Even my liberal AP self does not feel great about this week's Time mag cover

[leeannpal]

I question your logic, not your right to your opinion.

O.K. we'll just have to agree to disagree about this topic, but I think the issues you have with my opinion have less to do with logic and more about morality.

[Mom-ninja.]

Ok, that article about the reusable bags is gross.

 

Who in the world would keep a bag in the bathroom while they were sick and then use that bag to carry food in for other people?!

[leeannpal]

HA! If it weren't absurd I would be offended.

 

I had a professional photographer take birth photos, first breastfeeding photos, and again later. It was so I could capture and always have remembrance of the two most beautiful times in my motherhood. What is WRONG, is treating breastfeeding in photo like it is anything different than a child's first b-day, communion, first haircut, graduation.....

A magazine cover displayed to world is a lot different than family photos. It seems that some people are just trying to find something to be offended about.

[nmoira]

O.K. we'll just have to agree to disagree about this topic, but I think the issues you have with my opinion have less to do with logic and more about morality.

You are (mostly) incorrect in your assumption.

 

Not long before I moved from my home province of Ontario the case of a young woman had been arrested for being shirtless in public went through the courts. The arguments were long and fascinating (particularly about the "sexual nature" of women's breasts). She prevailed, and it's legal for both men and women to be topless in the province of Ontario.

 

Here's a 20th anniversary article marking the decision:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/story/2011/07/19/gwen-jacobs.html

[Ibbygirl]

:001_wub::001_wub::001_wub::001_wub:

 

I would have agreed with you, too, if you'd posted first! :001_smile:

 

lol :lol:

[stripe]

I am sure the mother had no say in what photo was used on the cover. She is lovely and her little boy is darling.

She did agree to be posed like that with him.

[clarkacademy]

And my pre-teen boy would not even bat an eye at the picture? Why? Because he's used to it.

 

Your son is used to seeing an oversized toddler pull a step stool to suck on you? Not too mention you wear skin tight clothing and full face makeup at all times too? This really portrays breastfeeding at it's best then I guess I did it all wrong. No this is disgusting this does not portray what a real wife or mother is defend it all you want

[LG Gone Wild]

That picture is revolting and unfair to extended BF moms (I am not one).

[nmoira]

 

Your son is used to seeing an oversized toddler pull a step stool to suck on you? Not too mention you wear skin tight clothing and full face makeup at all times too? This really portrays breastfeeding at it's best then I guess I did it all wrong. No this is disgusting this does not portray what a real wife or mother is defend it all you want

Well, people who wear skintight clothing breastfeed. So do people who wear heels and women who wear make-up and dye their hair and women with tattoos and women who smoke and women with denim skirts cut below the knee. I don't see her clothing as being an issue.

[clarkacademy]

Yeah I agree. I don't see it as sexual. But frankly it does not look natural AT ALL. As I said in a previous post she looks like a vending machine. It's an absurd picture.

 

Good post!!

[nmoira]

Yeah I agree. I don't see it as sexual. But frankly it does not look natural AT ALL. As I said in a previous post she looks like a vending machine. It's an absurd picture.

Agreed.

[TracyP]

This does look unnatural and staged, but geez...pornographic:confused: disgusting:confused:

 

My toddler does not use a chair, but she does stand up sometimes. I do wear makeup and I nurse no matter what I'm wearing. I guarantee my clothes have been a lot "worse" than this picture.:lol:

[amey311]

I agree. I am just glad she isn't wearing 3 inch heels. It could have gone that way.

 

I think the posing is a little awkward (maybe it's not even the chair - it's the chair in a studio, versus the kid on the chair while mom is trying to do something else?). However, I don't think the heels are necessarily bad.

 

http://yfrog.com/gz5b0ovj - Miranda Kerr nursing Flynn, in heels (because she was on a photo shoot for VS). YOu can imagine her instead on a couch in the robe and heels reading a magazine while Flynn nurses in 3 years and she's between shoots.

