Need Perspective - Friendship Breakup (AITA)

[Clarita]

13 minutes ago, goldberry said:

I'm kind of feeling like this reconnection is not something I want to engage in. But I don't want to trash the whole friendship either.  Thoughts?

It would be a hard no for me, at this time. 

I would probably respond with:

It was heartbreaking for me to hear that you have been harboring this resentment against me. We can reengage when you are ready to talk things over.

I don't know if I worded that well, it probably can be better. Basically I would let her know that as much as she is in the hurt space and feeling unsafe with you over what happened 20 years ago, you are now in that space with her because of what she did recently. As much as she should have what she needs to heal over what you did, you have needs to heal over what she did to you. 

 

[bolt.]

23 minutes ago, goldberry said:

 feel like she's telling me she expects whatever interactions we have to be on her terms 100 percent, which might involve me specifically not "defending myself". Am I reading this wrong? I'm kind of feeling like this reconnection is not something I want to engage in. But I don't want to trash the whole friendship either.  Thoughts?

You are absolutely correct. She has communicated her expectations clearly, and you have understood them perfectly. You also know how you feel about that and what you (don't) want to do.

Total clarity.

Great work.

If you don't want to "trash the whole friendship" your reply could be something like, "Let's wait a bit longer and keep it to texting until we both feel a little more settled about things."

[TechWife]

2 hours ago, Clarita said:

…Basically I would let her know that as much as she is in the hurt space and feeling unsafe with you over what happened 20 years ago, you are now in that space with her because of what she did recently. As much as she should have what she needs to heal over what you did, you have needs to heal over what she did to you. 

 

This is worded very well. She needs to realize that as much as she thinks you hurt her, she hurt you by her recent statements & reactions. She needs to own that she did not handle her problems well and in the process hurt you and work towards reconciliation of that specific problem. Until then I don’t think she’s safe. She can acknowledge that without delving into whatever bothered her.  That has to be repaired first. 

Working off of what Clarita said you could simply respond that when she’s ready to talk about how she hurt you as a starting point, then you aren’t able to consider reconciling. 

 

[KungFuPanda]

She thinks she's setting and enforcing boundaries because she heard somewhere that's a good thing.  However, it seems like she won't even know what those boundaries ARE until you cross them and she's offended.  It's a trap.  Leave a LOT of time and distance for her to get it together.  I wouldn't pursue her until she's less volatile.  Maybe set an alarm to check in in six months and see if her response is less chaotic.

[maize]

On 11/6/2023 at 8:47 PM, goldberry said:

You make some good points, but really this has only started the last couple years. She has been a good friend, supportive, showing up for me, caring and involved in my life. That's why this has been so shocking.  I've been "used" by friends before, and she never made me feel that way. 

You're right that I shouldn't keep overthinking everything. I felt from the beginning that it wasn't normal to drag up things from that far back, that's part of why I posted, to get confirmation of that.  

Could she be depressed?

I've seen in multiple people the way that depression changes perceptions--including memories! 

When a person is stuck in a place of darkness and pain, they can literally lose the ability to imagine or remember anything else. They forget all the good times and all positive emotions, and only remember negatives--and that can include framing experiences as negative that they didn't experience as negative at the time.

Psychologists call this mood-dependent memory or mood-congruent memory; here's an explanation of some of what may be going on, from this article https://web.colby.edu/cogblog/2020/11/20/mood-congruent-memory-and-depression-a-vicious-unrelenting-cycle/ :

Ok, let’s now go back to the beginning and tie this all together: Individuals with depression retrieve depressing memories because of encoding specificity –– the match in mood state at the times of encoding and retrieval increases memory accessibility. Depressing memories are so relevant to individuals with depression that they can automatically activate other mood-congruent memories, regardless of their accuracy. The problem, though, is not just the access to depressing memories, but also the difficulty eliminating them: The harmful memories persist, reinforcing the constant depressed mood and sustaining a toxic cycle of unhappy emotions and distressing memories. And, on top of all of that, people who are (and who used to be) depressed show dysfunction in brain regions that should be helping them break this cycle and feel better.

[J-rap]

I think I'd look at it two ways.  

