If you're a confident atheist, what makes you so sure?

[msjones]

Lots of interesting reading over in the everlasting evolution thread... and it has me thinking....

 

If you are an atheist, what has made you certain that there is no god?

 

I've heard it said (and tend to agree) that atheism requires just as much faith as a belief in god. What do you think of that idea?

 

No antagonism here-- just interested to hear from some of the atheists on this board. It can be hard to have a civilized conversation about this sort of thing in real life, but there seem to be plenty of pleasant, articulate folks with divergent perspectives on this board...

[Georgiana Daniels]

:bigear:

 

That's one of the things I like most about this board: hearing other points of view on topics that usually don't come up in real life.

 

Very interested in people's thoughts.

[Tammy]

because I have found no proof of one.

[Audrey]

because I have found no proof of one.

 

:iagree: and would add that not only have I found no proof of one, I've also found no reason to worship any of the ones purported to "exist."

[Mommy22alyns]

:iagree: and would add that not only have I found no proof of one, I've also found no reason to worship any of the ones purported to "exist."

 

 

:iagree: This too.

[melissel]

I have to agree with the others. I'm a reasonably confident atheist, but I don't teach my kids that there is no divine being, because I have no proof there is none. I'm fully willing to admit that I could be wrong, because there's just no way to know. I teach my kids that, "I believe..." and "Daddy believes..." and our Jewish friends believe..., and that any of us could end up being right, but we don't know for sure.

 

Frankly though, other religions simply don't reach any meaningful part of my being. They do appeal to my desire for a sense of community and to my appreciation of the beauty of ceremony and history, but in the past, when I've tried to accept the Bible and other beliefs as true and divine, I just...can't. I never have, and I was raised Catholic.

 

I'll be very interested to see what others say.

[blessedmom3]

I used to be an atheist . In the country I was born (Romania) they indoctrinated us about atheism in school. I read Nietzsche and Voltaire and I thought I was so smart . But I was empty . I found no meaning in life. After the communism fell , some American missionaries came and gave us Bibles...I read it and realized there is a God. I have a purpose now and I am happy . I read in the Bible in Ps. 19 " The fool says in his heart --There is no God -- " .This was me.

[melissel]

I used to be an atheist . In the country I was born (Romania) they indoctrinated us about atheism in school. I read Nietzsche and Voltaire and I thought I was so smart . But I was empty . I found no meaning in life. After the communism fell , some American missionaries came and gave us Bibles...I read it and realized there is a God. I have a purpose now and I am happy . I read in the Bible in Ps. 19 " The fool says in his heart --There is no God -- " .This was me.

 

In a thread that was designed to ask a respectful question of atheists, who would like to respond respectfully, please be careful about citing things that, while you may believe them to be true, are kind of insulting to those of us who don't agree with your books. I believe you didn't mean any disrespect, but this being a rather sensitive subject and common bone of contention around here, your words may be taken the wrong way (as in, it feels a little like you just patted my hand and called me a fool).

 

Thank you.

[kalanamak]

because I have found no proof of one.

 

:iagree: although I've not spent any time looking, nor do I label myself an atheist. I learned the term "apatheist" on the internet, but I was one without having been schooled in, or "converting" to it after hearding the term.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apatheism

 

Some points I have pondered over my years here on earth: humans like answers. They are nervous without them. They like to name things and find causes. People can sweep a whole lot of worry and concern and uncertainly under a rug of religion. Hence, the popularity of religions.

 

Our religion is like our language: while we can "switch" and learn a new one, most people grow up and accept the religion of their parents. Most people raised in a Christian faith stick with it, and don't become Hindus. The same goes the other way. It seems to be a human invention to me.

 

In my experience, people who are dealt a bad hand in life *tend* to focus more on the rewards of the afterlife. Can't blame them. I suppose it is would a bit blasphemous here to say that, like Russell, I hope I would have the courage to shake my fist at a Christian god and call him mean were I to ever meet him, given the suffering in the world. No apologist can justify it in my mind.

