WWYD: Retaining a really bright 5yo in kindergarten?

[peacefully]

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Edited November 20, 2012 by yllek
typos

[MelanieM]

I would tell him he's in a K/1 grade, then register him as K and let him call himself a first grader to friends if he chooses. As you say, you'll do work based on where he's at, not what grade he's in according to anyone else.

 

If he's the type of child you can discuss complex things with, or you think this won't be too sensitive a subject for him, then you could explain a little of this to him. If you think it will cause issues for him or he won't understand it, then I would avoid conversations about retaining him. (I have a daughter that I likely would have discussed this with at 5 yrs, but a son that I wouldn't get into it with at all.)

 

Are you committed to homeschooling for any length of time, or is this something you're trying for a short while and expect to go back to the school system soon? I ask because the whole grade distinction between friends might be an issue for him if he's going back to school in a year, but perhaps not so much in a few years from now. By then, he will likely have had opportunities to become friends with others in the grade level you're placing him in moving forward.

 

Best of luck to you! :)

[chiguirre]

Since it's public school, I'd tell him that the age cutoffs for grades are less flexible than they are for private school (IME, this is true). Since his birthday is after the cutoff, you have to register him as a Ker. Then I'd start talking about all the fun things he's going to do in the ps program.

[Pamela H in Texas]

*I* wouldn't hold him back. He's solidly K-2nd grade level so there is no reason to hold him back academically. IF you took the next two years off completely, he'll still learn some on his own AND he'd easily "catch up" when you started back to academics.

 

Also, after having a child that was SIGNIFICANTLY behind (and one that was extremely advanced), I wouldn't change grade level anyway. When your child is 7th-9th grade age and/or level, then it may be helpful to adjust the grade level based on his needs. We found that our struggling student was ready to do high school on time, for example, so didn't end up adjusting further.

 

Anyway, this is my opinion. Though you son could easily be a grade lower, I wouldn't change it. There has been some studies that show that holding back young children can make a significant impact on them. And again, he is VERY likely to catch up, being on target or ahead after taking time off.

 

You might try reading some Better Late than Early (Moore) material that shows how this can all work out just fine.

 

ETA: reread your post and if you are using a public school program, then you may not have a choice depending on when your school's age cut-off is. Many schools have definite requirements for entering 1st grade. Here, not only do you have to be 4 by Sept 1st to get into preK and 5 by Sept 1st to get into Kindy. You MUST be 6 by Sept 1st to get into 1st grade. If that is the case, you'll be able to hold him back like y'all want AND then the "silly policy" is the reason which should help in explaining. However, I still think it's not necessary. It would give you an out though.

Edited April 3, 2010 by 2J5M9K

[Sahamamama]

I would tell him he's in a K/1 grade, then register him as K and let him call himself a first grader to friends if he chooses. As you say, you'll do work based on where he's at, not what grade he's in according to anyone else.

 

:iagree:Melanie gave you good advice. At least, it's what I would have said! :lol:

 

Our K'er started Kindergarten at home a month before turning five. She was certainly ready for a bit of structure and has enjoyed calling herself a "Kindergartner." ;) She's strong in reading and quite bright, but if for some reason I thought it would help her in the long-term to hover over Kindergarten for at least part of another year, that's what we'd do. At this point, we don't see any reason to hold her back, but if I were in your shoes, depending on your son, I'd probably follow Melanie's advice.

 

Melanie is also right to mention that talking to him about it depends on how well you think he'd be able to understand it and what kind of child he is. Does he need to know why? For my daughter, I would openly and honestly explain my reasoning. She is that type of child! I would also talk about how nice it will be to work on X, Y, and Z without pressure to also master A, B, and C (since she knows those). She would understand (on her level) and appreciate knowing why we're calling the upcoming year K/1st. She would hold in her mind what we're "working on" this year (e.g., handwriting, more than history), and add that to her internal motivation. She likes seeing the Big Picture.

 

Only you and your husband know your son. Your husband's desire to have your son "repeat K" is something to be considered and cherished. Daddy is putting his fatherly heart and mind into what he feels is best for his son. That is priceless. I would honor and value that fatherly heart. My husband thinks and cares deeply about our girls. He's one of those "Deep Wells," LOL. :001_wub: He doesn't say much sometimes, but when he does say something, it's usually surprisingly deep and on target. I don't disregard it. HTH.

[Sahamamama]

Maybe this would interest you.

 

http://moorehomeschool.com/

[love2read]

If you have doubts now, they will just intensify as he gets older. I would register him as K and tell friends he's in K, otherwise at some point he's going to have to explain why he's suddenly "behind" a grade. That's a lot harder to do when you're 10 than when you're 5. If he suddenly jumps ahead in maturity and SPD related problems lesson, you can easily skip a grade.

[gingersmom]

I absolutely would hold him back. You can call him a first grader or a k/1st but I would hold him back.

 

I put my then 4 year old daughter in kindergarten because she just made the cutoff.

 

Fast forward to middle school and it was clear she did not have the maturity of the other girls. Add to that the death of her father and it became very clear that it was a mistake 12 years earlier.

 

Handwriting without tears is excellent for working on handwriting.

 

My son began OT at 18 months and ended when he was 8 years old. I can't even put into words the difference it made.

[freetobeme]

when i decided - kind of last minute - to repeat K with my august-born twin boys who thought 1st grade came after K :001_smile:, we called it "super kindergarten" and it was a big hit! it was truly a mix of K/1st.

they are now officially third graders doing a mix of 3rd/4th grade work. so far, so good. they were more than academically ready for 1st but there were fine motor issues, maturity issues, and also the consideration of their being the "oldest" rather than the "youngest" in their grade whether they stay at home or not down the road.

best wishes to you as you make your decision!

