Should I cause ANOTHER Blowup in My Family?

[katemary63]

Well, my mom is an enabler and severely co-dependant and always has been. I have had many discusions with her about this over the years. But she just seems to HAVE to have someone who NEEDS her.

 

So, her current "victim" is my niece. My mom has been "helping" N with homework since she was in the 8th grade. Thru high school she progressed to simply doing some work for her. Now, N is a junior in college and my mom had been doing half her work the whole time. She actually does entire projects and then gives them to N to turn in. Sometimes Mom does N's homework while N goes out to party or goes to bed.

 

Mom also drives to down town Chicago twice weekly to pick N up from school just so N doesn't have to take the late train home. It's a 2 1/2 hour round trip. Mom is 66 years old, desperately broke, and works full time. N has never paid a penny in gas or car maintenance. Mom has been doing this for 3 years.

 

The thing is, EVERYBODY in the family knows about this, including N's mother, who sits and watches TV while my mom sits at my sister's kitchen table doing N's homework and says nothing. People joke with my mom, "When are YOU graduating?" But no one ever says anything serious. It makes me sick. I have talked with my mom many times about it. I have told her how she is hurting N, NOT helping her. I have told her she is being selfish, meeting her own co-dependant needs at the expense of her granddaughter. I have been very blunt. We have had this same conversation many times over the years about other issues as well. Now she just tells everyone, "Don't tell Lisa what I'm doing." I know this because she says it in front of my DD23.

 

Well, to top it all off, the other day, my DD23 and N were having lunch. DD mentioned Grama and N says, "Oh, I HATE her. I can't stand being around her!" DD is shocked and says, "What about all the stuff she does for you for school?' and N says, "Yeah, I know. That's why I put up with her."

 

OMG! I would like to slap N smack in the mouth. But then, my mom created this monster, right? I don't know. If I say anything, no one will change anyway. They will just dislike me even more then they already do. I have always been the one to expose the truth amd confront people (kindly) when they are doing something this blantantly wrong. But the rest of my family LIKES living in denial and pretending everything is normal. My sister will just say I'm jealous. UGH!

 

I am having a lot of negative feelings for my sister because she has allowed this to go on for so long and to such an extent. But any kind of conversation would just end badly. My sister resents the heck out of my "normal" life. So me confronting her on this would just bring all that up. But my other choice is to do like they do, smile and pretend.

 

I would LOVE to tell my mother what N said just to be able to say, "I told you so!!!!!" but I would never do it. She would be devastated. She thinks N loves her like a mother.

 

Thinking ahead to N's graduation, I can't imagine telling her congratulations! Gag.

 

BTW: I live in a different state from DD and the rest of my family.

WWYD?

Edited June 4, 2009 by katemary63

[Marylou]

And send a graduation card to N when it's time. No gift or money. Just consider your part done.

 

They do not want any advice from you.

[Dobela]

If I say anything, no one will change anyway. They will just dislike me even more then they already do. I have always been the one to expose the truth amd confront people (kingly) when they are doing something this blantantly wrong. But the rest of my family LIKES living in denial and pretending everything is normal. My sister will just say I'm jealous. UGH!

 

Thinking ahead to N's graduation, I can't imagine telling her congratulations! Gag.

 

BTW: I live in a different state from DD and the rest of my family.

WWYD?

 

In a weird sort of way it is nice knowing my family isn't the only dysfunctional one... Honestly, I would say nothing. You may be right but if no one is willing to change, and they are willing to lie to cover themselves, what will it accomplish other than create stress for you? With my family the best thing I ever did was to finally step away and not get involved in scenarios like this. My mom accuses me know of being a snob and other family memners accuse me of worse but si be it. I am stronger, healthier, and happier.

[MamaT]

It sounds like they really don't want your advice. I wouldn't say anything.

 

I take it from your post that you are letting this situation eat at you. I have a dysfunctional family as well, and I have to emotionally detach myself from situations like this. I would try very hard not to let what's going on with them take up that much space in my head. Don't dwell on it, it will only eat at you and cause you stress you don't need.

[Andie]

Thinking ahead to N's graduation, I can't imagine telling her congratulations! Gag.

 

BTW: I live in a different state from DD and the rest of my family.

WWYD?

 

I'd send a card if I received an announcement.

