.deleted

[Tap]

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Edited August 13, 2017 by Tap

[Bluegoat]

My inclination would be to tell him he needs to be less sensitive, but that would probably be counter-productive.

 

I don't think you are the issue - those are well within normal things to say.

[klmama]

Obviously, you can't change him and can only change yourself, but I don't see how you can learn to stop offending him when he won't tell you when he is offended.  He sounds overly sensitive and not particularly logical.  One of my dc had a similarly sensitive friend, and it got to be... wearing... even on my my dc.  How does your dd see the interactions?  Does she think you are being critical?  I would take her advice on this one.

[Tanaqui]

I don't know what your other interactions with him are like, nor his interactions with the rest of his family. (It is entirely possible, for example, that his grandparents are being passive-aggressive in their offers to pray for him. This is a real thing that some people really do, and it's annoying as heck.)

 

I can definitely see how those statements might come across as critical if there is an already-existing personal issue between two people. I can also see how growing up in a household where people tend to snipe at each other in a passive-aggressive fashion can prime you to see attacks whether or not they're there. What I don't know is if either of these applies to this situation.

 

In your shoes, I might try providing less information, being less "chatty". If the nurse asks if you eat meat, and you are reasonably certain that the sort of meat isn't relevant, you might say "Yes, we eat a lot of meat" and leave your daughter to volunteer if she thinks she is eating too much chicken and not enough beef. (And tangent - this is my favorite cooking tool ever.) If you want to know if you should wake them, you could just say "Okay, enjoy your nap. Would you like me to wake you?" instead of going on about whether or not he has a curfew. (Or don't. They're adults. They can set their own alarms, or else ask you to be woken up.)

[Tap]

I don't know what your other interactions with him are like, nor his interactions with the rest of his family. (It is entirely possible, for example, that his grandparents are being passive-aggressive in their offers to pray for him. This is a real thing that some people really do, and it's annoying as heck.)

 

I can definitely see how those statements might come across as critical if there is an already-existing personal issue between two people. I can also see how growing up in a household where people tend to snipe at each other in a passive-aggressive fashion can prime you to see attacks whether or not they're there. What I don't know is if either of these applies to this situation.

 

In your shoes, I might try providing less information, being less "chatty". If the nurse asks if you eat meat, and you are reasonably certain that the sort of meat isn't relevant, you might say "Yes, we eat a lot of meat" and leave your daughter to volunteer if she thinks she is eating too much chicken and not enough beef. (And tangent - this is my favorite cooking tool ever.) If you want to know if you should wake them, you could just say "Okay, enjoy your nap. Would you like me to wake you?" instead of going on about whether or not he has a curfew. (Or don't. They're adults. They can set their own alarms, or else ask you to be woken up.)

 

Edited August 13, 2017 by Tap

[Tanaqui]

I think this is the hard part.  How do you have someone in your home and not have conversations with them.  That just leaves "dinner is at 6pm, do you want corn or beans?"  Then we sit in silence and eat? 

 

When my grandmother was young, she wasn't allowed to speak at the table, it was impolite!

 

But you can have conversations on light, impersonal subjects. I assume he doesn't get huffy if you say "I liked Spiderman" and when he says he preferred Wonder Woman you go "I liked that too, wasn't that one scene awesome?" (Or "Gosh, it sure is hot today!" or, if your politics agree, "Wow, that thing the government did was sure boneheaded!", or "Our local baseball team is doing great!" or whatever.) That's why they call it small talk.

 

In my family, we can talk for hours on such topics as "kennings, and are they awesome?" or "does Tanaqui really know everything*" or "what do we think about this obscure old-fashioned musical and its relation to this modern tv show" or "holy crap, the cashier at our corner store is nuts**" or "wow, that thing the government did sure was boneheaded". We don't have to ever bring up each other's habits if we don't want to.

 

It may also be that discussion of his family is just a sore spot. I notice that all these perceived criticisms have to do with how his family does things. If that's the case, you might be just fine saying something like "Wow, your opinion on current events is ridiculous" and "Only a lunatic would pair stripes and polka dots the way you did", but not "I think your mom's cake was lovely, but a little dry, and how kind of her to think of us!"

 

* I don't, but my mother cheats. She only asks me random trivia questions that I might plausibly know the answer to.

 

** He really is. He thinks the sun was replaced with five fake suns, and that's why trees have moss. I am not making this up.

Edited July 30, 2017 by Tanaqui

[Tap]

When my grandmother was young, she wasn't allowed to speak at the table, it was impolite!

 

But you can have conversations on light, impersonal subjects. I assume he doesn't get huffy if you say "I liked Spiderman" and when he says he preferred Wonder Woman you go "I liked that too, wasn't that one scene awesome?" (Or "Gosh, it sure is hot today!" or, if your politics agree, "Wow, that thing the government did was sure boneheaded!", or "Our local baseball team is doing great!" or whatever.) That's why they call it small talk.

 

In my family, we can talk for hours on such topics as "kennings, and are they awesome?" or "does Tanaqui really know everything*" or "what do we think about this obscure old-fashioned musical and its relation to this modern tv show" or "holy crap, the cashier at our corner store is nuts**" or "wow, that thing the government did sure was boneheaded". We don't have to ever bring up each other's habits if we don't want to.

