I need advise, please - baptising your child

[Mandarinmom]

Thank you very much your comments. This changed my thinking and plans. Really appreciate it! Still reading...

 

The dilemma is that I was taught it is a tradition in Russian Orthodox Christian church that baptizing or chistening is obligatory for a child to be considered by God. Until then the child is not under the Gods protection. Everyone was baptized as a baby, in many cases by grand or great grandmother secretly if young parents did not want or could not do it for some reason (mainly political, anti-religious, etc.) So, my fear is that my child is unprotected because of me...

Edited August 28, 2012 by Mandarinmom

[nansk]

nm

Edited August 27, 2012 by nansk
PMing instead.

[IsabelC]

I'm really sorry you are facing such a quandary. It must be a very difficult decision.

 

My first thought was that if I were religious enough for it to be essential to have children baptized, then I wouldn't have married a radical atheist. But obviously it is how it is, and there are reasons for it, so...

 

I don't think I would do something like that and try to hide if from my husband. I'd seriously question the continuing viability of the marriage if I felt I had to do something important behind his back. Do you believe that it is absolutely imperative to baptize your child no matter what? If so, is there any way at all that you can make it happen in a way that is acceptable to your husband?

[tammieb]

I realize you're dealing with what appears to be an unanswerable question, but remember wisdom comes from God. ANY problem He allows into our lives, He will give an answer for.

 

There are a couple of basic truths that came to mind when I read your question. Whenever our family has something we can't seem to see the answer for, we always start with what we KNOW to be truth and work our way out from there.

 

1) NEVER, EVER hide ANYTHING from you husband! The two of you are "one flesh." If you have a desire to see him come to know Christ as you and your daughter do, keeping secrets from him is not the answer.

 

2) Baptism is a step of obedience in the life of a Christian. If her father has adamently said he does NOT want her baptized, then allowing her to be baptized against her father's wishes would be encouraging DISobedience.

 

3) Read I Peter Chapter 3. So many Christians take these verses out of context. Read it in it's entirety. The husband in verse one that "believes not the word" is speaking of an unsaved husband married to a saved wife.

 

4) PRAY!!!!! EARNESTLY!!!!!!! My FAVORITE quote in the Bible is in found in a couple of places (Proverbs, and I think in Psalms) --- "God knows the hearts of ALL men." God created your husband. God knows why he is so against knowing Him. And God KNOWS what it will take for him to come to Him.

 

I hope that helps without sounding too "preachy." My husband and I lived the first 13 years of our marriage in reverse -- he was saved and I wasn't. I know how the Lord drew me. It wasn't in my husband forcing his "religion" (I use that word VERY loosely!) on me and my children. It was in seeing Christ IN HIM, in his actions, EVERY DAY! When the point came the Lord began to draw me to Him, he used my husband's testimony in so many ways.

 

I pray you find the answers you seek! God knows EXACTLY where you are! He KNEW you were going to be in this position. And He has the answer for you.

 

God Bless!

 

Tammie

[Crimson Wife]

Would he allow her to be baptized when she is old enough to express a desire for it herself? If so, I would raise her as a Christian even if she isn't baptized as early as I would prefer.

 

:grouphug::grouphug::grouphug:

[ktgrok]

I'd do it over his objections, but not secretly. I don't believe in dishonesty in marraige. He'd be upset, and I'd have to deal with that. But I'd do it. If he truly is an atheist I don't see how it matters to him that much, anyway. What harm is there if there is no God, to sprinkle with water?

[Mama Geek]

Would he allow her to be baptized when she is old enough to express a desire for it herself? If so, I would raise her as a Christian even if she isn't baptized as early as I would prefer.

 

:grouphug::grouphug::grouphug:

 

:iagree:

 

Dh and I have a little different issue. He doesn't want dd baptized as an infant and I did. This was a sore discussion point long before dd came along. At some point I came to the realization that he loves dd and has her best interest at heart and I am willing to let him lead. This is a different situation than yours though.

[kwickimom]

No do not do it secretly. . The only way this is going to work out is if you be the christian wife God wants you to be DESPITE what your husband believes. The only way he is going to ever change his mind or see God is through you and your daughter and it will not help if you sneak around.