 

Speaking of Russell, here is a quote about "Russell's Teapot":

 

"If I were to suggest that between the Earth and Mars there is a china teapot revolving about the sun in an elliptical orbit, nobody would be able to disprove my assertion provided I were careful to add that the teapot is too small to be revealed even by our most powerful telescopes. But if I were to go on to say that, since my assertion cannot be disproved, it is an intolerable presumption on the part of human reason to doubt it, I should rightly be thought to be talking nonsense. If, however, the existence of such a teapot were affirmed in ancient books, taught as the sacred truth every Sunday, and instilled into the minds of children at school, hesitation to believe in its existence would become a mark of eccentricity and entitle the doubter to the attentions of the psychiatrist in an enlightened age or of the Inquisitor in an earlier time."

[melissel]

Same here. One thing I wonder a lot about is if my existence has any sort of purpose. And why do people live as if they are going to live forever (is there something after "this"). It is a little hard to fathom that it all means nothing.

 

I don't feel as if I have chosen to be an atheist. I feel as if no religion has (yet) made sense to me. It isn't even entirely about proof. There are things I believe without having a ton of proof.

 

I hear you. I've wondered that a lot too. I've done a LOT of thinking about religion and belief since I came to this board. I don't have answers, either (just more assumptions :D). I just do the best I can for myself, my family, and others each day. You've gotten some things going around in my head though, and i have no time to post them now. Maybe I'll come back tonight after we get home!

 

ETA: This thread almost made me forget the reason I stopped back in here! And I have this overwhelming feeling that somewhere, a mod just saw this thread and put her head down exhaustion (apologies in advance!) :lol:

Edited September 26, 2009 by melissel

[secular_mom]

 

If you are an atheist, what has made you certain that there is no god?

 

I've heard it said (and tend to agree) that atheism requires just as much faith as a belief in god. What do you think of that idea?

 

No antagonism here-- just interested to hear from some of the atheists on this board. It can be hard to have a civilized conversation about this sort of thing in real life, but there seem to be plenty of pleasant, articulate folks with divergent perspectives on this board...

 

The whole "atheism requires faith" argument is a really old one, and is one that is thrown at atheists quite often. It does not take faith to believe what can actually be proven. It does not take faith to believe that we don't have all of the answers and we may never have them. It does not take faith to believe in evidence, though it does usually require a deeper understanding of any evidence in question.

 

I am certain that there is no god, because there is no evidence of a god. I could be wrong, so I suppose technically I could be classified as an agnostic atheist. If at some time in the future evidence that a god exists shows up I still would not worship such a being.

 

If you are very interested in the subject, there are lots of books and websites (and youtube videos) that explain things (some atheist POV's) in detail. I realize that some people may not like the idea of financially contributing to an atheist author, but you might like to check out some books from the library.

HTH

Edited September 26, 2009 by secular_mom

[Desert Rat]

I don't label myself an athiest either but I don't believe in a Creator/God. I usually label myself as a non-believer. The word athiest seems to antagonize people and I'm not interested in doing so. I admire some aspects of religion. Being a very organized person, I like the ritual and tradition. I love the music and art. I don't need to see God. I don't want proof. I'm not out to prove anything or disprove anything.

I feel cornered sometimes. This religious world is all about me and to speak against it is to be, I don't know, pegged a trouble maker or a lost soul or one in need of saving.

I think it is true that it takes a lot of faith to NOT believe. It's a big scary unknown out there. As much as I would love to have a heaven to go to or a nirvana awaiting, I just don't think it's out there. I prefer to be good for goodness sake. I live my life with what I hope is kindness and love. I often get what I give 10 fold. I am content not knowing.

[Ester Maria]

A. I don't believe there is God.

B. I believe there is no God.

 

Those are not two equal claims. Which type of atheism are we talking about?

 

A. does not actually state a belief. It's a statement of a person who rejects an idea and, perhaps, a specific worldview that such an idea would imply if taken seriously. It's a sentence analogous to "I don't believe there are green dragons", if somebody were to talk to me about the existence of green dragons. It's simply an idea I don't find logical, and will not associate myself with it, but I will NOT go openly against it, debate it assuming hardcore contra position... It's simply irrelevant for my life.