 

It may also be that discussion of his family is just a sore spot. I notice that all these perceived criticisms have to do with how his family does things. If that's the case, you might be just fine saying something like "Wow, your opinion on current events is ridiculous" and "Only a lunatic would pair stripes and polka dots the way you did", but not "I think your mom's cake was lovely, but a little dry, and how kind of her to think of us!"

 

* I don't, but my mother cheats. She only asks me random trivia questions that I might plausibly know the answer to.

 

** He really is. He thinks the sun was replaced with five fake suns, and that's why trees have moss. I am not making this up.

.

Edited August 13, 2017 by Tap

[gardenmom5]

I just had a long conversation with dd18s boyfriend who says I am very negative when I talk to him.  He feels like I put  him down a lot.  I am a very direct person, I know this about myself..DD has a chronic health issue and he is the center of her world.  I need to figure out how to change his perception of me. Things are just a matter of fact to me, are taken quite personally by him and it has caused a large rift.  I am going to have to be the one who changes when I am around this person, so please help me!!!

 

Example:

 

A nurse and I were talking about my daughter's low iron levels and possibly starting IV iron to restore them. The nurse, DD, he and I were in the conversation.  Nurse asks if we eat meat. "I say yes, we eat beef 2-3x per week, but dd has started eating at her boyfriend's quite a bit and they eat more chicken there"  Nurse says "well chicken has iron too" I say "yes, it does". Then conversation moves on and nothing else is said about it.  To me, it is just a matter of fact dd's iron is low, she has gone from eating red meat 2-3 times per week, to eating it only once every week or two for several months. (What he doesn't know is that dd has always craved red meat when she is low energy, we always assumed it is the iron she needed)  He took it quite personally and that I was criticizing him and his family because they eat more chicken.  I wasn't talking snarky, it was just a chatty tone.

 

When he first started hanging around out house, one night he told me he hadn't had a curfew since he was 18.  Another night, he and dd

 

ETA:  He also told me that he is the only person I do this too. He doesn't see me do it anyone else, just him.

 

well- I would probably have left off what they eat at the boyfriend's family's home.

 

and the boyfriend needs to seriously :chillpill: :chillpill: :chillpill: :chillpill: :chillpill:

 

and because it is his over sensitivity -not sure there is anything you can do.  if he's going to see you are critical - he's going to see you as critical.

 

you could try asking him his thoughts/opinions on things.   treat him as though he's needed.  but he could also assume you're just being patronizing and condescending.

Edited July 30, 2017 by gardenmom5

[myfunnybunch]

The problem is in his perception and expectation.

 

Because he is so important to your dd and you may be spending a lot of time together, I would ask him to give you his trust....that there are no hidden meanings in what you say, that you are a kind person who means well, that you like him and have no desire to criticize him, and that if you ever feel there is a problem to discuss you will approach him directly and respectfully.

 

Then if he seems put off by something you said, remind him gently that you don't do hidden meanings and you have good intentions toward him. I would not get into conversations in which you are defending what you really meant. You cannot win.

 

I have someone in my life like this. It can be very challenging. I try to watch my tone and delivery carefully, keep things light (similar to Tanaqui's suggestions above), and do small relationship-building things (bringing a cup of coffee, remembering a favorite snack), but also I realized I need to be me and be my own kind respectful self who really truly doesn't do hidden meanings or put people down.

[gardenmom5]

The thought about the examples all having family ties is a good one.  He does have significant family issues. Other examples he offered that I didn't list, have similar roots. HMM

 

He is very hard for me to have conversations with.  He is Highly intelligent but doesn't really have conversations about his education interests. ie no conversations about biology or chemistry etc I tried, they fell flat. He plans on going to medical school, but doesn't know what type of doctor he wants to be.  He likes real world video games not fantasy. (Racing/war etc) DS22 plays fantasy games almost exclusively, so that is what I know how to talk about.  General questions are met with concise answers, no give and take of dialog.  He works for his dad, and installs sprinkler systems. Not much to talk about there. 

 

DD18 and DS22  and are very goofy together, he is not a goofy person, so he can't join in when we start picking at each other at the dinner table. 

 

He and dd get along great and he is very chatty with her, but obviously they have tons in common so lots of common ground to talk about. 

 

I will see if dd will talk to me about it, but I am trying to avoid saying anything that will go back to him right now. She and I will be together a bit on Wednesday/ 

 

 

it's ok if he doesn't know what he wants to specialize in.  that usually will come later as they start doing rotations.  a friend of my sil's was just going to do IM.  she fell in love with nephrology during her rotation.

 

and it does sound as though he has issues with his own family - and that makes more work for you to show that your family is different.

ds has spent a lot of time with his gf trying to get her to chill about her own parents.  and she thought because she had strained relations, his should be too.  he's finally convinced her otherwise.

you could be upfront with your dd that you want to be friends with her bf, but you seem to push him away instead.  ask her for suggestions she thinks could help..  put the onus on you - even if he's the one who needs to chill.  it will get back to him - including that you do want to have a good relationship with him. maybe one day he'll understand not everyone is like his perception of his family being passive-aggressive.  (not saying they are - but that seems to be his take.)

[Tap]

well- I would probably have left off what they eat at the boyfriend's family's home.

 

and the boyfriend needs to seriously :chillpill: :chillpill: :chillpill: :chillpill: :chillpill:

 

and because it is his over sensitivity -not sure there is anything you can do.  if he's going to see you are critical - he's going to see you as critical.

