Informal poll

[Scarlett]

If you believe in the sanctity of marriage how do you handle this situation….

Your baby brother…who is in his 50s with  3 young adult children. …has left his wife of 30 years for a 26 year old.  There is a big family party in honor of your father……and she won’t be there because his young adults have made it clear they won’t attend if she is there.  But baby brother orchestrated a meeting afterwards with you and your wife to meet this…..girlfriend. 

 

How do you handle this.?

[Scarlett]

1 minute ago, Scarlett said:

If you believe in the sanctity of marriage how do you handle this situation….

Your baby brother…who is in his 50s with  3 young adult children. …has left his wife of 30 years for a 26 year old.  There is a big family party in honor of your father……and she won’t be there because his young adults have made it clear they won’t attend if she is there.  But baby brother orchestrated a meeting afterwards with you and your wife to meet this…..girlfriend. 

 

How do you handle this.?

Oh and divorce is not final.

[Rosie_0801]

I would say I wasn't in the right frame of mind to be as polite as he'd like.

[Tap]

How do I handle this.....I stay out of it. It is between him and his kids.

Attend if you want. Be friends with the girlfriend if you want since we have no clue what the story is there.

But for this party, stay out of it and do not engage if the conversation starts to twist towards discussions on the divorce or relationship. "We are here to celebrate father, lets focus on that and save discussions for another time".

[Scarlett]

3 minutes ago, Tap said:

How do I handle this.....I stay out of it. It is between him and his kids.

Attend if you want. Be friends with the girlfriend if you want since we have no clue what the story is there.

But for this party, stay out of it and do not engage if the conversation starts to twist towards discussions on the divorce or relationship. "We are here to celebrate father, lets focus on that and save discussions for another time".

But…….we do know what the story is……

[Scarlett]

     D

Edited August 1, 2023 by Scarlett

[Tap]

8 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

But…….we do know what the story is……

Then decline the offer for a future date. He can't command you to meet her or spend time with her. You are attending an event, focus on that. If he wants to pressure you into an after event get together, just say you aren't ready to meet her yet. Let him know that while you realize you don't know the full story, meeting her too soon isn't healthy for your relationship with him or her.  He is old enough to know that transitions can be tough, and that people don't want to get caught up in the wake. Let him know that you will be willing to meet her in the future but it is too soon for you to feel comfortable.

 

Or...if you are comfortable. Just go. Meet her.

Is this the newly found family member? If it is, it would be easier because you don't have a lot of history with the wife.  Then you can play it off as "I am here to spend time with my brother. Who he brings along is up to him. "

If this is a family you are close to....I would hold off for a bit. If for no other reason, out of solidarity with the kids. 

Edited August 1, 2023 by Tap

[Scarlett]

1 minute ago, Tap said:

Then decline the offer for a future date. He can't command you to meet her or spend time with her. You are attending an event, focus on that. If he wants to pressure you into an after event get together, just say you aren't ready to meet her yet. Let him know that while you realize you don't know the full story, meeting her too soon isn't healthy for your relationship with him or her.  He is old enough to know that transitions can be tough, and that people don't want to get caught up in the wake. Let him know that you will be willing to meet her in the future but it is too soon for you to feel comfortable.

 

Or...if you are comfortable. Just go. Meet her.

Is this the newly found family member? If it is, it would be easier because you don't have a lot of history with the wife.  Then you can play it off as "I am here to spend time with my brother. Who he brings along is up to him. 

If this is a family you are close to....I would hold off for a bit. If for no other reason, out of solidarity with the kids. 

Oh no this is not my family. It is my best friends in laws…..she is struggling mightily. 

[Scarlett]

I am gobsmacked that people just dump a spouse . I am super proud of these young adults…..standing up for the sanctity of the marriage of their parents. 

[Tap]

It really, really depends on the story.  And, both sides of the story!!! 

I tried for many, many years to work on my relationship with my xh before asking for a divorce. People on the outside thought we had a great relationship, but behind doors, it was a very, very different scenario.  My husband will say he was blindsided and had no idea there were problems. I know how many times I talked to him, wrote him letters, and even took the kids to a hotel one night. I didn't see him for weeks on end. I slept on the couch for years, but he still things it was a great relationship. 

