I am leaning towards a NO answer for youngest, and I feel bad about it

[DawnM]

Youngest child's scout troop is going on a high adventure trip in July.  The cost is upwards of $2,000.

 

He also wants to go on the 8th grade trip to DC, about $800.  That trip will be in May.

 

My reasoning:

 

1. I am not sure when we are moving, but I don't want to have to be tied to a summer trip in late July.  Our house is going on the market in the Spring and if it sells, we can move in mid-June.

 

2. I think the DC trip is enough for this year.

 

3.  We will have TWO kids in college next Fall.

 

4. He has to make TWO ranks before the trip in order to qualify, and he doesn't seem to be motivated to get on it!  It is non-refundable and if he doesn't rank twice, he forfeits the trip.

 

Just tell me I am right and not to feel guilt.

[Tap]

DC. I would let him go if possible.

 

Scout. trip.  Nope.  Too expensive and since he hasn't qualified yet, I wouldn't offer it as an option.  

 

 

Edited August 9, 2017 by Tap

[regentrude]

The scout trip is a major expense and commitment and does not seem to fit well into your family's plans. I would have no qualms about saying no. $2k is a ton of money, and I have a hard time imagining the trip being long enough to be worth it. Plus your DS does not qualify. So, easy.

Edited August 9, 2017 by regentrude

[Rosie_0801]

When is the latest RSVP date?

 

 

Moving house is hassle enough as it is without adding something like this.

[Arcadia]

4. He has to make TWO ranks before the trip in order to qualify, and he doesn't seem to be motivated to get on it! It is non-refundable and if he doesn't rank twice, he forfeits the trip.

This would make it a No.

 

The rest of your points aren't exactly in his control. However two ranks to catch up and forfeiting $2k if he doesn't make the cut would be a big negative in my family.

 

If the forfeit was like a tour deposit of $300 for example, then it might still be okay for my family to encourage our kid to make that effort to make the ranks.

[DawnM]

When is the latest RSVP date?

 

 

Moving house is hassle enough as it is without adding something like this.

 

I am not sure when the latest date is, it says that once it fills up, it is full, but I am sure that if they don't fill up there will be a cut off date.

 

I agree, and moving across the entire country!  We have so much to do on that end, like getting new DL, registering cars, transferring everything over, getting kids enrolled in schools, etc....

[Valley Girl]

The cost alone would be enough to make me say "no" even if he qualified. Just not happening given the circumstances you mentioned (pending move, two kids in college, etc.). The $800 DC trip is a big deal and a generous thing for you to do. He may be disappointed, but you have NO reason to feel guilty about saying "no."

[Ivey]

Even if it worked well with our plans, I would have trouble justifying spending $2000 on an "adventure trip" for a 13-year-old. 

 

In your situation, I would absolutely say no. 

 

[DawnM]

This would make it a No.

 

The rest of your points aren't exactly in his control. However two ranks to catch up and forfeiting $2k if he doesn't make the cut would be a big negative in my family.

 

If the forfeit was like a tour deposit of $300 for example, then it might still be okay for my family to encourage our kid to make that effort to make the ranks.

 

The DC trip is in his control, we could say no to that too, but we won't.  In other words, he could pick and I know he would pick DC.

 

As for the kids in college, he knows we will pay for his college too, and we will make sacrifices to do so.  So, he will get his "share" of that as well.

Edited August 9, 2017 by DawnM

[Annie G]

The 8th grade DC trip seems like a good 'last trip' before you move. It's an educational trip and a way to spend some quality time with classmates.  The scout trip is too expensive and too much hinges on him advancing two ranks.  

 

Don't feel bad. It won't scar him for life. 

[DawnM]

Thanks guys.

 

 

[Catwoman]

I agree with you. I would say yes to the DC trip and no to the Scout trip. :)

[Cinder]

Just adding my support and agreeing that your reasons make sense.

[DawnM]

Ok, he just came in and I had a little talk with him.  I asked him if he had a choice between DC and high adventure which he would choose.  (I already knew the answer) and he said definitely DC.  Then he said, "I was just wanting to do high adventure for something to do this summer.

 

I told him we would probably have to choose and he didn't seem as upset as I thought he might be.

 

[KungFuPanda]

I wouldn't feel bad about that No at all. DC is enough. The other just doesn't seem to fit the reality of your life. He can seek out a new adventure. 2k for a middle school summer camp seems obscene.