 

B. is actually more of a logical mistake. It's the kind of atheist which simply jumps to the conclusion there is no God out of inadequate premises (a premise of a lack of evidence for God does NOT imply there is no God), and it therefore becomes a kind of belief, and a reactionary ideology. It speaks in the language of the ideology it tries to negate ("I believe that..."), rather than simply distancing itself from it.

 

Basically, I'm A-type. Brought up in a secular Jewish Italian family, grown up and educated in a Catholic country, I value both cultural traditions I stem from and actively teach them to my children, as our heritage. If they choose to be religious, so be it, even though at home we barely practice anything, for traditional reasons.

I don't actively teach "atheism" to my children - I don't think you can teach a NEGATION of something, unless you have a problem with that thing in the first place. The belief itself is simply irrelevant to our lives, but we value the cultural context and wish to be somehow connected to it.

 

I have personally never came to a definite conclusion there is no God, because to reach such a conclusion, I would have firstly had to go through a "there is God" mindset, since only then I'd be able to negate. But I can't negate an idea I don't believe in, therefore, I can't be any kind of "militant atheist" or anything like that. I don't believe in God just like I don't believe in green dragons, but unlike green dragons, the idea of God does make a part of my cultural heritage and therefore I'm somehow in touch with it, even without belief. :)

 

Hope this explanation helps, sorry for the length.

[hornblower]

As has been explained by others, it's not that I'm certain that there's no god. It's that I think it's very, very highly unlikely.

 

Dawkins in his book The God Delusion lays out a spectrum of belief from 1-7 with

 

"1. Strong theist. 100% probability of God. In the words of C.G. Jung ' I do not believe, I know."

 

and

 

6. Very low probability, but short of zero. De facto atheist. "I cannot know for certain but I think God is very improbable, and I live my life on the assumption that he is not there."

 

7. Strong atheist. 'I know there is not God, with the same conviction as Jung "knows" there is one.'"

 

He goes on to say of himself: "I count myself in category 6, but leaning towards 7 - I am agnostic only to the extent that I am agnostic about fairies at the bottom of the garden."

 

That's pretty much where I stand.

 

Someone in the evolution thread responded to what they would need to be convinced: "I would have to see proof."

 

That's actually my view of theism.

[Audrey]

"I would have to see proof."

 

That's actually my view of theism.

 

Yes. However, even if someone could prove to me that their god(s) existed, I highly doubt I would worship it. I have studied a great number of religions over my lifetime, but none have deities that appeal to me enough to worship them even if I had proof of their existence.

[msjones]

because I have found no proof of one.

 

What would be an example of something you would consider "proof?"

[jujsky]

I wouldn't say I'm an atheist, but I'm definitely a firm agnostic. I believe there is some sort of higher power(s) but I don't know what it/they are. I definitely don't believe in the Christian God. I've experienced too many "coincidences" and such in life to chalk them up to mere coincidence. I think there is something behind the scenes that we're not seeing, but it's nothing I can put a name to. I've explored lots of religions and none of them really speak to me.

[Tangerine]

I suppose I'm not sure. I think it would be foolish (hot button thread word!) for me to tell myself I was. If incontrovertible evidence were available, I'd accept it. I will not, however, take it on faith as I was taught. I will question. I will always question. My questions, thus far, have led me to the belief that there is no God.

[KingM]

Yes. However, even if someone could prove to me that their god(s) existed, I highly doubt I would worship it. I have studied a great number of religions over my lifetime, but none have deities that appeal to me enough to worship them even if I had proof of their existence.

 

I am not an atheist, but I agree with you to the point that any sort of deity who would demand worship and obedience is a being to be feared, not honored.

[chiguirre]

:iagree: with Hornblower. I was just about to google Dawkins and look up that bit when I saw your post. I'm a number 6 too. I accept the evidence that supports the Big Bang, so I know that we will not ever know what came before it or what exists outside of our universe. We just have to accept that limit to our inquiry.

