnivores. They need the enzymes and proteins they get from bugs and meat.

[The Governess]

Buy pastured eggs!!! Do not buy "vegetarian fed" chicken eggs. It results in chickens missing out on a vital enzyme that they must then be supplemented with an artificial enzyme (which probably defeats the reason most people think vegetarian fed anything is good). The deficiency causes them to be cannibalistic and is one of the reasons they have to debeak some chickens. Vegetarian feed is a huge problem with chickens. As stated multiple times above, they are natural omnivores. They need the enzymes and proteins they get from bugs and meat.

The best eggs we have ever purchased came from pastured chickens. They were through a local co-op and were pricey, but they were so good. The yolks were bright and they tasted great. And the most ethical way to raise chickens. Totally worth it if you can find/afford them.

Edited November 17, 2016 by lovelearnandlive

[madteaparty]

I'd be interested in doing a blind tasting. I wonder if I'd notice. I don't recall ever having a truly fresh egg.

I have hens (see other hen drama thread) and I swear they free range all day AnD get supplemented with fresh fruit and organic feed as they want. I cannot tell the difference at all. But everyone we give eggs to, including people in DH's office keep raving on how delicious they are. I think they're all full of it. I mean I know mine are healthier, but I can't say they taste better.

[poppy]

Cage free and free range means absolutely nothing .Buy certified humane always.

 

 Pete and Gerry's at Costco is a good bet.

 

edited to add, obviously local is best.  Just, if you don't have that option easily accessible, certified humane is a fine choice.

Edited November 17, 2016 by poppy

[Zinnia]

I am another that can't tell the difference in taste with eggs. I suppose I am the opposite of a super taster

[Guest]

I have hens (see other hen drama thread) and I swear they free range all day AnD get supplemented with fresh fruit and organic feed as they want. I cannot tell the difference at all. But everyone we give eggs to, including people in DH's office keep raving on how delicious they are. I think they're all full of it. I mean I know mine are healthier, but I can't say they taste better.

I am the same way. I think it's the freshness that makes the difference. I also supplement them with omega 3 so it makes the yolks orangish and I think plays into people's perceptions of improved taste. :)

[Lanny]

I buy eggs that are shown to be  free range because the brand I buy (if the store is not out of them) is packaged better and I  go to the store for exercise, on my bike.  My wife says their shells are thicker.  If that brand is sold out, there is another brand that my wife also likes that also says  (now) that their eggs are free range.  They seem more durable, when I bring them home in the basket on my bike. Free Range Eggs cost more, but it is rare that when I come home with 30 eggs, that any of them are broken after the trip on my bike.  .

 

We are in Colombia, so if someone had evidence that they were not actually free range eggs, that would be Fraud, which is a Criminal matter here.  

 

When I was a young boy, I had an Uncle whose father had a Poultry (Egg) operation near San Diego. I remember visiting them there.  My Uncle had gone to         school to study Poultry Husbandry.  After awhile, the bottom dropped out of the Egg business and he then began working in other fields.  I remember the Hens were in cages. 

 

 

[Little Nyssa]

I'm not an expert, but I've heard that if the chickens are fed vegetarian feed only, it's not their natural diet, so they will look for protein- and get it by attacking each other.

[Rachel]

And this is why I have chickens in my back yard in the city. A flock of 6, purchased in May as chicks. AND STILL NOT LAYING. Freaking freeloadders!

 

 

But there is nothing better IMO than a truly fresh egg from a truly free range hen. The flavor doesn't even compare.

I use to say this about farm fresh eggs but the chickens' diets matter. We use to get eggs from a family at our church, they were fabulous. My in-laws give us free range eggs from their tenants and the grocery store eggs actually taste better. I've seen both farms up close and can't tell much difference in how the chickens are raised, the chickens run around during the day and are put in a coop at night. I haven't asked what the difference is, one of them must be supplementing the chickens' diets.

[regentrude]

I have hens (see other hen drama thread) and I swear they free range all day AnD get supplemented with fresh fruit and organic feed as they want. I cannot tell the difference at all. But everyone we give eggs to, including people in DH's office keep raving on how delicious they are. I think they're all full of it. I mean I know mine are healthier, but I can't say they taste better.

 

I can taste the difference in eggs from different farmers. There are two farmers who have pasture raised chickens and who supply the local health food store- they taste differently, and I as well as other people I talked to greatly prefer one source over the other.

 

The difference to the cheap battery eggs is significant.

 

This said, I bought once from a farmer at the farmer's market, and the eggs (from pastured chickens) had a distinct bad taste of dirt; I no longer buy from them.

[HomeAgain]

I know exactly where my eggs usually come from and how the chickens are treated.  It also means we don't pay less than $3 a dozen, but they taste good and I like supporting local farmers.  When I can't (like now, their hens aren't producing enough to sell), I buy free range that I've researched (Nellie's, they're certified humane, too).

