Mask optional in school

[Sneezyone]

With a new Governor installed, our school board seized the opportunity to reverse the mask mandate (never mind that six middle schools were closed a week ago because of COVID absenteeism). I am hopeful that, by tomorrow, a lawsuit will be filed by the parents of immunocompromised students to insure they also have access to in-class instruction. For those operating in mask-optional areas, what else is/has worked?

Edited January 21, 2022 by Sneezyone

[Spryte]

6 minutes ago, Sneezyone said:

With a new Governor installed, our school board seized the opportunity to reverse the mask mandate (never mind that six middle schools were closed a week ago because of COVID absenteeism). I am hopeful that, by tomorrow, a lawsuit will be filed by the parents of immunocompromised students to insure they also have access to in-class instruction. For those operating in mask-optional areas, what else is/has worked?

Our district delightedly voted to dump the mandate, too. Boo.
 

Listening in for ideas.

[Innisfree]

Ours is still considering...

[Faith-manor]

47 minutes ago, Sneezyone said:

With a new Governor installed, our school board seized the opportunity to reverse the mask mandate (never mind that six middle schools were closed a week ago because of COVID absenteeism). I am hopeful that, by tomorrow, a lawsuit will be filed by the parents of immunocompromised students to insure they also have access to in-class instruction. For those operating in mask-optional areas, what else is/has worked?

Nothing. Parents were told "Suck it", and despite there being a law about that, not one damn thing was done. I am pretty certain it is going to take a lot of lawyering up, and a boatload of lawsuits to force the issue.

[TCB]

It seems like it would be a good idea to have mask optional and masked classrooms. Might be a good study on their effectiveness. The lack of concern for vulnerable children or their families is horrible.

[kbutton]

Nothing. 

We have a Test to Stay program just about state wide (our county schools proposed it!), letting students don a mask to stay in school if they become a close contact. They have to test on certain days as well. There are slightly higher requirements for unvaccinated students than vaccinated students, and they have to remain symptom-free.

Two students in that program last week were totally violating this (and they shared enough info in class that people could tell they were in this program even though contacts are not supposed to be identified). One wouldn't wear the mask at all, and the other wore it on his chin.

Additionally, students here have basically stopped wearing masks on the buses even though it's a federal mandate.

I hope schools get the pants successfully sued off them by immunocompromised students. 

[hshibley]

My district is mandatory masks. The surrounding districts were optional. With omicron the surrounding districts that were optional all had to go remote due to staff shortages and then return in person with mandatory masks. That’s been about the only way districts switch back. Even with the closures you still have parents complaining about the mask mandates when students return. 

[Soror]

The local schools have been mask optional all of this year. Omicron is really raging now so I'm waiting to see what happens. They were out M-Thursday this week due to the holiday and weather. I had wished they would have went ahead and cancelled today too to give it a full week break since it is so heavily going around right now. So, very many people dont' test or just don't tell the school. One of dd's best friends brother tested positive and they didn't even tell her school she had a positive case in the house. I told the school as soon as dh tested positive- the kids then had to wear masks and get checked daily by the nurse but of course her parents didn't tell so no mask for her. It is ridiculous. (and her Mom is a lawyer- educated enough to know better). I dont' trust the masks are going to be that much help when you have so many walking around spreading it anyway.

[Dmmetler]

The big district here won a case in circuit Court for exactly that-parents of imkunocompromised and otherwise high risk kids, especially those who had existing 504 plans due to their risk factors filed a 504 case, and the district supported them and took it to court. The result is that masks cannot be mandated in TN-except in schools, where the Governor's executive order was overturned and the legislature's cannot apply as a result. The only district in my county that has had to go virtual due to COVID cases since returning in Jan is the one which has refused to enforce this. 

 

If there are any VA parents who want to file such a suit, my brother is at dCLV in Richmond, and is already researching the case law (and says it's a slam dunk). 

 

[wintermom]

Interesting that this is being pushed at the school board level. Our teacher unions are so strong in our province, and these unions want to keep membership numbers up. So going back into schools without masks would not fly here. Not to mention our provincial government mandates masks, but even if they lifted the mandate I'd be shocked if teachers would agree to being in the classroom without masks.