 

I do call myself an atheist instead of an agnostic, because I feel that agnosticism implies a higher probability of the existence of a creator than I personally accept. I'm not adamant that there is no god, but I'm 99.9% sure that there's no anthropomorphic deity guiding the universe and every little detail of our lives. If I'm wrong, I'll be in the fist-waving section in good company.

 

OTOH, I do think that it's an important element of growing up to develop your own personal view of religion. There are valuable elements in religion and I'd like my kids to absorb those while they're young enough to accept them at face value. I'm sure they'll go through their own metaphysical journey when they're adolescents and I'll be interested in seeing the conclusion they reach. It may not be the same as mine and that's okay.

 

Finally, I would accept evidence of a deity that was as incontrovertible as the evidence for the sun. It would have to be visible (or sensorially manifest) to everyone, believer and unbeliever. I don't think that's too tall an order for a being that created the universe, if it really cares about our opinion. Of course, given how big the universe is, I doubt a creator cares what sentient beings on a middling planet orbitting a middling star in a middling galaxy believe. Even if a creator exists, I don't think we merit even a passing thought, let alone his constant attention to every detail of our lives.

 

As to my reason for aspiring to being a good person and raising my children to respect and care for those around them, I stand with Adam Smith's Theory of Moral Sentiments. In an overly short and sweet summary, I want to behave well because I want to be able to see myself as good.

[cmarango]

I was raised Lutheran and ever since I can remember religion just didn't make sense to me. When I was told that anyone that did not believe in Jesus would go to hell during my confirmation class I decided that religion was definitely not for me.

 

My reasons for being a "non-believer"/atheist:

 

1. I don't like the idea of an afterlife.

2. I don't feel the need to use God as an explanation for my existence.

3. The amount of conflict that has arisen from religion is a turn off for me.

 

However, I do plan on raising my children with basic religious knowledge so that they can make their own choice. I do respect the fact that many people find their religion to be a huge comfort and receive guidance from it. If there does turn out to be a God, then I hope I can get a visitor's pass for heaven every now and then. :001_smile:

 

Christina

[Phred]

Thank you for asking.

 

Originally I simply didn't care. I was raised to be open to religion. My family believed in God but didn't go to church. My father was Missouri Synod Lutheran and my mother hated the Catholic church. It was always put to me that someday I might marry a girl that was religious and I might choose to join her faith. I never questioned this. God was always there, I always assumed that, even though I wasn't religious that God was there for me. When asked what religion I was I answered, "Lutheran." I went to many weddings and funerals with my Catholic relatives and could kneel and genuflect with the best of them. But as I got older I began to question why I felt the need to answer, "Lutheran" when I wasn't religious. Why was I ashamed to be what I was?

 

This was the beginning of my questioning.

 

I read the Bible from cover to cover. I still keep one on the bookshelf here and read it from time to time. At one point I was able to quote chapter and verse from it. I went to Lutheran services for a time, even bringing my family as we thought the children could do with religious teaching. But the more I was exposed to it the more I questioned it. And then the religious right started to take over the Republican party. James Dobson and Focus on the Family started to become loud and angry. I realized that what they stood for, I was against. If there was a god out there he wouldn't have anything to do with harming homosexuals or watching what I did in my bedroom. He wouldn't condone taking a busload of children on a picnic and baptizing them without their parents consent. Fred Phelps does not speak for God. Slowly I came to realize that while I might consider believing in a god it was not the same god these people believed in.

 

So I became an atheist in a sense. I knew what gods I didn't believe in. I didn't believe in Thor or Zeus or Ra or the god of Pat Robertson or Jerry Falwell or Ted Haggard.

 

But I still wouldn't have classified myself as an atheist. I still would have said that yes, there was a Big Bang but surely a deity could have started it all. Evolution was true but it could have been directed. There were all these little copouts that let a god of the gaps creep in. But, as time went by I found that, more and more, I just didn't believe. Not just in specific gods but in any god. It's not like I ever needed a deity to give me purpose and I certainly didn't need a god to calm my nerves about dying. When the curtain goes down and the lights go out it's rather comforting to know that's it. There is nothing else, no grand inquisition awaiting me after death, just blackness.