 

Before that, though, I'd take a giant step back out of the rest of the mess and concentrate my time and energy on my own life and family. I understand your frustration and concern for all involved, and for what it's worth, you're probably *right*. But no one has been receptive to your involvement. They obviously don't want to change. So, maddening as it is, I would realize that I simply must butt out, for lack of a gentler term. :) Then, the tricky part...not stewing. ;) I wouldn't hash over it with your daughter (I'd have stopped the conversation relaying N's talk about Grandma, for example) or others. Train yourself *everysingletime* to disengage. Say a prayer for them, or wish them well mentally, and do NOT DWELL on it further.

 

I *absolutely* would not let it turn into another "blow-up" in the family. This just isn't your situation to handle.

 

Good luck!

[NCMom]

I'm sorry and I do feel for you - my mother suffers from borderline personality disorder and we all suffer along.:glare:

 

But, I've had to face this fact in my own family - these people are adults and as such it's basically none of my business at this point. Especially when they actively choose not to accept advice or seek change.

 

And hey, your niece may love your mother, but her embarrassment over being so needy and co-dependent may have led her to say that. She may be out partying while grandma does her work but a part of her is always thinking "I'm a loser". Co-dependence is lose-lose.

 

The only thing I control is my behavior, so, for me I choose NEVER to engage in the insanity and to limit contact to some degree.

 

A card and a small gift would be all I would do.

 

hth,

Georgia

[katemary63]

Yeah, You all are right. I really don't "stew" about it..I have disengaged to a huge extent where "they" are concerned...but just the other day, learning that my N "HATES" my mom after all these years of "helping" her just made me ill.

 

There's this part of me that feels like this is an injustice and it has to be righted....but that is dumb, leftover crap from the family circus. I guess it's not an injustice if it's what they all want, huh? Thanks guys. Especially for the advice to send a card, say nothing, pray for them and live my own life. That's exactly what I will do. :001_smile:

Edited June 4, 2009 by katemary63

[katemary63]

.And hey, your niece may love your mother, but her embarrassment over being so needy and co-dependent may have led her to say that. She may be out partying while grandma does her work but a part of her is always thinking "I'm a loser". Co-dependence is lose-lose.

 

You know, this actually never occured to me and it really helps. Thanks.

[OHGrandma]

... I have told her how she is hurting N, NOT helping her. I have told her she is being selfish, meeting her own co-dependant needs at the expense of her granddaughter. I have been very blunt. We have had this same conversation many times over the years about other issues as well. Now she just tells everyone, "Don't tell Lisa what I'm doing." I know this because she says it in front of my DD23.

 

Well, to top it all off, the other day, my DD23 and N were having lunch. DD mentioned Grama and N says, "Oh, I HATE her. I can't stand being around her!" DD is shocked and says, "What about all the stuff she does for you for school?' and N says, "Yeah, I know. That's why I put up with her."

 

... would LOVE to tell my mother what N said just to be able to say, "I told you so!!!!!" but I would never do it. She would be devastated. She thinks N loves her like a mother.

 

 

WWYD?

 

You've said all there is to be said, and the only response they have is to try to hide their actions from you. No need to say it again.

 

Oddly, N probably does love grandma like she loves her own mother, and not in a good way.

 

You can't change your mother, sister, niece; but you can model the behavior you'd like your own kids to exhibit.

[CookieMonster]

You cannot make anyone do anything.

 

You cannot make your mother behave in an emotionally healthy way. You've already tried getting her to see her error and change her way. You cannot be faulting for 'standing idly by'. But, now your part is done. If she ever comes to you for help or advice, well, give it. For now, step aside. It's her life. It's her decisions. They are not yours to own or feel ashamed about.

 

You cannot make your niece appreciative of your mother or your mother's actions. If she were to have a conversation with you about your mother, you would be free to comment on her horrid use of your mother. If. Until then, there is no part for you in this. Her feelings and words are not yours to own or feel ashamed of.

 

In my experience, if you'd like to see positive change in your family, you must stop owning these people's mistakes, complaining about these people to other family members (husband excluded ;) ), lecturing these people about their misbehavior, and otherwise being unfriendly and overbearing. Show them respect as fellow human beings free to make their own choices. Show them love, compassion, and concern that doesn't require good behavior to be received.

