Advice for the child who wants to be first

[macmacmoo]

Our second child is rough around the edges. Stubborn, spirited, and strong willed could also be used to describe him. He is five and will be six in the fall.

 

I know wanting to be first is normal to some degree, I'm starting to think this is going towards out of hand. Not everything is a race but randomly he will seem something to be (generally when he isn't first) and things go south.

 

Most dangerous situation was when I told the boys to go upstairs to brush their teeth and he nearly pushed his little brother down the stairs when little brother got to the top first. I was right behind them and was there to prevent an accident. But tantrum did ensure.

 

Today I went to a little Q and A. Parents were in one room and the kiddos running around in the gym with the teens watching them. Someone brought snap circuits for the kiddos to play with as well. When the Q And A was over I told my kids to put the snap circuits away. Eldest 8 skipped across the gym to put them away and 5 was right at his heels and then started screaming that eldest needed to let him be first. At this point eldest has already put the snap circuits away and is back to watch us. Five year old is now on the floor screaming that eldest needs to get the snap circuits he had and go back to the other side of the gym so that five year old can put his away first. I do my best to tell five year old I understand he is upset but he is being unreasonable. (Punishments and rewards have no affect, waiting it out has been my best option at home but it's awkward in public)

 

Parents start sticking their heads in. Some ask if everything is okay. Things get really bad when the owner of the snap circuits ask for the pieces back. Five year old has no intentions of letting go of the prices not that he actually wants them but because he firmly now has it his mind that he should be the first to put them away and in order to achieve it eldest needs to go get the prices he had. I spend the need five minutes prying the pieces one by one from him. That black piece with the wire was a pain.

 

Once the prices were free I just walk away. Giving him as much space to just scream it out and to get his sibling out of eye sight.

 

Over hear the owner of the snap circuits saying so quickly put them in the car and I clarify that five year old isn't made because he had to give back the toy but because he is mad his brother put them away first.

 

Now five year old is yelling about how eldest was bad. That eldest should not get a present. That Eldest is in trouble for not listening to his directions.

 

I recall trying to turn his attention asking if he wanted to be my special helper and go get my purse. He declined. Asked if he wanted to be my special helper and get my keys out my purse. Also declined. Reminded him what our plans for the rest of the day was. More grumping. Went and got my purse. He was still on the ground of the gym. Me and the other kids just stood by the gym door waiting. He eventually relucatantly got up and went to the van with us.

 

So any advice because I know this problem of not being in first will come up. Not this exact situation but definitely his mindset. Being upset is a very hard emotion to work through.

 

I guess the hardest part for me is it occur in public. And while I did stay calm, with everyone around looking on I very much felt judged.

[Amy in NH]

I think you handled it fine. 

 

I think in situations in which I have control of the timeline I'd intentionally make him be last until he gets over it.  For instance, instead of asking the kids to brush their teeth as a group, I'd ask them each individually to do so and then come back one at a time, holding 5yo for last.  When he can get through that type of scenario without throwing a fit I'd change to random first selection.

[macmacmoo]

Is it bad I want to go looking through my Shel Silverstein poetry books and find the poem about the girl who yelled "Me First." Who wanted to be first on the bus and ultimately got to be first to be eaten by the cannibal?

 

Or are there better stories or picture books that would cover the topic better? Lol

[Jean in Newcastle]

Has he had any evaluations? His rigidity of thinking is a red flag.

 

 

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[Amy in NH]

Is it bad I want to go looking through my Shel Silverstein poetry books and find the poem about the girl who yelled "Me First." Who wanted to be first on the bus and ultimately got to be first to be eaten by the cannibal?

 

Or are there better stories or picture books that would cover the topic better? Lol

 

Not at all.  Look at Mrs. Piggle Wiggle too.  She probably has a good story about being first.

 

Learning to take turns is a skill.  Somehow he has gotten it into his head that he doesn't need to take turns?