As you can probably guess, this is not the US, and Canada has been much more cautious in general throughout Covid. 

[TheReader]

As far as I can tell, most of the attempts in our state to override our governor (who actually *banned*  mask mandates entirely) have not succeeded. A lower court grants that yes, districts can do it, then a higher court overturns that, and so forth and so on. It's ended up with all mask optional (and schools also can't go online only, b/c the state also passed a thing where they don't get funding unless they at least offer an in person option). 

If I had an immuno-compromised child, in my state, there's no way I'd trust them to an in person school unless I found a private school that was requiring masks of everyone, and enforcing it. 

Even at my co-op, masks are optional, but our Directors have told us that as teachers, we aren't to enforce it if a child comes in a mask (i.e,, if mom says "Johnny is to mask" we aren't supposed to then police that and make sure he keeps it on all day). 

[Dmmetler]

8 minutes ago, TheReader said:

As far as I can tell, most of the attempts in our state to override our governor (who actually *banned*  mask mandates entirely) have not succeeded. A lower court grants that yes, districts can do it, then a higher court overturns that, and so forth and so on. It's ended up with all mask optional (and schools also can't go online only, b/c the state also passed a thing where they don't get funding unless they at least offer an in person option). 

If I had an immuno-compromised child, in my state, there's no way I'd trust them to an in person school unless I found a private school that was requiring masks of everyone, and enforcing it. 

Even at my co-op, masks are optional, but our Directors have told us that as teachers, we aren't to enforce it if a child comes in a mask (i.e,, if mom says "Johnny is to mask" we aren't supposed to then police that and make sure he keeps it on all day). 

The key seems to be that the parents need to file a 504 complaint against the school district for an existing 504 plan that specifically addresses immunocompromise-and that the student has educational needs that cannot be met in a distance learning/homebound setting (which is actually easy to prove if there was pre/post testing done in, say, Jan 2019 and Jan 2020), and then the school files in FEDERAL court because the state laws/mandates put them in violation of federal law. This is what worked in TN, anyway, and seems to have the highest chance of success. (It also helped that even parents of kids where masks could arguably be an issue were willing to support mask mandates with the occasional exemption (teachers in the district that filed the case are allowed to unmask for language/reading lessons, and certain special ed classes do not mask, but do have extra air purification, etc running). 

 

 

[kokotg]

Our school district did away with the mask mandate in late fall then reinstated it this semester...until January 21. It's maddening because reinstating the mandate at all is an acknowledgement that masks help to keep transmission down in schools (you know, like every study out there also shows), so it makes no sense at all to lift it again while cases are still surging (Georgia as a whole appears to have peaked, but I just read yesterday that numbers are still going straight up for kids over 5. Which is weird because I've been assured over and over again that schools are magical places where covid can't spread). Anyway, this thread just inspired me to fire off my first angry e-mail in awhile to our school superintendent. THAT oughta do it!

[Dmmetler]

2 minutes ago, kokotg said:

Our school district did away with the mask mandate in late fall then reinstated it this semester...until January 21. It's maddening because reinstating the mandate at all is an acknowledgement that masks help to keep transmission down in schools (you know, like every study out there also shows), so it makes no sense at all to lift it again while cases are still surging (Georgia as a whole appears to have peaked, but I just read yesterday that numbers are still going straight up for kids over 5. Which is weird because I've been assured over and over again that schools are magical places where covid can't spread). Anyway, this thread just inspired me to fire off my first angry e-mail in awhile to our school superintendent. THAT oughta do it!

Meanwhile, my kid's college in Georgia went virtual the first two weeks and will be coming back in person Monday-with N95's or equivalents required, and the kids are supposed to make appointments to come in and be fit tested. It's a dramatic difference. 

[QueenCat]

10 hours ago, kbutton said:

Nothing. 

We have a Test to Stay program just about state wide (our county schools proposed it!), letting students don a mask to stay in school if they become a close contact. They have to test on certain days as well. There are slightly higher requirements for unvaccinated students than vaccinated students, and they have to remain symptom-free.

Two students in that program last week were totally violating this (and they shared enough info in class that people could tell they were in this program even though contacts are not supposed to be identified). One wouldn't wear the mask at all, and the other wore it on his chin.

