Salaried employees - how many hours is reasonable?

[Murphy101]

How many hours beyond the standard 40 are acceptable on an ongoing weekly basis keeping in mind they don't get overtime or to make up the time off at a later date.

 

My dh and I are arguing over this issue. I think he let's them get away with asking too much. (and he admits other employees play the kids and it's not OT cards). He says saying no to anything in this economy is like signing your own pink slip. (which I admit seems true, tho I still think it wrong)

 

ETA: Not a management job and no additional benefits come with being salaried. His benefits (health, vacation time, and what not) are the same as everyone else that is hourly. Job pays less than $65k salary. (I don't want to give too much personal detail, but I'm comfortable saying it doesn't go above that.)

Edited October 27, 2011 by Martha

[Impish]

Personally, this is why salaried jobs are so...touchy. B/c the employer *can* take total advantage of the situation, and then what does the employee do? And with the economy the way it is, I suspect more and more employers are taking advantage. Fire some employees, and demand that other salaried employees pick up the slack.

[regentrude]

It absolutely depends on the job.

In some fields, 60 hour weeks are completely normal.

My DH works at least 9-10 hours daily and brings some work home for weekends; some of our colleagues work significantly more than that.

(If you are in academia, overtime pay does not exist)

[WeeBeaks]

I didn't vote. My DH works insane overtime on salary (well into the >20 hours OT a week category most weeks). It is just the way it is. I don't like it, but a better job isn't out there right now. His employer knows it too.

[thescrappyhomeschooler]

I voted <10, but dh certainly works more than 50 hours a week without additional pay, but he has to in his business. I just don't think it's fair.

[AlmiraGulch]

I voted 10 - 20.

 

I've been a salaried employee my entire adult life and have NEVER worked a 40 hour work week on a regular basis. Sure, the occasional week is 40 hours, or sometimes even less, but 50+ is pretty much standard and always has been. If I do 60 I definitely feel it, but I often do more, particularly if I'm traveling, and I would not consider it abusive unless it were expected, forever.

[Mrs Mungo]

Is he in management?

 

Twelve hours a day is the norm for my dh. Fifteen hour days are not uncommon. I'd say he averages at least 60 hours a week, often more.

[2squared]

It totally depends on the job and your ambitions. When I was working at a fairly high level job in finance, I worked 50ish hours/week for three weeks of the month, 55ish/week during one week of the month, and 60ish+ during the annual plan season.

[Canadianmumof5]

It all depends on how long you have to be putting in ridiculous hours.

I don't think that 40 hours a week is what most people work anymore. 45-50 seems to be the norm, without being compensated. I blame technology :glare:

 

If you are working more than that for a short period of time (2-3 months), then I don't think it is a big deal and most employers should be flexible down the road if you need to take a day off here or there.

OTOH, if 60+ hours has become the norm, and you aren't being compensated, and the employer is taking advantage of you, then you need to decide if you can live with the new expectations or not.

 

DH has been working crazy hours lately (70+/week) - not compensated but it is a big project and his company will be A-OK when he wants to take some days off when it is done.

 

Seems to be the way things are these days........

[Karen in CO]

I've always been salaried and have never worked just 40 hours. Neither has my dh. I have had times where I worked more that 70 hour per week for months, but that is not the average. More than 80 starts wearing me thin. No matter how much I work, I have always know people that worked more and less than I do. I currently work close to a 12 hour day most days with the understanding that I am available by phone if needed for additional work.

[GoVanGogh]

I didn't vote...

DH has worked salaried for most of the past 25 years - 1 year he worked two different 6 month contract jobs, otherwise always salaried.

He has never worked less than 10 hours of OT. It has not been uncommon for him - on deadline - to work 20-40 hours of OT, when very late nights and weekends are common.

[valkett]

My dh puts in many hours over the regular 40. Sometimes, it's just 10, but many weeks it's more than 20. He usually has something to work on almost every evening and also on weekends. He's in the tech industry and it's just the way it is. It's competitive. He also know that if he doesn't, there is someone out there looking to take his place. He works for a good company and the salary is great, but the extra hours are just a fact of life. Always has been for him. In addition to working extra hours, he also take it upon himself to always be learning something. He has his Master's and all the coursework done on a PhD, but is also taking other courses. Have to remain competitive.