 

I mention the couch only because I found it easier to nurse bigger kids on a couch than a single folding chair - the couch helped support the kid - but I have done it in office chairs. I can also remember going on vacation with some friends. The mother was still nursing her 4 year old, and I remember watching my mom and Peg playing cards, 4 year old walking up to Peg and saying "Nin, mom? Can I have nin?" and Peg hiking up her shirt on that side while 4YO had a couple of sips and the adults kept playing cards. Again - a standing child, but standing because mom was doing something else and everyone just kept doing what they were doing.

[stripe]

I don't see her clothing as being an issue.

 

It's not her clothing anyway. Other models from the photoshoot were posed in the same clothes. There is some point the photographer wanted to make through the clothes.

 

I think the color, for example. So the breast "pops," as they say.

[nmoira]

It's not her clothing anyway. Other models from the photoshoot were posed in the same clothes. There is some point the photographer wanted to make through the clothes.

 

I think the color, for example. So the breast "pops," as they day.

:tongue_smilie:

I know this isn't the sense you mean, but after seven straight years of nursing mine more flop than pop.

[Mom-ninja.]

Your son is used to seeing an oversized toddler pull a step stool to suck on you? Not too mention you wear skin tight clothing and full face makeup at all times too?

 

Yep.

 

Although, I will admit to not wearing makeup at all times. 'Tis shameful, I know.

[Pretty in Pink]

Well, people who wear skintight clothing breastfeed. So do people who wear heels and women who wear make-up and dye their hair and women with tattoos and women who smoke and women with denim skirts cut below the knee. I don't see her clothing as being an issue.

 

Agreed. The picture is neither disgusting nor pornographic, IMO. At worst it's an awkward pose. I don't see what the fuss is about. I'm sure it looks unusual to people who aren't used to seeing extended breastfeeding in practice. <shrugs>

[chepyl]

Was it baby talk that had a nursing baby picture a few years ago? That was beautifully done. This picture really just stirs up a megative reaction to breastfeeding, if my Facebook feed is any indication. The picture was selected for shock value, the title/caption is antagonistic to a grpup of women. There are already bad feelings about who does and who doesnt, do you worl or are you a sahm....this just creates a deeper wedge between the two groups. My kids self weaned at two. This picture, as others have mentioned shows nothing of the relatiinship between mother amd child. It is awkward.

[twoxcell]

I am 100% pro breastfeeding, but I do not see the point of taking a picture of yourself breastfeeding just to prove a point. I also don't get people plastering them all over facebook and getting mad when they are taken down. I nursed in public all of the time and no one even really noticed because I was discreet. Some things are meant to be private and not because they are bad.;)

[LaxMom]

My boys weaned when they were almost 4. I have never, ever, nursed any of my children while they stood on a chair. I have also never, EVER, asked another woman "Are you mom enough?" That is the kind of parenting outlook that makes me crazy.

 

Eta: This is the kind of image I imagine those who are creeped out by extended breastfeeding have when they think about it. And it would totally creep me out, too, to think of randomly picking up a toddler to nurse. As I try to explain to people, it's different when it's just a continuation of what you've done since birth. I hardly think this picture suggests that.

Edited May 10, 2012 by MyCrazyHouse

[Mom-ninja.]

:tongue_smilie:

I know this isn't the sense you mean, but after seven straight years of nursing mine more flop than pop.

 

*snort* that made me laugh

 

 

 

Agreed. The picture is neither disgusting nor pornographic, IMO. At worst it's an awkward pose. I don't see what the fuss is about. I'm sure it looks unusual to people who aren't used to seeing extended breastfeeding in practice. <shrugs>

 

Thank you. I'm not understanding the fuss either.

[twoxcell]

Wanted to add that my first reaction to that picture was, Wow that is one big 3 year old, and that looks uncomfortable!:lol:

[Snickerdoodle]

Another thing just to fuel the mommy wars.

 

Aren't there so many other things to be concerned about in this world? I can honestly say that how long another mother breastfeeds her children is pretty darn low on my list of things to get riled up about.

