Non-Alcoholic beer and teenagers

[swellmomma]

Ds13 asked me last night if this summer during 1 of the bbq's we go to at gramma's house if I would buy him non-alcoholic beer so he could sit with the men and have 1 when they did. (the men in my family have 1 beer a couple times a summer during a bbq). I told him I had to think about that one for a while.

 

I get why he wants to do it, he wants to be one of the men folk. And on one hand I think it's non-alcoholic so big deal. Alcohol is a touchy subject in our family. We discuss it often as my ex was an alcoholic as were both of my bio-grandfathers. As a result in my extended family alcohol is injested sparingly, and I drink less than everyone else, and they rarely drink. My kids know this, we have discussed many times responsible drinking etc. On the other I do not want to promote drinking at a young age and worry that even non-alcoholic beer would be sending the message that drinking is okay at such a young age.

 

I would never allow my kids to have alcoholic drinks under age but trying to decide if a non-alcoholic beer is any worse than a can of soda basically, other than the connotation from the label on the can.

 

So I toss it out to the hive. If you are a family that does have a beer during a summer bbq from time to time (if you don't believe in alcohol period than this won't apply to you obviously), would you allow your almost 14 yr old son have 1 non alcoholic beer with the men folk? Why or why not?

[Princess Peach]

It is my understanding that NA beer does have a tiny bit of alcohol. You'd probably need several to equal one regular beer, but just thought I'd throw it out there.

 

I would not allow my teen to have NA beer. Beer is something for adults. It's just how it is. My DS could easily sit around with his dad and uncles and chat without having a beer.

[Chris in VA]

Please take this as gently as it's meant--

I see this as a total red flag.

 

No, the drink itself is not the issue. It's the fact that he feels he needs to have it to fit in to the crowd, and that beer is a man's drink.

 

I would not let him have it.

 

ETA--What I mean is that he sees drinking beer as a manly activity--it's for adults, yes, but it doesn't make you a man. If that makes any sense.

Edited June 5, 2012 by Chris in VA

[Mama_Rana]

I honestly am not sure how I feel about this. My parents would sometimes allow us a small amount of alcohol--sips of their beer or wine just to taste it, once the 3 of use shared 2 wine coolers with T-giving dinner--but we never had a whole alcoholic beverage with them until we were much older.

 

The thing with non-alcoholic beer is that is DOES still contain some alcohol, less than .5%. Surely not enough to cause intoxication.

 

I dunno.

 

Would he settle for some root beer in a "beer-like" bottle? What is his reasoning for near-beer vs. some other beverage?

[Annie G]

I wouldn't. Even though the alcohol in a NA beer is small, it's the message that he thinks drinking a beer makes him 'one of the guys'. You'd rather he learn that he can fit in without following the crowd.

Since he's years away from being legally old enough to drink, this request would probably put underage drinking on my radar for a while.

[EKS]

I'd say no but that he can have a root beer (or whatever soda-type drink he likes).

[Kathryn]

Please take this as gently as it's meant--

I see this as a total red flag.

 

No, the drink itself is not the issue. It's the fact that he feels he needs to have it to fit in to the crowd, and that beer is a man's drink.

 

I would not let him have it.

 

:iagree: 100% and see no reason that he needs to develop a taste for beer regardless of alcohol content.

[fairfarmhand]

Please take this as gently as it's meant--

I see this as a total red flag.

No, the drink itself is not the issue. It's the fact that he feels he needs to have it to fit in to the crowd, and that beer is a man's drink.

 

I would not let him have it.

:iagree:

[fairfarmhand]

I'd be super concerned about his developing the taste for it, since there are so many family members who have this addiction.

[MomatHWTK]

:iagree:

 

I think more and more our children have a long list of adult things they want to do to fit in, and we have to choose that line in the sand somewhere.