I would talk to your pastor and see what he thinks. This is a very hard situation. I do believe that God will still allow children in heaven that are not baptized. She can do it when it is her choice and when the time is right.

[butterflymommy]

I've done it myself secretly. I have no regrets but I was up against apathy, not hostility. I did the older ones, a friend secretly baptized our youngest.

[Mom-ninja.]

I just wonder how someone who is so devoutly religious ends up with someone who is so devoutly not. LOL

 

I don't have advice. I'm an atheist, but if my husband suddenly told me baptism was important to him I'd let him do it for his own comfort because I care about his feelings and I couldn't be mad at him for something like that. My non belief is not a religion to me. So it means nothing to me if my child is baptized or not (it does no harm). If it meant something to my husband, so be it.

 

All this to say I think your issues are far deeper than the baptism.

 

I'm also atheist and I would not have cared if the kids were baptized when they were babies. I even offered to dh that if it was important to his parents then we could do it. It was a non issue with me.

 

My dh on the other hand, who is anti organized religion, was absolutely hard core against the boys being baptized. We actually even debated about it. I, the atheist, was trying to convince the agnostic that it would do our kids no harm, and it would comfort the extended family. My dh made it very clear to me that there was no way his kids would ever be baptized. I'll spare you his actual words. Let's just say that I realized how important it was to him. He has his reasons and I won't list them here. He feels strongly about those reasons. For him it is the principle of the matter.

 

Because I know how important it is to him, I stand united with him. My parents argued and pleaded with me, but I remained firm for dh.

 

The funny part is that his family (more religious) than mine have never said a word about it.....at least to me. I know that they blame me for the lack of religion in our home, and for the kids not being baptized. I'm fine with being the scape goat. :tongue_smilie: Why burst my mil's bubble about her son being perfect? If she knew how her son really felt.....oh boy. He does not have pleasant things to say about being raised in his religious home.

 

Now, the fact that the extended family feel that my dc are doomed is not my problem. It's their belief and so they have to deal with it as best they can.

 

 

 

 

If he truly is an atheist I don't see how it matters to him that much, anyway. What harm is there if there is no God, to sprinkle with water?

 

For my dh it's the principle. It's his way of making a stand against the religion he was raised in and has strong feelings against. It's not just water.....it's what it symbolizes to him that he opposes.

[Cera]

I just wonder how someone who is so devoutly religious ends up with someone who is so devoutly not. LOL

 

I don't have advice. I'm an atheist, but if my husband suddenly told me baptism was important to him I'd let him do it for his own comfort because I care about his feelings and I couldn't be mad at him for something like that. My non belief is not a religion to me. So it means nothing to me if my child is baptized or not (it does no harm). If it meant something to my husband, so be it.

 

All this to say I think your issues are far deeper than the baptism.

 

 

:iagree:

 

Absolutely. We went through this and this is exactly how I handled it (except my dh wasn't the one who thought baptism was important, his grandmother was).

[Parrothead]

Well, you could do what my mom did. Wait for your dh to go off to war then visit you mom and have your dd baptized. It was a done deal by the time dad got home.

 

Now, to clarify. Daddy is not atheist. He was in the "let the baby grow up and chose what she wants" camp.

 

In lieu of waiting for your dh to go off to war, you could just go visit your mom and have the kiddo quietly baptized. I wouldn't keep it a secret though. More of a don't-ask-don't-tell thing.

[DawnM]

Well, I don't believe that you just baptize someone.....I believe that they need to have a knowledge of faith and that baptism is an outward show of devotion to God. I also don't believe baptism is necessary for salvation, nor does it actually do any saving.

 

The reason I said the above is that I feel it prefaces my answer. NO, I don't think you should do this to your daughter. If she isn't asking for it, there is no reason (according to my understanding of Biblical baptism) to do it.

[kiana]

I wouldn't do it behind his back.

[DawnM]

I do know this. DH grew up very nominally Catholic. He never set foot in Mass in his life, but dog gone it, they had him baptized as an infant. His sister says she "doesn't believe in all that God stuff," but she too made sure her children were baptized, I guess "just in case."

 

Dh was baptized again as an adult believer after he became a Christian. His mother saw the picture in our home and went NUTS. WHAT IS THIS? WHAT, THE FIRST TIME WAN"T GOOD ENOUGH?"