1)  She's depressed and going through some kind of hard time that you might not really understand, and you believe she's in a mentally unhealthy and unstable place and want to help her.  That means you won't take anything she says personally but will let her know that you're there for her, and you can keep in touch now and then to let her know you're thinking of her and you care.

or

2)  I'd feel kind of exhausted by the whole thing -- Not worrying about her well-being, and not in agreement with how she's dealing with stuff and blaming it on you.  Then I'd text her something like, "Okay, sounds like you have some things to sort through.  I'm here when you're ready to resume our friendship!  I love you!"

Edited December 26, 2023 by J-rap

[Catwoman]

Honestly, she sounds like a self-absorbed jerk. I wouldn't have the time nor the emotional energy to invest in trying to save that friendship. If I bothered to respond to her at all, I would probably just wish her well and move on.

[goldberry]

23 minutes ago, Catwoman said:

Honestly, she sounds like a self-absorbed jerk. I wouldn't have the time nor the emotional energy to invest in trying to save that friendship. If I bothered to respond to her at all, I would probably just wish her well and move on.

It's been a 40 year friendship. 😥 The most important person in my life outside my husband.

[Mom_to3]

25 minutes ago, goldberry said:

It's been a 40 year friendship. 😥 The most important person in my life outside my husband.

Keep the door open for when she is able to talk about your relationship - tell her this^. I would not agree to her current terms - it's not going to end well. I sounds like she needs a friend, but is barely keeping it together. You will feel like you are constantly walking on eggshells. I am so sorry.

[goldberry]

So, I responded this:

I'm so sad and sorry for whatever all you are going through, the things you can no longer share with me. I can't pretend I don't feel ripped apart inside and don't feel lost and confused about how we got here. I don't think having more interactions where we are both not being honest will help anything. So maybe let's give it some more time. I love you and I always will.

She responded furiously, that of course I had to control everything like always, and to stop sending her my "occasional insincere texts to see how she was doing when that clearly was all about me and nothing to do with her".

So yeah! 😔

Thank you guys though, because I have a tendency to overthink that I responded badly to make her act that way.  You guys give me some perspective to keep me from overthinking. I tried to word my responses carefully as best I could.

[saraha]

Oh @goldberry, I’m sorry that was the response.

[DeainUSA]

I can't even believe she started this up on Christmas Day for you.  That's inappropriate to me.

[Clarita]

I am so sad your friend responded in this way. 

[Tiberia]

It’s like she’s playing a game with you and she keeps changing the rules. At first she said if you’re unwilling to reconnect on her terms, no worries. You basically said that you’re unwilling to reconnect on her terms, and to give it more time. And she accused you of being controlling. But she gave you the option that you took, and now she’s mad. 
 

I don’t think she realizes what she’s doing. She’s hurt, depressed, whatever, and sees your interactions through a lens that doesn’t make sense. It’s her, not you. She is trying to set boundaries, but is not doing a very good job with it. You set a boundary, and now you’re getting a reaction.

I’m so sorry. I know this has to be baffling and painful. I would cherish the memories you have with her, but don’t put a whole lot of energy into the current relationship. It has changed and may never be what it was. It’s ok to grieve what’s gone.

[fraidycat]

I'm sorry. I don't think there is anything left for you to do except grieve the death of the relationship and the person she was. She is a self-centered jerk who refuses to take any responsibility for her actions and choices.

Even if you do reconnect at some point in the future, it will not be the same because the trust is gone. You will never trust her the same again. 

[goldberry]

11 hours ago, Tiberia said:

It’s like she’s playing a game with you and she keeps changing the rules. At first she said if you’re unwilling to reconnect on her terms, no worries. You basically said that you’re unwilling to reconnect on her terms, and to give it more time. And she accused you of being controlling. But she gave you the option that you took, and now she’s mad. 
 

I don’t think she realizes what she’s doing. She’s hurt, depressed, whatever, and sees your interactions through a lens that doesn’t make sense. It’s her, not you. She is trying to set boundaries, but is not doing a very good job with it. You set a boundary, and now you’re getting a reaction.

I’m so sorry. I know this has to be baffling and painful. I would cherish the memories you have with her, but don’t put a whole lot of energy into the current relationship. It has changed and may never be what it was. It’s ok to grieve what’s gone.

In a normal relationship you reach terms you both feel good about. I wasn't insisting, "no, we will talk about this now, even though you've said you're not ready!" I was acknowledging her desires and adding my own, "okay, then let's just wait until you are ready since my desire is not to set up unhelpful conversations".