 

My middle daughter and her husband wanted me to divorce him years before I did. She was elated when I did! She saw how miserable I was, and how I was dying inside. 

My oldest son, is deeply religious and didn't support the divorce. But he also had almost zero relationship with his father, so he understood his shortcomings and why I needed out.  It was hard on him. He understood, but didn't ethically agree.

My friends, coworkers and daughter's therapist wanted me to divorce him years ago.

His friends had no idea and probably think I was insane to split with him. 

 

We have very, very different versions of our marriage!!

 

[Scarlett]

10 minutes ago, Tap said:

It really, really depends on the story.  And, both sides of the story!!! 

I tried for many, many years to work on my relationship with my xh before asking for a divorce. People on the outside thought we had a great relationship, but behind doors, it was a very, very different scenario.  My husband will say he was blindsided and had no idea there were problems. I know how many times I talked to him, wrote him letters, and even took the kids to a hotel one night. I didn't see him for weeks on end. I slept on the couch for years, but he still things it was a great relationship. 

 

My middle daughter and her husband wanted me to divorce him years before I did. She was elated when I did! She saw how miserable I was, and how I was dying inside. 

My oldest son, is deeply religious and didn't support the divorce. But he also had almost zero relationship with his father, so he understood his shortcomings and why I needed out.  It was hard on him. He understood, but didn't ethically agree.

My friends, coworkers and daughter's therapist wanted me to divorce him years ago.

His friends had no idea and probably think I was insane to split with him. 

 

We have very, very different versions of our marriage!!

 

Did you brig a boyfriend to family gather before your divorce was over?

[Scarlett]

I think there is empathy for a bad marriage ending vs bringing a third party in.

[Rosie_0801]

Here, dating when separated but not divorced is not considered cheating. 

[KungFuPanda]

26 and 50? I think I’d wave baby brother off and delay meeting this girl for about a year after the divorce if they make it that long.

[Bootsie]

I think there are really two separate issues.  (1)  How do you react to your brother wanting to introduce you to a girlfriend before his divorce is final and (2) How would you react to your 50-year old brother wanting you to meet his 26-year old girlfriend.  

For the first issue, my personal, religious views of marriage do not line up with a specific legal authority's definition of who is married.  So, I do not place great significance on when a state says two people are married or not.  So, I would need to know a lot more about the situation before I could form an opinion.  

[DawnM]

5 hours ago, Scarlett said:

If you believe in the sanctity of marriage how do you handle this situation….

Your baby brother…who is in his 50s with  3 young adult children. …has left his wife of 30 years for a 26 year old.  There is a big family party in honor of your father……and she won’t be there because his young adults have made it clear they won’t attend if she is there.  But baby brother orchestrated a meeting afterwards with you and your wife to meet this…..girlfriend. 

 

How do you handle this.?

Ok, so girlfriend will NOT be at the party, correct?

Baby brother wants a different meeting for you and your wife to meet his new girlfriend.   

Go to the party with out the girlfriend and tell him you aren't interested in meeting his new girlfriend.   

[Laura Corin]

6 hours ago, Scarlett said:

If you believe in the sanctity of marriage how do you handle this situation….

Your baby brother…who is in his 50s with  3 young adult children. …has left his wife of 30 years for a 26 year old.  There is a big family party in honor of your father……and she won’t be there because his young adults have made it clear they won’t attend if she is there.  But baby brother orchestrated a meeting afterwards with you and your wife to meet this…..girlfriend. 

 

How do you handle this.?

I think I'd decline to meet the new girlfriend but in terms that didn't burn bridges with the brother, so that if the relationship ended up being short-lived, I could perhaps help to rebuild the relationship with the children.

'I'm sorry, I'm not comfortable meeting her yet.'

[Katy]

I think Rosie was more polite than I would be, but I would also refuse. In colorful language. And with a reference to his mental health. 

[Scarlett]

Thanks all.  My friend was tricked into going.  New girlfriend was VERY nice to my friend and friend was polite and kind.  Ii know she would not make a scene,  but she did not want to meet her.  
 

 

[OH_Homeschooler]

8 hours ago, Tap said:

It really, really depends on the story.  And, both sides of the story!!! 

