The Denver cheerleaders pushed into splits by coach and other teammates...

[unsinkable]

What in the world?

 

who recorded that?

[AK_Mom4]

The question shouldnt be Who recoded that? A better question would be Why Would Anyone think that hurting kids is ok?

[marbel]

Here is a link to CNN story:  

 

http://www.cnn.com/2017/08/25/us/denver-cheerleaders-forced-into-splits-trnd/index.html

 

Or maybe I was the only one who  needed to google it.

 

But, hey, the video was "taken out of context!"  Come on, people!  Splits are important!!

 

ETA: I should clarify that I am being sarcastic.  Splits are not important to  me. 

Edited August 25, 2017 by marbel

[EmseB]

Every place I see this has people posting in the comments that this is common in competition dance and cheer.

 

Yikes.

[unsinkable]

The question shouldnt be Who recoded that? A better question would be Why Would Anyone think that hurting kids is ok?

I'm not condoning it bc I want to know who recorded it.

[unsinkable]

Here is a link to CNN story:

 

http://www.cnn.com/2017/08/25/us/denver-cheerleaders-forced-into-splits-trnd/index.html

 

Or maybe I was the only one who needed to google it.

 

But, hey, the video was "taken out of context!" Come on, people! Splits are important!!

 

ETA: I should clarify that I am being sarcastic. Splits are not important to me.

Thank you for linking.

[Rebel Yell]

That is horrible. One of my dancers was close to a being able to do a full split, but slipped getting into it and injured herself- it took over 6 MONTHS to recover. no one else was involved with her injury, it was just an accident.

 

Reading that article just sickened me. so angry for that poor girl.

[Guest]

:eek:  What in the world?!? 

[unsinkable]

:eek: What in the world?!?

I know, right?

[Murphy101]

I don't care if it happens 'all the time.' The commonality of dumbbutt jerkiness happening doesn't make it any less of either.

 

I think all staff who knew or participated should be fired and charged by police for child abuse or endangerment. And what's it called when adults encourage or demand or threaten other children to hurt each other? That too. At least two girls' parents said they suffered injures and the poor girl in the video is being treated to a hot mess of hostility now too.

Edited August 25, 2017 by Murphy101

[bettyandbob]

I don't believe this is limited to cheer. There are bad coaches across all sports. Coaches who refuse to learn proper training techniques and push athletes too far. Such coaches should be fired and should be criminally charged if there are applicable charges. 

[gingersmom]

I read that the coach had been let go from another program for the same behavior.

[Lady Florida.]

I agree there are bad coaches in all sports. I coached cheerleaders in my day. Granted it's been 20 years since I last coached a squad (when I quit teaching after having ds), but even back then when we knew less this would have been horrible. No one was required to do gymnastics of any kind. We had some who could and they were often featured in routines, but no one was ever forced into it. 

Edited August 25, 2017 by Lady Florida.

[Mimm]

What the heck???

 

How is it ok to have a girl begging them to stop hurting her and have everyone ignoring her?? Bodily autonomy really means nothing to entirely too many people.

[AmandaVT]

i agree there are bad coaches in all sports. I coached cheerleaders in my day. Granted it's been 20 years since I last coached a squad (when I quit teaching after having ds), but even back then when we knew less this would have been horrible. No one was required to do gymnastics of any kind. We had some who could and they were often featured in routines, but no one was ever forced into it. 

 

I stopped coaching in 2010 and I was a gymnast until about 1994 and this was never ok in any of the gyms I've been in! Splits can be learned, but slow and steady is the way to do it - the stretches should feel like a nice stretch, not painful! Poor girls....  :cursing:

[unsinkable]

I stopped coaching in 2010 and I was a gymnast until about 1994 and this was never ok in any of the gyms I've been in! Splits can be learned, but slow and steady is the way to do it - the stretches should feel like a nice stretch, not painful! Poor girls.... :cursing:

Have you ever seen the TV show that follows the women trying out for the Dallas Cowboy Cheerleaders? I always cringe when I see the girls who aren't confident with the jump split then do it any way.

[Lady Florida.]