 

I wonder, though, why the mother would allow herself to be used to make such awkward and provocative picture like that.

[nmoira]

 

I know. He looks kinda like the size and age of my 6 almost 7 year old. He's eating steak and stuff. My boobs hurt thinking about it. :tongue_smilie:

My youngest was like a gymnast... friends would gasp and wince on my behalf even though I was long past noticing. Mammograms are a breeze though, so I guess everything has an upside. :D

[Ibbygirl]

My youngest was like a gymnast... friends would gasp and wince on my behalf even though I was long past noticing. Mammograms are a breeze though, so I guess everything has an upside. :D

 

*choke* This made me LOL. Too funny! My son used to bite. OUCH!

[Annie Laurie]

I love this very short response, and couldn't agree more.

 

http://www.askmoxie.org/2012/05/an-open-letter-to-time.html

[mom2scouts]

I nursed one of mine until she was almost 3 years old and I find this cover very negative. Our nursing sessions at that age were cuddling together at bedtime, not her standing on a chair pulling down my shirt! I think it was posed for the biggest reaction.

[Ibbygirl]

I love this very short response, and couldn't agree more.

 

http://www.askmoxie.org/2012/05/an-open-letter-to-time.html

 

Hear! Hear! Very well said! :iagree::iagree:

[Kathryn]

Even if it's not p*rnographic, er*tic, or s*xual, the pose is strange and unnatural. There seems to be no affection between the mother and child. It totally misses the relationship aspect of EBF.

 

My boys weaned when they were almost 4. I have never, ever, nursed any of my children while they stood on a chair. I have also never, EVER, asked another woman "Are you mom enough?" That is the kind of parenting outlook that makes me crazy.

 

Eta: This is the kind of image I imagine those who are creeped out by extended breastfeeding have when they think about it. And it would totally creep me out, too, to think of randomly picking up a toddler to nurse. As I try to explain to people, it's different when it's just a continuation of what you've done since birth. I hardly think this picture suggests that.

 

I agree with much that's been said here. I just finished nursing my almost-3yo last month. Extended BFing is not represented by that cover photo. It's meant to be provocative. I can't imagine that if I were to have ever been photographed nursing I would have agreed to such a pose, especially for a magazine cover.

[leeannpal]

I love this very short response, and couldn't agree more.

 

http://www.askmoxie.org/2012/05/an-open-letter-to-time.html

 

Beautifully said!

[butterflymommy]

Hmmm... at first it does seems sexualized and offensive but isn't that how mainstream america sees breastfeeding in general? How much of our impression is from the fact that the mom is young, beautiful, and sexy? If she were frumpy, overweight, wearing baggy clothes with disheveled hair and coke bottle glasses would we be condemning the picture because she's nursing her toddler standing up?

[LG Gone Wild]

I love this very short response, and couldn't agree more.

 

http://www.askmoxie.org/2012/05/an-open-letter-to-time.html

 

Bingo!

[Hilltop]

My youngest was like a gymnast... friends would gasp and wince on my behalf even though I was long past noticing. Mammograms are a breeze though, so I guess everything has an upside. :D

:lol::lol:

[Parrothead]

Your son is used to seeing an oversized toddler pull a step stool to suck on you? Not too mention you wear skin tight clothing and full face makeup at all times too? This really portrays breastfeeding at it's best then I guess I did it all wrong. No this is disgusting this does not portray what a real wife or mother is defend it all you want

What does hair, clothing styles and make up have to do with it? Some moms hang around in PJs and yoga pants all day. Others do hair and make up and dress less casual. Every one of them is a real wife/mother. None of that has to do with nursing - extended or not.

[LeslieAnneLevine]

The picture is weird, but it shouldn't shock, even if that is what it's trying to do. Breasts are for feeding babies and young children. That's why we have them.

 

(sorry if someone's made this same exact point, I read most of this thread, but not all)

[Wolfmeis]

I posted that Moxie response to my FB page. Thanks for the linkage!

[laundrycrisis]

The cover is a mockery of a nursing relationship.