 

Val

[sassenach]

It really depends on how high the salary is. If it's in the 40-60k, then 10-15. If it's higher, then the culture of business is to expect more. When dh was at the top of his corporate career, he regularly worked 60+ hour weeks. That's not even factoring the weeks that he traveled and was gone for a week at a time.

[angela in ohio]

Depends on the job. Dh always works 10, 20, or more hours over the standard 40 hour week, but that's the nature of school administration. it's worse these past few years as budget cuts have dwindled the number of administrators to below bare bones. Everyone is doing the work of more than one person.

 

I would expect that any management level position wouldbe the same. How much one puts up with depends on the salary/benefits and the intrinsic rewards from the job. Dh doesn't get as much of the former as others who do the same work, but he has plenty of the latter. :D

[Dolphin]

It averages to less than 10 hours a week here, but when grants or patents are going in, it gets crazy. Also, conferences, whenever he goes to those he is pulling 15 hour days.

 

He has found that he gets more done with longer concentrated work and does 4 10-12 hour days. Then he just has to check e-mails and be available by phone on day 5. It gives us more family time as he leaves early while we are all sleeping, and then has an extra day home with us.

[Barry Goldwater]

It can really depend on the industry he's in. There are cultural expectations for 'free overtime' that vary from field to field.

 

FWIW I've walked away from a very high paying salaried job because of the endless late night/weekend phone calls, emails, weekends of 'homework' and extensive travel...because my 'marginal' gain of income for the 'prestige' of management came out to something like $1.00 per hour, when I actually looked at it.:lol: I'm coin operated...so I made a change. It's not what you make, it's what you keep, and at what cost to you...

 

It also depends on your 'next best alternative.' If he draws a line in a sand and 'pushes back' to say, 'enough is enough!' does he have an alternative if his boss throws a tantrum and sacks him? Is he talented enough and/or offering a skill that is in high enough demand for him to push back?

[homeschoolmom]

I'm most comfortable putting in 50 to 60 hours. I can do 70 hours in sprints of no more than a month. After that I and my boss and I have to have a chat about how work is just a part of my life not my whole life.

 

I'm in IT, middle management. 40 hours is considered "not enough" 50 is the new 40.

[twoforjoy]

I'm a big believer in the 40-hour work week, so I don't think people should be asked to work more hours. But, realistically, I think 50 is pretty common and even 60 isn't unreasonable in most fields.

[Joker]

My dh has a theory that if you put in those kinds of hours it just becomes expected ~ so he doesn't. :D He's worked for the same company for the past 12 years and has steadily moved up. He makes a good salary and never works more than 45-50 hrs. week. There are people below him that will put in 12 hr days but never get anywhere within the company so he doesn't understand it. He's hasn't worked crazy long hours since he left the Marines.

[serabi]

I work part time (30 hours a week) but my husband works full time. His salary is calculated at $xx.xx for the first 40 hours and then time and a half for the next 12 hours that he's supposed to work every week, bringing him up to 52 hours a week that he's actually paid for. Realistically it will be more than that very soon (he's about to open a new store - he's a retail manager.) And any hours after 52 will be unpaid since he's salaried.

 

With that said, at 60+ hours a week we start really feeling it. 52 is manageable though.

[momma aimee]

as many as are necessary to get the job done.

 

My Mom commonly worked 60+ each week; Dh puts in an easy 60 on a normal week; and tons more some times.

 

You make a commitment to a job, you do what has to be done or you get a different job.

 

Barring a medical emergacny or something -- DH took off the day DS2 had to go to ER with no questions -- but the run-of-the-mill day -- you do what has to get done.

[DianeW88]

Is he in management?

 

Twelve hours a day is the norm for my dh. Fifteen hour days are not uncommon. I'd say he averages at least 60 hours a week, often more.

 

:iagree: My dh is in management and he regularly works 60 hours per week. Plus, he has to take calls and answer emails whenever and wherever he is. 24/7. It's just the way it is now.

[Danestress]

and ultimately what we want to do. My DH does work some long hours. He also works 40 hour weeks sometimes. It just depends on the workload. But he always wants to do a really good job at whatever he does, so he will put in the time that is necessary.

 

Jobs can be hugely stressful, especially in a dicey economy. I used to complain sometimes when he hours were long. No more. Now I am just very grateful he has a job and very grateful he is someone who wants to do any job well. He also wants to be a good Dad, so there is some balance here. My DH works 3 miles from our house, so he has no commute and when his hours are long, I am especially happy about that!