The vitriol is totally out of proportion to anything happening. Sadly you are right, it's time to just grieve now. 

[Spryte]

I am so sorry. That sounds confusing and hurtful. More than hurtful — heartrending. 

However, I do think you’ve done what you can, and that you have been kind, understanding and thoughtful in your responses to her. You are a good friend to her, even in the face of everything. I’m sorry that she doesn’t see that.

Grieving is never easy. Be kind to yourself now, too, and know that you’ve done the very best you could have done. Sending lots of support.
 

 

[forty-two]

It sounds like she might be judging your actions solely by their effect on *her*, with no consideration for the intrinsic nature of the action or your motivations - a sadly common issue these days. 

Also, it may be that when she sent the initial text she was feeling upbeat or strong or otherwise able to handle the task of rekindling your friendship, but by the time when she received your response, she'd lost whatever energy she'd had when she sent the original text.  Or that her desire to reconnect was stronger than her ability to deal with complicated emotions.  When I was seriously depressed, I was a rotten judge of what I could handle - in optimistic moments I was forever writing checks that my depressed self was in fact incapable of covering when they came due.  It took years for me to gain enough perspective to make realistic judgments about what I could *actually* do.

The fact she tried at all to reconnect is a sign she *does* care about you and her friendship, even if her (immature) attempts at reaching out are hurting you instead of helping <sigh>.  None of that makes her current behavior any easier to live with, but it's highly likely it's not about your actions but about her (lack of) ability to deal with life.

[SKL]

At this point, my gut is saying you're at the "if you love something, let it go" stage with this friend.

It feels like she's being influenced by people who are only interested in one side of the story, but she's a grown-up.  She's the only person who can decide whether a 40-year friendship is worth anything to her.

Nothing she's said in the past year or so has indicated she values the friendship at all.  So, I guess she doesn't, and I guess it's time to grieve.

I also feel like she's having a little too much fun dragging OP's heart around.

[SKL]

Maybe I'd respond "OK, let me know if you change your mind."  But then that would be my last unsolicited text. 

If she ever did respond, I would hold her to the standards I hold casual friends to.  In other words, she is not invited to smack you.  If she ever reaches out again, I'd consider having a coffee in a location where I could get up and walk out at any time, where we could talk about nice neutral topics agreed in advance.  "What books and movies have you enjoyed lately?"

[Catwoman]

16 hours ago, goldberry said:

It's been a 40 year friendship. 😥 The most important person in my life outside my husband.

I’m so sorry. 😞 

But look at it this way – if your husband was treating you the way this woman is treating you, and he wasn’t willing to work with you on the relationship, and he wasn’t willing to discuss anything with you, and he insisted on controlling every last aspect of your communication, many of us would be telling you that it was time to see a divorce lawyer.

Just because this woman has been your friend for 40 years doesn’t give her a free pass to treat you like dirt. You deserve better.

[Catwoman]

2 hours ago, fraidycat said:

I'm sorry. I don't think there is anything left for you to do except grieve the death of the relationship and the person she was. She is a self-centered jerk who refuses to take any responsibility for her actions and choices.

Even if you do reconnect at some point in the future, it will not be the same because the trust is gone. You will never trust her the same again. 

I agree! 

Goldberry has been far nicer to this woman than I would have been. 

[pinball]

On 12/25/2023 at 2:35 PM, goldberry said:

So, since I posted this I've sent her a few polite but distant texts "thinking of you" sort of things. She responded a couple times with short responses.  Today I got this text:

In a couple of weeks I might be ready to connect a lil bit on the phone. I'f you're wanting to hash out the stuff between us or want explanations or gonna feel the need to defend yourself more... I'm not gonna be in a space to do that for a long time. If you feel you don't want to connect on my terms ... no worries. Letting you know what I can do and in what appropriate timeframe. 

I responded:

What would that look like, just so I understand? Like just chit chat surface stuff like we were earlier this year? Nothing serious or just nothing serious about us? You still do not feel safe sharing anything about your real life with me? I'm asking so I can think about how I would feel resuming interaction with you on that level, not asking for explanation, I hear you that you don't want to give that.

She responded:

I can't tell you exactly how the conversation will go. What happens organically happens. I'm not up to being interrogated. If you need more than that to decide ...that's all I can give right now. I can't do a back and forth. Ttul.