I stopped coaching in 2010 and I was a gymnast until about 1994 and this was never ok in any of the gyms I've been in! Splits can be learned, but slow and steady is the way to do it - the stretches should feel like a nice stretch, not painful! Poor girls....  :cursing:

 

Are splits a thing now? They weren't that common (around here or in national competitions) when I coached from the mid 80s to the late 90s. A routine would maybe have one person in front, at the end, doing a split. Various forms of tumbling and being able to build (either as a good base or good top) were important. And of course, proper jump form. "Point those toes! No bent wrists!"

 

ETA: Splits were big when I was in school in the 70s. By the time I was coaching they seemed to have fallen out of style.

Edited August 25, 2017 by Lady Florida.

[AmandaVT]

Are splits a thing now? They weren't that common (around here or in national competitions) when I coached from the mid 80s to the late 90s. A routine would maybe have one person in front, at the end, doing a split. Various forms of tumbling and being able to build (either as a good base or good top) were important. And of course, proper jump form. "Point those toes! No bent wrists!"

 

ETA: Splits were big when I was in school in the 70s. By the time I was coaching they seemed to have fallen out of style.

 

I was a gymnastics coach, so yup splits were integral. Every class or team practice started and ended with stretching. I can still rock all three splits from all those years of leading stretch! But, nothing was ever done to pain. Sometimes the girls would push on each other, in a pike sit, to stretch the hamstrings, but as soon as the one stretching said enough - the other stopped. 

[Guest]

What the heck???

 

How is it ok to have a girl begging them to stop hurting her and have everyone ignoring her?? Bodily autonomy really means nothing to entirely too many people.

Especially for children. If you did that to an adult, it is assault.

[MercyA]

That was horrific. That poor girl.  :( Honestly, I hope she and her parents walk away with a nice fat settlement. 

[Butter]

Every place I see this has people posting in the comments that this is common in competition dance and cheer.

 

Yikes.

 

It didn't surprise me in the least either that it happened or that it was recorded.  My kids took gymnastics at a high level competitive gym.  My kids were rec kids just having fun.  Some of the competitive kids were stretched (to more than splits) by their coaches regularly.  Sometimes they would scream and cry and beg them to stop.  The coaches never did.  It was disturbing.  Unfortunately it is not uncommon.

[Guinevere]

I only lasted about 2 seconds into that video.  Why didn't the person taking the video stop them?  Was it another scared student?  

 

This is beyond wrong.

 

I think jail time is in order, honestly.

[mamakelly]

It's not even a regular split, it's an over split- over 180 degrees. They are holding her front leg off the ground, and I think the back leg too. Oversplits are really hard to get for most people, it's not common. I read somewhere that she was injured from this. I listened to the radio yesterday and they played just the audio and it's was horrifying.

[Guest]

It has now come out that the principal and the athletic director knew about this back in June, and met with the parents of one of the girls, but nothing was done about it. It wasn't until the local 9News did an investigative report a few days ago, and discovered that the coach has quite the past, and then featured the video on air, and on its website, that the school superintendent got involved. He watched the videos himself, and the coach was finally fired today. It came out that he had been fired from another school district, but left it off of his resume.

 

The principal and athletic director are "on leave," the news station is now pursuing why those two are still employed. The district has now called in legal advisors.

Edited August 26, 2017 by Fifiruth

[Arcadia]

Every place I see this has people posting in the comments that this is common in competition dance and cheer.

 

Yikes.

There are scholarships that cheerleaders can apply for.

 

At the competition level, many in the competition gym center that my kids attended recreational gym at started private training at 4 years old. So at high school level the aim is to medal at state and national levels.

 

Kids are training there almost daily 7 days a week. The parents can be worse than the coaches.

[itsheresomewhere]

I only lasted about 2 seconds into that video. Why didn't the person taking the video stop them? Was it another scared student?

 

This is beyond wrong.

 

I think jail time is in order, honestly.

I think the Today show? said this morning it was another student.

