Supporting a child in college - WWYD or WHYD

[brynndolyn]

Our oldest was adopted, against his will, at the age of 13.  Yes he's in therapy, it's been a difficult road, ultimately we did what we thought was best at the time. He has a diagnosed attachment disorder and other drama has gone on in the past years, now things are pretty well settled down though which is good.  

 

He is graduating from HS this spring, a year early. At his school if you take a full course load you can graduate as a junior. No extra classes are required, you just have to make sure you get all your required senior classes taken your junior year of course.

 

He wants to move out and get away from us. He is going to a community college with dorms about 1.5 hours away. He could live with us for free and go to a community college here, but then of course he'd have to live with us.  He has a part time job now, spends most of his money on food because he doesn't want to eat meals with us (yes I'm serious). He was eating all our leftovers and I told him he's welcome to eat leftovers when he eats with us (we all work together to prepare and clean up the meals, not really fair for him to refuse to eat with us and then come home at 10 pm or midnight and eat by himself), we did have his therapists support on that and she wants him to spend time with us. But, it is what it is.  He could also cook his own food but he just usually doesn't, he just wants to eat with his friends.

 

So that's kind of the short story, I realize this is way rambling on.

 

We don't have a ton of money. His ACT score was 17, his grades are passing but not great. No scholarships are on the horizon for him. However, he does qualify for the full FAFSA amount.  He could go to school for almost free with just that money buuuut he wants to live in the dorms which doubles the cost of his school.

 

He has no car because we said we'd pay half of a car, and match whatever he could save up. He has not been able to save any money so he has no car at this point.

 

We are going to help pay for his college but we are not going to pay for his dorm because he can live with us for free, he's just choosing not to. He's not really going to college to get an education, he's going to get away from us.

 

It is what it is, at this point, I am doing my very best to keep lines of communication open and to be a supportive parent.  

 

So my question is. He will be 17 and in college. What do you do, as far as supporting him? Monthly money? Just help pay for the school and expect him to support any extras he wants or needs? If he were 18 I think it would be a bit easier. I'm just curious to get some other people's thoughts on this.  I am hoping he will have a job but it's a pretty small town and he has no car to be able to drive to the next town so I'd say job prospects are not great.  I will be working with him to try to get him set up with something but obviously we can't like give him a ride to work or something since he'll be so far away. He works at a restaurant right now, but calls in frequently because he needs to "have a social life".

[Chris in VA]

We paid for 3/4 of all college expenses and expected ds to cough up the other 1/4. He was able to for 2 years, then we helped a bit more. We allow him to live at home now and pay a nominal rent while he is working at a good job--he needs about 2 years of experience in his field in order to move up a bit to where he can get a job that will allow him to make a reasonable living. He helps around the house, does his own laundry, and provides entertainment from time to time. He has bought his own car and clothes. He is generous at Christmas and birthdays.

 

In your situation, I'd ask my therapist to help us, as a family, to come up with a list of reasonable expectations and boundaries, and make a contract, including what happens if it is not upheld by you or by him. I would need that third party who knows the situation to really help.

[Pippen]

I'd lean towards doing what we what we'd planned to pay anyway, and let him figure out how to fund anything above that amount. Especially if there's a chance he'd do better being out on his own. You can always opt to more later if you are financially able, and if you feel like his academic performance and work ethic deserve the extra investment.

 

When you say he qualifies for the full FAFSA amount, are those Federal loans, or does that include supplemental parent loans? You'll want to look into whether he could sign for his own federal loans at age 17 or you'd need to cosign for him. In essence, anything you co-sign has the potential to become your loan.

 

 

[catz]

So my question is. He will be 17 and in college. What do you do, as far as supporting him? Monthly money? Just help pay for the school and expect him to support any extras he wants or needs? If he were 18 I think it would be a bit easier. I'm just curious to get some other people's thoughts on this.  I am hoping he will have a job but it's a pretty small town and he has no car to be able to drive to the next town so I'd say job prospects are not great.  I will be working with him to try to get him set up with something but obviously we can't like give him a ride to work or something since he'll be so far away. He works at a restaurant right now, but calls in frequently because he needs to "have a social life".

 

He calls in sick to work to go have a social life?  What does your last sentence mean?

 

This is such a hard situation.  A kid with this work ethic, attitude, and that ACT score honestly doesn't sound like a college ready kid and like it's going to be success story immediately.  If he were truly college ready, academically motivated, and just needed a break away from the family, I'd honestly consider helping him with the dorm.  Some 18 year olds just really are ready to get away.

 

When you say he gets the full FAFSA amount do you mean in straight aid/scholarships or in loans?  That would make a big difference to me.  I would not want to go heavily in debt for an educational experiment, nor would I want a young kid digging himself in a hole when he's not really ready for college.