[catz]

It absolutely depends on the job.

In some fields, 60 hour weeks are completely normal.

My DH works at least 9-10 hours daily and brings some work home for weekends; some of our colleagues work significantly more than that.

(If you are in academia, overtime pay does not exist)

 

:iagree: My husband regularly does "overtime". However, he is management and he is HIGHLY compensated. I used to work in corporate America and worked overtime on salary all the time. If you work in an important role in a company, it can literally mean the difference between success or failure of a product and maybe the entire business.

[bettyandbob]

This depends on the field. I've had 3 jobs where I was salaried and dh has had 1 in the last 19 years. During the times I've been salaried I've never put in less than a 60 hour week. Dh experience is the same, he often works more. I have a neighbor who works for a government agency. He gets comp time when he works OT. I never got comp time neither did dh when he was salaried.

[Mynyel]

I voted none. Why should salaried people be expected to work overtime when others aren't?

 

If there is a special project coming up or some such thing then OK fine. But just your normal every day week? Nope. If an hourly employee isn't expected to work overtime then neither should a salaried person.

[oldskool]

DH averages 55 at his current job. We think this is great considering other jobs he has held were a standard 70. BTW, he works in food service. I work for a small non-profit and am supposed to work 15 hpw, but come much closer to 30 when I count in all the work I do from home on top of the hours I am actually at the job.

 

Lesley

[Bluegoat]

My dh doesn't often work more than 40 hours a week - sometimes less. He's in management. But that is only for the half the year he's home. The other half he is on a remote island, and though he is only at work about 50 hours a week normally, he can't actually go anywhere. So I figure it kind of evens out.

[Murphy101]

My dh has a theory that if you put in those kinds of hours it just becomes expected ~ so he doesn't. :D He's worked for the same company for the past 12 years and has steadily moved up. He makes a good salary and never works more than 45-50 hrs. week. There are people below him that will put in 12 hr days but never get anywhere within the company so he doesn't understand it. He's hasn't worked crazy long hours since he left the Marines.

 

:iagree: that's my opinion as well.

 

This is not management or academia.

[bettyandbob]

I voted none. Why should salaried people be expected to work overtime when others aren't?

 

If there is a special project coming up or some such thing then OK fine. But just your normal every day week? Nope. If an hourly employee isn't expected to work overtime then neither should a salaried person.

 

 

Some people who are paid hourly may be eligible for some benefits, however salaried employees are often eligible for a lot more benefits like health ins, retirement savings, paid vacation, etc. I've never heard of an hourly employee getting paid vacation.

[Murphy101]

 

 

Some people who are paid hourly may be eligible for some benefits, however salaried employees are often eligible for a lot more benefits like health ins, retirement savings, paid vacation, etc. I've never heard of an hourly employee getting paid vacation.

 

 

:001_huh: every full time hourly job I'm aware of here gives at least 1 week paid vacation after a year of employment.

[silliness7]

How many hours beyond the standard 40 are acceptable on an ongoing weekly basis keeping in mind they don't get overtime or to make up the time off at a later date.

 

My dh and I are arguing over this issue. I think he let's them get away with asking too much. (and he admits other employees play the kids and it's not OT cards). He says saying no to anything in this economy is like signing your own pink slip. (which I admit seems true, tho I still think it wrong)

 

Is it wrong to say that it depends on how much they are paying him?

[goldberry]

I agree that it is expected now and that if you refuse you don't need to take that type of job. And there may not be other jobs available.

 

BUT, it is really sad I think. How much interaction can a parent have with kids or with their spouse when working 60-70 hours a week? It wasn't what we wanted for our family. I think relationships suffer, spirituality suffers (if that is important to you), many things suffer.

[goldberry]

:001_huh: every full time hourly job I'm aware of here gives at least 1 week paid vacation after a year of employment.

 

This is true here also. In fact, the higher up, the more vacation you may have but the less you are allowed to take. The company I used to work for would never approve any more time than a week off for management.

[Impish]

 

 

 

Some people who are paid hourly may be eligible for some benefits, however salaried employees are often eligible for a lot more benefits like health ins, retirement savings, paid vacation, etc. I've never heard of an hourly employee getting paid vacation.

I think its employment law here that a minimum x% goes towards pd vacation time.

[amy g.]