[ktgrok]

No, because it would be feeding into the idea that you have to be drinking the same thing to fit in and hang out. Not an idea I want to foster. In fact, I'd probably secretly talk to some of the other men about it, and arrange to have some of them drinking beer and some of them drinking soda, together, to show that you don't have to drink the same thing to fit in and have fun.

[Ottakee]

Not quite the same but my ds has fetal alcohol and there is a lot of alcoholism in his birth family. We as a family don't drink and we have talked with him openly about his fetal alcohol and why he should never drink.

 

That said, last weekend he went away with friends to a graduation open house and wanted me to buy him a monster drink to take with him. I am not overly fond of them but I don't think that an occ. one for a 24 year old is going to hurt him. I bought it and let him go and then he called us for a ride home later.

 

I would offer you son a pop or other drink like this of his choice to have but not non alcoholic beer, etc.

 

Also, if you have a good relationship with some of the other men and they are open to it, maybe you could discuss ahead of time with one or more of them privately about your concerns and they might just forgo the beer for themselves and opt for something non alcoholic as well. Not that they HAVE to but out of respect for your son knowning that they are an example to him and that he is at higher risk of addictions in the future.

[Tammyla]

No way. Drinking to fit into a crowd is not a good idea in my book.

[Ipsey]

I agree with the other posters.

 

Have a drink, why not? But why does it have to be fake beer? Coke, rootbeer, lemonade, so many options. My question is, why does it have to be beer in order for him to be a part of the manly gathering? (A question more for him, of course).

 

Does he even like the taste of beer? Blech! (My husband likes it fine, I don't understand it myself.) ;)

[BigMamaBird]

Dh and I both drink beer. With the scenario you gave and the fact that your son seems mature enough to ask you directly with a decent reason, yes, I'd allow it. It's non-alcoholic so it is legal and it's within the sphere of your family, not a bunch of twitty, peer pressuring teens.

[justLisa]

I would let him. It's not like the men are setting a bad example getting drunk daily. And the taste just might set him straight on it's on ;). I am not a big beer drinking, but DH and I do drink alcohol in moderation and responsibly.

 

I know alcohol can be a touchy subject, but I WISH more adults would model responsible consumption such as the adults you are mentioning instead of treating it like the root of all evil....which is even WORSE because then teens wonder even more what the big deal is and eventually have to hide it.

[EKS]

No, because it would be feeding into the idea that you have to be drinking the same thing to fit in and hang out. Not an idea I want to foster. In fact, I'd probably secretly talk to some of the other men about it, and arrange to have some of them drinking beer and some of them drinking soda, together, to show that you don't have to drink the same thing to fit in and have fun.

 

I think this is a wonderful idea!

[WishboneDawn]

I'll disagree. This isn't a peer pressure situation where in order to be a part of the group he has to partake, this is a family get together where having a beer is simply part of the feeling of community. He won't be penalized or tossed out for not having a beer, he's just recognizing a bit of a rite of passage.

 

There's this institution some of us attend on Sundays where having a drink of alcohol has become, in part, an event that is both a rite of passage and a mark of membership in a community. :)

 

I wouldn't have a big issue it myself. That's my experience talking though as I come from a family where alcohol was always in the house and out for gatherings but never a big deal. We drank wine as kids at special events and were given a "near" beer on occasion at bonfires or picnics. Drunkeness/drinking to excess was never a part of my childhood/family experience with alcohol.

[nono]

If you want him to never like beer, get him an O'Douls. Seriously. That's pure crap.

 

I'm not weighing in on this, but wanted to say I love the taste of beer. I don't always want the alcohol that goes with it, so I buy a good amount of "fake" beer. So a "taste for beer" is nowhere equivalent to a taste for alcohol. Just to be clear. ;)

[Samiam]

No. Drinking what every one else is drinking does not make you fit in. It does not make you "one of the men". In this group, a bunch of men, what would make you fit in, and make you feel "like one of them" is being mature, being able to hold a conversation with something interesting to add to it, etc.