 

Dh calmly told her that he had no idea he had been baptized before as she NEVER told him and it was never mentioned in their household nor did they ever attend church. :glare:

 

Dawn

 

See some people believe that if you aren't baptized you could go to hell. So Catholics hurry up and do it. I remember as a kid being horrified meeting kids who were not baptized. I thought they would go to hell and I was scared for them.

 

I now do not believe that, but it took me a long time to get over it. I'm not even sure if it is true, but somehow/somewhere I picked up that message.

[JVA]

I realize you're dealing with what appears to be an unanswerable question, but remember wisdom comes from God. ANY problem He allows into our lives, He will give an answer for.

 

There are a couple of basic truths that came to mind when I read your question. Whenever our family has something we can't seem to see the answer for, we always start with what we KNOW to be truth and work our way out from there.

 

1) NEVER, EVER hide ANYTHING from you husband! The two of you are "one flesh." If you have a desire to see him come to know Christ as you and your daughter do, keeping secrets from him is not the answer.

 

2) Baptism is a step of obedience in the life of a Christian. If her father has adamently said he does NOT want her baptized, then allowing her to be baptized against her father's wishes would be encouraging DISobedience.

 

3) Read I Peter Chapter 3. So many Christians take these verses out of context. Read it in it's entirety. The husband in verse one that "believes not the word" is speaking of an unsaved husband married to a saved wife.

 

4) PRAY!!!!! EARNESTLY!!!!!!! My FAVORITE quote in the Bible is in found in a couple of places (Proverbs, and I think in Psalms) --- "God knows the hearts of ALL men." God created your husband. God knows why he is so against knowing Him. And God KNOWS what it will take for him to come to Him.

 

I hope that helps without sounding too "preachy." My husband and I lived the first 13 years of our marriage in reverse -- he was saved and I wasn't. I know how the Lord drew me. It wasn't in my husband forcing his "religion" (I use that word VERY loosely!) on me and my children. It was in seeing Christ IN HIM, in his actions, EVERY DAY! When the point came the Lord began to draw me to Him, he used my husband's testimony in so many ways.

 

I pray you find the answers you seek! God knows EXACTLY where you are! He KNEW you were going to be in this position. And He has the answer for you.

 

God Bless!

 

Tammie

 

:iagree::iagree:....Couldn't have said it better. Also, ask believing friends to pray for you and your husband....that you will know God's will in this and that his heart could be softened to know how much the Lord loves him.

[littlebug42]

I would baptize my children. I believe firmly that this should be done and I don't think that my wishes for my children should be second to my husband's. We are both parents of this child. I can let a lot of things go but this just isn't one of them. If dh chooses not to participate, then fine. That is his choice.

[Ellie]

I would baptize my children. I believe firmly that this should be done and I don't think that my wishes for my children should be second to my husband's. We are both parents of this child. I can let a lot of things go but this just isn't one of them. If dh chooses not to participate, then fine. That is his choice.

:iagree::iagree::iagree:

[In the Rain]

Why is your husband opposed, rather than indifferent? I'm not an atheist, but it seems to me like an atheist wouldn't care about the ceremony because it wouldn't mean anything to them. :confused:

[J-rap]

I realize you're dealing with what appears to be an unanswerable question, but remember wisdom comes from God. ANY problem He allows into our lives, He will give an answer for.

 

There are a couple of basic truths that came to mind when I read your question. Whenever our family has something we can't seem to see the answer for, we always start with what we KNOW to be truth and work our way out from there.

 

1) NEVER, EVER hide ANYTHING from you husband! The two of you are "one flesh." If you have a desire to see him come to know Christ as you and your daughter do, keeping secrets from him is not the answer.

 

2) Baptism is a step of obedience in the life of a Christian. If her father has adamently said he does NOT want her baptized, then allowing her to be baptized against her father's wishes would be encouraging DISobedience.

 

3) Read I Peter Chapter 3. So many Christians take these verses out of context. Read it in it's entirety. The husband in verse one that "believes not the word" is speaking of an unsaved husband married to a saved wife.

 

4) PRAY!!!!! EARNESTLY!!!!!!! My FAVORITE quote in the Bible is in found in a couple of places (Proverbs, and I think in Psalms) --- "God knows the hearts of ALL men." God created your husband. God knows why he is so against knowing Him. And God KNOWS what it will take for him to come to Him.

