Garga Posted November 20, 2014 Share Posted November 20, 2014 I don't understand medical people. I really don't. Last week my husband had a terrible flare up of pain from degenerative disc disease in his neck. My husband gets migraines and regular headaches all the time, yet pushes through and doesn't whine or complain. But this time DH was in such terrible pain that we went to the ER and they gave him super duper pain killers. He can't move his head from the pain. He can't move his arm from the pain. This is *with* the medicine. Without medicine, he's at a 9 or 10 on the pain scale. With it, he's at a 6 or 7. We get to a pain center today after waiting over a week for an appointment, but this is better than the 3 weeks we thought we'd have to wait. They gave him a shot of lidocaine in the neck. They say, "You'll be able to drive home." But they also say that the pain he's having won't go away for 3-5 days (or 10, or never) after the shot. Um...then how could he possibly drive home? He couldn't drive there so what do they mean he can drive home? He can't even turn his head. He can't even look down at his own hands. He can't move his arm. Is he meant to sit in the waiting room for 3-5 (or 10) days until he can drive home? They knew the shot wouldn't immediately take away the pain, so how is he magically going to be able to drive a car? When they prepared him for the doctor to give him the shot, they asked him to lie down. He hasn't been able to lie down in over a week. When he tries, the pain shoots through his body. The lady gets him lying on the table and has him move his arm back (the one he can't move without pain, remember) and he's immediately in severe, blinding pain. He says, "I can't take this! I have to get up until the doctor is ready." She says, "Oh, no--stay there. He'll only be 3 or 4 minutes." He tells her, "I'll lie back down when he's here and ready. I am in severe pain in this position." "No, no! It'll only be 3 or 4 minutes." He got up against her protests. Has no one EVER been in their clinic for this condition? Blinding pain (people say it feels like a lightning bolt in your arm) radiating down the arm is THE symptom for the condition and the little brochure showed a guy with red on his arm to prove it. Everyone with this condition has arm pain and can't move their necks. That's *how* they knew he has this condition. Do all the others with this exact same condition really lie there in blinding pain just waiting for the doctor to show up? Do they all then drive their cars away, even though they can't turn their heads? Did they think he was lying about the pain? I just don't understand. I'll stop there, but I do have all sorts (really--all sorts) of odd little stories like this from doctors I've seen over the years. Doctors can be brilliant people but sometimes lack common sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laurie4b Posted November 20, 2014 Share Posted November 20, 2014 So sorry that this happened to your dh! :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snickerdoodle Posted November 20, 2014 Share Posted November 20, 2014 It's almost as if they don't want to muss the assembly line by waiting the extra 3 minutes for your dh to get into position. :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ausmumof3 Posted November 20, 2014 Share Posted November 20, 2014 I imagine the driving comment just meant the drugs wouldn't affect his ability to drive. The refusing to let him wait sitting is inexcusable, sounds like they were under pressure for time and not thinking about the patient at all. Hope he gets some relief soon, as that sounds very difficult. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farrar Posted November 20, 2014 Share Posted November 20, 2014 I also assume the driving thing just meant safe if he can, no drug related reasons. But generally, most medical people are idiots. I'm totally with you. Sorry you guys are going through that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harriet Vane Posted November 20, 2014 Share Posted November 20, 2014 :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
creekland Posted November 20, 2014 Share Posted November 20, 2014 :grouphug: Just like with becoming parents, it's pretty difficult to truly understand a situation until one is in it themselves. Obviously, that nurse (and doctor) never have been where your dh is at. What they think is ok just doesn't fit his situation, but they have no sense of that. I'm not fond of (most) doctors myself for various reasons, but I appreciate having them around when true needs pop up. (I'd never want to set a broken bone myself.) I hope the shot works well for your guy. Is there a Plan B if it doesn't? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anne in CA Posted November 20, 2014 Share Posted November 20, 2014 As I've gotten older I have gotten a lot less trusting of doctors. I had one who nearly killed me with her lack of common sense. Fifteen years later I was serving her dinner at a large wedding and I thought how lucky she was that I would never sabotage someone's food, because the dingbat nearly killed me at my own expense. But she was a truly awful doctor. I do think that doctors spend years in post graduate school studying during the years when other people develop common sense when their raging youth hormones are subsiding. Then the make a lot of money that helps the avoid other common sense knowledge that comes from taking care of yourself, cooking, cleaning, balancing a career with childcare. My oldest worked in a daycare by a hospital and was horrified by the lack of common sense parenting things that doctors do. I have a good friend whose ex is in charge of a whole rehab hospital and he is an awful parent. He sends the kids to school in clothes that don't fit, he feeds them junk because he can't/ won't cook, he doesn't talk much to them, he texts his own children to tell them to go to bed. They are 7 and 9. Last week he sent the 7yo to school with no socks or underwear because the housekeeper had the week off and he can't/ won't wash clothes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