I tried for many, many years to work on my relationship with my xh before asking for a divorce. People on the outside thought we had a great relationship, but behind doors, it was a very, very different scenario.  My husband will say he was blindsided and had no idea there were problems. I know how many times I talked to him, wrote him letters, and even took the kids to a hotel one night. I didn't see him for weeks on end. I slept on the couch for years, but he still things it was a great relationship. 

 

My middle daughter and her husband wanted me to divorce him years before I did. She was elated when I did! She saw how miserable I was, and how I was dying inside. 

My oldest son, is deeply religious and didn't support the divorce. But he also had almost zero relationship with his father, so he understood his shortcomings and why I needed out.  It was hard on him. He understood, but didn't ethically agree.

My friends, coworkers and daughter's therapist wanted me to divorce him years ago.

His friends had no idea and probably think I was insane to split with him. 

 

We have very, very different versions of our marriage!!

 

Well, I believe you.

Someone close to me divorced someone I learned was probably a narcissist. Honestly I always thought she could do better, but whatever, she seemed happy enough. Turns out she'd been struggling for years. I remember him going MIA when their baby was born, so she was basically a single mom the first month of the baby's life. He acted like such a child, but eventually came around and decided to be a dad. Then, years later, she found out he bought a car behind her back and that was the final straw. I'm sure there were tons of other things between those events that I never heard about.

But after 10+ years of him pulling stuff like this, he was completely blindsided by the divorce papers. She had to get a restraining order because of how he reacted. He went on FB and complained about how his wife wasn't willing to work on repairing the marriage. That's when I blocked him. I am sure there are people who think he was the victim, and it makes me so mad. All she ever did was work on the marriage, for over a decade. He just wasn't willing to participate until he realized his easy life was coming to an end. 

[Bootsie]

1 hour ago, Scarlett said:

Thanks all.  My friend was tricked into going.  New girlfriend was VERY nice to my friend and friend was polite and kind.  Ii know she would not make a scene,  but she did not want to meet her.  
 

 

The bolded would bother me more than the brother's decisions about his own life.  If I have chosen not to do something, someone knows that, and then they intentionally set up a situation in which I am doing it without my consent, I would be furious.  

[BusyMom5]

Our family was actually in a somewhat similar situation.  Uncle was divorcing wife #3 (a widow with 3 kids who fell for his false charm- we all loved her).  He cheated on her with N, years younger and also married.  Then N got PG accidentally (uncle was 50).  No one wanted to meet her, and while we didn't hold it against the baby, it was very hard to just ignore the 3 kids he had raised with his previous wife- they were traumatized by his selfish behavior!  They had been married 10 years, so they lost their Dad to cancer, then were raised by my uncle all through childhood, until he cheated on their mom and got a girl 20 years younger PG.  They have nothing to do with him.... but they were our main cousins on that side.  It's been 15 years and we just never forgave him for what he did to those kids.  We also do not like N- she's just awful!  They come maybe once a year and we usually avoid them.  There are other issues as well, it's not just N and the divorce,  it's an attire adulthood filled with selfish behavior and toxicity.  I'm sure N thinks we are horrible people,  but it's hard to pivot from " Married with 3 step-kids for 10 years."   To "Hey, meet my new PG girlfriend,  we are getting married as soon as the divorce is final- hers and mine."  

[Tap]

9 hours ago, Scarlett said:

Did you brig a boyfriend to family gather before your divorce was over?

No, but it isn’t uncommon for someone to do so. Especially after the legal separation. Divorces can take years and many people start dating after the separation. I waited for a year after the divorce but that was for me, not because I thought it was wrong. 
 

Im not sure if your story is that the person was cheating during marriage or split snd immediately started dating. Xh and I lived together for several months after legal separation. 

Edited August 1, 2023 by Tap

[Janeway]

I would tell him that I am not interested in meeting the hussy and then I would get on with my life.

[marbel]

11 hours ago, Scarlett said:

If you believe in the sanctity of marriage how do you handle this situation….

Your baby brother…who is in his 50s with  3 young adult children. …has left his wife of 30 years for a 26 year old.  There is a big family party in honor of your father……and she won’t be there because his young adults have made it clear they won’t attend if she is there.  But baby brother orchestrated a meeting afterwards with you and your wife to meet this…..girlfriend. 

 

How do you handle this.?