 

Ugh - I don't think your school is doing kids any favors by graduating them a year early when they are not college ready academically or in terms of maturity.

 

He is a year young for college correct?  I'd want him to be successful at the local CC while holding a job for a year and then re-evaluate.  I think talking to the therapist(s) involved about what expectations on both sides is a really great idea since they know the ins and outs of the situation. 

 

 

 

[Janeway]

Our oldest was adopted, against his will, at the age of 13.  Yes he's in therapy, it's been a difficult road, ultimately we did what we thought was best at the time. He has a diagnosed attachment disorder and other drama has gone on in the past years, now things are pretty well settled down though which is good.  

 

He is graduating from HS this spring, a year early. At his school if you take a full course load you can graduate as a junior. No extra classes are required, you just have to make sure you get all your required senior classes taken your junior year of course.

 

He wants to move out and get away from us. He is going to a community college with dorms about 1.5 hours away. He could live with us for free and go to a community college here, but then of course he'd have to live with us.  He has a part time job now, spends most of his money on food because he doesn't want to eat meals with us (yes I'm serious). He was eating all our leftovers and I told him he's welcome to eat leftovers when he eats with us (we all work together to prepare and clean up the meals, not really fair for him to refuse to eat with us and then come home at 10 pm or midnight and eat by himself), we did have his therapists support on that and she wants him to spend time with us. But, it is what it is.  He could also cook his own food but he just usually doesn't, he just wants to eat with his friends.

 

So that's kind of the short story, I realize this is way rambling on.

 

We don't have a ton of money. His ACT score was 17, his grades are passing but not great. No scholarships are on the horizon for him. However, he does qualify for the full FAFSA amount.  He could go to school for almost free with just that money buuuut he wants to live in the dorms which doubles the cost of his school.

 

He has no car because we said we'd pay half of a car, and match whatever he could save up. He has not been able to save any money so he has no car at this point.

 

We are going to help pay for his college but we are not going to pay for his dorm because he can live with us for free, he's just choosing not to. He's not really going to college to get an education, he's going to get away from us.

 

It is what it is, at this point, I am doing my very best to keep lines of communication open and to be a supportive parent.  

 

So my question is. He will be 17 and in college. What do you do, as far as supporting him? Monthly money? Just help pay for the school and expect him to support any extras he wants or needs? If he were 18 I think it would be a bit easier. I'm just curious to get some other people's thoughts on this.  I am hoping he will have a job but it's a pretty small town and he has no car to be able to drive to the next town so I'd say job prospects are not great.  I will be working with him to try to get him set up with something but obviously we can't like give him a ride to work or something since he'll be so far away. He works at a restaurant right now, but calls in frequently because he needs to "have a social life".

There are scholarships for kids who had been in foster care. Would he qualify for those? I would look for financing specific for his situation as well as look in to disability things for him if that applies. 

[Janeway]

I know I am the bad one here, but I would not financially support him in this. It sounds like he is not a part of your family. Even if he were a biological child, he would not be with you. I suspect you might not feel the guilt if he were your biological child. Where would he be right now if you had not adopted him if that is what he is asking for? Can you reverse the adoption? It sounds like the adoption never should have happened.

Edited April 17, 2016 by Janeway

[purplejackmama]

Does he have any interest in any other post high school options? Military? Peace Corp? He doesn't sound ready for college.

[bettyandbob]

There are scholarships for kids who had been in foster care. Would he qualify for those? I would look for financing specific for his situation as well as look in to disability things for him if that applies. 

 

 

This. 

 

I think there are scholarships for older adoptees. 

[Starr]

Is he really ready for college?

[AK_Mom4]

Gently, here - Figure out the amount you are willing to pay and tell him that money is available for him as long as he is in school.  If you feel like that amount is Zero unless there are strings attached (live at home, get a job while in college, buy a car, help out around the house), then I would be up front about that so he can make his escape plans. 

 

I can't see how you can get a "win" out of this by trying to hold the dorm thing over his head - at 17 and graduated from high school, he can get legally emancipated from you fairly easily in most states and then where will you be?  He doesn't want to live at home - one way or another, he will make that happen.  Off to college, living with friends or homeless - all possibilities.

 

Please don't think I'm bashing you because I'm not.  We didn't help any of our kids with college their first few years.  We helped them save money in their college funds, but they had to work it out themselves how to get there and pay for things.   For oldest DS, that meant the military.  DD22 chose to take on some loans to fill in the gap along with working.  DS20 spent a year away at school, then transferred to a closer school and is living here to save money.   What every family chooses to contribute to college kids is going to be different depending on the situation.

[oneangelwaiting]

I haven't been able to find any scholarships that he qualifies for, many of them have to do with length of time in foster care and age of being in foster care (ie, in foster care at the age of 16 or higher).