[OneStepAtATime]

Absolutely right decision.  Heck, even when you talked to him it sounds like he is o.k. with it, too.  He just wanted something to look forward to for the summer.  Surely something else will come along that will be a lot cheaper and less challenging for your schedule that he will still enjoy doing once next summer finally gets here.  Plenty of time to worry about that much later in the game.  Good job, Mom.  :)

[HS Mom in NC]

I wouldn't even consider signing up for activities that include $2,000 trips for kids.  Not. gonna. happen.

My internationally adopted child going to her birth country after she graduates from high school?  Absolutely. And then some.  My young adult daughter going to a doula conference to hear medical professional speakers and spend time with others who have chosen the same career path?  You bet.  Adventure camp? No way.

[Lanny]

I think you are correct about these trips. DC = Yes. Adventure trip = No for various reasons.

 

Sent from my SM-G355M using Tapatalk

[bettyandbob]

He's in 8th grade. He's not close to meeting the rank requirements. You will find a new troop when you move. In all likelihood, there will be chance for him to do more than 1 high adventure program before graduation with him having earned the money himself.

 

Don't feel bad.

[TravelingChris]

I am glad it worked out with him.  I would have said no to my kid just because of the two rank thing.  The HIgh Adventure Camp is worth the money I believe but not with the rank issues, the move, the selling of the house, etc.  If you are in CA, the costs of the High Adventure Camp in a Scout troop would probably be less because travel from NC to NM is much more expensive the CA to NM.

[DawnM]

I am glad it worked out with him.  I would have said no to my kid just because of the two rank thing.  The HIgh Adventure Camp is worth the money I believe but not with the rank issues, the move, the selling of the house, etc.  If you are in CA, the costs of the High Adventure Camp in a Scout troop would probably be less because travel from NC to NM is much more expensive the CA to NM.

 

it was Northern Tier, so it probably won't be cheaper.  But that's ok.  

[Katy]

If you want to sign him up for an adventure trip when he's at least a year older, not scout affiliated, you could look into whitewater rafting or backpacking with NOLS or Outward Bound rather than scouts.  That would probably cost less than $2k (depending on trip and location), and would work wherever you might move.

 

The 8th Grade Washington DC trip was one of my favorite things in school.

[bettyandbob]

Off topic

 

I'm starting to think everyone in the country took an eighth grade trip to DC. Bunches of people I know IRL did this. People on this board did it. I grew up outside of DC. An overnight trip anywhere was not offered. I don't think we even took a fieldtrip that year. (I did do various fieldtrips other years).I'm still in the area and my rec center gets rented frequently by these cross country trips full of eighth graders. They arrive after the center closes and play for a couple hours. It's just an extra activity one evening between days of museums and monuments.They must be exhausted when the whole trip is over. 

 

Anyway, I want an eighth grade trip. 

[lmrich]

Your instinct is correct. Do not feel bad about it. 

[Alessandra]

And another thing to make you feel better about saying no. If you move in mid June and the trip is in July -- your son would be moving out of his troop and joining a new one, correct?

 

Ds did Philmont at age 15, and it was great for Scouts his age and above. But, for the two Scouts who had just turned 14, not so much. Scouts who are 18 can still go on trips -- register as adults, but not as leaders. So your boy has plenty of time.

 

Plus there are lots of council-run high adventure sites -- for example Floodwoodwood in the Adirindacks offers backpacking and canoeing trips for $400 or so, iirc. (Not including getting there, of course).

[SKL]

I think I would skip the scout trip.  I would regret it too - I like to encourage that kind of thing, but I would frame it as you need to wait and do it with your new troop after we move.  Sounds like he isn't ready.

[SKL]

Off topic

 

I'm starting to think everyone in the country took an eighth grade trip to DC. Bunches of people I know IRL did this. People on this board did it. I grew up outside of DC. An overnight trip anywhere was not offered. I don't think we even took a fieldtrip that year. (I did do various fieldtrips other years).I'm still in the area and my rec center gets rented frequently by these cross country trips full of eighth graders. They arrive after the center closes and play for a couple hours. It's just an extra activity one evening between days of museums and monuments.They must be exhausted when the whole trip is over. 

 

Anyway, I want an eighth grade trip. 

 

LOL yep, at least those who can bus there.