[HomeAgain]

I find its best for everyone to remove the child from the setting. Outside, a bathroom, whatever, let them get it out privately and then rejoin the group. It tends to subside quicker than having an audience watch.

 

And I might be harsh, but when a child has an ongoing issue, by about the tenth time my empathy looks a lot more like telling them the cold hard facts: NO, it won't happen that way, NO what you want is not right, NO, you don't get to behave that way. YES, you are upset. NO, I'm not going to change that. I am calm while I do it, but I make certain the child knows in no uncertain terms that his wish will not be granted. Outside of the issue I try to meet the need in other ways, playing more games to model/expect good sportsmanship, for example, and giving the child extra skills to focus on like learning to fold paper airplanes or spool knitting or woodworking, an interest that is all his to help him define who he is apart from the family, but I have to pick and choose carefully which parenting tool I grab at which time.

[maize]

Has he had any evaluations? His rigidity of thinking is a red flag.

 

 

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I was thinking the same thing.

 

Some of this behavior is normal, but getting "stuck" in needing something to be a particular way and not being able to move past that can be an indication of underlying cognitive issues.

[foxbridgeacademy]

I'm going to be a meany and say you might have to get "tough" with him.  Make it fair but he HAS to take his turn (big battle ahead).  When DS was 4 he started throwing tantrums, we would give him a minute, explain clearly what behavior we expected and what would happen if he didn't settle down (we would leave ASAP) and then we left where ever we were no matter what we were doing.  Also, I know you were just trying to get him to stop but rewarding him with being your helper is actually a positive reinforcement of bad behavior.  

 

As for the other mom's, they are not the ones dealing with a 5 year old so I wouldn't worry about what they think.  You are doing the very best you can and it's obvious that you love him and take good care of him, kids are just big PITA's sometimes.

[wendyroo]

Has he had any evaluations? His rigidity of thinking is a red flag.

 

 

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I agree.

 

My second son is also 5 going on 6.  He sounds very similar - rigid thinking, lots of extended tantrums, excessively competitive, irrational, physically rough with siblings (and belongings), impulsive, immune to positive or negative consequences, etc.  He was recently diagnosed with ADHD and Oppositional Defiant Disorder; he also tested right on the borderline for autism.

 

We started him on ADHD medication a month ago, and the results have been extremely positive.  It certainly hasn't been a silver bullet, but the meds have helped slow down his thinking enough that he can pause before having an emotional meltdown and engage in discussion and collaborative problem solving.

 

Wendy

[EKS]

If he were my kid, I'd start by telling him that he will no longer be first--ever. And then I would enforce it until he no longer freaks out about being first. If that doesn't happen within 4-6 weeks, I would get him evaluated.

[Rebel Yell]

We have used "Girl Of The Week" when mine were younger. It wasn't always fair to have oldest go first, or youngest (one will always be a middle) Also, I didn't want to always pick movies, meals, activities, etc. based on what all the girls liked- even if they all liked THIS, there was often the kid who never got to have their favorite THAT because another sister hated it.

 

We had Girl of the Week, First Runner Up, and Bronze Medalist. GOTW got to pick her seat in the van, pick the movie or games, get shower first, and plan one favorite complete meal. It's been a few years LOL so I forget what else. If GOTW wasn't home, priority and decisions went to the next in line. They rotated positions every week so they all got to be first, second, and last.

 

Also, GOTW wasn't a power trip for the kids, it was a tool to help me make decisions. I didn't want to have to remember who went first the last time, or always go with what the most difficult or demanding child wanted because the easier ones wouldn't complain or wouldn't be unhappy with the selections. GOTW also couldn't just storm in and demand that anything in progress be changed to her preferences.

 

Also, it was understood that sometimes mom or dad had to go off the plan in certain situations for the overall good or sanity of the family.

[macmacmoo]

Evaluated for what exactly.