momacacia Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 There's a reason I've had 3 homebirths, and it ain't just the scenery. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
happypamama Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 I imagine the driving comment just meant the drugs wouldn't affect his ability to drive. The refusing to let him wait sitting is inexcusable, sounds like they were under pressure for time and not thinking about the patient at all. Hope he gets some relief soon, as that sounds very difficult. That's what I figured about the drugs too, that it's safe to drive, if he can. I agree that letting him wait in pain is inexcusable. I really hope he finds some relief soon! My mom had a couple of slipped discs about twenty years ago, and I remember how much pain she was in for a couple of months; it was awful, and I can only imagine how badly your poor DH must be feeling. Again, offers of help and rides stand; contact me here, on FB, or by email, text, or phone if I can do anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
creekland Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 Again, offers of help and rides stand; contact me here, on FB, or by email, text, or phone if I can do anything. This is true - we're pretty close to you as well, Garga. If you end up needing anything, definitely send a pm. When I'm not at school, my schedule is often quite free now that we're empty nesting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garga Posted November 21, 2014 Author Share Posted November 21, 2014 Thanks for letting me vent, guys. You're right about the driving thing now that you point it out. It's been about 70/30 for me and doctors. 70% of the time they seem soooo incompetent. 30% of the time they're great. It's been a long, draining week and I needed to yell about it to someone. DH is not the person to vent to, as he's stuck in their hands for now. Doctors scare me. I absolutely feel that I can't trust them and that they are never giving me the full story. Like the time my son had a wart. We spent about $150 in copays, my insurance was charged many hundreds, and my son endured terrible blisters from the acid treatments and pain from the burning/icing treatments. In the end, I asked the dermatologist, "I've been reading about tea tree oil. What if I said let's not do this latest acid treatment and I just tried the tea tree oil?" She said, "That's a good idea. I won't charge you for this visit." $6 and 3 weeks later the wart was gone, painlessly. Apparently she wasn't allowed to tell me about the tea tree oil because it's not an FDA approved treatment or something like that, but she knew it would work. ARGH. I see this happen over and over and over...I have a story like this for every doctor I've ever seen except my beautiful midwives. I love midwives. Sigh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reefgazer Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 Yup, I hear 'ya. When DD was a newborn, I had fluid build-up around the base of my thumb, and ever so often it would catch and hurt so bad I;d drop what I had in that hand. I was concerned because I didn't want to drop DD when I was feeding her (I held her in that arm and held her bottle with the other), so I went to the dr. This guy looks at me with a straight face and asks if I can just do all that one-handed. I thought, OMG, not only do they allow you to vote, they admitted you to medical school. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
creekland Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 Thanks for letting me vent, guys. You're right about the driving thing now that you point it out. It's been about 70/30 for me and doctors. 70% of the time they seem soooo incompetent. 30% of the time they're great. I'm kinda thinking it's the area we're in. I'm waiting for middle son to graduate from med school (of course, he has to finish undergrad first - details, details). Then he knows he's responsible for any and all of our medical needs. I'd definitely trust him with my life. If he decides to work in this area I'll let you know, but I've no idea how drawn to coming home he is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Word Nerd Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 I hope they find something that helps with the pain soon. That sounds terrible. What in the world was she thinking? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bettyandbob Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 I don't trust doctors. I use them, but I haven't trusted them since a neurologist (the "guy"to go to) first acted like I was a simpleton for being concerned about the amount seizures dd was having. And then seriously over prescribed her seizure med. Her liver was going to be destroyed by his treatment. In the end I discovered the cause of the seizures through my own research and because the neurologist just wanted to treat seizures , but not diagnose. Anyway, medical personnel screw up. I hope your dh feels better soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katy Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 Yeah, they just don't get it. Next time act as if he is paralyzed and whatever he is asking just isn't possible. "I'm sorry, that's not possible." Repeat, ad nauseum, and whey they raise their voice, softly suggest that perhaps they ought to go get someone who knows what they are doing. Eventually the medical assistant will go tell the RN or the doctor himself and they'll figure out a work around. Never leave pain decisions to someone who makes $10/hour who graduated from a 3 month program at a community college. Also, most patients at pain clinics are on high, constant doses of narcotics and the MA has learned that if she just repeats things over and over people will obey. Stand up to her. Be the squeaky wheel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