[Crimson Wife]

Will the district ISP allow you to teach him wherever he is in each subject or will they expect you to use the "official" kindergarten materials they provide? If it's the latter, I would encourage you to consider independent HS. One of the big benefits to HS is flexibility and with a kid whose abilities are all over the map you don't want to be boxed into a preset grade level.

[FairProspects]

Can you just tell him that K lasts for 2 years? That's what I'm doing with ds. Its kind of sneaky, but ds doesn't know when K ends - that's for me to decide :D. (Granted, this may be harder within an actual "school" setting if they talk alot about moving to 1st grade.)

[KristenS]

We're not working with a curriculum provider, so we get to be pretty flexible, but here's our take.

 

My son is now in 2nd grade, and my daughter is pre-K. They both have winter birthdays, but are academically advanced, so they are in that weird place too. My son, however, had some definite maturity issues, as well as fine motor skills issues. So he's 'officially' enrolled at his age-appropriate grade. This makes outside activities much easier. But at least half his schoolwork is advanced (if somewhat adapted to accomodate that handwriting and attention span!). He knows some of his work is harder, but he's fine. Of course, he didn't have to 'repeat' K so that made it easier.

 

My daughter is following the same academic pattern so far. I'd say she's more socially mature and physically adept, but she keeps hitting these shy phases, so I am going to keep her at age-grade level too.

 

I figure, around middle school, some of their work might start counting toward high school credit, and that's when we'll start reassessing grade level and keeping extra-careful count of credit hours in certain subjects.

 

Some places have a K4 and a K5 ... can you tell him he's in K6? Actually, in some countries, that *is* the kindergarten age.

 

No harm in repeating kindergarten and then skipping later, if your district is good with skips. Time to mature is never wasted. (Or so I keep telling myself!)

[Ellie]

I wouldn't do it. IOW, I'd let him be a first-grader next year.

 

He has another 12 years to develop and mature. Holding him back a year won't make that much of a difference, IMHO, and he'll *know* you did it. So will his friends.

 

And I have to tell you I've had many discussions with people who did the same thing you're thinking of, and later on, when their dc were older, they had to figure out how to advance their dc to where they should have been all along, and it was much trickier and painful to do it then. (Yes, I know some people hold their dc back and are happy, but how do you know which one *you'll* be??)

 

FTR, Mr. Ellie's bday is September 7, so yes, he was "young" for his grade, but he never had any problems because of it.

[Dmmetler]

How much of a big deal does your son's school make about K graduation?

 

I'm in a similar situation, age-wise, because my DD was moved into parochial school K a year early for academic reasons. And while it was a good move academically, like your son she's struggled some physically and emotionally (and has some sensory integration concerns). Academically, even 1st is too low in many areas. But emotionally, socially, and behaviorally, she's a lot more like a "going to K in the fall" than a "Graduating K in a month's time" child. It's been OK in her nice, developmental K, but the 1st grade is a totally different world. Even her K teacher suggested that we homeschool, let her go at her own pace academically, and have lots of time to run, play, talk, and just be 5.

 

 

I considered holding her back on paper and getting her back on schedule with the public school's cutoffs for next year, since we'd be homeschooling and we can do 2nd-3rd grade level work in one subject and K level work in another just as easily in K on paper as in 1st, and decided not to because DD's school makes such a BIG deal over "Graduating" K and leaving the early childhood center. She's OK with the idea of going to school at home next year, especially since half her K class is going to different schools anyway, but she would feel like she's failed if I tried to tell her this was K/1st or a 2nd year of K. So she'll be a 5 yr old 1st grader according to her school records. And we'll do whatever she needs at home and try not to worry about grade levels.

 

Having said that, I left her in preschool activities for dance, t-ball, and so on, and she'll move on to K dance with her current dance classmates in the fall. Just because she reads and does math like an older child doesn't mean she moves like one, and DD is perfectly fine with being in her dance class instead of the K/1 class after hers, even though a couple of the kids in her K class at school are in the older group.

[wapiti]

No I would not hold him back. If he does end up back in school down the road (particularly public school), it is a whole heck of a lot harder to get a grade skip at that time than it would be to later decide to hold him back at that time, in terms of dealing with the school. As far as your ds's opinion goes, he already attaches a significance to grade level. I would be concerned that if he is held back now, even in name only, it could affect his self-confidence, not later but right now.

 

FWIW, keep in mind that bright kids are often asynchronous in their development (e.g. http://www.hoagiesgifted.org/asynchrony_squared.htm), and they are also more likely to have sensory issues (see Dabrowski's Overexcitabilities). Perhaps your DH might want to do some reading at Hoagies about the other side of the coin, grade acceleration (maybe start with this excert from A Nation Deceived http://www.davidsongifted.org/db/Articles_id_10314.aspx ).

 

Just my two cents.

[peacefully]

.

[Janet in WA]

Our oldest son had a very similar story. It was my very strong wish to have him repeat kindergarten. His father, his teachers and school counselor disagreed. They insisted he'd be "bored" academically, and if promoted he'd "catch up" physically and emotionally. I acquiesced. If I had it to do over, I'd stand my ground, and my son would be retained. He didn't catch up, and the results were not happy.

[tex-mex]

If you are determined to keep him in public schools... retain him. Homeschooling? Accelerate him.

 

I taught K for many years -- the Fall bdays (boys) tended to be the ones we recommended for retention. Emotional immaturity was the main culprit -- plus not being able to handle the transition (maturity) for 1st grade seatwork. I have found the boys who did get retained tended to become class leaders in older grades and emotional maturity sank in along with strong academics. These kids were very popular and did fine. Better to hold them back now than later years, kwim? Stigma of retention does pop in by 3rd grade w/ peers -- if you wait. Don't wait. Hubby is right. Your son's SI issues will progressively grow and peers will treat him differently if not addressed by OT or accommodations.