 

When he was three he was evaluated with a heavy eye towards speech. Barely made it into the special education preschool at the local school since only one problem would not let him qualify but since his speech was so bad they couldnt tell where he was developmentally was it he didn't know how to say it or did he just not know.

 

When he would have gone to kindergarten they said he no longer needed services. We moved that summer anyways.

 

During all this we did go through doctor/insurance but they said they didn't think anything was wrong with him. Granted the only thing I knew to ask about was autism.

[LMD]

I am thinking they were suggesting ASD testing, because honestly what you described was more than just a tantrum IMO...

[mom2att]

Sounds a lot like my ds at that age. He had to be the first inside the house when we got home, first to turn off the light at night, first to whatever. And his sister is 4.5 years older so she was bigger and faster. Often she just let him win, but sometimes she got there first just to annoy him, and he would fall apart.

 

The book The Explosive Child helped me a lot, because it showed me that his meltdowns were due to emotions he really couldn't control.

 

[scbusf]

My DD has had some similar issues. Her frustration level was off the charts. Her brain was telling her that things should be a certain way. Obviously, life doesn't always work the way you think it should.

 

She was diagnosed with generalized anxiety. After seeing a counselor for a year, she started on meds and we have our lives back. (I'm not saying that everyone should jump to meds - it was a last resort for us, but it has made SUCH a difference!!!)

 

ETA: I suspect she also has ADHD, but we have not pursued a diagnosis for that yet.

Edited May 1, 2017 by scbusf

[maize]

Evaluated for what exactly.

 

When he was three he was evaluated with a heavy eye towards speech. Barely made it into the special education preschool at the local school since only one problem would not let him qualify but since his speech was so bad they couldnt tell where he was developmentally was it he didn't know how to say it or did he just not know.

 

When he would have gone to kindergarten they said he no longer needed services. We moved that summer anyways.

 

During all this we did go through doctor/insurance but they said they didn't think anything was wrong with him. Granted the only thing I knew to ask about was autism.

 

I would consider a full neuropsych eval. My child who has a lot of rigid thinking and massive meltdowns currently has a diagnosis of anxiety and ADHD; he also has ASD traits and may eventually end up with a diagnosis on that spectrum.

 

I would look for something more than the screenings that a regular pediatrician does; if you can get a referral to a developmental pediatrician that would be great. Early intervention/school district evals make a determination about eligibility for services but generally don't make actual medical diagnoses.

[HTRMom]

My kid is very much like that (3.5 yr old) and has had a professional evaluation and the conclusion is no diagnosis, just a tough personality. Just throwing that in. He will often try to make family members undo or redo things to get them the way that he envisioned. No type of punishment is effective for him either.

 

 

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[bookbard]

I am beginning to wonder whether there's an association between high-level competitiveness and anxiety. My daughter is just like this - always wants to be first, very competitive. I'm starting to link it to anxiety and perfectionism. It could also be a sign of inflexibility or black and white thinking. Do you find he is inflexible with other things, for example always needing to sit in the same seat at the table or do things in a certain routine?

 

There was a Thomas the Tank Engine episode where Thomas wanted to be first and ended up causing another train to fall into the water. I used to cite that to my daughter occasionally. But now I just try to make a point of having one child first one day, the other child first the other day. She's a year older and I think she's a bit better about it than she used to be. 

[Jean in Newcastle]

What I would do, since you know up front that this is an issue, is to work with him through role play on taking turns. Before you play a game or do an activity or go to brush teeth, talk about your expectations. Tell him what you want him to do instead of focusing on what you don't want him to do. You will need to supervise closely. Break it down so that he can be successful. Try to set the narrative before he gets stuck in a loop of rigid thinking.

 

For example: before tooth brushing time, sit the boys down. Warn them that it is soon going to be tooth brushing time. Tell them that you want them to WALK up the stairs. You might want to choose one to go first but I would talk about it first. Talk about how both can't put the toothpaste on at the same time. Talk about how there will still be toothpaste left even for the one who is second. Talk about strategies for coping for the one waiting. Perhaps the one waiting can do something else while waiting. Or he could count to a certain number. Or sing a toothbrushing song. That might sound corny but we had a made up tooth brushing song set to the tune of the Alleluia chorus. That can help alleviate possible anxiety or give a child with poor impulse control something to do.