[rose]

I got pushed into the splits in karate class as teenager but not to this point. I was willingly being pushed by my coach. He pushed my legs while I tried to bare it. I ended up tearing my thigh muscle and with an emergency room visit. It was sooooo painful. I was doped up on codeine for days and it didn't fully heal for months. Even now ever once in awhile that muscle will ache for no apparent reason.

[marbel]

What the heck???

 

How is it ok to have a girl begging them to stop hurting her and have everyone ignoring her?? Bodily autonomy really means nothing to entirely too many people.

 

Here is my theory on why people think it's OK.  (Note that I do not think it's OK!  I'm just describing what I believe is the thinking behind it.)

 

The girl wants to be on the cheer squad (apparently, because she had to have signed up for it).  Some people on the cheer squad will do anything to get on it, and then to have a good place on it or be a star performer.  So it may be assumed that any girl who signs up for it will also be willing to do whatever it takes to be on the squad and/or have a good place and/or be a star and/or win competitions. Because, you know, other girls endured pain and discomfort and it's all worth it, right?  

 

So in that case, bodily autonomy goes out the window because, why wouldn't she endure whatever pain was necessary to gain the skills required to do that split?  And she signed up for cheer, so she agreed to it, right?  

 

Again, I do not think it's OK.  I'm just thinking about why some people would think it's an OK thing to do.   Not me.  Not anyone in my world.  

[Murphy101]

Here is my theory on why people think it's OK. (Note that I do not think it's OK! I'm just describing what I believe is the thinking behind it.)

 

The girl wants to be on the cheer squad (apparently, because she had to have signed up for it). Some people on the cheer squad will do anything to get on it, and then to have a good place on it or be a star performer. So it may be assumed that any girl who signs up for it will also be willing to do whatever it takes to be on the squad and/or have a good place and/or be a star and/or win competitions. Because, you know, other girls endured pain and discomfort and it's all worth it, right?

 

So in that case, bodily autonomy goes out the window because, why wouldn't she endure whatever pain was necessary to gain the skills required to do that split? And she signed up for cheer, so she agreed to it, right?

 

Again, I do not think it's OK. I'm just thinking about why some people would think it's an OK thing to do. Not me. Not anyone in my world.

Yeah. Well. Some people are dumbasses who shouldn't be in charge of kids.

 

No means no. Stop means stop. And no one, especially KIDS, signs that right away for a friggin sport, no matter the scholarship or medal. So I call BS on some people's so-called "thinking".

 

None of this ire directed at you personally. I get what you are saying. I just don't have any patience for what excuse abusive power tripping jerks use to justify their tactics.

[Arcadia]

The girl wants to be on the cheer squad (apparently, because she had to have signed up for it).

...

So in that case, bodily autonomy goes out the window because, why wouldn't she endure whatever pain was necessary to gain the skills required to do that split? And she signed up for cheer, so she agreed to it, right?

My school district has try-outs/auditions for high school sports which include cheer. So to make the team for any sport, the expectations by other parents is that the participants who made the cut should be good enough to medal in regional and try for state, and that training would be tough.

 

There are also liability forms unfortunately

 

Example quoted from a high school cheer team try-out

 

"I give my child permission to participate in the Smoky Hill High School Cheer Pre-Tryout Clinic. I understand that there are risks involved in any athletic participation. I choose to accept the risks for any injury or claim resulting in my participation. I hereby release and hold harmless Cherry Creek School District, Smoky Hill High School, and its Coaches of any and all responsibility for any injury or claim resulting from any or such athletic participation."

http://smokyhill.cherrycreekschools.org/Athletics/Documents/Cheer%2015%20Tryout%20and%20Team%20Info.pdf

[catz]

That is just crazy cakes and I can't believe all the comments trying to justify it.  Not ok!  NO MEANS NO.  No one shouldn't be crying with normal participation. 

[Seasider]

There are scholarships that cheerleaders can apply for.

 

At the competition level, many in the competition gym center that my kids attended recreational gym at started private training at 4 years old. So at high school level the aim is to medal at state and national levels.

 

Kids are training there almost daily 7 days a week. The parents can be worse than the coaches.

Sounds like Dance Moms with stunts thrown in.