[Tap]

What do you expect the outcome to be if you approach any party in this? Knowing that you have seen your opinions in the past being chastized, do you think you can help, change, nudge, or create a different path for anyone in the picture? If you think there is one person you in this puzzle who will listen, act, and change, then there is a possiblitity that the intervention may be worth the emotional cost to you but if you really only foresee resulting problems....don't waste your energy.

 

In my experience....You can't go down the same path, with the same people, and expect a different result than you have seen in the past.

 

If you niece is close to graduation, the situation will be ending soon anyways. Her lack of knowledge in a certain area will either affect her job or not. She will be the one who reaped the rewards and who pays the price. You mother got something out of the relationship, whether it was fake adoration by your niece or genuine, your mother feels like she got something. Your niece sounds ungrateful now, but that is common in the young 20's when kids are just starting out on their own. Most people come around in their later years and realize what family means to them, and what sacrifices people have made. Hopefully this is sooner rather than later for you niece/mother.

 

The main problem I foresee is that once your niece no longer needs your mother, she will drop her. I can see you mother getting a lot of hurt feelings over this. But your mom is an adult and she will get over it. That will be the time to step in and while not saying 'I told you so', being supportive and letting the past go. This will be the time to see the changes in your and your mother's relationship, if you want there to be one.

 

I have the same issues with my mother doing wayyyyyyy too much for other family members. She is just a very generous (to a fault) person. I try to see her for that trait and not the individual circumstances of enabling. I think sometimes that she has taken care of other people so long that she really wouldn't feel complete without taking care of someone. It is just as vital to her as breathing. I am not that way, so it is hard for me to appreciate that quality in her, but I try to remind myself that while she does cross the line sometimes into enabling, it is her choice, and it is obviously the role she feels she must fill. I try hard to realize that my wanting her to change, doesn't make her want to change, and without that, my suggestions fall on deaf ears. Just like if she tried to convert me to her way of seeing the world...it just isn't going to happen!

[Impish]

Well, I'd send the congrats card co-addressed, but then I haven't had my full ration of coffee today yet.

 

Honey, you're living a distance from your family. A physical distance. Its time to start allowing that to be an emotional distance as well. They are never going to be the emotionally healthy, NORMAL, rational people you so want them to be. As often as you drag them into the light, they're going to kick and scream and go running back for the shadows. They don't WANT to be saved. They WANT the dark.

 

I know that hurts, and sucks, and you'd give anything to change it. Believe me, oh BELIEVE me, I so know. I truly do. But you can't. You want to save them, but you can't. So quit trying to save them, and save YOU instead.

 

A wonderful friend of mine said to me when I was struggling with the very same sort of issues, "Every moment you spend allowing them to consume you is a moment lost with your children. Every emotion you give them is emotion you've denied your family. Every energy you've wasted on their situation, you've robbed from your life. You need to quit robbing from your family to waste on those who will never change nor appreciate it."

 

He also shared with me a quote from a Franciscan Monk. "You cannot teach pigs to sing. You will only frustrate yourself, and irritate the pigs." Every now and then when I caught myself sliding back into getting entangled into negative family crud, my friend would ask me, "Teaching pigs to sing again?" and I'd pull back and look at the situation. There was one time where he asked, and I answered him in exasperation, "The problem with teaching pigs to sing, is that sometimes when I go to walk away, and one of the buggers starts to HUM behind me!" :lol:

 

Its a hard place to be. I wish you all the best, and please know that I'm speaking from a place of experience, and wanting nothing but peace for you, ok? I'm not trying to be harsh, or mean, so I hope that I haven't come across that way. "Tone" can be hard on a message board. :grouphug:

[CookieMonster]

Yeah, You all are right. I really don't "stew" about it..I have disengaged to a huge extent where "they" are concerned...but just the other day, learning that my N "HATES" my mom after all these years of "helping" her just made me ill.

 

There's this part of me that feels like this is an injustice and it has to be righted....but that is dumb, leftover crap from the family circus. I guess it's not an injustice if it's what they all want, huh? Thanks guys. Especially for the advice to send a card, say nothing, pray for them and live my own life. That's exactly what I will do. :001_smile:

 

Oops, you must have posted as I was posting. If I had seen this, I wouldn't have written out all I did. It sounds like you're good to go now.