 

 

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[katilac]

My kid is very much like that (3.5 yr old) and has had a professional evaluation and the conclusion is no diagnosis, just a tough personality. Just throwing that in.  

 

That's quite a big age difference, though.  

[HomeAgain]

That's quite a big age difference, though.

Yes and no. The tactics described by the OP (empathize, redirect) are toddleresque, not for a five year old. And wanting to be first or win is a classic five year old stage. Using little child techniques on a verbal, more-able to reason child will often have the effect of prolonging the tantrum because nothing is solved and the power of the situation is thrust into an imbalance. The parent isn't teaching, but placating.

[Barb_]

Yes and no. The tactics described by the OP (empathize, redirect) are toddleresque, not for a five year old. And wanting to be first or win is a classic five year old stage. Using little child techniques on a verbal, more-able to reason child will often have the effect of prolonging the tantrum because nothing is solved and the power of the situation is thrust into an imbalance. The parent isn't teaching, but placating.

That's an excellent point.

[AK_Mom4]

Kid #3 was like this when he was young. For him, if was a combination of competitiveness and anxiety - not a good combination.

 

We started removing him from the competitive situations. Time for bed? The other kids went and got ready, then we sent him off. We pulled him out of group activities with his siblings. If they played board games, he had to be on a team with an adult and being a good loser was part of the deal or he couldn't play. He ended up sitting on the sidelines next to me a good bit until he matured more and got a handle on his feelings.

 

At age 5, he was small enough still that I could physically remove him from the public meltdowns - mostly because I don't think other folks should have to listen to my kid scream. But if your kid is bigger, I understand that might not be an option. If that's the case, I would try to set him up for success by not turning him loose with his siblings in public for a while. He stays with you or he doesn't go.

 

Hope this was helpful - I sympathize having been there in the trenches with you on this one.

[wintermom]

Kid #3 was like this when he was young. For him, if was a combination of competitiveness and anxiety - not a good combination.

 

We started removing him from the competitive situations. Time for bed? The other kids went and got ready, then we sent him off. We pulled him out of group activities with his siblings. If they played board games, he had to be on a team with an adult and being a good loser was part of the deal or he couldn't play. He ended up sitting on the sidelines next to me a good bit until he matured more and got a handle on his feelings.

 

At age 5, he was small enough still that I could physically remove him from the public meltdowns - mostly because I don't think other folks should have to listen to my kid scream. But if your kid is bigger, I understand that might not be an option. If that's the case, I would try to set him up for success by not turning him loose with his siblings in public for a while. He stays with you or he doesn't go.

 

Hope this was helpful - I sympathize having been there in the trenches with you on this one.

 

This is excellent, and something you can start working on right now. Brainstorm with your dh on ways you both can manage the family and daily situations so that there are many more positive interactions and less opportunities for the negative ones you know are a recipe for disaster. Accept that this child, for now at least, is going to have these issues. Some conflicts you may be able to avoid by structuring the situations ahead of time. Some are going to pop up anyway, so try not to stress out when they do. 

[athomeontheprairie]

Great advice above.

I'll add two things that helped us with this issue.

 

Board games. Don't let him go first. and if necessary stack the deck so that he isn't the first to win. make a point of sportsmanship.

 

someone mentions movies up thread. I had a name list everyone, including me , was on it. we moved the marker down to the next person. that you chose the movie. I was on the list so they wouldn't keep watching the same things over and over . Dh was not on the list, but if he was home and they put in the movie he had the power to override all choices and put in what he wanted. this really was fair as it only happened once or so a month.

a friend with more kids than I used that same idea and applied it to words when the kids lined up whoever was first on the list was first in line, to choose the seat on the can, etc.