[mom2scouts]

This is NOT common in gymnastics or dance activities where we've participated. Stretching several times a day will help someone get more and more flexible. Heck, if I stretch regularly, I can still do a split and I'm an overweight 50 something woman. The only thing this coach is doing is risking injury to his athletes. *Gently* pushing down while stretching is one thing, but I would never stay at a gym or with a coach that "trained" my child this way. My dd can do splits 3 ways and has a pretty large overstretch and she never stretches much past the point of pain.

 

The video was taken by another teen cheerleader who had been injured by this method and she's now getting threats.

[MrsMommy]

I think it's horrible, and yet, I'm not surprised it happens. At all. I remember hearing about the stuff cheerleaders put up with when I was in high school, and that was 20 years ago.

[Murphy101]

My school district has try-outs/auditions for high school sports which include cheer. So to make the team for any sport, the expectations by other parents is that the participants who made the cut should be good enough to medal in regional and try for state, and that training would be tough.

 

There are also liability forms unfortunately

 

Example quoted from a high school cheer team try-out

 

"I give my child permission to participate in the Smoky Hill High School Cheer Pre-Tryout Clinic. I understand that there are risks involved in any athletic participation. I choose to accept the risks for any injury or claim resulting in my participation. I hereby release and hold harmless Cherry Creek School District, Smoky Hill High School, and its Coaches of any and all responsibility for any injury or claim resulting from any or such athletic participation."

http://smokyhill.cherrycreekschools.org/Athletics/Documents/Cheer%2015%20Tryout%20and%20Team%20Info.pdf

Again. BS. If a kid snaps an ankle in soccer at a game, that sucks but crap happens in contact sports. That is what liability forms are intended to cover.

 

It's total BS for a school or coach to claim some liability form might cover things like being abused by staff under the guise of making them better players.

[Guest]

The young woman who showed the videos to her mom, and was interviewed for the story, is now being cyber bullied.

 

What really gets me is the school coverup, and the fact that girls and women were speaking up and complaining, and the powers to be blew them off. It's like no one was listening to their voices. It wasn't until a male, investigative reporter went after them and the truth that everyone started getting held accountable

[tammyw]

Horrifying. I'm beyond disgusted. My daughter is a dancer and spent years getting her full splits. You don't just do them.

[unsinkable]

I just read on denver post the coach was fired.

[unsinkable]

This is NOT common in gymnastics or dance activities where we've participated. Stretching several times a day will help someone get more and more flexible. Heck, if I stretch regularly, I can still do a split and I'm an overweight 50 something woman. The only thing this coach is doing is risking injury to his athletes. *Gently* pushing down while stretching is one thing, but I would never stay at a gym or with a coach that "trained" my child this way. My dd can do splits 3 ways and has a pretty large overstretch and she never stretches much past the point of pain.

 

The video was taken by another teen cheerleader who had been injured by this method and she's now getting threats.

So another teen recorded it. I've only watched one video of one girl once but if IIRC, the coach seemed like he was aware he was being recorded.

 

It just seems like no one *there* saw anything wrong with what was happening, except for the screaming victim. And for there to have been 7? I think 7 recorded victims, it is chilling to think of the normalization of the act and intimidation all those girls experienced.

[KungFuPanda]

Are splits a thing now? They weren't that common (around here or in national competitions) when I coached from the mid 80s to the late 90s. A routine would maybe have one person in front, at the end, doing a split. Various forms of tumbling and being able to build (either as a good base or good top) were important. And of course, proper jump form. "Point those toes! No bent wrists!"

 

ETA: Splits were big when I was in school in the 70s. By the time I was coaching they seemed to have fallen out of style.

I remember being tossed through the air and caught in a split as late as 1990. Basket tosses were still legal then too.

[ChocolateReignRemix]

My school district has try-outs/auditions for high school sports which include cheer. So to make the team for any sport, the expectations by other parents is that the participants who made the cut should be good enough to medal in regional and try for state, and that training would be tough.