busymama7 Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 I had a friend who passed out and had a small seizure after donating blood at a blood drive. They called an ambulance who took her to the hospital. Immediately upon arrival someone came to her with like ten vials to fill wih blood. She was still pretty out of it but her husband tries to stop them explaining what just happened and expressing concern about them drawing more blood, especially that much. The nurse kept saying that it is standard procedure to draw blood on admittance to the ER and they had to. I actually don't remember the end result but the scenario as described to me has always stuck in my head. I think it is in part that in order to prevent large mistakes they have policies and procedures to follow specifically and they are taught to just do exactly as they are told. But it does seem to remove common sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MotherGoose Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 Many of the things doctors do are CYA to help prevent lawsuits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slartibartfast Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 They told me I could drive home after my first cortisone shot but I actually could not have driven home. I couldn't lift up my knees afterwards. I couldn't get in the car, not because I couldn't bend but because I couldn't lift my legs. I kind of just fell into the car. :lol: The second and third shots were a bit easier so I thought I could drive home after the fourth one. That was the one I got *after* the inflammation had settled. I sobbed the entire way home. it was horrible! IMO no one should drive home after that! Those people are crazy! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twigs Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 :grouphug: :grouphug: :grouphug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kroe1 Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 Speaking in generalities, not specific to the original poster. You guys are basically saying that you spend a lot of money going to people you do not even trust who have no common sense. So who is the one without common sense again? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elisabet1 Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 I have had such horrid experiences with doctors myself. I know we see doctors more than average (I have lung and kidney problems, and endocrine, I have 3 children with ASD, my husband has a heart defect, and I am pregnant, again). But my gosh, I have so many nightmare stories of stupidity. I have had a few times where I had to go straight from one hospital to another. Last baby, I went to L&D in horrible painful labor that had gone on for more than a day and a half, they would not even triage me because my OB was at a football game and told them not to triage me because he would not come in until after the game. I went from there to a different labor and delivery where they found the baby in distress and I had an emergency c-sect. Another time, I went to an ER, years ago, hardly able to walk from the pain. Turned out, I had kidney stones, big ones. They said go home and call a urologist on Monday. I said but I cannot even walk. So they injected me with a painkiller I was allergic to and gave me a throw up container and told me to leave or security would carry me out and drop me on the sidewalk. They managed to get me in a wheelchair and to the car where my husband drove straight from there to a different ER where they determined I was in immediate danger of going septic. I had a fever of over 103 and my ureter was blocked. I was taken in for emergency surgery. And these are not even my worst stories!!!! My son DIED from malpractice! Don't even want to talk about that. I do not trust doctors for the most part. It is always check check check and double check again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garga Posted November 21, 2014 Author Share Posted November 21, 2014 ! My son DIED from malpractice! Don't even want to talk about that. I do not trust doctors for the most part. It is always check check check and double check again. Oh, that's terrible. You poor, poor dear. :( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garga Posted November 21, 2014 Author Share Posted November 21, 2014 Yeah, they just don't get it. Next time act as if he is paralyzed and whatever he is asking just isn't possible. "I'm sorry, that's not possible." Repeat, ad nauseum, and whey they raise their voice, softly suggest that perhaps they ought to go get someone who knows what they are doing. Eventually the medical assistant will go tell the RN or the doctor himself and they'll figure out a work around. Never leave pain decisions to someone who makes $10/hour who graduated from a 3 month program at a community college. Also, most patients at pain clinics are on high, constant doses of narcotics and the MA has learned that if she just repeats things over and over people will obey. Stand up to her. Be the squeaky wheel. If there's a next time, I'll be with him the entire time. I was with him through all the questions because he was so drugged on valium that he couldn't think straight. I thought my part was done when they were ready to give him the shot. I thought it was safe. I waited in the waiting room with the kids and didn't hear about the goofiness of having him lie down and bend his arm till it was done. I have learned my lesson. Never, ever leave the patient alone. I would have totally run interference or him. Poor guy. His arm ached for hours after having to