 

As far as adoption stuff, we asked the state about a guardianship and they said because of his age they wouldn't consider it (this was when he was 13, before the adoption). We have also adopted his 3 younger siblings, so that was part of the equation also. It was somewhat out of our hands, other than saying no he can't live with us, you know what I mean?

 

I totally agree he is not ready for college. His therapist is the one who suggested he should try to live on campus, but then he realized that he could graduate early, and those two things combined to create the situation we are in now.

 

He qualifies for the full fafsa grant (it's something like 5k $ per year, I can't remember exactly), and also direct loans. We will not be cosigning on any loans for him (or any of our children most likely).

 

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[ktgrok]

I'd help as much as I could within our budget. Honestly, him moving out may be the best thing for everyone, ad better for your relationship. I could be wrong, but I sometimes thing teen boys just need to be on their own more than we let them. I have my reasons for thinking this, and may be proven wrong in the future. 

 

But yes, I'd pay for what I could of schooling and a monthly budget for food and incidentals and maybe let him pay for or take out loans for the dorm. 

[Annie G]

Is he really ready for college?

 

Kind of what I'm wondering. 

 

Sounds like he could use a year (or two) to grow up- maintain a steady job, manage his finances (save for a car, save for school, etc.) and decide what path he's planning to take to transition from high school student to a productive adult.   

 

:grouphug:  It's hard to know what the right decision is- every kid is different so there's no one 'right' path. 

[mysticmomma]

What does the therapist think?

[zoobie]

I haven't been able to find any scholarships that he qualifies for, many of them have to do with length of time in foster care and age of being in foster care (ie, in foster care at the age of 16 or higher).

 

As far as adoption stuff, we asked the state about a guardianship and they said because of his age they wouldn't consider it (this was when he was 13, before the adoption). We have also adopted his 3 younger siblings, so that was part of the equation also. It was somewhat out of our hands, other than saying no he can't live with us, you know what I mean?

 

I totally agree he is not ready for college. His therapist is the one who suggested he should try to live on campus, but then he realized that he could graduate early, and those two things combined to create the situation we are in now.

 

He qualifies for the full fafsa grant (it's something like 5k $ per year, I can't remember exactly), and also direct loans. We will not be cosigning on any loans for him (or any of our children most likely).

 

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Are you the OP? There are two different user names, which is confusing.

[oneangelwaiting]

Are you the OP? There are two different user names, which is confusing.

Yes I'm sorry. I do not know why this happens when I'm on my phone. But it is the same person.

[Ottakee]

I would let him go but not provide the extra financial support. I understand and it is hard. We have a 15 year old foster son who does not want to be adopted but wants to live with us until he is 18 and then move out in his own.

[cave canem]

Is this true?  I think emancipation requires proving financial independence and is difficult in most states.  Don't ask me how I know . . .

at 17 and graduated from high school, he can get legally emancipated from you fairly easily in most states 

 

[oneangelwaiting]

Is this true? I think emancipation requires proving financial independence and is difficult in most states. Don't ask me how I know . . .

In our state it is quite difficult to get emancipated. According to a few different friends in the system it basically never happens.

 

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[oneangelwaiting]

I would let him go but not provide the extra financial support. I understand and it is hard. We have a 15 year old foster son who does not want to be adopted but wants to live with us until he is 18 and then move out in his own.

I could understand with an older child especially. Our son has been living with us since just after his 11th birthday. It's just hard to know what is best always.

 

Off topic but I just started reading about how a bunch of adoptees are angry that their adopted parents gave them new last names (not new first names, just the family last name). One more thing to keep me up at night worrying if we messed up. Even people who were adopted as infants are angry about it. It never would have crossed my mind as something to get upset about.

[Carol in Cal.]

I think in this situation i would try hard to build a relationship even if he is thorny.

I'd plan a weekly one on one meal with him out of the house somewhere, just the two of us, and even if he complained I'd insist on it to a large extent.  I'd pay for it.

 

I wouldn't kid myself that that would reestablish our relationship, but I would figure that later on when he's more stable mentally he would look back on this and see that I was trying.

 

Re. college, it depends on what you told him in the past that you would do, and what you can afford.  It is a very different conversation to say, "We absolutely cannot afford this" than to say, "We will not pay for this."  I'd think that through very carefully.  

 

Remember, too, at 17 his brain is not fully developed, and I would also focus on having him learn delayed gratification and life skills.  Regarding the job, I would not have any sympathy for that position.  I'd require some amount of work serving the family (like 5 hours per day 5 days per weekish) for any time that he didn't spend either at work, looking for work, or at school, and I would enforce it with lists.  I think that that would get him to formulate better plans for himself, because really, you want the same thing--you want him to be mature and able to be on his own, and if he is not serving that by his school or job actions, he needs to serve the family directly to learn life skills and also to be on the hook for doing some mature planning.  

[Carol in Cal.]