 

you could try asking him his thoughts/opinions on things.   treat him as though he's needed.  but he could also assume you're just being patronizing and condescending.

 

Edited August 13, 2017 by Tap

[gardenmom5]

Yeah, looking back I could have left that off.... but honestly, it just popped out.  I was trying to think about what dd does eat that contains meat when the nurse asked because dd18 naturally eats many foods raw which naturally excludes meat.  She eats lots of raw veggies, cheese, toast, smoothies etc.  When she was home all the time, I knew what she was eating and purposefully made beef on the nights when she would be home for dinner. I really wasn't criticizing her eating or not eating certain meats, it was more just a matter of fact. 

 

yeah- and he's paranoid/over-sensitive and will look for hidden meanings that aren't there that are negative against him.  that's a reflection of how he feels about himself, and how he feels about his family.  you can't win.  it has to come from inside him. I'd wager there is some serious behind the scenes stuff going on to create such automatic reactions.

 

I grew up in a family with many hidden meanings and passive-aggression.  (and if you love me you will read my mind.)  I married a man who what you see is what you get.  I joined a church where most people are really trying to just be decent people and 'what you see is what you get'.   I didn't spend much time with my family - and forgot a lot of the junk because I wasn't living it 24/7 anymore.  until one day . . . my grandmother was being nice to me.  every. single. hair. on. the. back. of. my. neck. stood on end.  it all came flooding back.  my first instinct wasn't "gee, that's so nice, thank you." . . . it was "you're being nice - what. do. you. want.?"  

[Tap]

it's ok if he doesn't know what he wants to specialize in.  that usually will come later as they start doing rotations.  a friend of my sil's was just going to do IM.  she fell in love with nephrology during her rotation.

 

and it does sound as though he has issues with his own family - and that makes more work for you to show that your family is different.

ds has spent a lot of time with his gf trying to get her to chill about her own parents.  and she thought because she had strained relations, his should be too.  he's finally convinced her otherwise.

you could be upfront with your dd that you want to be friends with her bf, but you seem to push him away instead.  ask her for suggestions she thinks could help..  put the onus on you - even if he's the one who needs to chill.  it will get back to him - including that you do want to have a good relationship with him. maybe one day he'll understand not everyone is like his perception of his family being passive-aggressive.  (not saying they are - but that seems to be his take.)

 

 

Edited August 13, 2017 by Tap

[gardenmom5]

I agree.  It is just if he had an area of interest, it may offer some topics of conversation. 

 

he may be reluctant to give information because it is used against him by at least one person in his family.  you might want to keep conversation light and generic.  i.e. the weather, sports, movies.

I learned to never give information to my grandmother because she WOULD use it against us.   even to say "i love you" would be used against us.  it wasn't a matter of "if", only a matter of "when".

[Tap]

yeah- and he's paranoid/over-sensitive and will look for hidden meanings that aren't there that are negative against him.  that's a reflection of how he feels about himself, and how he feels about his family.  you can't win.  it has to come from inside him. I'd wager there is some serious behind the scenes stuff going on to create such automatic reactions.

 

I grew up in a family with many hidden meanings and passive-aggression.  (and if you love me you will read my mind.)  I married a man who what you see is what you get.  I joined a church where most people are really trying to just be decent people and 'what you see is what you get'.   I didn't spend much time with my family - and forgot a lot of the junk because I wasn't living it 24/7 anymore.  until one day . . . my grandmother was being nice to me.  every. single. hair. on. the. back. of. my. neck. stood on end.  it all came flooding back.  my first instinct wasn't "gee, that's so nice, thank you." . . . it was "you're being nice - what. do. you. want.?"  

 

Edited August 13, 2017 by Tap

[Catwoman]

I hope he's not treating your dd the same way he's treating you. I'm not seeing anything wrong with the things you said, and frankly, the boyfriend sounds like he has some issues, so I would be concerned that he might eventually start acting the same way with your dd if she doesn't always phrase things exactly to his liking. He sounds like he's waaaaaaay too sensitive.

 

I would also be worried that he will eventually try to drive a wedge between you and your dd by acting like he's the victim and you're the bad guy. Maybe I'm the only one who feels this way, but it's a big red flag to me that he is so quick to take offense over very minor little comments. I would hate to see this guy come between you and your dd, and at some point he may ask her to choose between the two of you because he thinks you hate him.

 

When he gets offended, what does your dd say to him? I would assume she would tell him that you didn't mean anything by what you said, so does he accept her explanation or continue to believe you're being mean to him?

 

Honestly, I don't have any advice for you except to say that it's hard to imagine that anyone would be so upset by the kind of casual, offhand comments that you described. I'm not sure you can fix the problem if he is that sensitive. I'm hoping that maybe he's still a bit immature and that he will become less easily offended by every little thing as he gets older, but I don't know if that will happen. If he doesn't change, I could definitely picture his personality becoming a problem for your dd over time, and it certainly won't endear him to other people he meets if he is always looking for hidden ill intent in their words.

 

I wish I had some ideas for you, but the guy doesn't sound like much fun and he seems like he would be a difficult person to convince that you're really a nice person. And it's kind of ridiculous that you should have to walk on eggshells when you talk to this young man because you might inadvertently say some silly little thing that will offend him.