 

I hope that helps without sounding too "preachy." My husband and I lived the first 13 years of our marriage in reverse -- he was saved and I wasn't. I know how the Lord drew me. It wasn't in my husband forcing his "religion" (I use that word VERY loosely!) on me and my children. It was in seeing Christ IN HIM, in his actions, EVERY DAY! When the point came the Lord began to draw me to Him, he used my husband's testimony in so many ways.

 

I pray you find the answers you seek! God knows EXACTLY where you are! He KNEW you were going to be in this position. And He has the answer for you.

 

God Bless!

 

Tammie

 

:iagree: Also, I don't believe baptism is what saves a person anyway. Baptism is a nice symbol of faith, but the real faith lies in the heart and mind of the individual, and the salvation comes through the grace of God. Your daughter can choose to be baptized herself when she is older.

[IsabelC]

Why is your husband opposed, rather than indifferent? I'm not an atheist, but it seems to me like an atheist wouldn't care about the ceremony because it wouldn't mean anything to them. :confused:

 

There are quite a few reasons why an atheist might be against the baptism.

 

For starters, Just because something isn't what you believe in, it doesn't follow that it would be meaningless. Imagine your were Christian, but your partner belonged to the Cult of Isis and wanted to initiate your children into that faith. Would you feel that this is fine, because you don't believe in Isis? I doubt it.

[Sneezyone]

Deceit is never a good idea.

[sahm99]

I would discuss this with a priest.

 

In the Catholic church this might fall under the "intention to baptize" category... If this was the case, the child would be considered baptized until it can be done...

I really am not sure, though, but simply can't imagine any priest supporting a "secret baptism":001_unsure:

Edited August 27, 2012 by sahm99

[In the Rain]

There are quite a few reasons why an atheist might be against the baptism.

 

For starters, Just because something isn't what you believe in, it doesn't follow that it would be meaningless. Imagine your were Christian, but your partner belonged to the Cult of Isis and wanted to initiate your children into that faith. Would you feel that this is fine, because you don't believe in Isis? I doubt it.

 

I see your point. I had considered that, but couldn't think of a polite way to ask if he might view her denomination as a cult.

 

My personal belief is that people can be saved without being baptized. My own children have expressed their salvation, but don't feel ready to be baptized. Dh and I are okay with that.

 

I agree with those who say not to do something behind your dh's back. Deciept is never a good thing in a marriage.

[justamouse]

I'd do it over his objections, but not secretly. I don't believe in dishonesty in marraige. He'd be upset, and I'd have to deal with that. But I'd do it. If he truly is an atheist I don't see how it matters to him that much, anyway. What harm is there if there is no God, to sprinkle with water?

 

:iagree:

 

Set out as you intend to go on.

 

But I take my Dh on in things like that, I don't hide them. I get what I want too (as opposed to him getting his way all the time), in my marriage, it's a partnership, not a benevolent dictatorship. ;)

 

You married him and he knew you were a Christian? Than this should be no surprise to him. And, it should be no surprise to you that he doesn't want his child baptized.

[WIS0320]

I just wonder how someone who is so devoutly religious ends up with someone who is so devoutly not.

 

Perhaps she converted after she was married. I'm personally in that situation and it isn't always easy!

[QueenCat]

Deceipt is likely to cause a huge rift in your marriage; one far greater than this. Baptism does not save you, it is an outward proclamation between God, you, your child and the church. It doesn't change that you will be raising your child in the faith. Just wait unless you want huge marital problems, which will be problems you are intentionally choosing if you go behind his back.

[Parrothead]

:iagree: Also, I don't believe baptism is what saves a person anyway. Baptism is a nice symbol of faith, but the real faith lies in the heart and mind of the individual, and the salvation comes through the grace of God. Your daughter can choose to be baptized herself when she is older.

It really will depend on the OPs faith. Some Christian groups believe the above - symbolic/is okay to ask for it later. Others believe baptism is crucial to salvation. To be in the later category and to be told it is no big deal is not helpful.

 

While true that one can be baptized at any age, for those believing that baptism is a sacrament of initiation having it done sooner rather than later takes a worry (of the child's immortal soul) off the plate of mother's worries.