 

With that in mind I found that there just wasn't any evidence of a god, no need for a creator and no reason to cling to the notion that I needed a god. So all that was left was the pressure of others who insisted that I couldn't be a good person without God in my life.

 

Ya know what? I'm a good person because it's the right thing to do, not out of fear of consequences from some unseen deity. Strike three.

 

I simply don't believe. But how do I know? What's more likely? A magic being who can do anything and interferes in our lives daily but leaves no trace or no being? The God most people imagine can't exist because the traces it would leave would be all over the place and they just aren't there. Matter doesn't move by itself. Matter, energy... they don't appear and disappear. God isn't Harry Potter. Harry Potter isn't Harry Potter. Magic is an illusion. So, I believe, is god.

 

I'd like to say I absolutely KNOW that there is no god. I can only say I absolutely know there aren't SOME gods. I believe there aren't any. I'm an atheist.

[Tree House Academy]

My ex husband is a very firm atheist. He believes that religion, God, makes no sense and that people buy into it to gain some type of comfort from the turmoils in life.

 

Faith is a tough thing - no matter which side of the fence you are on.

[Georgiana Daniels]

Thanks for openly sharing, everyone! I'm gleaning a lot from this conversation.:)

[astrid]

Thank you for asking.

 

Originally I simply didn't care. I was raised to be open to religion. My family believed in God but didn't go to church. My father was Missouri Synod Lutheran and my mother hated the Catholic church. It was always put to me that someday I might marry a girl that was religious and I might choose to join her faith. I never questioned this. God was always there, I always assumed that, even though I wasn't religious that God was there for me. When asked what religion I was I answered, "Lutheran." I went to many weddings and funerals with my Catholic relatives and could kneel and genuflect with the best of them. But as I got older I began to question why I felt the need to answer, "Lutheran" when I wasn't religious. Why was I ashamed to be what I was?

 

This was the beginning of my questioning.

But the more I was exposed to it the more I questioned it. And then the religious right started to take over the Republican party. James Dobson and Focus on the Family started to become loud and angry. I realized that what they stood for, I was against. If there was a god out there he wouldn't have anything to do with harming homosexuals or watching what I did in my bedroom. He wouldn't condone taking a busload of children on a picnic and baptizing them without their parents consent. Fred Phelps does not speak for God. Slowly I came to realize that while I might consider believing in a god it was not the same god these people believed in.

 

 

I agree, Phred. It's why I struggle with it. Raised CAtholic, but the more I saw, the less I believed.

 

astrid

[Tangerine]

The first real questioning moment I had was this:

 

I remembered watching a TV show that documented religious ceremonies. Voodoo, Hindu Thaipusam where they pierce themselves with hooks, and another (that slips my mind) where they self-flagellate. In my upbringing, such things were attributed to demonic activity. In a moment of clarity, I compared those to my more familiar western religious activities like being slain in the spirit, speaking in tongues, the "Toronto Blessing". I was sort of seized by an understanding that even things I had experienced myself, I now attributed to the ability of the mind to be so swept up in emotion and zeal. Things I would have previously attributed to God.

[LibraryLover]

I believe humans want to believe that we are special and that someone cared enough to create us. We are truly amazing...how could we have 'just happened' ? We want our mothers and fathers to love us and we want to be cared for. This is god.

 

We want god to exist, and at some point, to make every bad thing right. What is the point of suffering, without righteous in the end? We are not just worms coming to the surface only to be plucked by a mother bird looking to feed her babies. Are we?

 

I do believe in prayer/meditation because it's comforting, but in the same way music can be, or a warm fire on a chilly evening. Or a baby gently rolling inside of us. (Sorry guys).

 

Life is amazing...that we are here is amazing...it's miraculous, but not without some sense of order. I think the Here is enough. I've had this conversation with religious friends, and they all say "Here is not enough. There has to be more". I think the Here is amazing enough to stand on it's own.