Additionally, students here have basically stopped wearing masks on the buses even though it's a federal mandate.

I hope schools get the pants successfully sued off them by immunocompromised students. 

Ours does Test to Stay too. Masking is optional in our district (and most around here). The one that is still requiring masks has fewer students out... Our district just raised sub pay to address the number of teachers out sick. I doubt it will help. Not all kids count in the numbers the schools report. 

[kokotg]

32 minutes ago, Dmmetler said:

Meanwhile, my kid's college in Georgia went virtual the first two weeks and will be coming back in person Monday-with N95's or equivalents required, and the kids are supposed to make appointments to come in and be fit tested. It's a dramatic difference. 

And the school district that college is in is requiring vaccines for teachers in addition to masks, so the difference isn't just in private colleges vs. public schools. We're right next door, but we have enough angry anti-maskers in certain parts of the county to drown out the more reasonable voices. 

[Farrar]

On a practical level, I think a fight on this issue by nova districts is more likely to get farther than a fight by a blue bubble in a deep red state. I wouldn't let the experiences of others outside Virginia discourage anyone from fighting it specifically there.

[Ting Tang]

My husband thinks my opinion on masking is because I do not have to wear one for several hours a day, and perhaps he is right.  But I also feel that attitudes about masking come from the parents.  I live in an area where the local school voted to be mask optional, but it went to mask required due to the governor's indoor mask mandate. Still, almost every picture I see shows students with masks worn on their chins.  Also, a very vocal anti masker is a public school teacher.  She also believes in colloidal silver as a cure-all and is anti vaccine.

I didn't want my kids to have to wear masks in school all day, so I am glad they are now homeschooled. However, I do require whatever else they do, they wear KF94 masks.  

Schools are hard because these days, kids not only eat lunch there, they also eat breakfast.  So I can see how there are exposures.  Plus some schools didn't really invest in ventilation upgrades or air purification systems.  

I really feel bad for the people who do not have a choice.  (for school… not masking— pro mask here!)

Edited January 21, 2022 by KrisTom

[kokotg]

11 minutes ago, KrisTom said:

My husband thinks my opinion on masking is because I do not have to wear one for several hours a day, and perhaps he is right.  

 

My husband is a teacher who's been wearing a mask 8 hours a day for a year and a half now, and he's very much pro-mask mandate.

[kokotg]

Welp, the school superintendent got back to me already. He told me that the solution is vaccinations, not masks. I look forward to hearing that he's pushing hard for a vaccine mandate in schools, in that case, since he doesn't want one for masks. 

[Ting Tang]

1 minute ago, kokotg said:

My husband is a teacher who's been wearing a mask 8 hours a day for a year and a half now, and he's very much pro-mask mandate.

If my children were in brick and mortar schools, I would want them to have teachers who were as well.  I honestly hate that my tax dollars are supporting someone who is so anti public health measures.  It was not just masking, but quarantine protocols, etc.  

[Dmmetler]

55 minutes ago, kokotg said:

Welp, the school superintendent got back to me already. He told me that the solution is vaccinations, not masks. I look forward to hearing that he's pushing hard for a vaccine mandate in schools, in that case, since he doesn't want one for masks. 

I'll bet you can guess which TN school district has a superintendent who has pushed for vaccine mandates for teachers and made it easy for teachers and students to be vaccinated by arranging on campus clinics, etc...

[Faith-manor]

8 hours ago, KrisTom said:

Also, a very vocal anti masker is a public school teacher.  She also believes in colloidal silver as a cure-all and is anti vaccine.

 

Oy! 😡 People like this should be kicked out of the teaching profession. Whatever next? Flat Earthers teaching astronomy and earth science?

[Mrs Tiggywinkle]

9 hours ago, QueenCat said:

Ours does Test to Stay too. Masking is optional in our district (and most around here). The one that is still requiring masks has fewer students out... Our district just raised sub pay to address the number of teachers out sick. I doubt it will help. Not all kids count in the numbers the schools report. 

We have test to stay too. Except if the child is fully vaccinated. So my youngest could go to school all week even though he was in a household with 3 Covid positive people and no isolation measures being taken at home(Dad still has to work and the six year old can’t take care of himself, plus it’s a small house).  With no testing. Masking is 100%. 
I tested him every morning anyway, but NYS, which I thought had been reasonably cautious the last two years, has given up.