 

I've known for a while that cage free means nothing.  I also know that egg farmers are getting shafted by the companies they produce for.  The more I can support small farms, the better.

[cmarthur]

We have our own chickens for eggs. We purchase feed that is organic and non GMO because I believe that what you feed them comes through the egg. We pay more for it, but feel it is important. Our chickens are pastured so they eat what they want (bugs, frogs, snakes, my garden) in addition to the feed. We only purchase eggs during their molting time and would be suspect of those that said vegetarian fed if it also stated free range or pastured. Humane treatment of hens is important to me so I checkout egg companies online before I purchase their eggs. They could be scamming me and I wouldn't know it but I have to have some faith in what they say. We can tell the difference between factory eggs and pastured ones (the yoke size is one way) so that helps when I have to buy them. I believe that farmers will change over time if consumers buy the better quality eggs and vote for better conditions with our purchases.

[HomeAgain]

Um, no careful commercial operation is going to "let you visit". That violates every tenet of disease prevention. Years ago, the only way we'd let the 4-Hers visit was if they came here first. We stopped after one year when we found that the kids weren't cleaning their boots after doing their chores. And guess what--fed carefully, with all necessary nutrients, chickens still cannibalize each other. They are nasty little buggers.

Nellie's egg farms do tours.

[zaichiki]

I'm not an expert, but I've heard that if the chickens are fed vegetarian feed only, it's not their natural diet, so they will look for protein- and get it by attacking each other.

 

Chickens will attack each other no matter what they eat.  They are aggressive and have a ruthless social hierarchy.  They're also our favorite form of livestock (the kids love them).  And... fresh eggs - yum!

[zaichiki]

Chick are omnivores.  They will eat bugs, grubs, frogs, whatever.  I saw one once catch a garter snake.

 

I think some people don't realize this and like the idea of them being vegetarian.  

 

We have a lot of frogs... and one time I saw two of our chickens fighting over one... think "tug-of-war." :scared:  Not fun to witness.

 

When my oldest was little he used to enjoy flipping over large rocks to hunt for living things hiding out underneath (just to see them). Salamanders were a rare, but exciting, reward for all that looking... One day he found one and made a big fuss, yelling for his father and I to come and look at what he found.  We were in the pasture with the free-ranging chickens... hubby and I TRIED to shush him as we approached, but it was too late... a few hens came running over to see what the commotion was all about and the salamander was snapped up in a half-second.  This was my kid's face -->  :sad:   Happy hen, though. 

[laundrycrisis]

I buy eggs from a local farmer.  He even gave me a tour.  Here is a video from his farm:

 

https://www.facebook.com/UPcountry-Farm-325686507799660/   

 

We are fortunate to live in an area with several options for buying eggs directly this way.   When I need eggs on a day they aren't open, I buy Happy Eggs.

 

http://thehappyeggco.com/.  

 

I get those at Meijer. 

 

The truly free-range eggs really do taste better.  

[Carol in Cal.]

The shells of the real barnyard chickens' eggs are thicker and stronger, too.  Great for pysanky.

[Ausmumof3]

I think here there is a legal difference between free range and cage free or there was going to be I'm not sure if it went through - where free range has a population density requirement as well.

 

Even in a domestic farm setting chickens will occasionally turn on a weak or injured chicken if it's not spotted and separated soon enough. Just like magpies etc.

 

There can be similar issues with Stall free pigs. Where they are well managed, free range can be a great option but poorly managed can result in a lot of injuries/trampled piglets etc.

[madteaparty]

I can taste the difference in eggs from different farmers. There are two farmers who have pasture raised chickens and who supply the local health food store- they taste differently, and I as well as other people I talked to greatly prefer one source over the other.

 

The difference to the cheap battery eggs is significant.

 

This said, I bought once from a farmer at the farmer's market, and the eggs (from pastured chickens) had a distinct bad taste of dirt; I no longer buy from them.

Interesting. I must have defective taste buds. You could replace the eggs in my little basket with the foulest grocery store ones and I'd be none the wiser, taste-wise.

[MeaganS]

About 2 weeks ago one of my daughters left the lid of the top of the box that stores our chicken feed and there were 3 mice in it. I took the mice and let one loose at a time in the coop and the chickens caught and ate them. It was awesome.

 

I love having chickens and their eggs. We'll probably keep chickens for as long as we can. In fact, we'd love to have more and eventually raise some for meat. The taste difference between a free range chicken and grocery store chicken is significant.

[VaKim]

Just curious, for those of you who say you can't tell a difference in taste - do you eat your eggs sunny side up or over easy? I like my yolk to be nice and runny, and I find there is a huge difference in taste as well as mouth feel. I love the farm eggs I can get around here when they are available. My aunt used to have chickens she let roam around and their eggs were wonderful. However, my MIL had chickens that she kept in pens and fed store-bought feed and a few table scraps, and their eggs were not much different than store eggs. 

 

For some weird reason, store eggs give me indigestion really bad, but fresh eggs don't. 