So first, I felt like I tried really hard to be respectful in my response, but she still took that as interrogating. Second, I feel like she's telling me she expects whatever interactions we have to be on her terms 100 percent, which might involve me specifically not "defending myself". Am I reading this wrong? I'm kind of feeling like this reconnection is not something I want to engage in. But I don't want to trash the whole friendship either.  Thoughts?

I think she clearly told you the type of communication she wanted. Then you responded with 4 questions right in a row.

I don’t blame her for saying she wasn’t up for an interrogation! Four questions in a row is pretty demanding, especially after she was clear about what she wanted.

It’s seems to me you aren’t capable of connecting on her terms.

[Tiberia]

1 hour ago, pinball said:

I think she clearly told you the type of communication she wanted. Then you responded with 4 questions right in a row.

I don’t blame her for saying she wasn’t up for an interrogation! Four questions in a row is pretty demanding, especially after she was clear about what she wanted.

It’s seems to me you aren’t capable of connecting on her terms.

^^^And this is the toxic loop that is running through your friend's brain. You can't use a healthy communication style, because she will see it as an attack. Best to not engage at all. 

[Carol in Cal.]

It sounds to me like what she is saying is that she does not want to have a relationship talk at all right now.  That being so, while I think she is being pretty nutsy, I can see why she would think that your last message basically made having a relationship talk the only condition under which you are willing to have contact.  Her response was OTT, and it sounds like that’s not exactly what you meant, but it’s hard to see how to walk this back in a way that works for both of you right now.  Particularly since based on past history she is unlikely to stick to this herself, but still seems to expect you to do so.  

I don’t honestly know what I would do at this point.  It sounds like ‘polite but distant’ is painful.  I think I might say, you’re misinterpreting my comments, hope you have a nice New Year.  And then leave that ball in her court.

Edited December 26, 2023 by Carol in Cal.

[Mom_to3]

This is not about you. There is something going on in this person's life - she misses you but can't articulate it. Your last text was very special, and perhaps your (former) will realize what she is doing once she is able to get a handle of whatever else is going on. In the meantime, I would not expect anything from this relationship, but also think that perhaps a year from now, or later, the two of you will be able to reconnect. I am sorry - this is so hard.

[Katy]

I’m sorry to hear what happened today. I think you responded perfectly. If it helps, if she’s never shown this type of behavior before (towards anyone), I’m 100% convinced she’s got something neurological going on. Maybe depression. Maybe severe inflammation in another part of her body triggering mental illness. Maybe undiagnosed early dementia. 

If she has done this before but focused it on others, she might have BPD, or like my mom, show symptoms of BPD when depressed. 

[goldberry]

2 hours ago, Carol in Cal. said:

It sounds to me like what she is saying is that she does not want to have a relationship talk at all right now.  That being so, while I think she is being pretty nutsy, I can see why she would think that your last message basically made having a relationship talk the only condition under which you are willing to have contact. 

...

  Particularly since based on past history she is unlikely to stick to this herself, but still seems to expect you to do so.  

She's accused my of some pretty crappy behavior. Obviously I've deeply hurt her (without meaning to), but she has also hurt me. I had the feeling she expected to be able to say whatever she felt and I shouldn't challenge in order to "prove myself" to her.  I'm not okay with that kind of interaction. But also didn't think it would really HELP anything in the relationship either.   It would only imbed the dysfunction further. 

[Carol in Cal.]

16 minutes ago, goldberry said:

She's accused my of some pretty crappy behavior. Obviously I've deeply hurt her (without meaning to), but she has also hurt me. I had the feeling she expected to be able to say whatever she felt and I shouldn't challenge in order to "prove myself" to her.  I'm not okay with that kind of interaction. But also didn't think it would really HELP anything in the relationship either.   It would only imbed the dysfunction further. 

I completely agree, that’s what I meant by holding you to a standard that she won’t hold herself to.  Not OK, for sure.  Definitely not in the long run.

[Catwoman]

25 minutes ago, goldberry said:

She's accused my of some pretty crappy behavior. Obviously I've deeply hurt her (without meaning to), but she has also hurt me. I had the feeling she expected to be able to say whatever she felt and I shouldn't challenge in order to "prove myself" to her.  I'm not okay with that kind of interaction. But also didn't think it would really HELP anything in the relationship either.   It would only imbed the dysfunction further. 