[Harriet Vane]

10 hours ago, KrisTom said:

My husband thinks my opinion on masking is because I do not have to wear one for several hours a day, and perhaps he is right. 

 

The fact is that no one really likes wearing masks. It's not something anyone actually wants. But we cannot do anything about the way this virus infects people through the air. The discomfort of the mask is absolutely immaterial and irrelevant, because it's the only way at present to physically block the virus from entering our airways. It really is mask versus illness, disability, death. So we choose to learn how to wear a mask because we're grownups who accept those unfortunate facts.

[KSera]

13 hours ago, KrisTom said:

 But I also feel that attitudes about masking come from the parents.

Absolutely on this one. It always floors me to hear and see parents in other parts of the country so angry and up in arms about the idea of kids wearing masks at school when here it is such a non issue. I mean, I see parents on Nextdoor occasionally complaining about it, but they are the minority. The kids are all wearing them when I see them getting off the bus and I see them all walking together toward their houses and they all still have their masks on--it's not like they're even bothered enough to tear them off as soon as they get off the bus. And on my older kids' college campuses, students are walking together everywhere with masks on. Masks are required everywhere indoors on campus and anytime people can't maintain distance outdoors. It's not what anyone would choose, certainly, but it's just not the end of the world to do when it's necessary as it is right now. It's bizarre to me that some people have made it their central issue in this whole thing.

[Longtime Lurker]

My district has been mask-optional since the start of the school year in August. Things went quite well in the fall but are going less well now. There aren't really that many students out sick but there are a few teachers out at any given time so that is disruptive. Positive teachers and students have to stay out for 10 days per the health department because we are not a "universal masking environment." I am confident that 99% of the teachers are vaccinated, but maybe only half to two-thirds of the students. MyDD21 is student teaching at a school with a lower vax rate and an even lower mask rate so I worry a little about her. She does mask even though it is optional. She does not think she would have a serious case (but who knows?), but is highly motivated to stay covid-free so she doesn't miss 10 days of student teaching. She is fully vaccinated and boosted as am I (and DH and DS).

[Ting Tang]

15 hours ago, Faith-manor said:

Oy! 😡 People like this should be kicked out of the teaching profession. Whatever next? Flat Earthers teaching astronomy and earth science?

She believes colloidal silver is the cure-all.  She is very open about her belief system.  Her husband was the former school board president. He can barely spell or use proper grammar.  Prior to the pandemic, he claimed parents showed up to meetings due to "misinformation."  In the same paragraph, he said that parents turned school board meetings into "Jerry Springer" shows for showing up concerned.  They recently had a sports controversy appear in the newspaper for misuse of facilities.  Also violated the open meetings act for not posting board meeting minutes, which are sparse to begin with.  The school is severely underperforming and is one of the lowest-ranked schools in the state.  All of the surrounding schools are doing much better.

[Ting Tang]

10 hours ago, KSera said:

Absolutely on this one. It always floors me to hear and see parents in other parts of the country so angry and up in arms about the idea of kids wearing masks at school when here it is such a non issue. I mean, I see parents on Nextdoor occasionally complaining about it, but they are the minority. The kids are all wearing them when I see them getting off the bus and I see them all walking together toward their houses and they all still have their masks on--it's not like they're even bothered enough to tear them off as soon as they get off the bus. And on my older kids' college campuses, students are walking together everywhere with masks on. Masks are required everywhere indoors on campus and anytime people can't maintain distance outdoors. It's not what anyone would choose, certainly, but it's just not the end of the world to do when it's necessary as it is right now. It's bizarre to me that some people have made it their central issue in this whole thing.

Exactly.  It's not fun, but I honestly do not know when I will be comfortable doing life without them. Things slowed down last summer but flared up again. I think the easing of precautions led to the flare up.

[rebcoola]

Our state has an indoor mask mandate.  The school board has been pushing back more and more.  They recently sent out a poll about covid precautions that included questions like do you think the schools should follow state mandate. If they can find a way to ditch masks and not losing funding they absolutely will.

[athena1277]

Our district has been mask optional this year, but due to teacher shortages they had to go to virtual learning for 2 weeks.  
 