I'd probably handle it the way I'd handle meeting any stranger who was connected somehow to a family member. I mean, I'd be inclined not to like the person and would be disgusted with my brother, but my meeting the person would not establish a relationship with them.  I mean, what are the options here? I'd say hello and then leave as soon as possible. Afterward I might have a private talk with my brother, depending on our relationship. 

[Indigo Blue]

I’ve witnessed a similar situation in my toxic family. My heart hurts for the 3 almost grown children affected. It’s despicable. That’s all I can say. It’s sad, complex, and deep. I would not want to meet that person. I just have too many deep feelings. 

[Drama Llama]

I believe on the sanctity of my own marriage, but as someone who has gotten a lot of judgment for things in my marriage that outsiders didn’t understand, it’s not my place to make judgments about someone else’s marriage.  

If I was in the know about someone’s marriage enough to be confident my anger was warranted then I would be angry at my brother in this situation, not someone who didn’t make the vows.  If I was willing to see him, I’d be willing to meet her.

Edited August 1, 2023 by BandH

[Grace Hopper]

3 hours ago, Scarlett said:

Thanks all.  My friend was tricked into going.  New girlfriend was VERY nice to my friend and friend was polite and kind.  Ii know she would not make a scene,  but she did not want to meet her.  
 

 

I’m so curious to know how she was “tricked.”

1 hour ago, Bootsie said:

The bolded would bother me more than the brother's decisions about his own life.  If I have chosen not to do something, someone knows that, and then they intentionally set up a situation in which I am doing it without my consent, I would be furious.  

I’d be mad, too!

 

I would have probably gone to the event, but declined the later meeting, being upfront in telling my brother I wasn’t ready to meet her yet.

[SKL]

Personally I would discover another commitment I had to attend to.

To be fair, unless you are in their bedroom, you don't know what caused the divorce for sure.  Nor do you need to know.

[Indigo Blue]

I just want to clarify…I think basically abandoning your children while you cheat on your spouse is despicable. IMO. I can understand not judging the marriage, but not basically….. suddenly neglecting your children. 

[Catwoman]

I don't see anything wrong with a legally separated person bringing a date to a family function. I also don't see any reason not to meet and be polite to the new girlfriend, because your friend may not know the whole story here, and her brother may have told the girlfriend he was already separated when he started dating her. I guess basically I'm saying that I would not blame the girlfriend for "luring" the guy away from his wife and family, because as the married person, he was the one who was responsible for saying no to a relationship with her, and I have no idea who pursued whom in that relationship so I'm inclined to give the girlfriend the benefit of the doubt until I hear otherwise.

I think your friend did the right thing by being courteous to the girlfriend, and I'm not sure how your friend was "tricked" into going, so I can't really give you an opinion about that.

But if you're mainly asking if a legally separated person should bring a date to a family function before the divorce is final... sure, why not? 

[Catwoman]

1 hour ago, BandH said:

If I was in the know about someone’s marriage enough to be confident my anger was warranted then I would be angry at my brother in this situation, not someone who didn’t make the vows.  If I was willing to see him, I’d be willing to meet her.

That's how I feel, too.

If the friend is that angry about her brother leaving his wife for another woman, why would she be willing to spend time with him? Meeting the girlfriend would seem to be a secondary issue. The brother is the one who made the vows to his wife, and who knows what kinds of creative stories he made up to get the girlfriend to go out with him? He wouldn't be the first guy who lied to a woman about being separated or divorced from his wife, so I wouldn't be in too big a rush to blame the girlfriend. 

[Catwoman]

11 hours ago, Rosie_0801 said:

Here, dating when separated but not divorced is not considered cheating. 

It's the same here, among everyone that I know. 🙂 

[WildflowerMom]

2 hours ago, Janeway said:

I would tell him that I am not interested in meeting the hussy and then I would get on with my life.

Why is she a hussy?  HE is the one who was married for years and left his wife.    The problem is the man!!

[SKL]

38 minutes ago, Indigo Blue said:

I just want to clarify…I think basically abandoning your children while you cheat on your spouse is despicable. IMO. I can understand not judging the marriage, but not basically….. suddenly neglecting your children. 

I thought they were adults?

[Scarlett]

To be clear my friend doesn't think the 26 year old is the only one with blame.  But she was involved in an affair with a married man who then filed for divorce from  his wife.  They both did something horrible.  