PS Also, he might be better off pursuing a trade for a while or even for life.  The world is always going to need electricians, for instance, and good mechanics.  Is he good with his hands?  Maybe he should delay college and figure out some better goals.

[foxbridgeacademy]

I'd help as much as I could within our budget. Honestly, him moving out may be the best thing for everyone, ad better for your relationship. I could be wrong, but I sometimes thing teen boys just need to be on their own more than we let them. I have my reasons for thinking this, and may be proven wrong in the future. 

 

But yes, I'd pay for what I could of schooling and a monthly budget for food and incidentals and maybe let him pay for or take out loans for the dorm. 

:iagree:  :iagree:  :iagree:

 

I was on my own at 17 and had I had parents who would/could have (partially) financially supported me I think I would have gotten over my anger and been much more appreciative a lot sooner.  As it was I called my mom 5 times in the first week after I had sworn to myself I wouldn't speak to her until the end of the summer(we're on good terms and I think of her as a friend now).  Distance can help.  I would figure out how much I could afford and offer to pay 1/2 of it directly to the dorm first semester and if he has passing grades then I'd pay the other 1/2 for second semester.  I'd tell him he has to call to check in (proof of life) X times per week but otherwise his life is his own, but we'd love to see/hear from him more often.  Then I'd stick to it and wait him out.  

[oneangelwaiting]

PS Also, he might be better off pursuing a trade for a while or even for life. The world is always going to need electricians, for instance, and good mechanics. Is he good with his hands? Maybe he should delay college and figure out some better goals.

Being an electrician is what he's going to college for. No, not interested in finding a job where he can learn as an apprentice, or anything like that, has to be college so he can move out. We've had many, many conversations about it, but this is how he wants to do it and his mind won't be changed. This will be a very hands on type of college, we went and visited it a few months ago and I think if he must go somewhere then this is as good of a place as any for him.

 

He has thought of doing the military in one way or another but I think at this point he's leaning towards not doing that.

 

I'm pretty sure he wouldn't go out to eat with me. He did go to the grocery store with me the other night though so that's something! He normally eats one meal a week with us, usually lunch on Sunday but sometimes not even that.

 

He does have chores he does around the house and he has been responsible for his own money for a long time (for example, we give him a set amount of money each year for clothes, he can spend it how he sees fit and if he wants more clothes than that will buy he has to come up with the difference, we give him x amount of money for food per school day in one lump sum at the beginning of the semester, he spends it how he sees fit which usually means it's gone within a few weeks of school starting and then he has to figure out how to eat at school the rest of the semester; he has to pay for all the stuff he does with his friends and eating out with them etc.). Also we've done budgeting with him, when he was young we forced him to save 10% of his earnings and helped him open a savings account (we stopped that when he turned 15, we had hoped the habit would stick but it did not), he's taken personal finance in school. He has a lot of knowledge but no ability/desire to say "no" to himself or to anyone else and that is something we can not fix. Hours upon hours spent answering his questions about things and explaining why we do what we do (which is a very different way from his family of origin), helping him at his request only to have him say "I just can't do that". I think some of it has stuck. Hopefully. Maybe.

 

We haven't ever given him an amount of money that we would do, all we've said is that we will help him but we won't be able to pay for his entire college so he'll definitely be responsible for part of it.

[oneangelwaiting]

:iagree: :iagree: :iagree:

 

I was on my own at 17 and had I had parents who would/could have (partially) financially supported me I think I would have gotten over my anger and been much more appreciative a lot sooner. As it was I called my mom 5 times in the first week after I had sworn to myself I wouldn't speak to her until the end of the summer(we're on good terms and I think of her as a friend now). Distance can help. I would figure out how much I could afford and offer to pay 1/2 of it directly to the dorm first semester and if he has passing grades then I'd pay the other 1/2 for second semester. I'd tell him he has to call to check in (proof of life) X times per week but otherwise his life is his own, but we'd love to see/hear from him more often. Then I'd stick to it and wait him out.

Thanks for your experience, that is very helpful and encouraging :)

 

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[Xahm]

Do you happen to have a friend who could take your son out for dinner and financial planning? Someone your son will see as neutral (not on your side) and who has a nice enough suit and car to convince your son that this guy knows how to get money. They could create a rough "10 yr plan" of where your son would like to be and this guy could help him think of ways to make that happen, be they suck it up and live at home, work like crazy this summer to buy a car and get a campus job, join the military, or whatever.

Basically, I'd try to separate the issues and have someone my son would respect about financial issues go through those with him.

If he does join the military, try to get him somehow to set up an account to put his bonuses in that he can't get super easily. Sounds like his paychecks won't be put into savings, and if the bonuses could be, that would help his future a lot.

[LucyStoner]

It doesn't have to be college so he can move out. He could explore domestic volunteer programs for non-college grads like CityYear or he could apply to Job Corps which would help him learn a trade while paying him a stipend and housing him with other Job Corps members.