 

I missed going though.  I switched schools between 7th & 8th grade.  My 8th grade year was the year I would have gone to DC in my old school.  But my new school did it in my 7th grade year.  Waah, I want an 8th grade trip.  :P

 

I finally made it to DC when I was in grad school.

 

[scrapbookbuzz]

DC. I would let him go if possible.

 

Scout. trip.  Nope.  Too expensive and since he hasn't qualified yet, I wouldn't offer it as an option.  

This.

[JFSinIL]

DC - yes. Scout trip - not this year. He can go another year, meanwhile he can work towards the advancement needed to be able to go, and save some of his allowance (etc) towards it. Just does not work out in terms of time/money this year. Not everybody gets to do everything - life is like that. Gotta admit, $2,000 seems a pretty costly Scout trip!

Edited August 9, 2017 by JFSinIL

[TravelingChris]

it was Northern Tier, so it probably won't be cheaper.  But that's ok.

Yes, I know about that one too and you are right, I don't think there would be much difference in transportation costs from either place to northern MN, When you said high adventure, I thought you meant high altitude adventure which is what Philmount Camp is.

[Cinder]

Off topic

 

I'm starting to think everyone in the country took an eighth grade trip to DC.

 

My dc's school does this. Ds1 didn't start there until 9th, so he missed it. Ds2 started in 7th but I think they dropped the trip his 8th grade year. But they've resumed the 8th grade DC trip since then.

 

So, why 8th grade? Is 8th typically US HIstory? Ds2 was in 8th so long ago I don't recall what they studied that year.

[DawnM]

Yes, I know about that one too and you are right, I don't think there would be much difference in transportation costs from either place to northern MN, When you said high adventure, I thought you meant high altitude adventure which is what Philmount Camp is.

 

Yes, my husband and my oldest did Philmont.  

[bettyandbob]

 

 

So, why 8th grade? Is 8th typically US HIstory? Ds2 was in 8th so long ago I don't recall what they studied that year.

In the 1970s I took US history in 7th and civics in 8th. I took US History again and US government in high school. But yeah, middle school curriculum typically includes US History.

[Arcadia]

So, why 8th grade? Is 8th typically US HIstory?

My local K-8 school treats it as a "graduation" trip. So something to look forward to before the kids split to go to the assigned high school, lottery high school or private high schools for 9th grade.

[cera2]

#4 would make the Scout trip a no for me.  If he managed to make one rank and was well on his way to making the second before the deadline to register I might reconsider but the fact that you will also be moving at that time (or before) would leave me still inclined to say no for this year.

 

I would definitely say yes to DC.

[DawnM]

I'm going to disagree, knowing how hard it is to get a Northern Tier lottery spot. $2000 is not unreasonable for NT--it's going to run that for our boys next summer. In the new troop, how often do they do the Triple Crown and Grand Slam? However, if the boy doesn't seem to be motivated... 

 

It doesn't matter how often they do it in this troop, we are moving.

 

And we don't know exactly when.  If we can sell the house, we will move in June, giving us 8 weeks to move across the country, get our new house settled, get new state DL, new car smog registrations/inspections, enroll in new schools, etc.....if we stay here and let him do NT, we will have 3 weeks to get all that done, maybe less.

 

It honestly just isn't feasible.  He is 13.  NT will still be there IF he opts to find another troop.  He is the one boy of mine who is wishy washy on actually finishing scouts.

[Alessandra]

I'm going to disagree, knowing how hard it is to get a Northern Tier lottery spot. $2000 is not unreasonable for NT--it's going to run that for our boys next summer. In the new troop, how often do they do the Triple Crown and Grand Slam? However, if the boy doesn't seem to be motivated...

Two boys in out troop did the triple crown by doing a long winter weekend at NT. They had just found out about triple crown and rushed to complete it before college.

 

I remember being surprized at how reasonable Philmont was -- something in the range of $700 for the horseback/Cavalcade program seemed like a steal. Then there was airfare (expected) and getting from airport to Philmont (Blue Sky tours, unexpected). As long as you're out there, it seems logical to get a little sightseeing in, at least for us Easterners, lol. But what an experience! Ds wants to go again, and I would pay. But I would not have sent him at 13 years old and not if he hadn't made a reasonable commitment to scouting stuff.

 

I presume by now that OP is feeling less guilty!