[kroe1]

I am still a mean mom. I would pick him up off the floor, give him a good paddling outside the room, and throw him in the car. At age 5 he would be ignored on the way home, and not given an ice cream treat if the others got one. His artwork assignment that day would be sorry cards to his mother and siblings.

 

I never had to diagnose my kiddos with any disorders because stern discipline solved it all. I may have quite a few disorders, but that is beyond the point. I remember vividly my kiddos' rigid behavior, ridiculous tantrums, screaming fits, passive aggressiveness, you name it. I am always shocked at how quickly people want to give a diagnosis to normal childhood. This is not to say there are no disorders, but, that we are too quick to call behavior a disorder when in reality most of it can be solved without a money making DSM label.

 

But, really, there are a 1000 ways to raise a kiddo with 995 of them being the right way.

[HTRMom]

Another thing you might do, similarly, is have "Joe first day" and "Tom first day" alternating. On Joe's day, he gets to be first for everything, and the next day Tom does.

 

 

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[wintermom]

There is a huge range of "normal" behaviour for children. Sometimes a child lies at a much farther extreme on the range, and the parents have trouble dealing effectively with it. Most parents only get to see a very, very small sample of children (their own), and don't know where on this range of normal behaviour their challenging child actually is. It just seems really hard to deal with parenting this child. And parents question themselves, blame themselves, question their child and blame their child when things that "shouldn't" be tough are tough. 

 

"Stern discipline" (a very general term) also has a huge range of actual behaviours for parents; some effective and some not at all. The problem with using the term "stern" is that it immediately puts a negative spin on a parent's approach. I much prefer a positive spin, where the adult seeks to set up situations for success and positive learning opportunities as much as possible. Firm parenting with a plan, makes more sense to me. 

[Innisfree]

I am still a mean mom. I would pick him up off the floor, give him a good paddling outside the room, and throw him in the car. At age 5 he would be ignored on the way home, and not given an ice cream treat if the others got one. His artwork assignment that day would be sorry cards to his mother and siblings.

 

I never had to diagnose my kiddos with any disorders because stern discipline solved it all. I may have quite a few disorders, but that is beyond the point. I remember vividly my kiddos' rigid behavior, ridiculous tantrums, screaming fits, passive aggressiveness, you name it. I am always shocked at how quickly people want to give a diagnosis to normal childhood. This is not to say there are no disorders, but, that we are too quick to call behavior a disorder when in reality most of it can be solved without a money making DSM label.

 

But, really, there are a 1000 ways to raise a kiddo with 995 of them being the right way.

If stern discipline solved it all, your children probably would not have qualified for a diagnosis.

 

Many of us have tried stern discipline. The point is, when children genuinely qualify for diagnoses, stern discipline not only *does not work*, it may make behaviors significantly worse.

 

There are valid reasons many of us tend to recommend asking about possible diagnoses rather than resorting to punishments. If the skills necessary for self-control and good behavior do not exist, one cannot punish them into existence.

 

Punishment may work with kids who *already have the capability* to control themselves, but the OP seems to be saying her son shows consistent difficulty with this issue, and has had other flags for speech issues. Asking about possible needs for extra support seems far kinder and more productive than adding extra punishments.

 

I would certainly agree that there are many good ways to raise children; I just regret the times we (acting on advice) resorted to punishment before getting a diagnosis.

Edited May 1, 2017 by Innisfree

[maize]

I am still a mean mom. I would pick him up off the floor, give him a good paddling outside the room, and throw him in the car. At age 5 he would be ignored on the way home, and not given an ice cream treat if the others got one. His artwork assignment that day would be sorry cards to his mother and siblings.