 

Now, one only gets a limited number of years for Pell grants. And if you have 2 quarters on financial aid probation (GPA under 2.5 IIRC or failing to complete a minimum number of credits), you lose Pell eligibility until you have a successful term on your own dime. I'd seriously advise him not to use up any of that eligibility until he will be ready to focus and succeed. Something like Job Corps would give him the ability to get out of the house, have a structured environment and learn stronger skills before he burns up any of his aid eligibility. He'd also make a little cash. City Year would pay a stipend and then at the end give him a college grant as well.

 

Good luck. This is a hard situation.

Edited April 17, 2016 by LucyStoner

[Lolly]

I would figure out how much $ I could reasonably contribute and give him a monthly allowance for the time it should take him to complete his training/schooling plus an additional semester (just in case). Hopefully, it will be enough to meet his needs. If not, he will have to make the rest.

[kroe1]

Sounds like somebody might need some military training.

[creekland]

17 is such a tough age for many, esp when they have serious issues running through their "all-knowing" minds.   :grouphug:

 

The tough part of supporting him 100% is he'll come to think of that as a minimum - an expectation.

 

The tough part of not supporting him 100% is selling drugs is an incredibly easy and quick way to earn money for those without an internal work ethic and/or filter.  Petty (and then more serious) crime is not far behind.

 

He wants to get away.  That's actually normal.  Like some others have suggested, I'd be seeing if he'd reconsider the military (any branch) to give him a few years to mature and some structure.  Obviously, that can come with serious drawbacks, but generally the positive outweighs the negative.

 

If that - or any sort of similar program - is not something he'd do, I'd opt with supporting him as much as we could with as much unconditional love as we could muster in hopes that natural brain development coupled with more life experiences would do its thing in the meantime.

 

I'd drop expectations (mine) and focus on anything positive.  I'd very rarely, if ever, bring up anything negative, biting my tongue if I had to.  Negative "anything" drives away.  Positive helps put cracks in walls built up.  Sometimes those cracks eventually end up becoming a hole wide enough to enter.

 

There are never any guarantees, but I think those are the odds I'd be going with.

 

Best wishes to you.

[JFSinIL]

I'd let him know the door is always open if he needs to come home, and I would do what Chris in VA suggested and have the therapist as a middleman to come up with reasonable amount of $support you are willing to provide at least until he turns 18. After which, if he wants any support, he has to still be in school getting passing grades (and show proof). I'd provide has much $ support as I would if he lived at home and attended the local CC. If he wants to go elsewhere to live and attend school, he has to manage the difference. Make sure he knows this is what you would do for ANY kid of yours, biological or not. You are his parents, like it or not, and you will be there for him forever. But you are not doormats to be walked on. He is (almost) an adult and can make his own decisions - but you are adults, too, and can make your own, too. Good luck!

Edited April 17, 2016 by JFSinIL

[oneangelwaiting]

Thanks so much you guys, I appreciate all the thoughts and ideas.

 

Having someone else talk to him about money is a good thought. He doesn't disagree with how we do things, he just "can't" do it that way so he deals with the consequences (bumming money and rides from friends, going hungry until he comes home at night and making a sandwich, etc.). But maybe someone else giving a fresh perspective is a good idea.

 

He was seriously considering joining the National Guard Reserve, the one where you serve one weekend a month and two weeks a year. I'm wondering if I should press that at all. I'm trying to step back and be more of a sounding board than anything, asking him questions to get him to think about things rather than making suggestions. It's hard to know how much to say. His main concerns there were that he wouldn't be able to play rugby this summer because of when boot camp starts (yeah....) and "What happens if I get arrested?" That question really took me aback, we haven't had any law enforcement dealings for over a year so it kind of came out of the blue.

 

Is it worth talking to him about it again? It would give him some money in his pocket, delay school a bit though not much (just 1 semester), and give him some experience. He sees the pros but those couple of things have him hung up a bit.

 

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[bettyandbob]

Clearly, there's a lot of baggage. He's only been an official member of the family for four years. He became an official member against his will at an age when young people are typically seeking independence away from family. It sounds like he learned early not to trust someone to take care of him and maybe resentful that he needs your help when he can't trust. So he wants to find a way to get out.

 

Given that background I wouldn't force family meals. I'd let him know they are there and there is a place for him.

 

I'd work out what budget you could have and present it to him. What amount of money can you give monthly (I would not do more unless you were making a direct payment to cover dorm or a food plan). I'd also look into the school he'd like to attend. He has a part time job now. Is the school hef like to go to near places where he can land a job to provide some of his expenses.

 

Does the school have internships, apprenticeships, co-ops, so he can get experience and contacts to get a job when he finishes.

 

I'd also research things like city year and americorp.