Edited June 4, 2009 by CookieMonster
typo

[Loupelou]

I feel for you. :grouphug:

 

I actually did a lot of stewing and ranting about a situation in my extended family recently, until I realized it was hurting my family at home. This may sound silly but I found a great outlet in writing down my feelings, what I thought, what I would say, like a letter. I read it, in my case prayed about it, asked for closure, and that was it. I never shared it with the offending party because I knew it would cause even more trouble and the problem wouldn't be fixed. It was a real load off my mind.:001_smile:

[Word Nerd]

WWYD?

 

Nothing. This isn't your battle to fight. As frustrating as it is, they are responsible for their own behavior, and nothing you say will change that.

[2cents]

And send a graduation card to N when it's time. No gift or money. Just consider your part done.

 

They do not want any advice from you.

 

So true.

I am experiencing a similar issue with my sister who is financially exploiting our mother. After years of trying to help, I realize now that I was more of a sounding board for my mom's griping about a situation she wouldn't ever remedy. Years of anxiety and lawyer fees to help mom didn't help-she had allowed the situation to go on too long.

 

It sounds like your niece and sister are real losers but your mom is enabling them and co-dependent. They're all running their own agendas.

 

Personally, sending the congrats card might be a little bit of an eye-opener for your mom. Maybe if she sees a few "congratulations on all your hard work' kinda cards and how N takes all the credit she might wise up or at least feel a little put out. I wonder what she will do now that N is graduated? Is your mom planning to go to graduate school? :lol:

[2cents]

Well, I'd send the congrats card co-addressed, but then I haven't had my full ration of coffee today yet.

 

Honey, you're living a distance from your family. A physical distance. Its time to start allowing that to be an emotional distance as well. They are never going to be the emotionally healthy, NORMAL, rational people you so want them to be. As often as you drag them into the light, they're going to kick and scream and go running back for the shadows. They don't WANT to be saved. They WANT the dark.

 

I know that hurts, and sucks, and you'd give anything to change it. Believe me, oh BELIEVE me, I so know. I truly do. But you can't. You want to save them, but you can't. So quit trying to save them, and save YOU instead.

 

A wonderful friend of mine said to me when I was struggling with the very same sort of issues, "Every moment you spend allowing them to consume you is a moment lost with your children. Every emotion you give them is emotion you've denied your family. Every energy you've wasted on their situation, you've robbed from your life. You need to quit robbing from your family to waste on those who will never change nor appreciate it."

 

He also shared with me a quote from a Franciscan Monk. "You cannot teach pigs to sing. You will only frustrate yourself, and irritate the pigs." Every now and then when I caught myself sliding back into getting entangled into negative family crud, my friend would ask me, "Teaching pigs to sing again?" and I'd pull back and look at the situation. There was one time where he asked, and I answered him in exasperation, "The problem with teaching pigs to sing, is that sometimes when I go to walk away, and one of the buggers starts to HUM behind me!" :lol:

 

Its a hard place to be. I wish you all the best, and please know that I'm speaking from a place of experience, and wanting nothing but peace for you, ok? I'm not trying to be harsh, or mean, so I hope that I haven't come across that way. "Tone" can be hard on a message board. :grouphug:

 

This is such a wonderful and insightful post! Honestly, I am going to print it out and stick it right where I will see it everyday since I'm dealing with a dysfunctional family (thankfully they're at a distance!) too. Everything you said about obsessing on things you can't change robbing you is sooooo true. Thank you for posting this!

[scrapbookbuzz]

You said you've stated your case before and have, basically, been ignored. So, it's time to just bite your tongue and stay out of it. They aren't willing to face 'reality' so they may need to just let it bite them in the behind. I know that sounds harsh but, sometimes, we just have to let people actually feel the consequences of their behaviour.

[G5052]

My mom has Narcissistic Personality Disorder. I managed to see it for what it was in early adulthood and disengage myself into a pretty normal life. I paid for my own college because she wanted oversight of my grades and courses, and she has never liked my husband and almost didn't come to our wedding. My dad was very passive and let her have her way. I live many states away thankfully. As she's aged, vascular dementia made it even worse to the point that I've had to block her calls. I have a file of letters that would shock anyone. To my never-married brother, she can do no wrong, and I'm the one always causing problems. He lives in another state, but she still buys most of his clothes and almost the only vacations he has taken in the last 20 years are to go home.