 

A young teenager showing up to hang out with a bunch of adult men carrying NA beer JUST shows that the child is NOT mature, because the ADULTS all know WHY he is doing it...he's trying too hard. Frankly, most adult men I know that do drink real beer scoff at NA beer. I think it would just be more of a joke to them (hopefully they would be kind enough to not laugh at him directly though).

 

It's a fine line to cross when you know your parent is okay with you drinking NA, it's not too hard to convince yourself that it's not such a big deal to drink a real beer either. Honestly, how does he even know about NA beer? My DS13 knows about beer, I mean, we've been to events where it is being drank, etc, but he wouldn't have a clue that there is a NA option.

 

With the family history, another reason for it to be a huge NO!

 

I am sure the men in his family would welcome him to participate regardless of what he is drinking.

[mom2scouts]

I would not buy my teens non-alcoholic beer. I wouldn't want them to develop a taste for beer or to feel the need to drink beer to fit in with the men. Family addiction puts him at risk of alcoholism.

[raceNzanesmom]

Nope. There other appropriate drinks he could have while hanging out with the guys.

[Rebel Yell]

(didn;t read all previous replies)

 

I wouldn't allow it- even non-alcoholic, my bigger concern is would people assume it was real beer- especially younger kids? It would be more of setting an example.

 

Why not find a really tasty bottled soda- reed's Ginger Brew is amazing... or a birch beer- he can hang with the ol' dudes and have his bottle... bring an entire 4-pack in case another ol' dude doesn't want a beer, but doesn;t want to be seen sucking on a water bottle.

[LaxMom]

I'll disagree. This isn't a peer pressure situation where in order to be a part of the group he has to partake, this is a family get together where having a beer is simply part of the feeling of community. He won't be penalized or tossed out for not having a beer, he's just recognizing a bit of a rite of passage.

 

There's this institution some of us attend on Sundays where having a drink of alcohol has become, in part, an event that is both a rite of passage and a mark of membership in a community. :)

 

I wouldn't have a big issue it myself. That's my experience talking though as I come from a family where alcohol was always in the house and out for gatherings but never a big deal. We drank wine as kids at special events and were given a "near" beer on occasion at bonfires or picnics. Drunkeness/drinking to excess was never a part of my childhood/family experience with alcohol.

 

This was the case with my childhood, as well, though we did have a few alcoholics in the bunch. The rest of the family (my dad's side, my parents, my maternal aunts and uncles, save one of the spouses) would have a drink here and there on occasions, no big deal.

 

We went out to eat crabs when I was pregnant with the now 11yo, and I had a non-alcoholic beer with them, as did my then teen eldest daughter. It's just part of the ritual. I suspect, in the OP's context, it's also part of the ritual of the men sitting aside together at the gathering.

 

I understand the concern, but I don't share it.

[Carrie12345]

With a history of alcoholism, I would not allow it.

 

Since my family doesn't have that history, an NA beer wouldn't be a big deal here. But I also let my little kids have tea with Grandma, coffee with Grandpa, and overdose on marshmallows at campfires. Not to fit in, that's just "how we do."

[All4one]

IDK, my parents were really strict about most things but when it came to food and drinks they were pretty lax. I was allowed sips of wine and beer from an early age and as a teenager my favorite drink was Sarasoda which had a little bit of alcohol in it. Yum, yum, I wish it was still around.

 

Now, I hardly ever drink. I don't like beer and will have a glass of wine 1 or 2 times a year just to be social, and usually I don't finish the glass. Maybe because it wasn't forbidden, it lost its appeal?

 

By the way, alcoholism does run in my extended family - so we were aware of its affects and the pain it causes. Growing up I knew that 2 of my relatives died because of alcohol.

[HLDoll]

Please take this as gently as it's meant--

I see this as a total red flag.

 

No, the drink itself is not the issue. It's the fact that he feels he needs to have it to fit in to the crowd, and that beer is a man's drink.

 

I would not let him have it.

 

ETA--What I mean is that he sees drinking beer as a manly activity--it's for adults, yes, but it doesn't make you a man. If that makes any sense.