Obviously you don't have to answer this, but what could you have possibly done to make her behave this way toward you? Everything happened decades ago, right? And she forgave you then, but now she's taking back her forgiveness? 

She is toxic and as @SKL said in an earlier post, she seems to be enjoying hurting you a little too much. 

RUN away from her. Seriously. And try to forget about feeling sad or hurt. Let yourself be angry instead. That woman doesn't deserve your grief.

[goldberry]

2 hours ago, Catwoman said:

Obviously you don't have to answer this, but what could you have possibly done to make her behave this way toward you? Everything happened decades ago, right? And she forgave you then, but now she's taking back her forgiveness?

 @SKL

She's going back decades but including more recent things that she assigned bad motives to.

Examples: I am VERY happily married, but she has accused me of trying to get attention from her husband and "competing" with her. (3 years ago) Her husband is a complete ass. During my daughter's graduation party (5-ish years ago) there was an incident where she was talking loudly about a topic we both knew was really touchy to my husband, so I kept giving her a "zip it" look when I went by. She then asked in the midst of all these people as i was walking by "why are you being so crappy to me" and I ignored her because we were in the middle of everyone. The next day we were engaging normally, she never said anything, we had a couple more days of fun visiting. I guess I should have come back to it but she didn't seem bothered by it later so I just forgot about it. 

Only recently she brought it up as an example of how I "treat her as less than, not really family, like I don't want her around, etc" I honestly barely remembered the incident, that interaction was the extent of it. The rest of the party I was introducing her around as "my best friend of 40 years!" She was a lot more snippy to me at her daughter's wedding, but I just blew it off, because wedding.

Both of these examples were never brought up at the time, only now. If I had known how she was feeling I would have apologized and reassured her.  She's been keeping a list of grievances she never said anything about but confirm whatever her narrative is. I feel like she has some deep insecurities and has projected that onto our friendship. I agree with the other posters who said she's trying to take control and set boundaries but is being destructive with it. She has always let the men in her life treat her badly.

I confess I feel angry after all the crap she has put up with from men, I'm the one she decides to cut off. 😕

Thanks to all for listening to my drama. It's been helpful to me to vent and process. 

 

[SKL]

It seems you already provided her with info to debunk / correct her view of things.  She's not in a place where she can process your side properly.  You defending yourself harder isn't going to fix that.  Honestly, the more you insist on pleading your case, the more it seems to be about you being right / vindicated vs. rehabbing the friendship.

[Faith-manor]

Gently, there is nothing positive that is going to come from continuing to try to rehab this relationship. She has some serious issues, and she is using you as a dumping ground for her frustration, anger, and insecurity about her life. She will continue to do this because any and all attempts you make to placate her or engage her are seen as openings to continue to use you as her personal punching bag.

Also, you mentioned being very happily married, and she has a history of not good partners, rocky relationships. So there is probably some wistful jealousy wrapped up in all of this that she isn't processing and dealing with. I have gone through that before with someone who was going through a nasty time in her marriage, and just got so frustrated and upset because I wasn't in the same boat with her sharing all manner of anger about my husband. I had to let that person go.

40 years is a long time. But people change, people to through things that cause them to sometimes need to break off and start anew. Folks move on, for better or worse. Let her move on. Even if she contacts you in the future, please just let it go, do not take the bait. It is okay. Grieve. She may learn from this or not. If she does, then maybe she can form a new  attachment to someone else and have a healthy friendship. 

Also, I don't know if you are a christian or not, so I will just throw this out there for you, and if it doesn't apply, you can ignore it. "Love keeps no record of wrongs." 1 Cor. 13 She is keeping a laundry list of perceived slights. That means she can't really be a friend. There isn't a loving, supportive friendship when one side does this.

[goldberry]

58 minutes ago, SKL said:

It seems you already provided her with info to debunk / correct her view of things.  She's not in a place where she can process your side properly.  You defending yourself harder isn't going to fix that.  Honestly, the more you insist on pleading your case, the more it seems to be about you being right / vindicated vs. rehabbing the friendship.

Yes I see that. She doesn't want the friendship. I have to accept what is. 