 

When Dad died, I went out for the funeral and burial and spent a week there getting her affairs in order. It was shocking to see how she makes sure that she is always the center of attention and how she orders people around who will bend to her will. She even had the 92-year-old neighbor doing yard work for her for no pay, and had friends driving her places with only 10 minutes notice. Behind closed doors, she has nothing but contempt for everyone around her. I got things done and had to constantly set boundaries with her, but she was civil to me to the entire time. That changed when I got home, and we had to block the calls again. My brother thinks I'm making things sound worse than they are.

 

So I'm not calling my mother and brother anymore. I'm not going to pretend like anything's normal there, and as far as I'm concerned, my life is here. My husband thinks that I shouldn't even go to her funeral when the time comes because I'll have to deal with all the friends who worshipped her. Arg...

Edited June 4, 2009 by GVA

[KidsHappen]

You have said your piece. They are not going to change so it is time for you to disengage and move on. If it irritates you and you just can't get it off your mind, come here and rant. It is what we are here for. Also try journaling. Sometimes it just help to get the thoughts out of your head and off of your chest. Telling other people or putting on paper helps do that. ANd then your have more brain power and energy to deal with the things in your life that you can actually do something about. :grouphug:

[Chris in VA]

send a graduation card to N when it's time

 

Heck no. Send your mom one.

[Remudamom]

Shake the dust off girl. Right off. Because to me the other alternative would be ripping N's head off and crushing her spinal cord. Socially unacceptable.

[Impish]

This is such a wonderful and insightful post! Honestly, I am going to print it out and stick it right where I will see it everyday since I'm dealing with a dysfunctional family (thankfully they're at a distance!) too. Everything you said about obsessing on things you can't change robbing you is sooooo true. Thank you for posting this!

Thank you so much for understanding what I was trying to say. I worry that on a message board, things don't come across the way you mean them to :001_smile:

 

I've been very blessed to have had some wonderful people in my life along the way. Very blessed.

 

GVA, my mother has never been formally dx'd but I've read the criteria, and that fits her like a glove. You have my deepest sympathies, from one daughter to another :grouphug: My mother *didn't* come to my wedding, using the excuse that it was across country to not attend her only daughter's wedding...yet went on a vacation shortly after.

[PineFarmMom]

Heck no. Send your mom one.

 

That's what I was thinking. :lol:

 

I guess at this point, I'd be asking what my motives were for saying anything else. You know they won't listen, so correction won't be the purpose. The only other choice will be to try to prove your point, which is a very valid point, but won't be heeded by either. They will attribute your opinion to all manner of wrong on your part. Sadly, when your niece gets a job and is blind and ignorant of the skills she needs and blames your mom for "helping" her, the proof will be in the pudding. They both will suffer the consequences. She'll suffer the consequences of her own laziness and your mom will suffer disdain from your niece for having not believed she could do the work herself and for having enabled her. At this time, it will just be pearls before swine. It stinks sitting and watching someone make choices that will wreck their life, speaking, and realizing they just won't listen. :(

[Night Elf]

No, you wouldn't be like them, just smiling and pretending. Everyone knows how you feel. You can't make them change. If any of it ever comes up, say you don't agree with what is going on and then leave it at that. Don't ever do anything that makes you a part of the situation. But honestly, you can't tell your sister how to raise her daughter anymore than you would listen to someone else tell you how to raise your children. Right? Disengage yourself emotionally from the situation. It is what it is. Your immediate family isn't like that. You're okay.

 

As for the graduation card, send a Best Wishes type of card instead.

[Night Elf]

...but just the other day, learning that my N "HATES" my mom after all these years of "helping" her just made me ill.

 

So how would you feel about the people and the situation if she had said she LOVED your mom. That seems to have negative connotations as well, doesn't it?

[joannqn]

Yeah, You all are right. I really don't "stew" about it..I have disengaged to a huge extent where "they" are concerned...but just the other day, learning that my N "HATES" my mom after all these years of "helping" her just made me ill.

 

Actually, this reaction is normal in a co-dependent relationship. No one likes a co-dependent person, even if they are using them.