:iagree:

[jenL]

I would not buy my teens non-alcoholic beer. I wouldn't want them to develop a taste for beer or to feel the need to drink beer to fit in with the men. Family addiction puts him at risk of alcoholism.

 

:iagree: Bottled root beer or something similar would be fine, however. I have an alcoholic father, uncles, cousins, and a great-grandfather. Scientists have found it runs along the male gene, and for that reason alone, I would (and do) tread exceptionally carefully with this fact.

[gardenmom5]

Please take this as gently as it's meant--

I see this as a total red flag.

 

No, the drink itself is not the issue. It's the fact that he feels he needs to have it to fit in to the crowd, and that beer is a man's drink.

 

I would not let him have it.

 

ETA--What I mean is that he sees drinking beer as a manly activity--it's for adults, yes, but it doesn't make you a man. If that makes any sense.

:iagree: I would also sit him down and explain drinking alcohol doesn't make you an "adult".

[JudoMom]

Please take this as gently as it's meant--

I see this as a total red flag.

 

No, the drink itself is not the issue. It's the fact that he feels he needs to have it to fit in to the crowd, and that beer is a man's drink.

 

I would not let him have it.

 

ETA--What I mean is that he sees drinking beer as a manly activity--it's for adults, yes, but it doesn't make you a man. If that makes any sense.

 

:iagree:

 

If possible, I would call some of the other menfolk in the family and ask them to bring some soda and ask them to invite my son to sit with them during the BBQs.

[DesertDweller]

I would consider it if he was older. Maybe at sixteen or seventeen. I would not allow it at thirteen. I think it's too young.

[amo_mea_filiis.]

No, because it would be feeding into the idea that you have to be drinking the same thing to fit in and hang out. Not an idea I want to foster. In fact, I'd probably secretly talk to some of the other men about it, and arrange to have some of them drinking beer and some of them drinking soda, together, to show that you don't have to drink the same thing to fit in and have fun.

 

:iagree:

[swellmomma]

Thanks for the feedback everyone.

 

FTR when it comes to the men I will not ask them not to drink the beer. They have 1 beer a couple times a summer, otherwise they drink coffee, water, juice or pop. I will not expect them to give up their 1 beer because my teen wants to join them.

 

Those that have mentioned the risk of the addiction in the extended family. Can you expand further please. If this is non-alcoholic beer how does that increase his risk of becoming addicted? I ask this seriously as they already have virgin versions of alcoholic drinks as do I, (virgin daquiri's, shirley temples etc) and I do not feel that those drinks are predisposing them to alcoholism in the future. So is there something different about the NA beer that increases that risk, or is it just that it is a form of beer? I thought it was the alcohol that causes the addiction not the flavouring of the drink.

 

Those that mentioned the peer pressure angle. THat is something to take into consideration. I don't see this as the same thing, as the men are not pressuring him to drink it, and he has no interest in drinking the real thing with peers etc. BUt it is something to consider for sure. I asked him about his reasoning. He sees it as a bonding thing. He already joins the men for "shop talk" and usually has a soda. He sees it as a growing up thing. The men would not laugh at him for having a NA though they may go yak to their wives about me allowing it.

 

In this situation the men in question are my dad, my brother and my bil. This is not a party situation, it is a family bbq.

 

Anyway, you all gave me many things to consider. The first bbq of the season is still a good month away so I have time to think about it and weigh it all out.

[Guest submarines]

I'd be super concerned about his developing the taste for it, since there are so many family members who have this addiction.

 

3 beers per summer is an addiction? :confused:

[swellmomma]

Yeah then I'm in trouble. LOL :lol:

 

Swellmamma, based on what you just said, I hardly think it's a big deal. I wonder if he will even like the taste of the stuff.

 

I remember as a kid getting a kick out of ordering a virgin Shirley Temple at a restaurant.