 

I think 'god'/goodness exists, but god/goodness exists in our capacity to love each other and care for each other. Living forever would be nice, especially if we are really good and follow all the rules. It's not fair that bad people get good stuff too...it's not fair!

 

I get all that.

Edited September 27, 2009 by LibraryLover

[Greta]

I believe it was intended to insult

 

I disagree that that was her intention. I think she was just relating her story.

Edited September 27, 2009 by GretaLynne

[Rosie_0801]

I don't identify as an atheist, but am one for the purposes of this particular exercise.

 

There is no proof that there is a God and I don't care if there is or isn't one. I don't like the idea of their being one, so I don't believe. Dwelling on the truth of something you can't prove one way or the other seems pretty pointless to me, so I say if people like the idea of having a God and find that concept useful, good for them. If, like me, they don't find it useful, then don't have one. In my opinion, no God worthy of the title is going to care whether I believe or not. That would be immature and I don't think an immature God is worth my time.

 

For the record, I do have a deity equivelent, but it doesn't fit into any of the deity categories I've read about. Oh well. *shrug*

 

Rosie

[LibraryLover]

I don't identify as an atheist, but am one for the purposes of this particular exercise.

 

There is no proof that there is a God and I don't care if there is or isn't one. I don't like the idea of their being one, so I don't believe. Dwelling on the truth of something you can't prove one way or the other seems pretty pointless to me, so I say if people like the idea of having a God and find that concept useful, good for them. If, like me, they don't find it useful, then don't have one. In my opinion, no God worthy of the title is going to care whether I believe or not. That would be immature and I don't think an immature God is worth my time.

 

For the record, I do have a deity equivelent, but it doesn't fit into any of the deity categories I've read about. Oh well. *shrug*

 

Rosie

 

Coolness.

[smrtmama]

While I'm not an atheist, I disagree that it takes as much faith to be one as it does to be religious. Most atheists I know base beliefs on that which can be quantified. It doesn't take a leap of faith to believe in something that is evidence-based.

[nmoira]

If you are an atheist, what has made you certain that there is no god?

I never believed, even as a child going to church with my parents. I distinctly remember at age 8 or 9 telling my parents I could no longer attend church because it would be hypocritical of me due to utter lack of faith. I guess just don't have the gene. It never seemed more than stories to me, no different than other mythologies I'd read. However, I'm fascinated by systems, including religious systems and their influence on and interaction with social systems and culture... by how humans (individually and as groups) have sought to understand the world and have struggled philosophically to see our place in it. It's all part of the same thing to me.

 

 

I've heard it said (and tend to agree) that atheism requires just as much faith as a belief in god. What do you think of that idea?

This doesn't apply to any atheists I know, but I guess there could be a few out there who actively disbelieve in the sense that they need to convince themselves that it is the case.

[Tangerine]

 

For the record, I do have a deity equivelent, but it doesn't fit into any of the deity categories I've read about. Oh well. *shrug*

 

Rosie

 

Well now my interest is piqued!

[Joker]

Do any atheists here wish they could believe in God? I am a Christian and my dh is an atheist. I knew that when I married him 11 yrs ago - but I love him. :) He says he wishes he could believe but he just doesn't. He goes to church with us on Sundays and he is the one to pray with dds every night. He doesn't want them to know that he's an atheist because he says he wants them to have hope. He knows more about religion than I do (his dad is a minister) and he often helps me when I struggle with things relating to faith. I hope there is no offense taken to my post - I am just curious if there are others who don't believe and wish they did.

[nmoira]

Do any atheists here wish they could believe in God?

I'm not hostile to the idea, but it's something that's never occurred to me... so, no.

[Mad Jenny Flint]

I am happy where I am with my beliefs. I don't know about the statement regarding the amount of faith it takes. I just know that I rely on what I see, and that I take a lot of time in my life to look. I look at the things that are important, I discern the things that really matter, I find the things to be grateful for. I look for the lesson in my experiences and the experiences of others. I do what I believe is correct according to my values because I do want to be a good person and I want to have a positive influence on those around me. I believe that now is all we have, and I want to make it the best now I can, within the limitations of my own tiny brain and tiny body (with respect to the world, the universe) and my own fallibility. I try very hard to find joy and create joy. Not pleasure, joy.