Edited April 3, 2010 by tex-mex

[tex-mex]

Fast forward to middle school and it was clear she did not have the maturity of the other girls. Add to that the death of her father and it became very clear that it was a mistake 12 years earlier.

 

Handwriting without tears is excellent for working on handwriting.

 

My son began OT at 18 months and ended when he was 8 years old. I can't even put into words the difference it made.

:iagree: Add the SI issues for the OP's ds and it may be that they will need to get OT services for him.

[Carol in Cal.]

If you are determined to keep him in public schools... retain him. Homeschooling? Accelerate him.

 

I taught K for many years -- the Fall bdays (boys) tended to be the ones we recommended for retention. Emotional immaturity was the main culprit -- plus not being able to handle the transition (maturity) for 1st grade seatwork. I have found the boys who did get retained tended to become class leaders in older grades and emotional maturity sank in along with strong academics. These kids were very popular and did fine. Better to hold them back now than later years, kwim? Stigma of retention does pop in by 3rd grade w/ peers -- if you wait. Don't wait. Hubby is right. Your son's SI issues will progressively grow and peers will treat him differently if not addressed by OT or accommodations.

 

I would accelerate him. You can always hold him back later, but it's much harder to skip a grade down the road. I would suggest not making a big thing about grade level, either. Just be kind of matter of fact about it. At about the 6th grade level, pick a transitional year and decide whether to do it twice. One more advantage--at that level there is much more of an accepted range of achievement in subject area classes, so it's easier to make the case that an extra year doesn't cost him anything, really. That way, too, you have freedom of action maximally. Your DH is right about Malcolm Gladwell, but mostly for sports. The best thing your DS will get from this homeschooling, from a Malcolm Gladwell perspective, is the lack of spending time lining up or doing busy work. He can get to the 10,000 hour point much faster if you homeschool him.

[Guest PCM]

Totally agree with Tex-Mex. Her take on this is exactly what we experienced with my oldest son, who is now almost 30. Academically, he was ready to move to 1st grade, but it was the seat work and all the copying from the board that had his K teacher concerned. We were in a fabulous school at the time.

 

Both K teachers and the principal called us in and told us that ds could indeed go to 1st grade, but they felt he would do OK but most likely be in the bottom of the class. Or he could repeat K and be in the top of the class.

 

They sent us away with a lot of information and studies to read. They made us look beyond "my son failed kindergarten" which is what most fathers felt (your husband is a gem to be able to put your son's needs first) to middle school and graduation.

 

The social issues don't usually matter to 5 year olds, but most educators won't hold a kid back after 3rd grade because then it DOES matter. So, now is the best time to give your boy that extra year.

 

When he gets to middle school and the girls are all so much more mature, your son will be able to hold his own. He will probably be in the top of the class, which is a much nicer place to be than the bottom.

 

And if he is 19 rather than 18 when he graduates? So much the better to be one year older and wiser! We ended up moving overseas the summer after he graduated and I felt a lot happier leaving a 19 year old in college than I would have felt leaving an 18 year old.

 

My very bright son had a great run in the school system, socially, academically and physically. He was a leader on the soccer field and off.

 

Would he have been so successful had he been struggling along in the bottom third of the class? I don't think so.

 

Lots to think about, but you know your son and will make the right choice.

[EKS]

I wouldn't hold him back. I have a kid who is now 13 who probably should have been held back between K and 1st. We didn't do it and now I'm so glad we resisted all the advice everyone was giving us. He has a summer birthday, so he's always the youngest in his grade, but even so now if he went to school he would likely need a double grade skip to fit in academically and socially.

 

Should your son ever go back into a classroom, you can revisit the issue then.

[zaichiki]

Is the problem just about how he'll transition back into school? FWIW here is our experience. My oldest was always academically advanced. When K age came around we chose *not* to put him in school b/c he could already read chapter books but could not sit still, wait in line, or transition from one activity to another without a tantrum. To top it all off he ran with a funny gait. His is a spring birthday, so he would have been young-ish for his grade if we had chosen to send him to school. Academically he was 1st-4th grade level depending on the skill. Socially/emotionally, he wasn't even ready for K. So we homeschooled him where he was at in each subject and I lived by the mantra "there are no grades in homeschool!"

 

Seriously, grade level designations are for separating kids into classrooms in a school building. I honestly told my child that he was in no grade, b/c he wasn't *in* a class, he was *in* home. If people asked him or even pressed him for a grade level, I coached him to answer "I'm (insert age here) and I'm homeschooled." If another homeschooled child who chose to identify with a grade level asked him, he'd answer that he was working at several different grade levels, so it was hard to choose just one.

 

Fast forward to this year: we sent him to school for the first time. He is technically 5th grade age, but he's in the 6th grade. He is at the top of his class academically. He sits just fine now, and waits in line, and even runs normally (years of town soccer, basketball, and time to mature at his own pace). He has learned how to handle those 8th grade girls :rolleyes: and has friends.

 

The hardest part of the adjustment to school has been getting used to the demands on his time/greatly reduced free time AND the school kids' devotion to popular culture (in that order). The concerns we had when he was 5 are gone except for the fact that he is still not being challenged academically. There is quite a volume of work, but most of it is pretty much mindless busy work. The teachers just don't have very high expectations. If we choose to homeschool him in the fall it won't be b/c he wasn't ready for the grade skip; it will be b/c we don't want him to get used to getting high grades without putting forth much effort.

 

Why not just live by the mantra that "grades are for school" or say that being more than one grade level at a time is okay.