 

This is exactly how I see the photograph. I have nothing against extended nursing - I nursed well into the preschool age years. But I really dislike this photo.

 

I nursed one of mine until she was almost 3 years old and I find this cover very negative. Our nursing sessions at that age were cuddling together at bedtime, not her standing on a chair pulling down my shirt! I think it was posed for the biggest reaction.

 

I agree.

[Mommyfaithe]

Agreed. The picture is neither disgusting nor pornographic, IMO. At worst it's an awkward pose. I don't see what the fuss is about. I'm sure it looks unusual to people who aren't used to seeing extended breastfeeding in practice. <shrugs>

 

I am used to seeing extended b'feeding....it is pretty common in my circles....BUT never have I seen a toddler pull up a stool to nurse!! My own kids have at times tried to walk off...OUCH!....but quickly learned that is how you end that b'feeding time. Anyway, I found the picture extremely disturbing....nit because a toddler was breastfeeding, but because of the " are you Mom enough?" stance. And the pull up a stool and whoop mom's shirt down.....

 

And for the record, I do wear heals, have tattoos and usually try to look somewhat trendy.

 

This Time cover made me gag....because it is just OFF.

 

 

Eta: My real issue is the photo....not the breastfeeding. I think this could have been a really beautiful photo, had it been done right. The photographer stinks...and the editor should be ashamed of himself ( herself? ) for letting this shot go to press. I think they purposefully picked a photo where it would cause a ruckus....instead of focusing on extended breastfeeding and the benefits to child and Mamma...we can focus on a poorly done photoshoot, and a half @ssed headline...Are You Mom Enough? GAG!!!!!

Edited May 10, 2012 by Mommyfaithe

[StaceyinLA]

I am not overly impressed by the way they did the pic, but I wasn't disgusted by it. Certainly the pose could've been better. And yes, the child DOES look much older than 3, not that his age should be an issue.

 

And though I absolutely believe it is all for attention-grabbing, I rather think it is a positive that they have a young, attractive mom out there as an AP parenting advocate, since many 20-somethings have babies as "accessories" for someone else to care for the bulk of the time. I'm sure people have an image of the type person that might extended bf, and that image is probably not someone who looks like this young lady.

[momtoamiracle]

it's in very poor taste. I would not consider that showing a loving mom and son relationship. It looks perverted to me. The child is dressed much older than a three year old.

 

yuck.

[nmoira]

Love the tags. :D

[stripe]

I agree with much that's been said here. I just finished nursing my almost-3yo last month. Extended BFing is not represented by that cover photo. It's meant to be provocative. I can't imagine that if I were to have ever been photographed nursing I would have agreed to such a pose, especially for a magazine cover.

 

Right. The point of the article is to examine if AP is too extreme and mothers are now slaves to their children, or whatever. It's not "let's celebrate nursing." The photographer and writers/editors for the issue have chosen a topic of horror and repulsion, and that is their photo for it. So, for that reason, I am not crazy about the whole thing, because it's purposely not meant to be flattering. It is supposed to have the air of the freak show about it. Weird American mothers, slave to their nipples, versus liberated French mothers who don't bother.

[DianeW88]

They made the nursing look se*ual.

Wrong way to handle it.

 

:iagree: Good day for the pedophiles. :glare:

[melissel]

Huh. It didn't really faze me at all. I'm kind of surprised at the backlash here. I definitely didn't see it as pornographic (:confused:) or disgusting. I did see it as slightly provocative, but IMO, nursing moms still deal with a lot of BS, and yeah, a lot of them probably feel kind of defensive about it. Small wonder, given some of the comments on this thread alone. Let's not even talk about the idiocy that happens in the comments section under any mainstream press online news article about nursing :svengo:

 

And is there really only one kind of nursing relationship we're allowed to have--the touchy-feely, uber-bonded kind? If nursing occurs in a "means to an end" sort of way, that's not acceptable? Am I the only one whose nursing toddlers/preschooler often nursed in a "heymomneedadrinkOKseeyalater" manner? If I am, it's probably because of all the reading I did while nursing instead of staring dreamily into my kids' eyes :lol:

 

I don't know. It's just not that big a deal to me. I don't think the cover picture is representative of all EBFing moms.