Honest question here - since Fauci and others have recently said that the cloth masks really don’t do anything to stop Omicron, why are so many still fighting for kids to wear them?  Or are your districts requiring N95 masks?

[KSera]

1 minute ago, athena1277 said:

Our district has been mask optional this year, but due to teacher shortages they had to go to virtual learning for 2 weeks.  
 

Honest question here - since Fauci and others have recently said that the cloth masks really don’t do anything to stop Omicron, why are so many still fighting for kids to wear them?  Or are your districts requiring N95 masks?

Well, two things on this. First, it’s not that cloth masks don’t do anything, they’re just not sufficient right now to prevent infection. And they are more effective for protecting others than for protecting the wearer. I am seeing cloth masks less and less around me, including on the kids. Mine wear KF 94s or N 95s (the older ones), but I see a lot of KN 95 and surgical type masks on kids around here as well. I do think it would be ideal right now to require a certain standard of mask and for the school to provide it for those who don’t have their own, but I also understand it’s hard to expect teachers and school bus drivers to be able to identify what mask each person is wearing and if it meets requirements. At least cloth ones are catching a lot of respiratory secretions and reducing the amount of virus in the air, even if they don’t do so nearly as efficiently as better masks do.

[Dmmetler]

8 minutes ago, athena1277 said:

Our district has been mask optional this year, but due to teacher shortages they had to go to virtual learning for 2 weeks.  
 

Honest question here - since Fauci and others have recently said that the cloth masks really don’t do anything to stop Omicron, why are so many still fighting for kids to wear them?  Or are your districts requiring N95 masks?

We have surgical masks available for students, and show them how to knot/tuck them. It's not an N95, but it's pretty good.  Most of my kids who use cloth masks have Happy Masks or Enro masks, too-i don't see the T-shirt type ones anymore. 

 

And, honestly, if I'm not getting sneezed or coughed on, I consider that a plus. 

[Malory]

1 hour ago, KrisTom said:

Exactly.  It's not fun, but I honestly do not know when I will be comfortable doing life without them. Things slowed down last summer but flared up again. I think the easing of precautions led to the flare up.

Where I live, we have not eased the mask requirements except for 2 months last summer. Schools never dropped the requirements at all, and still cases surged this winter.

[Ting Tang]

16 minutes ago, Malory said:

Where I live, we have not eased the mask requirements except for 2 months last summer. Schools never dropped the requirements at all, and still cases surged this winter.

Maybe it is just different everywhere.  In the beginning of the school year, I saw a chart that showed the difference between masking and not masking.  Around here, I know they are not worn properly, and outside of school, they are not worn by some families.  Someone once told me that it's not IF you get Covid, but it is the viral load you get.  That was before Omicron, though.  And if masks helped lessen the load, then I could see the benefit, even if cases went up.  I am not an expert by any stretch of the means, though.  

[Frances]

5 hours ago, rebcoola said:

Our state has an indoor mask mandate.  The school board has been pushing back more and more.  They recently sent out a poll about covid precautions that included questions like do you think the schools should follow state mandate. If they can find a way to ditch masks and not losing funding they absolutely will.

In my state with a mask mandate, some superintendents in rural districts were fired by their school boards for following the law. Now there is a law being proposed in the legislature to help prevent such firings.

[Sneezyone]

Multiple districts filed suit Monday along with several local parents. DD got a text from a peer at a different district school saying most students were unmasked today, the first day of the new Gov’s order. DD said at her school all but 2-5 students per class were masked. That’s what leadership can do, I guess. We live 10 minutes from the other HS.

Edited January 26, 2022 by Sneezyone

[prairiewindmomma]

On 1/22/2022 at 2:34 PM, Frances said:

In my state with a mask mandate, some superintendents in rural districts were fired by their school boards for following the law. Now there is a law being proposed in the legislature to help prevent such firings.

Are you following what is happening in the Alsea school district this week? 

[Frances]

2 hours ago, prairiewindmomma said:

Are you following what is happening in the Alsea school district this week? 

No, I hadn’t heard about it. Thanks for the heads up.

https://www.koin.com/news/alsea-school-district-loses-funding-after-dropping-mask-requirements/