 

There are also liability forms unfortunately

 

Example quoted from a high school cheer team try-out

 

"I give my child permission to participate in the Smoky Hill High School Cheer Pre-Tryout Clinic. I understand that there are risks involved in any athletic participation. I choose to accept the risks for any injury or claim resulting in my participation. I hereby release and hold harmless Cherry Creek School District, Smoky Hill High School, and its Coaches of any and all responsibility for any injury or claim resulting from any or such athletic participation."

http://smokyhill.cherrycreekschools.org/Athletics/Documents/Cheer%2015%20Tryout%20and%20Team%20Info.pdf

 

Those liability forms protect schools from injuries that result from normal participation.  They do not make the school immune from lawsuits related to neglect or malicious acts.

 

Falling from a pyramid in the course of practice and breaking a bone?  Assumed risk of participation.

 

Coach intentionally injuring players or requiring others to do so?  Not an assumed risk.

 

[Guest]

Other parents who withdrew their daughters from the program because of this guy, are also coming out with testimonies of how their concerns and complaints were dismissed and ignored.

[Carol in Cal.]

F*ing child abusing bully.

[Arcadia]

Ozell Williams was fired from Boulder High previously for the same reason.

 

"A Colorado high school cheerleading coach was fired Friday after videos surfaced showing him pushing cheerleaders down in splits.

 

Denver Public Schools Superintendent Tom Boasberg said Ozell Williams was dismissed from his job at East High School.

...

Williams, the founder of a Denver-area tumbling school, was fired from Boulder High School in Boulder, Colorado, last year because of concerns about his techniques.

 

Boasberg said Friday that Denver Public Schools officials were unaware that Williams had worked with the Boulder school and that Williams had not told them about it.

 

Williams had worked as a contract employee with cheerleaders at Boulder High during two stints in 2015 and 2016 to help them with choreography and tumbling. He worked with the cheerleaders once or twice a week in the fall of 2015 and also during a summer camp in 2016.

 

He was dismissed three days into the four-day camp after a coach saw him using a technique similar to that seen in the Denver videos, said Randy Barber, a spokesman for the Boulder Valley School District, which includes Boulder High."

http://abcnews.go.com/Sports/wireStory/cheerleading-coach-denver-video-fired-school-49424261

 

ETA:

His bio http://www.milehightumblers5280.com/ozells-bio/

A 2013.write up on him https://cuindependent.com/2013/12/11/story-behind-cu-tumbling-sensation-ozell-williams/

Edited August 26, 2017 by Arcadia

[Carol in Cal.]

And the girl in the background going "You're just going to make it worse" was absolutely chilling.

[Liz CA]

As someone who used to be able to do the split - just regular - not overextended - I can tell you it took stretching and GRADUAL exercises. Once at that point, it does not hurt. If it hurts, you need to stop because your ligaments and muscles are not ready.

Horrific. And all in the name of flipping what???

[Word Nerd]

I won't even watch the video, as the screenshots are upsetting enough.

[kiwik]

It reminds me of a documentary I saw about little kids in China who were selected based on their build at 5 or 6 and sent to boarding schools. They were afraid before they were stretched each day and cried during and after but then just accepted it. It was horrible but it was a better life than some of the alternatives.

 

Eta. The whole programme made me feel sick but even then none of the kids were injured as far as I know - the coaches knew that would be counter productive.

Edited August 26, 2017 by kiwik

[Word Nerd]

On one of the articles I read, a commenter claimed he was a coach and does the same thing because it works, it's crazy that everyone is making such a big deal out of this video, etc. I hope this uproar will lead to other investigations at schools where this type of "coaching" is being practiced.

[Lady Florida.]

On one of the articles I read, a commenter claimed he was a coach and does the same thing because it works, it's crazy that everyone is making such a big deal out of this video, etc. I hope this uproar will lead to other investigations at schools where this type of "coaching" is being practiced.

 

Yeah, I've read some people (coaches and even one doctor) defending it as pushing the athletes to do their best. Nope. There's a difference between pushing to do your best and being forced to do something you already said no to. And from what I read she tore muscles and/or ligaments doing it. Coaches, good ones, push athletes to do their best. They don't push them into injuries. 

 

And whoever said her body, her choice up thread -  :hurray: . She said no. Full stop.