 

There's this part of me that feels like this is an injustice and it has to be righted....but that is dumb, leftover crap from the family circus. I guess it's not an injustice if it's what they all want, huh? Thanks guys. Especially for the advice to send a card, say nothing, pray for them and live my own life. That's exactly what I will do. :001_smile:

 

There's no injustice. Your mother chose her life and continues to choose her life. When/If she is ready, she'll begin her journey out of co-dependence. It's a long, hard journey, but it can be done.... but only if the co-dependent is willing.

 

The advise you've been given is right on. It isn't your battle to fight. Trying to fight it is wasting your time and energy on people who don't want your help. Pray for them. Live your own life. Don't feel obligated to do anything, even send a simple card, at graduation.

[Night Elf]

Shake the dust off girl. Right off. Because to me the other alternative would be ripping N's head off and crushing her spinal cord. Socially unacceptable.

 

:smilielol5: Priceless!!

[Marylou]

Actually, this reaction is normal in a co-dependent relationship. No one likes a co-dependent person, even if they are using them.

 

 

 

I was thinking the same thing. If you're using someone, then you are not loving them in the first place!

 

Now, about hating . . .maybe N didn't know how to get Grandma off her back and just gave in. Maybe what she really means is that she hates herself for letting the codependency go on for so long.

 

I'm sorry you have to go through this.

 

Regardless, I would still be quiet about it. And as NightElf said, send a "Best Wishes" card.

 

Now stop looking at this thread!

[katemary63]

He also shared with me a quote from a Franciscan Monk. "You cannot teach pigs to sing. You will only frustrate yourself, and irritate the pigs." :lol:

 

 

 

This is awesome! Thanks.

 

I know all you are saying. I am 45 and have been through this and come out on the other side. I AM "saved". I guess things like this just "rear their ugly head" every so often, huh? My way of thinking was something like this....do you just "sit idly by" and watch this go on? It just seems wrong. Like condoning a crime sort of thing. And no, I really didn't have in mind to change anyone or "fix" the situation so much as to say, "I don't go along with stuff like this! I have the guts to stand up against it" But....again...that's sort of not my place in THEIR life as many have mentioned.

[katemary63]

I feel for you. :grouphug:

 

I actually did a lot of stewing and ranting about a situation in my extended family recently, until I realized it was hurting my family at home. This may sound silly but I found a great outlet in writing down my feelings, what I thought, what I would say, like a letter. I read it, in my case prayed about it, asked for closure, and that was it. I never shared it with the offending party because I knew it would cause even more trouble and the problem wouldn't be fixed. It was a real load off my mind.:001_smile:

 

Great suggestion. I have done this at other times in my life and it really does help. Thanks!

[Tree House Academy]

It sounds like they really don't want your advice. I wouldn't say anything.

 

I take it from your post that you are letting this situation eat at you. I have a dysfunctional family as well, and I have to emotionally detach myself from situations like this. I would try very hard not to let what's going on with them take up that much space in my head. Don't dwell on it, it will only eat at you and cause you stress you don't need.

 

 

:iagree:

[katemary63]

Actually, this reaction is normal in a co-dependent relationship. No one likes a co-dependent person, even if they are using them.

 

This is so true! I even told my mom that awhile back. I TOLD her that she was not fostering love for herself in Rachel, but disrespect. She just poo-pooed me.

 

But, hey..thanks everybody! You are all so smart!

[G5052]

GVA, my mother has never been formally dx'd but I've read the criteria, and that fits her like a glove. You have my deepest sympathies, from one daughter to another :grouphug: My mother *didn't* come to my wedding, using the excuse that it was across country to not attend her only daughter's wedding...yet went on a vacation shortly after.

 

 

In psychological circles that's actually a fairly new term. I was going through some counselling over a year ago on other issues and of course everything with my mom came up in the process. The psychologist used that term several times, and it did help me see just how toxic she is and that it was a mercy that I separated myself from her will when I did. Shortly after that my aunt (my mom's sister) also went for counselling because she has NEVER gotten along at all with her and feels guilty about that, and the psychologist there used the same term.

 

I could tell stories. The ones related to my father's last months and the aftermath of his death are horrible. But I won't. That's behind me, and my life is many states away from her.

[Desert Rat]

Yup. I wouldn't say anything. If it doesn't DIRECTLY involve me, I stay out of family drama. It's the only way I've been able to stay sane for this long. Of course, I'm making a big assumption there--with the sanity part. :0

[gardening momma]

There's this part of me that feels like this is an injustice and it has to be righted....