While it is true non of us fully know what is going on in anyone's marriage, I wonder what some of you think would justify the above.  The wife is devastated, their 3 children are devastated.  Common decency should dictate a little compassion and standing up for the betrayed ones.  If more did that maybe some of these people might think twice before running off with someone half their age.  Instead, so many people are quick to act like this is just normal and fine.

[Scarlett]

1 hour ago, SKL said:

I thought they were adults?

They are but believe me they do feel abandoned.  They are also very young adults.  None are married.

[El...]

I'm glad your friend behaved in a classy way. I would not like the feeling of being ambushed, myself.

But obviously, his decisions are his. I try to remember that about adults! It helps me stay... mostly classy. 🤐

[kathyl]

1 hour ago, Scarlett said:

...

ue non of us fully know what is going on in anyone's marriage, I wonder what some of you think would justify the above.  The wife is devastated, their 3 children are devastated.  Common decency should dictate a little compassion and standing up for the betrayed ones.  If more did that maybe some of these people might think twice before running off with someone half their age.  Instead, so many people are quick to act like this is just normal and fine.

Yeah, I suppose she could tell her brother how she feels about the whole thing at some point.  But the above would probably come across as taking sides.  And that could end up backfiring somehow in the long run.  

With my own brothers and my kids who have gotten divorced, I tried to stay out of all of it and not take sides.  They were still my brothers/kids.  I knew I didn't know the full story.  And, as it turned out, with my older brother, at my father's funeral his ex told me some things he'd done that I was pretty much horrified by.  You just never know ...

Edited August 1, 2023 by kathyl

[Kanin]

8 hours ago, Laura Corin said:

I think I'd decline to meet the new girlfriend but in terms that didn't burn bridges with the brother, so that if the relationship ended up being short-lived, I could perhaps help to rebuild the relationship with the children.

'I'm sorry, I'm not comfortable meeting her yet.'

Me too.

[Red Dove]

1 hour ago, Scarlett said:

To be clear my friend doesn't think the 26 year old is the only one with blame.  But she was involved in an affair with a married man who then filed for divorce from  his wife.  They both did something horrible.  

While it is true non of us fully know what is going on in anyone's marriage, I wonder what some of you think would justify the above.  The wife is devastated, their 3 children are devastated.  Common decency should dictate a little compassion and standing up for the betrayed ones.  If more did that maybe some of these people might think twice before running off with someone half their age.  Instead, so many people are quick to act like this is just normal and fine.

I’m going to have to agree with you on this point. More people should show distaste for and not support this type of behavior. If you don’t want to be in a committed relationship, don’t get married. If you are married and want out, be open with it. It is entirely unethical to start another relationship while the other spouse is under the impression that it is a monogamous relationship. 

[Lecka]

She got tricked into meeting her once, she doesn’t have to meet her again.

 

I think over time maybe things will mellow out some, and that’s okay.

 

Or maybe they won’t, and that’s okay, too.

 

But after getting tricked once I would not want to be tricked again, and I don’t think meeting someone once means there’s a future obligation.  
 

She could be a great person, and there’s no obligation to look over the brother’s bad behavior.  Or maybe over time people decide to overlook it.

 

But having met her once under this circumstance doesn’t give any future obligation.  
 

That is how I feel.  
 

I think it is rotten behavior by the brother and there’s no obligation to overlook it.  
 

But I think it’s okay to overlook it, too.

 

Personally I think the person can decide on her own and not feel like she has to go along with the adult children.  But I do think it would be worth letting them know if she does decide to overlook it, and explaining why (to maintain ties with the brother I would assume).  And just say she hasn’t forgotten their mother and say some nice things about their mother.  

[Catwoman]

12 minutes ago, Red Dove said:

I’m going to have to agree with you on this point. More people should show distaste for and not support this type of behavior. If you don’t want to be in a committed relationship, don’t get married. If you are married and want out, be open with it. It is entirely unethical to start another relationship while the other spouse is under the impression that it is a monogamous relationship. 

Wait. Who supported the idea of a married man having an affair???

I don’t think anyone here has suggested that they would think it was at all ethical.

[Catwoman]

1 hour ago, Scarlett said:

To be clear my friend doesn't think the 26 year old is the only one with blame.  But she was involved in an affair with a married man who then filed for divorce from  his wife.  They both did something horrible.  