[Parrothead]

Deceipt is likely to cause a huge rift in your marriage; one far greater than this. Baptism does not save you, it is an outward proclamation between God, you, your child and the church. It doesn't change that you will be raising your child in the faith. Just wait unless you want huge marital problems, which will be problems you are intentionally choosing if you go behind his back.

The bolded is debatable and apparently not in the OPs belief system. Otherwise there would be no current conflict.

[J-rap]

It really will depend on the OPs faith. Some Christian groups believe the above - symbolic/is okay to ask for it later. Others believe baptism is crucial to salvation. To be in the later category and to be told it is no big deal is not helpful.

 

While true that one can be baptized at any age, for those believing that baptism is a sacrament of initiation having it done sooner rather than later takes a worry (of the child's immortal soul) off the plate of mother's worries.

 

That's true. I guess I'm not sure what I'd advise in this case then! I suppose that's when you pray really hard and hope that a wise solution is revealed, or that her husband has a change of heart. In any case, I think I'd wait it out just a bit...

[Halcyon]

Not exactly the same situation, but my DH is Jewish and doesn't want the kids baptized "before they decide on their own to do so". I thought this would mean when they turned 13 or so (that's when my father allowed me to be baptized; he is an atheist). But DH recently told me, no, that means when they are 18. So we're at an impasse. Nonetheless, he doesn't mind me taking them to church weekly, and we've told our church the issue and they are fine with it. The children participate as acolytes, fully participate in Sunday School and other church activities.

 

Then again, I don't believe they will "go to hell" if they are not baptized. In fact, I don't believe there is a hell, so there's that. :tongue_smilie:

 

ETA: It would be the end of our marriage if I baptized them behind DH's back. It wouldn't be about the religion thing. It would be about the deceit. He has clearly expressed his wishes to me, and either I agree, or I convince him otherwise through my powers of persuasion ;) But do it behind his back? No way.

Edited August 27, 2012 by Halcyon

[katilac]

See some people believe that if you aren't baptized you could go to hell. So Catholics hurry up and do it. I remember as a kid being horrified meeting kids who were not baptized. I thought they would go to hell and I was scared for them.

 

I now do not believe that, but it took me a long time to get over it. I'm not even sure if it is true, but somehow/somewhere I picked up that message.

 

No, the Catholic teaching was that unbaptized babies can't go to heaven, which may not sound very nice but is considerably nicer than going to hell ;)

 

They went to what Catholics called Limbo, where their souls would be happy but couldn't feel the "pure joy" of being in God's presence.

 

That teaching has since been revised to say that unbaptized babies might go to Limbo or they might go to Heaven; we do not have enough information to know.

 

I'm not arguing for or against the soundness of this teaching. I am just trying to ease the mind of anyone bothered by the thought of a religion thinking that babies can go to hell.

[BlsdMama]

One has to wonder, why, if he's an atheist, he minds his kid being dipped in water.... You know, if it means nothing?

 

We are a mixed household as well and religion is tricky. I'd advise you to honor both God and husband and try to help him see why you want to do this thing without making him feel like he doesn't count, kwim?

[Caitilin]

If I believed in baptism as a sacrament, then this is something I would fight for. As pp said, my beliefs are no less important than those of my husband, and if I regarded this as spiritually efficacious (as I in fact do), then yes, it would happen. ;)

[Farrar]

There are quite a few reasons why an atheist might be against the baptism.

 

For starters, Just because something isn't what you believe in, it doesn't follow that it would be meaningless. Imagine your were Christian, but your partner belonged to the Cult of Isis and wanted to initiate your children into that faith. Would you feel that this is fine, because you don't believe in Isis? I doubt it.

 

But that's completely different to me. If you're Christian (or Jewish or Hindu or Pagan or whatever...) then you have a set of beliefs that can be violated. If you truly believe none of it means anything, then it comes off to me as if it's a power play in the marriage and the parenting.

[BlsdMama]

 

They went to what Catholics called Limbo

 

 

I think you are thinking of Purgatory? Limbo is definitely not the term. ;)

 

ETA: Oh my goodness! I'm wrong, it IS the technical term. Limbo of the infants?

 

Catholic schools have failed in my teaching.