[goldberry]

Thank you for all the perspective. It has really helped solidify what I already know and feel but just didn't want to accept. My heart keeps thinking, there has to be something I can do, or say, or should have done or said. But it's time to just accept what is. 

[pinball]

10 hours ago, goldberry said:

During my daughter's graduation party (5-ish years ago) there was an incident where she was talking loudly about a topic we both knew was really touchy to my husband, so I kept giving her a "zip it" look when I went by. She then asked in the midst of all these people as i was walking by "why are you being so crappy to me" and I ignored her because we were in the middle of everyone. The next day we were engaging normally, she never said anything, we had a couple more days of fun visiting. I guess I should have come back to it but she didn't seem bothered by it later so I just forgot about it. 

ESH

[Ginevra]

On 12/26/2023 at 12:35 AM, Tiberia said:

’s like she’s playing a game with you and she keeps changing the rules. At first she said if you’re unwilling to reconnect on her terms, no worries. You basically said that you’re unwilling to reconnect on her terms, and to give it more time. And she accused you of being controlling. But she gave you the option that you took, and now she’s mad

100%. 
 

Im sorry, Goldberry. She is not being a friend to you, whatever the reason(s). If it were me, I would grieve it as a death and go on with my life without her in it. If she comes to her senses sometime in the future, maybe you can have a friendship again, but for now, she is showing you that isn’t possible. 

[PrairieSong]

The way you describe her reminds me of the borderline person in my life. You have been a good friend and have gone above and beyond for her. She is unwilling and/or unable to do the same. You don't deserve to be treated that way, by her or anyone. 

I am so, so sorry for the loss of your long time friend. I wish you healing and peace.

 

[goldberry]

I feel like she is dealing in counseling with her life-long habit of keeping destructive men in her life.  I have been lumped in with that group.  Unfortunately, she never really gave me the chance of respect to prove otherwise, just kept a tally of all the things that seemed to fit the narrative, never discerning whether or not they were true.

I get it.  My daughter came out of a toxic relationship, and is in a healthy one now.  At the beginning she was super "on-the-lookout" for problematic behaviors, as she should have been, but sometimes went overboard.  And that was a much shorter period of time than we're talking about here.  Even healthy partners can hurt each other.  It just should never be by intention or malice, and should be made better when it's pointed out.   It's sometimes hard to see if this is a bad person who is good sometimes, or a good person who is bad sometimes.  Because we all act less than our best at times.

OT, hubby just brought me home a donut because I've been sad. ❤️

Edited December 27, 2023 by goldberry

[Not_a_Number]

I have a totally different take from most other people. 

Next time she reaches out, just talk to her. Don't ask for clarifications and just let her be where she's at. It sounds like she's hurt and not feeling trust and I don't think any of the texts you sent were a good idea, because they were liable to get misinterpreted -- that's how it goes with text communications when there are hurt feelings.

She sounds like a difficult and emotionally damaged person. It's worth thinking about whether you even want a friendship. But if you do, I don't think this is the right way to engage. 

[goldberry]

On 12/28/2023 at 11:00 PM, Not_a_Number said:

I have a totally different take from most other people. 

Next time she reaches out, just talk to her. Don't ask for clarifications and just let her be where she's at. It sounds like she's hurt and not feeling trust and I don't think any of the texts you sent were a good idea, because they were liable to get misinterpreted -- that's how it goes with text communications when there are hurt feelings.

She sounds like a difficult and emotionally damaged person. It's worth thinking about whether you even want a friendship. But if you do, I don't think this is the right way to engage. 

I get that. It's pretty much what I've been doing for the last year or more. There have been cracks in our friendship that I've tried to address and she has not wanted to discuss. So step by step we've been retreating to this surface level communication. It's only made her anger and resentment build up more, it didn't make anything better. To me that's fine temporarily but not permanently. 

Any of us can find more "acquaintances" in our life, people we are friendly with, but can't be totally ourselves around or honest with.  She has said awful things about me. I don't see it healthy for me to keep investing in a former best friend who now wants to move to acquaintance while still thinking awful things about me that I'm not allowed to address. I was fine all this time giving her more space. But she's telling me she doesn't see that changing.  I can't rationalize it anymore. I feel like I would just be setting myself up as a target for her anger. 