 

ETA: We hs'ed in MA where our town "required" a grade level on the application to hs. I chose this battle and put only his birthdate on the line on the form. When the secretary called me to "explain" that they needed a grade level, I pressed for the reason and stood my ground. Turns out it was needed so they could determine which drawer to file his paperwork in! I still stood my ground and explained that he worked at a variety of grade levels. They said they simply needed a number. I told them to choose any drawer they liked (in a nice way). I think they chose based on his birthdate -- don;t know, though, 'cause I never asked. When we decided to put him in school, we chose an inexpensive Catholic school. The principal placed him based on a portfolio of work samples in each subject area.

Edited April 3, 2010 by zaichiki
spelling error

[Impish]

I'm facing a similar issue. Tazzie is in 'reading readiness' this year at home...which means he'll be in gr 1 for Sept. His birthday is in Feb, so he'll only be 5.5 in grade one.

 

My option is to do 'traditional homeschool' with him next year. Then the following year, put him in 'blended' or 'fully aligned', but in grade 1 again. That way, next year, we have no pressure. We do what we do, and then the following year, join up with some or all subjects meeting (or surpassing) the provincial outline for the year. I plan to tell him we're doing kindergarten next year. If we weren't hs'ing, he'd not have been able to start until Sept in ps anyways.

[Laurie4b]

I really need some different perspectives on this one. Please bear with me as I try to give some background:

 

Ds' birthday is in early September. When he turned 5, he started kindergarten at a private school that is classical education classroom/homeschool hybrid. (He attends class two days a week, and we homeschool the other three. There is some assigned work for school, but otherwise we can do our own thing for those three days.) He is the youngest kid in his class.

 

At the time, he seemed totally ready, and academically, there's no doubt that he is at least kindergarten level. He is currently at a late-1st to mid-2nd grade reading level and a 1st grade spelling level. I reviewed our state's standards for history and science, and he has a solid understanding of all the K history and science standards and most of the grade 1 and 2 standards. He is weak in math, but he is solidly at a K level there. Handwriting is just awful for him.

 

This year, we discovered that ds has Sensory Processing Disorder. This is probably what underlies his difficulties with handwriting and math. It's probably also hampering his reading as well, but he is a natural reader and able to compensate and do well. His SPD affects motor planning, gross motor function, strength and tone, fine motor, and visual processing. He struggles with the physical activities that most kids do rather easily at this age. He is currently getting OT for this, and knowing his diagnosis has helped me figure out strategies that work best for him.

 

For many reasons (not having to do with his SPD), we have decided not to return to the private school next year, but to homeschool full-time and work with our district's homeschooling program. My dh, who has been reading a lot of Malcolm Gladwell lately, is adamant that he wants to enroll ds as a kindergartener again. We will be doing activities that are appropriate to his abilities, but dh wants ds to be one of the older kids in his class, should he ever go back into a classroom. I'm not so sure that ds is going to be okay with being retained, even in name only, when all his friends will be calling themselves first-graders next year. How is this going to affect him?

 

OTOH, if we do retain him, we will be totally coasting in terms of meeting our state's grade-level standards next year. He's ahead on many fronts, and we would have the "time" to address his SPD fully, work on writing, and explore rabbit trails.

 

Gah... I keep going around and around in my head on this one. If you've made it this far, I'd love to hear any insight that you may have. Thanks for reading.

 

I held my ds with sensory processing back because he just couldn't accomplish anything academically. I wish I hadn't. It still bothers him in 7th grade, though he's homeschooled. Google the research for retention and you'll see that longterm the effects are mostly negative.

[Janet in WA]

I want to add that my comment is related to the day when, and if, you return your son to a regular classroom. What I would really do if I could have a do-over with my son would be to homeschool him and never look back.

 

However, I'd like to ask why your son should even feel "retained" if you homeschool him and he's doing activities appropriate to his abilities. Why does he have to know what "grade" he's in at all? Do you mean because he'll participate in grade-segregated activities with your district's homeschool program?

[Audrey]

I really need some different perspectives on this one. Please bear with me as I try to give some background:

 

Ds' birthday is in early September. When he turned 5, he started kindergarten at a private school that is classical education classroom/homeschool hybrid. (He attends class two days a week, and we homeschool the other three. There is some assigned work for school, but otherwise we can do our own thing for those three days.) He is the youngest kid in his class.

 

At the time, he seemed totally ready, and academically, there's no doubt that he is at least kindergarten level. He is currently at a late-1st to mid-2nd grade reading level and a 1st grade spelling level. I reviewed our state's standards for history and science, and he has a solid understanding of all the K history and science standards and most of the grade 1 and 2 standards. He is weak in math, but he is solidly at a K level there. Handwriting is just awful for him.

 

This year, we discovered that ds has Sensory Processing Disorder. This is probably what underlies his difficulties with handwriting and math. It's probably also hampering his reading as well, but he is a natural reader and able to compensate and do well. His SPD affects motor planning, gross motor function, strength and tone, fine motor, and visual processing. He struggles with the physical activities that most kids do rather easily at this age. He is currently getting OT for this, and knowing his diagnosis has helped me figure out strategies that work best for him.

 

For many reasons (not having to do with his SPD), we have decided not to return to the private school next year, but to homeschool full-time and work with our district's homeschooling program. My dh, who has been reading a lot of Malcolm Gladwell lately, is adamant that he wants to enroll ds as a kindergartener again. We will be doing activities that are appropriate to his abilities, but dh wants ds to be one of the older kids in his class, should he ever go back into a classroom. I'm not so sure that ds is going to be okay with being retained, even in name only, when all his friends will be calling themselves first-graders next year. How is this going to affect him?

 

OTOH, if we do retain him, we will be totally coasting in terms of meeting our state's grade-level standards next year. He's ahead on many fronts, and we would have the "time" to address his SPD fully, work on writing, and explore rabbit trails.

 

Gah... I keep going around and around in my head on this one. If you've made it this far, I'd love to hear any insight that you may have. Thanks for reading.