[Caitilin]

I think you are thinking of Purgatory? Limbo is definitely not the technical term. ;)

 

Actually, though it has been "phased out" in recent times, Limbo was definitely the real deal for a while. ;) purgatory is a place to pay off one's debts, so to speak, so an infant would not go there.

[Carol in Cal.]

I'd do it, but not secretly. Raising my kids in the Faith is one of my most important and nonnegotiable responsibilities. I would do it out in the open and let the chips fall where they may. "We must obey God rather than men."

[forty-two]

But that's completely different to me. If you're Christian (or Jewish or Hindu or Pagan or whatever...) then you have a set of beliefs that can be violated. If you truly believe none of it means anything, then it comes off to me as if it's a power play in the marriage and the parenting.

Well, some atheists believe that religion, though false, has a negative effect on believers and society. Or have a belief system that prizes seeking truth, and would not want their dc initiated into a false superstition. I can see why some atheists would be as adamant about not baptizing their dc as Christians or other devout believers would be about their dc being initiated into what is to them a false religion.

 

But in that case, they'd probably not want their dc raised in a false religion, either, which complicates things even more.

 

I do believe that God saves through baptism, and baptizing my dc was very important to me. (I had my newborn ds baptized in the hospital before receiving a blood transfusion because it was that big of a deal to me.) But I don't believe that God *only* saves through baptism - I would maybe not baptize my dc if my dh was dead set against baptism, but *would* allow me to raise them in the Christian faith. I'd discuss it with my pastor for sure.

 

But if my dh refused not just baptism but also letting me raise them in the Christian faith, I *would* baptize them, no question. If he can't respect my having any religious influence on my dc at all, then I wouldn't feel like I needed to respect a particular desire of his on the topic, and baptism is a huge enough thing to me to be worth the discord (in such a situation, I think my dc would need all the saving grace they could get). I'd do it openly, though (possibly in the "asking forgiveness rather than permission" way, which would rightly upset him, but I would weather that) - because if you are *that* scared of his reaction that you don't want to be open about something so important to you, I think there are bigger problems.

 

:grouphug: This would be a very hard position for me. :grouphug:

[Parrothead]

I think you are thinking of Purgatory? Limbo is definitely not the term. ;)

 

ETA: Oh my goodness! I'm wrong, it IS the technical term. Limbo of the infants?

 

Catholic schools have failed in my teaching.

This is one of those things that falls into the category of mystery. For a long time because there is nothing in the Bible or Tradition (note the T is not a t) as to the state of an unbaptized child's soul, it was believed that unbaptized babies/kids couldn't get into Heaven. Because in order to get into Heaven, one has to be baptized.

 

Yet at the same time since babies/small children haven't reached the age of accountability they would definitely not be going to Hell.

 

So there was a lot of guess work going on. Theologians never could come to any kind of agreement. Unfortunately lots of parents suffered thinking their unborn babies/deceased young children would not be in Heaven because priests had no clear teaching on the state of these peoples' souls.

 

Officially the teaching today is:

CCC: 1261 As regard children who have died without Baptism, the Church can only entrust them to the mercy of God, as she does in her funeral rites for them. Indeed the great mercy of God who desires that all men should be saved, and Jesus' tenderness toward children which caused him to say: "Let the children come to me, do not hinder them," (Mk 10:14; cf. 1 Tim 2:4) allow us to hope that here is a way of salvation for children who have died without Baptism. Al the more urgent is the church's call not to prevent little children coming to Christ through the gift of Holy Baptism.

[QueenCat]

The bolded is debatable and apparently not in the OPs belief system. Otherwise there would be no current conflict.

 

True, I wasn't really thinking of that as the op was quite that specific in her belief's. I can't imagine having such a conflict with my dh, so my focus was on that aspect.

[Parrothead]

I think you are thinking of Purgatory? Limbo is definitely not the term. ;)

 

ETA: Oh my goodness! I'm wrong, it IS the technical term. Limbo of the infants?

 

Catholic schools have failed in my teaching.

So very sadly they have failed a number of people.

[Dustybug]

Well, I don't believe that you just baptize someone.....I believe that they need to have a knowledge of faith and that baptism is an outward show of devotion to God. I also don't believe baptism is necessary for salvation, nor does it actually do any saving.