 

After you do all the research, sit down with him and his therapist and show him the options. Then I'd let him and the therapist mull them over.

[JFSinIL]

I know I am the bad one here, but I would not financially support him in this. It sounds like he is not a part of your family. Even if he were a biological child, he would not be with you. I suspect you might not feel the guilt if he were your biological child. Where would he be right now if you had not adopted him if that is what he is asking for? Can you reverse the adoption? It sounds like the adoption never should have happened.

I'd almost agree with this, except did I read correctly that you also adopted his younger siblings? They need to see that you are supportive parents who won't give up on a teen.

[Pegasus]

I would figure out how much $ I could reasonably contribute and give him a monthly allowance for the time it should take him to complete his training/schooling plus an additional semester (just in case). Hopefully, it will be enough to meet his needs. If not, he will have to make the rest.

 I agree with the above but I'd add strings:

 

1. He must be enrolled full-time and making academic progress.

2. If I suspected addiction issues, the money train would come to a screeching halt.

3. He'd have to come home once a week to eat a meal with the family (i.e., Gilmore Girls).

 

So, it sounds like he has:

Full Pell grant: $5,815

Subsidized direct student loan: $3,500

Unsubsidized direct student loan: $2,000

 

And a job that he works at least enough to pay for most of his own food.  Honestly, it sounds like he won't need much financial support.  Have you put pen to paper and determined his expenses?

[Haiku]

Sounds like somebody might need some military training.

Kids with attachment issues are terrible candidates for the military. I would seriously discourage this idea.

[ktgrok]

It doesn't have to be college so he can move out. He could explore domestic volunteer programs for non-college grads like CityYear or he could apply to Job Corps which would help him learn a trade while paying him a stipend and housing him with other Job Corps members.

 

Now, one only gets a limited number of years for Pell grants. And if you have 2 quarters on financial aid probation (GPA under 2.5 IIRC or failing to complete a minimum number of credits), you lose Pell eligibility until you have a successful term on your own dime. I'd seriously advise him not to use up any of that eligibility until he will be ready to focus and succeed. Something like Job Corps would give him the ability to get out of the house, have a structured environment and learn stronger skills before he burns up any of his aid eligibility. He'd also make a little cash. City Year would pay a stipend and then at the end give him a college grant as well.

 

Good luck. This is a hard situation.

 

This is excellent advice, actually. Something like Job Corps could be great for him, and get him out of the house! I really do think him moving out is probably important. I can't imagine living with people that I wasn't comfortable sitting and eating with (I know that's his issue, not yours, but still, it's how he feels.) He needs some perspective. 

[catz]

I think job Corp is a great option too. I know a LD senior who is not college ready going in the fall. It is an excellent idea for allowing for another year to mature. It really does sound like he might benefit from some distance and perspective. I would be worried about not being successful with college and then burning bridges on aid.

[ktgrok]

Yeah, I do not think putting someone with some serious emotional health issues into the military and handing them a gun, possibly risking PTSD on top of other issues, and having them in a place where other's lives depend on them, is a particularly wise idea. 

 

I think Job Corp or something similar would make a lot more sense. 

 

Also, I'd let the dude eat the leftovers. He's under 18 and having to pay for his own food, and that doesn't seem quite right. I get that it's his choice not to eat meals with you, but if he has a legitimate diagnosis of attachment issues it's really NOT his fault. I do think that if everyone else has to help either cook or clean up, it's reasonable to assign him some other chore, since he missed clean up/cooking time. But I wouldn't withold food from a kid because they didn't help with clean up, which I am sure is how he sees it. 

 

Also, you say that you give him a lump sum for school food/clothes/etc and he mismanages it. So why do that? Sounds like he needs scaffolding, and more time to mature. I'd stop and start giving him one week at a time. When he handles that well go up to a month. But stop setting him up to fail, you know? He says he can't manage the money better, BELEIVE him! He very likely has executive function deficits..it's a brain issue, not a character issue in that case. And if he's under stress to the point he doesn't feel able to eat in his own home that totally messes with your higher order thinking. Even a really great kid, when stressed, will make bad choices, and blow money just to make themselves feel better. adults do it too...that's what they call retail therapy. I really think you need to spend the next few months making some changes. Maybe it won't help, but you will have tried. Let him have free access to the food, help him with his money (that you give him) so he doesn't blow it all at once, etc. I know you are trying to force him to be more responsible but that just doesn't work with some kids. They need time, and if you throw them in the deep end to sink or swim they WILL sink. 

[QueenCat]

I'd find out what the legal obligations are as far as financial support for a 17 year old. You might HAVE to do some things as he's still a minor. And I'd find out from a legal expert in your state, not from us here.......... we can be very supportive but most of us aren't legal experts.

[Haiku]

But I wouldn't withhold food from a kid because they didn't help with clean up, which I am sure is how he sees it. 