 

I would be very curious to hear your dd's impressions of this situation.

[J-rap]

It does sound like he is being hyper-sensitive.  Maybe he has low self-esteem problems, or maybe trust issues with the adults in his life, or maybe he is just being a young adult trying to be independent.  At least he has been honest enough with you to let you know that this is bothering him.  (Even if we all think he is the one misinterpreting things!)

 

I think being honest about it in the moment, even with a light humor, might be okay?  And work on building him up.  I don't think you necessarily need to keep the conversation fluffy.  You just may need to work harder to find subjects he is interested in.

 

In your iron/meat example, I suppose you could have said, "yes, she still eats meat -- mostly chicken, three times/week or so." For the curfew example, I suppose you could have said, "Do you need me to wake you up at any certain time?"  Or probably not said anything at all in that situation.  Or asked your daughter, privately, if he has a curfew.

 

But in the future, if you say something that immediately after saying it you wonder if it was okay, you can look at him and smile and ask, "Now, you know I didn't meant that personally, right?"  or something of the sort.  You can also just by body language and gestures show him that you care -- a hug now and then, a smile when he tells a joke (even a dumb one!) a whispered "Thanks so much for coming over tonight" when he leaves, offering to make him his favorite dessert when he comes over next time.  Compliment him when appropriate.  Have family card games (or something) when everyone is just having fun.  Can you offer to help him when he needs help with something?  For example, if he needs a ride somewhere, you can drive him?  

 

For conversations, you can ask him what his favorite movies and books are, find something good to say about them, and ask him more about them.  Is there a period of history he's interested in talking about?  If he likes war in video games, maybe you could begin some conversations on World War II that he might find interesting.  Usually there's something that gets people talking.  

 

Anyway, I generally don't have a lot of patience for people who are overly-sensitive and assume the negative, but I'd want to give him the benefit of the doubt, and work on developing a good, positive, trusting relationship.  My hope would be that once he learns to trust you and maybe matures a little, he'll being to view you, other people, and even himself differently, in a healthier manner.  If six months from now you see no changes in him whatsoever, well then, hopefully your dd will see that too.

[Rosie_0801]

"I have no desire to be your enemy, so don't treat me like one, ok?"

 

As tactful as a brick through a window, but walking on eggshells is impossible when they won't tell you where they left the eggs.

[Twolittleboys]

This would be difficult for me too as I tend to say what I mean without much subtext (though I wouldn't call me "direct" as I am quite sensitive myself so try very hard not to say anything hurtful).

 

I don't think you can quite stop "putting him down" this way as you are not aware of doing it and don't mean to do it. However, maybe you could come up with more positive interactions? If you could find some things that he likes to hear/that make him feel good (I don't mean lying but just mentioning how good he is to your daughter or whatever) it might counteract the other instances you can't avoid. It might be tricky to find positive messages (as he seems very sensitive in an unpredictable way) but maybe your daughter could help with this?

 

Edited to add: Also, could it possibly be that you do have some negative feelings about him and they shine through? I am NOT saying this is the case and it sounds like he is just too sensitive. But sometimes we aren't even aware of some underlying emotions and they might come through in tone of voice etc. Not saying this is the case here but still it might be worth thinking about just in case.

Edited July 30, 2017 by Twolittleboys

[Lecka]

His mom sounds difficult. Maybe that rubs off onto you.

 

I don't know if this is a good suggestion or not, but I would try to add some appreciative comments or positive comments. Like "dd was telling me how much she enjoyed...." or anything.

[kewb]

I am someone who hears things that aren't there and I get why the chicken statement set him off. You meant they eat more chicken. He heard "they eat more chicken and are not taking my daughter's medical stuff seriously. If they ate beef like we do at home we wouldn't be having this conversation with the doctor right now."

 

The curfew. He heard "she thinks i am some kind of liar."

 

Now, these are his issues. You can't change him. Your daughter may be able to offer some suggestions. I would recommend you say nothing that refers to his family in any way. Clearly, some baggage there. Until you are able to say to him that you are not trying to criticize him and you're trying to be factual you can try adding more words to your statements. For example, the curfew - Just checking that I heard correctly that you don't have a curfew. I don't want anyone to worry if they are expecting you. I know I would be a basket case if it was dd and I was expecting her.

[hellen]

I guess I'll be the lone dissenter. I see criticism. I saw it not only in your examples but also in your description of him. Some good comments were followed by a but.

 

He is highly intelligent but....

He plans on going to medical school but....

 

And rewording one of your statements, he likes video games but not...

 

I'll give it to you blunt. The two of you have a mismatch somewhere, maybe personality, iq, interests, or something else. I don't think you need to change because I don't think it's just words that are the problem. I think it's deeper than that and it's not fair to ask either of you to change who you are to appease the other.

[Guinevere]

I, personally, would have been annoyed about the curfew things if I were them. His choice, his consequences. If he breaks curfew, he breaks curfew. I would have felt like my integrity to do the right thing was questioned AND I would have felt micromanaged. I would suggest you don't comment at all on things like that.

[Rebel Yell]

"I have no desire to be your enemy, so don't treat me like one, ok?"

 

As tactful as a brick through a window, but walking on eggshells is impossible when they won't tell you where they left the eggs.

This is the most awesome thing I have read in a very long time! Story of my life, walking on surprise eggs.