 

I never had to diagnose my kiddos with any disorders because stern discipline solved it all. I may have quite a few disorders, but that is beyond the point. I remember vividly my kiddos' rigid behavior, ridiculous tantrums, screaming fits, passive aggressiveness, you name it. I am always shocked at how quickly people want to give a diagnosis to normal childhood. This is not to say there are no disorders, but, that we are too quick to call behavior a disorder when in reality most of it can be solved without a money making DSM label.

 

But, really, there are a 1000 ways to raise a kiddo with 995 of them being the right way.

 

You are fortunate to have children who were able to cope with and respond acceptably to your parenting methods.

 

For a child who lacks the intrinsic ability to process and control their own emotional reactions, this sort of punitive parenting is a) ineffective and b) downright abusive (you punish a child over and over again for failing to do something the child is not capable of doing). 

 

I believe that in parenting as in medicine the dictum "first do no harm" applies. It is on our shoulders as adults to do the best we can not to harm vulnerable children. If a child is neurotypical there are methods other than harsh punitive measures that can teach appropriate skills and behaviors. If a child is not neurotypical there is even more reason to avoid harsh punishment and to seek rather to understand the needs of the child and work constructively and cooperatively to help them develop necessary skills and behaviors.

 

None of us is perfect in achieving this goal, but each of us can aim for it.

[amo_mea_filiis.]

I am still a mean mom. I would pick him up off the floor, give him a good paddling outside the room, and throw him in the car. At age 5 he would be ignored on the way home, and not given an ice cream treat if the others got one. His artwork assignment that day would be sorry cards to his mother and siblings.

 

I never had to diagnose my kiddos with any disorders because stern discipline solved it all. I may have quite a few disorders, but that is beyond the point. I remember vividly my kiddos' rigid behavior, ridiculous tantrums, screaming fits, passive aggressiveness, you name it. I am always shocked at how quickly people want to give a diagnosis to normal childhood. This is not to say there are no disorders, but, that we are too quick to call behavior a disorder when in reality most of it can be solved without a money making DSM label.

 

But, really, there are a 1000 ways to raise a kiddo with 995 of them being the right way.

I have an undiagnosed autistic l, 5yo extra kid from an abusive home.

 

You can literally beat this kid bloody, and he will still need to go fix the snap circuits.

 

You can toss him in the car all you want, but it's not physically possible to get him buckled into his car seat when he's like that.

 

No, I don't let him go first, or in our case, control the stairs or doors, but it means that our days (when he's here) revolve around waiting him out and teaching him. He's made a ton of progress.

 

I have another kid, 6yo, with a label, and strict discipline works just fine.

 

OP wouldn't be posting if it wasn't way beyond norms.

[Anne in CA]

We have used "Girl Of The Week" when mine were younger. It wasn't always fair to have oldest go first, or youngest (one will always be a middle) Also, I didn't want to always pick movies, meals, activities, etc. based on what all the girls liked- even if they all liked THIS, there was often the kid who never got to have their favorite THAT because another sister hated it.

 

We had Girl of the Week, First Runner Up, and Bronze Medalist. GOTW got to pick her seat in the van, pick the movie or games, get shower first, and plan one favorite complete meal. It's been a few years LOL so I forget what else. If GOTW wasn't home, priority and decisions went to the next in line. They rotated positions every week so they all got to be first, second, and last.

 

Also, GOTW wasn't a power trip for the kids, it was a tool to help me make decisions. I didn't want to have to remember who went first the last time, or always go with what the most difficult or demanding child wanted because the easier ones wouldn't complain or wouldn't be unhappy with the selections. GOTW also couldn't just storm in and demand that anything in progress be changed to her preferences.

 

Also, it was understood that sometimes mom or dad had to go off the plan in certain situations for the overall good or sanity of the family.

I had a mom in my first home school group years ago who did the same thing. It was Kid of the Week, because she had two boys, but it solved who sat in front in the car and other things. 