 

Also, you say that you give him a lump sum for school food/clothes/etc and he mismanages it. So why do that? Sounds like he needs scaffolding, and more time to mature. 

 

Yes to both these things.

 

My oldest was adopted around the same age as your son and also was not happy about it. She had many of the same issues you describe in your post. I get how exhausting it is to continue to try to meet the needs of someone who doesn't want your help. I get the feeling of, "Ok, have it your way then." I get the desire to just not have to deal with it.

 

But he's your son, he's under 18, and he needs your help. Let him eat the leftovers. Give him his money a week at a time. Help in the small ways you can that don't wreck you emotionally. Don't contribute to things that lead to failure.

 

As regards college, my dd had a very low ACT score, and we had real doubts about how she would do in college. She has definitely proved us wrong. What we did was figure out the amount we could contribute to her college tuition (not much, honestly) and give her several options for how to utilize it. We thought living at home and going to the local university would be best for her. She went out and secured massive scholarships to a private liberal arts college, where she now studies biology and chemistry and is on track to go to graduate school.

 

Your son may surprise you.

[Lecka]

You know, he did what he needed to do to graduate a year early. He did that on his own. For me, that gives some hope for the electrician school.

 

He does have a direction there, even if it is not the most practical direction.

 

They visited and said they think he can do well there.

 

I don't see pushing him towards the military, either.

 

It sounds like he has some information about it, and he can do it if he wants. He has got plenty of time to join the military. A lot of people join when they are in their late teens or early 20s. Not very many people join when they are 17.

 

I don't know about the finances, but I don't think it works out very well when young people join the military straight out of high school because their parents think it will be good for them. I think it is much better if they struggle a bit for a year and then decide they want to do it. It is really possible to not take ownership in the military, too. I mean, yes, you would do things you had to do, but it is possible to do that without taking ownership, and then it is just not the hoped-for outcome.

 

If this electrician thing is a good deal and practical for him ----- it sounds so much better to me. B/c he could get out of the military and never go to electrician school, maybe the time will have passed, and maybe he won't do anything better. It is naïve to think otherwise, imo. Yes, the success stories are really good, but it is not like people don't also spend 3 years in the military and then get a job in a restaurant kitchen.

Edited April 17, 2016 by Lecka

[Miss Mousie]

Are you the OP? There are two different user names, which is confusing.

 

 

Yes I'm sorry. I do not know why this happens when I'm on my phone. But it is the same person.

 

Multiple user names are against board rules.  People have been permanently banned for that.  You may want to PM Susan to see if she will delete your other account and let you stay.

 

That said, I have no direct experience with your situation, but I agree with others that he is not ready for college.  I like the Job Corps suggestion, especially the options that provide housing.  IIRC, Lori D. has done recent research there, but I don't think she reads this board.  You might try to find her on the high school board.

 

You have my sympathy, OP.  It sounds like a very trying and worrisome place to be.  I'm glad you are trying so hard to do your best by him.

[oneangelwaiting]

 

 

Yeah, I do not think putting someone with some serious emotional health issues into the military and handing them a gun, possibly risking PTSD on top of other issues, and having them in a place where other's lives depend on them, is a particularly wise idea.

 

I think Job Corp or something similar would make a lot more sense.

 

Also, I'd let the dude eat the leftovers. He's under 18 and having to pay for his own food, and that doesn't seem quite right. I get that it's his choice not to eat meals with you, but if he has a legitimate diagnosis of attachment issues it's really NOT his fault. I do think that if everyone else has to help either cook or clean up, it's reasonable to assign him some other chore, since he missed clean up/cooking time. But I wouldn't withold food from a kid because they didn't help with clean up, which I am sure is how he sees it.

 

Also, you say that you give him a lump sum for school food/clothes/etc and he mismanages it. So why do that? Sounds like he needs scaffolding, and more time to mature. I'd stop and start giving him one week at a time. When he handles that well go up to a month. But stop setting him up to fail, you know? He says he can't manage the money better, BELEIVE him! He very likely has executive function deficits..it's a brain issue, not a character issue in that case. And if he's under stress to the point he doesn't feel able to eat in his own home that totally messes with your higher order thinking. Even a really great kid, when stressed, will make bad choices, and blow money just to make themselves feel better. adults do it too...that's what they call retail therapy. I really think you need to spend the next few months making some changes. Maybe it won't help, but you will have tried. Let him have free access to the food, help him with his money (that you give him) so he doesn't blow it all at once, etc. I know you are trying to force him to be more responsible but that just doesn't work with some kids. They need time, and if you throw them in the deep end to sink or swim they WILL sink.