 

He does like the taste of beer. Last summer a bigger kid that bullied him (and has since been sent elsewhere to live) held him down and poured beer in his mouth. While the event upset him he did tell me he liked the taste of it. Now fake beer has a different taste than the real stuff so he may find that nasty as can be, or having more than 1 gulp of it will be nasty to him etc. He thought he liked ice cappacino's too until the 3rd gulp of them lol

[momofkhm]

So I toss it out to the hive. If you are a family that does have a beer during a summer bbq from time to time (if you don't believe in alcohol period than this won't apply to you obviously), would you allow your almost 14 yr old son have 1 non alcoholic beer with the men folk? Why or why not?

 

No. My menfolk drink beer. DH has one every night. Sometimes 2. But I still wouldn't buy a non-alcoholic beer for ds. I would buy a root beer bottle that looks like a beer bottle. Some are really dark and don't have a paper label. I just think it sends the wrong message. I also wouldn't want them (kids in general) to get used to the taste, decide they like it.

 

There was a small group of men in the back of the church. I knew them all pretty well, and was comfortable in asking this series of questions:

Do you drink beer?

yes.

The first beer you ever had, did you like it?

NO!

Then why did you keep drinking it?

not one of them could answer.

 

I wouldn't want a child of mine to get through that "beer is a foul substance" thing too early in life.

[MamaBearTeacher]

I agree with others that it is not sending the right message. He should be accepted as "one of the men" whether he drinks beer or not. Still, I might not say "No, you are not allowed." but rather have a conversation with him about all this and maybe he might arrive at the conclusion himself.

 

Is there something else in his life that you could allow him to do that would make him feel more grown up? ie. do something independently or with a friend that he previously needed adult supervision for or spending time with the menfolk? Could you talk to the menfolk in your family and ask for suggestions of how he could feel more grown up or perhaps just suggest that they talk to him in a way that makes him feel more adult?

 

It seems that the issue at hand may be just wanting to feel less of a child rather than which particular drink he has in his hand. If you address this directly in positive ways he won't feel the need to prove it with alcohol in the future.

[JessReplanted]

Nope. He doesn't need a beer to sit with the men. We are not anti-alcohol either, but teach our kids that a beer is something you can enjoy (in moderation) when you are 21 (b/c that is the law).

[LunaLee]

Treading gently here...I am another one that thinks that this sends the wrong message. Not for all kids, but from what I've read about the issues you've had with this ds, I think it's a red flag. And honestly, so might CPS or your Canadian equivilant.

[swellmomma]

Treading gently here...I am another one that thinks that this sends the wrong message. Not for all kids, but from what I've read about the issues you've had with this ds, I think it's a red flag. And honestly, so might CPS or your Canadian equivilant.

 

 

CPS wouldn't care about a non-alcoholic drink with a teen. an actual beer yes they would, a non-alcoholic would be seen as a parental choice. Just as virgin versions of other drinks, etc.

[swellmomma]

Nope. He doesn't need a beer to sit with the men. We are not anti-alcohol either, but teach our kids that a beer is something you can enjoy (in moderation) when you are 21 (b/c that is the law).

 

 

I agree with not giving an actual beer until the legal age (here that is 18).

[fairfarmhand]

3 beers per summer is an addiction? :confused:

she said that her ex (his father I am assuming) as well as some grandparents were alcoholics. I was referring to the original post.

[Ibbygirl]

Hmmmm. I can see your dilemma. My mother used to give us wine mixed with water with certain meals (dinner) and I never thought anything of it. It certainly didn't cause any adverse long term effects in me. To this day I only drink wine with a meal and only certain types of foods at that. So I guess in a way they were modeling how to consume alcohol in an appropriate way, but on the other hand, in your situation with the history of alcoholism in your family that are his direct genetic line, I don't know if I would risk it.

[swellmomma]

I agree with others that it is not sending the right message. He should be accepted as "one of the men" whether he drinks beer or not. Still, I might not say "No, you are not allowed." but rather have a conversation with him about all this and maybe he might arrive at the conclusion himself.