[zoobie]

I would remove him from public situations when possible. See if he can regroup in the car. If he's too overwhelmed/overstimulated, then just go home. Try again another day but as Jean was describing, prepare him first. Explain the expectations of the event. Explain your expectations. Ask if he has any questions or concerns. Work on a code word for when he's getting overwhelmed. Check in with him and remind him of the (short, few) expectations. Do this for any situations that could be triggering. 

 

In situations like your tooth brushing example, I would separate the kids. I've used "races" to help motivate some of my children when they're being pokey (first one ready for bed picks the first book!), but for two of the four, it does not work. Especially at night when they're tired! Send him up alone to pick out PJs while you herd the smaller ones. Make a calendar or visual aid for who does what when. "Look, today it's Bobby's turn to do X. When is yours? Can you count the days?" And if that doesn't work, let him brush his teeth first every day. So not a battle to pick! 

 

I don't agree with the advice to punitively make him be last at everything for a while. It's not going to help. It possibly could be damaging. If he's doing everything correctly and should be "winning," punishing him for a long-ago (yesterday is long ago to a five year old!) action isn't productive. Especially if he's developmentally still working on self control. Discipline = to teach. You've said punishment and rewards don't work, so amping up punishment isn't your answer. You might need to be more proactive and reactive than you are (for example, removing him), but it's really hard to tell from two examples on a message board. 

 

I would agree with **teaching** him the construct of taking turns. Cooperative games. Talking about empathy and kindness and helping. Set him up for an easy situation in which he can experience someone else "winning" and then talk about how it felt. You can google for social stories to help with this. 

 

I also agree with the recommendation for the Explosive Child. Figure out which battles are worth it. Tooth brushing? Nope. Being a turkey to other children in public? Yep. But that's probably something you are going to have to control until he is able to. If you look at everything and decide there are red flags more than some young child immaturity, get him tested. He may not be neurotypical. Or he may need a little extra time to mature and do some explicit work on social skills.

[amy g.]

I would absolutely not take turns being first because to me, that still teaches that being first is inherently better. Those are the people driving up the grass in a traffic jam and then pushing their way into the front of the line.

 

I don't like or respect people like that and I don't want my children to grow up with those values.

 

I would focus instead on asking how it even matters who is first.

 

In my value system, what matters is who gives up things and sacrifices for the well being of his fellow human beings. This is what I want to teach my children.

 

I reward and praise behaviors where kids willingly choose to put their siblings before their own wants.

 

If you are a Christian, then you talk about what Jesus teaches concerning the first being last.

 

I have a kid with inflexible thinking. Thankfully she has now developed into being inflexible about positive qualities like respect and honesty.

 

I am just afraid that if you take turns being first, the child still will have a melt down the first time you make a mistake and the system isn't perfect. The problem hasn't been solved. I do think that system would work with a less back and white kid, but what you describe already tells us yours isn't.

 

Diagnosis or not, his basic personality is unlikely to change. I suggest looking for ways to use that intensity for good. Channel it into helping him be a person who will do what is right and does not care about the repercussions. He is showing you that he has the raw materials to be that person. He just needs you to help mold him in the right direction.

[gardenmom5]

it may be an age thing.  I don't remember my older kids doing this very much.

 

with dudeling - he'd refuse to do something until I made it a race.  he wanted to be first.  that doesn't work anymore . . . .

 

eta: sorry, tired. . . . I wouldn't allow him to be first until he knocks it off.  He has the potential to hurt someone, you've seen that.  when it's time for them to go upstairs - he can wait at the bottom.  or send them off at separate times.

 

if he's going to have a tantrum in public - he can sit on the sidelines and not participate.

Edited May 1, 2017 by gardenmom5

[fairfarmhand]

Why not discuss why it is the best, kindest thing ever to allow others to go first. Give huge attention to the kids who let others go first. MAke it into a game "After you, my dear!" "Why no, after YOU!" No, I insist, after you!" Complete with lots of silly giggles this could be fun.

 

It's not polite to be me firsting all the time.

 

I would not send both kids to do anything at the same time for a long time until this behavior is improved.