From my POV, there is an injustice...your niece is cheating. She's cheating her college, and she's cheating whoever hires her thinking she has a degree. She isn't getting the education her college and future employers (and clients, customers, etc) think she's getting.

[katemary63]

From my POV, there is an injustice...your niece is cheating. She's cheating her college, and she's cheating whoever hires her thinking she has a degree. She isn't getting the education her college and future employers (and clients, customers, etc) think she's getting.

 

Yes, this does bother me quite a bit. But I am not seeing any way for ME to right it. :confused:

[SquirrellyMama]

I think it is probably a good idea not to say anything but me being me would find a way to let the school know. I don't like confrontation. I prefer the more passive-aggressive approach :001_smile:

[gardening momma]

I think it is probably a good idea not to say anything but me being me would find a way to let the school know.

:iagree:

The least you could do is contact the college (perhaps the department that is the most affected) and tell them that you are a relative of so-and-so, and you know that she is having someone else do her work. I don't know if they would ask you further questions, but you might be able to leave it in their hands at that point.

[mommaduck]

I think it is probably a good idea not to say anything but me being me would find a way to let the school know.

 

:iagree:

[Audrey]

I have no idea what you should, but that statement from N about your mother --- that is so horrible! What a snotty, little ingrate!!

 

If someone said that about my mother, after my mother had done so much for them, I'd let 'em have it with both barrels -- up one side and down the other! I would make her cry like a whipped puppy.

 

You probably shouldn't do that. But, I'm really mean when it comes to people abusing my family.

Edited June 4, 2009 by Audrey

[Rosie_0801]

I think the most appropriate reaction is to go and hug your daughter and tell her how glad you are she's a civilised person.

 

Rosie

[katemary63]

I think the most appropriate reaction is to go and hug your daughter and tell her how glad you are she's a civilised person.

 

Rosie

 

:iagree:

[katemary63]

I have no idea what you should, but that statement from N about your mother --- that is so horrible! What a snotty, little ingrate!!

 

If someone said that about my mother, after my mother had done so much for them, I'd let 'em have it with both barrels -- up one side and down the other! I would make her cry like a whipped puppy.

 

You probably shouldn't do that. But, I'm really mean when it comes to people abusing my family.

 

I agree with this too! I just got Sooooooo miffed at her. I am glad I don't live closer, I might not had taken the time to think about it before I let her have it!

Edited June 5, 2009 by katemary63

[kalanamak]

DD mentioned Grama and N says, "Oh, I HATE her. I can't stand being around her!" DD is shocked and says, "What about all the stuff she does for you for school?' and N says, "Yeah, I know. That's why I put up with her."

 

 

In short, no.

 

And what do you expect from a cheat? Can't get silk out of a sow's ear.

Edited June 6, 2009 by kalanamak

[ravengal]

You cannot make anyone do anything.

 

You cannot make your mother behave in an emotionally healthy way. You've already tried getting her to see her error and change her way. You cannot be faulting for 'standing idly by'. But, now your part is done. If she ever comes to you for help or advice, well, give it. For now, step aside. It's her life. It's her decisions. They are not yours to own or feel ashamed about.

 

You cannot make your niece appreciative of your mother or your mother's actions. If she were to have a conversation with you about your mother, you would be free to comment on her horrid use of your mother. If. Until then, there is no part for you in this. Her feelings and words are not yours to own or feel ashamed of.

 

In my experience, if you'd like to see positive change in your family, you must stop owning these people's mistakes, complaining about these people to other family members (husband excluded ;) ), lecturing these people about their misbehavior, and otherwise being unfriendly and overbearing. Show them respect as fellow human beings free to make their own choices. Show them love, compassion, and concern that doesn't require good behavior to be received.

 

Excellent advice. Thank you. I'm copying this into my Opera notes feature to reread as needed.

[Denisemomof4]

this is so sad on all levels. Your niece is NOT doing herself or your mother ANY good, and the fact that your mother continually bends over backwards for her actually has made her lost all respect for your mother. How sad.

 

Your sister sitting by and watching it all is failing your mother AND her daughter. I can't believe she's ok with what's going.