 

Is there something else in his life that you could allow him to do that would make him feel more grown up? ie. do something independently or with a friend that he previously needed adult supervision for or spending time with the menfolk? Could you talk to the menfolk in your family and ask for suggestions of how he could feel more grown up or perhaps just suggest that they talk to him in a way that makes him feel more adult?

 

It seems that the issue at hand may be just wanting to feel less of a child rather than which particular drink he has in his hand. If you address this directly in positive ways he won't feel the need to prove it with alcohol in the future.

 

 

Having a conversation with him about it may sway him if he knows that I am not trying to just slam the door on it. That would be something we would be doing anyway if I agreed.

 

As to the bolded that could very well be the case. That will be something I speak with him further about. Finding ways to help him bridge that feeling of wanting to be one of the grown ups but feeling like he is being treated like a child is a tough one. I will speak with the extended family especially the men before the next gathering about it. The adults in the extended family certainly treat him like he is years younger than he is. Due to his special needs they like to talk to him and act like he is 6-7 rather than a youngman, coming of age kwim.

[Ruby Rose]

NO WAY! However, I would let him have a suitable bottled drink like root beer if the men are drinking from bottles.

 

I think this is a recipe for disaster down the road.

[Mommy22alyns]

No, I wouldn't allow it.

[nono]

When I was pregnant I didn't drink a drop. I missed it. So DH bought me some non alcoholic beer as a treat. I couldn't stand it. Maybe some brands are better than others.

 

Most are horrible. A couple are neutral. One is good enough to drink more than once a week.

[Teachin'Mine]

I hope you don't for all the reasons mentioned. Have you noticed in recent years how the soda bottles and other non-alcoholic drinks in bottles have changed shape? This was done deliberately to get young people used to grabbing for the bottles. The beer industry lost a lot of customers when the legal age was raised, in many states, to 21, and they've been doing everything they can to make sure they've got future customers. The tobacco industry has been doing the same, but overseas. Protect him and educate him as much as you can. As you know, it is hereditary and he's got it on both sides. :grouphug:

 

Just a thought, you might want to, quietly and ahead of time, ask some of the men folk to do something special with your son at the bbq - join in a frisbee game, or whatever. Let him see that they value him and see he's growing up. You might even ask them if they wouldn't mind having a soda here and there too. Just a thought. Kids are so impressionable.

[theYoungerMrsWarde]

I had a nonalcoholic beer as a teen. I felt very grown up, but I HATED the taste. (It was O'Dool's) :ack2: I drank it down because my friends did, but I've never had a real beer since. I am completely uninterested in trying some. I occasionally drink sweet, not very dry wines, maybe once every 6 months, but that's it.

 

So you could let him try it. If he doesn't like it it could be a good deterrent.

 

ETA: I was raised at different times by both sets of grandparents. The ones I lived with at 11-14 years old believed in letting a child have a sip once in a while and "demystifying" alcohol so that it wasn't a big temptation/rebellion opportunity. At the same time my younger sister was being raised by my other grandparents who forbade it completely, but had a bit of a liqueur cabinet. She sneaked drinks and got secretly drunk at a young age. (I didn't find out about it till after we were both adults. And she's had small problems with it in the past when she got depressed.) I'm not saying that will happen to everyone. My sister and I are very different people. Just sharing what my experience was.

Edited June 5, 2012 by theYoungerMrsWarde

[nono]

I hope you don't for all the reasons mentioned. Have you noticed in recent years how the soda bottles and other non-alcoholic drinks in bottles have changed shape? This was done deliberately to get young people used to grabbing for the bottles.

 

Interesting. Can you supply more information? Of course, my mind goes immediately to Inbev, which I think is the biggest brewer, and at least on a secondary level, would compete with a Coca-Cola, a mixer and non-alcoholic beverage supplier. I don't see Coca-Cola really being interested in priming the Inbev market, as it would diminish its own. Perhaps this is with smaller companies that aren't popping to mind?