[zoobie]

What does DD see in him? I had a friend like that, and it was EXHAUSTING. Everything was an affront or an offense. It was honestly a relief when she got super mad about something I didn't even say.

 

As always, Rosie is wise. You're not being offensive. His taking offense from those things is his hypersensitivity. He will find things to be offended by, so keep being your genuine self. If you were being offensive, then it would be up to you to change. Eating chicken isn't an insult. That's nutty. How could you predict that would bring offense?

 

Is he telling you directly that he's offended or is this being filtered through DD? What does she tell him? Is he like this with her? It could be a self esteem issue or it could be a red flag for a deeper manipulation.

[Guinevere]

It could be nothing, except a desire to be autonomous and independent, especially if he has overbearing or manipulative relatives.  He's probably done with anything like that, and instead of a red flag, it's actually refreshing to meet someone who sees manipulation from miles away and refuses to engage.  I'm not saying you are manipulating, just that his meter is adjusting to a new normal if he's coming from an unhealthy environment.

 

Here's some things I would suggest.

 

Stop speaking for your dd or him.  When the nurse asks if she eats meat, let her answer.  In any opportunity to let them speak for themselves, let them speak, and don't correct them.  Speak for your part, say it is your part, and let the rest go.  So, "I make meals with beef 2-3 nights a week, but dd isn't always there.  What do you think, dd?"  I would suggest only saying that much if the nurse was looking at you.  The point of speaking would just be to punt to your dd in that case.

 

In the case of the curfew,  don't say anything.  If it's their decision, like I said above, then it's their consequence.  Let it go.  

 

Be sure your opinions are stated as such, and don't sound like judgments.  There's a difference in the sound of, "You did a good job," and "I really appreciate the work you've done here."  The first, to an independent person, sounds like you are taking the role of authority.  The second comes alongside them and builds a team mentality.

 

Lastly, don't put him on the spot.  Always leave a way for him to gracefully enter or exit the conversation, while saving face.  (The chicken comment was putting him on the spot, but the nurse saved him.)  I think that's just kind to do for anyone.

 

 

[Guest]

Your daughter is 18? She should be answering her own medical questions. She should have been the one to say, "I eat beef about once a week and chicken about 2 or 3 times." If the nurse asks you a question that the dc is totally able to answer, it's up to you to redirect the nurse to ask the dc directly.

 

It's hard to stop mommying our kids, but it's so important that we do. That means resisting the urge to make suggestions, to be overseeing all aspects of their lives, and checking on this and that.

 

ETA. I'm still learning and failing at times. After I wrote this comment, I caught myself asking my dc17, "Have you had breakfast yet?" We were getting ready to leave the house, and I wanted to make sure that he wouldn't be quesy later if he failed to eat something!!! Gads. I told him about this thread, and my comment, and he just chuckled.

Edited July 30, 2017 by Fifiruth

[MinivanMom]

I will fess up and say that I would have reacted the same way to those statements when I was that age.

 

I grew up with divorced parents and lots of manipulation. And with selfish, divorced parents came a lot of freedom and autonomy from a young age. If I (at 18 or 19) had heard a parent answer diet questions for their adult child, I would have viewed it as crazy overbearing and would have assumed there was a subtext. Just because it was so outside my experience for a parent to treat their adult child that way. I would have seen the curfew thing the same way. My thought process would have been, "Who has a curfew for their adult child? What the crazy?! What message are they trying to send?" My own parents didn't monitor me that way when I was a teen, so I would have reacted pretty strongly to a boyfriend's parents trying to monitor me that way as an adult.

 

At the time, I didn't have the life experience to understand how different families can be in this regard. I reflexively saw the parents as controlling and assumed that there must be a manipulative subtext (because who answers questions for their adult child or tries to monitor an adult's curfew!). With some life experience, I came to understand that my own childhood was a little outside the norm. And that most people just treat boyfriends/girlfriends the way they would treat their own children - and that is generally motivated by love & caring.

 

So I would cut the kid some slack. I don't think it's helpful to frame it as "How do I walk on eggshells since this kid is so overly sensitive?" Instead you might try, "How was his upbringing different than our daughter's? How can I treat him as an adult who is welcome in our daughter's life?"

[Wheres Toto]

I don't think you said anything wrong, and the idea of having to watch every single word I say to someone and analyze it for any nuance that they may find offensive, just sounds exhausting.  

 

I would also be worried about it he is this way with your dd, or if he might become this way.  Again, that is just an exhausting way to live, having to watch every word you say to make sure you don't slip up.   That's how people in abusive relationships have to act.

[vonbon]

If you think the hyper-sensitivity is more innate vs. solely a reaction to current life events, you might check out this book:  

 

The Highly Sensitive Person by Elaine Aron.  It's a worthwhile read for those who would know more about their personalities or those of others in their lives.

 

https://www.amazon.com/Highly-Sensitive-Person-Thrive-Overwhelms/dp/0553062182

 

It might be of help to you in understanding him.  I wouldn't want to lead you down a rabbit trail, as, again, it might depend on whether or not you can ascertain if his reactions are due to his way of operating as a human being or a reaction to you/others or a combination of both.  

[Tap]

Your daughter is 18? She should be answering her own medical questions. She should have been the one to say, "I eat beef about once a week and chicken about 2 or 3 times." If the nurse asks you a question that the dc is totally able to answer, it's up to you to redirect the nurse to ask the dc directly.