 

And, I really hate when people judge me only by the fact that I don't attend church or that I don't share their religious faith/belief in a god. Or think that my kids must be a bad influence on their kids. I think it must be something like what racism feels like.

[Tangerine]

Do any atheists here wish they could believe in God? I am a Christian and my dh is an atheist. I knew that when I married him 11 yrs ago - but I love him. :) He says he wishes he could believe but he just doesn't. He goes to church with us on Sundays and he is the one to pray with dds every night. He doesn't want them to know that he's an atheist because he says he wants them to have hope. He knows more about religion than I do (his dad is a minister) and he often helps me when I struggle with things relating to faith. I hope there is no offense taken to my post - I am just curious if there are others who don't believe and wish they did.

 

I admire the traditions, the ready-made community, the ritual. I don't really wish I believed (though I feel it would make my life easier sometimes), but I do wish there was more in the way of the community for my family.

[Tangerine]

And, I really hate when people judge me only by the fact that I don't attend church or that I don't share their religious faith/belief in a god. Or think that my kids must be a bad influence on their kids. I think it must be something like what racism feels like.

 

I had one atheist friend when we were in the military. When she moved on base, there was one family who would wave at her when she drove by, and she would wave back. When she eventually walked down to introduce herself, the woman asked where she would be attending church. When she told the new neighbor that they didn't go to church, she replied "Oh. You seemed like such a nice person." :001_huh:

[LibraryLover]

I'm not hostile to the idea, but it's something that's never occurred to me... so, no.

 

 

I've never believed. Not even as a tiny child did I wish I believed. I do like community, and I do love religious stories. My non-belief in the divine has never kept me from enjoying the peaceful parts of religion, or religious celebrations. I am fascinated and get invited to all manner of things. I think my favorite holiday of all time is Sukkot. Day of the Dead is a close second.

[Joker]

I had one atheist friend when we were in the military. When she moved on base, there was one family who would wave at her when she drove by, and she would wave back. When she eventually walked down to introduce herself, the woman asked where she would be attending church. When she told the new neighbor that they didn't go to church, she replied "Oh. You seemed like such a nice person." :001_huh:

 

My dh was in the Marines and his first set of dog tags said "Atheist" - his CO saw them and told him to take a few hours to fix the "mistake". :001_huh:

[Night Elf]

I believe it was intended to insult, but on the other hand I think it further illustrates why "I" do not believe in religion.

 

:iagree: I view it as a found moment to proselytize.

[Night Elf]

Do any atheists here wish they could believe in God?

 

I am an agnostic, not an atheist. Yes. I've tried and tried. I want to believe so much, to find meaning in my life, to feel there is something more after this life that doesn't seem too great in my opinion. Even recently, I posted on this board asking for help. I got some lovely responses and I truly appreciated every one of them. I really love to see someone immersed in their faith. It looks so comforting. I'm jealous that I can't feel the same way. I didn't get a good sense from the couple of people I talked to at churches near my home. I didn't get a sense of 'God loves you and wants you to be part of his family.' I got business stuff about taking classes and joining the church.

 

I do not know whether or not God exists. I can't get into the idea of multiple Gods and Goddesses, though it too is a lovely thought. I do not feel the Bible is the infallible word of God.

[KidsHappen]

And I have this overwhelming feeling that somewhere, a mod just saw this thread and put her head down exhaustion (apologies in advance!) :lol:

 

That exactly what I did. I was just getting ready to go to bed (early for once) and then I saw this thread and thought to myself, "Oh! This has got to be good!" :sneaky2:

[Greta]

I've heard it said (and tend to agree) that atheism requires just as much faith as a belief in god. What do you think of that idea?

 

I'm not an atheist any more, but I can't agree with that assessment. When I was an atheist I lacked faith. Now I have faith. It's just that simple.