[scholastica]

It doesn't matter how often they do it in this troop, we are moving.

 

And we don't know exactly when. If we can sell the house, we will move in June, giving us 8 weeks to move across the country, get our new house settled, get new state DL, new car smog registrations/inspections, enroll in new schools, etc.....if we stay here and let him do NT, we will have 3 weeks to get all that done, maybe less.

 

It honestly just isn't feasible. He is 13. NT will still be there IF he opts to find another troop. He is the one boy of mine who is wishy washy on actually finishing scouts.

With all you've said, I wouldn't feel bad at all. He is so young. If he really wants it, he'll work towards it. Saying no to him now may motivate him to get it done for the summer after you move.

[DawnM]

I don't even know what triple crown is, but if it involves all 3 high adventure trips, we aren't planning to do that.  ONE is about all I can offer each boy.

[DawnM]

Triple Crown was started for the first HA camps: Philmont, Northern Tier, Sea Base. When Summit was added, they called it the Grand Slam. 

 

 

I see.  My older two did Summit.  Summit is driving distance, so we just had to pay the $700 or whatever for the week.

[Guest]

I don't even know what triple crown is, but if it involves all 3 high adventure trips, we aren't planning to do that. ONE is about all I can offer each boy.

 

The troop is not fundraising?

 

I didn't allow my son to participate in HA trips that were not planned ahead of time enough to allow the scouts to fundraise. Its just not scouting to me if I write the check.

[DawnM]

The troop is not fundraising?

 

I didn't allow my son to participate in HA trips that were not planned ahead of time enough to allow the scouts to fundraise. Its just not scouting to me if I write the check.

 

They have some money, but they haven't been clear about all of it.  This troop just isn't as good at communicating.  Our last troop I was on the committee and very involved.  I just don't have the time now and they aren't great at it.

[Farrar]

I would lean toward doing the scout trip over the DC trip if it weren't for the needing to advance and not being on it. I'm not sure how to evaluate that, but generally I think the scout trip would be more worth the money. A big scout adventure trip can be lifelong memory-worthy. DC trips... I mean, obviously, I'm biased because I live in DC, but seriously, they are so lame. My nephew did one this year and I couldn't believe how tight the schedule was - so tight that they were just in and out of everything too fast to appreciate anything. Plus, I've seen these groups - they're all just on a forced march between museums and monuments and they barely look up from each other and the socializing. I don't begrudge kids their social time - I've run 8th grade trips - it's about the social stuff... but it always just seems like such a waste seeing all these kids here, knowing they paid all this money and... it's just not an awesome vibe.

 

[hellen]

I would lean toward doing the scout trip over the DC trip if it weren't for the needing to advance and not being on it. I'm not sure how to evaluate that, but generally I think the scout trip would be more worth the money. A big scout adventure trip can be lifelong memory-worthy. DC trips... I mean, obviously, I'm biased because I live in DC, but seriously, they are so lame. My nephew did one this year and I couldn't believe how tight the schedule was - so tight that they were just in and out of everything too fast to appreciate anything. Plus, I've seen these groups - they're all just on a forced march between museums and monuments and they barely look up from each other and the socializing. I don't begrudge kids their social time - I've run 8th grade trips - it's about the social stuff... but it always just seems like such a waste seeing all these kids here, knowing they paid all this money and... it's just not an awesome vibe.

That is such an accurate description of the DC student groups. They are absolutely everywhere in the spring. I think those kids would have had an equally good time touring their closest large city. The location isn't the highlight of the trip.

[DawnM]

I would lean toward doing the scout trip over the DC trip if it weren't for the needing to advance and not being on it. I'm not sure how to evaluate that, but generally I think the scout trip would be more worth the money. A big scout adventure trip can be lifelong memory-worthy. DC trips... I mean, obviously, I'm biased because I live in DC, but seriously, they are so lame. My nephew did one this year and I couldn't believe how tight the schedule was - so tight that they were just in and out of everything too fast to appreciate anything. Plus, I've seen these groups - they're all just on a forced march between museums and monuments and they barely look up from each other and the socializing. I don't begrudge kids their social time - I've run 8th grade trips - it's about the social stuff... but it always just seems like such a waste seeing all these kids here, knowing they paid all this money and... it's just not an awesome vibe.

 

Thanks.  It is more than just that though.