 

 

Haven't read the PPs, but you could do what we did. Homeschool and move along at the child's pace, eschewing any propensity to label him in any particular grade and just enjoy your child, your homeschool and all the potential that will unfold. :001_smile:

[kalanamak]

I didn't mention what grade my son was to him until he started asking (in second grade). I marched ahead in each topic as he was able. By mid second grade he was up to par on each topic. If he hadn't been in at least half of the academic topics, I would told him he was in first. Since he was soooooo wiggly and not early in reading, I didn't know how he would mature, and lacking a crystal ball, I just didn't put a name on it until I felt more confident.

 

HTH

 

(and if people asked, I'd say "For his age, he's a little ahead in math, a little behind in reading, but his musical and science abilities are very strong, and he loves learning about diseases', to which they would reply "oh, another doctor!' with a clever smile, and grades never came up again.)

[ondreeuh]

I wouldn't assume he will feel bad about it. Anecdotal, but my husband repeated 1st grade and his brother repeated K. Their sister didn't repeat but should have - she was always friends with younger kids and had a difficult time socially because she was a little less mature than her peers. My dh and his brother have no issues or regrets and both of them became leaders - so I've only seen it work out well.

 

My son has a summer birthday and began K when he was barely 5. Technically he's finishing 3rd grade this year and I've already talked about how in 4th grade he'll be reading some big hard books and writing a lot, and he needs some more time to get ready for that so we're going to do more 3rd grade work before we start the 4th grade stuff. He is completely fine with that! I will begin the 4th grade material when he's ready.

 

I think it really depends what you plans are. If you're going to buy grade-level materials or put him back into PS, then I would bump him back a year. If you piece your own stuff together and plan to HS long-term, it matters less.

[Lolly]

Btdt. I'm going to tell you the absolute truth.

 

 

Most likely it really, really doesn't matter what you do.

 

It won't scar him for life to be held back. He won't fail miserably because you keep him moving. With processing difficulties, he is probably going to have some difficulty with academics regardless of what grade he is in. Holding him a year can give you some padding to get his basics solidified. Moving him on can make you keep pushing harder which can be good.

 

So, make a decision knowing that whatever you do decide he is going to be just fine.

[jujsky]

I haven't read the other posts, so please forgive me if I repeat anything that has already been said. IMHO, I wouldn't retain him. My son (6) was diagnosed with SPD at 3, and shares many of the issues you listed with your son. If he is keeping up academically in his weak areas and he's above-grade level in his strong areas, retaining him will probably cause him frustration. If he has a group of friends who are all progressing to the next grade level it may further that frustration and make him feel as though there is something "wrong" with him. By holding him back now "in case" you enroll him in school down the road, you are creating a contingency plan you may never need. Would you rather have your son be a challenged younger child in a classroom or a bored-out-of-his-mind older child in a classroom? Option #2 sounds like it would be asking for trouble. Couple boredom with all of the distractions/inattention SPD can bring and your sweet little boy could potentially become a behavior problem in a classroom setting. Challenging him would probably keep him more focused in a classroom setting and at home.

 

Handwriting is something that will progress with time and hard work. I'm going through that right now with my son and I'm not stressing over it because I know with practice and as his muscles improve it WILL get better. First grade should give you plenty of time to go down all the rabbit trails. As for getting SPD under control, it takes time, and it's one of those evolving things. The issues that are manifesting right now may not be the same issues you'll see a year from now. Keep up with the therapy, give him the tools he needs and teach him how to use them.

 

Good luck! I know it's a difficult diagnosis at first, but with a good therapist and a good carry-over at home it really can get better with time. My son had extreme noise sensitivity and that has dramatically improved. He is also a "seeker" but we've given him tools at home (a cuddle swing that he uses before we start school, a "sensory tool box" full of fidgets and a body sock that he uses as needed) that he has access to. He's also at the point now where he is starting to recognize when things will be unpleasant for his senses and will ask for modification -- ear-plugs, moving to another table in a restaurant if a smell is irritating him, or sometimes being removed from a situation. You didn't say if your DS was a sensory-avoider or a sensory-seeker, but if he's a seeker you may want to ask your therapist about the Engine Program. Your child learns to label how fast he's running internally and externally and learns coping mechanisms to bring himself down to a normal level. It's generally used with slightly older kids, but our therapist modified it for us and it really did the trick!

[Margo out of lurking]

I really need some different perspectives on this one. Please bear with me as I try to give some background:

 

Ds' birthday is in early September. When he turned 5, he started kindergarten at a private school that is classical education classroom/homeschool hybrid. (He attends class two days a week, and we homeschool the other three. There is some assigned work for school, but otherwise we can do our own thing for those three days.) He is the youngest kid in his class.

 

At the time, he seemed totally ready, and academically, there's no doubt that he is at least kindergarten level. He is currently at a late-1st to mid-2nd grade reading level and a 1st grade spelling level. I reviewed our state's standards for history and science, and he has a solid understanding of all the K history and science standards and most of the grade 1 and 2 standards. He is weak in math, but he is solidly at a K level there. Handwriting is just awful for him.

 

This year, we discovered that ds has Sensory Processing Disorder. This is probably what underlies his difficulties with handwriting and math. It's probably also hampering his reading as well, but he is a natural reader and able to compensate and do well. His SPD affects motor planning, gross motor function, strength and tone, fine motor, and visual processing. He struggles with the physical activities that most kids do rather easily at this age. He is currently getting OT for this, and knowing his diagnosis has helped me figure out strategies that work best for him.

 

For many reasons (not having to do with his SPD), we have decided not to return to the private school next year, but to homeschool full-time and work with our district's homeschooling program. My dh, who has been reading a lot of Malcolm Gladwell lately, is adamant that he wants to enroll ds as a kindergartener again. We will be doing activities that are appropriate to his abilities, but dh wants ds to be one of the older kids in his class, should he ever go back into a classroom. I'm not so sure that ds is going to be okay with being retained, even in name only, when all his friends will be calling themselves first-graders next year. How is this going to affect him?