 

It's hard to stop mommying our kids, but it's so important that we do. That means resisting the urge to make suggestions, to be overseeing all aspects of their lives, and checking on this and that.

 

ETA. I'm still learning and failing at times. After I wrote this comment, I caught myself asking my dc17, "Have you had breakfast yet?" We were getting ready to leave the house, and I wanted to make sure that he wouldn't be quesy later if he failed to eat something!!! Gads. I told him about this thread, and my comment, and he just chuckled.

 

Edited August 13, 2017 by Tap

[Guest]

You don't need to change. You were thinking out loud. When you discuss it with him, ask him what he would say if the scenario include dd eating flown in fish at a religious friend's home every Friday? Would he interpret you as being against their religion, against the fish, against the friend, against the wealth? Remind him of Eleanor Roosevelt's thought,'No one can make you feel inferior without your consent.' Go on with the lesson of the blind men and the elephant. He needs to grow up and come to the conclusion that everyone has a different perspective, and he needs to seek to understand before criticizing.

 

Of course you are the only one who does this to him. He has rejected all others. He is angry and sees you as the barrier between him and your dd. Rightfully, too considering he is an adult who is not independent and has not accepted the responsibilities of adulthood but wants all the privileges. Just what are his intentions towards your dd?

 

Did your dd's high school health class educate her on the signs of abusive vs heslthy relationship? If not, its not too late. Getting rid of the relatives is a red flag.

Edited July 30, 2017 by Heigh Ho

[SparklyUnicorn]

Well gee I really don't know. 

 

I admit, "I" am quite sensitive.  Everything my MIL says to me or about me bugs me to no end.  But then if asked what she could do differently, I don't know.  Be a different person I guess.  LOL 

 

It might just take time.  Time for him to become more comfortable around you and realize you aren't so scary. 

[HS Mom in NC]

He's hypersensitive. It could be due to personality or upbringing or a combination of both. His life will always be hard until that changes.  You can't change it-don't even try.  Hypersensitivity is exhausting.

I let my children answer their own medial questions from the time they can comprehend the questions, so really early in life.  After they have answered for themselves I add anything that needs to be said.  As they get older they don't usually need me to add much. I agree that adults (age 18 and up) should answer their own medical questions if they are able and get themselves up as needed and worry about their own curfews. I consider it overstepping to be involved in those things at their ages.  I have a 19 year old with a complicated medical history involving immunological and neurological issues who has handled her medical stuff on her own since the day she turned 18 except paying the bills.  She took it all over when she was hired on full time and got her own medical insurance.

I was anemic due to a B12 deficiency they caught several years ago.  I've lost the ability to absorb B12 in my digestive tract no matter how much red meat I eat.  I get shots now. The anemia issued cleared up when my B12 levels were back to normal and I feel so much better now.

[LucyStoner]

Many 18 year olds tend to way over personalize things. I'm not sure there's much to be done. If they last, hopefully he will outgrow this juvenile tendency.

Edited July 30, 2017 by LucyStoner

[Lady Florida.]

 

 

I will see if dd will talk to me about it, but I am trying to avoid saying anything that will go back to him right now. She and I will be together a bit on Wednesday/ 

 

This might be the best way to handle it since trying to talk to him isn't working. While I think he's oversensitive it does sound like there are family issues are part of the problem. If they all snipe at each other or are passive-aggressive or if his parents criticized him often when he was growing up, he likely does see criticism where there isn't any. Hopefully your dd can help. 

[Paige]

Treat him like a crazy person. You know he's going to misinterpret what you say.

 

1. Try not to care too much. You can't fix him and your DD needs to see his crazy to make her own informed decisions instead of you trying to help him conceal the crazy.

 

2. Tread gently. Try not to use too many words or big words. I think about my grandmother when she had dementia- we knew she was in a delicate mental state so we were careful with what we said, would speak gently, and would try to never get offended by what she said in response. My experience with her as a teen served me well- once I recognize that a person seems mentally unwell, I go by different rules for what I expect from them and how I interact with them. That's not to say I cut them out, but rather I give them more slack in many ways while pulling myself back in other ways. 

 

3. Don't speak poorly about him to your DD. 

[Tanaqui]

Remind him of Eleanor Roosevelt's thought, 'No one can make you feel inferior without your consent.'

 

Putting aside the issue of how oversensitive he is or isn't, and why he may or may not be that way, and whether or not this is healthy for him or the OP's daughter, I'm just gonna say this:

 

I hate that quote. I utterly loathe it. It gets trotted out all the time by people who really mean "I can't be bothered not to offend you" and "You shouldn't care that I treat you like dirt" and "Don't come tattling to me just because the other kids punched you and stole your lunch money" and "Neither your feelings, nor you, matter to me at all" and "You're a whiner and a crybaby and stupid and therefore inferior to me".

 

It's like "sticks and stones". It's one thing if you say it to yourself to keep yourself calm in a trying situation. It's another to say it to somebody else. Please do not "remind him" of that quote. He's not gonna take it well, and honestly, I wouldn't either. And since he's going to be actually right to hear "Wow, you're an oversensitive crybaby" from that comment, the end result is that the OP's daughter is going to find herself in the middle. If you're worried about a potentially abusive relationship*, the worst thing you can do is force the issue of your kid having to take sides. There's every chance they're going to pick the wrong one.