[happypamama]

I haven't nursed that long, but nothing like taking a not-that-uncommon thing and skewing it to look weird. How many of you with toddlers have them stand on a chair to latch on? :glare:

 

Irk!

 

:iagree:Yes, this. I nursed a couple of my children a very long time (my DS2 self-weaned at not quite 3, when I was pregnant with his baby brother, and he was the earliest to wean so far), and I'm absolutely 100% for extended nursing, but I think they really went out of their way to make that look weird and provocative. I see it the same as if they'd taken a shot of a mom nursing her newborn, totally topless in a crowded mall or something -- just not something that is done, because it's just not necessary.

[justamouse]

Right. The point of the article is to examine if AP is too extreme and mothers are now slaves to their children, or whatever. It's not "let's celebrate nursing." The photographer and writers/editors for the issue have chosen a topic of horror and repulsion, and that is their photo for it. So, for that reason, I am not crazy about the whole thing, because it's purposely not meant to be flattering. It is supposed to have the air of the freak show about it. Weird American mothers, slave to their nipples, versus liberated French mothers who don't bother.

 

Well, it's horrific and repulsive to them. And they chose the pictures because they wanted the reaction.

 

What I really resent is the title of the article. The Man Who Remade Motherhood. He didn't 'remake' anything. He *restored* it, but he didn't remake a thing. Mothers all over the world (except France?lol) breastfeed their kids for long periods of time. Historically, children were breastfed for long periods of time. It's only when formula and advertising and *pasteurization* came into play that the PR on breastfeeding went into a death spiral.

[GWOB]

I came out of my self-imposed WTM board hiatus just to discuss this. I knew you guys would be able to have an intelligent discussion about this.

 

While I only nursed my dc until they were 12 months, I have no problem with people who nurse for however long they choose. Their body, their kid, their decision. Women nursing in public do not bother me one bit.

 

However, this picture has totally offended me (well, the picture in combination with the headline). Seriously? Am I mom enough? And the mom in the picture is striking a somewhat militant, defiant, and proud pose. Is she judging me because I don't make the same choices as she does? Is she saying I'm not mom enough?

 

Do we really need more fuel for the Mommy Wars? Because that seems to be the purpose of this pic and headline. Look, I get defending your choices. I constantly have to defend my choice to homeschool, but I would never pose on the cover of a magazine with my copy of WTM and ask other moms if they are mom enough. I don't judge moms who send their kids to public schools. I don't judge moms who decide not to nurse. I chose nursing and homeschooling because I d@mn well felt like it, not to prove my mothering prowess.

 

This isn't a good day for nursing. The pic just feeds the "It's creepy" argument. I worked very hard to get my extended family to accept that nursing is a normal and beautiful thing. Now I'm hearing things like "She should be arrested for child s@xual abuse" (referring to the mom in the pic). It doesn't look like she's nursing, and I have seen plenty of women nurse toddlers. It looks like she just stuck her booK in her kid's mouth and dared anyone to say anything. I really wish Time would have used one of the other pictures from the link posted earlier (which were so very sweet). Then it wouldn't feel so much like the cover mom was asking me if I was mom enough.

 

I'm just a bit riled-up about this. Moms get so much crap from so many different sides. We are our harshest critics. I just really hate it when men feed that fire. We should be supporting and encouraging one another, not tearing each other down.

[melissel]

I'm just a bit riled-up about this. Moms get so much crap from so many different sides. We are our harshest critics. I just really hate it when men feed that fire. We should be supporting and encouraging one another, not tearing each other down.

 

I do agree with every word of this. The picture doesn't faze me, but the article annoys me a little bit. That's media though. It sure did get everyone talking, didn't it?

[Impish]

The term, "Yuck" came to mind.

[EthiopianFood]

They managed to make him look about eight. It's completely ridiculous.