 

OTOH, if we do retain him, we will be totally coasting in terms of meeting our state's grade-level standards next year. He's ahead on many fronts, and we would have the "time" to address his SPD fully, work on writing, and explore rabbit trails.

 

Gah... I keep going around and around in my head on this one. If you've made it this far, I'd love to hear any insight that you may have. Thanks for reading.

 

If I understand correctly, you only need to choose a grade because you are working with your ps. I agree with your dh; I'd enroll him as a Ker and let him work at his pace. If he needs an explanation, the suggestion that the dates are less flexible is GREAT.

 

My dd's bday is three weeks past the cutoff. She began K and 1st in ps and could easily have fit in academically if she'd been younger. That wasn't an option with ps. It took no time at all for me to see how much better off she was being one of the oldest.

 

My ds's bday is three weeks before the cutoff. We've hsed him the entire time. We had him in an outside preschool program when he could have been in kindergarten. We taught himself to read, sailed through math, had a good attention span. He's big for his age, and all of his friends were a year older. We skipped K altogether and "made" him a first grader. Now he's in 6th grade. He can do the work, but it would be to his advantage to be an older student in 5th grade. Instead, he'll graduate just before he turns 18. I really wish we'd not "officially" moved him up all those years ago.

[ocelotmom]

I was held back in 1st grade under similar circumstances. I feel it had long-term negative effects on my self-confidence, motivation, and academics. I'm pretty sure that it didn't help me at all socially, either.

 

I don't think kids that age can really understand that someone might be held back for a reason other than "failing". I didn't get teased much, but I do think it impacted how people viewed me. And, after that point, I tended to feel that any academic accomplishments weren't really worth anything, as I should have done them a year earlier, if that makes sense.

 

Academically, I don't think a year of continuing to progress with basically no effort was beneficial. I was smart to begin with. By the end of my second year of first grade, I was reading at at least a 3rd or 4th grade level. I remember getting one word wrong on a spelling test (one word, late in the year!), and being super upset, because it was something I was already supposed to know. At the same time, it put me further in a position where I could get by with very little effort. And that combination (expecting perfection of myself without effort) is still very much with me today.

 

Even now, when I've basically gotten over the academic stuff, I'm still discovering issues. My son is a first grader this year, and, though very bright overall, he's a bit slow verbally (he was a slow talker, and is now a slow reader). I feel like I don't have a good frame of reference for what he should be capable of, because almost all my distinct memories of 1st grade are from the latter half of my second time through, meaning my perception of 1st grader capabilities are those of a bright 7.5 year old with an extra year of instruction. Which, since we're homeschooling, means I have an entirely new source of anxiety and self-doubt!

 

Obviously, I don't know how I would have turned out if I hadn't been held back. It's entirely possible things could have gone worse. Also, I grew up in a small town, where I was with many of the same people from K through high school graduation (well, most of them either started the year after me or finished the year before me, obviously, but close enough). In a bigger school, or if you're planning to change schools, social factors might not be as much of an issue.

 

I don't know if any of my assessment of my personal situation is valid, but I guess I'll leave it at saying that, whether it was the appropriate move or not, it was traumatic long-term. It's not a step I would personally take for my kids unless I really felt there was no other choice. If I did, I think I'd try to find a way to get them back up to their original grade level over the course of a few years if possible.

 

If you do choose to hold him back, I think that K is probably the best time. And I think not being truthful with him about his grade level sounds like a recipe for disaster unless you're 100% sure you can get him back to grade level before he figures it out.

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[Ottakee]

Why not call him Pre 1st---which is what they offer here for kids that pass K but aren't ready for 1st grade. NO repeating, just adding in an extra year.

 

Since you are changing learning environments he will be making new friends who won't know that he was "held back".

[Dmmetler]

You may be surprised at how non-heartbroken he is. I thought the same thing about my DD, who has seemed to LOVE her parochial K, but after I'd started bringing home stacks of homeschooling books, she asked me if we were homeschooling next year. I told her that yes, that was what her father and I had planned.

 

Her two questions

 

1) I can still see my friends after school, right?

 

and

 

2) And I DON'T have to keep learning things I already know?

 

I hadn't realized just how annoyed she was getting with the K curriculum, because she'd done such a good job of focusing on the positives.

 

Since then, there isn't a day where she doesn't mention that "next year, I won't have to go to the stinky cafeteria" or "Next year I won't be the only one who can't jump rope". And she'll point out "Cat is in my dance class, so I'll see her. Chase only lives a block away...."

 

The other thing is that it's very common here for kids to change schools after K. If this is the case in your area, it might be that your son and his friends are already aware that kids are going to different schools, and it won't be heartbreaking at all because that's almost expected. I discovered this was the case for my DD as well-and also discovered that "Tatum is doing school at her house, too!".

[Dobela]

When I was working on my MEd, I did a research paper on the effects of retention. The most suprising thing was a study that showed 5 yr olds who ranked the fear of failing kindergarten with the fear of going blind and the fear of their mother dying. Another study showed that any benefits of retention had faded by 3rd grade. Part of that was due to the issues leading to retention were not addressed adequately since repeating the same grade without changing the method or addressing the deficits actually did not help the child. For a child with sensory problems or other undiagnosed learning difficulties, just holding them back for 'maturity' isn't going to change anything except make them feel stupid at some point.

 

If your child has sensory issues, I would ask for occupational therapy. My son absolute had to have OT from about the age of 6 to 8. His handwriting would have never progressed without it. The help of a specialist that understood sensory issues was vital.