So the food thing: he used to eat with us always, until he got a job and friends with cars. He chooses to be gone from home until his curfew every night. I will buy him food he asks for, he can cook food if he wants to, I have taught him to cook, it's not like the kitchen is under lock and key or something. He bus himself convenience foods if he wants to, but I will buy them for him if he asks for them (I don't typically buy them, we are feeding 7 other people here and I'd go broke trying to feed us like that).

 

With the money, I'm not disagreeing with you but I'm curious how you would go about it. His school has no daily limit on spending, it's a la carte so you just buy whatever you want. If you want to spend twenty bucks and buy everyone at your table food then you can. Also if you want to go into debt on your card you can. And with clothing, I took him shopping, we'd talk about what he needed. He wanted a hundred dollar pair of shoes. I told him no. He cried, you guys. Nothing like being in a store with a very angry, grown man sized teenager crying about shoes. He gets so, so angry if he doesn't have control. He knows how to bargain shop, we talked about what he might not be able to get if he bought them. He bought them. I mean I don't know what else I can really do you know?

 

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

[SparklyUnicorn]

I didn't read all the responses.  I'd probably want to help as much as I can so that he can be successful in his life.  My continuation of support would be dependent upon his effort in school and not really anything else.  Sounds like his issues are somewhat beyond his control. 

[brynndolyn]

 

 

Multiple user names are against board rules. People have been permanently banned for that. You may want to PM Susan to see if she will delete your other account and let you stay.

I'm using the same log in, it's just that the user name part is different. I tried logging out and logging back in. I don't think I have 2 log ins. ?

[Miss Mousie]

I'm using the same log in, it's just that the user name part is different. I tried logging out and logging back in. I don't think I have 2 log ins. ?

 

Sorry, I don't know how to fix it except to suggest a PM to Susan, or maybe to OtherJohn in the tech issues board, whatever that's called.

[Chris in VA]

This seems to me like a young man who is not ready for life on his own. IIWY, I would meet separately with his therapist, lay out everything you've told us, all your fears, everything you are seeing (even the shoe incident) and try to come up with a plan. Then have him meet with you and the therapist (and your co-parent, if there is one, of course) and again, give him the scaffolding needed to meet his needs. He has a lot going on, emotionally and intellectually.

Hang in there.

[umsami]

So the food thing: he used to eat with us always, until he got a job and friends with cars. He chooses to be gone from home until his curfew every night. I will buy him food he asks for, he can cook food if he wants to, I have taught him to cook, it's not like the kitchen is under lock and key or something. He bus himself convenience foods if he wants to, but I will buy them for him if he asks for them (I don't typically buy them, we are feeding 7 other people here and I'd go broke trying to feed us like that).

 

With the money, I'm not disagreeing with you but I'm curious how you would go about it. His school has no daily limit on spending, it's a la carte so you just buy whatever you want. If you want to spend twenty bucks and buy everyone at your table food then you can. Also if you want to go into debt on your card you can. And with clothing, I took him shopping, we'd talk about what he needed. He wanted a hundred dollar pair of shoes. I told him no. He cried, you guys. Nothing like being in a store with a very angry, grown man sized teenager crying about shoes. He gets so, so angry if he doesn't have control. He knows how to bargain shop, we talked about what he might not be able to get if he bought them. He bought them. I mean I don't know what else I can really do you know?

 

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

 

Have you thought about leaving cooked/prepared food for him (leftovers) perhaps with a note or something to encourage him to eat it?  Something along the lines of "Knew you were out late, so saved this for you.  If you eat it, please wash the plate.  If not, please place covered in the fridge.  Love, Mom"    He may not eat it at first, but doing it for a week or two, he may start to.  In general, home cooked food is better than fast food.... and hungry growing teens often need a lot of food.  Having a second dinner wouldn't be unusual. 

 

Regarding the lunch spending limits, have you spoken to the school? I've had kids in numerous public schools and have never run across a situation where they would allow unlimited debt on a lunch card or wouldn't allow parents to put some limits.  Yes, they may allow the kids to go into debt on their lunch card...but once they hit $5 or $10, that's it.     If they don't have any limits in place, then I bet your son isn't the only one running into trouble and it's time to get some other parents on your side to push for something.  There are people who can't budget at 40... so I don't think it's that unusual for a teen to have trouble.

 

Re: The shoes, I would probably divide the clothing budget up to help him.   So, if you give him $250/year for example, give him $50 a month.  For the $100 shoes, I would have probably said I'll pay $50 or whatever a normal pair of shoes cost, and tell him he can pay the rest from his job.  Another option would be to allow him to "borrow" from the next month's allotment, but only one extra month at a time. 

 

Regarding college itself, I would just figure out what you can afford, get the therapist's buy in....and also offer up other alternatives like City Year, etc.   I had friends whose parents could not help them a lot at college.  They often sold/donated plasma and other things to get spending money.  Does the college offer any sort of work study program?

[*lifeoftheparty*]

...

 

Edited December 18, 2016 by *lifeoftheparty*