[ScoutTN]

We buy pastured eggs from local fatmers year round. Like Regentrude, I can taste the difference. I have been to the farms from which I but and know the farmers.

 

If I need eggs in a pinch, I buy pastured eggs from the store. Even among those, some are better than others.

[madteaparty]

Just curious, for those of you who say you can't tell a difference in taste - do you eat your eggs sunny side up or over easy? I like my yolk to be nice and runny, and I find there is a huge difference in taste as well as mouth feel. I love the farm eggs I can get around here when they are available. My aunt used to have chickens she let roam around and their eggs were wonderful. However, my MIL had chickens that she kept in pens and fed store-bought feed and a few table scraps, and their eggs were not much different than store eggs.

 

For some weird reason, store eggs give me indigestion really bad, but fresh eggs don't.

Sunny side up :)

i wish I could taste a difference. But I don't need to in order to be all righteous about it ;)

[pinkmint]

Haven't read all replies but my understanding is that chickens that are allowed to eat bugs make the best more nutritious eggs with darker yolks being a way to tell the higher quality.

 

The eggs at my local Aldi are the cheapest around and actually have darker, better tasting yolks. When I buy cheap eggs elsewhere they are pale yellow and nearly flavorless.

 

Strange. Maybe the Aldi egg vendor let's their chickens eat bugs.

 

But anyway overall it's just strange how the more messed-with and less natural food is raised/grown, the cheaper it usually is. And the food that is grown/ raised with less messing with is more expensive.

[vonfirmath]

The egg lady I used to buy from had truly free range hens....as in, drive up real slow so you don't run one over, free range.

 

But I never noticed a difference in taste.  I notice a difference in the beef, and I notice a difference between tomatoes I grow vs tomatoes I get at the store...cukes too.  But eggs... never noticed a difference.  They seemed to all taste the same, boil the same and bake the same. 

 

ETA: They even seem to peel....or rather NOT peel in the exact same fashion...which is to say that they peel so terrible that I usually end up with half a boiled egg instead of a wholelol

 

Agreed. My sister raises chickens and when she has extra, I get eggs from her I do not notice a difference in taste.

[vonfirmath]

Just curious, for those of you who say you can't tell a difference in taste - do you eat your eggs sunny side up or over easy? I like my yolk to be nice and runny, and I find there is a huge difference in taste as well as mouth feel. I love the farm eggs I can get around here when they are available. My aunt used to have chickens she let roam around and their eggs were wonderful. However, my MIL had chickens that she kept in pens and fed store-bought feed and a few table scraps, and their eggs were not much different than store eggs. 

 

For some weird reason, store eggs give me indigestion really bad, but fresh eggs don't. 

 

I eat my eggs scrambled or fully cooked. I don't like runny yolk.

[JustEm]

Haven't read all replies but my understanding is that chickens that are allowed to eat bugs make the best more nutritious eggs with darker yolks being a way to tell the higher quality.

 

The eggs at my local Aldi are the cheapest around and actually have darker, better tasting yolks. When I buy cheap eggs elsewhere they are pale yellow and nearly flavorless.

 

Strange. Maybe the Aldi egg vendor let's their chickens eat bugs.

 

But anyway overall it's just strange how the more messed-with and less natural food is raised/grown, the cheaper it usually is. And the food that is grown/ raised with less messing with is more expensive.

It is not that odd. They can cram hundreds if not thousands of chickens into a tiny area and feed them a feed that is specifically balanced for optimal production with the least cost (whether that is to fatten them up for meat of produce eggs.) Because the conditions are controlled so heavily they can predict the possible problems and plan for them. This is all controlled with profit margins

 

But if they wanted to allow chickens to eat what is most natural to them they'd have to use more land to provide them the ability and they have more risk factors such as predators. This all costs significantly more than the controlled conditions of a standard commercial production so the product will cost more.

 

It sucks royally for people who want to eat better quality or humanely raised food but can't because of the price

[shawthorne44]

I have hens (see other hen drama thread) and I swear they free range all day AnD get supplemented with fresh fruit and organic feed as they want. I cannot tell the difference at all. But everyone we give eggs to, including people in DH's office keep raving on how delicious they are. I think they're all full of it. I mean I know mine are healthier, but I can't say they taste better.

 

I recently read a book about Vinotypes.  Vino as in wine.   The idea is that since people truly taste things differently, that wines taste different depending on what vinotype you fall into.   People have different sensitivities to Bitter, Salt and Sweet.   Maybe the eggs don't taste the same to you as they do to the people that are raving.  

 

We live in a small town with farms around us.   We used to buy eggs from a certain person that sold them at the farmer's market.  I noticed the taste wasn't quite as wonderful as they had been when I started, but still better than grocery.  I mentioned that to another homeschooling mom.  She said, "Yeah, he has a lot more chickens now.  They are still definitely free-range, but the square-foot per chicken has gone down."