 

I also wonder why you are working so closely with the school district? Is it free materials? Or do you only plan on homeschooling temporarily? Honestly, one of the best things for my son (who started off much like yours) is that we just passed him along with peers in church classes but on paperwork I listed him at his working level. Yes he was retained academically (I did it in 1st grade), but because I was in control of the curriculum and I changed it each year (to better meet his needs and where he was academically) he did not know he was behind much until about a year ago. This year he has finally been making huge progress and is near his peers academically for the first time in at least couple of years. I can't imagine the pressure he and I would have been under if we had to work with the school district as closely as you are planning to do. Not to mention, the methods we are now using are not even available in our school districts.

 

:grouphug: Only you know your child, and only you can make trhe decision. I know it is a tough one.

[zaichiki]

He's big for his age, and all of his friends were a year older. We skipped K altogether and "made" him a first grader. Now he's in 6th grade. He can do the work, but it would be to his advantage to be an older student in 5th grade. Instead, he'll graduate just before he turns 18. I really wish we'd not "officially" moved him up all those years ago.

 

Kristine,

 

If you don't mind my asking, how would it be to his advantage to be an older student in 5th grade this year?

[Ellie]

:iagree::iagree::iagree:

 

I'm so glad you posted, especially about the study.

[Ottakee]

I am not the original poster but I see several reasons for a boy being older in his grade:

 

maturity--girls tend to mature earlier than boys and then if the boy is young for his grade there might be a gap of 2-3 years of maturity in the kids

 

puberty--it is TOUGH for a boy to be the smallest/least physically mature one--esp. in jr. high

 

sports--if the boy is interested in sports, most school and many rec. leagues go off "grade" levels so you might have him competing in a 5/6th grade league and some of the boys would be way older/stronger/coordinated than the boy who is young for his class

 

at graduation---many jobs now require a person to be 18. You might have a child graduating at 17 and have 3-6 months before they could get a summer or full time job.

 

I think that esp. if this boy is going to be switching schools/peer groups in many situations, it would not be that bad to "hold him back". Most (if not all) of the kids in the new setting would not know that he was "held back" as many of them attended various years of preschool, etc.

 

I just look back to my school years and it was very obvious which boys were young for their grade. The suffered a lot with peer relationships, etc. and sometimes with academics, esp. as things became more abstract in higher grades.

 

Ideally, this boy would not have gone to K this past year and then this would be a mute point.

[Cindyg]

We held our son back in K for similar reasons. At that time, he was in a Montessori multi-aged preschool class, so he didn't really know the difference. (They didn't really refer to "kindergarten" either year.)

 

In Sunday school, by good luck, the class changed from "Five Year Olds" to "Kindergarten," and they changed classrooms and teachers. So my son "promoted" down the hall and didn't really notice that he was being held back. At that time, he had little social awareness to notice which kids went on and which stayed back. BTW, quite a few of the boys in his "Five Year Old" Sunday school class stayed with him in the new "Kindergarten" class.

 

My son is almost 13 now, and he still struggles with handwriting. (An extra year was not enough to level this out.) Social issues have smoothed out significantly. (The extra year was necessary here.) He still has coordination issues regarding team sports. (The extra year helped, but has not been enough to catch him up with his peers.)

 

We've experienced no downsides to holding him back.

 

Because we're homeschooling (since first grade), we're able to go faster where we need to and go slower where we need to.

 

If he were in a typical public school classroom, I'm sure it would be very frustrating all the way around. He started that second kindergarten year easily reading multiple chapter books a week, independently. In a Montessori school and in homeschool, that's no problem. He thought it was great fun being the best reader in his preschool class. Over the years in various enrichment classes, he has always felt he was the smartest (and best educated) kid in the class, and he has always loved that status. Everyone thinks of him as "the smart kid."

Edited April 4, 2010 by Cindyg

[Laura Corin]

He sounds very like Calvin. His motor skills were dreadful at that age (dyspraxia/SID) and he was in OT for three years. The cutoff in Hong Kong made him the youngest in his class. Once we home educated I called him by the English cutoff, which made him one of the oldest in the year below. Meanwhile, I just taught him at whatever level he was ready for and used some techniques to compensate for his motor skills - mostly a slower introduction of writing across all subjects.

 

So, at 12/13 he believed himself to be in year 8 (7th grade). Then he realised that under the Scottish system there was flexibility as to which year he was in. He has largely overcome his coordination problems and is academically bright. He chose to 'skip' a year (to go back to the grade level he would have been in if we had stayed in Hong Kong) and will be starting bricks-and-mortar school in year 10 (9th grade) in the autumn. He will leave school at 17 3/4, but gap years are very common here, so I suspect he'll take that opportunity. He's tall, mature and well into puberty, so I think he'll fit in fine. He has no interest in competitive sports.

 

I don't regret letting him drift into a lower grade for those years. If his motor skills had not improved it would have been a good placement for him. He was not conscious of his grade level, however. If he had been, I suspect I would have kept him in the original placement and just continued teaching him whatever he needed.

 

Laura

Edited April 4, 2010 by Laura Corin

[ocelotmom]

I'm feeling like a horrible busybody in saying all of this, so, of course, take it all with a grain of salt if it doesn't apply.

 

Thank you so much for sharing your story, oceletmom. :grouphug: Seriously. What you described is exactly my worry for ds. I hope that by hsing, his experience will be different from what you faced in school. His academic work won't be stalled too much by retaining. I'll be able to do plenty of fun, challenging activities with him, but not face any pressure, yk? I'm hoping that will leave us free to focus a lot of energy on his therapy for SPD.

I understand where you're coming from, and do think it sounds better than the spinning-wheels form of retention in public school, and without the social pressure.

 

What I'm not understanding is where the pressure would be if your goal was to achieve (or come acceptably close to) state standards for 1st grade in all areas except those directly impacted by the SPD (eg. handwriting). From what you've described, he's close to this in many areas already, and you can take a light year without actually hindering his progress towards second grade.