 

And then there's you - the black sheep of the family because you're the NORMAL one and they're so dysfunctional. So there's a disconnect because of that and it's one I felt all my life. But that disconnect became a blessing recently when I TRULY realized how messed up my sister and brother are, and how my parents, who truly WERE good parents but TOTALLY enabled my siblings (my brother had absolutely EVERYTHING done for him by my parents), and I'm SO thankful NOW, at 46, that I AM so different from them.

 

Because you're normal you see the injustice of this all. That's good. But it's time not to get yourself emotionally invested in their business. If they want to live their lives in such a state, that's their choice. Be thankful that you're NOT like that and lift them up in prayer. Honestly, what else can you do?

 

I've had to bite my tongue for years and years. I had to learn not to say anything and not to care about the obviously wrong ways things were being handled. I felt VERY sad for all of them. And now there's no reason to. My dad passed away in August, my mother is lost to dementia. I really, really miss them both, even though mom lives with me. Oh yeah, being the only NORMAL one (honestly, I don't think I'm being truthful to say that about myself!) :tongue_smilie: I'm the one to take care of my mother. Being so different was a source of great pain earlier in life, and I'll mention again that I'm so glad I am now. You should be too. Can you imagine living in that dysfunction? No Thank You!!! Unfortunately it's how they choose to live. How sad.

[FlockOfSillies]

DD needs to get it on tape. It probably won't help much, but there you go.

[ConnieB]

How very sad I feel for your Niece. Yeah, she's quite a number....but ya'll know that in a couple of years this same girl is going to be complaining loudly about being fired from yet another job. While she'll of course complain that she was unfairly fired, the fact will likely be that they hired her because she had a degree in whatever.....and then when she started working it will be obvious she may have the piece of paper, but she doesn't have the knowledge. (Of course, maybe then they should hire Grandma!). And the sad part is that Niece will NEVER really understand it. Learning is not about having the books on the shelf....it's about opening the books and pouring the knowledge into your brain. And she hasn't done this.

 

I also feel very sad for the Grandma.....what she's doing is absolutely wrong, but how sad that this woman craves loves so much that she'll ruin her own granddaughter's future for it.....and not even realize that she isn't truly getting the love she craves. To be honest, I hope that no one ever tells this woman the mean and hateful things that Niece has said about her. Even for all her wrongs, no one deserves that pain.

 

As for OP...I think you already answered your question. No one will listen to you, and it obviously pains you greatly to deal with this issue. So, you need to let it go. As others have said, you can't change people. But more importantly you are doing yourself harm by taking on their problems. You may actually find that unburdening yourself onto a professional might help you to let it go....letting go is very difficult to do alone. But until you do, you will feel this rage and it does and will continue to affect other areas of your life.

[ConnieB]

:iagree:

The least you could do is contact the college (perhaps the department that is the most affected) and tell them that you are a relative of so-and-so, and you know that she is having someone else do her work. I don't know if they would ask you further questions, but you might be able to leave it in their hands at that point.

 

You know this was my first reaction as well....someone should turn her in! But then I realized that even if OP isn't the one that turns her in....if instead a wise professor realizes that a student who gets great grades on paper can't hold her own in class....and starts nosing around......OP is going to be blamed for it even then. And the family rift that this will undoubtedly cause will be MAJOR. I mean really, if Niece doesn't care, if Mom doesn't care and if Grandma doesn't care about what it's doing to Niece's future......well, getting Niece kicked out of college isn't going to change their feelings either. In fact, it will instead give them someone else to focus their anger on....OP. And she simply doesn't need that anguish for trying to do right by her Niece.

 

There are so many people in our life that we know are going down the wrong path....and we so desperately want to guide them back to the right path. But the fact is that you can only help people who are willing to be helped. These three generations do not want your help.

 

So before you consider turning her in, you have to ask whether it's worth it. It's not going to change Niece (and probably not mom or grandma either), so really the one that will be truly hurt would be OP by being ostracized. Noble gesture that nets zero in return.

 

But....on the other hand a part of me loves the idea of seeing these folks get their comeuppance. Too bad there wasn't a way to turn her in and make it clear that it wasn't OP that did it. Part of me says......Hmmm...tell me her name and college and I'll tell them. I wouldn't care about the wrath of Niece/Mom/Grandma and I'd make sure that the college told them it was me that turned her in.....let them stew for a long time wondering who I am and how I knew, lol. But at least it would get OP off the hook. Hmmmmm