My husband does everything his boss asks him to do. If he felt it was excessive he'd look for another job and mention the stress of the extra hours in his exit interview.

 

If he can't get another offer, that is a pretty good hint that he needs to suck it up and be grateful for the salary he has.

 

He would never complain about working overtime. It just sends entirely the wrong message.

[Murphy101]

To be clear.

My dh doesn't complain.

His wife is!

 

Also, other employees don't complain.

They just don't do it.

Either they say they will and don't.

Or they cop the "I have to get my kids" excuse, which really makes ME angry. Men have kids too.:glare:

[Bluegoat]

The big difference I think is that for an hourly wage, you are expected to be in a place doing something for a particular amount of time. For a salary, you are expected to complete a particular job, however much time it takes. There is a sense in which you are being given a different kind of responsibility.

 

That being said, the remuneration should take into account how much time is expected to be involved, so someone working a job that takes a lot of time should receive pay and benefits that accord with that. And it is totally possible for an employer to take advantage of a salaried employee by not paying enough or expecting things that are ultimately unfair to anyone.

[Word Nerd]

 

 

Some people who are paid hourly may be eligible for some benefits, however salaried employees are often eligible for a lot more benefits like health ins, retirement savings, paid vacation, etc. I've never heard of an hourly employee getting paid vacation.

 

This hasn't been the case in my experience, and I've had salaried and hourly positions. I've had two full-time hourly jobs and had paid vacation and sick/personal time for both after working there for a certain time period (which was true of the salaried job too), as well as insurance, 401(k), and other benefits.

[FairProspects]

 

Some people who are paid hourly may be eligible for some benefits, however salaried employees are often eligible for a lot more benefits like health ins, retirement savings, paid vacation, etc. I've never heard of an hourly employee getting paid vacation.

 

At his previous job, dh was eligible for health insurance, retirement IRA (but no employer match), and he accrued paid vacation/sick leave at his hourly rate. He was a full-time employee though in a professional field, so I don't know if that made a difference.

[Haiku]

You make a commitment to a job, you do what has to be done or you get a different job.

 

 

I don't buy that at all. This leaves the door wide open for employers to hire one person to do two jobs and then claim, "Well, you committed to the job." A work week is 40 hours. If an employee has to put in more than 5 hours extra a week on an ongoing basis, that employee should be compensated.

 

When my dh left his last job, they hired 3 people to replace him. Over the years, they just piled on more and more work on him with no compensation for it. It's not that easy to just "get a new job" when you are being taken advantage of.

 

Tara

[Haiku]

It's just the way it is now.

 

It's this way because people allow it to be. If people said no, it wouldn't be.

 

Tara

[C_l_e_0..Q_c]

I was a salaried employee (for a job that paid more than 65K). And most people were putting in 100 hours a week. At 80 hours a week (yes, on a regular basis) I got bad reviews. I wasn't as committed as the others. I had a house in the suburb, the others rented an apartment in the building in front of work. They even had impromptu meetings in the apartment building corridors! The company bought the apartment building after a while, but my house in the suburb, with corresponding commute time wasn't acceptable to them.

 

This is very dependent on the field you're in. It was expected in my field. You do the overtime, or you're out kinda thing.

[homeschoolmom]

I was a salaried employee (for a job that paid more than 65K). And most people were putting in 100 hours a week. At 80 hours a week (yes, on a regular basis) I got bad reviews. I wasn't as committed as the others. I had a house in the suburb, the others rented an apartment in the building in front of work. They even had impromptu meetings in the apartment building corridors! The company bought the apartment building after a while, but my house in the suburb, with corresponding commute time wasn't acceptable to them.

 

This is very dependent on the field you're in. It was expected in my field. You do the overtime, or you're out kinda thing.

 

Wow, what field is that?

[FaithManor]

How many hours beyond the standard 40 are acceptable on an ongoing weekly basis keeping in mind they don't get overtime or to make up the time off at a later date.

 

My dh and I are arguing over this issue. I think he let's them get away with asking too much. (and he admits other employees play the kids and it's not OT cards). He says saying no to anything in this economy is like signing your own pink slip. (which I admit seems true, tho I still think it wrong)

 

ETA: Not a management job and no additional benefits come with being salaried. His benefits (health, vacation time, and what not) are the same as everyone else that is hourly. Job pays less than $65k salary. (I don't want to give too much personal detail, but I'm comfortable saying it doesn't go above that.)