 

If you're planning to work with the public school system anyways, can you get an IEP for him that would adjust his expectations for motor-related tasks and other problem areas accordingly?

 

I'm not at all sure that retaining him is the right thing to do, but dh is really adamant. He is dyslexic, and he faced a terrible time in school until he was in third grade.

Do you feel that your husband is being objective about his (childhood) needs vs. those of your DS? It sounds like they have different strengths and weaknesses, and therefore different needs.

 

If he goes back into a classroom (and that's a big if), maybe he can be re-assessed and placed appropriately then.

My concern with this is that grade retention seems like a situation that's hard to come back from. It's usually harder (possibly impossible, depending on the district's policies) to get children placed ahead than held back. Personally, I happen to think it's ideal to have kids who are held back catch up over the course of a few years, but many districts are fairly adamant about not jumping kids ahead, even if that's where they were supposed to be in the first place, without clear documentation of very advanced functioning.

[zaichiki]

It's usually harder (possibly impossible, depending on the district's policies) to get children placed ahead than held back. Personally, I happen to think it's ideal to have kids who are held back catch up over the course of a few years, but many districts are fairly adamant about not jumping kids ahead, even if that's where they were supposed to be in the first place, without clear documentation of very advanced functioning.

 

Another busybody here --

 

One of the reasons we chose a private school for ds when he transitioned to school this year is b/c none of the 8 public schools in the 2 towns in which we lived would consider a grade advancement no matter what "proof" we showed them. Just our experience...

 

ETA: We had proof of very advanced functioning in the form of standardized test scores and work samples (and IQ scores, but I never mentioned those -- maybe they would have entertained the idea of grade advancement if they had had them?).

Edited April 5, 2010 by zaichiki

[zaichiki]

I am not the original poster but I see several reasons for a boy being older in his grade:

 

maturity--girls tend to mature earlier than boys and then if the boy is young for his grade there might be a gap of 2-3 years of maturity in the kids

 

puberty--it is TOUGH for a boy to be the smallest/least physically mature one--esp. in jr. high

 

sports--if the boy is interested in sports, most school and many rec. leagues go off "grade" levels so you might have him competing in a 5/6th grade league and some of the boys would be way older/stronger/coordinated than the boy who is young for his class

 

at graduation---many jobs now require a person to be 18. You might have a child graduating at 17 and have 3-6 months before they could get a summer or full time job.

 

I think that esp. if this boy is going to be switching schools/peer groups in many situations, it would not be that bad to "hold him back". Most (if not all) of the kids in the new setting would not know that he was "held back" as many of them attended various years of preschool, etc.

 

I just look back to my school years and it was very obvious which boys were young for their grade. The suffered a lot with peer relationships, etc. and sometimes with academics, esp. as things became more abstract in higher grades.

 

Ideally, this boy would not have gone to K this past year and then this would be a mute point.

 

Otakee,

You're probably not replying to my post, but I thought I'd jump in on this one anyway.

1. Maturity -- I have been a classroom teacher and I've noticed a huge (sometimes 2-3 year) maturity gap among kids of the same age anyway. You're gonna run into that regardless of grade advancement or grade retention.

 

2. Puberty -- same thing as above. IME this also occurs at different ages for different kids (some girls hit puberty at 9 and some at 15), so I don't think a year older/younger makes much of a difference overall.

 

3. Sports -- You may have a good point there, though this may also depend on the sport. Youth soccer is age-based around here. I know it's very common for parents to redshirt kids to give them an advantage in the sports arena, though.

 

4. Jobs -- I know kids in high school (not yet 17 or 18) who have jobs. It's very common where I live. What sorts of jobs have age minimums?

[EthiopianFood]

I'm feeling like a horrible busybody in saying all of this, so, of course, take it all with a grain of salt if it doesn't apply.

 

 

I understand where you're coming from, and do think it sounds better than the spinning-wheels form of retention in public school, and without the social pressure.

 

What I'm not understanding is where the pressure would be if your goal was to achieve (or come acceptably close to) state standards for 1st grade in all areas except those directly impacted by the SPD (eg. handwriting). From what you've described, he's close to this in many areas already, and you can take a light year without actually hindering his progress towards second grade.

 

If you're planning to work with the public school system anyways, can you get an IEP for him that would adjust his expectations for motor-related tasks and other problem areas accordingly?

 

 

Do you feel that your husband is being objective about his (childhood) needs vs. those of your DS? It sounds like they have different strengths and weaknesses, and therefore different needs.

 

 

My concern with this is that grade retention seems like a situation that's hard to come back from. It's usually harder (possibly impossible, depending on the district's policies) to get children placed ahead than held back. Personally, I happen to think it's ideal to have kids who are held back catch up over the course of a few years, but many districts are fairly adamant about not jumping kids ahead, even if that's where they were supposed to be in the first place, without clear documentation of very advanced functioning.

 

:iagree::iagree:

 

I'm really trying to be open-minded here, but I'm just not getting why you would want to hold back a child who is average to ADVANCED in basically all subjects? :confused: I mean, there are older boys who STILL struggle with handwriting. Isn't this just an area where boys may have a tendancy to develop a little later than girls? I see that your husband feels strongly about this but, to be blunt, he struggled academically because of his disability. Your son doesn't. Of course your husband would have felt bad during that time. Your son isn't even behind. :confused: You're homeschooling. Who in the world would he compare himself to anyway? Even if you send him to ps in high school, or even junior high, is it very likely that six to nine years won't be enough time for him to improve his handwriting?

 

Just something to think about, but have you ever talked with people who were ahead of their peers academically, and were forced to sit through boring, easy work all through school? Talk about making a child hate school....

 

ETA: Also, working at grade level in math in no way implies that your child is "weak in math."

Edited April 5, 2010 by RaeAnne

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