 

The reason I said the above is that I feel it prefaces my answer. NO, I don't think you should do this to your daughter. If she isn't asking for it, there is no reason (according to my understanding of Biblical baptism) to do it.

 

:iagree:

Deceit is never a good idea.

 

:iagree:

[Renthead Mommy]

My friend believes my husband was probably baptised in the bathtub by his very catholic grandmother. His mother was jewish, his father was ex-communicated catholic due to his divorce in first marriage. He was being raised jewish. She said Grandmothers things like that in situations where the gc were often done back in the late 60's. Today my husband is an agnostic.

 

I wanted my son baptised because that is what you do with babies. It was important to have a family thing and really important to me to for something "official" connecting my son to my best friend who is his godmother. Godparents are important so we had him baptised. My husband didn't really care one way or another just requested I not put him in some big dress. (which truthfully I wanted to, but couldn't as I didn't have enough material since I cut up my wedding dress to make his baptism outfit.)

[Crimson Wife]

I really am not sure, though, but simply can't immagine any priest supporting a "secret baptism":001_unsure:

 

My grandma was secretly baptized by the priest of the parish where her grandma and aunts worshiped. Her own mom had converted to Christian Science to the horror of the extended family, all of whom were devout Catholics. So great-great-grandma secretly had grandma baptized Catholic out of concern that she might get stuck in Limbo until Christ came again.

 

The ironic thing is that when my grandma grew up, she decided that she didn't want to be either a Christian Scientist or a Catholic but rather an Episcopalian.

[Mom-ninja.]

Well, some atheists believe that religion, though false, has a negative effect on believers and society. Or have a belief system that prizes seeking truth, and would not want their dc initiated into a false superstition. I can see why some atheists would be as adamant about not baptizing their dc as Christians or other devout believers would be about their dc being initiated into what is to them a false religion.

 

But in that case, they'd probably not want their dc raised in a false religion, either, which complicates things even more.

 

 

 

This. It's what I was trying to express before. My dh does not want our dc to be a part of it or what it stands for. There are atheists that do not view religion as harmless or the rituals as meaning nothing. The ritual of baptism would mean, to dh, a proclamation that he believes in what baptism stands for. He refuses to be in his words a "hypocrite." Please note that this is how my dh feels and I'm not saying that other atheists who allow baptism are hypocrites. :001_smile:

 

He has also made it clear that our kids will not be raised Christian among other religions. In fact, when I was exploring school options when our oldest was kindy age, he would not consider private Christian school an option. He would not even discuss it. It simply was not an option.

 

Again, there are atheists who possess more than a do-what-you-want-cause-it-means-nothing stance. Some take a more active role in acknowledging what they believe is truth and what is not.

[Mom-ninja.]

Yeah the guy is more a religion/god hater than a nonbeliever of religion/god. Is there a term for that?

 

Religion hater......yep. That sums up how some atheists feel.

[HappyCrazyMama]

I'd do it, but not secretly. Raising my kids in the Faith is one of my most important and nonnegotiable responsibilities. I would do it out in the open and let the chips fall where they may. "We must obey God rather than men."

:iagree:Yep, unless my priest advised otherwise my children would be baptized.

[Joanne]

But that's completely different to me. If you're Christian (or Jewish or Hindu or Pagan or whatever...) then you have a set of beliefs that can be violated. If you truly believe none of it means anything, then it comes off to me as if it's a power play in the marriage and the parenting.

 

Maybe he believes in a *lack* of religious indoctrination and feels that bapstism smacks of of indoctrination?

[Katy]

Religion hater......yep. That sums up how some atheists feel.

 

We have some friends who also claim to be athiest, but rather than indifferent, they are profoundly angry at God. All of their religious talk is centered on how it's impossible that God exists and still allow so much evil in the world.

 

My guess is that the same thing is going on here.

 

If DH suddenly announced he was athiest, and for some reason forbade me to baptize our children, I would do it anyway. IDK that I believe in baptism as a sacrament per se, but I definitely believe it at the very least acts as a hedge of protection spiritually. I believe in angels and demons and a supernatural realm most people can't see, and though it may not make a difference in their salvation, I can see that it might easily have a spiritual influence on them.

 

I would take them to be baptized, or maybe do it myself, and tell him later. If he threw a fit I'd probably ask why it mattered if God didn't exist.