 

* Could go either way here, I suppose. I don't think we have enough context to say for sure.

 

Edit: Also, just FYI, there's no solid evidence that she actually is the one who put those words together in that order.

Edited July 30, 2017 by Tanaqui

[MysteryJen]

This is me with ds1's gf. I can do nothing right. Even a lovely handmade gift (that was also given to my girls) gave offense, because I left it on the piano for her when I left on an early flight and didn't give it to her personally and watch her open it.

So I operate on the. Idea that anything I say or do will get filtered through some kind of lens that makes me look like an awful person.

 

But she is his issue and not mine, so I bite my tongue and make blandly supportive statements. I can't think of anything else to do.

[Robin M]

ETA:  He also told me that he is the only person I do this too. He doesn't see me do it anyone else, just him.

Perhaps because you don't see him as a good fit for your daughter and able to take care of her properly due to her medical issues, so subconsciously pushing to make sure he follows the rules. How old is he and is he taken proper care, especially when she has her blank moments or do you feel he is taking advantage?   

 

As for me I see it as a self esteem problem and bordering on emotionally abusive.  I say this only because I'm watching my father tread careful lines with his new lady friend who doesn't like how charming he is with everyone. Their relationship has revealed her long time unresolved baggage.  So I'm seeing for the bf,  baggage from a former relationship and hasn't learned how to deal with it.   

[Misha]

This doesn't sound like behavior that you need to change. To me, what you said are just normal observations. Could he be hyper-senisitve about you? It sounds like he feels that everything you say is a criticism of him, his lifestyle, or his family - besides not speaking, I don't see how you can improve this since it doesn't seem like your issue. 

[Catwoman]

This is me with ds1's gf. I can do nothing right. Even a lovely handmade gift (that was also given to my girls) gave offense, because I left it on the piano for her when I left on an early flight and didn't give it to her personally and watch her open it.

So I operate on the. Idea that anything I say or do will get filtered through some kind of lens that makes me look like an awful person.

 

But she is his issue and not mine, so I bite my tongue and make blandly supportive statements. I can't think of anything else to do.

In the situation with the gift, I would have definitely mentioned her reaction to your son, because that kind of behavior is something that I think should be pointed out to him. If she's doing it to you, she may eventually start doing it to him, too.

 

People are often on their best behavior when they're dating, but after they get married, their true colors start to show. Your son's girlfriend is already showing her true colors, and what will happen in the future if he makes a little mistake and buys her the wrong birthday gift or has to work late on Valentine's Day? She could make his life pretty miserable if she's as demanding and judgmental as you describe her. I mean, what kind of special snowflake is she that she seems to think you should have missed your flight so you could watch her open a gift? :svengo:

 

(Edited for typos!)

Edited July 30, 2017 by Catwoman

[heartlikealion]

I can totally see how this happens.

 

Might I suggest... just state that lately she has been eating less beef and more chicken. No need to state where it is being consumed. I mean, that probably made him defensive like it was his family's fault.

 

"I'll pray for you" DOES sound rude sometimes... have you never heard it used that way? Maybe when he leaves his grandparents' home they tell him this, but when his parents leave the house they don't say it. Maybe they have made other comments about his lifestyle (just guessing) that suggest that they disapprove of something and therefore it's easier to read into the "we'll pray for you" thing.

 

As for the curfew thing... maybe he wants to feel like an adult. Questioning if he has a curfew might make him feel like a kid? Let him feel like an adult. He can set his own alarm (cell phone alarm is what many people use and he probably had one with him).

 

It's not a right vs wrong thing. Definitely don't tell him to not be so sensitive. I hate it when people tell me that. Absolutely hate it. It would be better to reassure someone rather than tell them essentially that they are defective in some way (you're too _____). When he said he felt like you were offending him just say, "I'm sorry. I had no idea" or "how would someone else you know phrase it? I didn't mean anything by it, really." Then maybe he could put it into his own words what it was you said differently or how someone else says it and then just mimic their speech pattern.

[SparklyUnicorn]

In the situation with the gift, I would have definitely mentioned her reaction to your son, because that kind of behavior is something that I think should be pointed out to him. If she's doing it to you, she may eventually start doing it to him, too.

 

People are often on their best behavior when they're dating, but after they get married, their true colors start to show. Your son's girlfriend is already showing her true colors, and what will happen in the future if he makes a little mistake and buys her the wrong birthday gift or has to work late on Valentine's Day? She could make his life pretty miserable if she's as demanding and judgmental as you describe her. I mean, what kind of special snowflake is she that she seems to think you should have missed your flight so you could watch her open a gift? :svengo:

 

(Edited for typos!)

 

I don't know.  People can have very crazy rules for gift giving.  My MIL was mad at me because I didn't immediately open a gift she gave me on the morning of my birthday.  And she told my husband how upset she was about it. (This was before I was married to him) Thing is, growing up gifts were opened at a birthday party all at one time with everyone watching and not immediately upon receiving them.  I guess Germans expect them to be opened immediately.  I had no idea!  So if she grew up with this idea pounded into her it might be difficult for her to imagine another way. 

[Tanaqui]

In the situation with the gift, I would have definitely mentioned her reaction to your son, because that kind of behavior is something that I think should be pointed out to him. If she's doing it to you, she may eventually start doing it to him, too.