hold it funny during the shot. HOWEVER--good news. For the moment he's in considerably less pain. There's a risk it will get worse over the next two days before it stabilizes, but for the moment, he's getting relief for the first time in weeks. And that's why we put up with the medical community's goofiness. Because when they do come through, it's awesome. Getting there can be a hard road, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AimeeM Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 We've had pretty fabulous luck with doctors, in general. A couple oddities here and there, but overall a sincerely great bunch of doctors - especially DS5's team of specialists. I hope your DH feels better soon. I have seeing family in pain :( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sassenach Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 DH has a chronic pain condition, and all I can say is AMEN, sister. I am amazed by how thoroughly the staff in the PAIN clinic just completely doesn't get it. It's maddening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ausmumof3 Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 As a spin off there is an interesting talk on Ted by a doctor at the moment. She is calling for more openness and disclosure of doctors affiliations. She's started a website called know my doctor where doctors can voluntarily list themselves and any links they have to drug companies etc, policies or beliefs on birth control and stuff like that. She has received death threats over it. I don't have immense faith in the medical system as a whole but overall it is still better than the alternative. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
creekland Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 Speaking in generalities, not specific to the original poster. You guys are basically saying that you spend a lot of money going to people you do not even trust who have no common sense. So who is the one without common sense again? Personally, I'm not saying they have no common sense. I feel they are (usually) doing the best they can with the info they have. However, the info they have in many of theses types of situations (vs, say, a broken bone from an accident) is verbal and language often is not an effective communicator. (How often do people get misunderstood on these boards?) The right questions might not be asked. Even if they are asked, the answers one gives can be understood differently than they are meant. The patient has no other experience to compare. The doctor rarely has been in the patient's condition to correctly understand. Add that all to the fact that our bodies are different and will react differently and doctors may have some things higher on their list of concerns than the patient does. Then add how many people they need to be seeing in any given day. I know when I help multiple kids in multiple subjects at school (like in a tutoring situation), it keeps my brain hopping and I sometimes overlook things I shouldn't. When I help multiple kids on exactly the same problem, it's easy/routine, but then when another question comes up I have to stop to think about it a little bit (usually). Some questions can require a bit of thought, but I might have just 5 minutes or so on the spot. Imagine that not with math or science, but with medical issues. I'll admit to only going to doctors as a last resort (but that's not really a reasoned decision if I'm honest). If I ever manage to get meningitis or anything requiring a fast response, I'm history. But when I do go, I don't really expect miracles. As long as the doctor isn't drunk or high or sleep deprived, I'll give them check marks in the plus column for trying to help and I appreciate the knowledge they bring to the table. But I also go home and use google, the Hive (sometimes), and IRL friends to assess options/suggestions. I compare all of their thoughts to the cues my body is giving me. I've got all of 5 days to come to a decision on an unsure (to me) issue as I type. It's not a fun time, but I really don't feel like totally dissing the doctors even though I'm thinking they aren't right in this case. They could be right. I don't have much to compare with. Chances are I'll quit with the doctors and head back into my cave either opting to live with it or continuing to try to do things myself to make things better, but I don't know for sure. I'm still on the fence. If they are correct, this is the wrong decision. And this is why I think the better solution is to establish Body Marts and allow people of middle age (or with special conditions) to go select a new model of their choice rather than repairing the old one. HOWEVER--good news. For the moment he's in considerably less pain. There's a risk it will get worse over the next two days before it stabilizes, but for the moment, he's getting relief for the first time in weeks. And that's why we put up with the medical community's goofiness. Because when they do come through, it's awesome. Getting there can be a hard road, though. Glad to hear there's been positive change!!! And yes, this is exactly why it can be worth going this route when nothing else has worked (or sooner for some). I hope things continue to work! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laura Corin Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 Like the time my son had a wart. We spent about $150 in copays, my insurance was charged many hundreds, and my son endured terrible blisters from the acid treatments and pain from the burning/icing treatments. In the end, I asked the dermatologist, "I've been reading about tea tree oil. What if I said let's not do this latest acid treatment and I just tried the tea tree oil?" She said, "That's a good idea. I won't charge you for this visit." $6 and 3 weeks later the wart was gone, painlessly. Apparently she wasn't allowed to tell me about the tea tree oil because it's not an FDA approved treatment or something like that, but she knew it would work. ARGH. It depends so much on the doctor. When Calvin had a plantar wart, the doctor said, 'Well I could start treatment on him but I've been hearing from my patients about using banana skin. It might be worth a try if you feel like it.' There's no financial incentive for doctors to recommend (most) treatments here, so that might open up more space for this kind of conversation. L Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SparklyUnicorn Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 Wow, I don't understand that either. Very bizarre. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lizzie in Ma Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 :grouphug: :grouphug: I am so sorry. Dr.'s are a mixed bag for sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Susan in TN Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 Speaking in generalities, not specific to the original poster. You guys are basically saying that you spend a lot of money going to people you do not even trust who have no common sense. So who is the one without common sense again? Right, but honestly, "going to the doctor" is what we are taught to do from birth. Sometimes it saves lives, and sometimes the pediatrician decides that your child has a mental disorder and prescribes an empty placebo inhaler. Sometimes the general practitioner doesn't want to have to report a case of chicken pox in a vaccinated child, so instead they tell you she has scabbies and suggest you cover her body with neurotoxins. But then you finally find a doctor who discovers that the ringworm your child has been treated for for 6 months is actually a particular form of eczema, and it is finally taken care of. Or your dad has a stint put in his heart and years later he is still doing great. I have had doctors and nurses scoff at me for having looked up information and possible alternative treatments for things on the internet, but honestly, what do they expect? They are not all-knowing gods, and neither are we. But unlike in decades past, we have a (sometimes reliable and sometimes not reliable) resource to at least attempt to educate ourselves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LMV Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 I'm kinda thinking it's the area we're in. I'm waiting for middle son to graduate from med school (of course, he has to finish undergrad first - details, details). Then he knows he's responsible for any and all of our medical needs. I'd definitely trust him with my life. If he decides to work in this area I'll let you know, but I've no idea how drawn to coming home he is. Before your son starts providing medical care to anyone in his immediate family, please make sure that he looks at how his state medical board would view his actions. Generally, I believe that physicians should only be treating family members in life threatening emergencies when they are the only available physician [either literally or because they happen to be the only one available with certain specific training in the emergency]. Your son doesn't need to share my view but he does need to make sure that his practices are in line with the licensing board(s) in the state(s) he practices in. I'm not trying to be difficult I'm just genuinely surprised sometimes at physicians who were apparently oblivious on this point and then end up with action taken against their license because they have been treating and or prescribing to family members. [Yes, I realize that some prescribing to family members is just an iceberg tip in terms of controlled substance diversion but I've seen licenses encumbered for what is "legitimate" prescribing as in there wouldn't be an issue if the prescription wasn't written for mom.] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mandylubug Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 I think sometimes common sense doesn't come naturally to some. Like my dr office today, I need an updated prescription yesterday. I call today to discuss my issues and the lady on the phone says "ok, I'll email dr. Xxx now" I asked her if he was not in office because I need this med now. I've already missed a dose. Her reply "oh, he's in his private office. He prefers we communicate via email." Seriously, walk down the hallway and knock on the freaking door!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
creekland Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 Before your son starts providing medical care to anyone in his immediate family, please make sure that he looks at how his state medical board would view his actions. Generally, I believe that physicians should only be treating family members in life threatening emergencies when they are the only available physician [either literally or because they happen to be the only one available with certain specific training in the emergency]. Your son doesn't need to share my view but he does need to make sure that his practices are in line with the licensing board(s) in the state(s) he practices in. I'm not trying to be difficult I'm just genuinely surprised sometimes at physicians who were apparently oblivious on this point and then end up with action taken against their license because they have been treating and or prescribing to family members. [Yes, I realize that some prescribing to family members is just an iceberg tip in terms of controlled substance diversion but I've seen licenses encumbered for what is "legitimate" prescribing as in there wouldn't be an issue if the prescription wasn't written for mom.] In his case mom doesn't even take meds prescribed (or offered/suggested) by other docs, so he's probably fine. ;) But your overall thought is noted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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