In her romantic relationships there have been serious problems that she has just ignored and carried on like nothing was happening. Horrible hateful arguments that they would just wake up the next day and start talking about the weather. So I get that for her that is not an unusual response. But every time, that just leads to nothing being resolved and the eventual total blowup and destruction of the relationship. I mean, has that philosophy LONG TERM ever worked for anyone? It's been like two years of this for us. So yes, I hear that's what she wants from me right now, but I am not able to continue it, and don't see it ending up well if it did.

 

[Not_a_Number]

3 hours ago, goldberry said:

I get that. It's pretty much what I've been doing for the last year or more. There have been cracks in our friendship that I've tried to address and she has not wanted to discuss. So step by step we've been retreating to this surface level communication. It's only made her anger and resentment build up more, it didn't make anything better. To me that's fine temporarily but not permanently. 

Any of us can find more "acquaintances" in our life, people we are friendly with, but can't be totally ourselves around or honest with.  She has said awful things about me. I don't see it healthy for me to keep investing in a former best friend who now wants to move to acquaintance while still thinking awful things about me that I'm not allowed to address. I was fine all this time giving her more space. But she's telling me she doesn't see that changing.  I can't rationalize it anymore. I feel like I would just be setting myself up as a target for her anger. 

In her romantic relationships there have been serious problems that she has just ignored and carried on like nothing was happening. Horrible hateful arguments that they would just wake up the next day and start talking about the weather. So I get that for her that is not an unusual response. But every time, that just leads to nothing being resolved and the eventual total blowup and destruction of the relationship. I mean, has that philosophy LONG TERM ever worked for anyone? It's been like two years of this for us. So yes, I hear that's what she wants from me right now, but I am not able to continue it, and don't see it ending up well if it did.

 

I’m not suggesting a return a surface level stuff. You’ll need to hash it out with her and not let it build up under the surface. But I still wouldn’t have texted any of that.

I don’t know how to explain. The path I see forward is tricky and uncertain. But it sounds like you really value the friendship, so in your place I’d try it, I think. 

[BusyMom5]

On 12/26/2023 at 11:52 PM, goldberry said:

She's going back decades but including more recent things that she assigned bad motives to.

Examples: I am VERY happily married, but she has accused me of trying to get attention from her husband and "competing" with her. (3 years ago) Her husband is a complete ass. During my daughter's graduation party (5-ish years ago) there was an incident where she was talking loudly about a topic we both knew was really touchy to my husband, so I kept giving her a "zip it" look when I went by. She then asked in the midst of all these people as i was walking by "why are you being so crappy to me" and I ignored her because we were in the middle of everyone. The next day we were engaging normally, she never said anything, we had a couple more days of fun visiting. I guess I should have come back to it but she didn't seem bothered by it later so I just forgot about it. 

Only recently she brought it up as an example of how I "treat her as less than, not really family, like I don't want her around, etc" I honestly barely remembered the incident, that interaction was the extent of it. The rest of the party I was introducing her around as "my best friend of 40 years!" She was a lot more snippy to me at her daughter's wedding, but I just blew it off, because wedding.

Both of these examples were never brought up at the time, only now. If I had known how she was feeling I would have apologized and reassured her.  She's been keeping a list of grievances she never said anything about but confirm whatever her narrative is. I feel like she has some deep insecurities and has projected that onto our friendship. I agree with the other posters who said she's trying to take control and set boundaries but is being destructive with it. She has always let the men in her life treat her badly.

I confess I feel angry after all the crap she has put up with from men, I'm the one she decides to cut off. 😕

Thanks to all for listening to my drama. It's been helpful to me to vent and process. 

 

 

Gently, it sounds like this relationship was something you have clung to when you outgrew her maturity long ago.  Talking about touchy subjects in public is not something a friend would do.  The fact that she's using THIS example as a way that you were hurting her is just cuckoo.  

[katilac]

On 12/30/2023 at 4:22 PM, Not_a_Number said:

I’m not suggesting a return a surface level stuff. You’ll need to hash it out with her and not let it build up under the surface. But I still wouldn’t have texted any of that.

I don’t know how to explain. The path I see forward is tricky and uncertain. But it sounds like you really value the friendship, so in your place I’d try it, I think. 

You are suggesting that she do exactly what she wanted to do, that the other person refused to do. The other person stated that they were not wiling to hash it out, using those exact same words. 

It's a return to surface-level stuff or nothing, because that is what the other person is requiring.