While it is true non of us fully know what is going on in anyone's marriage, I wonder what some of you think would justify the above.  The wife is devastated, their 3 children are devastated.  Common decency should dictate a little compassion and standing up for the betrayed ones.  If more did that maybe some of these people might think twice before running off with someone half their age.  Instead, so many people are quick to act like this is just normal and fine.

But no one here thinks it’s “normal and fine” that the guy had an affair and left his wife.

And I’m not sure what the girlfriend’s age has to do with any of this. If anything, I would think it would help her defense (immature young woman manipulated by older man.) And realistically, even if she was the one who came on to the man, he was the one who was married, and it was his responsibility to say no. 

For all we know, he may have told the girlfriend he was already separated when they met. Who knows what lies he may have told her? 

I’m not saying the girlfriend is without blame, but if it wasn’t her, it probably would have been someone else (assuming he hadn’t already had a bunch of affairs the wife didn’t know about.)

[Scarlett]

31 minutes ago, Catwoman said:

But no one here thinks it’s “normal and fine” that the guy had an affair and left his wife.

And I’m not sure what the girlfriend’s age has to do with any of this. If anything, I would think it would help her defense (immature young woman manipulated by older man.) And realistically, even if she was the one who came on to the man, he was the one who was married, and it was his responsibility to say no. 

For all we know, he may have told the girlfriend he was already separated when they met. Who knows what lies he may have told her? 

I’m not saying the girlfriend is without blame, but if it wasn’t her, it probably would have been someone else (assuming he hadn’t already had a bunch of affairs the wife didn’t know about.)

I won’t be involved with a couple who broke up a marriage. And especially not before the divorce is final.  Depending on m relationship with one of them prior I may never be friends with them again.  

[Catwoman]

5 minutes ago, Scarlett said:

I won’t be involved with a couple who broke up a marriage. And especially not before the divorce is final.  Depending on m relationship with one of them prior I may never be friends with them again.  

In this case, though, it's your friend's brother, right? She might have a tough time having absolutely nothing to do with him, if he always attends family gatherings.

[Red Dove]

51 minutes ago, Catwoman said:

Wait. Who supported the idea of a married man having an affair???

I don’t think anyone here has suggested that they would think it was at all ethical.

I’m sorry I gave the wrong impression that I was taking her side as opposed to taking others’ side. I did not mean “I’m going to have to agree with you on this one…” I meant “I’m going to have to agree with you on this one…” with a soft “you” and no emphasis. Just showing my support with the original poster; that was an awful thing to do to his family. 

[Catwoman]

Just now, Red Dove said:

I’m sorry I gave the wrong impression that I was taking her side as opposed to taking others’ side. I did not mean “I’m going to have to agree with you on this one…” I meant “I’m going to have to agree with you on this one…” with a soft “you” and no emphasis. Just showing my support with the original poster; that was an awful thing to do to his family. 

No problem at all -- I'm sorry I misinterpreted your post! 🙂 

I agree that the guy did a horrible thing to his family, and it amazes me that he has the nerve to flaunt the new relationship in front of his family. I'm surprised his sister didn't pull him aside and tell him what she thought of his awful behavior!

[Scarlett]

12 minutes ago, Catwoman said:

In this case, though, it's your friend's brother, right? She might have a tough time having absolutely nothing to do with him, if he always attends family gatherings.

It is her husbands brother.  Thankfully they live across country.

[Clarita]

3 hours ago, Scarlett said:

While it is true non of us fully know what is going on in anyone's marriage, I wonder what some of you think would justify the above.  The wife is devastated, their 3 children are devastated.  Common decency should dictate a little compassion and standing up for the betrayed ones.  If more did that maybe some of these people might think twice before running off with someone half their age.  Instead, so many people are quick to act like this is just normal and fine.

I mean his kids are ready or have disowned him and he is still moving forward with affair. What is the opinion of his SIL going to matter or a bunch of strangers online?

My mom was the other woman and trust me the two of them would rather walk away (literally go to another country) from anyone who knew their past than to just stop. His own kids won't speak to him (because he screwed them over). I've conveyed my lack of respect and disappointment over the whole thing (we now have an indefinite don't ask don't tell policy to remain in each other's lives). People who have affairs don't care about the shame, they'll justify it for themselves and find a way to escape the day to day criticism.