Edited September 27, 2009 by GretaLynne
trying to find the right words

[Shawna in Texas]

I remember being a child and realizing the truth about Santa Claus and keeping up with the charade of it. It was fun. It was something that everyone I knew did. It took me a couple more years to realize that even the grown-ups believed in Jesus. I remember being 11 or 12 and telling my grandma that it was okay. I didn't need to memorize any more verses because I knew it was pretend. She was horrified. I'll never forget it.

 

The prospect of something like God was intriguing to me, but throughout all my teens years, I tried and tried to feel the joy and elation of the holy spirit. I read and sang with my grandma, was prayed over; witnessed many 'speaking in tongues' sessions. Soon, my grandma decided to work on all the younger grandkids.

 

I finally had my 'religious' experience when I gave birth to my first daughter. I spent my 20's learning about spirituality. Paganism, Buddhism, etc. I didn't know you could separate a deity from a spirituality. I didn't understand the difference between religion and spirituality. I didn't know that atheists could also be spiritual.

 

So, I don't believe in a deity. But, I have an interest in spiritual things. On some days I'm an atheist with pantheistic tendencies. On some days I'm an apathetic agnostic of the don't know, don't care variety.

[kalanamak]

My dh was in the Marines and his first set of dog tags said "Atheist" - his CO saw them and told him to take a few hours to fix the "mistake". :001_huh:

 

I know someone who had this happen to him. Did you know "zoroastrianism"

 

*just* fits on a dog tag? :D

[kiana]

I know someone who had this happen to him. Did you know "zoroastrianism"

 

*just* fits on a dog tag? :D

 

Wonder if anyone's put Pastafarian. Or Jedi.

[Kristin in Hawaii]

Quoting Melissel: "I have to agree with the others. I'm a reasonably confident atheist, but I don't teach my kids that there is no divine being, because I have no proof there is none. I'm fully willing to admit that I could be wrong, because there's just no way to know. I teach my kids that, "I believe..." and "Daddy believes..." and our Jewish friends believe..., and that any of us could end up being right, but we don't know for sure.

 

Frankly though, other religions simply don't reach any meaningful part of my being. They do appeal to my desire for a sense of community and to my appreciation of the beauty of ceremony and history, but in the past, when I've tried to accept the Bible and other beliefs as true and divine, I just...can't."

 

I just wanted to skip in and thank you for stating my feelings, almost precisely. I remember praying to God to help me believe -- because I wanted to fit in and share in the community. Won't be a hypocrite. Life is good -- beautiful -- fascinating... thanks.

Edited September 27, 2009 by beautifulbooks

[meet me in paris]

Do any atheists here wish they could believe in God? I am a Christian and my dh is an atheist. I knew that when I married him 11 yrs ago - but I love him. :) He says he wishes he could believe but he just doesn't. He goes to church with us on Sundays and he is the one to pray with dds every night. He doesn't want them to know that he's an atheist because he says he wants them to have hope. He knows more about religion than I do (his dad is a minister) and he often helps me when I struggle with things relating to faith. I hope there is no offense taken to my post - I am just curious if there are others who don't believe and wish they did.

<raising hand>

I have tried, tried, tried my whole life. Being a-religious is hard for me because it's hard on my family (not my husband and kids, but my family of birth). My family is very religious, brothers are pastors, etc. so they not only do not understand my positions, but WORRY about me. Oh well.

[msjones]

I'm not an atheist any more, but I can't agree with that assessment. When I was an atheist I lacked faith. Now I have faith. It's just that simple.

 

I think the idea (as I understand it) is that just as one can't prove that God exists, one can't prove that God doesn't exist -- so that's the leap of 'faith.'

 

And it seems, if I'm not misunderstanding, that many folks who have responded agree that they aren't certain -- they're choosing to believe what makes the most sense to them given what they do know to be true, or what seems to be false.

 

I think I'd call that faith. But, I certainly don't have some well-developed definition of "faith." I'm just thinking 'out loud.'

 

I have no axe to grind here. I just find it a fascinating topic -- and that evolution thread really got me thinking.