 

 

THIS!

 

Dh's company is in full tyrant, indentured servant, employees are property, mode and they will off shore any position as soon as the employee stands up for him or herself. So, there is no saying "NO" and remaining employed there. That would be okay if there was somewhere else to go. But in Michigan, the I.T. industry has tanked for the most part. According to colleagues who work for the competition, the hours are every bit as evil.

 

Dh never, ever, ever works less than 65. He is supposed to have 3 weeks paid vacation per his contract plus most federal holidays. He works the holidays except Thanksgiving Day, Christmas Day, and Easter Sunday. They rarely agree to let him take more than 1.5 weeks of his paid vacation because vacation is only approved at there discretion during "down time" and there never is down time because they are billing him out as 100% allocated to one project and 50% allocated to two others. He's supposed to be 200% of a person. :001_huh: :glare:

 

A 65 hr. work week is low in all actuality. He's on call 24/7. So even if he takes a vacation, he is supposed to drop everything if a colleague calls, find internet, and get online asap. When we went to Viginia/Washington D.C. this past May, the account manager for one project called him 8 times in 4 days. He worked 9 hrs. over the course of the 6 days we were gone but the full four days (we were gone over a weekend in addition to the four weekdays) of vacation were taken out of his vacation log.

 

Last week he worked 42 out of 48 hrs. His.boss.did.not.care. and told him to "suck it up" for the "team" (code for, the CEO wants a 28 million dollar bonus this year and we are taking it out of your hide).

 

The company policy on comp time is that you are supposed to take it the day after it is earned or it is lost. Hmmmm...give that most days are booked in advance with deadlines and meetings and the bosses know this, then it's impossible most days to take any "comp time" the very next day and the bosses know that too! The policy is designed to make sure the employee is run ragged and the company never has to pony up any time off with pay that is owed.

 

No pay raises, no bonuses, and pay cuts were instituted two years ago.

 

25 months and our last payment will be made. Dh is walking off the job and either going back to school and finishing a PH.D in math and will teach in college, or he's going to take a paid position with 4-H.

 

Reasonable, not more than 52 hrs. or there better be some time off without complaint of the company, or compensation.

 

In the last three years 2 months, dh's total comp time added up to 1 year and 1 week. That's right! They owe him a year paid sabbatical from the job.

 

Faith

[Parker Martin]

It varies. I know salaried employees who work forty hours, and I know ones who work eighty hours. Just depends on the job.

 

If it's too much for your family, he should put out some feelers with other companies. The time an employees is expected to put into a job varies wildly between different companies. At least, that has been the experience of my friends' husbands. My husband has his own company, so I doubt there will ever be an end to the over forty hour weeks.

[Veritaserum]

Dh has been salaried as a full-time software developer for over a decade. Most weeks he works 40-50 hours. When they are pushing up against a deadline, he'll work 80 hours+. The last two companies he's worked for give bonuses to highly productive employees. These bonuses aren't guaranteed, but they are related to putting in extra time.

[joannqn]

I think a salaried job should have a job description that you can get done in 40 hours a week. Calling a job "salaried" just so you don't have to hired the right amount of staff for the job is wrong, IMO. DH left a job because the boss expected DH to work more hours than he did because he was "salaried".

 

Check your laws. We found out that DH's salaried job didn't meet the legal requirements for a salaried job. The law indicated what kind of jobs could be labeled as salaried vs. being hourly.

[LaxMom]

as many as are necessary to get the job done.

 

My Mom commonly worked 60+ each week; Dh puts in an easy 60 on a normal week; and tons more some times.

 

You make a commitment to a job, you do what has to be done or you get a different job.

 

Barring a medical emergacny or something -- DH took off the day DS2 had to go to ER with no questions -- but the run-of-the-mill day -- you do what has to get done.

 

That would be my answer as well. Back in my IT consulting days, I often worked several contracts at a time, traveled, and was available to my customers' help desk staff during their own shifts, so 24 hrs a day (though most understood that I worked a normal day job so would try to call me during the the "decent" hours of their shift).

 

I was paid to produce, not to occupy a desk between specific hours.

[Parker Martin]

Wow, what field is that?

 

I'm going to take a guess: law or finance at a big firm. I know that one hundred hours is pretty normal for those jobs. When DH has been busy with a project a few times, we had a few months of one hundred hour weeks. Can't imagine doing that for years. Yowza!