 

People are often on their best behavior when they're dating, but after they get married, their true colors start to show. Your son's girlfriend is already showing her true colors, and what will happen in the future if he makes a little mistake and buys her the wrong birthday gift or has to work late on Valentine's Day? She could make his life pretty miserable if she's as demanding and judgmental as you describe her. I mean, what kind of special snowflake is she that she seems to think you should have missed your flight so you could watch her open a gift? :svengo:

 

(Edited for typos!)

 

You have to be careful how you bring this up, though. As others have said, abusers and emotionally manipulative people will tend to isolate their victims from friends and family. If you make your loved one feel like you're asking them to pick sides, you're making this tendency worse.

 

Hard as it is, having a loved one in a problematic relationship means you might need to spend a lot of time biting your tongue.

[Catwoman]

You have to be careful how you bring this up, though. As others have said, abusers and emotionally manipulative people will tend to isolate their victims from friends and family. If you make your loved one feel like you're asking them to pick sides, you're making this tendency worse.

 

Hard as it is, having a loved one in a problematic relationship means you might need to spend a lot of time biting your tongue.

I agree that you have to be careful about how you bring it up, but I do think if you're close to your child and he or she knows you're not the type of be petty, the time to mention red flag behaviors is while the couple is dating rather than waiting until things get too serious. The more time an abusive or manipulative person has to influence your kid, the harder it may be for them to recognize it. If it's mentioned to them early in the relationship, hopefully they will begin to recognize it on their own if it continues to occur.

 

Giving your teen or adult child information isn't asking them to pick sides. I guess it depends on what kind of relationship you have with your kid, as well as on how you deliver that information.

[heartlikealion]

So many posts here are like, "man this guy is so over the top sensitive." Well, speak as an HSP I can tell you I will get a vibe if someone doesn't like me. I will pick up on body language, tone, etc. So if you walk around acting like, "sigh, I can't do anything right. Sigh, this person is so difficult. Why won't he change?!" he can probably sense that. Stop looking at him as "dude with an issue."

 

This is me with ds1's gf. I can do nothing right. Even a lovely handmade gift (that was also given to my girls) gave offense, because I left it on the piano for her when I left on an early flight and didn't give it to her personally and watch her open it.
So I operate on the. Idea that anything I say or do will get filtered through some kind of lens that makes me look like an awful person.

But she is his issue and not mine, so I bite my tongue and make blandly supportive statements. I can't think of anything else to do.

 

Did you let her know where the gift was? Did you put a tag on it? Maybe she had no idea it was hers and someone offhandedly said, "oh that's yours."

 

Presentation has a lot to do with gift giving imo. It's not your fault you weren't there and I wouldn't expect you to be late to your flight, but making sure it was clearly stated that it was for her is important in my opinion. Did you tell her, "I have a gift for you and I'd like to see you open it but I really have to go" or were you gone before she arrived?

 

I'm a detail-oriented person. Not everyone is.
 

[Tanaqui]

I agree that you have to be careful about how you bring it up, but I do think if you're close to your child and he or she knows you're not the type of be petty, the time to mention red flag behaviors is while the couple is dating rather than waiting until things get too serious. The more time an abusive or manipulative person has to influence your kid, the harder it may be for them to recognize it. If it's mentioned to them early in the relationship, hopefully they will begin to recognize it on their own if it continues to occur.

 

Giving your teen or adult child information isn't asking them to pick sides. I guess it depends on what kind of relationship you have with your kid, as well as on how you deliver that information.

 

Absolutely agree. But sometimes people under the influence of an abuser can have a hard time seeing it.

 

(Which is why we shouldn't just bring this up if we're worried, but before the kids even start dating, the same way we explained about where babies come from and how to prevent that.)

[Seasider]

If he is going to be in a permanent relationship with your dd, who will have ongoing medical circumstances that require frank discussion, he's going to have to toughen up. That doesn't mean you shouldn't be intentionally more aware of how you interact, but he has to at least meet you halfway and decide what to let roll off his back.

 

I think life is especially challenging for highly sensitive people who always read between the lines in search of offense (I know not all HSP are this way, but many I've met are and it really takes a lot of joy out of their lives).

 

No person can expect everyone they meet to know and understand his/her full backstory and thus change their own communication styles accordingly.

Edited July 30, 2017 by Seasider

[SparklyUnicorn]

Another thing I thought of.  Maybe because of her medical issues you are highly involved in her care and he feels you are being too controlling.  I'm not saying you are...just that it might feel that way to him (even if it doesn't to your daughter). 

 

What is hard to understand from the POV of a kid (he's still pretty much a kid right?) is parents don't have a switch they flick when their child turns 18ish whereby they suddenly stop being in a parental role.  That tapers off over time.  The fact she needs extra help might make it different too.  When it's my parent doing that to me it might not even bother me too much because it's my parent.  I'm used to them the way they are. Even if they are controlling, I know this about them and have spent 18 years with them and that's just them quirks and all.  But when it is not one's own parent and that person is quite different than his/her parent it might stand out more.  So then everything you do feels as if it has a lot more meaning than it might. 

 

I mean heck, I have only come to this understanding now at 43 about my MIL.  I think she is pretty terrible sometimes, but if I step away from what she does and honestly evaluate it it's not that big of a deal as it seemed before.